My favorite part with Sora’s inclusion is how Disney was actually OK with it but Nomura was like “OK, but what about the lore? This is gonna complicate things”
Dude, If they start to imply that now smash ultimate is part of the lore we'll never be able to understand that lore again (do the trophies have heart? Is cloud trophy another entity with its own identity or some kind of artificial sentient thing? Etc)
@@somerandomguy9891 According to Smash's own Lore, the characters are Figurines (Trophies - blame localization for that, they didn't want to suggest Smash players were nerds) and aren't the real characters from the actual games - they also have an innate drive to fight regardless of the character they're based on doesn't really have the attitude for it - and they are brought to life by the imagination of the player, represented by the Master Hand. Take that with a grain of salt though, while that was the explanation given by Sakurai during his Subspace Emissary blog post, the real reason is the investors and higher ups don't like the idea of the characters in certain franchises being unnaturally aggressive (COUGH MARIO COUGH) or crossing over without reason, so Sakurai and Iwata use that as their excuse.
@@KahunaLagoona By this Point and with the movie coming up, looks like Mario will be shown fighting DK in SSB style. I Always consider SSB cannon in a Meta sense, doesn't affect the series where the characters belong but It Affects Smash...sometimes elements of Smash became cannon in the characters home series.
I still find the story behind Sora's inclusion so funny. They thought it impossible to get him despite being the winner of the ballot, and yet, a random lucky encounter got him in anyway. It's surprising the unexpected things that can happen and the great results they bare.
I think also interesting that people always speculated that Disney would be difficult to negotiate with, but it seems like they were basically 100% on board with Sora in Smash.
It's pretty funny how Sora got included considering how his entire series originated from a chance encounter between a Square Enix producer and a Disney executive.
And this is the reason why I would honestly say Sora must be the luckiest character in all of fiction. Given the story of his creation was from a chance encounter. To then getting into Smash from a chance encounter. It feels like something or someone wanted to Sora and Kingdom Hearts to exist. And it keeps watching over the series to this day. Just a weird observation.
A recurring thing in Smash is we never really got a character that represented the newest console because production began soon after the console released. We didn’t have a 64 character on 64, a GameCube character in Melee, or a Wii character in Brawl. 3DS was an exception because Sakurai didn’t start until he finished Kid Icarus Uprising, but the closest to a Wii U character was Alph as a costume. I’m glad that Ultimate got to show off three of the Switch’s new games.
smash 4 dlc also got bayonetta and corrin but I'm not gonna act like inkling and Isabelle weren't more definitive Wii U and 3DS characters. generally I think ultimate is solid at repping the switch also with stuff like botw link and the stage for odyssey (although the lack of stages for other switch or even Wii U games is a bit of a bummer) I wonder who we'll say is a missing switch rep after the console is all said and done.
@@audoodle9963 outside of the newest Pokemon rep, the newest Fire Emblem rep and the newest Xenoblade rep. I think the the only switch character missing is the Ring Fit Protagonist
@@gamji19 yeah I was looking through the best selling switch games and ring fit was my main choice. honestly no brand new character is as iconic to the switch as inkling was to the Wii U. as one of the 6 arms fans I'm hoping to see some more new IPs from Nintendo soon.
@@audoodle9963 I’ve also noticed Zelda characters was pretty much an exception because they’re legacy characters and the Moveset needs little change (Melee and Wii U didn’t have their Links, but that was more because a new mainline game wasn’t on each console at that point)
Yeah it’s cool we got Switch Characters but I would’ve chosen Ring Fit Adventure, Astral Chain, or a Gen 8 Pokémon Rep (Cinderace) over Fire Emblem again, did 3 Houses even sell well on it’s own before the Smash Clout it got?
Fun fact is that Disney was actually largely okay with Sora being in. It was actually Nomura who was against it, because he was worried how an inclusion to Smash would affect the story. Disney were actually the ones who told Nomura that he should do it and would be a great opportunity. Of course Disney still had their restrictions, but Nomura was the one who largely needed to be convinced.
I think that Nomura was overthinking things, there are a lot of characters in Smash with their own series lore and no one (creator, company, producer, etc.) behind any of those characters was even concerned about such thing as "affecting" their lore. I think that Nomura just gave that stupid answer as a way to make KH look more important (and don't get me wrong, I don't hate KH, in fact I like it and I'm a huge fan of the series).
I would also mention about Sora's inclusion that Disney was actually okay with Sora being in smash, but Nomura was more concerned about Sora's inclusion to smash because of the Kingdom Hearts lore. At least he found a way around it to not make things complicated.
People always say that, and yet Sakurai says Sora only happened because of a chance meeting with a Disney executive at an award show. So I dunno how much goes into which "truth"
@@DarkAura19it’s probably both tbh. The chance meeting was probably how Sakurai got the ball rolling, but since Nomura himself directly said he was the one that was on the fence about it, it probably ran into some roadbumps along the way
@@PaRappa_the_Rapper I can buy that. I moreso am talking about people who insist on going "SEE SEE DISNEY WASNT THE ISSUE" when like... yes, it was to an extent, lol
Banjo literally was my dream character realized, and he’s been my main since he released. He is my favorite character in smash, bar none, and it’s so nice to find out he got second on the ballot as well! I find the reasons behind Kazuya’s inclusion and Sora’s chance meeting incredibly interesting as well!
Tbh I'm convinced Steve was supposed to be a base game inclusion that just kept getting pushed back further and further Like, every other smash game with 3rd party characters has had two unique additions in the base game, expect ultimate which only had Simon (Richter doesn't count he's an echo)
@@Helios2737 I think most the 3rd party had to go DLC because companies probably wanted the cut of the $$$ but Steve was definitely intended for earlier release but development got in the way. This probably helped open the door to getting Banjo and when Banjo was announced.
Which makes sense, because not only do you have to balance how he interacts with each character, but then you have to consider how he interacts with each stage too, which makes things a thousand times harder.
It's pretty obvious how these characters were all chosen. You have the big IPs you'll want to have in your game about celebrating the entire industry (Persona, Dragon Quest, Minecraft, Final Fantasy, Tekken, Kingdom Hearts), a fan favorite since the Melee days (Banjo-Kazooie) and obviously your own IPs (Fire Emblem, ARMS, Xenoblade). Terry always seemed like Sakurai's personal pick since he's not as well known as other characters from this list, but well, the entire reason we have Smash in the first place is because of SNK's games so it was very satisfying to see it come full circle. Also Sakurai stated that ARMS and Xenoblade 2 were to have their characters in the base game but they were ultimately scrapped. I think it's nice that they finally got their chance even if you have to pay for them. Also Joker being the first fighter pass character was such an unexpected move and that's probably what they had in mind; to give people a nice surprise and get them to buy the FP.
If Ultimate had anothe ryear of dev time, you think at least Pyra and Mythra would've been able to make the base game, since Sakurai at least considered a character from XC2?
@@Vulpas he deserved the spot, but the franchise is not that well represented. Not to mention that the character is unbalanced af and that doesnt really help lol
@@doodoo2065Here are Steve's weaknesses. His down tilt and up smash leave Steve stuck until the animation is finished, making him open to a punish from the sides. While many of his core moves (such as his sword and axe moves) are very spammable, they only cover a very short distance and do not cover below or behind him, leaving Steve without a useful "get-off-me" option against combo-centric opponents, excluding using iron to summon an anvil or building a block to stall his fall, which are only effective with enough iron and within the stage's build limit, respectively. Additionally, the spammability of his moves are held back by Steve's low mobility, making it unwieldy for him to attempt rushdown tactics. His grab's range is offset by its very high ending lag, making his grab game less effective against mobile fighters, and his down throw is significantly less damaging and effective without iron. Steve's Minecraft-inspired playstyle can also leave him in troublesome situations. If he mines more materials than his inventory can fit, he will end up discarding resources that might have otherwise been valuable. This negatively affects Create Block, as it always prioritizes the weakest block first; weak blocks can be broken very easily by hitting them with attacks or hitting the bottom side of the block, making them less effective for edgeguarding or creating a blockade. Additionally, walling off a recovering opponent may not be an effective option, as damaging hitboxes can easily plow through weaker blocks without much trouble, and hitting Steve (or placing them near the build limit) will cause his blocks to break significantly faster. His tools can break if used up enough, forcing him to mine to collect materials and craft to re-upgrade them. Furthermore, getting KO'd results in Steve's tools reverting to wood (though he keeps resources already in his inventory), and mining for materials/crafting new tools can be difficult against faster opponents, who can constantly pressure Steve and deter him from gaining resources. His reliance on materials for the majority of his strongest techniques prevents him from repeatedly using them to a greater extent, due to the glaring downsides of running out of a specific material (ex. his down air and down throw accomplishing nothing with a lack of iron). Careless use of his resources will essentially leave him with almost no useful abilities: the time needed to mine can become very detrimental when fully depleted of resources, or when barehanded/using wooden or stone tools, as it takes a significant amount of time to fully replenish resources or dig for gold/diamond. His lack of a conventional projectile and short attacking range demands he gets in close to dish out damage, upon which fighters more suited for close combat than Steve can leave him constantly juggled. Steve's recovery, while having amazing horizontal and vertical reach, is also limited in some ways due to his low jump height and airspeed. Elytra takes some experience to get used to, as its mechanics can make it difficult to angle, and it can also be cut short if he bumps into an object. Minecart can be used for horizontal distance, though it does not grant good distance without gold, and cannot be used without iron.
I really believe the theory that Sephiroth was added to Smash as DLC just so Cloud could be in the base game for one main reason, besides Street Fighter and Castlevania, no other third party series has more than one rep, even then, Street Fighter and Castlevania’s reps are just echoes, think about how many people wanted a second Sonic rep, but it never happened because Sakurai was more interested in adding new third party reps from Sega rather then just adding to the Sonic series, I feel the same would’ve gone for Square Enix, but Square wanted Sephiroth as DLC so they could promote the FF7 remake, while this could be seen as greedy for locking up all of the good FF7 content behind a paywall, I’m at least happy we got a very cool character out of it
In my opinion I think the reason why Sephiroth got in the game is to make up for the lack of FINAL FANTASY 7 content had when Cloud was in the game because he only came with 2 songs
I more think it was just the simplest to renew the contract they had from Smash Wii U/3DS. Sephiroth probably also influenced that decision too, as including him would mean one-upping the lack of content with Cloud, which made them more inclined to just keep things simple over renegotiating everything putting Cloud in the base roster for Ultimate.
@@SamuelJohnsonYT Remember Smash is a Fighting game, so that means that the best characters that transfer well in Smash are characters from fighting games like Terry and Kazuya. Thanks to Dissidia, Sephiroth qualifies.
Sora’s inclusion story is hugely ironic considering how Kingdom Hearts as a franchise started. Literally a square exec and a Disney exec happened to be on the same elevator when the square guy pitched the idea to the Disney guy, and it went from there. So for sakurai to have essentially done the same to get sora is perfect
I believe Sakurai once mentioned that if Sora wasn’t in the fighters pass, either Kazuya or Steve would have been the last edition. But the fact that Sora was so requested meant he was the best character to release last
Sora was my second most wanted but Kazuya's my first, and frankly if Kazuya was the last then I would not need another character after him ever and would be happy
My two favourite Smash DLC were Cloud in 4 and Terry in Ultimate Cloud's reveal was just fire. I remember lying down on my bed watching the last quick montage of games before that and then immediately popping out of it when I heard those first notes of "Opening: Bombing Mission". He went on to become my main for 4 and half of Ult. While his reveal was unfortunately leaked out a day beforehand and the trailer was only half finished, Terry was my dream pick for the longest time. He was my first main in an SNK series and I had cosplayed as him in numerous occasions, including at EVO 2018. I had even thought about what his moveset would be and was pretty close to the mark (I didn't know if they would add Crack Shoot or Power Dunk and was pleasantly surprised that they added both). Thus, he became my main for the latter half of Ult.
I used to play KOF and Metal Slug at a local laundromat, so my hype skyrocketed when Terry was chosen for dlc. Plus I’m glad Fatal Fury’s finally making a comeback.
Nice video! It's really funny how Kingdom Hearts began as a chance encounter between a Square Enix and Disney exec, and Sora's inclusion in Smash began as a chance encounter between Sakura and a Disney exec...
"She was the one fans wanted in Smash, Rex was just the tagalong." Anyone else genuinely, truly want Rex in Smash _not_ as a tagalong, or was it really just me rooting for him? :(
You're not alone. I genuinely wanted him too. Still do, as a matter of fact. I get that Pyra and Mythra are more popular, but to say that people asking for Rex and Pyra in Smash really only wanted Pyra in Smash just feels wrong. I'm sure there were some who were only in it for her, but I feel like the majority that were asking for both legitimately wanted both.
Yeah, same. I'm happy we got a Xenoblade 2 fighter at all, but I actually wanted Rex as a fighter, not as some "tagalong" alongside Pyra. He's my favorite of the Xenoblade main protagonists, him getting passed over while constantly getting dissed like this really stings...
It’s ashamed Chadasorous Rex was just too powerful for the hardware limitations. Definitely hoping for the trio to be a fighter next time. It just doesn’t feel the same especially since all of XC2 was them saying they can’t do much without each other
That was just the recovery and even then that's moreso due to Sakurai's lack of imagination and deeper understanding of the Tekken series and also to be fair Kazuya was easier to make a moveset for + is more appealing anyways so eh
13:52 - I could* subscribe to this theory, if Sephiroth had come out in the first Fighters Pass, but he didn't. The Second Fighters Pass was not planned during the development of the base game, as indicated by Sakurai's lament over not being able to add Xenoblade 2 or Arms content in the roster. Notice how the same didn't happen with Byleth, because they already knew going into it that they were going to be added, as opposed to Spring-Man and Rex.
I imagined that the technical issue was having not only Rex and Pyra, but also Mythra being included all in one, no? The three are all highly detailed and Pyra and Mythra are tied together. Not sure if it was a Rex and Pyra issue since I think Sakurai would have been able to pulled off the duo rather than the trio.
Yeah I think that was the issue. Also another issue was having 8 of that trio on at once. The switch is just too weak. Hopefully if they port over ultimate, they will be able to do that. It would be super unique since they share the same life forces and also it would tie in closer to the actual xenoblade combat compared to just spamming as the whole idea behind XC2 was teamwork and that those 3 are much stronger together than without (both in battle and mentally)
Are you guys going to do a video for the characters/fighters that were considered for Ultimate in the base game or DLC because I would like to see that video because we have the videos on that topic for the other games in the series
Of the DLC packs, Pyra/Mythra was my favorite pick thanks because they realized an itch I was hoping for "I hope we get more echo fighters/clones added as DLC" Considering the two share most of the same moveset with small tweaks here and there, it was a great surprise since I felt most of the differences in echoes in base game were rather lackluster, so this plus the return of a swappable tag team was neat
I think the reason Steve is DLC is quite obvious, Money But no doubt the negotiations and development could have taken their time to finish in time too
Well not only that, but Nintendo was kind of obsessed with the game. Nintendo of Japan's RU-vid page during the Wii U era when Minecraft Switch came out was littered with Minecraft videos. So for Minecraft, there was a major interest on Nintendo's end to get Steve in there through one way or another. I would argue that Steve's situation was more Nintendo approached Microsoft for Steve than the other way around.
Funny thing is that Terry got good reception in Latin America (or at least in Mexico), because SNK arcades were popular at the time on some LatAm countries (I'm Venezuelan, but never got the chance to see or play a Fatal Fury or KoF arcade)
It's the sakurai way of pissing off the fans. Mostly the waluigi fans annoyed sakurai so much that waluigi got turned into an assist trophy in favor of piranha plant and the anime sword fighter complaint decided that they put byeth as the next dlc character so he could meme about that it's another ordinary FE sword character but byleth is a weapons master capable of using different weapons despite the main weapon looks like a sword, the snake sword works more like a whip so in short annoying sakurai won't get what you want.
I don't think any of the Gen 8 Starters would've made good DLC choices anyway. Rillaboom is a drummer that makes plants grow, he might be best stationary. Cinderace is a Football Player, that's kind of limited aside from kicking a fireball around. And Inteleon is a sniper secret agent, which would work fine if Greninja wasn't already the sneaky guy as is. Another factor might just be Creatures/GameFreak - they helped with the base game in suggesting a new Pokemon, but probably didn't care or bothered with DLC.
Also forgot to mention that I don't recall there being any explicit mention of Banjo being the second most voted character in the Ballot. Just that he was trailing behind Sora and was one of the most voted characters, but not *second* specifically
I also had a theory about why Steve got into smash because Sakurai added Minecraft in the game to make more money for Sora to get in because of Disney, even the fact that Minecraft is the biggest video game of all time
The DLC Pass of Ultimate has proven that Sakurai wanted to bring characters to each fanbase. Japan got the Hero, Westerns got Banjo-Kazooie, Latinamerica (especially Mexico) got Terry (here the Fighting Games is a big Cultural fact), Kids got Steve and EVERYONE got Sora. Everyone got what they wanted and it's Amazing. I got my girl Min Min, so I'm done for this generation.
Anyone who doesn’t understand why certain characters are in smash is mostly just refusing to acknowledge the love and history the characters that got in have.
Pyra and Mythra aren't Iconic like some of the characters that are in smash bros they are only liked because they are good looking and they simp for them
@@SkylightCiel I wouldn't say Xenoblade Chronicles 2 is a good RPG though the gameplay and story is kinda eh in my opinion and the voice acting is kinda bad
@@SkylightCielit's probably only popular because they have good looking female characters that people simp over them Xenoblade Chronicles 2 is not as good as FINAL FANTASY 7 and it's a way better RPG then Xenoblade Chronicles 2 imo
Curious how you'll handle cut characters from Ultimate seeing as we don't really know a lot (yet). Although there are definitely a few considered characters worth talking about like Alucard and Heihachi(again).
Doubt Tales had a shot as the second Bamco rep since Tekken is just that massive, arguably Bamco's biggest IP too, as well as having a much larger impact to gaming than Tales has, as Tekken is somewhat one of the progenitors of 3D fighting games as well as one of the only active ones in that subgenre As for why Kazuya, outside of being the poster boy and having an easier moveset to work for than Jin, Jin is also most likely harder to work with as he lacks Devil elements in his base moveset, while adding Devil Jin would not be as simple since they have completely different movesets and do not transform to one another mid-moveset in the original series. *Of course, Tekken 8 could change that, and perhaps Jin will join Kazuya in Smash very soon*
It's more of a matter of "who" from Tales gets in. People know Lloyd because of his Gamecube release, but Yuri in particular is banned from official polls because he's too popular. Tales IS big, but not as big as DQ or Monster Hunter. But if I were to pick another Namco rep I'd pick Tales, Soulcalibur, or another Tekken rep. Again, it's a matter of who.
It's true, SNK didn't have a presence in Smash, character wise, that is. Fatal Fury/King of Fighter has mechanics that Smash Bros borrows from. Different plains of terrain, roll, spotdodge, rage, super moves, short hops, the concept of crossovers and ring outs.
If Corrin wasn’t in the game, people wouldn’t be as mad with Byleth’s inclusion I believe . More just indifferent. That said Sonic deserved more characters honestly.
It's probably tinfoil theory, but part of me thinks that Heihachi was blacklisted as a playable fighter by Nintendo themselves due to his appearance in Playstation All Stars Battle Royale, kind of strange that Dante was also passed over, but as I said, tinfoil theory at best.
These fighters also needed to come from a franchise that had games on Nintendo. That's the most important thing Also Heihachi deserved to Join but Kazuya finally getting love is good (hope he joins in the next game)
Kinda doubt Heihachi's gonna be added sadly as not only am I uncertain as to whether Sakurai, or whoever the next director is, could figure out his recovery (though imo Hell Axle is perfect for that, plus they can give Heihachi a wall jump since Tekken characters, except Noctis, Akuma and Eliza, could wall jump), as well as Heihachi potentially not being in T8 + the uncertainty with his VA (like whether or not they're keeping his Tekken Bloodline VA or that's a one time thing). That and Heat System might give Jin a bit of an edge since he'd probs be much easier to work with with all that
@@Lexicon865 they already replaced Heihachi Seiyuu twice so it's not problem. They could very well reuse his lines like they did with Banjo, Sora and Sonic And for recovery... Use Kuma as a nod to Tag Team
@@StarWritterSW No Kuma would not make sense at all, none of their tag moves can be used as recovery. Hell Axle exists which is perfect for his recovery
I'm not about to complain about the final roster of who we got in this game, but two of the few grievances I have with this game are that my most wanted fighter was Ryu Hayabusa, and I'm bummed that the only Adventure Mode we have is World of Light as opposed to something that's shorter and more arcade-like. I know a lot of people would have really enjoyed something like Smash Run but with wifi (maybe sub spirits for Smash 4's customization somehow, unless you could have that customization again specifically for that mode), or at least something akin to Melee's Adventure Mode: short, sweet, and fully of fun and cheeky references! That said, I primarily play Quickplay, Tournament, and Battle Arenas and I'm a Snake/Terry/Kazuya main, so I wound up eating pretty good with what we got anyway, lol.
Shorter and arcade-like? That's what Classic and All-Star Modes are for. Adventure Mode in Melee is *not* that short nor arcade-like. As such, we got World of Light as the Adventure Mode. I suppose you want something of more middling length like Melee's Adventure Mode, but you can't expect them to give you that in addition to the short and long game modes. Most of us prefer the long story-based Adventure Modes of Subspace Emissary and World of Light over Melee's half-baked Adventure Mode
@@Compucles Perhaps I incorrectly stated what I meant when I said more arcade-like. Technically, you're right with what you said, given that Classic and All-Star play out more like a traditional arcade fighter a la Street Fighter, Fatal Fury, etc. My issue with that when it comes to Classic and All-Star being your only options for a short yet substantial single-player experience (outside of Spirit Board, but that can be included in what I'm saying here) is that they are, for the most part, JUST fighting. I don't even know if I can make proper sense of what I'm saying here because no matter how I put it in text form, it's going to sound like I don't like those modes when I love them and view them as staples. I've put tons of time into getting different Classic endings with different characters, and I appreciate that the paths change depending on who you play as, and I've also done a few rounds of All-Star. My main issue is that I wish they would have at least just a little bit more between fights than they do. Classic doesn't even have any variation of Break the Targets anymore, so that Race to the Finish-esque escape sequence is really the only thing they have to space out the fights. Adventure Mode in Melee has lots of things that you do between more than just a couple of the big fights, and that helps change things up. Even when you're going from fight to fight in Melee, the themes of each fight still help to give them a bit more flavor for the most part, sometimes helping them feel a bit more like more tame Event Matches. I felt that it was more arcade-like not in the sense of being like an arcade fighter, but the action felt a bit more on-railsz and like it was taking you through setpieces in a style similar to Time Crisis or House of the Dead. It's hard to explain and probably makes no sense, but that's just what I feel. I acknowledge that we wouldn't reasonably be able to have something like that alongside everything else in Ultimate, but that's why I said Smash Run would also have been a great thing to bring back. They could have done that instead. I still think Ultimate is the best Smash hands-down, but if it just had something just a little bit extra in that regard, I think I would have made for a near-perfect game, imo.
I don't know why people wanted Lloyd in the game. The only thing that Tales of Symphonia has going for it is that it's a game that exists on a Nintendo console... That's it! Same with Geno, the only reason fans started asking for Geno was because people who wanted Square Enix representation in Smash thought that Cloud was impossible, but by the time he actually got in, the snowball was already too big! Not Ridley kind of big, but still pretty big!
Tales of Symphonia is a great game from a that series that deserves more attention and for the record if the Smash Team *had* to include "another anime RPG sword character" Lloyd or a "Tales" character would be a solid choice for Smash
@@Antonio-is2cn - If that's true then how come he's only ever brought up when it comes to the Smash roster? If he truly deserved* to be there, his game would be a referent of the genre, like Final Fantasy VII, Sonic 1 and Super Mario 64. People would be making videos about how great it was, but that doesn't happen, that's never happened, because Tales of Symphonia it's, again, just a game that happened to come out for the Gamecube. If literally the same game had come out for the PS2 instead, no one would care.
@@julianx2rl People are asking for characters like Dante or Master Chief, who aren't nintendo either. The question of why do people want 'x' means jack squat for Ultimate when chars like Steve can get in. Lloyd is a classic jrpg protag so people want him in. Same goes for Isaac from Golden Sun. Anybody at this point is an open season request for smash.
@@julianx2rl Technically speaking it DID come out on PS2 later on. But part of the point of the hype for Tales of Symphonia was that Nintendo basically helped get the game out there in the first place, hence the GameCube icon in one of the dungeons (That was taken out after every re-release.) and for most people, that's the game that got them into the series. Ironically enough, Microsoft did the same thing for Tales of Vesperia, it was an Xbox 360 exclusive at first, then Bandai Namco made a PS3 version with more features. Tales IS a great series, although I'd argue that it wasn't really deserving of a playable character.
@@MH_Zard Look at Nintendo of Japan's RU-vid during the time when Minecraft Wii U edition was released and you know why Steve got in: Nintendo of Japan was obsessed with Minecraft, I have no doubt that a part of the reason why Steve took so much time was due to negotiations and trying to figure out how to implement his gameplay into Smash. As for Issac, it's clear why he isn't: Golden Sun's devs asked for people to beg for more Golden Sun games but it didn't happen. So years later Golden Sun fans thought that getting Issac in Smash would bring back the franchise, yet Sakurai cared about franchises that were still new and were still relevant - while Smash was the reason Fire Emblem was brought to the West, if that interest never happened, it wasn't like Fire Emblem was a dead series at that point (that would come later, when Awakening was the 'last chance') so it wasn't like Marth and Roy being in Smash revived Fire Emblem, just drew interest from a series that wasn't outside Japan.
@@Vulpas Ah yes, the cartoon squirrel who appeared in one game 23 years ago and a single remake over 15 years ago, who's main appeal is grotesque violence, should be in Smash instead of arguably the most iconic video game of all time
@@vgggyu9vhji981 Don't try to present facts and logic to a Smash fan. They won't listen and prefer to cope with the fact that their beloved character didn't get in.
Monolith Soft is THE BEST partner Nintendo has solidified in the past decade, glad they gave a spot for Mythra into smash bros. Huge important character despite the ignorants thinking is a regular swordie anime char, they legit dont know how good Xenoblade series is.
this is what I meant by ignorance, one day you will understand@@SamuelJohnsonYT . Takahashi played a major role in the development of classic RPGs such as Chrono Trigger, Xenogears, and Final Fantasy VI, Despite XC2 being a masterpiece people who say who play it are probably underage to understand or even scratch the surface of JRPG. Was not worth answering back then but now I feel generous, hope you give yourself a chance to try takahashis stories one day. Good luck
just really thankful Min Min, Pyra, and Mythra made it in among all the major video game icons picked. i was one of those people just hoping for ARMS and XC2 fighters in Ultimate and was stunned during that last Smash Direct where Sakurai said those franchises were too new for when he finalized the roster. Byleth getting in ahead of them despite being in a game that launched much later was salt in the wound
@@sakutaro3musik486 it did! and then i bought 3 Houses thinking i need to finally give the fire emblem franchise a chance and really enjoyed it. so i'm cool with byleth now, just had a year of bitterness between the Nintendo 1st party reveals to deal with lmao
To be clear, Banjo-Kazooie was NOT owned by Nintendo. They have always been a Rare IP. Nintendo never had more than 49% of the company and thus, it was never a full Nintendo company. Still a 3rd Party.
The DLC fighters have been great for the most part, but there's one thing that perplexes me, and it's about Byleth. Sakurai said that the Fighters Pass 1 characters were decided before development started, but Three Houses was released around seven months after Ultimate. He later said the developers wanted a character from a game people would be playing right now, and people were playing Three Houses. So that means they must have assumed that Three Houses was going to be a hit. It makes me wonder what would happen if Three Houses bombed, the backlash to Byleth would've been even crazier.
Sakurai is a huge Fire emblem Fan and played an unfinished version months before the release. I think for him it really didn´t matter to much how well 3 houses do and he just told Nintendo that it would be a good idea and he was right in the end
@@sakutaro3musik486Nintendo chose the DLC characters, while Sakurai could object if they can't work in the game. Nintendo wanted Byleth in the game to promote Three Houses (very similar to how Corrin was added in Smash 4 to promote Fates), so Sakurai did as they said.
@@willycheez7218 I think Sakurai is about choosing characters that he thinks would transfer well in Smash. Rather than just pandering to fans requests.
@@sakutaro3musik486 I think Sakurai wants to put in a much RPG characters as possible. So it maybe the same reason as Pokemon, there's a lot of playable characters to work with.
I hope Grovyle gets a chance next time. Mystery Dungeon representation would be amazing. Pico from F-Zero would be nice too, imo a more interesting choice than Black Shadow or Samurai Goroh. F-Zero has aliens in it, give us an alien character.
I still don't get how Byleth made it in before Min Min and Pyra/Mythra. The absence of Arms and XC2 characters was addressed when fighter's pass 1 was announced and decided on, citing characters from those games to be "too new". However, Min Min and Pyra/Mythra pre-date Byleth by a good few years yet Byleth was already chosen? I know he said it was for the base roster, not the DLC roster, but fighter's pass 2 wasn't always a guarantee, and wasn't even announced until months later. There was actually a chance it could have all ended with FP1, and Arms and XC2 characters didn't get into Smash for being too new, despite a newer character getting in. Pretty glad it all worked out in the end.
@@willycheez7218 It literally completely contradicts exact words from Sakurai though. Just kind of wild to me that FE priority was THAT important to them.
Is Rayman even that popular compared to Ubisoft's other franchises any more? You'd make the argument that Ubisoft would probably negotiate an Assassin's Creed character or something - Probably more moveset potential too...
@@KahunaLagoona The problem with Rayman is that his games are in inconsistent.ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-C5Rr0bn6Dvk.html Even if we were to focus on Rayman Legends, Rayman wouldn't stand out compared to Caption Falcon in terms of forward momentum and speed.
I'm still over here wishing for Tails to be in the game in a future iteration. I know a lot of times, they like to build characters around similar models already in developed, like a human for easy cloning. I would imagine that Tails would be more intensive to program in versus another Fire Emblem character with a new weapon.
One such character that I hoped would be able to appear in "Super Smash Bros. Ultimate" is Sash Lilac from "Freedom Planet", since it has always been one of my favorite indie games ever since it was released on the Nintendo Wii U back in 2015, and I'm even able to imagine which Special Moves she'd be able to have including what her Final Smash would be. But, I then eventually realized that Lilac's inclusion in the game would probably not be possible due to the fact that absolutely no one even knows about the game except for me...
Nice to see the reasoning behind them all at least. Doesn't really change how I feel about both passes in general though. Since two of my least favorite game genres generally speaking are jrpgs and traditional fighters, I found myself really dropping off speculation and excitement after Sephiroth. And Pyra pretty much killed it. Banjo is the one I absolutely love, I have fun with Terry, and on occasion I play Steve and Sora but most of these picks I both dislike or don't care about, and don't find them fun to play.
Waluigi wasn't that popular back in the Smash 4 days. He only started getting really popular when Ultimate was revealed at E3 2018 and Daisy was made playable, while Waluigi stayed an Assist Trophy.
@@SonicTheCutehog I call bull. Waluigi has always been a popular pick, and was greatly desired during the Smash 4 days. Plenty had even pointed to some conspiracy idea that he was going to be in due to _a purple chair in the background of a video_ The issue with Waluigi is he doesn't have anything _tangible_ that only he can do - and unlike Daisy who also doesn't have a unique identity aside from her personality, Waluigi doesn't have a model that could work as an Echo Fighter for another character. He's too tall and lean to be Luigi or Wario's Echo Fighter.
@@KahunaLagoona Not nearly as much during Smash 4. The example you provided was from Ultimate and they should have already known he wasn't in the game since they revealed he was an Assist Trophy again during E3. They were just delusional and in denial.
@@SonicTheCutehog The whole Purple chair thing was during the video talking about features for the games, when Greninja was announced. Point still stands though, the Waluigi fanbase wanted him in since Smash 4, and they got their loudest with Ultimate's E3 trailer when it revealed he wasn't in.
As we’re just about every other Fire Emblem character. Sad that it reached a point where people rolled their eyes more often than not when a new Fire Emblem character was added
I'm *_still_* kind of upset here that Waluigi didn't make it into the _Super Mash Bros. Ultimate_ video game! Waluigi *_*NEEDS*_* to have either his own video game where he stars or is the main antagonist in, or is added to the next Wario video game as the "player 2" character (like Luigi is in most Super Mario video games). What is in that way, he would be an iconic enough character to be added to the next Super Smash Bros. video game as a playable character.
I'm good Waluigi has no buisness being apart of the mario cast, nor does Wario for that matter their one note antagonists who rarely show up anymore Waluigi less so.
I feel like this one will be the most controversial although overall both Fighter Passes had pretty good picks. I think there were just a couple of major Western fan favorites missing: Rayman, Crash-Bandicoot, Geno, Doomguy, Masterchief. I think having one of them may have calmed down the complaints from the West. Rayman made the most sense with all the content he got in 4 and 5. Odd he didn't make it.
While I don't know if complaints could ever stop in the West, I am still genuinely quite surprised Geno did not end up making it into Ultimate. I feel like this was the best chance he will ever get alongside all of the other huge fan requested characters they added.
@@subarashiineko1 Geno was one that was actually addressed and some of it had to do with Square Enix. SE apparently was surprised by Geno's popularity being an IP they no longer consider relevant and they were concern that if he made an appearance, there would be a push to create another Super Mario RPG game or game with Geno. I am thinking it is a dead franchise that won't be coming back... SE is always odd with the way they think IMO. Why give us two FF7 characters? Why not have the second FF character be from another FF title?
@@volbound1700That makes a lot of sense. It's an unfortunate situation for fans of the character that SE stills apparently owns him, or else I truly believe Sakurai would've gotten him in. As far as a second FF rep, I am personally very happy with Seph, but it would've been cool to see a character from another game in the series as there are several I could name off hand.
@@subarashiineko1 True but knowing Nintendo, he probably wouldn't be getting a lot of love either although I could see him getting a Smash spot by now. I think Sakurai is kind of a fan as well which is where the hype/speculation originated.
Crash bandicoot was an inactive franchise at the Time and he was barely voted for in the smash ballot that's probably why crash bandicoot didn't get in the game
Honestly, I’m in the minority to say this, but Min-Min shouldn’t have been a playable character, I get that she’s the Arms co-producer’s favorite character in the game, but it just feels disrespectful to be honest. Personally though, even though Spring-Man should’ve been the Arms rep, he was already an assist trophy in Ultimate, so it made more sense to have Ribbon Girl be the Arms rep. Edit: I watched a video from NearChris, and apparently the Dragon Quest characters in Smash Bros have names. The hero from 11 is Luminary, the hero from 3 is Erdrick, the hero from 4 is Solo, and (get this) the hero from 8 is litterly 8😂. I’m not making this up, I swear.
@@IcyDiamondthere’s boundless potential obvious ones like Shadow/metal sonic, birdo, Funky kong, dixie kong, dry bowser, Protoman etc. but more than that it’s just really surprising they introduced an idea with so much potential only to only make 5 of them and have all of them in base game. It’s just such a waste, the development time and resources have to be paltry in comparison to an independent fighter and they could charge 2-3 dollars per echo and no one would complain
Is it weird when I see Gengar as a possible Echo for Mewtwo? It's an actual floaty lightweight, can learn basically every move Mewtwo uses in Smash and all moves Mewtwo does with its tail Gangar would just do with its tounge like in Pokken (this would also remove the annoying hitbox that Mewtwo has).
This is Smash 6. Sakurai has been on record to say that Smash 3DS and Smash Wii U are Smash 4 and Smash 5 respectively, making Smash Ultimate Smash 6. This has even been said by Source Gaming a number of times - they even have a video on it.
One thing that I never understood is that why Activision was against Crash and Spyro being in other crossover games that aren't Skylanders? I mean Nintendo was perfectly okay with allowing Donkey Kong and Bowser being in Skylanders, yet Activision refuses Crash and Spyro to part in the biggest crossover fighting game of all time? It says something when both Disney AND Microsoft are far more willing to allow their characters to be DLC for Super Smash Bros Ultimate.
Nintendo was okay with Donkey Kong and Bowser, but Activision/Toys for Bob also asked for Peach, Fox, and Kirby. Peach was denied because she was too human, Fox was denied because they wanted to focus on Star Fox Zero at the time, and Kirby was denied because Kirby is owned 50/50 between Nintendo and HAL Labs. As for why Crash and Spyro were denied, was it said it was due to Activision? I'd argue that part of why they never made it to Smash was due to being Western franchises and not being as popular in Japan (despite one Crash commercial in Japan being a meme)
@@KahunaLagoona crash bandicoot was an inactive franchise at the Time and he was barely voted for in the smash ballot I think that's why he didn't get in the game
Being honest your Byleth reasoning is just wrong, Sakurai said that the DLC roster for the Fighter Pass 1 was decided months before Three Houses released Byleth was nothing more than a promo pick just like Corrin, popularity and fighting style had nothing to do with it
People WERE asking for Byleth though when Three Houses was revealed, and Sakurai wouldn't have added them if they were just a generic sword-wielder, much like how Corrin got added due to the dragon limbs thing which was what Sakurai said made them different from the bloating cast of Fire Emblem.
@@KahunaLagoona That is a shitty reasoning No one and i mean no one wanted Byleth the moment was announced outside of FE fans who wanted another one to fuck with Smash fans They are nothing more than a blatant promo pick
I wanted Cooking Mama to be in the game. Wish didn’t come true but I felt she checked off a lot of the “requirements” and “prerequisites” for a smash fighter. Nintendo staple, lots of games, moves can be taken from any game and implemented nicely, creative ultimate, costumes, etc. Someone said, I don’t know if Sakurai or someone else, that smash was never to “advertise” a character so sales of that game could flourish, or something. I think that’s bs. It’s doing just that with the way some of these DLC characters went
I don't really care about any of these characters except for Sephiroth I was hyped when he got in he is also the reason why I even got a Switch in the first place and he's the reason why I got into smash bros
Thank u.Looking smash content since Ultimate dlc ended.Before watching vid.Will update here(this space is for update not wont see what comes after the ")")if anything.
@@SamuelJohnsonYT Fair but I know Crash IS popular in Japan (apparently, Japanese fans have been voting for him for years) so he would’ve been a cool choice. Out of curiosity, who would you add?
@@SamuelJohnsonYT fair though I disagree that Crash would be a boring choice as he would have a cool move-set plus many iconic locales as stage possibilities
The Engaged FE Protagonist is coming to the next Smash and I am calling it now (be warned guys) if I am wrong I will like that I would be Also the Sora section is my favorite one of this video
The fan rules our pointless and flaws. Big massive most obvious hehachi being a mee costume did not mean tekken was completely off the table for having content configures being. An kazuya techinically was the main character of the first 2 teeken Jim became the main character in teeken 3 and up.
