I have the Saucony pro 4. I love them. Very snappy responsive ride with a lot of help. Great grip for different types of pavement. Love the newer version than the pro 3. I've owned the alpha fly one and two but notice the heel starts to peel away just when I'm past my Nike warranty time frame. Saucony pro 4 a little more affordable than the Nike also. Crazy how expensive these running shoes are getting. Painful on the wallet. Been running 20 years and can't believe how much money I have sunk into my passionate hobby. Happy running to all. Great review, thank you
Having run marathons now in all 3 versions of the AlphaFly, I definitely feel the AF V3 is the superior shoe as a 3:15-3:30hr runner. I didn't think about my shoes once on Sunday where I was able to pull off another huge PB. One thing I do notice, is that the AF V2 was a more protective shoe. I didn't experience any calf soreness post Oct 2023 marathon at all. While my calves yesterday and today are a bit sore, not terrible considering I raced a marathon! But if I was just running a marathon without concern of trying to achieve a PB, I'd seriously consider putting the V2's back on. To race in? V3 every damn time. My AF V3 proto version now have 120km on them with ZERO wear, and will be wearing the same pair to Chicago 2024. While both my AF V1 and V2 had significant wear in the rear just past the rear rubber early in their life span. Both my V1 and V2 are over 200kms now, and I use the V1 for 5/10k stuff and the V2 is the race specific long run training shoe.
Awesome review!! Would be curious to see how both these models would compare to Adidas Adios Pro 3, and Metaspeed Sky or Edge Paris doing the same type of comparisons
Hi Andy. Do you think the additional 'rest' when changing shoes could have impacted your HR (both average & max)? The lower starting point after switching shoes could mean a lower average and peak by the end of the rep.
Great comparison! I'm a mid packer, probably can't run the Alphaflys but have been considering the Pro 4. I think, based on your testing, that the Pro 4 may be a better half marathon shoe.
Saucony shoes encourage faster cadence whereas ZoomX will yield a lower cadence but longer stride (at least from my Stryd data). For me ZoomX is a winner as a forefoot striker
Using both these shoes in my Chicago build up. Would choose the AF3 anyday over the Endorphin Pros. AF3s are just a lot more responsive. I am a 3:15 marathoner and run my long runs around 7:50-8:15 pace
Pro 4 is my current racing shoe. Ran a 10k pb without going for one just running it as a workout. And I've ran 21 miles in training for my marathon and we're equally as good. Light as a feather and get that fast shoe feeling. I don't get on with the alphafly because of the arch so I wernt on my short list while choosing my latest racing shoe.
Interesting test. I think it does largely, as you say, come down these days to which shoe you prefer to run in as I would say statistically those results were pretty much the same. Indeed looking at your HR graph on Strava the 166 max HR on your 4th rep (2nd in the Pro 4) looked like a mini spike as your HR went from 161 up to 166 and back to 161 again all in 30 seconds. That looks like would have added at least 1 bpm to that rep's average HR. Also looked like that 4th rep was slightly uphill and the last one in the AF3 slightly downhill so not surprising HR dropped a little bit. Be interesting if you could do similar in the AF3 vs Endorphin Elite given they seem to be the 2 super shoes you like the most at the moment. Plus I could do the same test for another comparison. I never got the Pro 4 in the end as kind of thought there are only so many £200+ effective super trainers I need which is what the Pro 1/2/3 all essentially became for me. As for AF3 not been on my feet since January but maybe now in warmer weather they might feel better than they did for me back then.
Yeah absolutely… got to take those HR stats with a pinch of salt because that spike could have been the monitor throwing a bit of a wobbly. So reps 1 and 3 were the same direction (alpha then pro) and 2 and 4 were the same (alpha then pro) so they both got 2 reps on exactly the same route… the elevation plot is dubious, my watch plots some weird elevation sometimes. The only oddity was 5 where I had to spin just over half way and come back 👍 Yeah the elite and the v3 alpha is on my list to try!
You can always override the elevation using Strava data on a per-activity basis. I use it regularly when my watch's altimeter throws some dodgy values.
First run today in Endorphin Pro 3 which I got for a daily trainer price (40% off). First run in any carbon plated shoe - so I know nothing - but I think they'll do well for me.
Hi Andy I’ve got the AF3s at the beginning I was a bit perplexed about the shoes, didn’t feel something special in them. I did a couple of training and started to appreciate them more and more … I did Paris Marathon with them and did my PB. They are fantastic for crewsing and keeping the pace … they less bulky than the v2s. My HR is lower too with these shoes. I’ve got the Metaspeed edge Paris with the lower plate and for me it’s more for shorter distances et higher speeds even if running a marathon with them is ok. (It’s a bit unstable on the back too, they feel more like vaporflys for me but they are great) . I don’t have the Pro4s. 😉👏👏👏🇫🇷
2 seconds every 2 km also adds up. Just like the minimal heart rate difference does. I'd say: test results inconclusive. Except for you liking Nikes more. Which IS important for you of course.
Aggressive compared to the alphafly 3… in terms of the pro 3… yes the pro 3s plate feels more snappy to me, but again I put a really fast workout in the pro 4, it’s still a rocket of a shoe
Endorphins upper is better and doesn’t give me blisters cause it’s roomier. But I am telling you. When running, AF3 wins it hands down. You just need to take it with the pain on your foot arch if you have wider foot
is this even a fair comparison? the alphafly vs saucone endorphin elite would be the right comparison isnt it? ... vaporfly with tthe pro 4. got my pair of elites cheap these days and love em
"Cardiovascular drift, also known as heart rate drift, is a gradual increase in heart rate and decrease in stroke volume that occurs during prolonged, moderate-intensity exercise. It usually begins after about 10 minutes of exercise in a warm or neutral environment, such as a 50-75% V̇o 2max effort. Heat stress and thermal strain can make cardiovascular drift worse." This is why this test shows nothing. Re do it now but switch up which ones are done first. If alphafly is the same hr or less than id say you can say its more effecienct.
On a run a few days ago, I was thinking about these sorts of head to head comparisons and how different running channels approach them. I think that what I'd really love to see is basically a four part test for every shoe. Tests 1 and 2 would be right out of the box, or close to it. Do 5k on a treadmill, increasing pace three times, going from marathon pace to 10k pace to 5k pace. Then, do the same 5k exercise on a slightly hilly stretch of road, something with around 40 to 50 total metres of climbing and descent. Tests 3 and 4 are after a fair amount of distance in the shoe to ensure familiarity with it (say, 100km or more), and it's otherwise the same as tests 1 and 2. Track the metrics you used: HR, cadence, and stride length.
Loving the pro 4 in couple of shorter races. Is the elites much faster than pro 4s do you think? Is it a case of 270euros for 15second better 10k time in elites compared to the pro 4s ? Not sure 😂😂
Real world testing imo,give a real outlook than these treadmill lab testing as there’s grit,stones and elements where you’ll be using the shoe great vid as always Andy
Thanks for the review. Do you wear your regular size in both or did you had to size up ? I am tempted to get the Alphafly 3, but for the pro 4 I had to size up as the length was a bit short.
