What If Diary Riddle Came Back? | Harry Potter Film Theory 

But would he know that he loses his nose?

That version always had a nose

He’s be picking it for days

@@pokebreederrichard1200 I mean somebody would notice and mention it and then I'm pretty sure first time anyone has the sort of God your Gryffindor anywhere near him it would just so happen to nip his nose off

now i imagine tom riddle running around the castle, telling everyone, in a similar way of that video of Darth vader telling everytone he has children (think it was HITHE)

I was thinking that too, but technically this part of soul was detached before Voldemort attempted to kill Harry. Given that things like knowledge and power seemingly wouldn't have passed from the Voldemort that "died" to the diary Tom Riddle's resurrection, I don't think the protection from Lily would work either.

@@hyperspark2360 I'm not so sure. If it would work why would riddle in the diary be able to take Harry inside. Wouldn't that harm him/cause him pain?

@@poxidog Harry and Voldemort spend a lot of time in each others heads, so answer is Harry’s scar would hurt which it did

Will kinda hard to hug him to death when riddle just uses avada kadavra fron 15 meters.

Why would he let him do this tho

This is a good argument but it might be possible that Harry, having quidditch reflexes, would be able to avoid it from being taken.

@@zenbladejs I’m down for this solution. It would’ve been cool to see Harry quick reflex disarm him

Thats the payoff for showing Ron's faulty wand

This is a good point, even if he learned what and how, repeating or improving upon all those to regain that power would likely make things take longer.

Adult voldamort is a ghost and not strong at all

I agree. He might have more drive and charisma, but less knowledge and lived experience. So things might not happen as quickly as Ben thinks. I think Riddle also could potentially have different goals, considering the dairy was made before the gaunt ring. He hasn't had the same punch to the gut about his parents yet, which seemed pretty foundational to his motivations and hatred towards muggles. Sure, before that he disliked them from his time in the orphanage and thought himself better than them, but he also thought himself better than everybody. It was learning about his parents that seemed to make it a true vendetta. All we know about Riddle is that he had a megalomaniac's lust for power, which could still take him any number of directions

He was still just as smart and talented though. It’s not a stretch at all to say he was already above and beyond any other student ever to go through hogwarts except dumbledore, even before he graduated. I agree it would take longer to rediscover all the dark magic he learned, but he managed to make a horcrux in highschool when he killed the Riddles before any of that happened

10:05 Also at least for the first situation, what about Neville? Yeah the prophecy would have played out with either Tom or harry killing the other, but then would that mean a new prophecy might have popped up with Neville stepping in as the hero considering he was the other possible candidate for the original prophecy?

Maybe he had a vault at Gringots he stored it at.

No, the Voldemort's wand was still in the ruins of the Potter's house, where only a rat could find it.

Diary Riddle hasn't heard the prophecy so he certainly wouldn't

@@clayhunter2572 He still planned to split his soul, the Dairy was actually the first of that plan. He might not have specific intension to kill Harry but one murder's as good as the next for Horcruxes. Dumbledore's theory was only just that a theory and one based on Voldemort's narcissism, not a magical law.

i might just be going off the movie, but diary young tom said he wasnt interested in killing muggles and his new target was harry.. voldys soul would still carry on with his desires despite age.

@@clayhunter2572 No Riddle has actually heard the prophecy. Only reports about it and even then just a part.

@@RyanYoxo my point is he would have been less stubborn about having to kill him himself after seeing that the wand core issue was screwing him over and just ordering one of his followers to do it would have immediately solved the problem

Half of that is definitely a sad circumstance.

@@lunaitc Lockhart dying is sad, but who cares about Ron

I mean ron is useless and lets Hermione free so go on baldy

@@MordechaiHershoffyoutube the second main character?

@@avatar5023 It's a supercarlinbrother joke, they love Lockhart and are Hermione Harry shippers

This!!

harry beats voldemort for good in book 1, or dies as a child because Dumby keeps monsters in random rooms of the house

Dumbledore would have to retire from his positions.

A nanny would raise him and Harry might feel resentment towards Dumbledore due to his lack of involvement Edit: he would be best friends with Ableforth though

ooo YES

Or he would kill his younger arrogant self for not falling in line

I want to think younger Tom would defer leadership to the elder, but like, would he?

my thoughts are with Tom's blatant narcissism, it probably wouldn't result in a proper fight(though if it did, my money's on the fully formed guy), but I doubt that he would take orders even from himself, especially not a version that failed to even kill a baby. so young Tom would probably Take command if he had to, but older Tom would not make his rule pleasant

Mini Me.

You two obviously never read the books. which is far superior than the movie in my opinion.

😮

The Elder Wand might just make the Fiendfyre stronger and harder to control.

@@patrickhackett7881 not if you have the right ownership. The whole point of the elder wand is to perform extraordinary feats, and we saw Albus control fire in the half blood prince, plus the 5th film as well

@@andreijohnson3953 That's not said to be Fiendfyre.

@@patrickhackett7881 So he's gifted in it in the first place and is likely to be able to control it

@@MordechaiHershoffyoutube I don't know if Dumbledore would *use* or even *practice with* Fiendfyre (too dangerous)

Grabbing swords by the blade is actually common, even in combat, it’s know as half-swording. You can even grab it with both hands and use the guard as a blunt weapon against armour. The only time it cuts is if you glide against the edge, holding it doesn’t actually cut you

@@TheNinthGenerarion yeah but he wouldn't really know how to do that and as said above the slightest cut could possibly kill him

Like hard would it have been to grab the handle and lay the blade on his hand? Why risk it? Malfoy: " FAMOUS Harry Potter can't even grab a sword without risking death".

or Cho?

Ron getting over Ginnys death would have been a heavy arc for a while.

I wonder how Harry and Ron dying in this scenario would effect the harry-ron-hermione relationship

One of them was through a camera lens. Which, depending on the model of camera, may be no different than looking at it through any other piece of glass.

Does Myrtle wear glasses in the book (cause the films aren’t canon)? If she does then that would prove that wearing glasses wouldn’t protect a person from death from the basilisk.

@@phiefer3 it wasn't the lens of the camera that saved colin, it was the mirrors. If it was the lens, then the film would have been fine inside the camera, complete with a picture of the basilisk

I've one. What happens to the series if the Weasley's don't win the lottery. Sirius doesn't try to escape. Peter doesn't flee the weasleys and stays a rat, doesn't find Voldemort.

Ooh ooh, what if Harry were a girl?

@@joey_surewhynot6270 except “she” would date Ron instead of Ginny.

@@Rizzob17 that would be hella awkward

AGREED

That's what I was wondering.

Yep, so I guess he could still have mutilated his nose with a simple punch in the face.

I think it was a one-time protection that serves when he is with his family members of bloodline (aunt Petunia), but not insie the school.... My Idea is that even if Harry doesen't feel necesserary to destroy the Diary, phoenix could still heel him, and, sencing bad wibes coming from Voldemort, grab Harry, (mby Ginny also), Ron and Lockhart to Dumbledore.

@@lindamazule2289 The protection charm from Lilly was durable as it saved Harry from Quirrel in first year. It last at least until Harry is 17/18 as long as he lives with blood relatives.

If he stay's and privet drive then yes.

Maybe, but also maybe not. The whole legend of the hallows is probably a myth, Dumbledore doesn’t believe the encounter with Death really happened and that the Peverel brothers created their hallows themselves. Being master of all 3 hallows might not actually do anything special. It’s likely that it’s only actual effect in Harry and Voldemort’s final two encounters was that the Elder Wand was not loyal to Voldemort and was instead loyal to Harry, so any spells Voldemort tried to cast on Harry wouldn’t work right.

@@MerkhVision the cloak, stone and wand were real. How could Dumbledore not believe in things he held in his hands?

@@kellysouter4381 The secret is that they're not actually that special. The Invisibility Cloak is like normal Invisibility Cloaks but cannot be summoned and doesn't fade over time. The Resurrection Stone can summon the souls of the dead but not bring them back to life. Not that much of a stretch for normal HP magic since ghosts, Horcruxes, and the Veil exists. The Elder Wand is more powerful than most wands but is so finicky that it didn't let Grindelwald defeat Dumbledore. The Hallows aren't special. They're mundane

@@hachikou42 I know the Elder Wand wouldn't have killed him if he didn't want to die. If Voldemort tried to kill Harry against his will, the Avada Kedarva would be as ineffective as the Cruciatus curses were

@@kellysouter4381 Just because something exists and is powerful, doesn't mean that the legends about those things are true. Yes the items are real, yes they are uniquely powerful items. But it's still entirely possible that they were simply created by the Peverel brothers, just as so many other powerful magical items were created by other powerful wizards.

I could see them working together while both planing to recontain the other as soon as they disagree. A hydra with many heads to slay

That soul difference is basically my argument for why this Diary Voldemort would be more powerful. I think he'd just win

Ooo such good questions!!!!

but i mean... he did help harry telling him he had to die and all that, and his patronus is a Doe

@@agustinfranco0 It's a "what if" situation. Snape knew he was dying when he gave that information to Harry-in fact, he had that information for well over a year without telling anyone. What if his reason for finally divulging the information was selfishly wanting his name cleared posthumously? Or he'd been hedging his bets dithering between siding with Dumbledore or Voldemort, depending on who he thought would win? Also, correct me if you have a reference, but I don't think it was ever confirmed in the books that Lily was associated with a doe in anyway except inferred because her husband was a stag. It's just a thought experiment, I'm not saying its canon.

@@janealroberts7585 He still gave Harry the Sword of Gryffindor during the time of Voldemort's reign. It is unlikely anyone would bet on a 16 year old, with no wand, no way to destroy horcruxes, and an incomplete magic education, defeating Voldemort at this point. If Snape was just playing for the winning team, it would not make sense for him to help Harry Potter at this point. Not to mention stopping other students being punished by the other death eaters, if his allegiance was not to the "light side" was not sincere. As more if there is any clear mention of Lily's representing the doe I am not sure. I think the clearest thing in canon is Dumbledore connecting it to lily.

You can't mislead someone with your memories - at least not intentionally. Memories aren't the same thing as thoughts. False memories are a thing - but by necessity, because of how your brain files them, you are not AWARE that they're false. The moment your brain files that away as "memory", you are convinced it's true and it actually happened. Because that's what memories are supposed to be - real events that actually happened. Your brain does not have a separate setting for "events that we're putting in memory that we know aren't true", because that's a lie; not a memory. Your brain doesn't like lying, which is why it's so hard to do it well - so it doesn't keep your lies in the same place as your real memories. You can remember what the DETAILS of a lie are - but that's different, and Harry would be able to tell it was a lie, because Snape would know it was a lie.

He would likely regain his body and power and immediately murder Harry

HARRY! DID YAH PUT MAH STONE IN DA HAND OF A QUIRREL?!!!

That would be cataclysmic.

That's a bit out of character for Harry

@@clayhunter2572 he lost his parents. Kids would do anything for that if their upbringing isn’t good. Harry with the Dursleys? Yes I want my parents

In the Goblet of Fire Wortmatil uses Harry's blood to bring Voldemore back. Because he used Harry's blood, Voldemort is essentially acting as a horcrux for Harry because of Lily's protection. Because that wouldn't have happened yet, Voldemort returning in full form from the diary means that Harry doesn't have that protection unless he is at Privet Drive since his aunt lives there.

@@joykeel3332 It's also why Dumbledore reacted the way he did after Harry told him what happened in the graveyard. Suddenly, Harry had a way to survive the sacrifice he had to make to make Voldemort killable. Dumbledore, of course, couldn't tell Harry as the sacrifice had to be genuine in order to work (granting the sacrifice protection on everyone and so effectively nullifying Voldemorts power so that someone might actually be able to kill him; probably Dumbledore expected himself to be that person until found out he was going to die).

@@joykeel3332 He had the protection from Voldemort the year before, and the reason he needed the acting like a horcrux was because he took the blood so the protection itself stopped working when not in Privet Drive

@@MordechaiHershoffyoutube im not sure what point you're trying to make but the protection only ever worked when he was at Privet Drive, which wouldn't allow harm to come to him by Voldemort as long as he could call that place home. It also protected him from being touched by Voldmort. When his blood was used to bring Voldemort back to full form, Voldemort could touch him but he himself couldn't kill Harry because he was now tethered to life through his blood. So if Tom Riddle is brought back then he could kill Harry and he would just die because Tom never used Harry's blood for his "rebirth ".

@@joykeel3332 In my opinion when not in Privet Drive Voldemort also couldn't harm just like he couldn't touch, and after he took the blood then he only couldn't get to Harry in Privet Drive , but could everywhere else as far as blood protection was concerned, but still couldn't because Voldemort was like a Horcrux to Harry

maybe when she was crying she removed them

I also don't think glasses protect. It is only stated that looking at a reflection protects one from death, but if one is looking through glasses it isn't a reflection one sees but the real thing. Only the gase is slightly warped through the lenses. And since Colins camera is quite old it functions via a mirror so what he sees is also just a reflection.

I suspect that as soon as Voldemort came back, he’d free all the death eaters who were imprisoned, and if that’s the case, Peter might ask Voldemort for a favor and have Sirius killed right there. If Sirius, upon learning of Voldemort’s return, escaped and tried to seek out say Lupin or Dumbledore to explain the situation and be safe, which would be easier in this timeline as it’s been established that he failed to kill Peter in the first place, I think he’d be protected by the Order, and Grimmauld place would still be their base of operations.

Yup. I think he forgot about that lol and it’s a major factor in all this.

Until touched by harry hands

Unless there is a reintegration, in which he would look much younger while having all of his old knowledge. Further, it would likely be the older and more wiley version that would have the necessary knowledge and so we would have a nearly 80 year-old Voldemort inside a 16 year-old body this version of events places him at an enormous advantage.

@@jayt9608 Yeah, that would work. But I'm working with Ben's statement that Tom would have turned old voldy into a horcrux, and not re-integrated him.

@@MarkG-Pouncinglion Which is why I based my response with "unless".

I feel there might be an argument for Tom to actually be at least somewhat stronger though, considering Voldemort went through a lot to come back; his body and mind might be weaker than this Tom, albeit more knowledgeable. Tho Tom learned things pretty quickly for his age, wouldn't be surprising this would simply be a stronger, prime, version of Voldemort. This Tom wouldn't have his soul split so much either, hence making him stronger. Also, I can't imagine those entire 40 years were spent learning/practicing dark magic. He *is* pretty arrogant (enough to not deem training as necessary for himself, at least not after already mastering a spell, which he does learn and master magic pretty quick, he *was* basically a prodigy)

@@KevinAccetta but soul splitting didn’t affect Voldemort’s power

I thought so too, but I love and agree with the way SCB explains why that wouldn't happen. For the two parts of the soul to inhabit the same vessel, Voldemort would have to feel remorse. Without doing so, I imagine that trying to possess the same vessel would greatly weaken the vessel and the fractured souls.

If I remember correctly from the book and movie, Tom told Harry that Ginny "poured herself into the diary " and would talk about the "boy who lived". The more diary Tom learned about Harry and Harry's destruction of the "greatest sorcerer in the world ", the more that Tom wanted to target Harry rather than "mudbloods "

Given the rarity of the affliction, it is very likely that they wouldn't have that kind of stuff on hand, and neither would anyone else. I mean, why would you produce and store the cure to a curse that hasn't affected anyone in decades?

@@SgtSupaman We have vaccines and cures to diseases that haven't been a concern here in the US for decades stockpiled just in case. Same idea really. And who knows where else in the world petrification might be a problem.

Beat, maybe, but I imagine they'd work together and stay AT LEAST 2 Voldemorts.

But the book explicitly states that the biggest part of Voldis soul is inside Voldi prime (prime+6 hocruxes = 7 parts, not counting the unintentional Harry)

Both voldys would definitely try to destroy each other.

SICK

@@andromeda7758I could honestly see 16 year old Voldemort trying to manipulate Harry to help him kill his older version by convincing him that he has a chance to change or something like that but his older version is too far gone I know Tom Riddle would never change even when he was 16 but he could act like it or something to gain a false sense of trust from Harry.

I assume they were all basically a mindless being like the one we saw when Harry was in King's Cross. All except Diary Tom who was made with this specific mission as a potential backup plan.

Also can we get another what if series I loved the harry in slytherin one

haggis? who is that

BRUH, what happens to the sorting hat if it had a piece of voldy's soul?

That would be horrific, hed have no power, be trapped in an item and humiliated for all time while being screwed over and his thunder stolen

Presumably all the pieces of his soul are sentient. Each time he makes a horocrux he is willingly putting a version of himself into it. Prime Voldemort would just be repeating what parts have him have been doing all along.

You're thinking of the protective magic that Dumbledore puts on Harry by making him live at the Dursleys. That's the one that breaks once he turns 17. There's no age limit on lily's protection

@@DavidvdGulik exactly! Her protection was love itself which has no limits.

Super late here but she was crying so maybe she took them off to wipe her eyes

None of them knew about the elder wand yet. At worst, Harry's wand could serve Voldemort as any casual wand, or It could recognise someone else using him, so it would make some awkward spells (a phoenix wand can act at his own accord sometimes, you know), or, if Harry uses the sword, it could imbude any spells throwen at him. The golden flames happened only afer the fourth book, and in the small fight scene in the begininng of deathly Hollows Harry's wand recognises his enemy and sibling, Voldemort's wand, and reacts accordingly. And that is because in the end of the fourth book, the wands met each other, and what happpened was the strongest one made the other Wand to puke out it's latest spells. So in the next fight, the wand recognised it's sbling enemy not only in the wand, but in the person (Voldemort) Himself. In The chamber of secrets there is no possibility of that, because Voldemort uses Harry's wand and his wand is nowhere to be seen. There is like "I am the God now, I have the power, and you can do nothing about it". And, in my opinion, in this moment, when Harry defeated the Basilisk and slowly died from basilisk venom in his arm, phoenix Fox saved him and carried him (mby with the dead body of Gnny) to Dumbledore, together with Ron and Lockhart. Like, I imagine Voldemort throwing some spells at the phoenix, carrying away Ginny's dead body and Hary, but it would eventually lead them back to Dumbledore, where he would probably make a new plan. Keping in mind the original Voldemort didn't have his own body at this time, he probably went along with his Ideas about Triwizard tournament and Harry's blood and everything would turn out as it did, except voldemort II would try to learn everythig that had happened after the diary in mby a year,, so voldemort I should have to prepare to protect himself and stilll get the boy.

@@lindamazule2289 no sorry, I mean like in the main story, completely hypothetical, post goblet of fire, harry with the holly wand, voldemort master of the elder wand who wins

Ok, let's make It two years from chamber to the Graveyard. Voldemort I get's the winner of triwizard tournament (Harry, let's just imagine Cederic was hindered by something and didn't get to the cup in time), revieves himself through servants flesh, Fathers bone and Enemy's blood. And Let's make it that now the other VOldemort realises everything and while following his dad's forgotten past returns to the Littlehangelton. Harry escapes through the triwizards cup. What does the two Voldemorts do?

@@lindamazule2289 they sit there in shame

@@rhyswheldon9176 well, Harry Can not die, because his mothers life in Voldemorts veins teethers him to life. But Voldemort Can die, if you mean the final battle, because all his horruxes are destroyed. If the fight happens before all hocruxes are destroyed, Voldemort could still come back later, but he still could not kill Harry, because he is keeping him alive BY his own existance. That is the meaning of "neither Can live while the other survives". If all his horcruxes are destroyed before the fight, Harry wins. If not, Harry lives to fight another day. The only way for Voldemort to achieve his goal, is to make someone else kill Harry, because that would totally work... 🤯

i was under the impression she took them off, because she was crying, so didnt wear them when she saw the basilisk

Basilisk only obeys slytherin's true heir

@Beastmode-zj2gt It's possible Voldemort lied about only the heir being able to control it (out of arrogance, pride and to not give Harry an advantage) and that any parselmouth can. Either way, Harry has a piece of Voldemort (the true heir of Slytherin) inside of him, which didnt even die off with Basilisk venom thanks to Fawkes. If Trelawney can correctly "predict" Harry's Horcrux's date of birth instead of his own, the same rules should apply.

@@S-Mania but, doesn't the legend itself state that the heir can only do it though?

It depends, I mean, that version of Voldemort *didnt* try to kill Harry and be stopped by his mother's sacrifice, would the protection still register him as the same person? Would he even still be safe at the Dursly's, as the protection he gets from being at his mother's relatives was tied into the sacrifice? Like, could Riddlemort nit just walk up to his house like the Weasleys with their flying car?

@@danielled8665 Riddlemort? I love that, that is exactly what he should be called. I don't know, I assume that the love protection would apply to all possible Voldemorts. I think that if Riddlemort tried to use the killing curse on Harry it would rebound and disembody him just like Voldemort prime. But who knows for sure.

This, he's protected as long as he calls the Dursley's home his home, by spending Summer there.

No I think you’re right! They forgot about this crucial piece of info lol

So when He comes face to face with Dumbledore, Diary!Riddle would triumph and kill Dumbledore.

@@adammartinez8061 possibly. All things considered, Dumbledore himself may end up becoming reluctant to fight Voldemort if he recognises that the new Voldemort is his better. Though I don't imagine that would last forever - eventually Voldemort would force Dumbledore's hand and make him fight him. In such a case, I could see Dumbledore intentionally passing the Elder Wand to someone else so Voldemort doesn't become its master.

That depends. Draco's wand and the elder wand switch allegiance because Harry snatches Draco's wand out of his hand, so it is possible that Harry's wand switches allegiance as well. This wand however wasn't forcefully taken so it isn't as likely. I think you should also consider that the avada kadavra still bounces of Harry's expelliarmus and here Harry has no protection

The elder wand is q special case. It's more sentient than most other wands, hence why it can turn on its wielder if necessary. Most wands would simply bend to those that use them, especially if they're powerful wizards.

Maybe the size of the chunk you rip off is equivalent to the atrocity of the crime you've committed?

The use of the word 'fractured' infers more randomness to me. Rather than an exponentional mathematical equation, I think horcrux magic would work more like a shattering a mirror, with large jagged chunks and little pieces of powder that dissipate in the wind, making repair almost impossible. At least, that's how I always imagined it.

@@janealroberts7585 Hmm... I really like that imagery. It fits. Instead of slicing off pieces of soul to store away, Voldemort is repeatedly smashing his own soul beyond repair in a vain pursuit of Earthly immortality.

Well one thing I'm surprised about... Moaning Myrtle has glasses... I never really thought it was a question of if they'd help :/ Also cameras had a lot of different components that made them work back then so I can buy that.

Yeah I think old cameras like that actually used a lot of small mirrors on the inside, so looking through the viewfinder wasn’t the same as just looking straight through a lens.

@@MerkhVision True. It sufficed for Hermione to have only one mirror.

It’s a single-lens reflex (SLR). The viewfinder is never looking at the object. The aperture focuses light onto *a mirror* that reflects the light up to the viewfinder. A camera would save someone from a basilisk’s gaze, because it uses the exact same technology that is used against basilisks (and other gaze weapons) in the folklore. It’s gobsmacking that JK wouldn’t be aware of that.