There really is no denying it, it's pretty much impossible to collect GW products without feeling like you're being fucked. It's an extremely toxic kind of relationship for a business to have with it's customers. I shouldn't be feeling bad about every purchase I make, like I'm being ripped off and taken for a mug, but that's what you feel paying such exorbitant sums of money for plastic figures. I stopped playing a couple of years back, you shouldn't feel like you're being bent over and fucked in the ass every transaction.
G3 XE its sad you have to search for the cheapest shit on ebay, which is probably dodgey and comes from some shed in the russian wilderness just to get a decent price and then your shipping costs fuck you over... GW are making serious cash nevertheleess.
Same, when I realized each of my 5 armies could pay for a good guitar (or 3 guitars in the case of my Tau army) I just gave up on buying anything else for 40K anymore. They need a shakeup, lose the money haemmoraghing brick & mortar stores that only 2% of players can benefit from but EVERYONE has to pay for, at the very least. And the rules should be free to download like virtually every other wargame.
Well, the new CEO of GW seems to slowly be pushing things in the right direction. It may take some time, but I think we may one day see somewhat affordable GW in the future.
+Sup3rSaiy3n I just bought the 7th edition rule book set for $25 at my local Half-Price Books, using a -50% coupon. I got REALLY lucky. And I'm thinking about returning it because everything else is so expensive, and I doubt I have time to play much. I'd love to see if I'm any good though. Also some of the battle videos make me think the battle system might be too unrealistic for my tastes. I can't remember what it was that bothered me so much any more. Edit: I think maybe it was how fast units die and how "fast" the game plays, so even though the game might take an hour or 2 to play, the battle would have taken a few minutes at MOST. And that takes me out of any immersion in the universe. How can they go through so many troops so QUICKLY, and still keep their numbers up?!
+Sup3rSaiy3n I also got the Firestorm Planetfall Commander Pack for $8. That has everything I'll ever need to pay for to play the game. Spartan Games has the rest of the stuff you NEED available for free download on their website. I say you don't need the miniatures, though it would be REALLY nice. You CAN use cardboard base-plate cutouts.
A cheep trick for many COs that know they are leaving is to do whatever they can to get as high bonus as possible, if it hurts the company they don't give a shit about. It happens every day all over the world.
I'm trying to get into the hobby, and I'm not sure when to start it because I'm building a computer soon. How much money will it cost just to get started?
RU-vid why can I not reply to Darby Conway?! Anyway, yeah I did see a t-shirt with a print that read "Drugs would be cheaper". I think it showed an Ork snorting bits off a sprue.
this shirt is funny because when I was back in High School (around the turn of the century) I actually used 40k as my substitute to not do drugs any more, the price was about the same back then, at least the amount I would pay, so yes that shirt is correct "Drugs would be Cheaper"
***** This was 2013, prices are even higher now. I just got back into Warhammer after many years. And indeed when I first started aged 12, it was 'for me' maybe not completely, since it did still cost money but it was buyable, if the prices were the same as then and with us now being older, it would be completely for us, but sadly, a lot of prices have gone up by about 30% adding the fact you now get less models within most boxes as well, I'd put it at 40-50%. It is known - widely known in fact - that it has almost died out and many people did indeed think that it would stop, simply due to the absurdly high prices compared to other things and taking into account ages 12-16 wish to do it as a part-time hobby and truly do not have the money. Though, price changes is understandable, I am mostly just upset that they also have the audacity to cut the model amount by 30%+ in some cases. I can't speak with regards to knives, that's always been a weird one for me. It seems pointless and too violent in its nature, which makes it seem a bit capricious. (Unless you actually use them out in the woods/fishing etc). However, It is clear and widely known and infamous for being highly costly compared to other hobbies, the prices of knives won't have changed much if they're standing next to Warhammer. And there's a great range on knives or anything of this nature.
***** As I just stated within my former comment I just got back into the universe of Warhammer and Games Workshop. I am currently creating a Warhammer chess set, I have a huge piece of modelling foam to house it within and a really old chess board. To make the 32 chess pieces, 16 each side (Using the same models for each side and just painting them red and white (this being the cheapest option)) comes to around £150, one could make it £100 but you'd be removing the more apt and nice looking models, and if one went all-out it would be £200. I am 50/50 with this. I feel it's a little too much, but then again is it? 32 nice models to create a chess set for £150 doesn't seem too bad giving the fact you can buy chess sets themed and otherwise ranging from £100-500, that's not including old ones and the first range of set chess which would be thousands. I've looked through every single model on the new Warhammer website since getting back a few days ago. And it seems the only thing one can do is to buy the kits/set/models which are nice/good/big whilst being cheap-ish. There's a strange gap between price ranges, some things are £20-40 and worth it and other things are £60-100 and not worth it. A few armies are cheap and a few are absurdly expensive, maybe we just need to make sure we get what's best for our money, as it were. :) In a just would I'd have loved to get the chess set I want for £100 or less rather than £150+ (Although, they are not made for chess sets which come in fours, Warhammer sets come in threes a lot of the time, so it's quite difficult). But, just looking at the armies themselves, the normal men/troops, they seem to be more deer than just buying singular big models. Thoughts, anybody? :)
***** I remember buying 18-20 troops for £12, then it was £15, then it was £20...and now it's £20+ for 10-16 troops. So in reality, it's £30-40 for the 20 troops that would have cost £12-20. The deer point being 2015 and the cheapest point being 2008. This does not seem right, though, it is like this for most things, food shopping even. The real problem is that we the everyday Englishman do not get paid/given money to counter these huge increases. It's almost like rent going up but our income staying the same..this is prescience for the matter. This is the emphatic problem and reality of the situation. We also seem to have a kind of innate compass for knowing just what something is worth and knowing when it's no longer worth it. It seems to me that 20 models for £20-30 could be imagined, but 10 models for £30-40, I'm not convinced.
Your comment confused me. At 3:37 I said that paints are £2.40 a pot which they still are. At 3:48 I state that models are £30 for 5 models which a pack of 5 Sternguard veterans still are. At 4:14 I reminisce how you could get 5 Space Marines for under £10 and that nowadays for 5 Space Marines you will not see much change from £20. 5 scouts are £15.50 so my statement remains correct. Is this what you were referring to? The video is over a year old but is still in date and more relevant now than at any other point in the hobby. Would you like to iyo answer the question the video asks?
I just bought 2 post of paint for £2.50 a pop today, before that though I did buy some for £3.00, but looking back that might of been from an independent retailer. Also I think I misheard you with the count of marines, I remember when 10 marines gave you change from £20, but now that won't even cover it.
GamingBooth Yeah, I remember when you could get 10 Space Marines for £10 but hey I can't complain too much the models are a lot nicer nowadays. Dat Knight Titan tho.
Wow, I thought UK prices for GW models were moderate, unlike across the pond to Canada where for the items featured in the video would cost us folks $190 or £104.27 equivalent
I could never afford to buy into this hobby even as a kid some 20 years ago, but now I do (though I don't think my wife has any idea quite how much I've spent). Then again, I'm always shocked at how much kids are able to spend these days, or what parents will buy them. Man, that makes me sound old...
Firstly. don't buy from GW or GW resellers. Find yourself a hobbystore that makes its own prices and can give you a reasonable discount if you buy alot from them. Always question yourself: "Can't I get this cheaper anywhere, must I buy it here?". And if you can wait patiently, ebay is the way to go.
thats what i say i buy some from wayland games cuz i wanted to buy centurions theyre 62 euros i cant afford three miniatures for such a price im not that rich that and on wayland games its like 49 euros
RubixTheBrute you guys are damn lucky we can't get shit from them over here in the states.... I recently started this hobby because a friend did a report on it in school a few years back. I wasn't expecting this.... 12 Firewarriors equal $36.25? seriously? The only jobs around here are fast food jobs, and for part-time it's around 20 hours a week at $7.25 an hour! over time, yes it will stack up, but not all people want to spend all their money on this- They need to save up to go to college, pay bills, taxes,etc.!
auslov so pace yourself. find a local game store, they are usually 10% off or so. on top of that, bills first, as you dont need to buy more models every paycheck.
There is a local game store around here but sadly they sell everything around the MSRP. Lately the only things I've bought were paints, and a few models off of friendly EBAY. Bills always come first.
I started playing 40k in 2000. Back then, the game was expensive, but it wasn't overly so. Back then, my sense of "wow, that's cool" far outweighed my sense of "that's a rip off!". These days, it's totally the opposite, and I have way, way more money now. Sorry, GW. We had a good run...
malicant123 To me someone spending £200 on a pair trainers is "A Rip off" but if that is what they want to do and if that is the price they are being asked and are willing to pay how can it be a rip off.
@@banhammer7243 lets boil this down. 2 pencils exactly the same, one costs 50p, the other £10. Two people buy them and each is happy with his purchase. Now objectively, who would you say got ripped off?
I think the edition rulebook should carry all factions it would simple fix allowing everyone to play right away, however in GW's endless pursuit of profit they gave up doing that. The recent "you will not be missed" (regardless of weather or not you conform) stuff just justifies my decision to do my backlog and move to another system, which doesn't insult it's customers.
I have been asking myself the same thing lately - who has GW pegged as their primary market? I got into the hobby when I was 13. Even back then, it was expensive, but not ridiculously so. I had a part-time job that earned me minimum wage; between that and allowance, I had no issues making a monthly trip to GW and buying a couple of boxes worth of models. I never bothered with second hand stuff; I didn't need to. I could afford the models new, and stripping paint was a nuisance, so what was the point? Fast forward to today. I now have a job that pulls in six figures. I have a mortgage to pay, but even so I have a hell of a lot more disposable income now than I did back then. I am increasingly finding myself being priced out of a hobby that I did, and still do, enjoy. Whenever I buy a new model, I feel guilty - I know I'm being ripped off and I feel like an idiot for supporting this sort of business. Which is why I have increasingly started buying models used off of eBay, or just not bothering at all, which doesn't strike me as a success for Games Workshop's marketing department. And I'm not exactly hard-up for cash! At worst I'm upper-middle class and there are plenty of people who would call someone with my paycheque "rich"; if I'm rich and I think this hobby costs too much, GW has a serious problem on their hands.
I watch this video in my third year of high school when it first came out, and my father bought the models for my brother and I. And I didn't understand this video. Now that I buy my own miniatures and build my own army's its become clear. Some of these models are crazy how expensive they are. But for me, I still buy them for the memories of my childhood.
Heres a little anecdote for you. In 1998 When I was about 10 or 11 years old I was introduced to Warhammer 40k by a friend of mine whose father was very into traditional model collecting (ww2 planes/tanks, model rockets ect.) I played it for several years after that with my close friends and people at the nearby Games Workshop store and a local comic book store that had a few tables in the back. I even went to Games Day (official GW convention) in Baltimore, MA one time. When I got to high school, everyone there played Magic The Gathering. That game was much better suited to high school than warhammer, all you needed was a flat surface and some cards. You could play it in between classes, at lunch or even on the bus. So I became a magic player for a while. When I got to college, nobody played Magic or Warhammer so I started playing World of Warcraft. After the first 1 1/2, 2 years of college, I simply didn't have time to play that anymore since it required me to sit there for 4-5 hours every night raiding or doing arena. I graduated right after the whole 2008 financial crisis shitstorm. I had no job and no money living at my parent's house doing basically nothing. I dug out some of my old paints and models and started painting just for fun and because I was bored. However, in my area took the financial crisis pretty hard and the local comic book shop AND games workshop store had closed up. So I gave up on Warhammer again for a few more years, I got a job finally and started playing MOBA games on my computer. Recently, I heard that GW was updating the Dark Eldar Codex (my old army) and a new gaming shop had opened not too far from me. I went down there to check it out and had a great time. Everyone was so friendly. The young guys brought me up to speed on the new rules and armies while the older guys enjoyed reminiscing about the old days when I played. I purchased the box set that comes with 10 kabalite warriors and 1 raider and some paints and brushes. After a few weeks of painting when I have free time, I have the contents of that box fully painted and based. I recently purchased some scourges that I look forward to painting soon. To answer your question, who is this hobby for? I am in my late 20s, my girlfriend and I both have nice jobs and our own place and we are both painting and enjoying it. However, I don't do it like you do where you buy 2 boxes and 2 characters at one time. I just buy one box and wait until I paint the whole thing until I buy new stuff. It helps keep the cost down a little bit. I am encountering some problems though. I need to get some grotesques but they are finecast and sold out on the GW website right now. My local shop doesn't have any. I will need to venture into the risky territory of ebay or amazon to get them or drive a far distance to go to a store that might have them available. Anyway, hope you enjoyed my story and good luck with your hobby and channel.
Finecast stuff is starting to vanish. I can no longer get a Big Mek with KFF... and COINCIDENTALLY, GW just came out with some really expensive kits -- Meganobz, and the Orkanaut -- which BOTH include a KFF bit. So now, instead of going through the complicated process of buying a single model for $22.00, I can buy a $63-100.00 kit and haphazardly glue the KFF to a Nob!!!! >
Completely agree. It's becoming even more of a niche hobby with every release. Back when I was a lad it's all we talked about and played. Nowadays it's incredibly expensive even for someone with a full time job and other responsibilities let alone newcomers to the hobby.
***** Its worse for me I think, considering I live in Hawaii, and I'm a full-time college student. The minimum wage and the cost of living here are literally the worst across the entire United States, someone would be better off living in California simply because groceries alone cost 40-50% *less*. At this point my hobbies have become a few video games, most of which free to play, and a sparce purchase here and there for model kits like a Mastergrade Gundam kit, or in last year's case a Knight Titan...which I still think was an okay purchase (although 100$ would've been a bit more fair). As much as I love Warhammer the best I can do is ask some friends around the university for bitz and cobble things together, or just draw stuff. In Hawaii's crap economy, minimum wage is around 7.25$ (with plans to increase it-slowly of course :/), however for a *not-too-crappy* apartment it'll cost from 1,000 to 1,300 a month, and that's not including your groceries, cable, or internet. Toss in transportation and upkeep costs and you've basically bankrupted yourself. In my case I live with two roommates and we all work a part-time job or *two*, and even with that we all have to take out loans via financial aid to help pay for school. Sad part is we all like Warhammer, but Games Workshop doesn't like us.
+Brass 'n Barrels Firearms Channel Yup I am looking at getting a 3d printer already. Gonna play table top games with my brothers so who gives a fuck if the models are perfect. $400 for a unlimited size army as many tanks as I want sounds like a good deal to me.
I was quite intrigued when I saw the title of this video. I started a Warhammer army years and years ago when I was coming towards the end of my GCSEs. At the time I was relatively immature, impatient and I did not have the impetus to properly build an army. Fast forward 10 years. Some of my mates have small Warhammer armies. I have been considering starting one myself. However, whenever I go into Games Workshop I get the same feelings you have. I look at the prices of the models and I just think, 'are these people serious?'. Do casts cost a lot? Probably, but they can't cost that much. I don't know where GW sources its figurines from but I would be surprised if they're not just mass produced in one of the usual Asian countries. £18 for a single, plastic figurine on a sprue. £18. £20 for 5 plastic figurines on a sprue. £35 for a few panels that make up a tank on a sprue. It is sheer madness. It is also why I have not yet started a new collection. My mates don't have large armies; they are quite modest. That said, I worked out that to buy a Necrons starter box, the paints I would need to do a good job, etc... would probably cost me in the region of £150. The recommended paints needed to properly pain even basic figurines are normally 10-15 at least. I have seen people on RU-vid with armies that have literally cost them 3 - 4 thousand pounds. Then a new edition of the rules comes out and renders it useless (presumably another GW move motivated by money...). Who is the hobby for? I don't know. I find GW's pricing structure ludicrous, though, that is for sure.
Vengeful Swan Excellent contribution to the debate. Thank you for sharing. Now about those guys with large collections haha!: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-cxN99fuhRu0.html
1532chris It isn't a matter of affordability. The very fact you have gone there just demonstrates that you are a bit of a 'fanboy'. Games Workshop prices are ridiculous for what you get; that is a fact. Casts do not cost that much to make, and GW's global restrictive import/export model just evidences how much their business model depends upon stifling globalization in order to control regional pricing.
+1532chris Look, with the quality games workshop has, they are not exactly exceptional when it comes to their miniatures. Most miniatures now-a-days are slightly below or above GM's quality level, but cost boatloads less money. Unless GM miniatures are made of PEWTER, then they aren't worth what they are charging.
Old comment, but what range is superior to GW? I'm a warmahordes and infinity guy and you're out of your mind if you think they're even remotely in the same league as GW quality, especially in plastics land.
For me, the prices are not as high as people make out. Maybe this is just because I'm more into the modelling side of the hobby, but I'm fine with paying full price for a box of models. I take my time with building, painting and the odd conversion, and when I'm finally finished with a great looking model that I've spent my time on, it seems like money well spent. From what I can see, the people who tend to complain about the prices are the people who don't give a rat's ass about what their models look like and only use them for gaming. Nobody really likes killing an army of grey models.
Oh yeah I'm definitely into the modelling side of the hobby like yourself. Part of me thinks that sometimes, not all the time, GW are taking the mick or testing their market to see what they can get away with. Just one current example is the Gorkanaut vs Stompa. For £5 more you're getting a much nicer model imo, that you can spend more time modelling and painting that just happens to have great rules too. Maybe I'm just a little cynical but for good reason.
***** I do agree somewhat about the prices if you look at the stompa. It's a huge model, and then look at the knight. It's a lot smaller than the stompa, but it's £10 more expensive. Another instance is when I bought some centurions, and it hit me that it was £50 for 3 models! But in all honesty, it doesn't really bother me.
it's a bit like drugs imo. GW/drugs are started with small amounts at low cost, the more addicted you become the more you spend and the easier the justification of that expenditure becomes. the problem for GW is that they've increased the price of that 'first hit' so much (see other posts here that state the price of a GW starter set with paints and other needed accessories) that people won't/can't try it in the first place. older GW vets are already addicted and will no doubt always find a way to get their fix but where is the next generation of gamers coming from?
I disagree, I'm also into the modelling side of the hobby definitely more so than the gaming side but i also come from a scale modelling angle mostly 1:48 aircraft which usually entail aftermarket options such as photo etch, full resin cockpits and engines and if i were to compare what I would get for 80 pounds from hannants as opposed to forge world or god forbid games workshop new zealand which is significantly more expensive than buying from gw uk , I definitely get more bang for my buck just buying an airfix spitfire and embellishing it with all the aftermarket goodies. Perhaps when gw finally go bust hornby might pick them up and redirect them towards the light just as they did air fix
I'm pretty new to the hobby myself. I got into it about a year ago because of an old friend who has an enormous collection. I was blown away by the work he did on his models. When I walked into the game shop the people basically told me up front that GW is a ripoff but that it's about the community, not the money. I didn't really get it, but I picked up a Dark Eldar battleforce (I thought they looked the coolest), some tools, and some paints, and left about $180 lighter. Ever since then everyone I've met in the hobby has been really helpful with modeling and painting advice and helping me learn to play. Everyone's really into the hobby and inclusive. None of this has anything to do with GW, because as much as they'd like to pretend otherwise, they ultimately don't control the metagame. Half of my army is made up of old 3rd edition stuff I either got a great deal on from other hobbyists/stores or that were just given to me. If GW starts charging $50 for a box of 5 space marines, people will still play the game. They'll buy older models, or covert them from other manufacturers, or swap for them.
There is always the option of supporting the smaller companies (Wargames Factory, etc.) You get a lot better price per model and the quality is just as good. I recently bought a box of Zombies and Skeletons for $40 American and ended up with over 50 models. There are plenty of game companies out there and if you want to show GW you're unhappy, don't buy their products. Just my 2 cents anyway...
+Robo Mac Art Thank you for your input. There's certainly more competition and choices out there than there ever has been, yet GW's prices continue to rise...
It is still for everybody. You just can't buy a whole army in one go. I'm a 26 year old student (working part time as an asset consultant besides my studies) and recently got back into the hobby with a few friends. Over the last 3 months we built up 500 point armies (hopefully get to 1k in the next 3 month) with roughly spending 140€ over said three months. I'm also in collecting knifes and I just changed my focus for a bit to spent some money on 40k instead of my other collection. It does not break the bank if you get 1 maybe 2 packs a month, just enjoy the other aspects of the hobby, take your time painting and maybe even playing lower point games and built up your army step by step. PS: This does not mean I'm fine with GWs price pplitics, but i still think the hobby is still manageable if you're not rich.
There seems to be a direct correlation between the rising price of the game ($63.00 American for 3 Mega Nobz!), and how proficient my molding and casting skills are becoming. I'd rather just buy all the mini's I need, but unless I want to save for a year to get a small army, it's just MUCH cheaper to buy one box, a bottle of RTV rubber and some resin and go to town. If the prices were closer to reasonable, I'd just buy all the kits I need, because casting can be very time intensive and sometimes frustrating.
Nice one Aaron. Yeah I think GW have realised the direction the hobby is going and have responded with a much more aggressive release schedule and rise in prices. Maybe they haven't realised but it would explain their business model of late. The direction of which I am talking about is 3D printing. 3D printers are becoming more affordable by the month and soon it will be cheaper to buy one and print an army. It's not that far off as some might think. We can already print guns and seeing as GW no longer cater as much for tournaments and game clubs, playing with printed armies between your friends will rise in popularity.
I remember when I started this hobby a good 20+ years back. The idea behind the hobby was that you made a purchase based on your own personal budget. You knew what you could spend each month, and you rolled with it. You got a character, saved the rest, the month after you got a slightly bigger box, and so forth. The idea to purchase an army in one go, that a great many people have today, was beyond reason! You just wouldn't do it, it was that simple. Why? Because it took away from the hobby experience. You made a purchase, you took your time to clean, assemble, paint and base, and by the time your regiment was completed, you had just enough time to try it out on the battlefield before the month was due, and a new purchase could be done. If anyone remembers "a tale of four gamers" episode in an old White Dwarf magazine, well, that was basically the mindset back then. Now for the pure X is more expensive than today's Y, well we can all use the inflation calculator and see that its a difference. But is it a "major" difference? If you cut away the need to buy a 3k list in one go, and take it box by box, its not that much more expensive, and I can only say by my own situation that I can afford more products from Games Workshop now than ever before in my life. But apart from that, I can (no matter what the hipster-warhammer community says about it) now enjoy better models than ever before. You know I used to pay around $10 for a box of 7 (or was it 6...) monoposed plastic infantry-men for my Warhammer force. This made it so I had to get 3 boxed to get a regiment of 20. Now this might seem all well and done you think, but ad to this that you didn't get any command squad with it, so that's another $10 for a blister of 3 metal models. Now... If I where to be a serious hobbyist that also wanted an alternative pose to my rank and file models, I would have to purchase separate blisters (also $10) with these models. Take in to account that Im not from America, but have roughly translated as best I could the cost they charged at my local store back in 1990. So, not saying anything about today's prices not being pricy, Im just saying, its always been an issue. Im also stating our mindset have drastically changed from when I was young! This might even come as a surprise for a great many people. In these times of fast food and instant access to just about anything, the idea to save up money, take your time with something might just seem strange. But again, back to the subject. Yes, we covered that its always been expensive, and yes, the idea to save for stuff have long since been abandoned by today's hobbyists, but here's my real argument... We have forgotten that engaging a hobby is a luxury! It is an excess that stretches beyond your everyday needs. Our society has spoiled us so much that we have forgotten that its a privilege to enjoy this hobby, not a right.
Why did you buy them if you don't value them accordingly? They charge what the market is willing to pay. YOU AND OTHERS LIKE YOU ARE WILLING TO BUY ENOUGH THAT THEY TURN A PROFIT.
GW have a monopoly on decent quality miniatures; they have no competition so their extortionate prices are unchallenged. The choice isn't: GW or a reasonably priced alternative, but GW or no hobby at all
I concur. Let us not forget that this requires time effort and money for resources to piece these models together and paint them as well.... and then of course we could discuss the cost of materials for terrain and the like.....
I totally feel ya on that! At least you actually had a "real" hobby though. I spent 12+ years investing in and playing MTG. Pack after pack after box and fat packs and singles and tourney entry fees and travel expenses to attend those PTQ's and pre-release tourney's. About 4 or 5 years ago I bailed cold turkey and sold off my collection. I will tell you this, I have not looked back and glad I did as I used the proceeds to acquire a respectable collection of various other board games and tabletop games that I would not have otherwise had the pleasure of experiencing. Since then I have had the pleasure of enjoying "real" hobby games that require some assembly and painting and the like which is quite therapeutic and enjoyable to me where as CCG's you see lack that and eventually just become addictively competitive. Funny thing is that is actually how I ran across your video. I have given some serious thought to investing in 40K for my first time recently but the price point is quite bothersome and very MTG reminiscent to me as far as investment goes.
Game Talker Understand your comment mate. Yeah people know I moan now and again but with good reason. With the time, money and talent invested I think I've earnt that haha. Anyway the prices have been the worse since I started but it's not just that as people have said if you can't afford it then quit, well it's not just about their prices. We all know they're a business but they're alienating their core customers by re releasing almost the same codex from only a year ago. They're about to do it again soon with Space Marines and I really hope people wake up and say enough is enough. It's ludicrous if you ask me. I bought a codex for £25 last year and it was completely replaced (as they removed the older one from their webstore) only a year later. Sorry but I unless I'm playing 40K every weekend it ain't worth it and even if I was I'd still think it's money grabbing at best. Other people will always defend their actions but even they have their limits, unless it's their main hobby or they have piles of disposable income. However saying all that it can be a very rewarding hobby just try not to get hooked haha. Good luck whatever your decision. Hope you enjoy my other videos!
It's an interesting question you raised here. And the situation with hobbies and toys where I live is kind of interesting as well, now that I think of it... Firstly, where I live the GW hobby has always been far too expensive for kids and teenagers. My own first contact with the hobby happened when I stumbled by pure accident upon a small independent retailer who sold GW models. And I still remember with 100% clarity how when I entered the store, I had my jaw literally drop twice: first it was at the total awesomness of the figures, books and artwork, and second it was at the prices, which were downright insanely high for a university student without a proper job (that's what I was back then). So I had to forget about Warhammer for the next 3 or 4 years - and returning to that store was one of the first things that I did to celebrate my first full-sized monthly salary after passing 3-month probation period on my first good full-time job after graduation. And - guess what - this was over 15 years ago! I still have a few unopened blisters laying around that I bought over 10 years ago, and price tags on those blisters make me want to laugh and cry at the same time :) Basically, 40k here has always been mostly an expensive pastime for young to middle-aged men. I'd say that for the bigger part of the last 15 years about 80% of the local player base were dudes of 23 to 35 years old with decent jobs and no families (or at least no kids). This is why, despite the crazy price increases, the change of situation in the hobby doesn't feel too dramatic. And secondly, come to think of it, the overall situation is changing in a strange way. Thing is, in the last 2-3 years I noticed that prices for all toys (even those for little kids) have become crazy high overall. For example, a (relatively) nice-looking doll that we recently bought for my wife's 5-year old niece did cost roughly as much as a full-sized 10-model 40k squad box. That was far from the most expensive dolls too - more elaborate ones would cost as much as an Imperial Knight or even more. And that's a regular toy store for you. This made me wonder if GW actually tunes its prices to match the overall market of quality toys. At least, seeing those prices I can't help thinking that, weirdly enough, right now it's probably less impossible to imagine parents buying their kid a bunch of 40k models than it was 15 years ago - because most other toys are just as expensive anyway. That said, in the last couple of years the 40k community has expanded with many new players, most of them young - and most of them play with models bought from pirate recasters. Speaks for itself, really.
+Harry Gunston No offence but your comment reads like you don't understand why everything is more expensive in Australia. I'd suggest you read: thenewdaily.com.au/news/2014/03/05/everything-australia-expensive/ or put up and shut up as prices aren't going to fall anytime soon. It sucks that a luxury item costs...well a lot, but it's relative to our minimum wage AND they have to ship it all the way over to you. - I'm not agreeing with their pricing at all but it's impossible for them to price it the same as every other country. I too get annoyed when us Brits have to pay double for knives over what the Americans pay for exactly the same product. I get Australians moan about their prices all the time so I'm always compelled to compare them. I do know Aussies pay a lot for everything in general, but I also know they have the highest hourly minimum wage in the world, are one of the richest counties in the world and two thirds of their population choose to live in densely populated areas. Hope that helps if you weren't fully aware of some of the reasons.
The Outer Circl covered the shipping and packaging oricing very well - look it up. GW has now become so ecxpensive in Australia that it is literally for the wealthy table top gamers only. I could buy an entire WWII army for the cost of a squad of Citadel miniatures and one Forgeworld tank.
8 лет назад
Copy the photos of figures on the net,print them out,cut and stick on cardboard,and play.Same game,teeny,teeny fraction of the cost.
+Gamer Hudson Quite right, the only rulebook I think should be bought would be the one in the starter box. Actually, the big boxes sold by gee dubs are roughly the only thing I buy these days since they are often cheaper than the sum of the individual components. Still expensive though...
Unfortunately that just really isn't true, 'supply in demand' is half a lie. It's true that the higher the demand, the lower the price usually but GW stuff is high demand and their logic says they should charge you an arm and a leg for their models cause they know you'll buy it. It's capitalism at its dirtiest.
I can understand where GW get their pricing from. As a product designer, I have designed plastic components for manufacture. And yes these parts are extremely detailed, the main cost of plastic part production is the manufacturing of the moulds. I could easily see the cost for the mould for five space marines run into at least 10-20K because of the fine detail in the tooling. However once the tooling is completed, the cost per unit will be cheap as chips. I'm talking £1-2 per sprue, But once they factor in the overheads of the company / Factory packaging I can see where the high cost comes in, Manufacturing in china isn't as cheap as it once was. The eastern work force are becoming more aware and are demanding higher wages, much like what happened in the UK. So that is where the rise in price comes from again, Also with the rise in popularity of video games kids and teens are building less models, the are playing less football....etc, the way society is changing is causing these kind of hobbies to die, its only a matter of time before it sinks. That's just my opinion. you will have the die hard fans and the a small minority who will still play it. but that's not enough to keep a business afloat.
"Trying not to be negative." How could you not be negative? And I like the fanatics that call you, me, and others like us cry babies and telling you to shut up and find a new hobby, which these morons don't understand that if people like us leave their gaming community all becomes a bit smaller. I can't stand a-holes that defend GW business practices!!! And yeah I understand they're a business out to make money, as fanatics like to keep reminding me, but there is something called business ethics and price gouging. Truth is that the fans that cry foul are the customers GW doesn't want. The addicts/fanatics and the rich that all bend over blindingly to GW's business practices are the ones that are most desirable naturally. I just hope that when GW eventually dies there is still a large gaming community out there that plays the older editions of Warhammer. Thank God for internet communities.
I go second hand most times. I use to buy monthly from GW, but now I make a big purchase once or twice a year but spend less overall in comparison to the golden years.
"I'm a proper adult and things, at least... I try to be." - I love the sincerity in this, don't let Games Workshops pricing grind your evident passion for collecting down!
As someone who has been getting into 40K through the video games and novels, I can say with confidence that I probably will not get into the miniatures part of the universe. It's so ridiculously expensive that it's making the that part of the hobby almost prohibitive for me. Then again, I did buy the rulebook set recently, and am interested to see what the "bare minimum" squad would cost me to just be able to play every once in a while. Or perhaps put together two opposing squads and be able to play with a friend or the wife.
the hobby is for people who like Warhammer, people who enjoy the models, people who like the rules. not everything needs an age group, and not everything needs to be bought from retail. On top of that, you don't need to constantly buy new models or paints unless you want to. Even video games, which you brought up, are still expensive. If I bought a brand new ps4, and 2 games, I am in 520 dollars and around 50 to 60 hours of entertainement, but If I drop 500 on warhammer I can get an 1000 pt. army that will get me through quite a few games.
Ok, lets examine that example. I'll even up it to a more expensive range. For about 1500$ every 5 years you have a gaming computer, for 20$ you have minecraft, for 0$ you have a whole ton of microtransaction games, got 15$ a month you have any number of mmos. Pick what you like. There is simply no way that 40k gives more hours of enjoyment per dollar. Plus all the non game related uses for the pc. 40k is more expensive than motorcycles per hour of enjoyment, just think about that for a moment.
skugnjgs shpodms It's all about how you spend your money vs. how you use what you spent it on. With warhammer I've spent much but I spend about 60% of my spare time working or playing with it. I feel I've got my moneys worth. Unlike some of my other hobbies.
skugnjgs shpodms 1500 dollars, for a computer that lasts 5 years? You can build one for half that price to last you twice as long!Just because consoles become obsolete in 5 years, doesn't mean Pc's do as well.
Slim Skaven Gaming Oh please, only 60 hours of entertainment? judging by that you only play the game once, so apply that to war hammer, you get a 1 hour game of warhammer, It does come to money, what kid can afford those prices? let alone 2 kids, because it takes 2 people just to play the game.
who said everything is for kids? Plus you are forgetting assembly, painting, and how many 1 hour games of warhammer are you playing? at a decent point cost they run 2-4 hours.
I just got back into the hobby, and stepped into a GW shop here in Houston, and was floored by the prices. I have a great job, but I'm not paying for that shit. The spray paints are 20 bucks per can, the brush-on paints are $4.25, and it costs anywhere from 20 to 60 bucks for a single plastic figure. That's a lot considering I have to bust my ass assembling it and painting the thing! For one 50 buck miniature, you'll have to shell out 40 bucks in paints, another 60 for brushes, and more money for tools and other shit you might not have in your model supply collection. As I said in another post, I'll buy figures separately (sets that have been broken up), put them together, then 3-D print them at the school I work at, and I do it for free. That's the only way to amass an army of decent size without breaking the bank. Of course, those printers are expensive, but I'm just in the right place at the right time.
I'm gonna reword my long post that has spread to shitstorm. The hobby is expensive, but its the same price as many, many others. Gaming (console and PC), other wargames, and many other things all have a high baseline cost. The hobby is for the person who can opt to not buy a game this month, and buys a box or two of models. the hobby is meant for people who like the setting, and want to play. If cash drives you, look at the amount that is spent on competitive magic card decks, video games, and the like, and you will notice, they are remarkably similar across the board, by monthly cost.
The prices are getting ridiculous. They never have any sales or very really have any deals. Best thing to do is to find a good independent supplier who can usually give a discount.
I have thought about going back into GW as I was a gamer back in 88 until 94. I went into the shop looked at the prices and thought to myself, are you taking the piss or what. Back to the gym and cheap DVDs from poundland.
im under the impression that this is NOT for young adults as this is generally the best time to get on with the wild and dangerous things you will do in your life, but as a teenager, a child and entering your senior years for the simple reason is that its a peaceful thing to do in your retirement.
I for myself have chosen not to purchase new GW models any longer. I won't play age of sigmar, and any further incarnation of 40k is done for me as well. In my opinion GW could care less about the gaming community or those of us who put way to much money into a hobby. I have found other game that I feel are just as good as any I have played from GW, at a fraction of the cost. It's sad because I used to love the lore and purchased many books, but I used to think GW was making games because they love making games. My opinion now is they only care about the money. My guess is in a few years it wont matter as I see 3d printing as the death of GW anyway. Farewell GW rest in peace.
I've done me some pricing. I'm a 17 year old bored child. I have seen my dad's old Metal ultra marine army he's had for over twenty years, and I wanted to try this hobby, because, "Why not?" I did some pricing for what you need just to get your foot in the door if you just want try this hobby (playing, painting, conversions etc) and here is what in my opinion you need to start. 2 Squads of whatever faction, (we'll go with space marines because they are most popular) a transport, a starter hobby set, a carrying case, rule book, codex, templates and dice (10-30 D6). All for fresh start on this game. All with current money conversions of when this comment was posted. 1 Citadel Build + Paint Set 33$-25.02 English Pound (EP just to save time for the rest of them) 2 Space Marine Tactical Squads 80$- 60.65 EP 1 Space Marine Land Raider 74.25$-56.29 EP 1 Codex: Space Marines 58$-43.97 EP 1 Universal Templates set 13.25$- 10.05 EP 1 Ultramarines Dice set 20$-15.16 EP 1 Warhammer 40,000 (English) book set 85$-64.44 EP 1 Citadel Battle Figure Case 83$-62.92 EP This is if you want to buy from games workshop and have a good start on this hobby, now let's add up both currency prices. $361.50-338.50 English Pounds. That's is how much you would pay to start this hobby where you use CHEAP PLASTIC MODELS to play the game, it's all cheap materials they pay most for the molds and after that all they pay for is plastic, they are making a killing. My verdict: Fuck games workshop ( I have such little respect for them I won't even capitalize their name), don't buy from them, buy off of Ebay and local retailers. Games workshop is a bunch of money grabbers. Don't tell me, "Oh they do pay a lot". Yeah I'm sure it's more expensive to make these little plastic fuckers than it was to make the Metal ones twenty years ago when they were cheap to buy from GW, (considering we can make plastic out of a lot of different things, whilst metal is more limited). Ebay will make this hobby easier.
I will reply to your comment because it looks like you've spent a lot of time writing it. I guess when you look at all of the initial costs it can be off putting. So much passion (all the swearing) for someone who has not experienced any part of the hobby (assumption as you don't mention in your comment) but has mainly focussed on the initial cost. Buy just one set or a squad, play a game using your dad's models to see if you feel any different. You don't have to buy all those things in your list at once. I didn't. I remember buying a squad of 5 with paints. A month later I bought some terminators, then a dreadnought and so on. I remember taking them to a local club once a week and joining forces with another player. This was when I had very little income, think I was 12 with a job. Yes you can buy second hand models off eBay if you want to cut costs but still be part of the hobby. Anyway whatever you choose to do, make sure you have fun. The moment you don't move on to a different hobby. Thanks again for sharing your opinion.
This video is over 5 years old and the same question is STILL relevant!!! I started this hobby last year and was shocked by price of the start collecting sets. $85 for those sets were expansive as all hell. So I decided to wait. This year I was going to actually purchase the Flesh-eater Courts set and just mere days, DAYS, before my tax returns dropped the start collecting box sets jacked up even higher! Now nearly $100! A person needs to put his/her foot down at some point. I am well aware of the costs of new molds and resources but at the risk of sounding like a complete and utter dick, most of the start collecting kits are just a bunch of older models thrown together and offer not much more. One can literally spend a MASSIVE amount of cash on just the basics when it comes to ANYTHING that GW offers. It blows my mind how over the top they are willing to price even basic tools. I made scale models a number of years before getting into mini's and bought basic sprue cutters for under $5 while GW wants well over $5! Worse yet is the cost of spray paints! I can go to Walmart and spend under $10 for a good primer/paint (2 in 1), while GW slaps on more then $10 extra! A massive $20(excluding taxes and shipping) is just highway robbery! The single mini's are the worst of the worst! I was going to buy Gutrot Spume when I looked at the INSANE price of almost 30 !@#$ing dollars! For a normal sized mini!!! JUST 1 FIGURE. I look at the competition and am seeing them start to jack up the prices too. Why? Because collectors are actually buying these products from GW thus making GW the base line cost. So $25 a mini is the norm. I then looked at other mini companies that are not army based and was blown out of the water at their prices! I looked into some D&D mini's and was surprised by the cost effective mini's they have for sale. I bought a bunch of Nolzur's Marvelous Miniatures for half the price or less! Those mini's come most of the time packed with 2 mini's for $5. So to get 5 mini's I would spend around $15 and have an extra mini! How much did you just pay for 5 Blood Angels? Furthermore, Reaper Bones also offers up a MASSIVE selection of mini's ranging from $3 and up for a single mini! One cannot beat that price! In fact I placed a special order for a Worldbreaker model that stands over 7 inches tall for a mere $50!!!! A mini of this size made by GW would have a price range starting at $85 and up! Simply put GW thinks and feels that it's a cut above the rest of the companies out there because for years they were top of the line. The pricing they currently have is based on this mentality of how things once were. Companies either adopt to the change of time or fail and ultimately go bankrupt. It's that simple. Companies CANNOT be "king of the hill" forever. I have NEVER EVER seen a single GW product on sale any place I have gone. They are ALWAYS FULL PRICE. Chances are if they ever do go on sale it's going to be just a mere dollar or two off the normal price.
Personal attack at what I spend my money on which is totally unrelated to the question raised and also none of your business. Easy response with little info to back it up. Come back when you have all the right information and we'll have a real conversation. I am not going to do your homework for you to falsify your statement.
How is this an attack? You either spend your money on one hobby, another or something completely different. By that standard it's not your business who plays WH40k and why they spend money on that. Despite the fact I hate the prices of GW, we must remember they are not idiots and spend huge amounts on money to make sure they make even more. Sorry if I upset you
Marcin Obuchowski Maybe you should have worded your statement a little better? Similar to what your second comment read like would've sufficed. You didn't upset me tho bro but I welcome your apology. I was just concerned at how quickly you went about to criticise what other things I spend my money on (Which I then spend a ton of time and money to share them with everyone on youtube). You then used that against me as ammunition to drive home your statement. This time your ammo was blank though. Allow me to elaborate (I wouldn't need to if you'd done your homework like I suggested). Although I cannot deny that I buy knives, however FYI the last knife I bought cost £30 a couple of months ago and before that was back in Jan. Also I've bought one watch this year and buy just one every year. The point is what I spend on knives and watches doesn't come close in denting what I spend on this hobby. Your first statement is obvious. It doesn't even need to be said. Of course I know there are choices in which hobby funds are allocated. Everyone realises this too. However that's not the issue here as you should be able to tell from my other videos I spend more on this hobby than any other. By a long way. I spent more in one week the other week than I have on knives all year. It's that expensive. Ultimately though I don't think you understand the question I posted. It was not who can and who can't play 40K nor was it questioning whether they should spend their money on it. It was at who is this hobby is aimed at? You took my question and aimed it at me. I was asking the question. You say you don't want me to spend any of my money on GW products anymore because I have other hobbies. That's ridiculous. Why even bother posting that. I think who it is aimed at has fundamentally changed. Others will agree. I don't think even Games Workshop know who it is aimed at anymore. I am entitled to ask that question given my contribution to this hobby. I had other hobbies when I first collected many years ago but my point was that this hobby did not take up the largest piece of pie back then. I was illustrating how difficult it must be for hobbyists with limited available funds to invest most of those funds into just one hobby. It certainly wasn't meant to invoke a factually redundant one-liner aimed at my own personal spending decisions. That's all mate. No hard feelings bro.
it seems you haven't collected the hobby for years, basically 15yrs ago a tactical squad cost $35, for the same squad with a few extra weapon options the squad now costs $62. After 17yrs I will NOT be continuing the hobby because of cost
Chris S You're wrong about me Chris I have been collecting for may than 15 years and a squad cost £10 back then and they now cost £25. Thats 2 and a half times more than 15 years ago.
I started collecting when I was eight and kept doing so until I was twelve, now I come back at eighteen and it feels so much more expensive and I even have a job now! And since i like guard I gotta shell out alot to make the type of army I want. It's for the people who are driven by passion and fandom.
I think It's mostly for single men or guys without girlfriends because they drain your wealth. If you have a wife and kids, then your job will have to be above average income because your wife sure as heck will not spend any money on your hobby. So, yeah stay single if you want to play this game. I think a 3000 pt army is going to cost around $1500-$2000 dollars (Canadian and that excludes paints, carry case, rule book etc.) But honestly, I still don't think THAT is too terrible. I have another hobby that costs FAR more costly than GW minatures. Like, cars. We don't really realize it because cars are not really a hobby for most people but a car can run you at $15000 Canadian and if you get a older model and then modify it. Well, you can guess how much that can cost. I also do long range target shooting (firearms) and one long range rifle ran me $5000, a scope costs $2500 and the rings to mount that scope on the rifle was $350. That's three items. That does not include ammo, carry case, Range fees, a car to get you to the range, gas for the car etc. A top end long range rifle will easily cost up to $8000, without scope or rings. And if you are a dedicated long range enthusiasts you HAVE to reload your own ammo. Now, throw in Presses, die casts, powder, bullets, brass casings, primers, tumblers and powder measurer etc. So all in all, that's around $12000 to $15000 or more if you want to shoot long range. So all in all, I think an army is not that costly. It gets out of control when you start buying warlord titans etc. Or when 1-2 armies is not enough and you start buying more armies. That's when it gets very expensive. Take my advice. Which is why as a male, you better be single if you want to have any fun hobbies.
you ain,t wrong.;-) my uncles and even my mum said to me: if you want to buy stuff for your hobbies, buy them before you have girlfriend/wife. they are not all like that. but most of them are. and to see where they spend their and your money on... oh boy... make-up,clothing, jewelry, dogs, horses etc etc etc etc etc etc.
If I remember right, in the mid 90s you could buy a blister pack of three Space Marines, or four Eldar for £4. Individually, mail order was £1.35 for a Space Marine, or £2 for a captain or sergeant, and I thought that was expensive then. And I distinctly remember reading one of my brothers old White Dwarfs from a couple years earlier, with models for 50p, and wondering even then how bits of lead could have got so much more expensive in a short time. 20 something years later and I'm wondering if I really want to get back into 40k, or if War Machine would be a better choice.
Mikey R Yep, you remember correctly. When I started out in '88 with the release of Rogue Trader 3 metal Space Marines cost £2.50, 30 plastic marines was £9.99 as were 3 Rhinos and two plastic Land Raiders cost £12.99.
leakycheese yeah, I had that Marine kit! Mk6 armour with the pointy beaks. I used them for the basis of some conversions I did for my art GCSE. Those models were really pants, they used the beige plastic, you had to use the later grey plastic Marine arms and weapons to make them look decent.
GW will never die. they been around longer and if they GW losing money they would cut costs of their models. we are the GW master race and you guys are the mantic peasants. but at the end of the day we still love the same hobby so kudos to that. i apologize if i had insult you
I don't really have that much of an interest in playing the game, but when I was a little kid I really enjoyed painting them. I ended up painting them for allot of my friends who did play. I really enjoyed it and I'd like to paint some again for fun, maybe even try to play a few games. But the cost just to start painting one guy can be well over 100 US dollars if you include paints, primer, and glue terrain. That's insane. How can they expect new people to start buying their products if the cost to start is so immense.
They need to synchronise the release of all rules and codex to approximately every 3 years. Halfway through they should start open beta testing. I'm okay with trickle release of models, but they need to get the rules to align... I can see why the single units are more expensive, I think they are trying to align dollar costs with points cost, so that no one simply gathers a collection of characters. I can only guess that costs keep going u because people keep paying. They are creating a very dangerous economic bubble for themselves. Like yourself, people are starting to question their loyalty and whether or not they can afford this hobby. After that, they lose economies of scale and its all downhill from there. It's quite sad really, Warhammer 40k is possibly my favourite IP, and I'd rather not see it go under due to greed.
the reason why they stagger the release of new books and models, is because you sell more. if you release the Tau Codex, SM Codex, and Eldar codex, a person who collects all three will not be nearly as willing or content to buy all three than if there was a 90 day gap between the three books. They look at their shopping cart of all three books and a few models thrown in for good measure and mentally say, "that's a huge chunk of money I wont have this month." However, If they are only buying the eldar book with a sack of guardians (approximately 80CAD), they think, "Eh, my wife spent that much on shoes this month. I can afford it." It's evil, but necessary to drive sales. Remember that GW has repeated over and over that they are a collector's company first, and a gaming company second.
PerfectTangent I understand that, but my gripe is actually the constant state of "one-upmanship" every codex release. Since Rogue Trader, not once have the rules for every army in the game been playtested and balanced against each other. This makes the product feel unfinished as it is technically in a constant "beta" state. If I'm "investing" $1000+ in a game, I don't want the game itself to feel like a bunch of "home rules", regardless of the quality of the components.
That is a good question. One way to evaluate the value of this high priced purchase is cost per hour of entertainment. As a married father of two, I do not have much time or money to spend on Warhammer 40k. I recently switched to Infinity. Two reasons: less models means less cost and less hobby time; and skirmish games are typically fast. However, if you play 40k - the hobby + game = many hours of entertainment. It may still be a good value. I do not know. My answer to your question is people with lots of time and money to spend, upper middle income.
I think it's worth it, you spend so much time to model, after to paint the miniatures it takes a lot of time! Of course it's expensive if you buy 100 models in one time and do nothing with them, but yeah that's my points of view.
Personally, I think that the hobby is for GW stockholders and investors, However, there is a niche' for the hobby, and hobbyists will continue to purchase these models no matter the cost.
When I worked for GW about 15 years ago it was £25 for a rulebook, £40 for a starter set or battle force/battalion, paints were between £1 and £1.50 (metallics used to be more), people would still query the price of models back then though, especially when 10 Tactical Marines went from £12 to £15 or Catachans went from £15 o £18 but people were still sort of okay with it, I left a couple of years later and now I look at the state of GW prices and it makes me cringe, to me the kits aren't worth what they charge, I know that's relative and depends on individual circumstances, I know many people who were GW hobbyists but now less than a handful still play or collect, like myself a few will at best buy a novel as the lore is the only redeeming feature of the franchise.
Tim Whitehead The hobby wasnt available to them so they did as they had to do to do what they loved. Do you truly feel it was wrong of them to steal from a multi million dollar company who produces these for most likely around 20 cents each making a 1000% profit?
AnCom Commie take a look at the financials reports for Gw from the last 10 years and tell me you honestly think they make 1000% profit! That level of mark up for a company of this size would make them in the billions range not just millions!
Tim Whitehead Even more reason to steal from them, the effort and price it took them to produce one model is practically nothing. How can you defend property over humans? edit: the 1000% profit was referring to how much they make from a single PLASTIC model
AnCom Commie as for "defending property over humans" what GW and any other hobby company make is a luxury item not an essential item for living. Would I throw you in jail for stealing food to feed your family? No. Would I throw you in jail because you stole something you don't need just because you wanted it! Heck yes!
RE: The knife question. In 1987 or 1988, I purchased a Schrade Old Timer (Still made in the USA at this time) Trapper pattern pocketknife from a hardware store for about 11 or 12 dollars. Today, I can find similar knives (Schrade is no longer made in the US, but same type of knife) for about 18 dollars.
Without that Macbook Pro and also my lovely iMac 5K this channel would not exist. I don't know how old you are but I hope there's still time for you to stop judging people on their purchases. You're saying because I choose to be part of an expensive hobby I should adjust my other spending habits, otherwise I'm not entitled to any opinion on it. What's next you're going to judge people on benefits with expensive phones? Get real. Regardless of how much anybody spends on anything they should always be allowed to question it. I asked a question about who is this hobby is for anymore. You chose to ignore this and judge me instead. Judging isn't healthy and there's no point to it. I work hard to afford what I value.
A $3000 MBP you keep for 8 years amortizes to the same amount as a $1500 Thinkpad you only keep for 4. That said, I buy the $1500 thinkpad, put Linux on it, run it for 4 years, drop in another 16GB of RAM and replace the HDDs with SSDs (cost: another $800) and then plan to use it for another 4 years.
I don't think that is his point, really. Obviously, price will always be a barrier for a hobby. And clearly he can still afford it (along with his other hobbies). I think the point is that the barrier has been raised to the degree that someone who fell in love with the hobby as a kid has difficulty seeing that younger version of himself being able to getting to the hobby today. One thing I would add to this is that a hobby like wargaming is far more of a social and competitive hobby than knife or watch collecting. Most people buy these items to play with other people and higher pricing barriers shrink the number and type of people who can (or consider it worth the money) to play with you. That is a different type of value than a Rolex (pure prestige good) or Macbook (specialized tool). Then add in the fact that purchasing power isn't just an entry barrier, it affects your competitive advantage in the game as well: everyone who can "buy in" to Halo competes on an equal footing; you don't have to spend real money on better weapons to use them. Pricing barriers directly impact games in a way that is not true in other hobbies. Even GW will reference the "culture" around their products when justifying business decisions. Is that a problem? Depends on what you want out of the game and the community around it. Do you want a community that is relatively open and based purely on interest in the game? Or do you prefer something more exclusive? Do you want a competitive style based more on skills and tactics or the ability to leverage purchasing power outside the game into power inside the game? Of course, what I don't know is whether it is feasible for GW to operate at lower price points. Maybe the market is too small and wouldn't increase enough at lower pricing points to keep them in business. I'll let others debate that because I don't know enough to make an intelligent argument about it.
WOW 7years old and the question is still relevant. I was a longtime Dawn of War player, read the books, and Graphic novels. I started buying models in March and prices were kind of hard to swallow. However I brought first strike, paint death guard and paint ultramarines so it cost about $100. I didn’t think it was to cost prohibitive. however it depends on your faction your cost of entry. I say shop around.
This game is done. Nobody really does GW anymore. Their fucked up management has singlehandedly destroyed this once fine game. Greed, overpriced 100.00 rulebooks, 50.00 for a single unpainted model, Gestapo GW clerks.... no thanks. I moved on to real models. Also, far too many rule changes by the time an army is finished in construction.
+Mike Shearman Excellent points Mike that I cannot disagree with. Every item on your list, a long with the competitive game scene, independent retailers, gaming clubs and lacklustre get in a queue to buy our products gamesdays, to mention a few, have all contributed to any difficulties they might come into as a company. They are a very large company and won't disappear overnight but I swear some on the internet think that they can do no wrong and justify all of their actions.
Im a life-long GW fan and recently got back into the hobby, whilst its true that some figures are not good value (£18 for one captain) many other things are quite reasonable. Dark Vengence got the ball rolling again and with a few additions that was it. Im playing again all for about £150 inc paints. When I think of the xbox games ive bought over the years for £35-45 a go that i will never play again, it puts GQ in context. Consoles are £300+ and break or get replaced every few years, with this in mind, i'll always have a Dark Angels force and whilst Im always gunna want new squads, my army can just grow and change over time. Plus all the many many hours of enjoyment paintingh/ kit-bashing GW's prices dosnt seem to bad. My feeling now as well is that with the release of new table top games such as warmachine that this style of gaming is coming back and I cant wait to see whats next. To add to the larger debate, Im 30 so now that Im not paying for GW with my paper-round the hobby seem far more open to me now.
this is the injustice of schools to young people. I'll explain. Let's run a quick general costs in life for someone that works. 2 bedroom hovel in gang land. .. 35k, mortgage: £185pcm plus 3k deposit in the first place and the buying process will not give you much change from 2k gas & electric £90 car, finance £150pcm for a rubbish Citroën or similar from a dealership. council tax £90-120pcm perhaps fuel (conservative) £200 food: £200 based just on living!!! and working your essentially throwing away £1000 a month to survive in life. now when I was at school my capitalistic farther explained all this and my school was, pretty the ball too. for example what do you want to do in life matt? err, mechanic!! well that's only reallygoing to make you 25k a year it's rewarding work but you'll be cold sore and covered in grease all day. 25k a year in 20 years will be the same as £6.50 an hour now (1998) oh, right. Well I won't have any money to do anything other than live..... bang!! there's your problem and solution all in one. economics should be anyone's driving force to choosing a career. granted its the musician not the instrument......my brother has 2 degrees one in maths the other in mechanical engineering, yet he's working in McDonald's at 29years old. he's essentially intelligent but thick in common sense terms. me on the other hand, zero qualifications yet I own a medium sized building company. the key point is an awareness of life's costs and your ability to be motivated by money. I wrote off any idea of spare time to play with my willy watch films and generally have a hobby......the opposite of my brother, he's got every game console game etc he squandered his spare time in the pursuit of pleasure. I used mine to obtain wealth......now, I have as much spare time as I want, I'm the boss!!!!!! not for everybody and most people Un motivated by money generally will rip me to pieces and come out with the "well it shouldn't be like that things should be cheaper" but in reality if you have money, everything is cheap. so going back to why it's an injustice. people spoilt by their families and miss informed by schools wonder why the £1200 a month isn't going anywhere. You've been conditioned to believe being happy is paramount. it is.......but at the cost of money!! and seeing as everyone in this hobby seems to moan about the cost........... why don't you swap some x box time, hobby time, chilling time, to obtaining more money to make your hobby cheap??? its this simple in its most utterly basic form bottom of the scale silly (but tested!! I've done it) 1 ton of aluminium, how many pop cans are in the bushes and bins, will return once weighed in £130 give or take 20/30 quid. if you spent 4hrs a week collecting cans rapid and with a smile on your face, you would return realistically in your pocket £200-400 in a month. That's external of your earnings, that's for free for you, free money. for those that will say Yeah but you can't Yeah but we shouldn't have to and yeah what about inland revenue and trespassing etc are purely procrastinating to poo poo the idea because money......Doesn't motivate you. you want to work 8hrs a day and expect all companies and products to make sure you can have what you want when you want and leave you with plenty of money left to play with. life's not like that. my dad always said happiness is for your spare time, a job is for life. your not supposed to enjoy work, Your supposed to enjoy your spare time. it's sad to see so many people miserable in thier spare time because of a lack of money to supplement interests. dead easy.... make more money.
also you mentioned that casts cost a lot of money. around 3-5k per new steel mould. yet you say £20 is a lot of money. but the reason things are expensive for no apparent reason, is, well you've got the answer in your hand. You've bought it. I'm s business man, I increase the prices of my services in my business yearly, it's only when people stop using me I know my ceiling height on how much I can charge has been met. if I were games workshop I'd charge more!! because regardless of the moaning everyone keeps buying the products. it's a business not a charity. it's a business not a hobby to the owners. until people stop buying products the prices will keep rising. but the little man the man with a few spare pounds a month isn't a concern, when people more affluent are spending as much as they are. I'm thinking of returning to the hobby from the rogue trader days. I actually thought it was expensive back in the 90's. because I only had a Saturday job......again money being relative. looking at it now, for £1000 investment I'll be able to get what I want and be happy. that's not a lot of money. I did motocross, that's 6-7-8k a year I did Thai boxing for year's! I was there every day training, sometimes twice a day. at £7 per class, plus diet supplements, traveling to fight opponents in the UK or abroad that was probably knocking on 10-15k a year cost is relative. if you are say......a project manager for a construction company you'd earn over 40k. if you lived in a small one bed flat you'd have 1500 a month spare to play with. it's all about aiming high earning high things then get cheap.
The underlying reason that GW can charge so much for WH40K products is that the company has a monopoly on "official" WH40K products. In a free market, competition puts downward pressure on prices, but "officially" GW has no competition in the production of WH40K products. They won't sell their e-books on the Amazon like everyone else, which means that they can charge more for e-books than print books - the opposite of the situation for all other books. (BTW, have you noticed that GW has started selling "limited edition" novels for $70, bundled with "never to be printed again" short stories?) Paints are a different situation. You can paint their overpriced models with any paints that you want, but GW and other hobby companies take advantage of the fact that most people don't know how much paint "really" costs. (Hint: the containers that hobby paints come in cost about as much as their contents.) You can get better paint at a better price by using Golden's fluid and high-flow acrylics or Liquitex soft-body paints.
Sell off all that GW rubbish and get into historical wargaming instead. Just as much fun, get a chance to learn a bit of the (real) history behind the force you're building, and a tiny fraction of the cost involved! Eighty Six quid for that - for a book and seven figures..? With all due respect mate, you need your head looked at!
GW prices have always been exorbitant. Back years ago my dad and I would walk past the GW store by us and be fascinated with all the models in the window and we'd go in look at the ridiculous prices and walk right back out. Basically GW lost 2 people buying at the very least 2 full armies because they charge so much. Now my dad and granddad have done modelling their entire lives and by comparison GW prices are ludicrous.
The sad part of this hobby is that when I started playing (back when it was rogue trader) GW used to encourage people to scratch built all but a few things. Beanies were $20 for 30 marines. GW built rhinos and predators and that was it. It's come a long way as to what they make. In the beginning GW was forced to use tin instead of lead, the models did cost more but not much. Then they switched to plastic assuring us that the models would be better and cheaper. The models got better over time but they went up because the "molds cost them more." Recently one of GW's CEO bragged that a box of 5 miniatures cost them 3 cents to make in China. So yea.... That hasn't stopped me from buying some items but it's more for the modeling since I haven't played since 3rd ed. Makes me mad though because you can't buy single models when you just need 1 more guy for your conversion. When I played back in the day you could get models in blister packs so you could do a lot more specialization/customization. To be honest I wonder why I still play around with the models but, at this time I have a "war room" with a 4x9 table and 2 shelves of minies and under the table even more. Now to be fair only half of that is mine, the rest is my brothers. I feel bad for getting my brother into this "hobby " between the both of us we have spent an ungodly amount of money. 😡
To be perfectly honest, I completely agree that Game Workshop prices are utterly ridiculous, but if you take your time over a box of minis and really enjoy them, I can see the point in spending the money. However, if you search around and find cheaper prices in other shops, online etc. then you can feel a lot better about being part of the hobby.
Very good questions. I definitely agree that price has skyrocketed of GW models and also, do you Really get the details worth in comparison to resin kits that are popping up more so frequently? If you ask me do definitely think GW nowadays aim more towards keeping already established buyers with existing armies then recruiting new players (collectors). That is what I believe is the reason to why prices has gone up because the majority or the players today have the income to pay for the products apart from that GW sales has gone down. The obvious reaction to this dis to increase price. Maybe I'm misinformed but that's my opinion.
I used to work for a GW retail store. The story told to me was that the guys who made Warhammer were people interested in playing miniature wargames, but those were mainly historicals, and played by clubs or groups that they could not join. So, they went and made their own game, obviously based on Tolkien or D&D. Many years ago that was. Now they are becoming the elite. Poor or average kids cannot afford to play these games. The local GW store is in a very well-to-do suburb. GW will tell you its expensive to produce quality miniatures, blah blah bullshit. I bought a great model of Battleship Yamato, shipped from freaking Japan, large as a battlefleet gothic battleship, for 6 dollars shipping included. Reaper miniatures sells metal minis of great quality for a fraction of GW prices. Greed will someday kill GW.
They produce plastic miniatures and with the recent advances in 3d modeling, GW no longer has a huge edge when it comes to the quality of it's miniatures. There was a time when they could lean on their high production values in comparison to other companies but those days have passed. Things have changed.
Games Workshop has made it evident, in print, that their games are "grown up games for grown adults". That's why their rules are so stringent about only using nicely painted models, owning the exact models of the units one wants to use, discouraging broken or kitbashed models, etc.
labor costs are also measured in production time and downtime, spread over how much you produce. Plus Marines aren't their only product, you have to analyze the other lines to get an idea of the whole system because when a run is done, the worker services the machine, or changes positions so that a different product could be made.
Good video Sup3rSaiy3n. A couple of years ago a friend and I calculated using catalogues of 1993 that equivalent products were more expensive but in line with inflation, more or less. Then 2011. Regional pricing, NZ prices 20-35% more expensive for no reason overnight. It's continued in that vein.
I see exactly where you're coming from, and it's pretty reassuring to see an increasing number of people feeling this way too. I can never remember a time when GW's miniatures were particularly reasonable by way of price, and I can appreciate that the quality of their miniatures is quite a lot higher than the majority, but at the same time I do wonder whether they're deliberately trying to alienate casual collectors by ramping the prices up to the lofty heights only achievable by the landed gentry.
+andspiders Completely agree with your train of thought. I'm not sure if they are deliberately trying to alienate casuals but it sure does give the impression. The entry cost may be too high for newcomers and veterans or collectors can only put up with their prices for so long before they move on to something else to collect. I also think collectors get kicked in the teeth by all of their limited editions or limited runs. They have an incredible back story for their models and make some truly fantastic miniatures but sometimes their business model works against their existing customer base. I do feel they are appealing to fewer and fewer people as time goes on.
What was that? 18 pounds for a single model? If my conversion is right, when I started playing, I used to be able to buy an entire SM sqaud for that much. On the sort of bright side, this high cost of entry does make it a bit of an elite hobby, which goes directly against previous criticism that too many uninterested players were getting into the hobby. This does sort of vet the quality of players, since only the most serious or.most wealthy can play. I'm not sure if that's really a good thing or not, but it is something to recognize.
11-12 years ago, I'd go in and get 20 Night Goblins for $40... I wanted to get back into it, and I went in to see that there's no more pewter miniatures and the price has almost tripled. $100 for 5 Vampire Count horse men?! And they're plastic?! No wonder why both shops in the big malls shut down and they got banished to the low income area of town....
Thankful for spending 120 bucks just for rule books. Like i did not even bought a damn model. Sometimes i regret my choice to have started. But thanks to 9th edition my money is wasted. Thank u life
its still for us...I remember how slow my first army was built...blister by blister and box by box...I rarely made "large" purchases...I do think its harder for those of us who have played since rouge trader... I remember paying $25 dollars for the first land raider kit and my friends couldn't believe I spent that much...blisters were $3 bucks a pop and I remember a two pack of rhinos was $11 dollars or there abouts. comparing now and then the price seems to be a humongous jump. but the quality is way better, the community is much wider and involved...so to answer your question its for me :)...one often neglected thing is that the resale value of miniatures, are extremely higher than that of other hobbies...outside of super rare collections...lol, you can safely assume that if you had to sell even run down mini's that you could get 30 to 50% of their current cash value.
I think, the hobby is for everyone who enjois it. For example: My first GW buy was the High Elf army box, it was about 90€. Alone the joy of unpacking, put them together and paint them are really worth the money. For the Box, in all, i needed say 3 days, 72 hours, for put them together and paint them ( just basic painting). Now divide 90€ through 72 hours and you get 1,25€ per hour. If i, for example, go watch a movie in cinema, i pay 10€for a 1,5 hours movie which makes 6,66€ per hour, 4 times than my army box. and i didnt even count in snacks. On Top of that, i didnt even count in the time of playing with my minis, and i played a ton of games. so the cost per hour is almost to 5 cents, if even. And nobody is gonna take that minis away from you, you can have fun for the rest of your life with them if you like to, or can sell them if you want, and you dont loose very much money, opposite, you can make money if you are a good painter (im not). So, what i try to say is that Warhammer is a expensive hobby no doubt, but on the long hand it is worth its money.
Wow. Just now im realising how lucky i am to be in poland and have a store called veto with -28% off of everything related to gw. And its not the kind of rising the prices and then lowering them oh no my friend a glottkin here costs about 240 zlotychs (around 60 pounds) while ive heard that in america they go for 110 bucks!
I went into my local GW shop at the weekend after a substantial break from gaming and couldn't believe how much things had increased by But I think it comes down to the old saying u can't put a price on happiness I have done so much computing and consoling it starts to grind and just sitting back and painting your favourite army is bliss
I don't understand why anyone stuck with Games Workshop for this long. They've been all about ripping off and suing their own customers for years now; maybe more than a decade.
Commandcombat I remember the hobby in 2005, actually when I worked for them. I used to get 50% discount in store, part-time hours, more than one employee in the store and could purchase metal models based on their weight. I feel it has specifically come to a head within the past year though. I have a video out next week that covers the reasons on why I'm taking a break from the hobby (I'll still be making videos).
Commandcombat Two reasons: peers how play it as well, and investment. If you already have an army and extend it a bit every now and then it's still cheaper than starting from scratch with something else. And a significant part of your player community would need to switch, too.
funny enough i was asking the same question myself. i have followed and enjoyed the warhammer fantasy and 40k universe for over 12 years about now and indeed the question popped up aswel. every year a new rulebook comes out "new edition rules" twice a year a new codex and like all year round new units to get. paint and brushes and all other tools required are expensive for that it realy is. i enjoy warhammer because its quite an unique in dept tabletop game but in all these years i had to stop playing because its insanely expensive. not to mention that tanks can be like £100 a pop for a simple land raider redeemer variation. everytime i check the units there are more and more comming out with minor variations (the whole baneblade spinnoff is a good example) Baneblade, Stormsword, Banehammer, Doomhammer, stormlord, shadowsword, banesword, hellhammer. these are i shit ya not £85 a piece. i think this is a hobby for those who have to much income for their own good.
I can shed some light. I'm now much older but between the ages of around 12-16 I was heavily Into painting GW figures. I never played the game but I bought a lot of lead figures and became very good at painting them, which I enjoyed Immensely. They were originally all metal and I remember when they Introduced the plastics with the Space marines and Titans etc. Plastic Is extremely cheap to use as a material and also lighter so Its cheaper to transport. I used to spend most of my money on figures, paints etc. Even back then they were not dirt cheap but It was possible to buy most Items no problem. These modern figures are plastic and the prices are frankly disgusting. The prices appear to have Increased at vastly Inflated rate over the years. If I was In my early teens again I would not be able to afford this as a hobby!
My hobby is now for Dropzone Commander. With those 90 quids ($150 us), you should have purchased the Shaltari or PHR starter plus a commander or the rulebook. If you are in the british lands is more easy to get like 10-20% discount.
