Why did this TENPOINT arrow break?

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Why did this arrow break? Too much power? I have my thoughts but I'm interested to hear your thoughts, as well.
I am not sponsored by anyone! But I do share what I like and what I don't like. And I like a good coupon code to save a few bucks as much as you do (see below). My "perfect" crossbow setup these days includes:
Killer Instinct SWAT X1 (starting 2023)
Burris Oracle X Scope (since 2022)
AJ's Custom Arrows, LLC (since 2024, Reaper FOC shafts, 8.35 GPI (40 Ton Carbon) with 110 grain inserts and Vanetec Swift 2.25" vanes on the SWAT X1 and Reaper 9.6 GPI shafts (24 Ton Carbon) with 110 grain inserts and Black Sky vanes on Bunjie, Jr.
Bunjie and I also recommend the following, 100% of time:
Burt Coyote Lumenoks (since 2012 or so) (save 10% on lumenok.com with coupon code BUNJIE )
Swhacker #251 3" cutting diameter crossbow broadheads (for our last 20 or 30 deer/hogs and woodchucks). Swhacker stopped production of the #251 in 2023 but never fear: the #243 is the same exact item, although a different color. You're good to use that one :)
Dragon Claw arrows from Wyvern Creations (good outfit, been buying different gear there for years, these arrows were great in the SWAT X1 throughout the 2023-4 Crossbow Seasons!)
A.J.'s Custom Arrows, LLC (since 2024, see below)
ajscustomarrows@gmail.com
(203) 528-8736
/ ajscustomarrows
Check out the Gear Page on our website, deathbybunjie.com. Again, I am not sponsored by anyone! But you can see what gear I like and don't like on that site. And if you buy from Amazon.com using one of those links, Death by Bunjie receives a small referral fee and you DO NOT pay more! How cool is that?
Bunjie (The Original Bunjie, The O.B.) is my 2010 Excalibur Axiom that got me hooked on crossbow hunting. This was my "one gun" for more than a decade and Bunjie's reliability is the reason I ONLY hunt with a crossbow. After killing dozens of deer, hogs, squirrels, woodchucks, and even a bear, Bunjie is now semi-retired, but still gets out every year and even killed two deer 2023--and a woodchuck at 81 yards!
Bunjie, Jr., is my daughter Genevieve's crossbow, an Excalibur Micro Suppressor 355. This crossbow was also a much appreciated gift from a Friend of Bunjie, and it changed Death by Bunjie forever by inspiring Genevieve to become a part of our story as a second-generation crossbow hunter, and it also convinced me there is a benefit to a newer, faster crossbow back in 2020 when I began the Quest for a Successor to Bunjie.
Enter Bunjie III (or Bunjie '21, Bunjie 3.0, The Slick Black Cadillac of Crossbows), a 2021 Scorpyd Deathstalker 420, the result of trying various models and looking at dozens of them online for characteristics I liked. It is, in fact, a gift from a Friend of Bunjie, which goes to show how important Friends of Bunjie are to this channel and what an impact they can have. Bunjie III is a testament to modern crossbows, producing over .7 slugs of momentum and almost 140 ft-lbs of kinetic energy with stock arrows--at around 400 fps! This crossbow helped expand the Kingdom fo Bunjie by introducing me to compound crossbows and showing me they're nothing to be feared, and also helped me get my first deer on public ground. This crossbow also inspired the "Rule of 400" that I talk about from time to time: a crossbow that can shoot a 400 grain arrow at 400 feet per second is the definition of a modern crossbow--producing over .7 slugs of momentum and over 140 foot pounds of kinetic energy, the envy of the archery world.
Again, I am not sponsored by these companies. I am sponsored by Friends of Bunjie! (I'm not asking for gifts whatsoever--please don't feel like you should send me stuff! But I do appreciate the support I've received over the years! I'm just trying to express my appreciation for that.)
Bunjie and I have written two books: The Death by Bunjie Crossbow Method ( amzn.to/3zJbAI0 ) and The Death by Bunjie Crossbow Story ( amzn.to/2Peq4aC ), both available on Amazon.com with those links.
Check out the Death by Bunjie podcast, Talking with Bunjie! It's available on deathbybunjie.com or on the podcast app of your choice.
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This channel is the result of combining my interest in filming and hunting...and music, too! The soundtrack for this channel is provided by my band, Yankee Militia. The albums "Live Free or Kill" and "Zombies Gotta Eat, Too!" are available on Amazon.com and elsewhere. A third album is in the works.
If you've read this far, then there is only one thing left to say:
All Hail Bunjie!
--Rich Wilson
Death by Bunjie

Опубликовано:

10 сен 2024

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Комментарии : 97

@lnlyhntr 27 дней назад

With all of the great info and research included in Bunjie's video's I am really surprised at the number of likes! Besides the aforementioned I am always impressed with Rich's presentation! I know that he's an Attorney and should be used to speaking in front of people but his presence in front of the camera is spot on! (And so is Genevieve's, especially for her age!) I hope that Rich doesn't mind me spouting off here for a minute but the truth is the truth! Thank you Rich for all of your work, though I realize that you are in it for the fun of it and just trying to share what you've found!

@Deathbybunjie 27 дней назад

Thank you for this!

@robertandrews33 27 дней назад

Could move the target further back to let the arrow slow down and stabilize some. Say to 10 or 15 yards behind crono

@robertwhite3752 26 дней назад

As always a great video produced by Death By Bunji. To me there’s more to take away from this than just the arrow breaking. I think we should all be very thankful that the shooter and no bystanders were severely injured. Let’s take away a very good safety lesson from this one guys, and especially from such close distances and angles. Safety was my first takeaway from the original video, and this follow up video Rich. Having said that I was thinking the same exact thing you said. The arrow broke because of simple physics, inertia. I have also entertained the possibility that this shot may have been too hasty? As in was the arrow fired without a tip being inserted, be it a field tip or a broadhead? I don’t have the capability to slow it down that much to see if that possibly could have been the culprit? But, either way I’m very glad that everyone walked away from this one without incident and I held my breath for more than a few seconds when it happened . God is good, all the time.

@CCMarsh-dd1vx 17 дней назад

Someone mentioned the proximity to the target being a factor. I agree, we know as an arrow travel downrange the kinetic energy dissipates. Shooting ~ 6 feet away unleashes the full kinetic energy on the target. I also agree that that the shaft angle could have been a factor but ONLY at this very close range.

@archery365 27 дней назад

I had a Vapor 10point which was rated at 460fps. It would break shafts just like you shown with a steep shot angle. At the time, I was shooting was one of those very blunt type field tips ( to keep the shaft from blowing through the bag target) and with that steep shot angle, that tip was more less making the shaft deflect just enough at that kind of speed to snap those shafts. I then tried a more tradition type field point that has a sharper tip and could shoot at the same steep angle without breaking them. Although the shot angle in the video seems much less then what I experienced.

@paulkircher9542 21 день назад

Carbon arrows should be flexed by hand before every shot. Bending one of these arrows to an inch of deflection or so will not damage the arrow unless the arrow has already sustained structural damage for whatever reason. Way better to discover damage or break it in your hands rather than having it come apart at the shot and going through your forearm, missing or worse wounding a target animal. Get in the habit and avoid some painful scenarios.

@danielmcallister9705 27 дней назад

I shot a bolt that was damaged bent my pulleys killer instinct replaced them both good customer service great inotive designs

@billgalante1181 27 дней назад

Great video, all hail Bungie.

@CCMarsh-dd1vx 17 дней назад

@roberthomiak5003 27 дней назад

All hail Bungie

@Ratt-ln3mk 27 дней назад

All in all thank goodness nobody got a serious injury, i personally don't care about having a faster c/bow happy with my wicked ridge rated at 360 fps ( factory) it drops deer and that's all that matters. People i know got faster c/bows last year and still can't hit the right side of a barn 😂.

@DeeDee-vu5mi 27 дней назад

IMO, At that speed I think the target was took close not allowing the arrow to stabilize like was said previuosly. or an unseen defect in the shaft when shooting that close and at that angle

@gregstephens8386 27 дней назад

I think that eventually they will get too fast I mean if slower crossbows get the job done with less issues then why go to higher speeds just my opinion

@georgekeith7969 27 дней назад

Them zombies usually pretty tough so I’d say may of had a defect or slight damage in the shaft. Kinda like a graphite fishing pole. One little nick and next time you set the hook (SNAP).

@blacksrfm 27 дней назад

With those high power crossbows, you have to inspect your arrow and flex it after every shot if it has just a hairline crack in it, it can make it explode with all the power it has

@richardgrant764 24 дня назад

My TRX 515 is shooting great with the arrows that came with it. But they are also supposed to be the finest arrows ten point makes. 445 grains

@roberthomiak5003 27 дней назад

I bought the boat back in the seventies 150 pounder I didn't get to shoot it much back then but last year I gave it to an Amish kid help me with my cows he was very appreciative of it Head Shoulders much younger than mine

@gregoryrekitt9375 27 дней назад

Hey Rich! I do believe that crossbows with speeds in the 450+ fps range are really exerting enough energy that they will need extra attention to details in bolts and other equipment used. While watching the video, I immediately thought the gentleman was standing too close to the target. When you take into consideration the distance and the angle, there was not enough time to even begin to stabilize the bolt in flight before it hit the target. I believe that is the main reason the bolt exploded. The bolt would have stood a better chance if it were at a level right angle to the target, but it is still not a good idea to stand so close to the target. It's kind of like shooting a 9mm pistol at a hard surface 10 ft away. I'm glad no one was injured!

@MichaelLakota-vc4tk 23 дня назад

Agreed 👍🏻 Zombies are my favorites as of today

@robertdurovka1346 27 дней назад

As speeds increase in crossbows,makes you wounder if it’s time for stiffer spines bolts, no different than shooting a heavy arrow with a big heavy Broadhead. Always went with a stiffer spine than I needed, so in my case arrow chart called for a 350 spine but I went with a 300 spine because I was shooting a 150 grain broadheads,95 grain insert with 100 grains behind the insert. Total arrow weight of 565 grns

@nicolaalberti7736 19 дней назад

If the haevier insert is longer than the standard insert, it actually "shortens" the shaft making the spine stiffer.

@Kurtdog63 27 дней назад

I suspect the arrow broke from the energy of the crossbow before it made it to the target and parts of the arrow actually slapped the target? I watched an arrow at 20 yards de-stabilize in flight right before it impacted the target and totally veer off to the side missing a 24 inch target. Have no idea what happened. The arrow was aluminum and other arrows with the same point weight, shaft, fletching, and nock flew perfectly fine. Upon inspection, the arrow shaft appeared to have a very slight ding in the shaft wall, but it actually spun fine without a wobble. Weird.

@jefftheetge7879 27 дней назад

With a chronograph speed of 421 fps., that arrow was either weighted very heavily or it was coming apart as it left the crossbow. My guess is the shaft was damaged before being shot. Speed from that crossbow should have been over 500 fps.

@Deathbybunjie 27 дней назад

This is a very heavy zombie that only shot 421 though

@davetaylor1102 26 дней назад

I’m the guy shooting that TRX515. The arrow broke because I was too close to the target. Hitting at an angle didn’t help anything. Watch some of Rich’s slo mo video to understand that these arrows are flexing back and forth as they leave the flight rail. Too much energy until stabilized. The arrow was simply overwhelmed and failed right at the point penetration stopped, essentially flush with the target. I have yet to damage another arrow since.

@davetaylor1102 26 дней назад

@@Deathbybunjie I still can’t figure out why it read so slow for that arrow. Currently I’m seeing 482-485 fps with a total arrow weight of 490 grains. The cocked ATA is relaxed somewhat from factory specs a bit(6 3/8” actual vs 6” spec).

@Deathbybunjie 26 дней назад

@@davetaylor1102 your next shot was around 421 or so too wasn't it?

@davetaylor1102 24 дня назад

@@Deathbybunjie Yes, I think it was. Something weird was going on there.

@jonathang8571 15 дней назад

I think that arrow broke as part of a publicity stunt so it could go virial and enjoy its fame on this channel. 😂 On serious note - I think your assessment is spot on. Be exciting to see over the future years how equipment adapts to handle these speeds.

@dannyrichardson732 27 дней назад

i agree

@Cloud4hundred20 27 дней назад

My bow and arrow set up is the bear x intense cd about 400 feet per second or very close to it with a crossbow bolt being the killer instinct hypr bolt with lighted nocks with 100 grain broadhead it’s at 415 grains total… the same set up I’ve used for a few years now and man this combo in my hands is deadly…

@Cloud4hundred20 27 дней назад

To me this is the perfect set up for me and my bow hunting the elusive white tailed deer.

@Cloud4hundred20 27 дней назад

I believe that arrow has probably been an older arrow shot how ever many times. So I’m saying just repeated stress over time may have been a weak spot in the arrow. Also that bow ain’t playing games at that speed. I always say one arrow = one deer I expect nothing more from my arrows. So if I get a second use from an arrow that’s a plus. But I try to keep my arrows I shot a lot separate from my good hunting arrows.. obviously I’m shooting those also to make sure it’s a good straight arrow but I try to keep the number of shots down some compared to my hunting arrows..

@Cloud4hundred20 27 дней назад

My buddy last year was shooting cheap Amazon arrows. Super cheap I would not even shoot them for practice as I don’t believe they shoot consistently.. but he broke almost every arrow over one season.

@dennisrobinson753 27 дней назад

I've thought a lot about the flat line 460 the only reason is so I can use a heavy arrow and stay at 400 fps or there about my 400 ibo bow dros to about 360ish if I add 100 grain bow is so much quite slowed down a little to me 330 to 360 is blazing fast, if the 460 would agree with 550 bolt and shoot real close to 400 that would be great at white tale distance less than 40 yards what could be the down side white tales can't stand that much speed and momentum all hail bunnies keep it coming

@wolfgangvonmueller6895 27 дней назад

The TenPoint 515 (and the new 440) is designed only to shoot TenPoint HPX arrows. The arrow nock has a special index that locks into the string and trigger box assembly and the arrow shafts are layered carbon designed for the application. You are guaranteed to blow up non HPX arrows and potentially damaging the bow. Lots of folks think you can use other arrows but you really cant and shouldn't. Play safe, don't run with scissors. All hail the OB.

@archery365 26 дней назад

Excellent point. Even a mm gap of the nock off the string with the force that bow generates could cause major issues.

@davetaylor1102 26 дней назад

Respectfully, I think you are conflating HPX arrows with HPX nocks. To say that you are guaranteed to have failures when not using the factory arrows is wrong and terribly misleading.

@wolfgangvonmueller6895 26 дней назад

I get your point but all the same thing. HPX nocks are intended for use in HPX arrows according to the manufacturer. And that broken shaft didn't look like it had an HPX nock so there was could have been a gap between string and nock. Can the HPX nocks fit other brands? Yes. But with a bow like this I'd stick with the manufacturers directions. Shoot what arrow you want but I wouldn't second guess the people who designed it and the manual states clearly in bolded type use of anything other than the HPX arrow voids the warranty.

@gierhedd75 26 дней назад

@davetaylor1102 Agreed. You can get the correct inserts ti run HPX nocks in other bolt - specifically the 400 grain carbon elites they used to get the 440fps rating advertised.

@frankfields2411 27 дней назад

I’m thinking too much power for standard bolts, based on Ravin making bolts specifically for their 500 series. I enjoy watching your videos and learning from your experiences. I’m considering hunting deer with a crossbow, and using the Swhacker 125 grain with 2 1/4 inch cut. I haven’t taken a deer in about 20 years, not that I haven’t had plenty of opportunity. I’ve been considering the Swat X1 , and wondering if you know about how many times you have shot yours since replacing the string.

@Deathbybunjie 27 дней назад

Video coming on that but string wear seems pretty good

@LSWH 27 дней назад

First Comment! Thanks For CAM! I’m excited for season starting Sep 7 here in Carolina.

@Deathbybunjie 27 дней назад

Good luck!

@chrisruzsa2798 27 дней назад

Agreed need heavy arrows no need for going 500 plus. It over complicated everything.

@BackyardBroadheads 27 дней назад

With the 515 it might be a good idea to only shoot 30 yards and out to go easier on the arrow and target and even the shooter if something bounces back

@justinditzler4168 27 дней назад

Totally off topic but love the asuka shirt.

@Deathbybunjie 27 дней назад

😆👍💯 you have good taste

@jimcarriekarker8399 27 дней назад

This would be a good question to present 10 point and see what they come back with. Only being a few feeet away your reasoning seems solid but has anyone heard of this happening to anyone else? Compare the arrow with the recommended arrow from TenPoint to see if there is a difference in specs.

@nathanmorkovsky2855 26 дней назад

Fast is maybe too fast but dead is always dead!!

@ShooterMcNut 27 дней назад

I wonder if a bag target would be better at dissipating energy. Of course you wouldn't be able to shoot broadheads.

@musthavefaith8142 27 дней назад

I believe xbows should have their own hunting season. It's just a matter of time before xbows are doing 600-700fps. That's getting up there, close to handgun speeds. With almost no skill involved, anyone can pick one up without practice and hit 3" groups at 30yrds.

@Deathbybunjie 27 дней назад

I'm okay with them having their own season as long as it's every bit as long as any other archery season and takes place at exactly the same time lol

@timsmith1698 27 дней назад

I think the target was kind of close to be stopped so quickly The arrow had not fully had time to recover and stabilize out. If the target was 10 yd further down range I think you probably would not have broke the arrow

@olehemlock 27 дней назад

Speed cost, period. The cost of lack of dependability. I am not going to mention any manufacturers. I have friends that have these compact high speed crossbows and they only can get 50 shots on a set of strings. Plus you have to be very selective on which mechanical broaheads to use. Stay 420fps or lower and you will have less problems.

@theamputeehunter2074 27 дней назад

I think with them crossbows shooting 500+ fps they should have at least a 500 grain arrow to be sold with them or maybe heavier that just my thoughts on it

@matthewwichtner2935 27 дней назад

Not completely sure. But speed had something to do with it. I have noticed, some of my bolts, do have a wobble, for lack of a better word, before they hit the target. I've noticed it more at night when I shoot, because of the light it knocks. Makes it more noticeable. Now I have upped my arrow weight like many. Compared to the original lighter bolts that came with the crossbow. I can still put a 150 grain field points, on the original bolts, and not get any wobble. Now I might have some practice bolts that are .003 straightness on the newer arrows, even though I switched, to the .001. not sure if that matters. I think I've jumped up 75 maybe a hundred Grains from the original bolts, possibly a tad more. Anyways, I do wonder if that has anything to do with it. And I find this very interesting. Doesn't happen every time, but I do notice it off and on. Which bothers me, cuz that could be the difference between a clean kill shot, and not. Wonder if anybody else has noticed the same type of thing???? Shooting 410/420. Not the fastest but not the slowest.

@carlpowers6040 27 дней назад

I agree with your explanation of the arrow failure. Sad to see as expensive as arrows can be. I’ve busted up arrows killing deer and moose, but that’s hunting. Keep up the good videos. Just over 6 weeks until Canadian hunt. When is the Maryland hunt this year?

@Deathbybunjie 27 дней назад

September, be here before you know it

@gierhedd75 26 дней назад

Sad is right. The HPX bolts are about 30 bucks apiece. I've already smoked 3 of them getting dialed in (totally my fault), btw)

@FDRGREG 27 дней назад

Is the failure repeatable? I know you don’t want to break a bunch of bolts but … Otherwise maybe that bolt had some sort of issue ( partial crack or split) that was hidden before the shot. The impact spot or angle on the target doesn’t look like a problem. I’m not sure what that was all about to be honest.

@philiplang5256 27 дней назад

Just curious where the field point ended up again? How heavy that bolt for it to shoot 421? Would multiple inserts not together properly,possibly create defective bolt in that situation. Inertia and angle/speed I think too. For new crossbow users that discharge a bolt into ground, beware of hardpan or frozen ground, same results and hard on bolts.

@Deathbybunjie 27 дней назад

All good points. The field point and part of the shaft was inside the Target and we got it out with a pair of pliers.

@boomerrangerron 27 дней назад

My guess is that it was shot too close to the target, especially with this amount of speed! As I recall, at one time Tenpoint used to advertise, Speed Thrills, Accuracy Kills! I guess this was before they got the speed bug!

@turtleman5111 27 дней назад

Yeah, perhaps. I bought a de-cocking arrow, shot it into nice soft grass, about 2 ft away? I heard something go hitting trees 30 yds away, and all I had left was the feather end of the bolt, about 10 ft away! After that, i bought the small de-cocking target.

@boomerrangerron 27 дней назад

@@turtleman5111 Yes, I'm fairly certain that there was simply too much speed shooting this close to the target! I have seen some strange things happen when the nock jumps the string, so I'm sure that wasn't the issue either! I've used a decocking arrow now for several seasons, but a regular field tip works from 20 yards just fine too.

@roberthomiak5003 27 дней назад

I had one of Ted Nugent's signature compound bows and I had to go up with a heavier shaft it was just Eastern arrows but with the normal Eastern Arrow would bend in flight so I got a heavier shaft

@andrewpierce2395 27 дней назад

did it have the correct alpha nock on the arrow or was it a half moon?

@Deathbybunjie 27 дней назад

Alpha I believe but good question

@andrewpierce2395 26 дней назад

@@Deathbybunjie I just watched again and missed where he was holding the broken end, it was the newest alpha nock ten point sells with the aluminum bushing so it definitely was not that.

@waynehumphrey8910 День назад

Spend $5000 on a crossbow but think it’s to much to pay the price for the arrows the company recommends that’s basically what it comes down to just bite the arrow and buy what the company wants

@drewwagner9584 27 дней назад

You may be on to something lad.

@donwilson350 27 дней назад

I think you had a defective Arrow if you watch that video Rick The Arrow coming out of there at 421 ft a second didn't break that Arrow he just had a bad Arrow

@littlewoody5539 27 дней назад

I’m thinking his arrow hit something hard in the target like an arrow insert with a broadhead that wasn’t glued in correctly . My brother lost insert and broadheads in my block target cause he bought some bolts off eBay .

@one-eyedarcher 27 дней назад

If there was anything in the target it came that way from big shot. That target was brand new/never shot before the gathering.

@charlesnorman1072 27 дней назад

What I feel is it's not the speed it self of the cross bow but with a faster cross bow or even compound it needs a heavier arrow weight the arrow or bolt was too light causing this at close range..now heavier arrow weight that wouldn't of happened. I feel but I could be wrong

@Deathbybunjie 27 дней назад

This was pretty heavy! Only shooting 421 out of a 515!

@charlesnorman1072 27 дней назад

@@Deathbybunjie ok could have just been a weak spot who knows

@Paulmgilbert1069Gilbert 27 дней назад

It looked to me that the arrow did not stop in the target st all it looked li,e it hit the very top of the target maybe more like a skip the top and broke look at a slower speed of you can like your vidioes

@Deathbybunjie 27 дней назад

I can see that but it did hit the target because we had to pull it out with pliers

@mr.skeptical3071 27 дней назад

U still shooting the swat x1?

@Deathbybunjie 27 дней назад

Yeppers

@michaelcurtis8114 27 дней назад

I believe the time will come when crossbows become too powerful. Speed sells and manufacturers know that. What I've noticed is that they keep upgrading the crossbows but not the arrows. And that's not very fitting in my opinion.

@ryand5313 27 дней назад

Looks like the arrow hit the top edge of the target

@ryand5313 27 дней назад

Take that back, it didn't

@gramps5157 27 дней назад

No, it hit in the bottom of that upper right egg shaped target.

@one-eyedarcher 27 дней назад

I think you are spot on Rich. That target being brand new and super tight could for sure caused the break IMO, especially at the angle.

@donfinley7502 27 дней назад

At 500 fps the speed is like a sub sonic firearm or air rifle. At this speed and beyond, arrow the arrow will need to be stiffer, maybe solid instead of hollow. It will perform and have range like firearm. Soon crossbows will be regulated like a firearm. Good bye crossbow season. "Too much is never enough ".

@Deathbybunjie 27 дней назад

The sky is not falling, don't worry

@danielmcallister9705 27 дней назад

Yeah damaged bolt