I appreciate this; "You will not find Peace until you have removed the nails from the hands of God's Son, and taken the last thorn from His forehead. The Love of God surrounds His Son whom the god of crucifixion condems. Teach not that I died in vain. Teach rather that I did not die by demonstrating that I live in you." A Course in Miracles (T-11.V1.7) love this topic and conversation. Raised in a Christian Science home and I was taught this truth about Jesus. We did not speak about crucifixion only glory of the resurrection! No sacrifice involved. I am grateful 😇
One should ask themselves, am I willing to allow my own son or daughter be crucified and murdered, so my neighbor can be saved? Can we not hear the insanity of this teaching? What has happened is we have projected our own world beliefs into God-yet God is so far removed from the thinking of this world-that to our ego minds this is hard to imagine.
"immunity to attack".. what a simple explanation of the crucifiction! Thank you so much Robert & Emily, as a new student of the course I feel so grateful and indebted to both of you for your teachings!
Bless you for this message. The sacrificial death model turned me away from Jesus and the Course has brought me back to him. Words can express how grateful I am for this 🙏❤️
Exactly, me too. I had a hard time to forgive Christianity that because I was an Atheist for the first 4 Decades of my life until my NDE and then ACIM... I still wonder that so many people are buying this Doctrine even today. Although I can not imagine that there is a Father/Mother on the planet that would REALLY think that to torture their most loving Child for all the sins of their nasty ones would ever redeem the Lives of the spoiled ones for good - I mean which Parent would EVER consider this to be a sane & functional educational approach... ?🤔 So thanks for everyone really working sincerely through the challenging Lessons of ACIM in a still very dysfunctional Upside Down World....🤗
God does not enact violence and revenge. Those are acts of Ego and are purely human. Even as a young child in the 1950's --long before ACIM had been written down--I never understood why Jesus's death was considered payment for human sins. It mad no sense to me. Thank goodness my logic was correct even as a youngster.
It is not what God does to man; it is what man does to God. Man crucified Jesus. He chose not to have a special relationship with his tormentors. It is a great act and teaching of forgiveness. Forgive them, for they do not know what they do.
Sure is.... It's really unbelievable that over a billion Christians would ever buy the entirely psychopathic Doctrine of Jesus' supposedly atoning for our sins.... Actually pure blasphemy that is illustrating in this upside down projection of human Ego God as a complete psychopath... which has caused damage of immense magnitude to Humanity for thousands of years.... The greatest spiritual Betrayal in all of Human History that has stretched my capacity for forgiveness for decades to its utmost limits....
"The crucifixion doesn't symbolize what we need to do to get to God. It symbolizes what we're already doing to ourselves, and need to get out of" (Robert Perry) And I might add... beautifully stated!
Matthew 9:9-13 "I desire mercy not sacrifice" - Thank you for this podcast. I do wish you guys would scour the Gospels for more parallels, too. Thanks!
27:30 "Because God is so holy he has to hate sin...." One of the most destructive human Ego projections upon God.. One can observe that this is a completely dysfunctional conclusion... Because that very Hatred for the sins of the others will over time always distort one's own Consciousness closer & closer to that of the immoral sinful people one hates..... The real non self destructive reaction towards the sins of others should never be hate but either deepest emotional detachment or Forgiveness since everything else comes with a huge personal cost & damage... But despite of this one can everyday all over the globe simply observe that the vast majority of people is programmed to react in the self destructive Hate of the Ego almost no matter the cost of it.... And to project such toxic and self destructive Egotism upon God is not only the peak insanity but also destroys the last remaining spiritual remedy for a world lost in the darkness of Ego - now finally even God became a dysfunctional "holy" Egomaniac and the Ego can now feel safe, sanctified and on the highest "moral" ground in its cruelty and even pure Hate now finally equates to Holy "Love"... Billions of Lives have been ruined & destroyed by this cruel thought system that is rampaging through Humanity from the beginnings of Humanity to this very day hardly ever questioned.... And whole Theo"logies" have been build for millennia upon the very root core of all evil... With the peak political "wisdom" of Mutually Assured Destruction (MAD) as the thermonuclear Doctrine... Thanks God we have a flood of alcohol, drugs and psychopharmaceuticals to numb the omnipresent individual & collective pain, abuse & hurt in the global Absurdistan of Ego where only Suicide & Death hold the last hopeless Promise of possible Peace.... For God so loved the world that he dictated Helen A Course in Miracles....😋 Hallelujah....🙏.
PS: Jesus was crucified simply because Judaea's Roman Governor, Pontius Pilate, was anxious to keep the peace with Jesus's envious but influential Pharisees. 👺
I always thought , How could a Father do that to his son ? Then I thought that maybe Jesus didn’t feel any pain ? Because maybe he could heal himself on the cross. It never made sense to me. And The Bible written by men’s ego ?? God saved the Israelites , then they mocked God and build a golden calf ! Idk 🤷♀️ I know what I know FORSURE God is LOVE and if he is in all ? I believe !!!! Why would he send himself to a hell ?
You guys need to read Rene Girard. Sacrifice is the religious mode of Jesus' time that he overturned, not a mode he reinforces. Jesus' sacrifice and resurrection is what /ends/ the need for sacrifice.
You might also want to read Howard Thurman and MLK. Jesus sacrifice can also be understood as a willingness to live God's plan and have all suffering that results redeemed. This was Dr. King's activist theology.
We know almost nothing about the historical Jesus, except via the biased testimony of the New Testament and church dogma, and a few sketchy allusions from contemporary historians. As students of Schucman/Thetford ACIM from the 1960s, we should be cautious about imposing ideas about "Jesus" from current popular theology onto Helen's Jesus as he speaks to us in ACIM. I think it's safe to say that the Jesus of ancient Israel was executed, not for preaching love, but for challenging the corruption of the priesthood. Helen's modern Jesus dismisses any atoning value attributed to the historical crucifixion, and simply teaches, "God's Son is guiltless."
Jesusu knew his fate. He said he would be crucified. So he had no reason to react with rage when aggressed on the way to the cross. When we are aggressed we react with rage because we think the aggressor does not belong to our fate...
Why did Jesus and/or the Holy Spirit allow the misinterpretation or misrepresentation of his life, death and resurrection in the Bible? I understand we Project our supposed guilt, but wouldn't the real purpose be protected to stop that?
I don't think "the real" is hierarchical or corrective in that sense. Bear in mind that we are the Son of God, and there is no administrator or ultimate authority outside ourselves. So it all comes back to you, to your self-honesty, and to your willingness to "choose again".
If it makes sense to you that "forgiveness" must include somebody "paying" for a sin,, then please stay as far away from me as you can. YOU don't do that. When you forgive someone, you don't say "Okay, John. I forgive you when you get Mary over there to pay the money you stole from me." THAT is not forgiveness. That is a transaction. And tell me: How does a superior spirit being, immaterial, incorporeal, outside of time and space become INJURED by a human being? If it can, then it's not a god. MERCY is the waiver of the demand for justice via grace. It doesn't say "Okay, somebody has to pay for this."
