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Why Some Languages Lack a P Sound 

LingoLizard
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Ever wondered why some languages like Arabic have no p sound and others like Japanese and Vietnamese have a relative lack of p's? Watch this amateur linguistics video!
#language #languages #linguistics

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30 май 2022

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Комментарии : 483   
@annonymouslyannoying7297
@annonymouslyannoying7297 2 года назад
I will never take P's for granted ever again *sobs uncontrollably*
@Jacob.D.
@Jacob.D. Год назад
Then PAY for it
@Avicerox
@Avicerox Год назад
@@Jacob.D. BAY
@sorayacatfriend
@sorayacatfriend Год назад
sops uncontrollaply
@chick2d
@chick2d Год назад
this channel is the definition of underrated
@ShauMapping
@ShauMapping Год назад
I agree
@snyn73
@snyn73 Год назад
seconded
@totallynotnopysyoutubechanne
Overrated (nippon) imagine
@micosstar
@micosstar Год назад
yes
@snek_john_titor
@snek_john_titor Год назад
Yes
@HA-pu6ce
@HA-pu6ce Год назад
As a Japanese I'd never realized that native words in my own language don't have P except when it's altered H, until you pointed it out. Wow, linguistics is cool!
@ryuko4478
@ryuko4478 Год назад
that's why ぱぴぷぺぽ and ばびぶべぼ are derived from はひふへほ and why in rendaku /h/ becomes /b/ like in 星 (hosi) > 星星 (hosibosi)!
@user-kp9of7re9q
@user-kp9of7re9q Год назад
界隈では結構有名です
@mucpougaming6092
@mucpougaming6092 Год назад
10/10 would argue for paizuri.
@ryuko4478
@ryuko4478 Год назад
@@mucpougaming6092 paizuri is from oppai + suri, double /pp/ never becoming /h/ in the history of Japanese which should explain why there is an initial /p/ there.
@mucpougaming6092
@mucpougaming6092 Год назад
@@ryuko4478 im aware and thats why i think paizuri should be heralded as a special and unique japanese word, for no reason other than linguistically :D
@watchmakerful
@watchmakerful Год назад
On the other hand, Slavic languages have [p] in many native words, but rarely have [f] in them (except interjections), [f] can occur either in loanwords or as a contraction of consonant clusters, usually [x] (or [h]) + [v]. The opposite process also occurs, especially in dialects: words with [f] are pronounced instead with [xv].
@amabarbigrl
@amabarbigrl Год назад
You are right. I've heard that there is not any Serbian native word that starts on F. That's maybe not true, but the truth is that [p] is much more used than [f]. Before the name Filip was written and pronounced as Pilip. The sound [x] is even less frequent than [f] and [xv] is very often replaced with [f] in dialects. Instead of "hvala" (thanks) we usually say "fala" and instead of "uhvatiti" (to catch) we say "uvatiti" or "ufatiti" (both are not correct, but many people say like that) also "kafa" (coffee) was "kahva" before (muslims in Bosnia still say "kahva"). What is funny is that some people say "hvaliti" instead of "faliti" (which is correct form and means "to miss"), because they think "faliti" is incorrect form the same as "fala" and "fatati".
@xXJ4FARGAMERXx
@xXJ4FARGAMERXx Год назад
@@amabarbigrl wait a second, we have a word in Arabic قهوة, which is pronounced /qahwa/, are you telling me it went like qahwa > kahwa > kahva > kaxva > kafa > kafe which is so similar to English/French cafe?
@spaghettiking653
@spaghettiking653 Год назад
@@xXJ4FARGAMERXx ‮‭I'm no expert in Arabic‭, but according to Wiktionary, the etymology is 'disputed',‭‭‭‭ qahwa is its own word. By cafe do you mean كافيه ? If so, then that supposedly comes from the French word, and the similarity with qahwa is supposedly just coincidental. ‮
@ryuko4478
@ryuko4478 Год назад
@@xXJ4FARGAMERXx yup! Arabic ⟨قهوة⟩ /qahwa(h)/ → Turkish ⟨قهوه⟩/⟨kahve⟩ /kahve/ → Italian ⟨caffè⟩ /kaffɛ/ → French ⟨café⟩ /kafe/ → English ⟨cafe⟩/⟨café⟩/⟨caffè⟩ /kæfeɪ̯/ Arabic ⟨قهوة⟩ /qahwa(h)/ → Turkish ⟨قهوه⟩/⟨kahve⟩ /kahve/ → Italian ⟨caffè⟩ /kaffɛ/ → Dutch ⟨koffie⟩ /ˈkɔfi/ → English ⟨coffee⟩ /ˈkɒfi/
@florianscompositions
@florianscompositions Год назад
I think it's the same in Georgian 🇬🇪, which lacks a /f/ sound but has an aspired and an unaspired /p/ sound. The aspired /p/ is used to represent /f/, e.g., my name Florian would be ფლორიან (phlorian). Btw, correct me if I'm wrong, I'm not an expert of Georgian.
@lopk4568
@lopk4568 Год назад
The somali language also lacks the "P" sound. It was difficult for me to differentiate between the P and B sounds in English when I was learning it
@seneca983
@seneca983 Год назад
Somali and Arabic are related so the lack of P might be due to the same reason.
@lopk4568
@lopk4568 Год назад
@@seneca983 maybe
@valkeakirahvi
@valkeakirahvi Год назад
@@seneca983 It's not, other Semitic languages much more closely related to Arabic (like Hebrew and Akkadian) have both b and p.
@samantarmaxammadsaciid5156
@samantarmaxammadsaciid5156 Год назад
I think the consonant p was lacking in the original Afro-Asiatic, for that Soomaali and `Arabic still retain! It is the f that turned to p, rather than the p turning to f!
@valkeakirahvi
@valkeakirahvi Год назад
@@samantarmaxammadsaciid5156 I'm not an expert of this, but what I can find p has been reconstructed into both Proto-Afroasiatic and Proto-Semitic. Is there a competing reconstruction you are familiar with?
@ryuko4478
@ryuko4478 Год назад
Here's a list of things I wanted to point out: @0:25 that is correct for modern loans in Modern Standard Arabic but loaning foreign [p] as /f/ in Arabic is not uncommon historically or modernly in an informal manner, many Malay words in the Arabian peninsula are loaned with a /f/ when they have a /p/ in Malay, also historically Ancient Greek /pʰ/ was loaned as /f/ but unaspirated /p/ was loaned as /b/, with some exceptions like Παλαιστῑ́νη /palai̯stǐːnɛː/ being loaned as /filastˤiːn/. @1:45 it's not "pronounced [p] out of convenience" it's that historical /Qp/ [pp] and /Np/ [mp] where not affected by the sound changes that lenited [p] to [ɸ] to [h], similar to how /hu/ isn't pronounce [ɸɯ̟ᵝ] "out of convenience" but rather than original [ɸu] never shifted away from it's original sound because the roundedness (whether protruded or compressed) for the /u/ preserved its bilabial nature, Japanese speakers are capable of saying /Nh/ in compounds like in 半々 /haNhaN/ "half-half" and /Qh/ [hh] in loans like /maQha/ [mahha] for "Mach (number/speed)". @video the overall video lacks looking into why *specifically* [p] gets lost, because all of the cardinal stops ([p t k b d g]) can lenite to sounds like [f θ x v ð ɣ], the thing is it's very frequent for specifically [p] and [g] to be dropped out of the cardinal six, suggesting that there is a tendency to avoid voiceless sounds at the front of the mouth and voiced sounds at the back of the mouth (further hinted at by the extreme rarity of [ɢ] compared to [q]). it should also be noted that with Arabic specifically the story might be more complex, while a very popular theory posits that Arabic only recently before the Islamic conquests lost its /p/ there's actually little evidence for that, Arabic *might* have not had any /p/ sounds for thousands of years for all we know, as most Semitic languages lack a /p/ sound (with Hebrew, Aramaic, and Akkadian being exceptions not the rule!) and many Afro-Asiatic branches also seem to lack a /p/ in many of its languages that might mean that the proto-language might have not had a /p/ (especially Amazigh, Cushitic, and maybe Chadic), and even in the languages that do have /p/ the rest of the labial series looks uneven, for example Middle Egyptian had this /m p β f w/ for it's labials, compared to Arabic /m b f w/, and Proto-Amazigh /m (b) β f w/.
@hengsikai2862
@hengsikai2862 Год назад
Totally agree with what you said about /p/ in Japanese. A lot of people (textbooks, language teachers) like to explain synchronic sound variations in a language (where a single underlying morphophoneme has different surface forms across different inflectional, derivational forms, etc) by saying "it's easier to pronounce" or "it's more convenient" and stuff... but the real reason for a lot of these variations is actually due to historical sound changes affecting the same sounds differently in different environments.
@afesfrytuykjhyj
@afesfrytuykjhyj Год назад
I agree however, to a comment this long about inaccuracy, I have to say one word. NERD!
@tisjustangie
@tisjustangie Год назад
Rly interesting but i realized after reading most of it that I'll forget all of this in about 5 minutes
@EragonShadeslayer
@EragonShadeslayer 11 месяцев назад
Where can I learn this sort of thing?
@karonhiio_d
@karonhiio_d Год назад
As a member speaker of one of the Haudenosaunee languages (Mohawk), our language family is known for not having any native labial sounds. When we adopt words in Mohawk we normally convert a -b/p- sounds into -gw-, such as the name “Peter” is some dialects is said as “Kwíte.” Then we covert the -m- sound into either -onw- or -w- such as the name for “Mary it can be said as either “Onwá:ri” or just “Wá:ri.”
@dayalasingh5853
@dayalasingh5853 2 месяца назад
I've been learning Mohawk recently, it's such a cool language.
@cupcakkeisaslayqueen
@cupcakkeisaslayqueen Месяц назад
Isn't mohawk from the Iroquoian family? That's the family known for lacking labial sounds
@sakamotosan1887
@sakamotosan1887 Год назад
Strictly speaking, Japanese does not have an 'F' sound. It has a bilabial fricative, the same sound in Greek that gives us the 'PH' digraph in English being pronounced as 'F'. It's more like an 'F' if you pronounced it with your lips instead of your lips and teeth. In other words, t's a bilabial fricative rather than a labiodental fricative.
@seneca983
@seneca983 Год назад
I'd say "F sound" can refer to both unvoiced labiodental fricative [f] and unvoiced bilabial fricative [ɸ] so saying that Japanese doesn't have an F sound is a bit wrong or at least misleading (though it's of course fair to note that it's a bit different from typical English F sound).
@henryrichard7619
@henryrichard7619 Год назад
For what it’s worth, lots of languages that developed f sounds went from /ɸ/ to /f/, like Hebrew and Greek (presumably the reason why phi, which is now pronounced /f/ in Greek, is used for the bilabial fricative). It seems to be a sort of unstable sound that shifts easily - I think Japanese has retained it before /ɯ/ since that vowel is formally pronounced with compressed rounding, which makes /ɸ/ sort of easier than the /h/ (or /ç/) it shifted to before other vowels. Since it’s becoming a separate phoneme in loanwords I wouldn’t be super surprised if in the future it shifts to /f/ - but I’m no linguist or prophet so I’m probably horribly wrong and it’s not going to happen lol
@thepanremastered
@thepanremastered Год назад
എന്താണ് ഫക്?
@trafo60
@trafo60 Год назад
Okay, but another crucial detail is that /p/ is slightly harder to pronounce than other voiceless stops. Basically, for phonetic reasons, the further towards the front of the mouth you go, the harder voiceless stops become; the further towards the back, the harder voiced stops become. Which is why /g/ also has a certain tendency to be lost, and why voiced uvulars are especially rare.
@fanqa9765
@fanqa9765 Год назад
a very similar thing applies with implosives and ejectives, which is why velar and uvular ejectives are most common, and bilabial and alveolar implosives are most common
@haroothy
@haroothy 3 месяца назад
Interesting, this is consistent with how the Arabic consonant ق /q/ is pretty hard to pronounce, it even rarely occurs in the dialects.
@dimaskr2000
@dimaskr2000 Год назад
Thanks for the video! This reminds me: I've always wondered why many Sundanese speakers cannot differentiate p, f, and v. They mostly resort to using /p/ for all of them since it's in their alphabet, which is somehow the opposite of Arabic, Vietnamese, and Japanese.
@exciton9861
@exciton9861 Год назад
As a sundanese speaker, hardly but surely i'll get used to it. Its only because its appear on alot of loanwords
@LDaz
@LDaz Год назад
Arabic has F (ف) but it's much softer than the English f
@ryuko4478
@ryuko4478 Год назад
@@LDaz There is no significant difference between Arabic ⟨ف⟩ /f/ and English ⟨f⟩ /f/, they sound almost if not completely identical.
@LDaz
@LDaz Год назад
@@ryuko4478 no they don't lol. Its fa and ef. يعني بتلاحض لو قدرت تتكلم عربي
@ryuko4478
@ryuko4478 Год назад
@@LDaz بعرف اتكلم عربي، ولكن انت تقارن اسم الحرف وليس صوت الحرف، الصوت هو نفسه أو على الأقل مشابه جدا بحيث لا يلزم تمييزه، انما اسم الحرف الانجليزي (إِف) مختلف عن اسم الحرف العربي (فاء أو فا).
@dalubwikaan161
@dalubwikaan161 Год назад
Here in my country (Philippines), northern luzonic languages don't have the letter p. Most of the time when the tagalog words use "P", it will become "F" on those Northern Luzonic languages like the "Ibanag Language".
@DinoBryce
@DinoBryce 9 месяцев назад
Interesting in the way Philippines is pronounced (even though it comes from Greek)
@harveylam4294
@harveylam4294 Год назад
Technically, that wasn't the whole story for Vietnamese; while /pʰ/ did disappear from the language after spirantising to /f/ (likely during the Middle Vietnamese period), that doesn't explain how it lacks /p/ word-initially. Both were likely separate phonemes in Proto-Austroasiatic and Proto-Vietic. Historically, there appeared to be a chain shift in the initials that went somewhat like /p/ > /ɓ/ > /m/ (original *m- stays as /m/) from Proto-Vietic to becoming modern Vietnamese, leading to words like 'bốn' and 'muối' coming from PV *poːnʔ and *ɓɔːjʔ. The same process nearly happened with the dental series as well (via /t/ > /ɗ/ > /n/, where we get 'đẻ' and 'nước' from PV *tɛh and *ɗaːk) but /t/ was preserved as a phoneme from other processes, frequently from the fortition of /s/ > /t/. These changes were applied to Sino-Vietnamese loanwords as well.
@dankmemewannabe7692
@dankmemewannabe7692 Год назад
It’s also really cool seeing how some older Vietnamese features are preserved in other Vietic languages :0 I don’t know Mường, but I remember the word for nước being like the example you gave, so like “đák,” and also the word for đi in Mường is ty :0 Do you know how I find some comprehensive history of Vietnamese linguistics? My Vietnamese is bad, but it’s okay if that’s all you point me to :0
@harveylam4294
@harveylam4294 Год назад
Ferlus' and Haudricourt's works on Vietnamese and other Mainland SEA languages are great resources; Gong's 'Chinese loans in Old Vietnamese with a sesquisyllabic phonology' is also pretty interesting. I recall reading some considerable corpus of Middle Vietnamese text as well (not the de Rhodes' dictionary), but I haven't been able to find that :(
@urinstein1864
@urinstein1864 Год назад
There is very little info on Japanese language history easily accessible on the web, so I very much appreciate the point about Japanese p shifting to h. There more I learn about phonetics (Japanese or other), the more sense the kana system makes. As a European, the connection between h and b/p has eluded me for a long time as opposed to the other dakuten uses. I think what applies to P also applies to B, which likes to shift to V a lot, at least in European languages. I believe it has done that in all Germanic languages bar High German (compare "to have" vs "haben, "love" vs "Liebe"), in Modern Greek Beta has come to represent a V sound, and I think Castilian Spanish doesn't distinguish at all between B and V?
@spaghettiking653
@spaghettiking653 Год назад
As for Japanese language history, the English language Wiktionary is a good place to see the evolutions of words. Many common words have etymologies associated with them from which you can see lots of these evolutions, such as the progression from /p*/ (Proto-Japonic) to modern f, e.g. in 人 (hito); I don't know if you speak Japanese, so I can't say if it'll interest you though :) Unfortunately, you're right that there isn't much teaching about the truly ancient Japanese language; mostly just superficial glances at what the language sounded like during more recent periods. That said, the video 日本語の歴史 is certainly an interesting watch if you do speak Jap. Also you're right about b > v, certainly in Spanish many Latin /b/s have turned into /v/s and then been merged into the sound for /b/ again, so b and v are basically the same sound, β. Ain't that interesting how that affects so many languages?
@seneca983
@seneca983 Год назад
There's a Japanese youtuber named Omizan Sakamoto who had a fun video on using dakuten (which turns unvoiced consonants into voiced consonants in kana) in Latin alphabet. So e.g. instead of D you could use T with a dakuten. I'll give a link to the video in a separate comment (so that this comment doesn't get removed).
@spaghettiking653
@spaghettiking653 Год назад
@@seneca983 I don't know whether you already posted the link, but if so, then it must've already been shadowbanned anyway.
@seneca983
@seneca983 Год назад
@@spaghettiking653 I did. If you're curious you should be able to find it through the title which is "アルファベットに濁点を付けてみた Dakuten: a Japanese diacritic sign".
@spaghettiking653
@spaghettiking653 Год назад
@@seneca983 Ah thanks a lot, I checked out his channel earlier today and it looks like a real treasure :)) thanks for showing us!
@pabs4883
@pabs4883 Год назад
An interesting opposite of this is korean, which often uses the P sound and even has two different letters for P sounds (ㅃ and ㅍ), all while having no F anywhere in their language or writing system. Loan words like coffee and sofa are written and pronounced with P.
@birgbirg111
@birgbirg111 Год назад
Haha, same in my mother tongue - which is Chechen. We have many loanwords from Russian and we changed all the fs to ps. Examples: confetti -> conpetti, France -> Prance, Finland -> Pinland, federation -> pederation
@hachiko9
@hachiko9 Год назад
I came here to say the exact same thing 😄
@davidjacobs8558
@davidjacobs8558 Год назад
Korean don’t have V sound either. R and L are not differentiated, at least not in English way.
@thegoldendragonacs
@thegoldendragonacs 2 года назад
Now knowing what I know, the question arises as to why the “b” sound was chosen in place of the “p” sound in words adapted into Arabic? Was this just the only choice that would’ve made sense, or is there actually a story behind that choice? Also, this is quite good as an explanation. Very clean and concise as a script. One would even say that this is classroom ready!
@LingoLizard
@LingoLizard 2 года назад
Because the b sound is very similar sounding to the p sound, the only difference is that b has a vibration in the vocal chords
@AdamCrazyDude2007
@AdamCrazyDude2007 Год назад
Some of us do use a special letter for the p sound: پ (it's also a full letter in Persian and Kurdish), however, it's often substituted for ب (b sound). Same goes for ڤ (v sound, also a full letter in Kurdish) for ف (f sound)
@SerbAtheist
@SerbAtheist Год назад
Most languages approximate sounds they lack from foreign loanwords with phonologically close sounds they do have. For example, many languages do not have the 'th' sound, so it is usually approximates either as 's' or 't' and similarly the voiced 'th' sound (in 'this') is approximated either as 'z' ('zis') or 'd' ('dis').
@Bacopa68
@Bacopa68 Год назад
@@SerbAtheist "Mayday, Mayday" "Bremerhaven Coast Guard here. What is your emergency?" "We're sinking!" "Oh, what are you sinking about?"
@MrMirville
@MrMirville Год назад
The sound of P definitely exists in classical Arabic but it results either from a hamza crowning or followed up with a fa : (i)'flaTun is pronounced as Platon, or from any voiceless sibilant such as h or s followed with a b : isbania is pronounced as ispania. It is just considered as the result of the combination of other sounds, like sh, ch, sch, sci, which in so many languages have resulted from s + h or s + y merging into one sound. There is no specific letter or letter combination for the zh sound which is but rarely written as such (except in Proper nouns such as Zhivago) but it is very frequently heard in words such as garage, vision.
@user-bp5qz5jd3f
@user-bp5qz5jd3f Год назад
Hokkien, Hockchow are the only Sinitic languages that retained the original "p" starting in words where it became "f" in other Sinitic languages. For example, 放 is "pang" in Hokkien, "fong" in Cantonese and "fang" in Mandarin. Not only that but it retained the original "h" initial too, for words where it became "f" in other Sinitic languages. For example, 風 is "hong" in Hokkien, "fong" in Mandarin and "fong" in Cantonese. Even the province that the language hailed from, which is 福建. 福建 is "Hokkien" in Hokkien, "Fokkien" in Cantonese and "Fu jian" in Mandarin. *pronunciation may vary across speakers. Mine is based on the way people in my area pronounce these words.
@hengsikai2862
@hengsikai2862 Год назад
Not just Hokkien and Hokchew, but almost the entire Min branch of Chinese.
@yeungcharlie7296
@yeungcharlie7296 Год назад
What an awful comment. Your romanization of those languages is such a mess. If you dunno the exact romanization, please use IPA. Also, the middle Chinese initial of 風 is/p/, not /h/. The reason why most min languages pronounce it as /h/ is, that most Sinitic languages underwent the /p/ to /f/ sound change while min does not, when min languages later import the 風pronounciation from mainstream Chinese, they could not pronounce the /f/, so they mimic it as /h/.
@hengsikai2862
@hengsikai2862 Год назад
@@yeungcharlie7296 The middle Chinese initial of 風 was actually /p/, not /b/, as it falls under the voiceless tone category.
@yeungcharlie7296
@yeungcharlie7296 Год назад
@@hengsikai2862 Sorry, my fault, corrected.
@mathy4605
@mathy4605 Год назад
Just a minor correction: "Pirahã" is best pronounced as "Pirahan". Completely eliminating the nasal sound at the end feels very strange to my ears.
@MrMirville
@MrMirville Год назад
Pirahan has few vowels (a, i, u) few consonants but it has tones, which makes its phonetic system as elaborate as any other languages'.
@anomalapithecus
@anomalapithecus Год назад
pirahã is the portuguese name for the language, although it is my understanding that the language has very small vowel inventory only if the analysis ignores the lengthiness and nasalisation distinctions. (But. it has been a while since i've researched it, so, citation needed, lol)
2 года назад
Nice job on this video! I learned a lot.
@chandrahasanand4622
@chandrahasanand4622 Год назад
This phonemic shift away from P is super interesting considering it happens in so many different languages! One language that i didnt see being mentioned in the comments is Kannada. A lot of native Old Kannada words underwent the phonemic shift from P to H directly (with no F in the middle i think?). Which is why when other dravidian languages have similar words starting with P, Kannada has it starting with H. Examples include- Milk - pāl(u) in Tamil/Telugu vs hālu in Kannada The number 10 - pattu in Tamil vs hattu in Kannada Pig - pandi in Telugu vs handi in Kannada Name - peyar/pēru in Tamil/Telugu vs hesaru in Kannada and so on... However, kannada keeps the letter p in words that it borrows from sanskrit (and there are a lot of words it borrows from sanskrit) so the phoneme is still pretty common in the language. It's a very interesting phenomenon!
@santhoshrider7348
@santhoshrider7348 Год назад
In the case of kannada it might be due to the change in script which could have caused confusion among the people. Then the confusion was normalised. Then it got standardized.
@rudigernassauer6075
@rudigernassauer6075 Год назад
I first wondered why in the Cameroonian language Éwondo "French", "français" is "plési". Eventually I got it: The letter "f" is substituted by "p", "r" substituted by "l", the nasalized "an" is substituted by plan "e" and the accent is shifted to the first syllable. Their word for "German", "ndjaman", is more comprehensible.
@WagnerdsClan
@WagnerdsClan Год назад
It’s so fascinating and makes so much sense that the Japanese writing systems reflect this as well! For example the character は, it is a devoiced consonant sound, but when you add this mark ば a “ducted” it becomes a voiced sound. HA becomes voiced as BA. Then lastly the plosive mark (don’t know the technical name) can be added ぱ to turn HA into PA. This mark indicates the sound is a plosive sound and requires a larger amount of air to make the plosive noise with your lips.
@lizavetabudnik3140
@lizavetabudnik3140 Год назад
that's a cool video, thanks! I'm sure your channel will grow fast :)
@Garfield_Minecraft
@Garfield_Minecraft Год назад
Arabic writing system is so beautiful
@sammo7017
@sammo7017 Год назад
Hi, I speak Syriac Aramaic and Arabic and would like to add an information regarding Arabic. It seems that Arabic has dropped the letter P because it abandoned a Semitic feature that we call in Syriac as (the Qushai and Rukakh) which means (hard and lean -sounds-) this feature exists in 6 letters : B - G - D - K - P - T These 6 letters have 2 pronunciations, the Qushai which is the main one (the one above) and the Rukakh which makes the sounds become like this : V - Gh - Dh (th as in the) - Kh - F - Th (as in theatre) As you guessed the P sound and the F sound are the same letter ܦ݁ for P and ܦ݂ for F The same word can accept the two pronunciations depending on known rules or cases, for example the word ܦ݁ܽܘܡܳܐ which means 'mouth' is pronounced 'Pumo' but if you added ܕ before it to mean (because of - that of mouth) the word will be become ܕܦ݂ܽܘܡܳܐ 'dFumo' And Arabic doesn't have this anymore and treats the two sounds of 4 of these letters as separate different letters
@ryuko4478
@ryuko4478 Год назад
Hello! Semitic linguist here: The process you explained here is a feature, called begadkefat, unique to Aramaic and versions of Hebrew that are heavily affected by Aramaic (basically most versions of Hebrew), it's the lenition of post-vocallic non-geminated unemphatic oral plosives (aka /p b t d k g/) into fricatives [f v θ ð χ ʁ], to explain the terms: post-vocallic (after vowels) non-geminated (not double) unemphatic (not [tˁ] or [q]) oral (not [ʔ h ħ ʕ]) plosives ([p b t d tˁ k g q ʔ]) fricatives ([f v θ ð s z ʃ χ ʁ ħ ʕ h]) Later those sounds became phonemic but that's the origin of this system. It is not "Semitic feature" and Arabic didn't "abandoned" it, it never happened in Arabic to begin with. In fact the lack of /p/ is much more common within Semitic than having it, out of the dozens and dozens of Semitic languages in the Middle East and Horn od Africa only few are attested with a native /p/ (Aramaic, Hebrew, Phoenician, Ugaritic, Akkadian, Maltese, Cypriot Arabic, etc ), every other Semitic language lacks a /p/ sound As for Arabic having /θ ð χ ʁ/ those are not from /t d k g/ those are from kther sources, compare Syriac ܚܙܝܪܐ (/ħzira/ in the East and /ħziro/ in the West) and Classical Arabic /χinziːr/, here Arabic /χ/ is related to Syriac /ħ/ not to Syriac /k/-/χ/
@sammo7017
@sammo7017 Год назад
@@ryuko4478 Wow! Tawdi sagi, I didn't know that it's almost exclusive for Aramaic, thanks for clarifying I think I got that info wrong from somewhere
@learnurduwithsara1068
@learnurduwithsara1068 Год назад
I have always thought about it. This is an interesting explanation.
@yeozdemir75
@yeozdemir75 Год назад
Good video, subscribed!
@09onine
@09onine Год назад
before the Malays adapt to use roman alphabet, the Malays were mainly using arabic alphabet which were adapted from the arabian traders but the malay language has some vocabularies that aren't exist in arabic alphabet so the malays added few of their alphabets which became the "Jawi" variant of arabic alphabet which includes the "ch" sound and also the "p" sound.
@fayhay8011
@fayhay8011 Год назад
This is true,there are other letters which the Malays create it to make the Abjad writing system more fitting to the Malay language.The examples are: ڠ (ng) ۏ(v) چ(ch) ڽ(ny)
@09onine
@09onine Год назад
@@fayhay8011 I think the first one is supposed to be "ch" sound like "chat" or "cheese". "Kh" is ‌ك
@fayhay8011
@fayhay8011 Год назад
@@09onine oh yea,my mistake,I'll edit it
@EDeeseLex1
@EDeeseLex1 Год назад
P is so shy in English. Pneumonia, Pseudo, the P is silent before n and s, then when it meets h, it makes and F sound (Phillip).
@camelcaseco
@camelcaseco Год назад
nice video! im not sure "pee" and "eff" are the most accurate names for these sounds but it certainly gets the message across so i wont complain.. well explained
@whisperSSG8
@whisperSSG8 Год назад
very interesting, this is the opposite for indonesian and javanese, where f actually turns into p. For example faham (loaned from arabic) is often pronouced paham. nice vid tho
@birgbirg111
@birgbirg111 Год назад
Fatima Patima
@tcoren1
@tcoren1 Год назад
Hebrew has this feature where bgdcpt (but in modern hebrew just bcp) have two pronounciations, depending on where in the word are they. A soft b is a v sound; a soft c is a ch/h sound (this is not the english ch or h sound, I dunno what it's called); a soft p is an f sound. I believe the rule is, you use the hard sound if it's the beginning of a word or it's after a stop, and the soft sound elsewhere. You can use a small dot to indicate the hard sound, but nobody does it except sometimes with loanwords that break the rules like jeep
@konstkaras
@konstkaras Год назад
I heard some rumours that some loanwords in Hebrew go with P instead of F (hence it's opposite to Arabic). Is it wrong?
@alal7194
@alal7194 Год назад
The opposite is in Georgian language where there is no F letter so loanwords with F are pronounced with P, same was with old Armenian language later F letter was added into Armenian alphabet. Such F to P transformations are common in some languages of the Caucausus region
@AjibPuteh
@AjibPuteh 5 месяцев назад
kinda unique how a lot of languages shifted some words from p to f. because in Malaysia (it's acual more of malay speakers than malaysians), we tend to do the reverse. instead of pronouncing f, we pronounce it as p. tho, this only happens in dialects and not the entire language itself.
@v7ran
@v7ran Год назад
Ayy glad to see my language! IIRC the only two words in Vietnamese that start with p that isn’t paired with h (ph) are pin (your example) and pía, part of “bánh pía”, a durian pastry.
@sehr.geheim
@sehr.geheim Год назад
In my bavarian dialect there's no p. It's almost fully merged with b and the aspiration is completely gone.
@TheLegend2T
@TheLegend2T Месяц назад
“P has a pretty frequent habit of turning into F” Arcade game named Puckman:
@Twice_Tess
@Twice_Tess Год назад
honestly, the most unpeliavably interesting video I've seen in a while.
@rutkauljanowa
@rutkauljanowa Год назад
I'm a proud 28th subscriber. You bought me with this video
@Abhijeet-id3fs
@Abhijeet-id3fs Год назад
I'm a Hindi native, the aspirated p फ [pʰ] in my language has largely shifted to फ़ [f]
@ryuko4478
@ryuko4478 Год назад
As far as I can tell that's more of an Urban thing in Hindi and in rural areas it's more common to say [pʰ] in any case it's pretty cool!
@Applestripe
@Applestripe Год назад
Also phonetically it's easier to pronounce a voiced front consonant than a voiceless one, like with back consonants, but the opposite
@afesfrytuykjhyj
@afesfrytuykjhyj Год назад
So far, you are the first youtuber i have seen to pronounce Maori better than most other channels. I was so glad when i didnt here "Mayory". Thats how bad people are at saying it.
@paradoxelle481
@paradoxelle481 Год назад
Another thing to note on comparative phonology is Korean has p, but not f, so while the loan word in Mandarin is kafei, in Japanese koohii, in Korean it's something like keopi, or koppi. I don't why it is, but it's interesting to think that the loan words for 'copy' and 'coffee' sound similiar in Korean.
@jeff__w
@jeff__w Год назад
Yes, and the English loan words _file_ (for computer file) and _fashion_ sound like “pile” and “passion,” respectively. The word for _France_ in Korean is pronounced (roughly) “peulangseu.” (Consistently, Korean lacks _f’s_ voiced equivalent _v_ as well.)
@rm689
@rm689 Год назад
In Filipino, coffee is called kape (from cafe in spanish)
@chrisamies2141
@chrisamies2141 Год назад
Coffee is 'kopi' in Indonesian and Malay also.
@kanef_videos
@kanef_videos 10 месяцев назад
old irish actually has absolutely no Ps anywhere, not even a letter in ogham, and it's also pretty absent in frequency outside of loanwords. meanwhile then you have welsh which uses it everywhere, but only with a k to p sound shift from the rest of celtic that gauls also had for some reason
@JayaSaputra
@JayaSaputra Год назад
That is interesting because for most Indonesians it’s easier to say p than f. Most Indonesian words containing f were derived from foreign languages like Arabic. But most of the time we pronounce the f as p.
@akutomo9080
@akutomo9080 Год назад
in my native language, Javanese, the F and P relationship is the other way around. We use a lot of P sound but almost no F sound. When we use word from other language with F (and sometime V), we turn it into P.
@yuvalne
@yuvalne Год назад
Hebrew is somewhere in the middle of this shift, by the way. we have the /p/ phoneme which is realised as [p] when it's at the beginning of words or has emphasis in the root, and as [f] (historically [ɸ]) when not.
@Moses_VII
@Moses_VII Год назад
Arab here: I must watch. Too interesting. Why do we lack a P in standard Arabic? Well, let me tell you, in Iraq, we call a man who fixes flat tyres a "pentcherchy", from the English word "puncture" plus Turkish suffix "chi". The comparison with Japanese was fascinating. I almost forgot about how Japanese turned p into f into h, which I learned when I was curious about why they wrote p as a h with a half-voiced mark. The connection between h, b, and p in hiragana was strange, until I read about the half-voice mark's history on Wikipedia. This video reminded me of that. Did you know that Arabs used to turn the p in loanwords into f? Parsi, Farsi is an example. Plato, Eflaton is another. Now we turn it into b, but I think f is better than b. For example, fentsherjy instead of bentsherjy as a way to write pentcherchy without using Persian letters chim (gim with three dots) and pa (like ba, with three dots).
@ryuko4478
@ryuko4478 Год назад
We still use /f/ to loan foriegn [p] just not as often as before, Saudis for example consistently loan Malay words with /p/ as /f/. Historically with Greek /pʰ/ was usually loaned as /f/ and /p/ was usually loaned as /b/.
@ThunderK01
@ThunderK01 Год назад
Hebrew also changes /p/ to /f/ depending on the position of the letter for P (פ) and the letter preceding it. פ - F פּ - P
@ryuko4478
@ryuko4478 Год назад
in Hebrew it's a different process called begadkefat where ALL non-emphatic stops (/p t k b d g/ but not /tˁ q ʔ/) were lenited into fricatives ([f θ χ v ð ʁ]) after vowels, which later became a phonemic distinction in Mishnaic Hebrew, in Modern Hebrew /θ ð ʁ/ were merged back into /t d g/ because many speakers had difficulty pronouncing those (ironic since the dominant pronunciation of /r/ became [ʀ~ʁ̞])so now the only pairs are /p/-/f/, /b/-/v/, and /k/-/χ/, but that's not the case for other liturgical varieties like Yemenite Hebrew. Interestingly Samaritan Hebrew completely lacks phonemic begadkefat, as it wasn't part of the Mishnaic tradition! In any case hope that explains why Arabic having /f/ with no /p/ but not have /v/ either is different.
@infinite5795
@infinite5795 Год назад
Somewhat similar happens with Indo-aryan and Dravidian languages, which somewhat follow Sanskrit grammar( the former ones) or influenced by it( the latter ones). Sanskrit grammar( Astadhyayi) as codified by the Hindu Grammarian Panini in the 8th-6th BCE and Tamil grammar Tollakappiyam( 3rd century BCE), didn't have F, Q, Z sounds originally as the grammar books of other indian languages, which resulted in nearly no native Indian language having it( with some exceptions like Urdu, Punjabi borrowing it artificially from Persian-Arabic and Marathi, Assamese having similar internal developments on their own) . We traditionally have one non-aspirated p and K ( प and ख as in Hindi for instance) and an aspirated p and K( फ and ख़ as in Hindi). Indian speakers can easily make out loanwords from Arabic and Persian which have these aforesaid sounds more specifically and can only pronounce it with effort but out of laziness, we tend to pronounce F, Q, Z as indigenous Ph, Kh, J. We do have P in all our languages though. It is the reason, why Indian scripts didn't have letters for F, Q, Z until recently, many still use the letters corresponding to their native approximate sound value or with slight modifications to them by adding nuqta/Bindu to the already present native letter. For example in Hindi, ph is transcribed in Devanagari as फ, but F is फ़. Kh is ख, Q is ख़ J is ज, Z is ज़ Bonus- the hard guttural g of Arabic( Ghayn) is transcribed as an allophone of native g( ग), that is ग़.
@theodiscusgaming3909
@theodiscusgaming3909 Год назад
ख़ is not aspirated, it's a voiceless velar fricative /x/
@Sunflower-vq6vl
@Sunflower-vq6vl Год назад
In Japanese, /h/ came from /p/ historically
@boghund
@boghund Год назад
He says it at the end
@nehcooahnait7827
@nehcooahnait7827 Год назад
@@Physche p with an aspiration ph, while the p faded out and the h remains. Japanese languages f also sounds like an h with a very gentle f sound ahead.
@LingoLizard
@LingoLizard Год назад
No, /h/ did not come from /p/ *directly*. It first shifted from /p/ to /ɸ/, and THEN shifted from /ɸ/ to /h/, which is a sound change that occurred in some other languages such as hawaiian (proto-polynesian /afi/ > hawaiian /ahi/).
@LDaz
@LDaz Год назад
Brother, if you need any help with the arabic language and it's dialects i can definitely help. There's alot of nuance depending on locale and dialect that could be confusing, especially as "standard" Arabic is still spoken with an accent or even not spoken at all in some places (like the maghreb or egypt)
@syasol
@syasol Год назад
interesting, i've experienced the opposite with malay and tamil pronunciations, speakers tend to turn f-sounds to p-sounds. i think it's because F isn't native to the languages.
@2life4ever777
@2life4ever777 Год назад
in Indonesia too! People in the rural areas find harder to pronounce the "f" and would rather make a "p" sound instead
@kekroneplay4014
@kekroneplay4014 Год назад
The channel deserves much more attention than it got
@SteinGauslaaStrindhaug
@SteinGauslaaStrindhaug Год назад
I've read somewhere that one reason p often changes to f is because our jaws have become shorter with modern diets. Hunter-gatherers will chew a lot more tough food that causes the jaw to grow larger, and when the jaw is further forward it's easy to make a p sound and somewhat hard to make an f sound but when it's further back the f is easier. So the reason is (maybe) ultimately because of soft food
@ryuko4478
@ryuko4478 Год назад
This is actually based on one really bad study that assumes that humans only developed overbites very very recently (which might be true) and that before than labiodental sounds like [f v] did not exist or were exceedingly rare. But that's not true at all as we have many languages with labiodentals that have been attested for thousands of years not to mention reconstructed languages.
@SteinGauslaaStrindhaug
@SteinGauslaaStrindhaug Год назад
@@ryuko4478 AHH cool. I thought it sounded a bit weird. Especially that f sounds should be impossible. The core idea that labiodental sounds become slightly more easy than labial sounds, still seems fairly reasonable to me.
@ryuko4478
@ryuko4478 Год назад
@@SteinGauslaaStrindhaug The effects would be slight at best, but yeah it's not completely unaffected, perhaps it affect labiodentals (upper teeth on lower lip) vs dentolabials (lower teeth on upper lips)? but dentolabials are rare even in regions where underbites are uncommon so it's back to square one. People seem to frequently overestimate how much environments affect language (see the discredited "mountains cause ejectives" hypothesis for another example).
@b1battledroid882
@b1battledroid882 Год назад
Also sorta explains how the "F" sound is sometimes represented by "Ph" in english.
@dolorsitametconsectur
@dolorsitametconsectur Год назад
I think that’s just because Greek used the bilabial fricative /φ/ which is pronounced in the same place as a p but in the same way as an h
@p3achyyp8p16
@p3achyyp8p16 Год назад
Keep it up!
@lampboy926
@lampboy926 Год назад
In the Japanese's case, The /f/ sound mentioned in the video is actually /φ/, which is bilabial fricative(sound that is pretty simillar to /f/ but you pronounce it only with your lips, which is sound when you try to pronounce "wh"o).
@josiahsaquiton8261
@josiahsaquiton8261 Год назад
Vietnamese historically had two p, /p/ and /pʰ/, the former merge with /ɓ/ while the latter became /f/
@mep6302
@mep6302 Год назад
Sometimes I can't pronounce the p in Spanish (native language) while speaking spontaneously. I don't know why. But I change it to a soft b (it's represented similar to ß with IPA). Even words like "papá" (dad) occasionally I'll pronounce it as "babá" (with the soft b)
@therongjr
@therongjr Год назад
Hindi even differentiates between aspirated (प) and unassisted! (फ) . . . as well as the dotted aspirated version (फ़) standing in for the "f" sound in loan words from Persian or Arabic!
@octobixer
@octobixer 11 месяцев назад
In arabic we have a letter for p that we use to distinguish it from b but its not that commonly used it looks like this پ and is a loan from persian which does have p
@deece79able
@deece79able Год назад
There is such a character in a dialect of arabic, but not MSA I believe. This is a statement from wikipedia. The third letter of the Kurdo-Arabic alphabet. Its name is پا‎(pa) and it has the sound of English P. It is preceded by ب‎ (bi) and followed by ت‎ (ti)‎
@holierthanmao1609
@holierthanmao1609 Год назад
As far as I know, Indo-aryan languages never changed their p's to f. Rather, f only occurs in loanwords for most. However, I have noticed some speakers switch aspirated ph to f. Change in progress
@VideoNOLA
@VideoNOLA Год назад
So you're partly saying that, given time, P tends to shift to F and ultimately H in certain (especially ancient) languages. Makes sense. Would be cool if we had a phonetic term for that shift and/or descriptor for languages in which this tends to happen (or not) the most.
@ryuko4478
@ryuko4478 Год назад
Ancient languages? in Japanese it happened around the 8th century, in German around the 11th century, in Persian it happened around the 9th century, in Indo-Aryan languages it is happening *right now* Just because you are more aware of it in Ancient languages (because it is kore clear then) doesn't mean Ancient Languages had tendencies that don't happen much anymore
@ntombi105
@ntombi105 Год назад
2:02 "... p has... frequent habit of turning into f" Explains so much. In South Africa, some languages (eg, Nguni languages) use f (say in the word "funa" = want) while other languages (eg, Tsonga & Venda), not too far from the region of the "f" language will make a pf sound ("funa" becomes "pfuna"). It's sort of this middle ground between a p and an f, but sounds like a very hard f... it's hard for me to make that sound. Interesting
@king.jaguar
@king.jaguar Год назад
In my language (Mam) there is no F sound. Some people would pronounce loan words containing an F with a P instead, which is the opposite of what you just discussed.
@gabriela.7422
@gabriela.7422 Год назад
In contrast to that, in Portuguese there's a text with only P words, it's the Pedro Paulo Pereira Pinto, the Portuguese Painter, it's the story of a Portuguese Painter that worked in Brazil and had to Pay a Promise to Priest Paulo to Paint Pots and Plates, then Parted to Portugal to visit his Papa and then went to Paris to Paint Poor People in Ports and Plazas, but before Painted the Peeks of the Pyrenees. And the story goes on... the whole text: “Pedro Paulo Pereira Pinto, pequeno pintor português, pintava portas, paredes, portais. Porém, pediu para parar porque preferiu pintar panfletos. Partindo para Piracicaba, pintou prateleiras para poder progredir. Posteriormente, partiu para Pirapora. Pernoitando, prosseguiu para Paranavaí, pois pretendia praticar pinturas para pessoas pobres. Porém, pouco praticou, porque Padre Paulo pediu para pintar panelas, porém posteriormente pintou pratos para poder pagar promessas. Pálido, porém personalizado, preferiu partir para Portugal para pedir permissão para papai para permanecer praticando pinturas, preferindo, portanto, Paris. Partindo para Paris, passou pelos Pirineus, pois pretendia pintá-los. Pareciam plácidos, porém, pesaroso, percebeu penhascos pedregosos, preferindo pintá-los parcialmente, pois perigosas pedras pareciam precipitar-se principalmente pelo Pico, porque pastores passavam pelas picadas para pedirem pousada, provocando provavelmente pequenas perfurações, pois, pelo passo percorriam, permanentemente, possantes potrancas. Pisando Paris, pediu permissão para pintar palácios pomposos, procurando pontos pitorescos, pois, para pintar pobreza, precisaria percorrer pontos perigosos, pestilentos, perniciosos, preferindo Pedro Paulo precaver-se. Profundas privações passou Pedro Paulo. Pensava poder prosseguir pintando, porém, pretas previsões passavam pelo pensamento, provocando profundos pesares, principalmente por pretender partir prontamente para Portugal. Povo previdente! Pensava Pedro Paulo… Preciso partir para Portugal porque pedem para prestigiar patrícios, pintando principais portos portugueses. Passando pela principal praça parisiense, partindo para Portugal, pediu para pintar pequenos pássaros pretos. Pintou, prostrou perante políticos, populares, pobres, pedintes. - Paris! Paris! - proferiu Pedro Paulo - parto, porém penso pintá-la permanentemente, pois pretendo progredir. Pisando Portugal, Pedro Paulo procurou pelos pais, porém, papai Procópio partira para Província. Pedindo provisões, partiu prontamente, pois precisava pedir permissão para papai Procópio para prosseguir praticando pinturas. Profundamente pálido, perfez percurso percorrido pelo pai. Pedindo permissão, penetrou pelo portão principal. Porém, papai Procópio puxando-o pelo pescoço proferiu: - Pediste permissão para praticar pintura, porém, praticando, pintas pior. Primo Pinduca pintou perfeitamente prima Petúnia. Porque pintas porcarias? - Papai - proferiu Pedro Paulo - pinto porque permitiste, porém, preferindo, poderei procurar profissão própria para poder provar perseverança, pois pretendo permanecer por Portugal. Pegando Pedro Paulo pelo pulso, penetrou pelo patamar, procurando pelos pertences, partiu prontamente, pois pretendia pôr Pedro Paulo para praticar profissão perfeita: pedreiro! Passando pela ponte precisaram pescar para poderem prosseguir peregrinando. Primeiro, pegaram peixes pequenos, porém, passando pouco prazo, pegaram pacus, piaparas, pirarucus. Partindo pela picada próxima, pois pretendiam pernoitar pertinho, para procurar primo Péricles primeiro. Pisando por pedras pontudas, papai Procópio procurou Péricles, primo próximo, pedreiro profissional perfeito. Poucas palavras proferiram, porém prometeu pagar pequena parcela para Péricles profissionalizar Pedro Paulo. Primeiramente Pedro Paulo pegava pedras, porém, Péricles pediu-lhe para pintar prédios, pois precisava pagar pintores práticos. Particularmente Pedro Paulo preferia pintar prédios. Pereceu pintando prédios para Péricles, pois precipitou-se pelas paredes pintadas. Pobre Pedro Paulo pereceu pintando.. Permita-me, pois, pedir perdão pela paciência, pois pretendo parar para pensar… Para parar preciso pensar. Pensei. Portanto, pronto pararei.”
@Zeyede_Siyum
@Zeyede_Siyum 11 месяцев назад
In Amharic all P(ፐ)and V(ቨ) words have foreign origin specially V is recent. They don’t exist in our language. But there are lots of greek words adopted to Ge’ez and Amharic for liturgical purposes and they are written in the ejective P’(ጰ) for example P’etros(ጴጥሮስ),P’awlos(ጳውሎስ),P’eraqlitos(ጰራቅሊጦስ), P’agumen(ጳጉሜን) etc. So when we pronounce Ethiopia it’s ItiyoP’iya (ኢትዮጲያ)
@PeterNguyen2k4
@PeterNguyen2k4 Год назад
it is true that we "mostly" pronounce "p" just like "f" in Vietnamese but it's only when p with h "ph" is more likely to pronounce like "f" other than that "p" is just like "b" and sometimes it can create some funny situations
@StealthySceptile
@StealthySceptile 2 года назад
Interesting.
@thegoldendragonacs
@thegoldendragonacs 2 года назад
Interesting.
@weirdlanguageguy
@weirdlanguageguy Год назад
Something interesting about p in English: almost all examples of p are from loan word, there are only a words native to English with ps, such as apple and play. This is because English "p" derives from proto indo European "b", which was almost non existent
@rosiefay7283
@rosiefay7283 Год назад
"Up". Do you count "place" and "power" as loan words because they derive indirectly from Latin and Greek?
@weirdlanguageguy
@weirdlanguageguy Год назад
@@rosiefay7283 true, I forgot up. As for power and place, for the purposes of my comment I use "native" to mean "inherited from proto Germanic". I probably should have just said thst
@omp199
@omp199 Год назад
@@weirdlanguageguy That is very interesting. You did say "such as", in your initial comment, so I think we should understand that you were not giving an exhaustive list. :)
@AhmetwithaT
@AhmetwithaT Год назад
I had a friend whose native language was Arabic and I saw in him that if he really tried, he could pronounce P but during normal speech he defaulted to B. Turning policy into bolicy, for instance.
@ilghiz
@ilghiz Год назад
2:37 "except after U" Did you mean "except before U"? F comes before U in Fuji. Great explanation, thank you 👍
@Theo-oh3jk
@Theo-oh3jk 6 месяцев назад
Japanese /p/ only survived when it was geminated intervocalically. It shifted first to a bilabial fricative (not quite an /f/, more breathy and weak) and then happily shifted into an h, probably via an intermediary voiceless labiovelar fricative.
@chrisk5651
@chrisk5651 Год назад
I had a Filipino friend in grad school & he said that in their language that they did not have and "F" sound & that the name of their country is pronounced starting with a "P" sound instead of an "F" and that country was named by the Spanish. I hate to assume but his native language was probably Tagalog
@sunduncan1151
@sunduncan1151 Год назад
Modern Khmer is similar to modern Vietnamese lack of initial /p/ in native word. /p/ in Old Khmer and Old Vietnamese are shifted to implosive [ɓ] (not voiced stop) in modern phonology that’s why both languages sound unique because of implosive initials while Mon and other Austroasiatic languages preserve the initial /p/
@gabriellawrence6598
@gabriellawrence6598 Год назад
I've been wondering about this for a long time. I thought Arabic was the oddball in this case.
@Arviragus13
@Arviragus13 Год назад
Nitpick, but the Japanese "f" is, outside of loanwords, an allophone of 'h' and is bilabial (and optional in some accents)
@Pavme
@Pavme Год назад
It is interesting that even in Japanese P, F, and H are in the same letter but only with a small sign on the top right to distinguish it
@cazwalt9013
@cazwalt9013 Год назад
In turkic languages we don't have the sound th and we replace it with a t sound
@sollrandomguy
@sollrandomguy Год назад
The ending was golden
@siddheshgandhi7668
@siddheshgandhi7668 Год назад
Even in Kannada, the initial [p] sound shifted to [h]. Where Malayalam and Tamil have poovu, pogu and paalu, Kannada has hoovu, hallu and haalu.
@obay_humran
@obay_humran Год назад
in the old hijazi dielect there was p (arabic )
@IINGHII
@IINGHII 11 месяцев назад
شلون؟
@ezelio
@ezelio Год назад
meanwhile sundanese struggling to not spell P
@baltulielkungsgunarsmiezis9714
@baltulielkungsgunarsmiezis9714 11 месяцев назад
Latviešu language does the opposite. We have no f sound instead typically changing it for a p, sometimes for a t. Friedrich becomes Pidriķis.
@Couryielle
@Couryielle 2 месяца назад
my native language tagalog has /p/ but no /f/, so being told that people find it easier to pronounce /p/ as /f/ is wild to me when i myself often slip into pronouncing /f/ as /p/ when i'm not careful 😅
@MonibaKoliSMB
@MonibaKoliSMB 27 дней назад
You have seen my language yet lol😂😂😂 it’s even worse than this except we have P, F, and words so hard to say 😂😂😂
@frenchertoast
@frenchertoast 8 месяцев назад
I found hebrew kinda has the opposite case- where it's rare to found f, and much to found p. Ths most common case f appears in is in the coda, whereas p is never in the coda except for loanwords.
@raediaufar5003
@raediaufar5003 Год назад
It's weird because in my language (banjarese) we don't have f and instead using p to replace f sound
@qiziqkop_
@qiziqkop_ Год назад
It's the opposite in Qazaq. F often turns into a P. Like the word for Farsi is "parsı". The word opinion, which in Turkish is "fikir", is instead "pikir"
@hensleydodson5733
@hensleydodson5733 Год назад
literal kazakhstan
@litfill54
@litfill54 Месяц назад
In javanese pegon writing system that uses arabic letters, the /p/ sound is represented by ف /f/ not ب /b/
@ahmadawlagi6481
@ahmadawlagi6481 Год назад
Although we don't have a P sound in Arabic (me being a native speaker) for some reason we don't have any issues distinguishing it and the B sound in English apart.
@ryuko4478
@ryuko4478 Год назад
We do have issues, mostly Arabs can't pronounce /p/ or keep mixing up /p/ and /b/, saying "bart" instead of "part" and "bolution" instead of "polution" and "beebul" instead of "people". Some people who do learn how to pronounce /p/ keep mixing it up with /b/, saying "pite" instead of "bite". We, Arabic native speakers that can fluently distinguish /p/ and /b/, are the minority.
@ahmadawlagi6481
@ahmadawlagi6481 Год назад
​@@ryuko4478 ​ yeah in terms of pronunciation a lot of people mix them up but I meant that they can distinguish them when they listen to the language being spoken lime for example "pop" and "bob" or "pack" and "back"
@ryuko4478
@ryuko4478 Год назад
@@ahmadawlagi6481 Again you are talking from your experience as a fluent speaker (or perhaps you're Iraqi and have a lot of /p/ words from Persian too) most Arabs can't tell apart pop and bob and pack and back
@ahmadawlagi6481
@ahmadawlagi6481 Год назад
@@ryuko4478 I don't know maybe it is just my experience but at least that is what I noticed in my environment(friends and family), not just me, and no I'm not Iraqi so we don't have Persian words, but thanks for the information
@acompletelynormalhuman6392
@acompletelynormalhuman6392 Год назад
I thought the text was stylized Elian script for a second
@mollof7893
@mollof7893 Год назад
I assumed "fu" in japanease was from /h/ being labialized.
@ryuko4478
@ryuko4478 Год назад
nope! Diachronically speaking Japanese [ɸɯ̟ᵝ] is from [pu] > [ɸu] > [ɸɯ̟ᵝ] not delabializing, synchronically speaking you can analyze it as /hu/ labializing into [ɸɯ̟ᵝ] tho. It should be noted that [hɯ̟ᵝ~xɯ̟ᵝ] are valid allophones of /hu/ just rarer than [ɸɯ̟ᵝ].
@hoangminhtran1100
@hoangminhtran1100 9 месяцев назад
Slight correction (from a Vietnamese): In Vietnamese we do pronounce the 'p' (in 'pin') properly in the beginning of the word. In fact, all of my friends along with most of the people i met pronounce it as a 'p' with slight nasalisation.
@hasanhaitham276
@hasanhaitham276 Год назад
As an Arabian P is a really easy sound to say so the lack of it does actually affect our ability to speak english
@hanggaraaryagunarencagutuh7072
But Arabs can never have "P" in their language.
@hasanhaitham276
@hasanhaitham276 Год назад
@@hanggaraaryagunarencagutuh7072 Most dialects have loan words from other languages that have the sound P and it is very similar to B sound in Arabic. Although the French P is much more difficult to pronounce.
@save_sudan_and_palestine
@save_sudan_and_palestine Год назад
Most Arabs who can say /p/ easily is due that they learned a second language that has a /p/ or they live in a society that uses /p/ (for the same reason), but if you went to a place where only Arabic is learned, you will notice that all /p/ shifted to /b/
@hasanhaitham276
@hasanhaitham276 Год назад
@@save_sudan_and_palestine I speak the Iraqi dialect some words like shampoo are sometimes said with p
@Maurice-Navel
@Maurice-Navel Год назад
In Hebrew, P alternates with F depending on place in the word. So, Pharaoh is usually Par'o unless there is a preclitic preposition attached to it.
@silpheedTandy
@silpheedTandy Год назад
the intonation of this guy's voice makes me feel like i'm watching an infomercial, haha. (i'm not complaining)
@oravlaful
@oravlaful 4 месяца назад
1:21 lol at "purezento". in portuguese this would mean that something is "mashed (potato) like"
@blueeyedbaer
@blueeyedbaer Год назад
I don't understand how it's easier to pronounce F instead of P. It's totally different lip configuration and personally for me more work is needed to pronounce F (moving lips and pushing air) than P (just pushing air through closed lips). Some languages (Baltic and Finnic) don't even have F (and H in Baltic) sound except for loanwords.
@ryuko4478
@ryuko4478 Год назад
Some languages have /p/ and no /f/ and find [f] difficult, some languages have /f/ and no /p/ and find [p] difficult, some languages have /p~f/ and find neither hard tho they might find telling them appart hard, and some languages have both /p/ and /f/. Languages that you fluently know or at least got exposed to a lot (especially as a child) determine what you find easy or hard.
@lilith6072
@lilith6072 Год назад
2:35 i never knew old japanese had front rounded vowels
@maymeg6777
@maymeg6777 Год назад
That should be /j/
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