Baobhan Sith’s explanation on having a riding skill is absolutely hilarious, it basically says 'You know what? Walking is sorta like "riding" the ground.'
I mean she can fly technically due to her fairy trait as in alter to float this is likely what gives her trait As for Mashu that's easy she inherited it from Galahad who was shown with his horse in the prologue anime when Mashu see him
Babbage just sitting there in the "immune to pigify" trait, being the only silver border and probably feeling horribly out of place makes me smile for some reason. Like, multiple divine entities, some very powerful mages and then there's just the English gentleman in a giant robot body.
@@tipoima On that note, I'm pretty sure the potential explanation to babbage having the immune to pigify might be because we told her not to pigify him in the future
I think saberface trait is fairly logical. It's not only about resemblance of the art. (Although it's a significant part of it) All Artorias have this trait for obvious reasons. Mordred is basically a clone of Artoria born by Morgan. So she should be very similar in appearance to her "father". (And early arts of Mordred show her almost identical to Artoria) So it's still pretty logical. Jeanne is saberface because of Gilles. He couldn't distinguish Artoria from Jeanne in fate/zero. And while it could be said that it only was because of his madness, I think they are similar enough. Jeanne Alter is ... well... Jeanne. Her face is not just similar to Jeanne's. It's identical. And thus she also should be similar to Artoria. (And Jalter lily too, by the way. For the same reasons) Same with laksmibai. She was drawn as Jeanne with dark skin because of some book. ("Jeanne D'Arc of India" or smth). And if she is similar to Jeanne who is similar to Artoria, she also should be similar to Artoria. Thus saberface trait. Nero is indeed a saberface, but drawn by Wada Arco. See early Takeuchi's arts of Nero. She was basically Artoria in the red dress. So that's why she is a saberface. (Not to mention that her similarity to Artoria is a theme of constant jokes in games, ovas and etc.) So in conclusion saberface trait is not only because of art. It's also because of some lore, fate jokes and some old arts too.
To add to your point about Nero, it is revealed in TYPE-MOON Ace 8 that they designed her similar to Artoria in order to trick players into thinking they were the same character until Nero went “HAHA you fools it was I, Nero”. I’m not sure how you’d fall with that trick since they’re pretty different character wise, but hey. Never question Takeuchi’s Unlimited King of Knights NP.
I do not agree with "All Artorias are saberfaces" argument. Lancer/Lancer Alter/Ruler all look nothing like Saber. They were designed to look unrecognizeable. If you extend the saberface trait to them because they are the same person as Artoria, you kinda have to extend it to Arthur. If Lakshmibai gets the trait from being really a Jeanne-face that has very tangential relation to Jeanne, then you should also extend it to Bedivere, who looks very much like Saber, and it is deliberate, as he literally worships her. And if that famous "Waver in summer Okita swimsuit" edit is anything to go by, Waver should have it to.
@@infernohellfire9647 this is also the reason nero has the nickname "Red Saber", but she was designed as Saber (as in Artoria's nickname, not the Saber class), but red instead of blue
@@dmitrygolubev9398 Lancer and Ruler versions of Artoria are a "mature" version meaning they are how Artoria is supposed to look as a full grown adult instead of being a perpetual teenager so they should still have the Saberface trait. It similar to how Da Vinci Rider is still in the form of Mona Lisa but obviously aged down.
The reason why Anne and Mary don't have the riding trait despite being riders is because while they did ride on a boat, they were crew members, and not the helmsman or captain of the ship. They were plunderers who got on to enemy ships to attack, giving them their first skill to drop more C-Stars instead of the Riding Trait. Sincerely, A Anne Bonnie & Mary Read Simp.
@@Omniseed As of right now nothing about Anne and Mary stands out. She's a solid rider that'll severely beat up casters and any berserkers you might need to. Her NP depending on current HP can deal dummy damage. When her first strength comes out, it'll get a lot easier to pull off. She's just on the solid range of riders usually overshadowed by the welfare rider kintoki. Granted, if you don't have rider kintoki and just need a single target rider, she'll do fine. To be honest, I've been playing for a long time and I'm still struggling to find an ST rider better than Kintoki. :P So being good when you don't have the best is fine, innit?
@@markedfang yeah, that's exactly what I was hoping for and a relief to hear. I was worried that she might have had some hidden early years syndrome that made her way worse than she looks on paper. But my only other riders are the boss baby Ozy, lvl80 Alexander, and Marie Antoinette + Martha each at 50. An SR or SSR AoE Rider would be a really nice addition to the lineup, but for now Alexander is fine. I rolled a lot of quick servants early on so he's been a reliable fighter for me when I need to save some points or it's casters all the way down.
@@Omniseed they're easily overshadowed by other SR Riders, I Simp for them because I got Them early on in my play through and they helped me tremendously during the singularities. I'm currently trying to get them to Bond 10, They do have a 100% Crit Damage upgrade on their second skill.
Nero's art has changed a lot since it's initial release In og carnival phantasm she was literally just Artoria but different clothes They changed her later to differentiate her
The only thing that's really changed in Nero's design is an increased exaggeration of her "hair vents" (they are visible in her Extra art, but notably more defined in FGO and Extella art), its hard to say if the exaggeration was really to differentiate her from Artoria or just a result of the evolution of Wadarco's style (as you see the same prominent "hair vents" on Hololive's Kronii who Wadarco is the artist for.
@@camil3545 I just think back to the carnival phantasm endings She shows up in one of the taiga dojos and she literally is just Artoria in different clothes He design has stayed consistent enough though you are right. It's like the difference between literally copypasting and drawing from a very clear memory
@@camil3545 She definitely included those hair vents to distinguish Nero from Artoria. If you look at Nero's first appearance in EXTRA, they're barely visible. Then when you look at WADA's Artoria rendition, she lacks them
No, he is immune to pigify, it's just in one of his passives, not as a trait for some reason lol Protection of the Messenger God B Grants self Great Witch's Pigify Debuff Immunity. Increases own Arts performance by 10%.
I think that some of the Immune to Pigify subjects may come down to the meta reason of 'we don't want to make unique pigs for them and we know people would complain if we didn't'. This would explain Babbage and the Mecha-Elis as you know someone would go 'need metal pig'.
@@klidge for babbage, someone mentioned the very convincing explanation that, after the incident of the giant mecha pig during valentine, she was forbidden from turning him ever again, this earning him "immunity"
The Forklift certified trait is going to appear during the next Amazoness event and it’s going to be given to Penthesilea rider and is a status she can confer to enemies through her NP, where she channels the spirit of Bezos to banish her opponent to the wage cage.
Interesting thing about the Child trait, people speculate that the real qualifier for it is based off if Illya herself sees them as a child or not. Which would probably explain some of the weirdness of it.
I think the only reason why Jeanne is classified as a saber face is because Gilles mistook Artoria for her in Zero. Hence why lily and jalter (and I guess Lakshmibai since she's considered a Jeanne face) classify as well
I find the "Caenis" trait more like a place holder than a proper trait since "Feminine Looking" isn't enough to give her story justice or until other servants "like" her are released. At least is miles better of a reason to exist than the Shuten Doujin trait...
3:28 "The tagging has no bearing on the game itself" MHX has Saberface special damage on her NP. It's the only thing that uses the trait, but it IS something used in-game.
@@klidge Sorta. I think it was back in Saber Wars 1 where MHX notes that aside from her hunting down Saber-class Servants, she also has it out for Saberfaces. She actually notes how it's only a mild resemblance that Jeanne has to Artoria, but even that much is unforgivable, and so Jeanne must die too. That mild resemblance goes back to Fate/Zero, where Gilles de Rais believed that Artoria was Jeanne. Mordred is an in-universe homunculus copy of Artoria, and her original concept art pre-Apocrypha made it clearer by having her look exactly like a paler-haired palette-swap in different armour. Nero looks a lot more like Artoria when Takeuchi does the art, instead of being done in Wada Arco's more distinct style. Plus, the active intent behind her design back in Fate/Extra was to make people wonder 'WTF happened to Artoria?' before discovering that she's a separate person.
I think part of the reason that some Saberfaces don't look like Saberfaces is that they're drawn by different artists. If you look up Mordred and Nero drawn by Takeuchi they look much more like Artoria. Mordred's original design (which you can see in DEEN's FSN adaptation) looks exactly like Artoria, and Nero was designed by Takeuchi to look just like Artoria to trick people into buying Fate/Extra.
Was surprised "Animal Characteristics Servant" wasn't in this due to how some servants get it for just slapping on bunny ears while other VERY obviously animal traited servants don't have it for some reason.
From what I remember Baobhan sith has riding because, in her legend, she has goat feet, which she hides in game with her heel So the game basically says that she knows riding because she has the feet of a possible mount, so she is basically riding herself Also Carmella doesn't have riding, supposedly because she is using a car..and i guess cars are not epic enough to be considered a worthy mount... That or ,it's a joke about her not knowing how to drive because she runs people over
Kiyohime is canonically 12, and Van Gogh I think strongly gives off the vibe of like a 14 year old. Abby in says in Imaginary Scramble that it would be nice to have a friend closer to her age, referring to Van Gogh.
5:08 some of the goddesses there may not be able to turn in to pigs because of the Core of The Goddess skill, which basically able them to conserve their beauty no matter what happens to them, therefore they can't become bigs because it would make them "uglyer".
About the riding passive, It's the Saber class standard passive, such as archers having independent action, assassin's having presence concealment, casters having territory creation and berserkers having madness enhancement
The problem is it should be the RIDER standard passive given it is the skill that class is known for. Sabers like the Knights of the Round do have a good reason for having the riding passive but there isn't a good reason for a RIder class to not have the skill they are named for, unless you can find a rider that effectively has a "curse" or "Oath" that prevents them from riding the way Mandicardo can't use an actual sword,
@@truekurayami Both Magic Resistance and Riding are standard class skills for both Sabers and Riders, but the emphasis differs - Sabers tend towards stronger Magic Resistance, while Riders tend toward stronger Riding. Not an absolute rule, just a general trend.
@@truekurayami Any Servant can lose one of their class skills because it either goes against their legend, or they have something more specific that replaces it. Dedicated Riders naturally get specific replacements for Riding more than Sabers who get Riding as a side-gig, which is why it's ironically more common gor Riders not to have Riding.
The Riding skill can be finicky, but for basics... The Rider and Saber classes both get Riding as inherent class skills, so generally anyone in those classes gets it unless specified otherwise (some of the ship-riding Servants get a ship-specific variant skill like Voyage or Voyager of the Storm. Also a small number of Sabers suffer penalties that deprive them of the Riding skill, like Musashi who has historical anecdotes of falling off of a horse's back in combat). Certain other Servants in other classes may have Riding for certain reasons (the Lancer Artorias fighting on horseback, Altera the Santa on sheepback, MHX riding a spaceship...). At any rate, the Riding skill trait exists to mark that they're vulnerable to Archer Nobunaga's cavalry-busting Three-Line Formation NP, or Britomart's horseman-felling Penetrate Bladud.
Just commenting to emphasize that Riders and Sabers get Riding as a 'class' skill. It's not tied to their lore, but to the summoning system itself and how classes are represented, so no experience required. Servants in other classes (or even the same servant in a different class) can get Riding as a 'personal' skill, but not as a class skill. And sometimes personal skills may overwrite or alter class skills (like the pirates mentioned with Voyage/Voyager of the Storm). Of course, exceptions and broken rules dominate Fate lore, so... make of it what you will (one of the oddest, in my opinion, is Saber Alter's loss of Riding). It's also similar to how all Casters get Item Construction and Territory Creation, even if they weren't mages (exceptions may apply). >.>
Imo mordred is a saberface because she is a homunculus that comes from two other saberfaces, she may not look like saber but by blood or whatever she uses as blood she is a saberface
To be fair on Mordred, her original design before Apocrypha was a thing was exactly like Artoria, identical in art style as well. Not even 'original as in concept art', she did bear the same appearance save for armor in the FSN anime by studio Deen.
@@GarkKahn Especially when drawn by Takeuchi, for obvious reasons. A lot of Saberfaces are Saberfaces because despite having different art styles and flairs, in universe they're supposed to look eerily similar.
when the og visual novel came out (or maybe closer to hollow ataraxia) jeanne shows up at a literal saberface, the case with nero is similar before wada. look up the song THIS ILLUSION to get the gist of the designs
Imune to Pigify seems to be mostly related to actual High Servant/God Servants, with an additional caveat being given to mechanical servants (like Tametomo and Mecha Eli) and True Ancestors (Yu Meiren and Archtype Earth/Arcueid). Void Shiki is probably on here because since she reached the Void, she exists outside of the influence of standard magic? Honestly, the only two I see on here that doesn't make sense to me are Jiang Ziya/Tai Gong Wang and regular Romulus.
The riding trait for Suzuka just says that she is capable of riding any vehicle like Artoria, but I guess they just give her that trait because she jumps on her swords like in her extra attack animation, therefore "moving to various places just like if you were riding a mount or something".
According to Zero the rider skill applies itself to any vehicle that the servant rides on, meaning that it already is "Fork-lift certified", just not explicitly stated.
Sorta but that depends on the rank. SurfMo's riding skill manifests as one of her active skills cze she's "specialized". Okita having riding was a joke as it used (still kinda is) to be a requirement to be a saber. she just has it and is this qualifies as a saber instead of an assassin. Nero hacked her way with her IP skill altho she had the opposite situation but would rather not be summoned as a rider for personal reasons. Ceaser is questioning why he is a saber when he should be a rider. Most people think it's cze of his being very well known.
I think the deal here is that the company is not concerned with being entirely consistent in such things. Saberfaces seem to be split between "looks like Saber" and "Is naratively a Saber clone (who was made to resemble Saber just enough making it a self-fulfilling propechy)."
I feel like the Mordred and Nero art comparisons are unfair, they are clearly drawn by different artists in their own style so they will look further removed from the base Saber look, it is the same case with how you mentioned X Alter looks different, but other than the clothes she would look just like Saber Alter if X Alter was drawn by Takeuchi, the difference only being in the artist's personal style. Like for Nero, if you looked at Fate Extella's character art of Nero and Artoria (where they are done by the same artist), it is more clear that they are meant to look very similar to each other.
Child trait is for those characters Illya perceive as being children. Hans for example is a huge manchild. Also, Mordred is the original Saberface: preview.redd.it/br1jbftx8a371.png?auto=webp&s=9f92d3ff500b50470204ebe3f2b195a18608367a And here is the original design of Nero: preview.redd.it/6lr542mtx3151.jpg?auto=webp&s=30df3fa76d82de5476aab9c08b8e22b9680a7b10 I just realized the video is a joke.
I think you're missing the point that Saberfaces are people who look like Arturia *in universe*, So even if the style shifts canonically everyone sees doppleganger. Also Nero and Mordred are very bad examples, All Takeuchi art makes it very clear they're supposed to look the same and Mordred is literally a clone of Arturia in universe
If we are going on how Samurai were primarily trained, Any actual Samurai Servent should be a sword wielding Archer just like Archer Emiya first any other applicable class second.
Wait hold on during Valentines day doesn't Circi turn Babbage into a giant mechanical pig? How is he immune to the skill but still able to be turned into one? Or is it just the fact that he can't be turned into a normal pig so he's excluded on the ground that they would need to allow you to play as one of those boar robots for the Np to work on him?
@@EclipsedTwilight I guess but still seems weird that the game would chose a Servant who is "Immune" to the effect for the scene rather then just chosing a string of Servant who arn't.
The animal characteristics trait is also wonky. Artoria Ruler has it in her first Ascension because of her bunny ears, Astolfo Saber has it because of his bunny ears, and Shiki Saber, Scathcach Lancer, and Paul Bunyan have it thanks to having bunny eared costumes. But Elizabeth, with her horns and tail, Siegfried with his horns, tail and wings and Suzuka Gozen with her fox ears and tail don't have it. I thought maybe the dragons didn't count because they're dragons, but MELUSINE has the trait, too. Suzuka can't be denied for hers being fake, because literal costumes allow three servants to have the trait. THOMAS EDISON doesn't have the trait and he has a whole lion head. Caenis lacks it too, despite their horse ears. Red Hare has it, but Chiron doesn't have it. Not even for his 3rd Ascension. WACK
I agree, those traits make absolutely no sense in so many cases. IMO the devs hand them out either based on bias alone or maybe because they have certain gameplay reasons in mind (like certain combos or whatever) and choose to apply those traits ignoring possible lore conflicts in favor of said gameplay.
Combos/Counters for gameplay make sense for some of them in each catagory, like more people are going to have a possible version of MHX over a MoonCancer to fight Jalter, or an Avenger for Jeane, but other cases it seems like a needless nerf like Nobunaga being a sometimes anti-rider because the Namesake skill was left off of certain riders.
1:05 I glad you said that it wildly inconvenient in many ways especially the visual department and the very mature characters with a child body Asterio is a young Minotaur so he’s very big
in regards to Saber face. I think whoever is the artist for it has that unique Art style in regards to making the eyes, eyebrows and face in general. Like a signature per se. Yes I know they have similar faces, but the art style the way they are drawn is really unique. (like ritsuka in the animation series is not a saber face but look at the way his eyes, eyebrows, face features are drawn in. The style of drawing is similar to saber faces in other anime series). Which answers the question why nero, jalter, okita are there. Just look at the art style of the eyes alone. I know nero got a more unique eyes. But she is definitely a saber face. Thats why even though some servants are not regarded as a "saber face" they are called saber face because the art style is very similar. Take for example The art style of Saber, kotomine, rin's father, kiritsugu, natalia kaminski, in Fate/Zero, Look at how there face and eyes are drawn/designed. Very unique "art" or look and very similar to ritsuka in the Babylonia anime series (same look as saber face too well the art style of the eyes and face), the Temple of Time Movie etc. In the other hand, the saber in the original FSN where People die when they are killed. The art there is a bit more off. I assume they are not the same artist? I might be wong. edit: also fionn is definitely not a sabe face. That peon can die in a gutter.
I think you can categorize most of the Servants Immune to Pigify thusly: Gods (including High-Servants) and similar high-tier spiritual beings (Arcueid the True Ancestor/Archetype Earth; Yu-senpai, Taigong Wang, and Qin the Xians; and Kiichi Hogen the Tengu, which her profile states are high-tier Elementals; and possibly BB, but you could potentially put her in her own category based on her completely unique bullshit instead) Servants made entirely out of metal (other "mechanical" trait Servants like Danzo and Fran are made out of other things like wood or flesh respectively) "Pureblood" dragons (Melusine and possibly Vritra, but she's also a goddess) Void Shiki, because she's literally the Root and Ashwatthama who has me completely stumped. Maybe it's his Fury Incarnate skill.
From wiki "Ashwatthama was then made to surrender the gem on his forehead and cursed by Krishna for 3000 years that he will roam in the forests with loneliness, guilt, ulcers, blood and puss oozing out of his injuries crying for death but death would not meet him and no human will be able to heal him" Maybe he can't be pigged because he has an even more potent curse on him? Changing him into a pig might fall under "healing the wounds" bit.
You also forgotten the point, that BB (and, subsequently, her clones) is practically an AI from the Moon. So the fact that originally she's an entity without convenient body can be at play here (for example, she probably can instantly transform back). I'd have said that it's due to the fact that she's a foreign entity, and thus, ignores that spell, but Foreigners aren't immune to that, and being outside of normal rules is their whole schtick, so...
@@DarkeLourd Sitonai is an amalgamation of several beings, some of which were minor gods, if I remember her lore right. Name was taken from the most prominent. So, not necessarily true for her. Plus Super Orion isn't immune, and he's Grand Archer, isn't he? Douman though... Honestly, I'm not sure. Maybe properly translated 5.5 would explain it. After all he does have Alter Ego class, which, normally, means that servant isn't exactly what he seems to be. Or, maybe, I'm wrong, and you were right with that assumption. Who knows.
Essentially, Jeanne being Saberface is a sort of metajoke about how often Saber was confused to be Jeanne of Arc for the people who pread the VN blindly and didn't know the indentity of her. Urobuchi was one of them, that's why Gilles even was in Zero in the forst place - Uro wanted to have cahracter that would mistake, in the story, Saber for Jeanne.
Honestly, Nasuverse is great universe as the man spent a lot of time explaining everything as much as he can. But just like everything else it is not perfect, which we excepted as long as mostly everything else makes sense so-so. As for Saberface trait, it is hard to see similarity becuse the art is not consistent over the media (see original Archueid and remake one). In that case they are probably going with "whatever Takeuchi says" as he is the main artistof the franchise.
Some of these immune to piggify chars reasoning could be related to "shape" or "shape shifters that already are something else"? Like Caenis(poseidon blessing already altered her and Ushi tengu teacher are already shape shifted into something else magically, which would stop it? Babbage reality marble must make him have the robo body as he his father of computers etc, Gu-chan can just go and reshape herself. The divinities could be similar, as they are usually here the big gods attributed to something more specific, like Quetz is the sun, Romulus is Roma, so they cant be changed bc they are strongly connected to a concept
One thing I always did wonder was why Suzuka had the Riding Trait. It never really worked with her kit of being a Crit Buster servant, and she already doesn't have a whole lot of IRL lore to base it off of. But then I realized the naming of her upgraded first skill, "Divine Power (JK) B+", and realized it might be a joke around JKs and compensated dating. Which *kinda* fits, because they say that's what she manifested around for her base form. It was either that or a shrine maiden.
I’m guessing that being “Immune to Pigify” has another stipulation, that being it only works on organic creatures and/or something human. Like take another look at the list, note a lot of mechanical servants that are obviously inhuman (Babbage, the Mecha-Elis, QSH is literally a chad version of AM, and the Sakura 5 are mechanical), also monstrous units such as Hogen and Meiren. As to why Taigong (I think that’s his name?), Romulus as a human, and Parvati are immune? No clue.
I feel like if you showed someone who knows nothing about Fate Artoria and Nero together they'd think they're similar. Also, maybe the riding trait is actually based on riding your sexual partner, since that's literally how Medb became a rider.
Babbage and the robots might be immune because of their metal outsides maybe? The robots because they aren’t organic, and babbage because he’s permanently sealed in his armor
The reason Jeanne is considered a Saberface is because of Gilles mistaking Artoria for her in Fate Zero. They don't really look alike but he's fucking lost it in Caster form.
Your magic resistance idea about being immune to being turned into a pig is interesting... but the fact that Astolfo isn't immune to it despite having a book that can completely nullify all magecraft would _only_ make sense if they actively decided he has a weakness to transmogrification that cancels it out since Alcina turned him into a myrtle tree that one time... _BUT_ that happened before Logistilla gave him the book; being charmed and polymorphed by Alcina is actually _the very reason she gave him the book_ in the first place! I have no idea what the hell kind of drugs FGO is doing and no, I would not like some.
With regards to the Riding trait: as I understand matters, Riding is actually a Class Skill for the Saber class, which is why so many members of the class have the Riding trait. The trait is supposed to represent possession of the Riding skill. (Every Servant of a given Class is supposed to have its Class Skills; that's why they're called Class Skills, as opposed to Personal skills, which are based on the individual Servant's legends. Of course FGO just uses the terms to represent active and passive skills, but that's not how they're supposed to work.)
The “pigify” thing is only unable to affect things which lack worldly connection, sometimes by association, or were directly affected by gods. Pseudo servants are vessels for gods, thus overriding the human host’s intrinsic human trait. Some are pretty much gods, like Quetz or Romulus. Robots are excluded, explaining the Sakura 5 and mecha elis. Caenis had the Poseidon nonsense. Most of the alter egos contain very powerful divinities. This also explains the outer god foreigners. Unlike psuedo servants, the foreigners are simply conduits for outer gods power, rather than a vessel. Danzo is also not immune due to worldly connections. They were (historically) not a robot afaik.
Another odd one is animal characteristics from dark Koyan’s Slaughter beast troupe skill. It seems to just be a bunch of servants that featured in the lostbelts with a few exceptions and of course servants with bunny outfits. Barghest gets this trait when most of her dog traits are covered up as a servant, yet Baobhan sith’s secret deer hooves doesn’t count. Melusine also raises the question that dragons might count as a animal, if it’s just based on her name then there’s no reason Bao wouldn’t have it, and if it’s because dragons are animals then the entire Elizabeth crew and possibly even Artoria should count. Xiang Yu and Arjuna alter also don’t get this trait for some bizarre reason
I've always interpreted "Child Servant" as "Illya sees these characters as children like her". Which makes it funny to imagine that she legitimately thinks Anderson is just acting older then he is, like those kids who put on airs of maturity. Saberface is easy, if we/the characters in the series can be confused for Artoria, they're a Saberface. That means younger and older selves of Artoria, relatives of Artoria (Mordred is a Saberface considering she's a literal clone of Saber due to Morgan who is also a Saberface), Jeanne who Artoria was confused for and her clones (Lak and Jalter), Nero who was 100% looked like Saber during the first few appearances and changed artstyles when drawn by Wada Arco, a non-Takeuchi artist (a noticable trend for Saberfaces being drawn by Takeuchi), Okita who was also just kinda a joke about Saberfaces in general iirc and thus her clones are by extension. Fionn can't be confused as Artoria and nobody in the series or in the fanbase would even be able to be confused even if you squint hard enough. Immune to Pigify strike me as "Creatures that either are powerful enough to ignore it or don't have enough human to become pigs". That's why Babbage can't be piggified but Nezha can despite both being Mechanical, since one is a massive steampowered train calculator while is just artificially made.
You're not a child at 16 so I don't see why Artoria should be there, Helena is an adult while Hans has his form from when he was a child, Kiyohime is 12
The thing that always bothered me about trait stuff is you really find it in the game itself which is dumb and literally have to look online if you ever want to check something.
The Riding Skill is usually applied to small vehicles and horses, while Summer Camilla and Mordred would make sense to have this skill (Camilla's NP is a car, Mordred has a surfboard), it can be argued that Teach and Anne & Mary do not have this skill because they are captains, but drake has this skill, so that doesn't make sense either.
So the justification for much of the saber class having the riding trait is due to it being a class skill of Saber class, meaning that they all, under normal circumstances, have the riding skill of at least C or D. Also, the Riding Skill is more than handling mounts, it also grants the ability to steer vehicles, namely ships. Anne Bonny and Mary Read were always crew members of the ship they were on, never Captains, which means they didn't steer the ship likely, and they wouldn't have the Riding trait, or at least that's how I would justify it. EDIT: Also have to mention that Class Skills work the same way for most servants. Regardless of whether they had corresponding abilities in their life or legend, if the skill is Class Skill, if they are summoned in that class, under normal circumstances, they will have the skill, and abilities associated with it. No idea how to explain Blackbeard though, for all intents and purposes he should have the trait.
Forklift certified lmao it’s gunna be just moriarty, emiya, Babbage and the Mechaellies those on account of being forklifts. Holmes uses too many substances too qualify.
Nero and Jalter are inarguably Saberfaces. I can't prove it, but I suspect Nero is the character saberface was *coined to describe*. Nero looks like Saber for what are likely marketing reasons, and jokes about this are made in Carnival Phantasm. Jeanne canonically looks enough like Artoria that in Zero, Artoria was mistaken for her by Gilles. Seeing as Zero's source material came out before Apocrypha's, it's also safe to say Jeanne was designed to look like "saber, but different" again. I agree with you on Mordred, though.
A teenager or adolescent isnt a child.....in regards of Artoria its just her body that is 16/15 and Im talking about OG Artoria. Lily and Castoria are actually 16/15 and I wouldnt consider them a child too. I also think that the comparison of the saber faces are super farfetched. MHX is Salter technically but drawn by an other artist thats why she looks different. For example Lartoria (adult body artoria) has also a different artist. So not even the OG Artoria versions have all the same Artist. Jalter would be better compared to Salter who is Artorias alter and has more similar colo scheme and you have the same comparison as Jeanne and Artoria, Mordred is Artorias clone and has the same face, its more that the Apoc artist draws very different and if you compare his drawings of Artoria with Modred they look much more alike. Nero is also different bc of Wada arcos style if you find pics of them being drawn by either both by Takeuchi or Wada then it makes sense. Saber Lily and Jeanne lily are not the same age at all, Jeanne lily appears to be 8 or ot most 10, while lily is 15/16 thats not the same....
I think the reasoning for Babbage and the Meka Eli's being immune to Pigify is because they're mechanical Also, weird how Odysseus DOESN'T have the trait, but has it as a passive that he is immune to pigify
As someone who just finished Yuga Kshetra with a fixed team, that Immune to Pigify one hurt me since Circe was on said team. So, it wasn't just my bad luck that no important enemies turned to pigs, it was also mechanics too? 😂
Huh. I wonder, why Klidge ignored "kemono" trait. It's also extremely strange at some points. Like, why Scathach and Bunyan having a bunny suit qualify them for it, yet Bunnytoria with the same f-ing type of clothing doesn't? Why Ibuki Douji, Vritra and Gorgon qualify, yet Nitocris doesn't? Also, Kiichi Hogen, you know, tengu, youkai with bird head?... Yep, you've guessed it right, she also doesn't have trait. What, she is without any obvious animal parts? Ok, I'd grant you that. Then look at Queen of Sheba, who have f-ing animal ears (not sure if they're supposed to be cat ears, or smth else)! Ding, ding! Also not a "kemono"! 'Well, she's a human, and those ears are just a random shit.' By that logic Dobrynya is out too, right? Nope, she, unexpectedly, does have "kemono" trait. And, yeah, "unexpectedly", 'cause she's literally in the same situation as Sheba. Fgo devs literally say "f*ck that logic thingie". So don't try to find it. P.S. Also, Ishtar have good alignment, but Ereshkigal, despite being as kind (if not kinder) as her sister, is considered as evil. You can argue, that Eresh is practically a goddess of death, but Ishtar is a goddess of war (besides everything else), so by that logic she also should be evil. Ah, as another "fun" and "pleasing" point - Melt (who is a f-ing sadist) is also of good alignment. Deal with it.
