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What is Split timeline theory? 

dshaynie
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for a while now to fill the unexplained void left by sonic forces (because of course its sonic forces) fans came up with the theory called split timeline, what is it? and does it work? well lets find out.
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Sonic The Hedgehog is copyright Sega
Music used:
Title screen - Sonic Generations
Sunset heights - Sonic Forces
Egg Reverie - Sonic Mania
Sonic Forces - Ghost Town - Turret 3471 Remix
Final boss - Sonic mania
Collision Chaos "G" mix - Sonic the Hedgehog CD
Hard boiled heavies Boss - Sonic Mania
Rooftop run Act 1 - Sonic generations
Flying Battery Zone Act 1 - Sonic Mania
Windy and Ripply (Emerald Coast) - Sonic Adventure

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28 сен 2024

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Комментарии : 716   
@Fnaffan777
@Fnaffan777 7 месяцев назад
2010’s writers: We don’t give a shit The writers this decade: We are so sorry
@charmyzard
@charmyzard 7 месяцев назад
"I should not have said that. I should not have said that."
@AltKaxREAL
@AltKaxREAL 7 месяцев назад
Sonic stories somewhat matter now... and that's bit of a problem, it is so unfortunate of how many stuffs they need to change for things to begin making sense. i highly appreciate for them just now starting to respect the fans that care about said stories, but if the mess has already been made, it seems nearly impossible to fit a majority of these games into a cohesive journey from one to the next without bumping into a few plot holes along the way... then comes a few more plot holes... and _more,_ and *_more..._* i think you get it
@Wingsoffayt
@Wingsoffayt 7 месяцев назад
@@AltKaxREALI feel that the story mattered for the 2000’s too, I feel like it was just during the 2010’s where the story was put way in the back
@JadenFox9
@JadenFox9 7 месяцев назад
right
@JadenFox9
@JadenFox9 7 месяцев назад
@@AltKaxREAL the 2010s stories still fit despite being horribly executed, at best, I think they retconned the whole Generations Alt Timeline of Generations, Mania, and Forces
@biggiecheese2544
@biggiecheese2544 7 месяцев назад
In all fairness, EGGMAN could be the variable here. Modern Eggman abducted Classic specifically to help him with his plan (which makes no sense because Classic Eggman should be LESS smart???) But they had to choose what locations to rip from time, so Classic Eggman could have learned a lot more than Classic Sonic and Tails did
@biggiecheese2544
@biggiecheese2544 7 месяцев назад
Also another plot hole is Tails not recognizing Green Hill because unless the Time Eater abducted Sonic 1 Sonic (which is IMPOSSIBLE because he knows Tails and can spindash) Tails would have had to been near by when Time Eater steals Green Hill so by default Modern Tails SHOULD HAVE RECOGNIZED GREEN HILL
@dshaynietheawesome
@dshaynietheawesome 7 месяцев назад
Now that is a plothole we never so much as find out how either eggman escaped white void
@dshaynietheawesome
@dshaynietheawesome 7 месяцев назад
Ehhh wibbily wobbly timey whimey
@arzfan29
@arzfan29 7 месяцев назад
​@@biggiecheese2544 hard to recognize a white void
@rynobehnke8289
@rynobehnke8289 7 месяцев назад
​@@biggiecheese2544to be fair generations did early on play with the idea that eggman deleting the moments from time made it hard for the characters to recall them like how tails also couldn't quite put his finger on were the sense of familiarity was coming from in chemical plant .
@Bananaboat.
@Bananaboat. 7 месяцев назад
Its so weird how the concept of modern and classic sonic change from being from the past to becoming this complicated dimension stuff. I'm not sure whether to hate it or like it.
@jaizzop3196
@jaizzop3196 7 месяцев назад
I hate it lol
@ultima_pilot
@ultima_pilot 7 месяцев назад
I really hate so I just head cannon it away.
@JM57-99
@JM57-99 7 месяцев назад
Hate it, it should've stayed as little more than a design change
@rorkeslayer3925
@rorkeslayer3925 7 месяцев назад
I hate it, I really thought the idea of classic just being younger sonic was fitting and simple enough to pass
@sboinkthelegday3892
@sboinkthelegday3892 7 месяцев назад
Time is a dimension. Tails is a scientist and sees a split version of himself ENTERING another timeline that he knows is not his expereince, so he calls it DIMENSION, accurately. He doesn't have this unga-bunga MCU fan FALSE conception of mistaking the English word, what Schroedinger tried to say with his cat metaphor. Or even Plato's cave. It's not elaborate at all, you're just so painstakingly room temp IQ smoothbrain that any wrinkle appears "complicated" in comparison. I could literally write the letters l and Ω on chart to explain it, and the SHAPE of Ω would make your eyes gloss over.
@ShorTMan0787
@ShorTMan0787 7 месяцев назад
It was just a mistranslation. Forces is a mess in many ways and has more of those. The line "Tails just lost it" should be "Tails went missing". In japanese, they say "isekai" which can mean from another world or dimension. In this case, it meant "from another time".
@waff64
@waff64 7 месяцев назад
yeah but tails can just be hallucinating
@waff64
@waff64 7 месяцев назад
watch that shadow dude
@algotkristoffersson15
@algotkristoffersson15 7 месяцев назад
Changing the past with timetravel causes a new timeline to be created, so he is from the past AND from another dimension.
@jurassicarkjordanisgreat1778
@jurassicarkjordanisgreat1778 7 месяцев назад
No way.... This whole time. The past 7 years of debating. Was all over a mistranslation. All the problems could have been avoided! ahhhh! This is exactly how the human covenant war started in the halo universe.
@robertlupa8273
@robertlupa8273 7 месяцев назад
Sonic being tortured however I'm pretty sure was a leftover from a previous draft of the script. I think the Japanese version doesn't have it, but the English one does. They both used to have this detail, I'm pretty sure.
@slateoffate9812
@slateoffate9812 7 месяцев назад
I like to think there's 1.5 timelines between Modern and Classic Sonic. It's like Doctor Who, namely Out of Time, where the 10th Doctor doesn't remember the 4th Doctor's experiences until they happened during the story. So, Modern Sonic did experience Mania, but he also didn't because he and Classic Sonic were out of sync like the 10th and 4th Doctor.
@alexthebluehermit
@alexthebluehermit 7 месяцев назад
Or it could be like dragon Ball with trunks
@slateoffate9812
@slateoffate9812 7 месяцев назад
@@alexthebluehermit Maybe, but I prefer mine.
@alexthebluehermit
@alexthebluehermit 7 месяцев назад
@@slateoffate9812 understandable
@Theover4000
@Theover4000 7 месяцев назад
Y’all keeping conversation civil. Always nice to see.
@andrewhall6479
@andrewhall6479 7 месяцев назад
I’d like to offer a counterpoint: Mania and Sonic 4 take place in the same points in their respective timelines. They happen around the same event: Little Planet coming back around. The difference being that the Phantom Ruby existed in the Classic timeline, causing the change in plans.
@MarioSonicBee
@MarioSonicBee 7 месяцев назад
Imo I feel like they shouldve gone with the split timeline theory. Making it so Classic Sonic is literally the same as Modern Sonic even after Gens and Forces is weird when theres so many plotholes. Now I dont want them to be like classic is a diffrent dimesion or something stupid, just that classic is indeed Sonic from the past but ever since Gens the timelime split so now the classic we see nowadays is in his own unique timeline, letting him be free without worrying about canon.
@TakeshiInazuma
@TakeshiInazuma 7 месяцев назад
It's not a theory. Unless people REALLY think Sonic went through Generations and Forces twice. That Classic met all of his friends before Sonic adventure.
@toopienator
@toopienator 7 месяцев назад
​@@SonicXisCanonhow could he go through Gens before CD if he already met Classic Tails by the time Gens happened? We know CD is before Sonic 2 thanks to Origins.
@hyper5925
@hyper5925 5 месяцев назад
​@@TakeshiInazuma Yeah, he did, but Ian Flynn said that he does not remember any adventures he had in the future.
@TakeshiInazuma
@TakeshiInazuma 5 месяцев назад
@@hyper5925 o you're saying he met everybody and seen everything twice, and forgot!? They just got to keep it simple. The current Classic Sonic became an alternate timeline version due to getting pulled into the future.
@hyper5925
@hyper5925 5 месяцев назад
@@TakeshiInazuma Well, that is the Canon explanation. Superstars, Mania, Mania Plus and Mania Adventures were referenced in Tails Tube, so, it happend in the Canon Timeline. The Timeline split has been confirmed to be non Canon by Ilzuka and Flynn, so, Modern and Classic Sonic are the same Sonic. They are not from different universes or timelines. It's just one. Sonic met his friends and his future self, but he forgot everything. Every single second he passed in the future doesn't exist ins his mind anymore.
@faeraluran9143
@faeraluran9143 7 месяцев назад
honestly, I kinda wish they went for the timeline split idea. I feel like it gives the story some extra complexity, and I always found it fascinating to see how games/media manage to keep the timelines relevant in ways that not only involve them as a pieces to the major canon, but as individual, minor canonical stories as well.
@thatoneguy4452
@thatoneguy4452 7 месяцев назад
A couple of things: One, in fiction, terms like alternate timeline and alternate dimension are used interchangeably. Your definition of timelines and dimensions aren't mutually exclusive and there's no reason why an alternate timeline couldn't be considered a separate dimension. Also, it is not Classic Sonic's knowledge of the future that caused the split in the timeline, it's Eggman messing with time. After all, modern Sonic and Tails do not remember the events of Generations from Classic Sonic and Tails' perspective, even though they would if they are the exact same. Secondly, that isn't the Q&A in which Iizuka confirmed the split timeline, it was a different one. He was specifically asked about the "another dimension" thing and while the Q&A gets a little muddled, you can hear Iizuka say "timelines" in English and his translator says something to the effect of "modern Sonic's history is the same, but Classic Sonic is his own thing." I believe Ian Flynn also said recently on his podcast that an alternate timeline was indeed the original intention going forward. Things like TailsTube and the Sonic Superstars interview are simply retcons and not proof that this concept never existed to begin with. Lastly, I want to point out that Classic Sonic is already a teenager. Modern redesigns are just that: redesigns. Sonic never went through a physical change from Classic to modern designs.
@dshaynietheawesome
@dshaynietheawesome 7 месяцев назад
[processing]
@antunderexist692
@antunderexist692 7 месяцев назад
Didnt they retcon classic sonic's age to 11?
@thatoneguy4452
@thatoneguy4452 7 месяцев назад
@@antunderexist692 Nope
@jamesstreet2397
@jamesstreet2397 6 месяцев назад
Two timelines was debunked in a bumblekast episode by Ian flynn, tails on tails tube references they are still friends with trip, mighty and Ray, and other events from mania and superstars, so those games are part of modern Sonic's past.
@thatoneguy4452
@thatoneguy4452 6 месяцев назад
@@jamesstreet2397 That's a retcon. It's clear the original intention was for it to be a split timeline.
@revya4294
@revya4294 7 месяцев назад
Best way I personally can see how this story even fits is there’s 3 timelines. Timeline A ends with 06 Timeline B continues pass 06 and ends with Generations Timeline C is mania sonic which was classic sonic from generation and now we’re just watching a modern sonic from a different dimension who met the classic sonic we know.
@azimuddin1890
@azimuddin1890 7 месяцев назад
I think it would’ve made sense if Classic Sonic Classic Tails after Generations would cause another timeline where they have different adventures cause they have knowledge of characters they’re gonna meet, like Shadow. If Classic Sonic from Generations knew Shadow, and grew up to be Modern Sonic, he’d try to convince Shadow to be a good guy. He’d already know Cream in Advance 2, know Blaze and the Sol Emeralds in Ruse 1, ect ect. Events might have played out differently if he did free up as Modern Sonic. So personally I welcome separate or a new timeline branch while the Modern cast is unaffected.
@SuperCeasar777
@SuperCeasar777 7 месяцев назад
That fact that sega Figured out a way to create two of the same character and then sell us both games without us being confused is pure genius
@MJGaming57_REAL
@MJGaming57_REAL 7 месяцев назад
I agree but the timeline theory just makes more sense. If they went with that, then they could make as many classic games and contradictions as they want without fans getting skeptical when there's like 20 classic games at some point. Not everything has to remain one universe that's why we have things like spider-verse. And don't even get me started on sonic prime.
@jamesstreet2397
@jamesstreet2397 6 месяцев назад
Two timelines was debunked in a bumblekast episode by Ian flynn, tails on tails tube references they are still friends with trip, mighty and Ray, and other events from mania and superstars, so those games are part of modern Sonic's past.
@logic-dy1su
@logic-dy1su 7 месяцев назад
No offense but it was no reason for this video as tails said the other dimensions can be timelines
@lonelyonionagain.
@lonelyonionagain. 7 месяцев назад
Okay i genuinely liked the bit where you started zooming out to every editing software.
@HedgeRobo
@HedgeRobo 6 месяцев назад
FINALLY! That line Tails said always bothered me. I used to think that for modern Sonic his timeline just started in Sonic Adventure and for Classic Sonic, Sonic 1 (bear in mind back in 2018 I was not as educated about Sonic despite being a fan). I am glad someone addressed this issue, but to be honest despite the timeline split I feel that Tails saying "from another world" in the Japanese version makes more sense than "from another Dimension" because another world feels like the timeline split created another world where events play differently, but not another dimension. It''s a bit complicated.
@PluckyInc
@PluckyInc 7 месяцев назад
honestly, my idea of Classic Sonic existing can be explained by the events of Sonic Generations; basically the old design of Classic Sonic is modern sonic in his younger years. but they can justify the Mania Sonic being the result of generations. so the timeline is a puddle. the Mania universe essentially has characters that exist within the modern universe, and possibly could take aspects from pieces of media SEGA no longer considers canon. So Main Sonic has never met Fang the Hunter, thus the events of Sonic Drift, Fighters and Chaotix never occured. however Mania Sonic became something of a classical NSMB universe, such as taking elements from Origins such as Classic Amy's moveset and possibly Ray/Mighty's characterization from Segasonic the Hedgehog and Chaotix (for Knuckles), though it doesn't mean Origins ties into Superstars. i'm a little curious if the plot of Shadow x Sonic generations would have Black Doom realize that he's an echo of time and has read Shadow's mind (due to being part black arms). also, Classic Robotnik/Eggman would have to had found a way out of time like his modern counterpart. Also phantom ruby usage probably pulled infinite potential from other realities as a reference, like Metal Sonic's new form in Mania Plus. devs did mention that Bean/Bark/Fang in Mania was stated to be the real deal when shooting your plane down, but the heavy magician just simply assumed their forms during the boss fight. probably shook that reality's timeline by now. heck, classic eggman probably got ideas/knowledge from his modern counterpart. Sonic the Fighters though? i can't see that happening in a Mania/Superstars universe, since they'd have to explain things like the extra chaos emeralds and also Espio. definitely assuming the Chaotix (outside of Mighty) are considered off limits and covered in shadow to maintain brand consistency. shame they'd probably absolutely would not go with the obtaining knowedge viewpoint for classic eggman; i don't think eggman was aware of Metal Sonic's abilities fully until stuff like Heroes and Colors Ultimate. not the ability to utilize energy (since even Mecha Sonic could use the master emerald in 3), but more like utilizing wisp energy (Colors Ultimate) and scanning bio information during Heroes. So i could totally see a classic eggman impeding on metal, or at least keep a tighter leash over him to prevent a betrayal arc.
@Gamecliparchives
@Gamecliparchives 7 месяцев назад
If you think about it if in Sonic Forces Modern and Classic are the same person, Sonic could have stopped Eggman from taking over with the knowledge
@redpanda4818
@redpanda4818 7 месяцев назад
So if Sonic comes from the past (Sonic Mania) to the future (Sonic Forces) with the help of the Phantom Ruby, that means that the Ruby has the power to time travel. But this is not used in Forces to stop the war, or in the IDW Comics by Dr. Starline. It is only used for teleportation, and a few other minor uses. So, maybe to not mess up Sonic Forces' storyline, they said that "Classic Sonic came from another dimension" because they meant for the Ruby to only have dimension manipulating powers, not time powers.
@Glitchyy07
@Glitchyy07 6 месяцев назад
Tbf I think it was the phantom ruby reacting to the chaos emeralds that caused it to send classic sonic to forces
@redpanda4818
@redpanda4818 6 месяцев назад
@@Glitchyy07 Now that you mention it, I think you are right
@GenghisConnThr333
@GenghisConnThr333 7 месяцев назад
I don't know why so many fans had a hard time grasping this but Classic and Modern were supposed to take place in different continuities (which explains why they both have different art styles and lack characters that the other has) with the events of Sonic 1, CD, 2 and 3 happening in broad strokes in the Modern continuity. Timeline theory also makes sense because why would Classic Eggman repeat the exact same stuff he knew failed Sonic Generations? Why would Sonic, Tails, Knuckles and Eggman have no recollection of the Phantom Ruby? Where's Mighty and Ray been all this time?
@paperprince2953
@paperprince2953 7 месяцев назад
Yeah, and I don't think this video really even understands this concept in the first place. There's alot more evidence in the source material itself to conclude the Classic Timeline is seperate to the Modern Timeline since in Origins, CD is supposed to take place before Sonic 2 LOL. When in the Modern timeline, it takes place after Sonic 3 and Knuckles. Not to mention, Classic is mute while Modern Sonic can speak (he can speak in Segasonic and etc.), he is literally equal to his Modern self as shown with Time Eater, Chaos and Egg Dragoon, the same Egg Dragoon who was fighting Werehog Sonic, who is equal to Generations and onwards Modern Sonic. It's pretty irrelevant for it to be "oh, well this wasn't supposed to be the intent!!" Well honeybuns, the official material overrides this. Conclusion: Classic Sonic is from a seperate dimension or world entirely from Modern, however he is a younger variation and comes from a variation of the past. EVERYTHING in the source material alludes to this so don't try to any smart business with me.
@jamesstreet2397
@jamesstreet2397 6 месяцев назад
Two timelines was debunked in a bumblekast episode by Ian flynn, tails on tails tube references they are still friends with trip, mighty and Ray, and other events from mania and superstars, so those games are part of modern Sonic's past.
@GenghisConnThr333
@GenghisConnThr333 6 месяцев назад
@@jamesstreet2397 That's dumb.
@paperprince2953
@paperprince2953 6 месяцев назад
@@jamesstreet2397 Ian was asked about the Sonic canon and has already admitted in Bumblekast that he wasn't qualified to give a definitive statement on what is canonical. Ian Flynn had made it quick to clarify their show was not sponsored by SEGA (although doesn't mean we can't use his statement for other purposes outside of "canonicity". Tailstube was never really reliable to begin with, assuming that you use the argument about "Superstars and Mania footage and art was shown", Sonic the Fighters clips were also shown which couldn't possibly happen in the Classic Dimension given in IDW, it's confirmed that there were never 8 Emeralds and Fighters never would have even happened (As confirmed by Sonic himself in the comic). Origins also contradicts what was established with Sonic 4 given how Sonic CD takes between Sonic3&K and Sonic 4. And there really isn't evidence to suggest Tailstube is even canon in the first place, all it has is contradictions saying it isn't.
@BoyleVoices
@BoyleVoices 7 месяцев назад
Eggman Nega is from another dimension in the Rush series, yet he’s from the future in the Rivals series. Seeing as how they have been consistent with their inconsistencies, it almost feels intentional. I believe in the split timeline. It’d be cool if they go into how all of this is happening, maybe involve Little Planet and the Time Stones?
@greenstarlover1
@greenstarlover1 7 месяцев назад
Same with Blaze with Sonic Rush and 06.
@BoyleVoices
@BoyleVoices 7 месяцев назад
@@greenstarlover1 💯 Exactly.
@JonnySpec
@JonnySpec 7 месяцев назад
I think there's also contradictions between Sonic Battle and Shadow the Hedgehog, which is why for some time I thought the timeline split after Sonic Heroes.
@RealBroccoliHour
@RealBroccoliHour 6 месяцев назад
Sonic Forces’ story is secretly genius confirmed? 🤔
@chaoschannel3428
@chaoschannel3428 3 месяца назад
The term "dimension" can still be used interchangeably with "timeline" in this case, given one of the definitions of "dimension" being another realm that's similar but separate and not connected. The problem is you're thinking of time linearly, thinking Mania-verse is just a split timeline moving forwards from wherever in the original timeline Classic was ripped from. However the very action of being placed back to his original time would create this new timeline that spans forwards (obviously) AND backwards. Essentially making two parallel timelines with exactly the same history up to the point of Classic getting snatched up. Seeing as the new timeline of the Mania-verese would have events drastically different from the event of the Classic era of the regular verese we know, said differences (along with the afformentioned copy of the history of the original timeline) would make it different enough AND technically separate to be considered another dimension. As for Tails referring Classic as being from another dimension as opposed to the past, Tails is smart. He saw Classic go back to his timeline, and there's a good chnace he knows or at least hypothesizes how time travel works in the universe, so would know for a fact (much like the audience) the Classic Sonic and by extension Classic Robotnik would do things differently and end up creating the new branch timeline.
@ZephyrTheBoltYTOFFICIAL5464
@ZephyrTheBoltYTOFFICIAL5464 5 месяцев назад
I think tails said classic sonic was from another dimension cause he was so fed up with stress of Sonic’s loss and focus on fixing omega that he couldn’t think properly
@ZephyrTheBoltYTOFFICIAL5464
@ZephyrTheBoltYTOFFICIAL5464 5 месяцев назад
Or also it could be from another world because classic sonic from forces didnt know the homing attack while generations classic sonic did
@noyz-anything
@noyz-anything 6 месяцев назад
personally i think the sonic fandom solved it with their OTHER explanation - namely, the "santiago" meme. while classic is obviously not a scandinavian terrorist in either appearance, i think the classic in forces is a fake sonic of some sort - a *phantom* if you will. and you all know which ruby is present during the events of forces forces sonic is "the same" as mania because the phantom ruby remembers what happened in mania and is essentially just replaying clips of sonic from back then. so he's basically a living sonic mania youtube poop
@Oceane1803
@Oceane1803 7 месяцев назад
I think that Classic Sonic can be from another dimension, as the "real" Classic Sonic, the one that we see in the Classic games, is 16, has an attitude, a dark blue fur color, and can talk (even if we don't see him doing it often in the games). Meanwhile, this Classic Sonic is light blue, has a wide-eyed personality, doesn't talk, and is significantly younger. So he might be a different Classic Sonic from the one in the classic games, Modern Sonic's past self.
@CauaFriendsOficial
@CauaFriendsOficial 5 месяцев назад
TailsTube #4 confirmed Classic is Sonic from the past. Done.
@andynava5144
@andynava5144 24 дня назад
I think the line about him being from another dimension makes sense when you learn that originally, instead of the avatar stages they were going to be Sonic Boom stages. That Sonic being referred to as from another dimension would have actually made sense and I'm sure they just wanted to use dimensions as an umbrella term for the three of them. Ofc, Boom ended up being dropped from the plans
@SnaksiXD
@SnaksiXD 7 месяцев назад
7:08 The question was again asked in a way that led the answer to be about the Split Timeline Theory in the following year's SXSW panel, the one where they also had a guy asking about a crossover between The Joker and Sonic The Hedgehog.
@Kazuo1G
@Kazuo1G 7 месяцев назад
Already pulling the references from Modern Doctor Who, huh? XD
@thebrickbros.1294
@thebrickbros.1294 6 месяцев назад
I have 2 theories about classic sonic. One is everything is normal until after sonic 3 before sonic mania where classic sonic goes to the future in sonic generations and remembers everything after leaving and instead of practicing the air boost modern sonic was teaching him, he formed in into the dropdash to use in sonic mania. The other is that the classic sonic from sonic generations was transported to sonic generations after sonic one and when coming back he immediately goes into his adventure on little planet in sonic cd and the time stones erased the memory of sonic generations and replaces them with visions of the future, specifically Amy tails and knuckles, which is why he goes to west side island immediately after. But that’s just a theory, a game theory. (Thanks for the iconic line matpat)
@comicfan1324
@comicfan1324 7 месяцев назад
To be fair, I can totally see why people would believe in a split timeline. After all, it would be weird if classic sonic, new characters, like shadow, silver, and blaze exist, but then wouldn’t recognize them years later. And of course it would be strange that Eggman wouldn’t recognize the phantom Ruby enforces if he had already gone through the event of mania. Also, although I agree that dimensions can often be vastly different than the “main” universe, there’s also been cases infection, where a universe is created because of a split timeline. Just look at DC comics handles the Multiverse. Some universes are split off of decisions people make, while others are simply universes that work differently. Who to say the sonic Multiverse in Sonic’s franchise doesn’t work off of the same logic. Alternatively, the simplest explanation is that when tails said “you’re that sonic from another dimension” he could’ve just been referring to white space
@ProjectRafael123
@ProjectRafael123 3 месяца назад
The fact that the thumbnail is a reference to Doctor who is 🔥
@dshaynietheawesome
@dshaynietheawesome 3 месяца назад
maybe
@MrScaryPasta
@MrScaryPasta 6 месяцев назад
Let’s all agree: We don’t talk about Sonic Forces. We don’t acknowledge it. It doens’t exist.
@mspaint-hd7qf
@mspaint-hd7qf 6 месяцев назад
Think it’s easier to say that tails got it mixed up😢
@evdestroy5304
@evdestroy5304 7 месяцев назад
A dimension is simply a measurement of space, a plane of existence as you will. An alternate timeline 100% counts as an alternate dimension, it is a unique plane of existence that exists seperately from the main one. It's no different from how Blaze has her own dimension with locales very similar to Sonic's yet they are not the same. Many of those things you just associated with being from multidimensional stories happen in alternate timelines. Alternate Sonic with alternate versions of all of his locations and locales. Superstars does not take place in the alternate dimension, it takes place in-between 3K and Adventure 1, they (and more specifically Ian Flynn) have ditched the Classic dimension because clearly it confuses people such as yourself (admittedly the fault of Forces not elaborating on the concept whatsoever).
@jaxon7514
@jaxon7514 7 месяцев назад
Fantastic video. I love the detail about the issue and clarification around it. Side Note: For your chart, Silver's future isn't unknown because of the IDW Comics which are canon to the continuity. It's in the Metal Virus Saga
@dshaynietheawesome
@dshaynietheawesome 7 месяцев назад
I was being unspecific we know very little about it but we know it’s there and it’s nothing like crisis city
@mattwosrandomgameplay
@mattwosrandomgameplay 7 месяцев назад
3:35 "Or sometimes referered to as another universe" Uh, dimension is a geometric term. Not a single official dictionary acknowledges the rampant misuse of it being a nebulous space-related term. It's not even always referring to alternate universes. It could also be higher planes of existence like DC's "Fifth dimension" where Mxyzptlk and Bat-Mite come from and "pocket dimensions" aren't really universes in a traditional sense.
@MadelineJS.2727
@MadelineJS.2727 5 месяцев назад
And that's how Mr. Infinite lives messed up the entire franchise chronology
@59orJimmy
@59orJimmy 7 месяцев назад
Remember, in a previous cutscene, Amy (I think) said that Tails had gone crazy after Sonics disappearance
@crimson5pider
@crimson5pider 3 месяца назад
I just see it as a future trunks situation. The events of Generations caused classic sonic's timeline to branch off on its own path without changing modern sonic's past because the time travel works on multiverse theory
@mattwosrandomgameplay
@mattwosrandomgameplay 7 месяцев назад
2:57 To be fair, the multiverse model is practically the same thing as the branching time stream model. The only real difference is one is related to space and the other time. Ben 10 Omniverse even specifically uses the branching time stream model
@yamsicallymagnificent
@yamsicallymagnificent 3 месяца назад
my head canon is that classic tryna learn homing attack lead to the drop dash in mania because they both use the same input to use and in frontiers sonic suddenly knows the drop dash so this would lowkey make sense
@dshaynietheawesome
@dshaynietheawesome 3 месяца назад
That is actually kinda cool
@SparklingJam
@SparklingJam 7 месяцев назад
I always thought of it as the dbz timeline as classic’s timeline were affected by the events of generations and if this never happened class I would go through adventure as history originally intended
@arzfan29
@arzfan29 7 месяцев назад
Modern sonic doesn't remember generations ftom his past, so it never happened to him, the events of all the classic games before then are in bith timelines, but after generations there's a new timelime where sonic did experience generations when younger, they make it pretty clear when they still call the classic games events from the past after forces
@jamesstreet2397
@jamesstreet2397 6 месяцев назад
Two timelines was debunked in a bumblekast episode by Ian flynn, tails on tails tube references they are still friends with trip, mighty and Ray, and other events from mania and superstars, so those games are part of modern Sonic's past.
@Stickboy321Go
@Stickboy321Go 7 месяцев назад
0:44 sonic 4? Never heard of it! I hope it’s a good game with great physics.
@azimuddin1890
@azimuddin1890 7 месяцев назад
I mean it’s Sonic.T.H.4 after all, a sequel to an amazing Sonic game, Sonic.T.H.3&K, which had multiple playable characters with each having their own twist, expansive levels, fun Special Stages, amazing art style that is consistent yet improves on the previous three Sonic games (1, C.D, and 2), amazing soundtrack, amazing story, and multiple save slots! I think Sonic.T.H.4 just needs to look at and understand what makes that game so amazing and add on to it. Hopefully Sega doesn’t make Dimps turn a 2.D side scroller mobile game into the sequel, that’d be a terrible move.
@Stickboy321Go
@Stickboy321Go 7 месяцев назад
@@azimuddin1890 I honestly secretly liked sonic 4 but I only hated it to fit in the fanbase but it was said that sonic 4 was actually not meant to be a sequel to sonic 3 It was said it was meant to be a sequel to sonic CD but honestly I kinda want a true sequel to Sonic CD
@azimuddin1890
@azimuddin1890 7 месяцев назад
@@Stickboy321Go I like 4 Episode 2, but there’s so little to go back to that game, and a lot the game already has that needed to be improved. - Making the physics better than 3&K - Give Sonic his Insta-Shield and Super Banana Peel-Out. - Make Tails playable in single player - Give him a proper Super form - Add more playable characters like Knuckles, Mighty, Amy, and Ray. - Make the Green Shield deflect projectiles - Being back Elemental Shields. - Expand the level design - Add six more zones - Make new Special Stages - Remove the cutscenes for each boss after completing the game because they drag out the battles. - Add a better final boss - Improve the soundtrack to sound more like how CD’s soundtrack sounded like. - Collecting Red Rings throughout each stage should give rewards. - If they’d do that, then add four more Red Rings for each level. See, there’s a lot that they needed and should’ve added in to make it more re-playable.
@kongthornton780
@kongthornton780 7 месяцев назад
What about the phantom ruby, Forces Sonic acts confused about it and its power
@dshaynietheawesome
@dshaynietheawesome 7 месяцев назад
Because forces came out in 2017
@Dyundu
@Dyundu 7 месяцев назад
When dealing with any story element from anything that has gone through a translation process, always, _always,_ ask what the original text said in the language. Sometimes translators and localizers get things wrong, and that can completely upend the understanding of intended canon. Check to see the OG meaning behind “other dimension” and determine if nuance or definition was lost or changed. This PSA brought to the Sonic Fandom, with love, from the Zelda Fan Community, who is totally not in flames right now because of how poorly NoA handled Breath of the Wild and Tears of the Kingdom 😅
@midnightmoonwolf7306
@midnightmoonwolf7306 7 месяцев назад
The most funny thing is, is the thumbnail of the video It’s both classic sonic and modern classic sonic bi-generating
@dshaynietheawesome
@dshaynietheawesome 7 месяцев назад
Sonic mania came out after generations which one is modern classic sonic
@GeonusKaikun
@GeonusKaikun 3 месяца назад
My theory has always been that Classic and Modern Sonics belong to two different universes, not a split timeline. This has been my theory since Sonic Generations. The reason why Sonic and Tails speak about their counterparts as though they are their past selves is because they had similar pasts, though not exactly the same. This means that prior to Sonic Adventure, they went through events very similar to those depicted in Sonic 1, Sonic CD, Sonic 2, and Sonic 3 & Knuckles, though not exactly the same. (You could say that there is evidence of this because they way Sonic Adventure's flashback shows how Sonic met Tails is different from what is shown in the new FMV in Sonic Origins.) With this in mind, in my head-canon, the old Sonic canon is still in place for Classic Sonic, with their planet being called Mobius, Robotnik being the former Dr. Kintobor, etc. But if Sega announced that they are the past and future and not two different universes, well, I guess that's that, then. It's stupid, though. How does Sonic's eye color change? Why did everyone grow up except Tails, who is still a child? So many problems.
@GeospaciallyGone
@GeospaciallyGone 6 месяцев назад
If it is just one timeline, does that mean Sonic teaches himself how to homing-attack/air dash?
@LDTV22OfficialChannel
@LDTV22OfficialChannel 7 месяцев назад
No one was big, and now nothing's small.
@santiagoarrieta2175
@santiagoarrieta2175 3 месяца назад
Sega has a problem with the 2 concepts of timeline and dimensions. Classic Sonic is not the only mix up of it, we have Blaze and Eggman Nega 2. Curiously both roothed in a bad recepted game(with reasons) 2006 and forces.
@superplushroompower-up
@superplushroompower-up 7 месяцев назад
I kinda wish so much stuff wouldn't take place between Sonic 3&K and Sonic Adventure. At least, not involving Knuckles. I think if between those two games, if Knuckles only met Sonic like once or twice, Knuckles not 100% trusting Sonic in Adventure would make a lot more sense. But then by the time they get to Heroes, they've gotten to know each other a lot more.
@Lightning-ig2do
@Lightning-ig2do 7 месяцев назад
The reason I think there's a timeline split is because when Classic Sonic is brought into the future, goes on his adventure with Modern Sonic, and gets sent back, he should have knowledge of what's about to happen in Adventure, Adventure 2, Heroes, 06, Unleashed, and Colors, but he doesn't appear to. When you play those games, Sonic shows no knowledge of what's about to happen in those games, because he's experiencing them for the first time.
@Catohat52
@Catohat52 7 месяцев назад
0:08 the GOAT
@the120cxx
@the120cxx 7 месяцев назад
Ive been making sonic timelines for years, and yes, this whole timeline split thing was a massive pain since then it calls into questions what games be in what timeline since some interviews said certian games like knuckles chaotix wasnt canon since the version of the chaotix from heroes onward was a reboot of them essentially... Only for mighty to appear in mania alone with some elements from the 32x game as well so its like... "Is chaotix on 32x exclelusive to the mania timeline?" And the game gear games being kinda on the fence in that regard as well since stuff from those are also in mania. Needless to say, that (along with the 2 planets thing to explain when humans show up or not, despite how much more plotholes ot creates innthe process) was just more of a jumbled mess than it had any right to be. They trying to set the record straight now but man i could do a whole video series on trying to piece together all of this now even if we just doing one timeline again. And even then 06 would still need to be its own freaking timeline because of the blue emerald bootstrap paradox breaking everything. I swear this series is a practice in frustration...
@SKOT_3
@SKOT_3 19 дней назад
Tbh i didn't really mind the idea of splitting classic and modern ala Megaman. Specially since it meant certain characters from the classic era like Nack, Bean, Bark, Honey, etc could return and have some spotlight they would otherwise not have in "modern" titles. Like yeah it's a convoluted mess, but i still think it has potential if they keep going with that route.
@dialgahappy5968
@dialgahappy5968 7 месяцев назад
Lets just say that tails didnt realise he said that XD
@liznyaga3918
@liznyaga3918 6 месяцев назад
from what I understand,Its kind of a''different dimention and timeline at the same time''
@ItzKardiss
@ItzKardiss 7 месяцев назад
i think a more interesting debate is where are the humans? first Iizuka says that the more cartoony levels (i.e Green hill, Chemical Plant etc) happen on a place called south island and the more realistic looking levels (rooftop run, speed highway etc) happen else where. But then he goes onto say that their two different worlds sooooo... idfk
@aidianajones
@aidianajones 7 месяцев назад
Sonic has bigenerated.
@GoobNation
@GoobNation 7 месяцев назад
I'm not a sonic fan so I don't know much of the canon but timelines and dimensions (universes) are somewhat interchangeable in some works of fiction. Marvel is a great example for this since timeline splits create separate universes like the Netflix MCU films
@henry1312
@henry1312 7 месяцев назад
What if the Split timeline was the friends we made along the way
@swipeslogjack_tgaming9472
@swipeslogjack_tgaming9472 7 месяцев назад
My understanding was that gens classic went on to lost world on account of featuring abilities he picked up in gens, like the homing attack and boost (while super), went on then to have his own generations, where eggman, deciding he knows better, messes with space, not time, thus the drop-dashing, sky-blue "modern-classic" sonic from another dimension.
@Player-fx8ul
@Player-fx8ul 7 месяцев назад
Shadow use the time stone and fix it
@goofy-ahh101.
@goofy-ahh101. 4 месяца назад
Say Time Travelling exists in this Universe.
@originalname1008
@originalname1008 7 месяцев назад
Man this theory is the only way to make it make sense. Especially since modern sonic never experienced the events of mania. I'm just gonna take this as them not understanding the differences between alternate timelines and alternate dimensions. It doesn't make sense for modern sonic to have experienced mania cus then wouldn't he have past recollection of the events in forces since he was transported there at the end of the game? And if that didn't happen in modern sonics timeline but the core events of mania did then that would still make it an alternate timeline.
@dshaynietheawesome
@dshaynietheawesome 7 месяцев назад
There is no reason to think he has never experienced mania infact its possible mania may be referenced at some point if recent media has anything to say about it
@liekkianimaatio3652
@liekkianimaatio3652 7 месяцев назад
I can't believe Sonic bigenerated
@Gator159
@Gator159 7 месяцев назад
I love classic Sonic, I love your videos, thank you for going through all this work for a subject I genuinely would never care about otherwise considering I never invested into the Sonic games after Sonic 3 & Knuckles
@dshaynietheawesome
@dshaynietheawesome 7 месяцев назад
That is my job: Over explaining pointless topics to entertain people
@Blazedeath597
@Blazedeath597 5 месяцев назад
Get dshaynie to a million subscribers! :D
@Catguyanimations
@Catguyanimations 6 месяцев назад
My headcanon is that Tails and Eggman accidentally said “dimension” instead of “the past”
@ewdproductions
@ewdproductions 7 месяцев назад
I havent finished the video yet so if he says something abt this later sorry But a different universe is created when atleast one thing different happens from our own timeline if you were to spilt the timeline it would make a while new reality as a branch from the original
@charmyzard
@charmyzard 7 месяцев назад
While we would all love for it to be one timeline, wouldn't it mean that Modern Sonic should have had knowledge of the Phantom Ruby/Infinite catastrophe to warn his friends one day so Forces wouldn't go as badly as it did in the first place?
@OmegaDrive987
@OmegaDrive987 7 месяцев назад
My headcanon is that Modern Eggman building Time Eater caused an alternate timeline to begin. It starts out the same, all be it a little altered (the placement of some games are moved around). Then the timeline goes normal, except that Classic's will be probably have him stay Classic Sonic. I feel like him staying Classic would better because that way, if they want to make more Classic Sonic games, they don't have to say, "Oh, this game takes place between SA1 and the last" every time.
@Tinheadskillsman-pj7om
@Tinheadskillsman-pj7om 3 месяца назад
I like when your talking about different dimensions you can see sanic and Mario that’s cool. And personally I prefer classic.
@maximyllion
@maximyllion 4 месяца назад
eye color can change as a person ages, the front layer of melanin in sonic's eye could have just went away.
@Aaron6IX
@Aaron6IX 6 месяцев назад
So the classic sonic and modern sonic in generations will always be the same
@cool_guy_1.e4071
@cool_guy_1.e4071 7 месяцев назад
My theory before Sega confirmed it was when classic and modern met when they saw each other it made classic sonic timeline or when he made it into the future it made the classic timeline
@azzaelulbrinter
@azzaelulbrinter 7 месяцев назад
How is that no one has commented how a "different dimension" can be taken literally, as in, classic sonic is in 2D
@isthisthingoH_NO
@isthisthingoH_NO 4 месяца назад
3:16 DOCTOR WHO REFERENCE LET'S F_CKING GOOOOOOO
@Sonic_The_Cool.
@Sonic_The_Cool. 7 месяцев назад
I don’t why but I love hearing people talk about the sonic 06 timeline
@santiagoarrieta2175
@santiagoarrieta2175 3 месяца назад
I Guess with Sonic x Shadow Generation we gonna get a definitive answer of what of the 2 it's. I'm inclined that it's gonna end as simply past Sonic, mostly because all extra material of the classic is treated as such, like with Superstar that is part of modern continuity, for the Tails tube that promote it.
@TheOneGreenDuck
@TheOneGreenDuck 7 месяцев назад
Huh.. There Goes My Head Cannon Of A Split In Dimentions After Sonic 2
@milestale
@milestale 6 месяцев назад
But that's just a theory... A GAME THEORY!
@JusticeSolaris85
@JusticeSolaris85 7 месяцев назад
Maybe Classic Sonic can rembember Generations only when he goes to the future, while he is in his time everything that has happened in the future can be considered a sort of dream
@ineophobe
@ineophobe Месяц назад
clearly the answer is this is what doctor who was doing between his 8th and 9th regeneration, he accidentally crash landed in the sonic universe and made his tardis into a paradox machine to maintain modern and classic sonic at the same time and then left because he wanted to distract himself from the time war by doing something amusing and it's why he knows about parallel universes later on (dude trust me) (not clickbait)
@johnhayden4226
@johnhayden4226 7 месяцев назад
It makes sense to me. Let's say you have never met your future self in 2004 and lived your life normally. 20 years later, you bulid a time machine and went back to 2004 and met your past self. The fact that you went back in time to 2004 and met your past self drastically changed the future for your then past, now alternate younger self. You created a new timeline, where past you lives a completely different life due to your interaction. But it actually changed the sec you stepped into 2004, because there shouldn't be 2 you's existing at the same time.
@Gaboxf
@Gaboxf 7 месяцев назад
The problem with the first explanation is that you are using your own (and other sources) term for a timeline and a dimension, you need to remember that if a series says that they are traveling to other timelines but in reality those are dimensions or universes, they are timelines in that series. Also, you used the example of Rick and Morty, where they use dimension and timeline interchangeably. Moreover, little changes in a timeline can create other dimensions and universes in different media, like marvel. Besides that, I agree with most of this, It can easily be one timeline that just felt a little confusing after using the wrong terms and adding more games to the classic era.
@abramally1566
@abramally1566 4 месяца назад
I casually just ignore the "other dimension" line.
@skip-4259
@skip-4259 6 месяцев назад
See the only difference between the two timelines in my headcanon is that Generations and Forces never occur to Classic Sonic, and Mania is Classic exclusive, with Superstars being the equivalent for classic modern
@lil_Gamer_12
@lil_Gamer_12 7 месяцев назад
1:05 wait, can you do that in Generations as well?!
@Gh0stShapesOST
@Gh0stShapesOST 7 месяцев назад
I really love the idea of classic sonic being the split timeline / different universe :) I think both sides of the series are distinct enough from one another to justify it, plus I just prefer the classic side of the series so being able to just stick with that is much nicer for me :)
@dshaynietheawesome
@dshaynietheawesome 7 месяцев назад
but it's same series can you imagine if everyone considered all the 2D mario games before super mario 64 to be a different continuiety
@GenghisConnThr333
@GenghisConnThr333 7 месяцев назад
@@dshaynietheawesome And? Several different series/franchises have split timelines/universes, Mega Man's a pretty famous example, even Mario has alternate continuities with Paper Mario.
@jamesstreet2397
@jamesstreet2397 6 месяцев назад
Two timelines was debunked in a bumblekast episode by Ian flynn, tails on tails tube references they are still friends with trip, mighty and Ray, and other events from mania and superstars, so those games are part of modern Sonic's past.
@GenghisConnThr333
@GenghisConnThr333 6 месяцев назад
@@jamesstreet2397 That's a dumb retcon, Flynn's a bad writer and Tails Tube is non-canon.
@jamesstreet2397
@jamesstreet2397 6 месяцев назад
@@GenghisConnThr333 sorry, I don't see any evidence for it being non- canon anywhere. And the quality of Flynn's writing is subjective. But you are free to your opinions on the matter.
@caseyblox4674
@caseyblox4674 7 месяцев назад
I want to bring this up but where is the adventure sonic era like is he different?
@dshaynietheawesome
@dshaynietheawesome 7 месяцев назад
In what way?
@caseyblox4674
@caseyblox4674 7 месяцев назад
@@dshaynietheawesome like you remember that adventure was going be in generations right if it was in the game there is 3 sonic classic adventure and modern era
@dshaynietheawesome
@dshaynietheawesome 7 месяцев назад
@caseyblox4674 im aware of the rumor but if it was true it probably wouldn’t of gone far into the planning stage because truthfully adventure sonic and modern sonic aren’t really that different and that would be more of a pain to both write and market for
@caseyblox4674
@caseyblox4674 7 месяцев назад
@@dshaynietheawesome no I forget something like All adventure character would appear in generations like amy,tails,knuckles and so many more I would think that if adventure sonic was in the game he's game will be like adventure 1 or 2 like bounce somersault and spindash lighattack and dash and he's levels would probably play as modern but no boost and JUST 3D levels no 2d levels edit: I forget and there's going be a 3 eggman
@jayeraine
@jayeraine 7 месяцев назад
If there were just one linear timeline then surely Modern Sonic would be able to remember the time when he was a kid and met his future self. But as far as I now he doesn't indicate that he knows this when they meet ub Generations, does he?
@Fradopowsan
@Fradopowsan 3 месяца назад
Ok, so it DBZ time travel. Got it.
@stevenshockley4237
@stevenshockley4237 7 месяцев назад
Sonic fans make the BIGGEST cases for continuity and "omg is it canonnnn???" which is funny because Sonic from the beginning, has never been truly consistent in any sense. Sonic looked different every game. Were all of these just, all a bunch of different timelines too then? Almost as if the whole multiverse/timeline thing is oversaturated, and different games having different devices makes a difference. Wow.
@BananaR777
@BananaR777 7 месяцев назад
Alt Timelines=/= alt universes, a lot people really keep getting these two mixed up, Multipletimelines are tied to saved universe. I usally theorize that it stored the 4th dimension of said universe. There is rare occasions a narrative might be a multiverse that can share timeline or a 4th dimension. In reguard to sonic im guessing when dr eggman was messing around with the time eater and sonic confronted him with the chais emeralds, with thier reality warping powers must of caused said universe to split into a seperate universe.
@teaoftraffic
@teaoftraffic 7 месяцев назад
my take: Classic Sonic WAS Modern Sonic, but just younger. However, due to the Time Eater, the current timeline split, resulting in Mania and Superstars being on a separate branch from Frontiers and the modern IDW comics (ie Metal Virus Saga). I like to think the Phantom Ruby holds a small part of the Time Eater’s power, which is why it can wrap reality on a whim and cause people to travel between timelines. the tails line of classic being from another dimension is not canon to this. just pretend he said from “that alternate timeline” instead
@jamesstreet2397
@jamesstreet2397 6 месяцев назад
Two timelines was debunked in a bumblekast episode by Ian flynn, tails on tails tube references they are still friends with trip, mighty and Ray, and other events from mania and superstars, so those games are part of modern Sonic's past.
@teaoftraffic
@teaoftraffic 6 месяцев назад
@@jamesstreet2397 i know about that i was just having some creative fun
@jamesstreet2397
@jamesstreet2397 6 месяцев назад
@@teaoftraffic oh. I'm so sorry 😞 carry on, then.
@gamemaster2819
@gamemaster2819 7 месяцев назад
A notable thing on the Japanese version referring to Classic Sonic being from another world (sekai), Forces is not the first time. In Sonic 06 and Sonic Rivals 2 (which never had a Japenese version, but was following the language Silver used in 06), Silver (and by extension Sonic and Espio) refer to Silver's time as his world. It's more meaning, it feels like a different world because everything feels different. The word can be used to mean society. It's a homophone essnetially. This issue may also be what confused fans with the human and animal worlds. He may have meant human and animal societies.
@0_0-859
@0_0-859 2 месяца назад
diferences of Genesis Sonic And Classic Sonic Genesis Sonic= nice deep blue quills, a bit snarky but he means well,hates oppression and cares about nature, he always does what he thinks is the right thing Classic Sonic:HE HATES YOU , HE ONLY SPEAKS SCANDINAVIAN , HAS BEEN ACCUSED OF SEVERALS HOMICIDES , NATURALLY HAS EVOLVED PAST THE NEED OF MORTALITY
@WakoDoodle
@WakoDoodle 7 месяцев назад
What if sonic ended up how we know him now, because classic sonic did meet modern sonic during generations and forces? Classic sonic has always been optimistic and held his friends close to the point of being a flaw of his; trying to protect everyone. So what if this is because he saw his future and loved it, so he continued forward with a smile on his face because of it? I know if my future self appeared and showed me all the amazing things I did and got to see; I'd be excited for my future and optimistic! After all, before those games I always believed sonic was like the way he is because he has confidence in himself, well it still makes sense, but instead it's sonic having confidence in sonic as two versions! :D
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