They were merely interested in making sure the gas still flowed through the pipeline on their territory, the one they made profits off for every single cubic meter transported.
I find it curious cause I never notice such things, 5 minutes after meeting someone I would not be able to tell what they were wearing... Might be related to colorblindness?
Nonsense! Ukraine didn't do that for sure! And the chartered yacht isn't capable to carry the necessary amount of explosives. It was a false flag operation from the kremlin, men with ukrainian passports? No problem for the invaders!
I really do not think that Russia blew up their own pipeline when they could just easily turn off the gas. A pipeline that would have brought them billions of dollars.
anyone with a semi functioning brain came to this conclusion the moment the pipeline exploded. Critical thinking is a skill that, unfortunately, seems to be in decline year after year..
@@Cloud30000 Putin was using the pipeline as leverage. But it didn't work, for him at least. But it was still a big bargaining chip for somebody else, who might step into Putin's shoes should he accidentally fall out of a window.
It's not "Berlin" or "Germany" claiming that, but some German Newspaper. This is a distinct difference. Germany did not adopt this as state perspective.
Not openly at least... they are a afraid of Russia and don't want to give them more leverage, they do not want russia any closer to their borders. But they were so foolish and short-sighted to keep buying Russian gas and shut down their nuclear plants.
Crockett has returned! I thought maybe Phil Collins was going to come on the show and sing for us... I don't think Simon has to worry about his "do" getting messed up flying along on a high speed boat chasing the bad guys!...
For anyone interested in cctv recordings from port in Poland not being given to Genrmany. This is in fact very simple, they are telling the truth, the recordings have been destroyed, automaticly and there is nothing strange about it. RODO regulations that are mandatory in all EU don't state clearly how long you have to keep the cctv recording, however it is stated that "not longer then neccesary" which is generally agreed to be not longer then 3 months. In practice cctv stays on hard drives from 1 to 3 months, not longer, after that time it is simply overritten with new data, new recording. So there is nothing controvercial about the fact that the footage has been destroyed, no one simply keeps it that long.
German investigators say they already requested it within a timeframe were it shouldnt have been destroyed and received no response until a couple months back.
@@meinnase well as of now we can only speculate on the specifics as we simply don't know. I only said what I know to be true, I have no idea how it all went down.
Hmm… Germany accusing Poland of an act of war in late August that Poland claims is a false flag attack in a situation involving Russia… I’ve seen this one before.
Well...we know from drone attacks on refineries in Russia that Ukraine sees advantage in attacking Russian oil infrastructure, but the very fact that Germany sees an attack on Russian gas export infrastructure as an attack on themselves, and could reasonably have been predicted to take this stance, is a strong disincentive. Also, the attacks on Russia refineries are directly influencing Russia's ability to produce/acquire fuel for their own use. Which includes reducing the capacity to supply military vehicles and logistical infrastructure. Attacking NordStream to reduce Russia's ability to make money by exporting gas to Germany is a somewhat more abstract approach, and accounts for a relatively small proportion of Russian oil and gas exports. As noted, it had no strategic benefit to Ukraine, and this was probably at least as easy to predict as Germany seeing it as an attack on their energy supply rather than Russia's money supply. It is, however, potentially a very dramatic raised middle finger pointed at the Kremlin. Which, as this war has taught, is never entirely out of question when it comes to Ukrainian actions. For it to be a Russian false-flag attack, the motive is clear (sew discord between NATO and Ukraine to try to disrupt aid) and the means are obvious (consider all the BS Russian spies have gotten up to over the years that we only found explanations for years later)...but the question is why would they make the trail convoluted enough that it takes 2 years to dig up. The point of a frame job is that the framed person gets framed. If you're Russia and looking to use this to make NATO back off, don't you want that to happen later in 2022 when you still have a decent chunk of the Russian Army left? By 2024, their hardware is digging into the kinds of vehicles that must be from Soviet deep storage facilities - nobody who has enough modern tanks to do the job fields T-62. To me, this still feels like a third party actor - someone who wants to hurt Russian income, push Germany (or Europe as a whole) to sever its financial ties with Russia regardless of the cost to themselves, and someone who really didn't want anyone to get caught at all. Who that is, I dunno. Probably not Germany. But I could be wrong. Still not enough evidence to convince me.
Honestly, you are doing so many mental gymnastics it is kind of suggestive of mania. Your not convinced that the only party that stands anything to gain from destroying the pipeline, who is now under investigation for destroying the pipeline, did it. Your just deluding yourself
@@Weberkooks Ukraine has more to lose than to gain from destroying Nord Stream hence it being either incredibly mental and possibly genius if they actually did it.
A convoluted Russian false flag operation is possible. KGB knew Biden's "stop NordStream" statement and that USA could/would be blamed - especially if assisted by Russian-leaning conspiracy theorists like Seymour Hersh - BLAME ON USA WHICH DID HAPPEN.
My money is on America.... But maybe that's cause I've got a bias. Seeing how we manage to stick our noses into everything and anything for our own agenda. Ukraine is only even having issues with Russia because of the American CIA backed coup in the early 2010's inside of Ukraine... Wouldn't surprise me if we did this too. We have the means, motive and manpower. CIA is active in basically every nation.
Easier said than done German police loves to put stealthy speed cameras at 100 meter streches of 20 - 30 km speed limit and their cameras trigger once you pass 3 kmh over the limit instead of 10 percent like most of the world so for a alien it's really hard to not commit misdemeanor on German roads...
Its easier said than done, German police loves to put stealthy speed cameras at 100 meter patches of 20-30-50 kmh speed limits plus their cameras trigger once you are 3kmh over the speed limit not 10% so it's pretty hard for foreigner to not commit misdemeanor at German roads.
As a German... fair enough. I was rather in favour of building Nord Stream back then, the change through trade policy had been a success in Europe's West and in the 90s and 2000s, building Europe until and including Russia seemed like a realistic idea. Im not even sure today that a 2003-Putin, what with anti-Iraq-war alliance between Moscow, Berlin and Paris, was fundamentally against the idea. But that's entirely speculative, in hindsight it's easy to see we failed to pull the cord and modify our policy in time... after 2008 when Georgia got the first taste of re-emerging russian aggression or in 2014 at the latest, when the Ukraine war had its creeping start. So what if Ukraine blew up our pipeline? While the war lasts, nothing. Maybe politicians can issue some not very heart felt protests and condemnations towards Ukraine and Poland - it IS a dick move to blow up your allies' stuff, even if you disagree with it having been built. More weapons and ammo until peace is signed and hopefully all Russia's troops back in their own pre-2014 borders. THEN and only THEN it'd be nice to have a chat about it and maybe eventually a calm symbolic apology from Ukraine. As for Poland, meh, once this is history, put this tiny grievance to the "historical grievances"-account our countries share. Overall, I hope our relations to the Poles improve as a result to being on the same side as a european war, possibly for the first time ever.
Exactly. Even if this turns out to be factual and Ukraine is behind the destruction, the country will deal with political consequences after they are done fighting an existential war. Maybe not an ideal method tho achieve the results, but a wake up call for Europe was much needed at that time.
@@worldwanderer91 It’s incredibly easy to simplify and reduce than it is to understand a complex relationship. There are two paragraphs worth of information stating why they do not believe this is an act of war. Most would argue even if it was Ukraine’s doing, they were most likely looking to hurt Russia more than they were looking to harm Germany. Germany is a well developed and sophisticated economy that has handled this situation well and is still making money off Ukraine for equipment leases. Let Germany decide how they’d like to handle this; lord knows that they still risked Ukrainian security with their leaked military calls/discussions.
@@worldwanderer91 May have* And yes. The pipeline was of less and less utility anyway tbf, Russia stopped sending gas to pressure us and once we got our shit together, we wouldnt have used it to buy from them anyway. Short term, a bit of a problem, long term, could even be beneficial: no diplomatic embarassement to still have a now useless pipeline... what do? Dismantle? Regardless, getting all angry and diplomatic incident over it now doesnt do good to anyone except the expansonist wannabe empire in the east so... it's okay by me if they do the minimum reaction they have to and we chat about further implications later.
When this first happened, I was convinced that the sailboat thing was ridiculous. Partly because some of the stories about people on it flashing Ukrainian passports all over the place sounded like an extremely clumsy false-flag, but also because of everyone, the Ukrainians had the most reason NOT to do this. If it got out that they did it, they stood a good chance of alienating the support of the very lifeline to which they clung. IOW, you're talking about an existential downside where Ukraine ceases to exist if caught. And the upside? The pipeline was already shut down. The west was already trying to make alternative arrangements to Russian gas. Repairing the pipeline isn't really that difficult. The entire thing is, at best, an inconvenience to Russia on the upside, and an Ukraine-go-bye-bye on the downside. It would be monumentally stupid for Ukraine to be involved. And now, I have to wonder...maybe Ukraine WAS monumentally stupid?
The WSJ article implied that it was a rogue operation, in that the President has ordered cancellation and it went through anyway. The article claims that the general was told to knock it off, but doesn't say whether he relayed that down. Would be interesting to learn at what level someone said "f" it and did it anyway. No matter how smart a country is, it will always have idiots. Usually though they don't have access to underwater explosives.
Exactly the pipe line is repairable if and when Russia is able to be readmitted to the civilised west. Germany being reliant on Russia for energy is beyond stupid, these german/russian pacts for resources haven't gone well in the past....
i remember Trump warning Germany and then Biden actually threatening them about nordtreams, meanwhile the US became a major gas exporter over those years, coincidence?
The funny thing about this case is that the day after the pipeline was blown up, the German energy minister shook hands with his Norwegian counterpart to open the taps to the brand new Norway to Germany gas supply line.
So it sounds like it was a private venture supported by Zaluzhnyi and opposed by Zelensky. Which leaves the question how much control does Zelesnky have over the armed forces if they are able to ignore his decision? I wonder if that had anything to do with Zaluzhnyi eventual departure from The AFU.
How was it opposed by Zelensky? Cancelling it just because the CIA found out has no value whatsoever, he was still okay with it and probably would have been till the end if they weren’t found out
I can see two reasons why Ukraine would want Nordstream destroyed. First, to punish Russia by eliminating a significant revenue source. Second, to force Germany to evaluate its relationship to Russia and to force Germany to commit to the NATO alliance.
Diving to 80 metres which is way beyond recreational diving limits and then setting explosives and not having them go off during the lengthy decompression is not a simple matter.
It is crazy to me, as a German, that this story is seemingly not addressed by German media. You would expect this to make headlines but so far I have only come across this story in international media.
@@alexspanke Well you might be right then. But compared to the Israel-Iran conflict or the Kursk invasion which make what feels like daily headlines, this was really not big, otherwise I would have seen it. Don't get me wrong we should definitely support Ukraine more no matter who perpetrated this attack, nevertheless, I feel like the media is so biased here: They love to focus on stories which hurt Russia while downplaying stories like this now because they are afraid support for Ukraine might wane otherwise.
Tagesschau, ZDFheute und die ein oder andere Zeitung haben drüber berichtet. Aber ja, ist irgendwie bisschen untergegangen vorn Hintergrund anderer Meldungen
I'de also like to point out that once again we never get anywhere with vague statements like "everyone knows who did it. Only look at tangible evidence, and stop with the supposition.
Now before everyone gets carried away, can someone please do a video on the physiological/physics of diving to that depth and the equipment required to do so. I have dived to 85m and it’s no easy task, equipment, decompression times and boats used are very specific, getting it wrong kills you.
As a German I totally understand the Polish and Ukranian Positions should those Allegations hold true. However they wholeheartedly shot themselves in the foot by doing it. Not only is the support for Ukraine wavering for quite some time in Germany, but the explosion of energy prices has been a major point of sociatal unrest ever since the start of the Russian Invasion. Withdrawing support for Ukraine is a major talking point for the new far right partys in Germany, and this will add fuel to the fire and might conclude in a total withdrawal of military and financial aid for Ukraine. Moreover Poland is using German Tanks, which also might not be on the table after this. A very shortsighted move all in all, allthough I get the thought process behind it. Just be clear, I still think Germany should support Ukraine and Nato with everything that is possible, since Russia has shown itself to be the biggest threat to a peaceful European Continent.
German foreign policy has been a disaster since 1888. Possibly with a small break from 1945 to 1989. In the last 30 years, they made themselves dangerously dependent on autocratic regimes in the areas of energy, technology and exports. This was a doubly bad idea because it has reduced US support for Germany as well due to being an unreliable ally. Now the trade links to autocratic regimes are being cut and they reap what they sowed in the last 30 years. High energy costs, loss of industry, soon loss of living standards.
If they know all this then they knew already . They're already still helping Ukraine . So it didn't matter . Any talk about withdrawaling support is probably due to the war actually slowing down.
Got news for you. It was the US who did it. Been covered and investigated thoroughly across the pond over here. After that crap, I can hardly blame Putin. Not that I like the guy, but hell, man.
@@spambot_gpt7 I wouldn't agree with it being a total disaster, however making ourselves dependent on China and Russia for crucial necesseties has been the dumbest move one can think of. However I think it is largeley due to corruption and Russia paying off our former politicians to do Lobby work for them.
This took some guts. Let that be a lesson to frivolous leaders who consider making strategically dangerous decisions. I salute you, Ukraine and Poland, for improving the strategic situation of Europe.
@@ryankline1164 I suffer from Asperger's Syndrome my speech/writing is a bit different from most. Sorry if it offends you but it's rather unusual for someone to complain about it.
There was nothing new. Russia supplied Germany with gas for the last 60 years or so, always staying truthful to their contracts, even through the roughest parts of the cold war. The former US president mostly wanted Germany to be dependent on the US for energy. But especially this former US president showed how unrealiable the US is as a partner, and that sticking to the russians was the right decision. At least they will not try to blackmail you with the livelyhood of your country every other month for their own national interests or their election campaigns.
They did what needed to be done in a world where we, in European Union, paid Russia good money while they invaded the borders of European Union. Hypocrisy in war is the end of a country.
It is most likely that Gazprom destroyed the pipelines. When Putin ordered the valves closed, Gazprom was liable for compensation for undelivered gas, and the destruction of the pipeline allowed Gazprom to declare force majeure and avoid compensation.
Exactly, explosives delivered by robot inside the pipe - word is that such robots are routinely used inside pipelines for maintenance. For me this version makes most sense.
@@countdooku2237 I don't know if metallurgical analysis of the damaged pipeline has been carried out, but it would take such to make an educated guess as to where the explosives were placed.
@@Andrzejjsjthe implication is that it was a competitor for delivering gas to central Europe, and without it there might be transmission fees in it for poland. Not sure if that's really true but it's the insinuation here
Because of the way the contracts are written, Gazprom would have had to pay huge penalties to the customers they were not supplying with gas per the contracts. Follow the money.
I ruled out the Russians long ago. I mean there will be an after war at some point. They still could have made money off of it. I didn't think the US, too much of a risk for little gain. Ironically I was thinking the Poles, but I didn't think they'd have the capability. And I'm still not convinced on that last part. It is quite the mystery.
I find Poland to be a fascinating layer to this geopolitical issue..... A colleague of mine who is polish put it to me like this.... Poland has been caught with its pants down too many times throughout history. Which is why they feel the need to defend themselves. If you want peace, go to war.
You know what, listening to this channel after serving jury duty makes me realize how much they rely on presenting their case and evidence in a truly professional manner
The article basically assigns all the blame to Valerii Zaluzhnyi, who is now an ambassador in the UK. Yet, he denies any involvement. I wonder if German investigation could lead to an arrest warrant for him, only he has a diplomatic immunity now, how convenient...
Germany had an EU arrest warrant, Poland told them to STFU, literally said if you know what is good for you, you will shut your *****ing gob, that was D Tusk, yay Poland ignoring all the EU rules
Ukraine has a trak record with ambassadors with a shitty relationship towards Germany, like the idiot that was the ambassador TO Germany whose constant shit essentially made him a PR asset to the Russians.
@@user-uq7io2os3r Especially the Polish one, constantly taking shots at the German government while all too happily being a drain on its EU funds contributions.
Blowing up the pipeline hurts Germany the most. Gas and oil used to be imported cheaply and cleanly from Russia and the economy grew, gasoline was affordable and energy prices were normal Now the Germans are paying many times more for everything with no prospect of improvement. There are supposedly “Germans” in the comment section who celebrate this miserable burger money pack
“Cheap gas is worth letting Russia ethnically cleanse Russia” is a really selfish position, and a stupidly shortsighted one, considering the West took that same attitude and allowed Hitler to build up a massive war machine while the rest of Europe looked the other way. You’ve failed to learn anything from your own history.
@@0ld_Scratch It's just schadenfreude at being vindicated that you all were making terrible, short-sighted energy decisions and Germany learned the hard way why those who warned it were exactly correct. You only have yourselves to blame for ignoring the criticisms against the pipeline.
@@Vaeldarg If we want to make deals with Russia, we make deals with Russia. And if you destroy the infrastructure you're an enemy. Also what we? There is no We in a Democracy, I never voted for this, also zieh Leine und geh jemand anderem auf den Senkel mit deiner Niederträchtigkeit!
The rest of the EU is generally less dependent on gas. Demanding a boycott for the thing you don't use is easy. All the EU is largely import dependent on petroleum. Stopping petroleum from Russia was a lot more sensitive.
As a german I have a split view onto this. On the one side I see the importance of Nordstream as the failure of the green energy transition. We could have been far more independent with proper investments in biogas and green tech. On top, we even limited the production of biogas by law. Nordstream shouldnt even have been this importamt in the first place. On the other side gas is meant to be phased out in 16 years anyway and this gas in-/export dependency works both ways. Russia makes most of its money via energy exports. With proper enforced sanctions this could have hurt Russia far more. Nordstream 2 also took years of planning, it just happened to be at this date by chance. Poland crying about germany building them in a way to avoid transit fees is quite pathetic. "How dare you trying to avoid unnecessary costs. We totally would deserve this transit money, because...we just happen to be in the way." This just fuels the old joke: Life is like Poland, you have to get through it. If Poland and Ukraine really did it, this is like an act of war against germany and requires consequences.
But the pipeline was worthless. It has already been decided to not import fossil fuels from Russia. And by the time Putin finished paying reparations and the sanctions wear off, fossil fuels will not play a significant role anymore. That's why I don't get why people continue to discuss this. It's like someone set your happy meal toy on fire and you view that as an act of war.
We did it. Americans. Us. It's obvious. Stop pretending otherwise in order to avoid facing the reality that you are still occupied, and are stuck in a very dangerous situation, as a mere colony of Washington. Germans to need organize and stand up for themselves and control their own destiny. Your government and media are traitors. Nothing more than US stooges. Your cointry will lose all freedom and prosperity eventually. Just like all our "allies" (vassals) in conflicts since ww2. Vietnam. Iraq. Afghanistan.
German here, if its true, I can fully understand Ukraines actions, no hard feelings on my part. The goal was to hurt the Kremlin and its our fault that we were still so dependent on Putin long after the Krim.
Too early to address it. Notice all that the journalists have done here is to tell a story. They presented no evidence. Simone here says it was "backed by" an article in Germany -but those guys are co-authors telling the same story. No one has presented any evidence. The Russians are the best story tellers on the planet right now. The Russians duped foreign reporters again seems to be the real story here.
Interesting...from what i've read in the news, Pres. Zelensky ordered the Operation to be stopped but the Operators in the field couldn't be reached for no one knew where they were nor did they have any radio of some sort with them.
I’m at a point where I don’t believe anything coming from a government report. I’m more inclined to believe that this report simply presents what is politically expedient for somebody.
Russia is trying to sell gas to China since losing Germany as a customer. Glad to see that China is refusing to build the new gas pipeline up to 2028. China is really not a fan of Russia. Back to the USA, don’t think USA has the balls to do it. Too scared of Putin’s Redlines, especially at the beginning of the war. Ukraine does have more than a couple of balls 😂.
Counter point - why would we? Russia seems more likely as to sew discord and distrust between European nations and cut support for Ukraine. This smells as fishy as a mongers market in July. This screams russian false flag, moscow-backed deception to harm support for Ukraine.
Does the CIA earn style points for warning the victim before doing the operation or did the spooks decide to play the game on hard mode? The US had already stopped the pipeline via sanctions. Then it released the sanctions. Then after Germany said they wouldn't use it, the US decided to blow it up? The US has gotten to to some crazy stuff, but there is usually an underlying logic to it.
@@angelgallegos199 Keep in mind that "renewable" energy is cheaper in the long-run, by paying for itself. It's more "cheap oil/gas bad", since the reason it is cheap is that nobody else wants to do business with authoritarian pariah states that spend the money on a war machine with imperialist intentions.
Hiding the role of the USA is so funny. Biden said at a conference that there will be no pipeline. Trump said that he wont disclose who did it, because it could harm USA. Discussing this without mentioning the USA is hilarious.
I was a yacht captain. There is no room on this boat for gear or to suit up. That platform is tiny and the cockpit is cluttered. The other problem is the deapth, a yacht would not have multiple deep water anchors on board or the space. And a bunch of people cannot fit on board either. If someone wanted to dive , we would rendezvous with a dive boat. I have read about their cruise and it is possible they had been some sort of support to the operation. Delivery of the explosives maybe. Or they are the patsy!
The answer is NO. It wasn’t Ukraine who’s done it, it was Russia. For one, in some released footage you can see the pipes were blasted from the inside out. There’s a special crawler, little cart essentially, that companies like Gazprom put inside the pipe to check its integrity. Nothing would stop russians to load such cart with explosives, put it on their side, and then blow it all up. Second thing, around the time of that explosion, there were literally russian navy vessels conducting “exercises” in that area with their transponders turned off. And one such ship was… drum roll please… a vessel designed to perform underwater operations. Since, as far as I remember, there were two explosions, these people probably worked together to sabotage both of pipes. Never trust anything that comes from russian authorities mouths, never. They always lie, and almost all the time they literally accuse others of things they’ve done themselves.
Um, nope actually NATO did exercises and that is when the explosives were planted. BTW do you know how big and protected these were. Why did Biden say that the NordStream would be blown up to the WH press room and was questioned by a reporter in January 2022? I guess ppl who watch these channels of whatever that has made this crew a tonne of $ pump out garbage ad nauseam.
They got their snorkels on, called Flipper to help them and dove just 80 meters, asked Flipper to quickly put the C4 and went back up - all that on single lungful of air!
I listen to this show through my phone audio and I can barely hear the show with my volume turned all the way up. I don’t have this problem with any of Simon’s other channels. I’m not sure why it’s like this, but I think other people in my position may share this problem.
