What's better for your Pathfinder 2e game? | GSR S1E18

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Today Robert and Erik debate the pro's and cons of Milestone and Experience based leveling. what is your preferred method?
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Опубликовано:

19 июн 2023

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Комментарии : 37

@p.dee.x Год назад

Exp all the way imo Giving players those little exp bonuses outside of combat is really rewarding and feels good for both the players (who doesn't like treats?) and the GM (seeing their face light up is nice). It's caused players to think more creatively as well because I like to give bonus exp for particularly clever ideas. I also run sandbox campaigns, not so much planned narrative stories with set chapters like most GMs do, so milestone just doesn't work for my 90% improv structure.

@jordanwatson3784 Год назад

I'm prepping a conversion of the Red Hand of Doom campaign and one thing I did was write a list of all the encounters in the main storyline leading up to the finale and plotted the xp and level ups and that's how I'll award it. For any side quests or roleplay, instead of xp, I'll award items, favors, titles, and even extra feats! This way, encounters stay balanced and I don't have to mod much on the fly and players are still rewarded even if they go off track.

@silverevil00 Год назад

comment for the comment gods, engagement for the engagement throne.

@goblinsalvagerites Год назад

Your amazing!

@kwagmeijer26 Год назад

In my current PF2 game, we are on milestone leveling, but we are in a sort of more guided adventure stage where the backstory of the full adventure is built up. Eventually, through this guided adventure, enemies and motivations will be set-up to create a more open-ended sandbox world where the characters have motivations to drive the story, at which point I plan to move over to XP leveling so their progression is more driven by the players who are now participating more in the direction of the game.

@Fuzhelmet Год назад

I used a version of milestone leveling in ad&d, so it isn't necessarily a new thing. I ran a campaign with only two players and normal leveling was excruciatingly slow in ad&d, so to keep player interest I called it story progression leveling.

@goblinsalvagerites Год назад

Oh wow! It's interesting hearing different people's experiences. Some people have never heard of it while others have been using it for years!

@thomasfavrot4987 Год назад

I always played with milestones, even during the 3.5 days. We were playing once every other month, so standard levelling was terribly slow. Milestones allowed us to progress at a 1 level per session (a session was an entire day). We never even reached level 10. But these are still some of my favorite memories of ttrpg. So... I guess more casual players benefitted a lot from milestones progression.

@goblinsalvagerites Год назад

Oh wow! That's such an interesting solution to the problem of infrequent games. When you play for an entire day, it makes a lot of sense to want to move on from your current ability. At that moment It would be worrying though if you didn't attain anything significant enough in the game to warrant the level.

@deadfenix3 Год назад

if you want a blue mage style class, check out Roll For Combat's Battle Zoo Azure mage archetype. has a few other monster related player options and a whole monster part system for crafting iirc.

@Jacob-gy6jl Год назад

Seconded!

@adriel8498 Год назад

Sometimes I like to know if i'm going to level up soon to include some narrative situations for my character to grown up, for example, use all my spellslots trying to summon things on that fight because i'm going to take a more powerfull summon spell. I don't feel like thats metagaming, it's more like giving continuity to the character progression

@goblinsalvagerites Год назад

Absolutely! Doing stuff like that maintains verisimilitude not only for you but for the other players at the table.

@CopperDragonGames Год назад

Milestone, but always make sure players know where the goalposts are. A surprise level up from time to time is fine, but milestone done well, in my opinion, includes the GM making it clear that, "You will gain a level when you achieve ________." In the absence of this, XP can feel better for players because the target is clear - even if they don't know how the XP will be earned, they know where the finish line is. But milestone with clear goalposts is 100% the superior system.

@adriel8498 Год назад

I don't like clear goal on milestone because then I feel like I should just do everything to reach that goal or i'm slowing down the progression of the team. I can't roleplay freely or help to the old woman on the town if I know I should clear the goblin cave to level up.

@CopperDragonGames Год назад

@@adriel8498 I hear you, and I can understand why you wouldn't want to let your team down. It sounds like leaving open the possibility for "surprise" level ups, as I mentioned before, would be important in a game you were participating in. A conversation with the rest of the players would be key here as well. If there's a compelling reason to clear out the goblins (which I would hope there is, if it's been designated as a campaign goal), there would already be tension whether the "level up" goal was set or not. Delaying the confrontation with the goblins might have other consequences that the rest of the party doesn't want - they take more hostages, for example, or they burn more of the forest, or whatever. All of those could be worse consequences than delaying the level advancement. Either way you look at it, though, kudos to you for putting the team first.

@j-pspore2887 Год назад

Milestone ALL THE WAY. I use XP to figure out encounter balance, but I like making sure that I have control over how the overall campaign is paced.

@goblinsalvagerites Год назад

That's a great way to strike a balance!

@StabYourBrain Год назад

I just like XP Leveling. Feels more rewarding for players and gives them more control over their own progression. And XP aint so bad in Pathfinder. 1000 XP per Level Up with Encounter XP that scales with your heroes is easy to manage. It's not nearly as tedious as tracking the hundreds of thousands of experience points needed to level up in 5e.

@goblinsalvagerites Год назад

Yes! Pathfinder 2e makes it so easy to do!

@JohahnDiechter Год назад

Dm can use XP as a way to track progression, but it may be best to keep xp secret from the PCs for immersion reasons.

@goblinsalvagerites Год назад

This is a great alternative! It sounds like a way to combine the best of both worlds.

@Rashagar Год назад

My first time with milestone levelling was 1st edition pathfinder. But I was the one running the game, and I did it just because I didn't want to faff around with all that additional maths. So I'm not sure it counts haha!

@goblinsalvagerites 8 месяцев назад

Ease of use definitely counts as a valid reason!

@barrydingles442 Год назад

Milestone or die-lestone Just kidding. Xp in megadungeons and dungeoncrawl games, but if there is more intrigue, then milestone makes more sense.

@goblinsalvagerites Год назад

Lol that would make a great shirt! Absolutely, game systems matter, So tailoring your experience to the game you want to have is an important part of being a good GM.

@JaredRedDeath Год назад

Milestone all the way, it feels better narratively.

@goblinsalvagerites Год назад

Another point for Erik! Lol

@Coffeewings334 Год назад

Exp is handled okay in 2E so I don’t mind using it, but my players prefer milestone and it’s not like I have a strong preference either way.

@goblinsalvagerites 11 месяцев назад

You sound like a great DM to have!

@oakstubble Год назад

Fastest click in the tribe

@goblinsalvagerites Год назад

🔥🔫

@brendantuthill6491 Год назад

I am terrified of using XP and having my players just start farming for levels. Couldn't be me

@goblinsalvagerites Год назад

😬😬😬 That may be a session zero conversation you want to have with your players. Even though we don't really use it that much at the table, it doesn't sound very fun to play with people who would do something like that..

@brendantuthill6491 Год назад

@@goblinsalvagerites it's such a weird balance at our table, because the games are always fun, the RP is frequently spectacular, and the players aren't even power gamers in the sense of always trying to make the most "optimal" choice, but they are very, VERY power hungry.