What HAPPENED?!?! MSI Claw 155H vs 135H vs ROG Ally Z1 & Z1 Extreme // Benchmarks & PC Gaming

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👉 In this video, we will be following up to my in-depth coverage of ‪@MSIGamingOfficial‬'s first entry in the Windows-based handheld market, with the MSI Claw. This time around, we will be focusing in on the Core Ultra 7 155H model and see how it compares against its cheaper and less powerful sibling, the Core Ultra 5 135H variant. Not only that, we will be examining Intel's driver updates as well as putting the MSI Claw against the ‪@asusrog‬ ROG Ally with the AMD Ryzen based Z1 and Z1 Extreme processors using in-game benchmarks as well as actual gameplay comparisons.
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📑CHAPTERS:
00:00 Intro
01:55 Benchmarks
03:19 In-Game Benchmarks
07:00 Old Drivers (5333) vs New Drivers (5379)
08:47 135H vs 155H (God of War)
09:40 Forza Horizon 5 (135H vs 155H vs Z1 vs Z1 Extreme)
11:40 Diablo 4
12:40 Hogwart's Legacy
13:42 Control
14:29 Red Dead Redemption II
15:49 Spider-man Remastered
16:51 Horizon Forbidden West
17:32 What do you think is happening?
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+++Please let me know what you think and how I can improve. I'd love to continue producing more YT videos and have plenty of content planned. Thank you for your support!+++
*This video is not sponsored. The product shown here was purchased by me for the purpose of this review. This video is for educational purposes only.
#amd #intel #pcgaming #asus #msi #rogally #msiclaw #coreultra #ryzen #handheld #pcgames #benchmarks #onexplayer #legiongo #steamdeck

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Опубликовано:

22 июн 2024

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Комментарии : 110

@retrotechdad 2 месяца назад

Did the results surprise you? Do you think we can see some improvements here?

@MichaOstrowski 2 месяца назад

3DMark's Time Spy CPU test is about the most irrelevant thing there is. The entire thing has dubious validity, but that one is extra dumb.

@retrotechdad 2 месяца назад

Which is why you always test further with different benchmarks using a combination of synthetic, in-game, and actual gameplay.

@Muhluri 2 месяца назад

Weird how it performs great in benchmarks then falls apart in actual gameplay

@retrotechdad 2 месяца назад

For sure, we see some hints of the performance capabilities but for the most part, the Z1E stays ahead.

@killthemessenger84 2 месяца назад

The problem is power efficiency

@haysen123 2 месяца назад

The temperature is concerning on intel still

@julianojosoa2145 2 месяца назад

That's Intel products in general

@TheRealConflictedGaming 2 месяца назад

I think it’s suffering from the arc experience, should be great but awful optimization and poor drivers.

@ryukuuchiwa 2 месяца назад

Thanks, very complete test

@retrotechdad 2 месяца назад

Thank you, I'm glad it was useful! 🙏

@GameTechTalk 2 месяца назад

Oh it releassed today! Sweet :)

@retrotechdad 2 месяца назад

🔥🔥 Hustled to get this out!

@macky10229 2 месяца назад

nice video @9:44 what TDP are you using on all devices?

@retrotechdad 2 месяца назад

Best performance presets available for each device. In other words, MSI Claw is set to Performance modes (~35w TDP) and the ROG Allys are set to Turbo mode (~25w TDP).

@MichaOstrowski 2 месяца назад

One thing that's missing here for me are Ally gaming tests with CPU Boost disabled (which I assume was enabled). With framerates as they are, I found that the extra CPU power is way more useful for emulation (Switch, PS3, to some extent PS2) than for native games that will load the GPU more.

@retrotechdad 2 месяца назад

Thought about doing emulation comparisons as well. I suspect the Z1E will still pull ahead based on what I've seen individually when doing emulation. The Core Ultra processors don't support AVX 512, which is particularly useful for PS3 emulation.

@MichaOstrowski 2 месяца назад

@@retrotechdad that's possible, and still a damn shame. Maybe you could test if the latest Intel driver fixes Xenia? I've recently tried GOW Judgment and aside from very minor graphical glitches, once shader compilation settles down, I've got no problems getting to 30FPS without disabling any graphical effects on Z1E Ally using 15W TDP without CPU boost.

@JoeysRetroHandhelds 2 месяца назад

So, keep my Ally? WHAT DO I DO ROBERT?

@retrotechdad 2 месяца назад

I think you know the answer, Joey 😅 I still think there are things you will like about the Claw. 🤗

@K543 2 месяца назад

pcode/Firmware current? Do you have bios E1T41IMS.105 installed?

@cppctek 2 месяца назад

Avg fps doesn’t paint the clearest picture. The 1% lows are really bad on the claw esp in cod and tons of issues with games just not running at all as well as menu freezing. The ally is the only one I’d suggest buying today

@retrotechdad 2 месяца назад

For sure, and it will vary on a per-game basis. The Ally (both models) are the better choices right now easily based on current price, performance, and maturity with drivers and software.

@chocho2188 Месяц назад

Thanks Rob 🙂

@StubbsStuff 2 месяца назад

Still so crazy, 135H is winrar! Great video, different vibe but i really enjoyed it 🎉

@retrotechdad 2 месяца назад

Yup, just straight into the numbers for this one! 🙏

@Muhluri 2 месяца назад

Haha winrar

@Mrbowgod 2 месяца назад

like some other reviewers stated before (ETA Prime and Retro Game Corps) it has to be a power struggle with the amount of cores the CPU has vs the onboard graphics. The core ultras might out perform the z1 extreme if there was an option to disable some of the cores to get more power to the GPU. But that is something msi and intel have to figure out.

@zenbyo 21 день назад

Not only that but the 135H intel model has faster VRAM along with less cores to power which is most likely why it trades blows (with the 155) so well. Those intel cpu's aren't sweating at all. I can't wait for the Lunar Lake chips.

@LiquidTens 2 месяца назад

Imo it is not about unmature drivers. Z1 extreme is more powerful here. Time to time. I don´t know how MSI is selling this product. Why someone would buy one?

@retrotechdad 2 месяца назад

Not on paper though, the 155H in theory has the power but falls apart when going in-game. We can see the performance there for some games with the 135H/155H but for the most part the Z1E does stay ahead. Agreed though, the value is not there at least not today.

@LiquidTens 2 месяца назад

@@retrotechdad agree but sometimes no more power has to be directly better in videogames. Even if they get similar performance in the near future (give me the benefit of the doubt) how are they solve that high temps and energy consumption? Great job at the video dude but the games you say performs better is slightly. And what about the cross and de L1 R1 buttons? MSI 👎

@mgsan4702 2 месяца назад

@@retrotechdad Because of ARC GPU..? Can driver fix issue? When Ally first came out do it have issues like this(low fps in games)?

@fyrebryan Месяц назад

What happens when you disable some of the cpu cores to reduce power needed by the cpu? Seems pretty clear the cpu and gpu are fighting for power.

@user-wx9oj2gv9u 2 месяца назад

This just proves that companies now targets benchmarking system to boost sales in poorly performing devices not actual gameplay performance. Basically scam-ish kind of thing, as long as it sells.

@retrotechdad 2 месяца назад

Yea, I wouldn't go based on just synthetic benchmarks alone. At the end of day, how it performs in-game matters the most. 💪💪

@shura4136 2 месяца назад

Can you do an updated review of the onexfly, please,

@retrotechdad 2 месяца назад

What would you like to know? 🙏

@shura4136 2 месяца назад

@retrotechdad I would like to know how well. It's held up with all the games you played with it so far. Have you had any issues and would love to see if it can run these games well Call of duty mw3 the most recent if you have it helldivers 2 and a new game that comes out on April 5th called bmx streets I'm willing to wait until the 5th before I buy the onexfly because that's the game I'm most likely going to play the most on it and how long the battery lasts on AAA games with use edit and would love a howto set it up out of the box 🙏

@animationalltout3134 2 месяца назад

Hy bro is there a huge difference between the z1 and the z1 extreme regarding ps3 emulation?

@badass6300 16 дней назад

Not really, they are pretty similar.

@animationalltout3134 14 дней назад

@@badass6300 Good !!!!!

@Shenron67 2 месяца назад

I don't have any x86 device like this, can you tweak the bios ? If not, can you use ThrottleStop ? We all know that Intel loves to burn energy like good old Netburst. Considering that the "125w TDP" of the 14900k still allow it to take up to 282w, I wouldn't be surprised that there's just not enough room for all the cores. See the TPU review with the 14900k down to 35w where there's just not enough power for the p-core.

@retrotechdad 2 месяца назад

100% there's too many cores and not enough power here. We know that more power helps with these chips. The BIOS can be unlocked to modify advanced settings, which is nice. Unfortunately, disabling certain cores doesn't seem to matter much so there's something else going on here.

@MichaOstrowski 2 месяца назад

The Phawx already tried disabling e-cores. It hasn't helped.

@dingodoobie6269 2 месяца назад

Great review! Seen a few of your vids now, got a like and a sub from me :) Got an Ally and SD myself, so not fan boying intel. I do think they have done an ok job here, the pricing of the Claw is the main problem currently though. I'm pretty sure, given some time, that driver updates and BIOS optimisations will massively improve performance and bring it in line with the Z1E and even ahead in some titles. Intel is the underdog here whether people want to admit it or not, they haven't had the time nor experience with optimising drivers for gaming specifically, they have in the past only focused on compliance; compliance != optimised. Their massive improvements between driver versions on Arc is kind of proof of this fact. Out of interest, have you tried using DXVK for DX11 titles? Similarly, have you thought about trying a Linux variant where VKD3D (DX12 translation layer) is easier to get working? I've seen some videos showcasing DXVK on Windows and giving what seems to be massive improvements over native DX11 in performance in some cases on desktop Arc graphics, it makes me wonder if that would be the same here on the iGPUs. I would check myself but I don't have the cash spare for a Claw haha

@retrotechdad 2 месяца назад

Thank you for the kind words and the sub! 🙏🙏 You've got me very intrigued about DXVK, I need to look into this a bit!

@dingodoobie6269 2 месяца назад

Fallout 4 is a good one to test to make sure you've got the general process right, it gets an improvement regardless of CPU GPU manufacturer due to its ridiculous amount of draw calls (puts a ridiculous load on the main CPU thread); DXVK optimises this away. From my own testing on the Ally, mostly 60fps at 1080p high settings is possible at 12W with DXVK. Using native DX11 with those settings at 12W results in 30-50fps and sometimes dips below 30. Not all games benefit, but many do. GTA IV is another that often benefits from DXVK that immediately comes to mind, much smoother frame pacing in most cases. Iirc, Intel actually make/made use of DXVK for their DX9 driver

@arield1899 2 месяца назад

How are you, what a great video, check out, please recommend me the normal ASUS ROG Ally Z1 ? would I use only portable, many indie and triple AAA that work at 30/40 at 720p would be happy ? Thank you very much, I hope you can help me.

@retrotechdad 2 месяца назад

If you can get the Z1 ROG Ally for a good price, it's very capable and based on your needs should be plenty powerful! 🙏

@MrSkipLim 2 месяца назад

DX11 test plz

@Cosmonautchronicles 2 месяца назад

I got my Z1 Ally open box. It’s the best deal in gaming!

@MitchellKuykendall 2 месяца назад

I think I might be insane but I'm still going to get the MSI Claw. Intel improved the drivers on the desktop Arc GPU's so significantly and they've already sent out multiple driver updates for the 155h in the past few months with the latest being march 20th. I'm really rooting for Intel to succeed in gaming!

@retrotechdad 2 месяца назад

The funny thing is the actual hardware is pretty nice. I like the comfort of the Claw quite a bit.

@andrejasofrenovic3425 2 месяца назад

I'm honestly surprised that the base Z1 didn't perform much worse.

@retrotechdad 2 месяца назад

Agreed! I think the Z1 was overlooked because of how expensive it was initially. Nowadays, it's a bit more interesting since you can find it for as cheap as 299 USD open box.

@Narshtashkia 2 месяца назад

Those higher temperatures and less performances is crazy.

@alderlake12th 2 месяца назад

Intel need to made some specific models for these handheld console The Ultra 7 is an example, we wont need as much cores as it have Should be 8P+2LP only

@retrotechdad 2 месяца назад

It would be really cool to see something that is specifically tailored for a handheld device!

@karathkasun 2 месяца назад

135H and 155H have the same iGPU, but the 155H has two more cores to feed with power. At equal power limits the 135H will have more GPU grunt because it has more power available to the iGPU or for more core turbo. Higher frequencies tend to help more than cores for the large majority of games.

@zenbyo 21 день назад

Faster vram too in the 135h.

@karathkasun 21 день назад

@@zenbyo VRAM = system RAM, both are LPDDR5 6400

@zenbyo 20 дней назад

@@karathkasun You're right i had it confused. The CPU in the Ultra 5 does have a higher base clock at 1.7ghz even though it doesnt have the turbo boost option so it's headroom isn't as high.

@TRX25EX 2 месяца назад

I think MSI took Intel because they got a long term contract with Intel, so they can get their next gens of APUs or ARM chips..... I just wonder how good is Qualcomm X Elite cause it might change Handheld market for good if done right, apparently it can emulate not supported games with near 0 compromise in performance.....

@retrotechdad 2 месяца назад

Very excited for the Qualcomm X Elite!

@robras2850 2 месяца назад

I need an ally 2 oled and a safe sd card slot and more battery

@djmorris666 2 месяца назад

The issues are two: arc drivers are still improving (as the desktop gpus show), plus the price is way to high. At 300-400 this would be a good entry level device

@retrotechdad 2 месяца назад

Agreed, I've said it before but Intel does need to compete somewhere whether it's on price, performance or potentially both.

@kaimmjattzz Месяц назад

Ally z1 extreme still 🐐

@retrotechdad Месяц назад

Agreed!

@antonhorvath2725 2 месяца назад

I think that the difference between 135H and 155H will become apparent at a higher power, since they have a peak of 115W, but CLAW will give them only 35W, so they will not narrow their advantages.

@retrotechdad 2 месяца назад

I'd actually be very curious at what it can do at that peak. I wonder if there is any hardware out there that allows for the full capabilities. 🤔🤔

@Veddy74 2 месяца назад

Call it reminds me of the pentium 4 VS the AMD.Athlon

@retrotechdad 2 месяца назад

Good 'ol days! 🤗🤗

@TinTalon 2 месяца назад

Interesting. Maybe a future firmware update could help the 155H?

@retrotechdad 2 месяца назад

I hope we do see some improvements with the drivers from Intel. I think anything they can do to help close the gap is needed here for sure.

@Sadtiric 2 месяца назад

Huh... they're multiplying?!

@retrotechdad 2 месяца назад

🤣🤣🤣

@garys6898 2 месяца назад

Why is the legion go always left out?

@retrotechdad 2 месяца назад

I can definitely include the Go next time around. Performance should be similar because of the Z1 Extreme.

@garys6898 2 месяца назад

@@retrotechdad I hear you but I have the ally and the legion and I think the legion performs a little better especially when I throw 30 watts at it

@samsungfan1982 2 месяца назад

Even though Intel made the attempt in the handheld market, the price to performance just doesn’t cut it when there are better devices for less. I was excited for this one too.

@retrotechdad 2 месяца назад

Agreed, either they need to be more competitive on price or performance and in an ideal world, both.

@richieb9675 2 месяца назад

Its a brand new device with a new chip…it will mature overtime and get better and better. It took Ally 7 months, LeGo 4 months. And yes i did perform better as the Claw now at the start. MSI did releae it too early. Price and performance doesnt fit now….but it will get there

@samsungfan1982 2 месяца назад

I really hope so. It looks so good and promising!

@MrCcfly 2 месяца назад

@@richieb9675 with intel inside u will get what u get now ..

@alphaomega154 2 месяца назад

this is why common people/consumers should learn to research and read the DETAILED SPECS of electronic products before buying. you are tasking those devices for GAMING. and UNLIKE the AMD Z1 and Z1extreme which each has DIFFERENT set of iGPU, the intel's 135H and 155H SHARES EXACTLY THE SAME iGPU. and in "gaming" you are relying on the graphics processors. more than the CPU. for CPU specific tasks, the 155H sails ahead of the 135H and even the AMD Z1 extreme. and just to add more, again, UNLIKE the AMD Z1 and Z1 extreme, the core ultra chip inside those intel based "gaming" hendhelds are STANDARD core ultra chips that you find in many intel based THIN ultrabook type of laptops. which are NOT gaming laptops. they are "business"/office work oriented. despite the "arc" name on the iGPU that dont means its synonymous to gaming. "arc" iGPU line up effectively replaces the old iris iGPU. thats all. the gaming oriented ones are in the DISCRETE ONES. like those you find in MINI PC like intel's NUC 12. which has DISCRETE arc A770mobile GPU. that one will sail miles ahead of the radeon 780m in the Z1 extreme. but again, since the 780m is an iGPU the A770M should instead compare to AMD''s mobile discrete GPU like the 7800M XT. so "what happened"? thats what happened. the handheld devices that adopts the intel's core ultra FORGOT or deliberately FORGOT to order for a CUSTOM CHIP from intel that comes with gaming fitting type something like arc 770M. while the AMD based handhelds uses CUSTOM chips. by the way i support the idea of people start to move towards "low voltage" side of things in consumer level computing tasks/purposes. also since the ARM64 would be a common PC chip format soon. you know, for the planet. (do you realize how CHEAP those mini PC these days? like those intel NUC that has core ultra 155H and discrete A770M. WAAAY cheaper than alienware beefy gaming laptop and performing similar. im not promoting intel here, but go CHECK THE MINI PC STUFF. its CHEAP and it is ABLE.).

@tortandt 2 месяца назад

It's strange that Intel always uses up 16GB of memory.

@crestofhonor2349 2 месяца назад

It likely has to do with a combination of drivers and too much CPU boost where the CPU takes too much from the GPU. Intel never has been great with drivers and you can see how much some of their Intel Arc dGPUs have improved with drivers. The Arc A770 performs vastly better today than it did at launch. Overall Intel needs to have a better designed chip for handhelds as the MSI Claw has the potential of being very good with that large battery

@skystoure6756 2 месяца назад

LEGION ALL THE WAY!

@raguel259 2 месяца назад

Intel processors have too many cores. The Steam Deck has only four CPU cores and has excellent performance because the CPU and GPU do not fight for power, which is probably the reason why the 135H can perform better in games than the 155H despite having fewer CPU cores.

@cqllel5186 2 месяца назад

MSi CLAW at 30W can't even match Steam Deck/OLED at 15W and less in game performance

@Gh0styGames 2 месяца назад

🤔

@retrotechdad 2 месяца назад

What do you think, Ghosty?

@Gh0styGames 2 месяца назад

@@retrotechdad Intel igpu useless as usual only difference is they hyped it this time 💀 feel bad for ppl that copped claw

@VatchGaming 2 месяца назад

I think it's because its a garbage.

@MrCcfly 2 месяца назад

lol intel

@djmorris666 2 месяца назад

Competition is good and really needed… nothing to lol about

@retrotechdad 2 месяца назад

@@djmorris666 Exactly 🙏🙏

@MrCcfly 2 месяца назад

@@djmorris666 intel cant compete with arm consoles let alone with amd console so LOL

@HDRPC 2 месяца назад

Z1 consumes more power than Ultra 5 and 7 and almost same performance in forza 5.

@retrotechdad 2 месяца назад

It doesn't. You need to look at the total power for the Intel chips. Regardless, FH5 numbers between the three are quite close overall.

@HDRPC 2 месяца назад

@@retrotechdad i just saw in saw video. Those watt is total SoC power means CPU+iGPU combined. Forza 5, Intel and Z1 is consuming almost similar power. You are not showing power of z1 extreme most of the time. I have ultra 5 125H Galaxy Book 4 Pro and it is giving me 100 fps average with 82 fps 1% lows in GTA 5 in 28 watt using built in benchmark. I am going to do more testing and i will upload many many games testing. I also did BATTERY drain test.

@retrotechdad 2 месяца назад

@@HDRPC AMD and Intel are represented differently in HWinfo.

@HDRPC 2 месяца назад

@@retrotechdad i did testing. Hwinfo shows CPU package power and msi after burner Riva tuner shows GPU power, both are showing similar power means CPU package power is total SoC power CPU+iGPU combined. GPU power of msi afterburner is also total SoC power means CPU+iGPU combined.

@HDRPC 2 месяца назад

@@retrotechdad hwinfo cpu package power remain at 3 to 4 watt in online video playback means total chip power, CPU+iGPU+Ram. If it was above 4 watt so it will never be able to provide 11 to 12 hours of online video streaming with 62Wh BATTERY capacity of Galaxy Book 4 Pro 14".