Hi Daniel. I am also a retired chemist and a long time follower of your channel and occasional commenter. I’ve made the same argument re surface reactions on coins being technically “damage” to that surface, vs assertions by numismatists like John Albanese of CAC that ugly toned coins are desirable because they display originality. Nope - the original coin surface was consumed during the process of toning. Re storage, I have used Intercept slab boxes to store coins for decades. The concept was invented by an individual at Bell Labs and used the principle of sacrificial reaction to protect other metals. The inner dark liner of those boxes is infused with copper which reacts with toning gasses and locks them up so they can’t react with coin metal. Unfortunately, the copper has a limited absorption capacity and indicates by turning black that it is spent. Wizard is where I’ve bought mine. Hope this is useful.
Good morning Daniel, I’ve been a machinist for 52 years and knowing what happens to different metals and materials has been something I’ve paid attention to. Thank you for sharing this with us and I’ll be getting the book today after work 😂
You did a video with this book back at the end of April or the first part of May just before the Richmond, VA coin show. The first day of the show there was a guy who had a bunch of supplies & numismatic books who had two copies of that "Coin Chemistry" & because of your video I bought one. When I went back the second day the other book was gone. I haven't read the entire thing but the little that I have looked at it's a great wealth of knowledge & should be something that any serious collector has in their collection. I've been collecting for more than 20 yrs & had never heard of this book until your video so it's great that you shared this so thank you!
I buy charcoal dehumidifiers from dollar tree and keep them in my safe. It's amazing how fast the bottom part of it fills up with water. Silica gel packs work too but they don't last long and there's no good way to tell when they need to be replaced
Thanks for the info Daniel, I think what gets people upset about cleaning coins is that it is so easy to do it the wrong way. And once incorrectly cleaned it is just one more damaged coin lost to the rest of the coin collecting world. Most people have no business trying to clean coins so it is easier, safer? to say don't clean your coins. You are a professional and I have no problem with what you do, I am just a little uneasy about lay people thinking they should clean their coins.
Yes you can. Just because someone has a degree does not make them an expert that cannot be challenged. Science by definition and through the scientific method challenges the status quo
In 1987 i found a 21 morgan in what i would guess is BU, bright silver, in a whip cream bowl in the closet with other pocket junk. Ive had the coin ever since, no special handling, no special official holder. Its been loose in a tin or jar for years and many more years kept in a zip lock bag and it has no sign of tone at all.
Thanks Daniel, very informative. I got started in coins buying junk Morgans and Peace dollars. Some are in flips, some are in capsules (the better ones). Some are black on one side and fine on the other. Some look like they were glued to a brown paper bag. I have one coated in gold and another that the reverse is painted blue. My intent is to some day clean them, first by just washing them with dish soap. Then maybe some E Z Est.
Copper is a very reactive metal. it's just waiting to expel any free Cu ions. I'm assuming this results in the toning process too. Chlorine really facilitates this reaction and is easily visible, to the human eye. You'll see your pennies turn pinkish/red and for the most part damaged beyond restoration.
People carved buffalo nickels during the great depression. They usually make the indian on the front look like a 'hobo' with various jackets, smoking, etc. The reverse was also sometimes carved, sometimes to look like a train the hobo was travelling on. There are some well-known artists from the '30's who have distinctive marks on their work and are coveted by collectors. There are also some modern artists with their own take on this medium. These are essentially always carved on VF or lower pieces, but well-carved specimens from well-known artists can go for north of $300. Something similar, but not as widely collectible, is trade dollars carved to make it look as though lady Liberty is sitting on the toilet. I think they are called 'potty dollars'.
DAMAGE defined: physical harm caused to something in such a way as to impair its value, usefulness, or normal function. None of this applies to toning. Corrosion, the reaction of two or more dissimilar materials making contact, airborn or otherwise, IS damage and often leads to pitting. Toning refers to a change of color and is visual in nature; just like the hobby. It can be attractive or unattractive but is still not damage. The fact that attractive toning ofter demands an increased premium supports that it's not damage. At least thanks for the topic.
Incorrect, mint errors are damaged, waffled coins are damaged, hobo carved coins are damaged and yet they have more value than regular coins. Toning is corrosion that causes a change in color, it's not just a change in color. You used the only part of the definition of damage that made you correct and ignored the rest. Words are much more complicated then using just part of their meaning. Read the comments and the book, three chemist are telling you it is indeed damage, your opinion is wrong.
@@CoinHELPu Please stay on topic. This has nothig to do with mint errors and I used the entire definition of damage. No chemistry class I attended ever described a molecular add, remove, or change as "damage". As to the chemists, there are many types. Hopefully the authors are physical chemists. My opinion, and the opinions of many others you've argued with over this, are not wrong. They're just not yours. Your page so you can have the last word.
It is damage to a coin, it’s not my opinion. You’re ignoring most of the lexicon of damaged and its uses. You used the simple version. Just because some toning is colorful and some coins are worth more doesn’t mean it’s not damaged. Most people prefer white coins with little toning and untoned coins are worth more over the entire market. So there is a a loss of value. Bright white coins are worth more in the market, sell for more and sell the most, while most toned coins loose value and are damaged coins and less desirable. I’ve been in this business all my life and colorful toned coins with eye appeal are rare and not the whole. I am on topic, we collect damaged coins and physical or chemical is all the same as damaged. It’s not my opinion, it’s a fact and they don’t have to be any kind of chemist to give you the exact chemical reactions that cause toning which is a form of rust. It changed the chemical properties of the coins surface alloy.
Toning is damage and toning is a chemical reaction that changes the composition of the metal. Ask a chemist, you’re incorrect, it’s just like rust in steel.
@CoinHELPu you are spreading incorrect information. Per the American Numismatic Association a damaged coin is ," a coin that has been impaired apart from normal wear, by scraping, drilling polishing or other abuse..." ANA Grading Standards, pg 370. Further more just because one person (white) says toning is damage does not mean it is. Your creating anxiety and hype in these videos with click baitntitles to increase your viewership which is unprofessional and unbecoming of someone who should be a pillar in the industry
It is YOU who is spreading misinformation, about this subject and about me. I could care less what you think of me or my titles. I’ve educated and helped more people this week alone than you have all your life. Toning is like rust on steal, it’s a fact. If you think rust or oxidation isn’t damage then you need some chemistry classes and need to take a long look in the mirror. People like you keep the hobby from moving forward and away from opinions and subjectivity. My reputation isn’t defined by you, you have no authority or voice, just trying to piggyback on my video comments.
@@justinpickar1755 Just because the ANA doesn't mention oxidation as a form of damaged does not validate your incorrect opinion. "Other abuse" covers toning or anything the ANA didn't mention. Anyone who knows chemistry knows that toning is damaged and you're wrong for insulting me over it.
Well if you say incorrect things don't get offended when people call it out. Your videos are offensive. You make absolute claim which are not absolute. You are not THE authority on toning.
Hickock45 has a very heartfelt and to the point video about how there’s too much hate, especially here in social media. Always like 👍 never hate like grandma said if you ain’t got nothing nice to say keep your mouth shut, unless they step on your toes!
Thank you once again Daniel for the great info . We coin collectors would be poorer with out yer videos . I bought Intercept years ago . They work great . Well worth the price too keep yer coins the best you can . You are one of the best out here . Tom Daytona Beach , FL. 26, June 2024 .
What A Chemist Said About Toned Coins - How To Protect Coins. In this video you will learn what a chemist said about coin toning, how to restore coins and how to prevent toning and properly store your coins. It doesn't matter if your coins are nickel, copper, silver or gold, this is how you prevent toning which is damage and tarnish. Join this channel to get access to perks: ru-vid.com/show-UCIYtW3byS0u7rBmXg71pXQwjoin Buy Coins From Us: portsmouthcoinshop.com/ CoinHelpu Community coinauctionshelp.com/welcome-to-coinhelpu-community/ Coin Value App: coinauctionshelp.com/coincollectingapps/ Mint Error App: errorcoins.coinauctionshelp.com/wordpress/
Nice show today Daniel ! Interesting comments. Stay calm. 😉😄 I myself use primarily the Leuchtturm Ultra Intercept capsules for storing my more valuable coins, some gold included. I buy from Lighthouse but i need to check out Wizard now. I do have one coin im worried about - 1883 O Morgan, NGC MS66 when i bought it, with beautiful rainbow toning in half moon on reverse. You saw a picture of it some time ago. The toning is spreading to almost whole reverse. Not sure if im going to do anything about it but i think ill try to find a copy of the book you noted. Thx again for a good show.
Thanks Daniel. While I understand toning is a damage to a coin, once in awhile, I dont mind an edge toned Morgan. Overall though, I prefer them blast white and my copper to stay as red as it can be. I'll check this out for sure.
Isn't using toning retardants considered cleaning? If your going to dig down to the molecular level for nits to pick that would mean there is no such thing as a perfect MS 70 grade. As soon as the coin leaves the die it is exposed to the atmosphere and starts to oxidize and therefore technically it is no longer perfect.
Hey Daniel, I'm a new comer to the channel...I'm wondering which grading service is best for someone who occasionally wants to submit a coin...The process seems so freaking difficult to decipher...I'm not sure if I'm going to end up owing them $kk's of dollars...I can't possibly be the only one...thanks Michael
Just to be as blunt as you are, your ignorance is astounding. Toning is tarnish as rust is to steal, toning is damage to a coin. It’s a chemical reaction, it is a well known chemical reaction that is not supposed to happen to a coin. Using another chemical reaction to reverse the damage doesn’t harm the coin, that surface has already been harmed. Buy the book I showed so you can learn the facts. I can't help you with trust issues.
