Who Says F1 Innovation's Dead? - MP354 

You did the Racing Point tech review last year

A video on F1 software would be fantastic Marc!

Tracing Point.

Even if the Mercedes toe in control doesn't make a really big difference; it'll mess with the other teams' minds.

This is what I absolutely love about F1. The "surprises" we get from engineers thinking outside of the box are just the best... Especially when we, as viewers, can actually see what's going on (Merc's toe adjustment, the F-Duct, Brawn's double-diffuser).

The most frustrating thing about innovation. The F.I.A. For me, one of the greatest draws to the sport is the innovation and Technology.

As Marc (spelling corrected) stated, innovation and creative thinking has always occurred in F1. In the late '80s, Honda was working on a quick shift gearbox in parallel with McLaren who was developing their own gearbox with the aid of an electronics wizard from TAG-Heuer to momentarily cut or reduce engine power to enable ultra quick upshifts. After extensive testing, sometimes with Ayrton Senna behind the wheel, McLaren eventually settled on their own gearbox, after some modifications, to put down power from the Honda engine. This probably helped pave the way for today's seamless-shift gearboxes currently in use by all the teams.

Agreed. When you look at the top-down views of these new cars, it's amazing how much of an F1 car is empty space. The weird thing is, what's left void is actually part of the car, because at speed, that empty space fills up with all manner of invisible vortices that help guide the car forward. Apparently, it takes all three states of matter to go racing.

A video on the brilliance of software within F1 would be very cool! It’s such a hidden part of it all, and while not all lines of code would be equally interesting, I’m sure there’s loads of interesting stuff there! Keep it up

Innovation is what separates F1 from the rest and what makes it a true encompassing team sport. I really hope you can get someone available for the software episode because like you said, it's more about what you don't see that makes a big difference. Great content as always, Marc!

I think we love all those little and big innovations too. It's always great to hear from someone who's actually been there.

Engineering innovation in F1 is truly amazing. I just wish we could see more of it. So much is hidden from the public and the other teams!! It would be so great if say after a year all the cars parts are laid bare for us to see.

Great talk at the end of the video

Talking about software, back in the day Ferrari had launch control and used the pickup coil in the tarmac to determine the launch. The coil in the tarmac is there to detect a jump start and is turned off when the lights go out, that was the cue for the launch control.

Best F1 analysis on the net. Hands down. No competition. Luv this channel. Thanks Elvis

It's so great to see someone who is as excited about F1 and F1 innovation as I am. I've been talking to my mates in exactly the same excited way all this week about all the new things I've seen from the 2020 cars 🥳🙊🥳

We really do appreciate you taking the time to do all these videos! Such a great insight into how lots of innovations are going around and how its not ONLY Mercedes. I got to say biggest issue I think F1 had was the toxic coverage covering F1 but now F1TV are doing an amazing job with Buxton and content like yours on RU-vid makes the sport so much better! If you ever come to Turkey for a talk hope you announce it before hand :)

The enthusiasm of this was brilliant. Thank you for sharing as always

Marc - I've been around watching F1 since the days of James Hunt. The one thing I miss is seeing drawings or pictures of the engine. When I was a teenager I spent hours assembling very detailed Tamiya plastic models of F1 cars. Doing this further educated me in what was what with engine ancillaries. Today's fans only see aero details - I think they are being denied access to an aspect that could further broaden the appeal of F1. Whilst I realise that, due to secrecy, you could not show pictures of the latest power units, would it be possible to create a feature video on power units from just a few years ago?

Stethoscope - Mind blown. That is absolute genius I had never heard of before and right up there with the F-Duct. As you say, it's the little outside-the-box thinking that keeps me buzzing about F1. Sensational insights again Marc.

everyone forgets crazy stuff like the Double DRS, merc would stall the front wing as well using the rear DRS.... FRIC suspension, blown diffusers, the Lotus one would exhaust in the leading edge of the sidepod! The double diffusers, so much.... in 2005 Renault figured out the frequency to the lights for starting the race and connected it to their launch control.... Benetton figured out traction control using the pressure in the airbox..... Mclaren had 2 brake pedals in 99.... etc, all i can think off atm

THANK YOU MAN.KEEP UP THE GOOD WORK WE WISH U THE BEST

Love the F ducked better though. Subtle stuff.... But you can't hide a few things on a F1 car, and 2 of these things are the steering system and the front wheels. But you are correct there's more to the car than a couple of degrees of toe out.. Love your show BTW...

Last week i figured out that i can wear fingerless gloves on top of my smartphone gloves. I'm expecting a call from Mercedes any day now.

Not necessarily a technical innovation, but one of my favourite stories was from your book where the team got all the mechanics to stand around the back of the car, in effect to block the view of a "new" development, when it was actually a new front wing. Brilliant thinking nonetheless!

Love your Work, Marc. Always look forward to your video's. Best f1 channel on RU-vid.

Thanks Mark. As far as passion for motorsports is concerned yours is infectious.

Thanks, Marc! You're killing it these days. Really looking forward to your insights throughout the upcoming season! 👍

That stethoscope on the fuel rig trick is brilliant! I've only recently started watching your channel, and I am certainly enjoying it. Maybe this is something you already do or have done previously, but your story about the fuel rig got me thinking: as someone who has been "on the inside" of Formula 1, maybe you could bring us more of these stories about tricks, secrets, bending the rules, etc? I love hearing about these things from people who have been in the game and involved in things that get shown on TV all around the world for thousands of people to see, yet we as viewers have no clue as to what is really going on. I find it fascinating. Your story about the fuel rig reminded me of a video I saw which was mostly about Nascar and American Sports Car racing team bosses and engineers pretty much confessing to some of the cheating and underhand tactics they would use. This is what gave me the idea, hopefully, you have seen that video and know what I am talking about. Anyway, I've gone on long enough, thanks for the great videos Marc, cheers.

We are going to need a technical run down on the daily driver there too! Just found you, super excited to have commentary from someone who has experience and knowledge of the industry! Bring it on!

The innovation in F1, in all its forms, is such a big reason I love the series so much more than any spec series. I understand the desire for the new spending caps and generally support them, but I hope the innovation remains. Teams may still have periods of domination like Mercedes and Red Bull before them, but if we loose the innovation we loose F1. Thanks Elvis, love the videos.

Hi Marc, I don't know if you will read this comment, but it is worth a shot. I think it's amazing how much innovation that you don't see is being done in F1, but I think it's a real pity so little is made public (for obvious reasons) and you have to puzzle it together with info from your videos and series like Drive to Survive.

8:57 Exactly how many coffees did you have at this point? 🤪 Another interesting video, Marc

What next mate ? Magnetic strips in the Tyres that attract metallic foundations below the track 🤔

I think you are right. A lot of innovations are not visible for the general public. Mercedes showed a video on how the battery for the hybrid system was improved. First a rather bulky battery it turned in to a lot smaller one with more power. Finally it was a very small unit with even more energy in it. The FIA even restricted the teams from making them even smaller. We never saw that on TV. I was amazed. I really enjoy the after race presentation by Mercedes where strategy is explained. You get to see a part of the engineers and analysts doing their work during practice, qualification. Long gone are the days where wife’s and girlfriends kept time on clipboards with stopwatches.

@askelvis!! On DAS - What of wheel banging during race? Thinking of the Max tap on Leclerc in Austria but there are many other examples. Mercedes gets caught up in the crowd and a sudden unexpected wheel bang alters toe-in and rips the steering wheel out of the drivers hands? Shades of Senna?

Something else you can see from reviewing the generations of F1 cars and the individual innovations, is that all designers copy from others. It’s a common practice across all motor sports and It’s why the grid looks the way it does.

Another great video. I love your passion it resonates why I love F1. The combination of innovation on a technical front and driver skill to create the ultimate winning combination. Keep up the great work.

thanks its exciting to see all those brilliant innovation. Road cars would not be so good today if there was no F1.

Can’t wait to buy my own DAS system from amazon!

Excited to hear some software insights in the future!

I spent a few minutes trying to figure out how you mirrored the video before realizing you're just driving on the wrong side of the road...

Trouble is that the FIA seems to have banned 90% of innovations. Skirts, double chassis, double diffusers, f duct, mass dampers Perhaps if the rules insisted on some sort of technology sharing at the end of a season then we might still have some of these clever ideas in F1.

It’s such a pity that most of these innovations remain hidden for us. I would like to see less regulations but the obligation for teams to publish their innovations 13 months after their first use. This will give us the viewers the opportunity to admire and enjoy all the innovations and it will accelerate innovation within F1 because teams will be able to build upon the work of others. The 13 month delay will still give the teams a l1.5 Season advantage over other teams.

Thnx Marc! Amazing content!

Just a note on racing point: 3d scanning equipment has been around of a couple of years now and there is no doubt that it is used in F1 pit lane and is likely how racing point derived their car. You may want to go to a supplier of hobby/3d printing grade equipment at do some content related to this.

As far as I know, the idea of changing the car throughout the lap has been in F1 for a long time. But these ideas were often banned when discovered.

If you bring back DAS in 2021 it’s the same as bringing back say active suspension, obviously a good idea in terms of being at the innovative edge, but I think the idea of the FIA is more about limiting crazy expensive innovation wars... however successful that can be... As for insider videos.... do a video explaining the oil consumption limitations explain what they did with exhausts blowing the rear end aero and more of these things.... the normal F1 completely misses out on providing in depth technical background information, which I find really sad.

Marc where do you see RU-vid taking you? I really love this channel and all your content but all good things come to an end eventually, I just hope you continue to expand the channel for a few years yet. Random comment I know...

Very intriguing video, speaking about the advantage of the DAS system

Innovation we can't see may as well be dead. It's as good as not there. I suppose we see the results of it but we may not know why. I long for the days of the F duct and double diffuser. I believe rules are meant to be worked around not cheated and that an established set of rules should last for the year. You've already built the car a certain way with certain expectations built on a certain set of rules. They're written down for a reason so they don't change. Unless it's for safety. That's always the exception. We need to see Innovation to keep us interested.

Thank you Mark. Another great and informative video. Loved the very last thing you revealed. Which team did you work for when you were in F1?

If you are going to copy a competitors car, even by virtue of just taking lots of photos, you would choose one that is competitive and preferably with the same engine as your own car. Wouldn't have made sense for Racing Point to copy a Sauber because not only is the Sauber car slower, but it would make packaging the power plant in much harder. Make a body the same as a Mercedes and the chances are that once you shoe horn the power train in, you have something pretty much identical to the Mercedes internally as well as externally.

Marc another great vid you do a fantastic job, hearing about what you guys did to the fuel rig thats awesome innovation, but this new thing is just going to far again, dont get me wrong fantastic bit of innovation the engineering in this is amazing, but as a fan I want to see the drivers have to drive a car setup for a track not a car that can adapt corner to corner

What do you think about the FIA banning DAS after the end of this season? It feels like every time we get some visible innovation it ends up getting banned

Another great video Mark. Really glad you keep doing these!

Yes! Software video! That would be such a good topic😁

Surely the DAS is part of the car and in some ways the same as using DRS. After all that by design is adjusting the aero profile of the car when used.

On the whole DAS 'Parc fermé' thing. The 'setup' argument is arbitary really. They can adjust brake bias, balance, engine modes, tyre pressures and temperatures, steering angles, suspension angles, damper settings - why not toe-in? If they follow this route to its conclusion, we would have KARTS - with nothing adjustable - no suspension - nothing.

Your videos makes me want to join F1 R&D even more.

Isn't switching the engine mode aswell changing the setup? I dont see the problem there.

Hey Marc, thinking about DAS and how it's banned from 2021 controlled by steering wheel. Do you think it would be practical and within regulations to implement such a system controlled by the gas pedal. Basically neutralizing toe at full throttle and increasing toe they more you lift from throttle? Would also argue its even more natural for drivers and gains bigger benefits then only used on this long straights.

If I remember correctly S-duct was first seen on ferrari in 2007 in Catalonya GP

Will it not give a quicker straight line speed and instead of outlawing it they could incorporate it within the DRS zones 🤔 and I always loved the bonkers 70s attempts at downforce using stuff like a fan to suck the car down and trying 6 wheels with 4 wheel steering

The innovating racing series looks to shift to prototype racing with the Aston Martin Valkyrie and a new Gordon Murray sports car. They're trying to get to F-1 speeds with sports cars!

I would love to see some insight in the software development in F1

#AskElvis Could you explain the allocation for winter testing? I was initially under the impression that teams can use how many ever they wanted, but was surprised to hear teams talking about running out of tyres. Couldn't find anything on the internet about it. Thanks for the great videos!

Damn they are the best team

Loved it ! More of these ☺️

In relation to not being able to use DAS in qualifying, could they set it before hand and just run less toe without changing it during qualifying?

What's you favorite time of the day? Idk, whenever Marc Priestley uploads a video.

Great channel & great content as always, but unfortunately the audio quality is lacking (again). There are some good quality clip on mic's which filter out unwanted noises etc... maybe it would be good to invest in one of those. I do follow other youtubers and the audio on your channel could be much better. This is the only point of constructive criticism I have though, so keep up the good work.

MP: If it blows my mind, (and I've been involved in the sport for 20 years), I am sure its gonna blow your mind. Loved this line (because its true)!! :D :D

Hi Mark, what do you think of mercs rear lower wishbone setup on the W11? Perhaps more innovation?

HOW ABOUT RACING ? Do we want a technical show and put the racing aspect behind that ? If a balance is not achieve I predict the end of F1.

@MarcPriestley: i was thinking that this DAS system must have downsides. I assume the centre of gravity suffers from (heavy) moving parts on/in the top of the nose of the car. That would mean more understeer is think. What do you think?

Tbh, with software, any decent programmer would keep it simple. In fact they (used to?) have an acronym: KISS. Keep It Simple, Stupid! The more complicated (not complex) software gets, the harder it is to find the inevitable bugs :) Great video and thanks for your perspective - and stories - on innovation!

#askelvis do you think Ross Brawn’s efforts to shut down these “loopholes” from 2021 could potentially hurt more than help? I’ve thought the coolest solution with the cost cap would be to strictly enforce it and let the engineers go wild. What if one team wanted a straight 6 engine to narrow the back of the car or even a modern version of the original 4 cyl monsters? Racing is a visual and to some extent aural sport... software is neither and aero is only somewhat visual. The closest hundreds of millions of us will get to f1 is watching it on tv, and this DAS intrigue shows how much passion there can be if only we can show why it’s the pinnacle of motorsport and engineering.

Nice video of Marc Priestley's face......

According to a Reddit post the toe angle does not need to be specified for Parc Ferme so DAS wouldn't break it but I have no idea if that's accurate

I wanna see six wheels, rotary engines, crazy innovations not a slightly different nose if you really zoom in on it

Do you have to wash the dogs everytime they run into the lake and then roll in the dirt?

My first idea was that Merecedes changes brake balance during braking when changing the position of the wheel. It turned out to be something different. Would it be allowed to do my idea, so to use your steering wheel position the modulate the brake balance during braking? And do you think this would make sense to do and it would improve breaking? My idea would be that the slower the car gets, the more you want brake balance at towards the rear...so when you slow down while breaking, you could slightly adapt brake balance towards the rear.

I know Mercedes cleared it with the FIA already but what I was wondering is if they were trying to keep it secret and it got out or if they’re obliged to tell the other teams?

Hey Marc, thank you for always giving us these great explanations on how the (new) cars work. But I was just wondering. How do you keep your knowledge up to date, without actually working in F1? How hard is it to stay informed? Anyhow, keep up to good work! :) #AskElvis

Does the DAS system lock, or can a driver accidentally pull the wheel and have zero toe angle on a very short straight, which I’d imagine would drastically affect steering ability?

Hey Marc , enjoying your insight and content , just wanted to know , have you tried anymore to have a meeting with Kimi and do a video with him , I swear you were ready to do it last year or 2018 , not sure correctly but you were having contact with Mark Arnall , Kimi’s trainer , Do you think this can be possible this year , somehow , it would be nice , hopefully you read this and give me an asnwer hopefully , Have a great weekend 😄

It would be interesting if Force India buys the DAS system; i'm surprised they haven't already!

The dogs are entertaining.

What years were you at Mclaren? You've probably answered this in previous videos.

I'd love to see the software video!

Great job as always mark.. Q. @9:00 Are you innovating with double diffuser eyebrows? Got a wolverine thing going on dude..jokes

#askelvis Has the FIA banning Mercedes DAS system for 2021 made it unlikely that other teams will try to make their own version even if it is declared legal for 2020 as it can be seen as a waste of development resources?

DAS control of rake angle to act as an air break?

I think the issue is that today the regulations limit too much the speed with which the teams can test and introduce innovations. If memory serves in 1998 McLaren put 3s over everyone else in one single lap, but it didn't end up like 2014. If Renault and Ferrari were able to improve their engines like in the past, they'll catch up or maybe surpasse Mercedes in 2014 rather than suffering the artificial domination of Mercedes (Damn Nico, you ruined F1 for us).

I love the innovation! Marc I have a question for you, do you think the teams and F1 could do more to involve fans? I feel like they are so far behind compared to other sports.

Who first discovered the merc steering trick?

OCD triggered on the seatbelt twist.

#askelvis How much toe out would be the max since there's no reason to minimize it for the straights?

Racing Point is very similar to Mercedes so no urgency there 😄