Grab some G54 merch here - www.en.garage54.ru/ In this video we do a bit of custom cross drilling. Some of the results were fairly predictable, but at times we were genuinely surprised. For business inquiries: promotion@garage54.ru
Most of the loss in distance between tests could be attributed to the pads and rotors bedding together and working better after some stops. Brand new pads on brand new rotors always stop more poorly for a period of time and a few heat cycles before they're at peak performance.
Properly bedded brakes will transfer some material to the rotor face. I don't think there actually needs to be more friction. Lots of brake systems on a car are actually way oversized where you can lock the tire at will.
@@timothybayliss6680 Yeah, if the wheels can lock, the brake is powerful enough and the stopping distance depends on the rest (like weight and grip). The cooling advantage likely isn't appreciated at a highest temperature of 100-ish degrees Celcius. They would barely steam up water that hits them, nowhere near fading point.
@@Kalvinjj prolonged heat generates brake fade. Not common in a regular car unless you are severely speeding. Get a car up to 100mph+ and firmly apply the brakes, before you can stop you will have to slam on the pedal to get wheel lockup. Do it again and you can push with ALL your might on the brakes and it feels like you lost 50% of your brake power and you can't lock up a wheel or activate abs if your life depended on it. Brakes are certainly oversized for driving within the speed limits, but once you exceed that and really test the brakes you know how little energy they can dump. Which is how trucks get into trouble going down hills. Hot brakes barely work, and with a heavy vehicle it's even worse.
i think the performance drop when you went over 100 holes is from the rotor not having as much mass to soak up the heat and experiencing brake fade earlier
I really enjoyed this video, it answered several of my "what if I just..." questions. The engineers have obviously discovered that there's a point where cross drilling and retaining available braking friction surface is maximized, as this experiment proves. I'm also fascinated by the chamfered slotted and cross drilled rotors. The slots allow pockets for the gasses to expand and evacuate without compromising the structural integrity of the rotor disc. Science around this is very interesting, thanks Garage 54!
When you take away rotor surface area (drilling holes) you take away the ability of the brake pad to have something to push against (called brake effort). As you found out, there was a test where a small amount of holes reached the maximum brake effort. All the best guys.
Also, it's now not a very smoothe surface, you can hear the clickity clack sounds, each hole can be compared to a bump or pothole in the road just like it makes your car bounce they are making the brake pad bounce and each bounce it makes it's not properly uniformally compressing the rotor as it should compounding with what you said above, so all around it's a bad idea.
@@MidnightMarrow I've been an auto, jet engine mechanic and a metal machinist for 60 years. Yes, I'm 77 yrs. old. Been there , done that, got the "T" shirt as they say. I'll bet bet a lot of subscribers don't know about mechanical things. They have other interests. All the best to ya'.
I had drilled, slotted, and vented rotors on my dually. They lasted over 200k miles and that’s with pulling and hauling as a dually truck was intended for. I didn’t replace them with the same thing. I got regular vented rotors and they wasn’t the cheapest either. But they lasted half as long. Same as the pads. About half the life as before
That was a good one! I had a feeling you'd hit the snow bank before the end of the video! I was hoping you'd do exactly as you did at the end and get multiple stops into the brakes.
those stopping tests would have to be repeated like two or three times to see brake fading and if it doesn't crack near those holes, Ive seen dozens of cars especially going sporty or on a track with cracked rotors near those holes, never seen any with full ones, but my guess is they will cool down harder due to limited airflow and dust on them
Brakes are converters of car energy due to friction to heat. Better heat disipate, better are brakes, but the more holes, the smaller the temperature capacity and friction surface so brakes are less efficient. U need to balance friction temperature capicity and heat dicipate, to have the highest friction, highest heat dicipate and not loosing the temperature capicity( this parameter is responsible for multiple braking).
one note of confusion with the temperature is that for a lot of performance rotors, due to their lower mass, they will often get hotter on any single stop. but for a more prolonged track application, they are more able to shed the heat to the air due to their increased surface area, resulting in more consistent stopping power and making them harder to encounter brake fade
Because at the increased speeds and increased rotations (and rarely braking to a complete stop), you have the highest transfer rate of heat to the air, and it stays that way consistently through the raceway track.
My concerns would start going to the structural integrity of the rotors at some point. Yes, they are hardened, but they will eventually break. But it was a great endeavor.
I've noticed that the projects you have taken on and the ideas you've tested in the past few Years has progressively gotten better. Keep up the good work, I love seeing your ridiculous ideas and I feel like I can clearly see how much more competent you've all gotten over the Years (that's not to say you were ever incompetent!)
Lol it needs to be done in a "lab" situation to get real results, have them sit under load for xxx of time and have a stationary mounted thermal checker pointed on the same position and show the differences in the graphs like a dyno tune :D pretty fun all the same!
@@chrissanders2562nah it's for cooling. They use them on race cars as they are breaking at high speeds and sharply as a regular disk would likely get damaged as ofcourse metal is weaker once it gets hot.
@@chrissanders2562 it allows gasses from the hot pads to escape, same as grooves, not needed in normal driving as the pads don't get hot enough to emit gasses, apparently the gasses get trapped behind the pads and reduce braking
Most roters I have seen have had a second rotor that had holes in the sides with some joining metal to make square holes on the sides. So you have two smooth surfaces for the break pads.
It worked fine with the first 3 sets of holes. Because there was sufficient surface area for the pads to hold on too , more holes less surface area for the pads.
My car (MK5 GTI) has non-ventilated cross driller rotors in the rear. The rear rotors are oversized enough, and being a front drive car, it doesn't need ventilated rotors, and you have to go into the high end aftermarket rotors to find ventilated rears. Tho to be fair as well, the stock rotors aren't drilled at all, but I have mid range aftermarket rotors intended for use on an Audi TT. (Zimmerman sport)
Ive seen tests done and there was little to no affect to brake force/power but when using the brakes a lot like going downhill and "spirited driving" they help keep brake temps regulated so they dont overheat. They slotted surface rotors barely did anything while full slotted and drilled or both made a difference
Yo lo hice con discos macizos y lo que pasa es que hacían un ruido como de matraca, con el tiempo entendí que con la temperatura se dilataba el aire dentro de los orificios y ese era en ruido, como pequeñas explosiones, aunque parecía que se había rajado el rotor, y volví a ponerle rotores normales ya que tampoco se notaba una gran diferencia
This is a demonstration of unsprung weight and thermal mass. Unsprung weight: weight of components below the suspension that rotate with the wheels (includes rims and tires). The lighter you make this, the more dramatic the results (each lbs is about equivalent to removing 10 lbs of weight anywhere else) Thermal mass: the amount of mass on an object capable of resistance absorbing and dispersing heat through itself. Think radiators for CPU cooling. If you apply 100 watts of input to 100 grams of mass, it will be cooler overall than applying that same 100 watts to 90 grams of mass because there is less material to hold the heat. I'm not 100% sure I was accurate, so if you're interested in these ideas I suggest you go research them yourself because sometimes you might find a secret interest, you never know.
Это был интересный эксперимент. Спасибо за предоставление результатов теста торможения. Мое заключение состоит в том, что некоторые отверстия могут помочь с краткосрочным охлаждением после тяжелого торможения. Но для достаточной производительности торможения необходима определенная площадь поверхности.
Need to measure how much quickly it cools more precisely vs the og rotor. They tend to get hot but dissipate heat quicker so by the time you're at the next turn and getting down on them they've cooled quicker. They hold some heat for optimal performance but dissipates heat quicker to combat brake fade like you saw with the last few runs at high speed and lots of holes drilled
The holes were drilled straight across the solid rotors, what if they were drilled at a slight angle to create a fan blade type of effect pulling cool air from inside the wheel arch, passing thru the brake rotor and being forçed towards the outside of the wheel...forçed air draft removes more heat
Should have left it a set time or driven back around without using the brakes and measured the temp again each time to see how much it cooled each time. With less material it’s going to heat up faster, but more surface area it’s going to cool faster too. Idea is that the brakes cool faster between uses on a track for instance. Also, cross drilled discs are more effecting on vented discs, as they are shaped to pull air through them as the wheel spins.
Enjoying your show here in the US with my son. Haven't laughed this much since we used to watch MYTHBUSTERS and they had a life sized dummy named TED: It was variously detonaTED, assassinaTED, exploDED, etc....from cannon to cars, and everything in between!! LOL! BTW, a friend told me how happily she "defrosted" her new car windshield with hot water; it worked for her and her dad was furious! Keep up the good work, gentlemen!!
should have only done 1 wheel at a time then you could compare sides equally, temperature wise and the better braked wheel would have pulled to one side
I wonder if BRIMBO got their start this way? Ether way, very COoL. Looks like a Lotta' fun. The last time I was this excited to see holes was on my last "3rd date" p.s. I didn't know about spraying black, mat paint prior to temp measuring. 500 points awarded to the team!! Cheers from the other side of Earth
Tests have shown that cross drilled are not as effective as slotted. The gasses produced by the pads dont have anywhere to go. Also, it has less metal to soak up the temperature, thus brake fade will start sooner. This is from a brake manufacturer i used to deal with.
As I understand it drilled brake rotors is to give better breaking when the disks gets wet with mud, as I understand it only something used off-road as it give no benefit in other situations.
You guys should really slap a fat turbo on a Lada. Maybe HX35 sized or so. You've already gotten fuel injection to work. Add a good pressure regulator, block studs, and forged internals. With a cast iron, closed deck, engine block, I don't see any reason this motor couldn't make some serious boost, and serious results!
enough holes helps in releasing the gases release between pads and rotors while braking and it makes the pads gripping the rotor better. helps in reducing the heat better while releasing the brake and cruise. too much holes means less surface contact between pads and rotors, less material to grip.
More holes more efficient slowing via debris dispersal. The energy has to go somewhere that's why high heat and decrease of stopping performance at a certain point.
I guess it reveals a lot on brake technology when u see the brake system on a motogp bike... it has no holes. The carbon bakes wont overheat so i guess there is no need to ventilate and therefore max contact with the disc for most stopping power.
What about an elastomeric mounted roll-cage within the car frame that moves forward, independently, after the initial collision. This will remove much g-shock from the passengers. 6 in. of travel should be cool.
crosdrilling means not sinking the holes! they have to be sharp to prevent wedging the air between the disk and the pads, they lifting on air film when there are to many holes . you created a trustbearing like a ship propellor bearing. my motercycle has stainless disks with holes to prevent loss of breaking in rain. great job boring so many holes! keep on the good work I am enjoying it very much.
and now try to make DIY slits on the Brake Rotors like the EBC or ATE Powerdiscs have 👌 this works a way better and you don't get cracks between the holes on the brake rotors like you get on drilled ones.....
The real benefit is in cooling off quickly while still moving. Coming to a complete stop negates the whole purpose. Also there is obviously a point of diminishing returns.
Your new test car is a real beauty! Did you trade a screwdriver or a pair of sunglasses for it? It's obvious to me that the ultimate brake rotor would be a transparent one. Garage 54 has repeatedly proven that transparent auto parts are superior in all respects to opaque auto parts. Making a clear rotor should be much less difficult than making a clear engine block so you may as well just do it so we can all learn how much better they will work than conventional, old-school (boring) steel rotors.
The idea of cross drilled rotors is to allow gasses to flow out through the centre of the rotor. It won’t work on non vented or solid rotors as there is pad on either side of the hole. Cross drilled rotors get rid of gasses more efficiently than slotted rotors at the expense of structural integrity. You will find that drilled rotors get replaced frequently in motorsports as they will start to crack at the edge of the holes because of continual head cycles and mechanical stress.
@Garage54 what if you do a ser of rims that work as a fan/propeller so that when it turns itll pull air into the tire brakes see of that helps keep them cool
Holes make higher surface area for heat dissipation. Grooved rotors are for debris clearance. Too many holes affects rotor life dramatically and strength is compromised.
Less material, same work = obviously higher temperature. What about the holes in the discs? Thanks to this, they cool down faster before the next braking.
