Why Do Audiophiles Fall for Placebo Effect? 

What this individual does not realize is that the “measuring folks” are the engineers who make equipment he listens to. Most audio engineers and musicians laugh at the degree audiophiles take things.

I literally experienced audio placebo firsthand when testing a $110 Qudelix 5k against a $1000 RME ADI-2 DAC with some planar headphones. I was swapping back and forth and got distracted. Thought I was listening to the ADI-2 but it was the Qudelix. I was like "wow maybe the ADI-2 is better" and then noticed I was still listening to the Q5k. Going back and forth I realized, there's no damn difference.

Gene you've always tried to give your viewers accurate information so they can make educated decisions. This guy is just picking on things he really doesn't understand. Keep up the good work.

As the famous physicist Richard Feynman once said "the first principle is to not fool yourself... and you are the easiest person to fool" After selling and servicing thousands of systems I can attest to this phenomenon, and yes, I have fooled myself into believing I heard differences! Now at 70+ years young and most of my hearing gone, any decent sound is welcomed, gone are the days of comparing cables and interconnects. I now read reviews comparing pain relievers and Medicare advantage plans... Cheers!

There's been some studies where doctors actually TELL the people this is a placebo pill, and yet they still get better or improve themselves. Crazy.

Excellent Gene, as always. There is a way to prove to believers that what they think they hear isn't real: A proper blind test. The problem is when you propose that to them, they come up with endless excuses why a blind test isn't valid.

During the pandemic, I still wanted to watch movies in a "theater" setting. Gene and the guys convinced me to not go "by ear" and actually measure. Use results followed by listening to see what you like. Their advice has given me the best experience. Knowing about how bass and reflections work and effect your sound, moving speakers around the room to fit YOUR ROOM, etc. Saved me a lot of money and time, and also made my room the envy of my neighbor buddy whom I will soon be helping with his room. He came over and was absolutely flabbergasted because he tunes his "by ear" and has roughly the same quality of components in his setup. Thanks guys. Also, seat shakers are a must for movies. Keeps the boomy-ness out of the subs but still gives that visceral feel. #protip

This channel truly is such a gem. Bravo!

Gene, you are one of the very few that I would thrust for advice! Great presentation!

Gene, this is absolutely a great topic and video. The point you made that really stood out for me was that speaker manufacturers really do use objective measurements. There is always some hard science involved in research and manufacturing. Using the ear alone to research and manufacturer would be a throwback to the early 40s and 50s kit era of high fidelity where results would be subjective, questionable and inconsistent. It's at the consumer end where subjectivity seems to be the rule rather than the exception these days. I really appreciate the fact that you periodically bring out similar topics to remind the consumer not to fall for any placebo effect, especially with cables. Audioholics is outstanding when it comes to using objective measurements to assess performance. At the same time, the measurements are balanced with subjective observations. I fell prey to the cable nonsense back in the mid-90s when my curiosity got the better of me. So I bought a Monster Cable Interlink 300 for one of my components and a pair of Monster Cable speakers. While I couldn't make an A/B comparison between my old cables and the then new Monster Cables, I quickly found that there was no apparent difference. From that day on, I vowed never to become a victim to anymore nonsense. I grew up on a steady diet of Audio Magazine, High Fidelity and Stereo Review (Sound & Vision's Predecessor). My own experience validated the objective approach of these publications. But I'm glad you took the torch and continue to present the truth to a new generation of audiophiles. By the way, you're not that old. I wish I was still 48.

Great video. I like how you explain how you feel and the science behind what you say/feel. It’s good to do a video discussion about peoples comment. It shows a maturity level beyond the normal channel.

You are a very smart man, all makes perfect sense. That is what makes this channel great.

Thx for your neverending excellent work Gene 🤗

My personal journey has been more so helped by experts like yourselves. The basic explanation for what type of changes has helped me personally distinguish different sound descriptions like, sound imaging, warm vs bright and neutral. I recently added a marantz mm9000 amp for the front L&R channels. Bi-amps with surround channels, split the preout with y-splitters. Now my focus is if the bi-amp has made a noticeable difference or not. If anyone could point out differences to listen for comparing biamp vs not. Please comment.

Great video. I never took your videos over the years as telling people not to do anything. I so appreciate the measurements done on different cables and equipment. Thanks and don’t let the noobs change anything. Placebo-More money (especially in cables-gas filled anyone) does not necessarily mean better. The people at Big Box stores and real stereo stores are there to upsell you. That’s their job. Telling the truth may not be a part of their job description.

I tried bi-wiring years ago. I had read about it and I'm thinking "you know this doesn't make any sense because the wires terminate to the same posts on the amp side but what the hell". So I tried it and of course it didn't sound any different. It turned out fine though because later I got a new receiver that was bi-amp capable so I already had the wiring in place to bi-amp. Thanks for the confirmation.

Great video, super appreciate your insight 🙏🏻

Another good video Gene. People who have been in the game for a long time and listened to many home systems often say more that half (actually they usually say about three quarters) of people's personal hifi systems actually sound very average despite the big bucks invested. You should do a video where you visit volunteer's homes, set up some equipment in their listening position and explain/demonstrate where they are going wrong (or right!). It will be your most successful video series. If you were in Australia I'd volunteer first. Cheers mate, Tony

The placebo effect is an excellent analogy. In addition there is another reason not appreciated in the audiophile world. Think of the fact that when you look at a computer screen you only see an area about the size of a nickel, that’s a fact. We have the illusion we see the whole screen. Surely we’ve all had the experience of missing something right in front of us. This is why. The same thing exist in audio. And like with our visual system, we have the illusion we hear everything going on at every moment. For this reason when auditioning cables or a DAC or amp, it’s all to easy to think you hear something fresh when in fact all that changed was your focus. This doesn’t explain every situation but it is not recognized at all in this hobby as far as I’ve ever heard it mentioned before.

My 3 kids are proof that your ears can be fooled. I remember the days when they were babies and I would put them down to sleep and then go take a shower. Many times, and this happened with all 3 of them, I could swear I heard them crying. I'd rush my shower yelling "It's okay, daddy's coming" only to rush out to the bathroom to crickets- the baby is sleeping deeply. And it wasn't just a one time thing. And the more it happened, the more I would wait, aim my ears to be absolutely sure, then I'd rush out to more crickets. The one time I told myself that it's just my ears playing tricks on me, I finished a normal shower to find that the baby was really crying.

In my small circle of audio friends a year or so ago I did a double blind test using an associates Wilson Audio towers (don’t recall the model number) as he claimed his $5k+ cables and equally expensive interconnects made an audible improvement in performance. Many times we switched between his interconnects and bi wire cables and my $1.50 a foot Knukonceptz 12/4 braided cable in a single wire termination with the factory jumpers installed. No one, including the owner who has had these speakers for over 10 years in the same room with the same content could hear an audible difference. As soon as we changed the parameters from double blind to allowing the listener to choose the cable, the owner immediately said “See here, the midrange has significantly better imaging and the bass is much tighter” the next round of listening using his cable regardless of the fact that when he wasn’t aware of the cables being used he didn’t make these claims. It was the bias effect incarnate. Oh also, the 3rd and 4th cables and interconnects were some Kimber Kable 8VS’s I had laying around I received as part of a trade and some basic Monoprice 12/4 CL3. In addition the amplification source and source material as well as the CD player were all from the owner’s library and songs he had listened to literally thousands of times. At the end of the day I understand purchasing high end cables to match your $50k speakers aesthetically, however you lose me when you start telling others something like a $5000 passive cable is making an audible difference against a quality cable retailing for 98% less. Science is great because an empirical measurement can be conducted using the same parameters and achieve the same results time and time again.

Hi Gene, this topic will never go away, nor will you change anyone's mind. Those who agree will have their opinions reinforced, and those who disagree will not change their mind because you are negating their experience. I'm in the middle, I know for a fact that cables make a difference, however i believe the divide is caused because of the obscene prices some manufactures charge. I agree, they do not carry their weight in price to benefit ratio. That's why I design and build my own cables, win/win. Definitely worth it there.

Spot on as always..

Another wonderful, and practical lecture, Gene; and demonstration! Thumbs up. Furthermore, from My Experience of listening to most categories of music, I agree with no less than 97% of what you have explained. I'm also very glad that I have watched this RU-vid hi fi audio topic on bi-wiring; in the recent past I was curious about maybe getting into that configuration! Fortunately, I have watched your RU-vid hi fi audio topic; thank you very much. As for the Placebo Effect, all I can actually say is that I have studied 1st year psychology when I was in first year university in my very early twenties. In a past RU-vid lecture you said that such a Placebo Effect is "psychological", and pointed to the upper side, close to front area of your head; fair enough. HOWEVER, the area for hearing is near the back of the human head behind the ear; thus after the hearing apparatus - my phrase. From my perception, and that it is about hearing, maybe it could be called Mental. Since there are four perspectives of psychology: behavioral, cognitive, biological, and psychodynamic. The fourth perspective, whereby the study, and practice of psychology is within the case studies, theories, and results of Sigmund Freud, and Carl G. Jung. Anyway, I'm almost going off the topic, but I think you get my point. In these cases of your topic of, "Why Do Audiophiles Fall for Placebo Effect?" it belongs in the Cognitive Perspective of psychology; for the most part. Mainly my opinion. Keep up the wonderful measured work.💿🔉🎵🎶

"Nothing unreal exists" is from Star Trek IV: The Voyage Home

Thanks for your video presentations. I like listening to music on a good hi-fi system but do not consider myself an audiophile by any means. I also like watching audio presentations like yours and have been puzzled by the furore about audio interconnects and power cables. I've watched audio experts say how they can definitely hear marked differences. But then others say no. As you state, it's what you want to believe though I would like to know for sure if there is any difference at all and if so, how does it happen. I really enjoy your down-to-earth factual presentations. Please continue doing what you do. Very best wishes from Sydney, Australia.

Fascinating subject

Agree totally. The placebo effect can be very powerful and the brain can play tricks. I started to develop a vision problem years ago where blank patches started to develop in my visual field. For years I had not realised what was happening as my brain was filling in the blanks. Seeing is not believing, same with hearing. Our perception can be heavily influenced by our expectations.

The placebo effect occurs when you're blind and you don't get to see scientific evidence or measurements. I fell for the 12AWG AC power cables until I saw measurements from Amir at Audio Science Review which proved that there was no difference over the manufacturer's provided ac cable.

Your state of mind determines how much you enjoy your music. 100% correct.

This has help me choose 12g Blue Jean wire instead of 14g biwire. Also I did magnet test and Klipsch jumper bar won't stick. I say I on simple path for better sound. Thank you.

Would love to see you test this live. Blind testing with your buddy Hugo!

From my perspective, an important factor in this is the desire to justify buying equipment, cables, etc.

The reason some speakers have two sets of inputs is to use one amp for the tweeters and one amp for the woofers. The upper set controls the tweeter and the lower set controls the bass. This is helpful for aidioheads to use say a hybrid or tube amp for the tweeters and a solid state amp for the bass.

Gene you Are spot on !,,,,, 👍I by wired and by Amped and it made no difference to my hearing but then again I’m 72 and I’m probably half deaf.

As always ! great video Sir, I don't think you were overly snarky with that cable hugger.

This was a great video. I definitely fall more into the subjective than the objective camp, but I always listen to what engineers and people capable of measurement have to say. I think there are limitations to measurement because some of those measurements don’t know what to measure for, given our lack of understanding about the complexities of neuro psychology and perception. With that in mind, there are a lot of times that when I listen, I want to hear a difference because I want to have confidence in my ability to discern differences. That is a serious bias, that is born of the fact that I want to become better at listening! And measurements can help keep me honest.

I think the reason this fellow fell for it might be that he used to have a set of modest speakers before, then upgraded to something real far upscale on the quality department. As he was setting up these new speakers, he took the time to biwire them properly. So when he turned them on and they blew away what he had previously, he attributed at least a portion of that improvement to the biwiring work he had so painstakingly conducted. And there you have it.

Gene, as you say the mind's power is strong. If you think it's going to sound better it will. I don't want to paint everyone with the same brush but I wonder if those that don't have a reasonable science or engineering background struggle more with the basic concepts of why certain things can't sound better. There's also the issue of catching "upgraditis". Those that have the bug perhaps need to feel their constant search for the next upgrade isn't in vein and so want to hear improvements in whatever they do for validation. I'm on a couple of face book groups where snake oil improvements get regularly discussed - I really don't know how to let the believers (who are generally nice guys) down gently! Any tips? I've kind of given up trying.

We can never discount the placebo effect. Thank you for raising this issue.

If it were not for "placebo effect" the ultra high end audiophile market would not exist.

There could be a set of circumstances where the listener indeed hears a significant improvement when bi-wiring. If those jumpers are corroded or not making a good contact, then switching to the bi-wiring may (falsely) convince them it was the method of connection, and not the ill-fitted jumper.

My neighborhood Hifi dealer is routinely - yes routinely - selling systems in the six digit $$$$$$ price range - including Transparent Cables for many tens of thousands of dollars. Many of the clients work in the medical profession - you would think they'd be well aware of the placebo effect. However, I believe a lot of the "drinking the Kool-Aid" comes down to enjoying being part of a very "exclusive club." Having the ability to hear things the average person cannot ("Well.... you must not have good enough ears" or "your system isn't resolving enough" are the common talking points), and amassing "knowledge" about high-end audio properties and brands that the average person isn't refined enough to know about. People love to feel that they know things others don't and belong to exclusive clubs. It's human nature - especially amongst the wealthy.

Best placebo effect is having a few drinks while listening to your system, it's repeatable and sometimes it's even better than the last time. 😊

Price and looks have a huge impact on perception. That's why blind tests lead to funny results (if done right)

For a start, I don't see myself as an audiophile but I enjoy listening to music and I like it to sound as good as possible. And I am a mixer. I mix multitrack recordings to a stereo master. The most important thing I have learned in the more then 30 years I am doing this is what you actually think what you hear is not the sound which is coming into your ears, but what your brain makes of it. When I am listening to a mix after a busy day when I am pretty tired I hear something completely different as when I listing to exact the same mix the next day early in the morning when I am fresh and full of energy. The mix which sounded not good at all the day before suddenly sounds a lot better, when actually the only thing which is changed is my state of mind and nothing else. When realizing this, I think I can understand how people can hear things which I can't hear. When different people are listening to exactly the same soundsource they all hear something different. What they hear will depend on their listening experience. A well trained ear can hear much more than an inexperienced listener.The well trained ear knows what to listen for. So I think when audiophiles are hearing things which I can't hear there are two options. 1) They have a better trained ear and can hear things I can't hear, or 2) they want to hear something (because they have spend a lot of money for it) or really think they are hearing something which is not actually there. If they think they hear something and even become convinced of it, they are fooling themselves. But if this makes them happy, let them be happy.

Hi gean great vid really enjoyed .I have a friend who recently bought new audio cables replacing his old pair which cost him £1200 uk pound he did this ×3 and the new pairs he purchased were £3000 ×3 I were invited over to listen to the new cables perform on his home audio and quite honestly I couldn't hear any difference my friend was convinced passionately .I didn't have the heart to tell him as in the past I have done and he didn't take it on board and got upset he has got a great sounding system but I do find myself having to lie just to keep him happy as he falls foul to the placebo effect very often many thanks gean I have learnt so much from your channel audioholics 👍😀

Hey Gene. I've a geek for HIFI as well home theater for over 2 decades, i had tested on the same system, single good wiring connection to the amp, and do the same biwiring.. I can tell you there is not a single advantages in to do so at all. Except in spending double the money. But the real game changer come to play if you decide to make the giant leap when is come to increase the sound stage and quality and it when Biamping comes into a play. Better bass response, the mids and highs sound more separate and detailed. Specially if the speaker has great crossxover network quality built. Is important to try to use better horizontal amplification to keep the same gain levels, except the customer know what he is really doing matching vertical amps. This is my sincerely humble experience.

I biwired my surrounds just because I didn't know any better. I used those extra pairs to feed the tops when I upgraded to 7.x.4. Made no difference taking the biwiring off the surrounds.

In my listening and HT room the biggest sound changes can be made by speaker placement. The second was some treatment for room slap and first reflection. The speaker cable wars are interesting to listen to. On one hand the measurement side of the argument uses some simple measurements to justify bashing the listening side of the debate. On the other side the listening folks say we don’t know anything about engineering but we can hear a difference. Both sides are pretty committed to their position. I have a different view point. First, measurements are very important to anyone who is planning on designing anything. It is the only way you can verify your design model. Without measurements you can’t verify your design and, just as important, uncover design flaws and errors. In todays world you can model just about anything if you want to take the time and money to do so. Unfortunately, you might only model what you know about. So, the design measurement process can uncover unknown causes and effects. My point is where is the model of the sound you hear from the amplifier to your ears? In fact, put the microphone one meter away from the speaker and measure some music. Not a single test tone, but real music of your choosing across its bandwidth over time. It’s pretty complex. Remember to keep track of time and phase. I think it might be important. A pretty complex task and way more intensive than most audiophiles want to even think about. Just measuring that for a two channel system consistently could be a challenge. Then change cables and repeat. Is it different? If so, is it audible? What does your model say? Then repeat these measurements using the binaural earphones. How does the data compare. My point in all this is pretty simple. There are a bunch of folks that hear a difference by changing speaker cables. Some of them might know what they are doing. So, before you go bashing them you might consider that the measurement of resistance and inductance could be insufficient. It might be more complicated. I’m not saying that all the crazy claims made by some cable guys are true. Actually, some of it is quite entertaining. All I’m saying is there is some evidence that speaker cables have an effect on some revealing systems. So maybe we can be a little understanding of the two positions. Just remember the old engineering rule. A young engineer thinks he knows everything and a old one knows he doesn’t. This comes from a guy who was one for 35 years. In audio, if you think it sounds different, well, I guess it does, to you. I’m ok with that.

Great video. I think people fall victim to placebo in audio because they don’t want to feel that they got duped…or because they want to believe they have “better hearing” than they actually do.

Part of the problem here I think can be "Conformational Bias". You went through the expense and effort therefore it must sound better. And, then there is the law of diminishing returns. That $4000 turntable has to sound better than the $500 turntable. I'm 71 and yes my hearing is not what it used to be but it is still good enough to tell the difference between a good and bad system. I was using a Thorens TD-160 turntable with a Shure V15III cartridge, purchased new in 1976 ($256) I had no complaints about the sound and it was a dependable TT. About a year ago I had the urge to step up to a VPI Prime w/ 10.5" arm and Ortofon 2m Bronze cart. ($4000). I have since replaced the stylus with an Ortofon 2M black LVB. Funny thing, the VPI Bronze combo was pretty close to the 45yr old Thorens Shure combo and the Black 250 was marginally better. Knowing what I know now I probably would not have made the purchase but I have no regrets. On the other hand, I think most making this upgrade would claim they were blown away by the difference. (I have a comparo video on youtube of this setup). To further elaborate, the system used: McIntosh MA352 Integrated Amp McIntosh MC275 power amp running on output 2 of the MA352. Project Tube Box S2 for the Thorens Niles speaker selector to balance the level of the two amps Klipsch Forte IIs modified (on the 275) JBL L100 Classic (on the 352) I was warned about comb filtering using the 4 speakers - I certainly don't hear it. Both TTs provide great reproduction with accurate sound

I almost fell for the placebo effect too. I was going to upgrade all my speaker cables from 16 awg zip cord to 12 awg twisted cable with fancy covering and insulation and then I watched your video about Audio Quest 5000$ cable where the battery actually caused higher Capacitance. I might still do that just for esthetics but I think I now realize it won't do anything to improve the listening experience.

I think your channel and opinion is a valuable part of discussion and debate. It helps contribute to educating folks. My criticism is when folks try to prove absolute or black and white answers. Obviously, audio is subjective. This video sounds like a response based on facts, engineering and science...very absolute.

Placebo is very strong. 30 years ago I gave a real and moderate pill killer to a patient and told him that it is a vitamin C . After an hour patient's pain still remain the same. But gave him a multi vitamin (large and beefy) and told him that this is the strongest pain killer we had, after an hour and he said he felt better. I did not know if that was true or not, but I believed him and thought the pain killer finally working.

Possibly due to 'sunk cost' as well. If someone spends a lot of time and/or money on something and it fails to live up to expectations, they may double down still believing it is great despite all evidence to the contrary. It is hard to admit it when you have wasted money on a product.

Gene, thanks for this timely, important video. Audioholics and ASR are carrying the banner for accountability and science in audio. This industry is rife with snake oil, so we need pros like you and Amir to continue keeping ‘em honest!

4:16 Amen to that; design substantiation engineer here BTW.

My Denton 85th Anniversary speakers have a serious boost in the upper treble. Tried everything, even putting 1 ohm resistors instead of the jumpers (which actually works, BTW) but it wasn't until I bi-wired them that everything fell into place. Suddenly, after months of tweaking and experimenting, the Dentons suddenly sounded balanced. I had given up hope, I did not believe it would make a difference, but most definitely did. And the difference is not subtle either. In fact, it's so obvious that I think there must be a design flaw somewhere (in the crossover?) because it's like someone has turned down the treble tone control to zero. I have no doubt that in most cases it wouldn't make a difference.

"statmat" for the CD player as another example. A piece of plastic with "special magic coating on" that you put on the top of the CD before it loaded, that was supposed to distribute static electricity evenly on the surface of the CD. I bought it in the store after a demo night, because I was certain I could hear difference at the demo. I could never hear any difference at home. Not when I tried it on/off my self, or when I had my wife help me blind-testing it. It was "only" about 15$ back in 1996 or so. I also fell for the bi-wiring many years ago with my first surround system. At the same time I also fell for buying more wire, so that I had the EXACT same length to all LCR speakers. 4 meters bi-wire (8 meters of wire per speaker), so I ended up buying 24 meters for those three speakers, where I could have been equally fine with app. 9 meters. Also - the store earned more because I payed them for mounting plugs on the wires, so a lot more plugs and workings hours that I had to pay for.

Yes gene your right I respect your opinion 👏 bi wiring does virtually nothing bi amplification on the other does,thanks for you great content.

I've never done it and maybe I don't really understand it but wouldn't that allow you to change the volume of each individual driver/tweeter to taste?

In the immortal words of Ron White: "Let me tell you something, folks: You can't fix stupid. There's not a pill you can take; there's not a class you can go to. Stupid is forever."

I don’t bi wire myself but my amp has a separate bi wire output. So it looks like I can main wire my front speakers disconnect the jumper in the speaker and ad a separate wire to the second set of binding posts. Not real sure if this would make any improvements or not. Now in the Audeyssey setup menu you can choose to bi amp the front channel. This on the Marantz SR8015.

Gene, only different's is that one set of speaker wire does not go through the Magnet Steel Jumper *Binding Posts*. which might affect the Higher HZ Or you could just make 2- Copper jumper or wires and remove the Steel jumpers ,,,Oh I don't bi-amp

Have you ever had or used the elcaset format.? Did you like it.?

I bi-wired my speakers because it looks fancy. If it looks fancy then it makes me happy 🙂

It's not so much placebo effect as cognitive dissonance. Cognitive dissonance arises when we hold one belief and are presented with factual evidence that contradicts that belief. Particularly if we have a great deal invested in something (money, time, effort), this can make us very uncomfortable. Some are better at resolving cognitive dissonance by accepting facts than others. Some simply can't do it, and dig in ever deeper to their beliefs, defending them vigorously against the perceived assault. You see this in many areas, but politics is another notable example.

I wonder if it's possible to «build» a diy cable which values of resistance, capacitance or inductance are so bad, that bi-wiring can do a difference. The hypothesis would be that if we use any standard (good) cable for the woofer, and another very thin and very long cable -maybe with a resistor- for the tweeter that can lower 1 dB the output, the difference should be noticeable. Does it make sense ? (I don't speak English so....)

I've tried all sorts of audiophoolery tricks. The most ridiculous one was power cables. I do believe in spending a little more money on a quality interconnect that is well shielded, but even then, I don't hear any differences between the cheap RCA cables that come with equipment and better ones. Same goes for speaker cables - I get the correct gauge for the distance, but tend to stay away from anything under 16 gauge.

Still using my 90’s radio shack speaker cable 😁.

My father was an excellent business man and one day,back when I was really young mowing yards for money during summer vacation he gave me some advice. He told me to give my customers an option list ,different packages if you will of my services. He said to make sure I had a "special" package and to charge exactly double my rate for it. So I made up some flyers and put them on doors in my neighborhood. I was shocked at how many of my customers chose the special package! Now mind you my special package was just a reworded version of what I normally did! I was also amazed and confused by how many people who chose the double priced special package and would actually go on and on how much better their yard looked after! Lol!! Anyways that's when I learned people will pay for the ideation of something better! It doesn't even need to be better. Just the illusion of better is sometimes just as good.

If I think and feel it sounds better. Then it does ... Keep the placebo coming. Especially the looks, things sound so much better when they look nice. 😘

Music is quickly changing thing that you can’t hold in front of you like a picture so it is hard to compare sources of music perfectly as your second hearing of even the same sounds begin to sound different (as anyone knows when listening to repetitive music, especially ones with repeated voice samples). Ear fatigue sets in too and the imagination is at work (remembering what others have said in a review or marketing about a device), and memory is difficult too. Imagination seems to go into overdrive when the situation is the most difficult to discern logically (and when one feels compelled to come up with an observation about a difference observed by another competing male).

Audiophiles can be audiofools. We’ve all been there…but it’s always good to check biases against facts!

Talking about Placebo effect, considering the reverse aspect, isn't it possible that super-audiophiles who have convinced themselves that different cables/ cords/ components don't make any audible difference, end up hearing no difference, when some others are able to perceive the difference ?

My Yamaha s-2000 amp has two sets of output binding posts and an option of A, B or A+B , so the bi-wiring is different to your diagram. I have tried both ways with cheap 10 gauge cable and did not notice a difference.

I think there is a ton of placebo in the vinyl community (I love my vinyl as well). A few months back, I played my Mofi Supertramp Breakfast in America and thought this sounds amazing. Then I put my CD in and thought, this sounds amazing. Then I switched between them and finally decided, they both sound amazing. Thanks again! What happened to Hugo?

Hi Gene, for a moment I was pretty sure you were going to mention my comment as well, and I got a bit excited. Oh well. The craziest thing that happened to me (audio wise), was when I was upgrading my studio monitors and a friend of mine convinced me to try his Kimber interconnects. I had the left speaker connected with my cable(same length) and the right with the Kimber. Let me tell you that the right speaker was considerably brighter in sound, resulting in the stereo image being garbage. Where my original cables really that bad? Was the force too strong with the Kimber? Should I go for a hearing test? What does the science say? Genuinely curious.

So Richard Vandersteen recommends biwiring his Treo CT. If it's all a placebo effect, why would this excellent speaker manufacturer demand biwiring? This discussion reminds me of an academic experiment I was involved in a few years back. Using a mass spectrometer I could not discern any differences in aroma between two olive oils. Yet, a double blind trained sensory panel found statistical differences between the 2 extra virgin oils. To this day I still dont accept the results given the mass spec is the most sensitive "sniffer" on the planet.

Green pens and using armorall on CD's was one I fell for.

The biggest victims of the placebo effect are high end amp buyers. That when hearing a $10k amp it will be better than a well designed $2k amp with similar output capabilities (wattage into 8, 4ohms, etc) on same speakers, volume levels.

Hi talking about the placebo effect do jumper cables on the back of your speakers make a difference (I have the factory metal bracket on 702s)? Thanks!

Like I said before I'm a huge audio file , but you have a lot of common sense and are extremely intelligent !

Gene I would LOVE to have you over to see/hear my HT.

I tried biwiring, in which I ran the speaker A terminals to the LF and B to the HF- and gave it a really good before, after, before , after listen… it was no different at all. In fact I think it made things a bit worse- but I’m not sure. I do know it did not sound better. Not at all.

I trusted reviewers that wrote for magazines and went out and bought the equipment that they said it was the best amp and then realized that they said that with everything they reviewed got me thinking that best thing for me is too go and listen first and let my ears hear it and then decide if I want it.

Bi wiring is pointless. Bi amping with no passive crossovers and an electronic crossover before the amplifier stage is a big difference. But thats quite a bit more involved.

In the end it's just people trying to justify their expensive purchases. Disregarding all objective evidence and facts to say their ears are better and they know better. Companies like Monster and Audioquest etc. love people like that! You've delivered some of the best objective research on RU-vid, it's too bad some people can't handle the facts.

My take on Bi-wireing is take the shortest run Possible! One cable to the speakers Woofer connect and then use a jumper wire to the tweeter - "over two long wires" running from the amp as one to woofer then another one to tweeter! I do hate the cheap binding post Metal jumpers tho and replace them with good copper or Silver cable....

What about bi-amping?

I just sold my legacy audio classics and went back to my polksi setup.i seriously feel like the lsi is a more balanced speaker especially at louder volumes.

Do you discourage using dual L & R towers, like a Speaker B? Am I doing more harm than good? Def Tech ST towers & bp9060 towers. Thank you in advance for any feedback!

It might halve their effective length if you leave the jumpers in, if that makes any electrical difference.

I owned a reasonably good set of speakers with two sets of binding posts allowing for bi-wiring. This was the Polk Lsim 707. With a decent 110 watt per speaker HK receiver I bi-wirred them and could hear no difference. Later I owned a higher end NAD with two sets of speaker outs allowing for bi-wiring (not for bi-amping) and I did believe I heard a difference. There was seemingly more bass out-put. It wasn't a massive difference but I believed it was significant and clearly there. I did go back and forth to "confirm" this but I didn't ask someone to give me a blind test.

I totally agree that bi-wiring by itself doesn't do anything. But it does give hobbyist and tinkerers a chance to add external networks to the speakers without breaking into them. For instance adding a simple resistive pad can lower the relative loudness between the mid/tweeter and woofer speakers. And of course there are manufacturing variations in the speakers that it can addressed on an individual basis. Then there's the difference in output impedance between tubes and solid state that can be compensated for. The real fun begins figuring out the compensation that makes a speaker sound "better", what ever that is.

If you spend the 💰 and the ⌚ on equipment or cables, you expect to hear a difference, some people can't accept the fact that they wasted money on snake oil 😂

Gene, doesn't distance (length) matter? i learned speaker cables are like garden hose and water pressure.same argument for smaller v larger gauge.Just a thought....

Dear Gene - budding audiophile here, in search of chocolatey midranges, no wife though so kitchen acoustics are not critical at this point. Could you do some testing with cable risers? Seems absurd to me but I’d love to see some measurements with high-end equipment, and I’m sure others would. Thank you for measuring things! I know it makes some people angry but still seems like a good idea.

How about Reverse Placebo Gene. A well known cable manufacturer with an extensive lineup told me that the higher up you go in cost the less the cable will alter the sound.