Let's get a depiction of a "Shorty" predator that gets pushed around by the normal sized predators, but is also terrifyingly agile and can more easily fit in human sized spaces.
So true. Make the “better” Predator actually a better Predator! Better stealth techniques, better weapons, better hand to hand combat. Don’t just enlarge him! He just becomes a brute idiot- no longer a Predator.
@@shellpose Exactly right! That interview with the original Predator actor really nailed down the problem with modern Hollywood as a whole, but movies like these in particular - the "rule of cool". They're so eager and impatient to make something that looks or seems cool, but they don't put enough thought into what and how that cool imagery or concept fits into the world they've built up. Or, more simply, they ask "Wouldn't it be cool if...?" instead of "How does this fit into the world and does it make sense in the story?"
When filmmakers start down the "classic movie monster, but *bigger"* rabbit hole, they need to shelve the movie idea and go make the Contra romhack they're actually thinking of...
I get annoyed when they forget the Predators are semi-arboreal. Also none of the Predators after the Predator 2 had Kevin Peter Hall's distinctive grace and body language.
@@MaryBrownIsTheBlairWitch See I agree. But if the movie wasn’t so DAM DARK. I mean holy smokes you can not even see anything half the time. Even the direction of that film was crap. But Wolf was all I could enjoy. His writers just blew it... the mix between cleaning up the mess solo secret agent, to slasher, to almost comedy, to creature horror and body horror? Hard to tell what the plot is about. Just for it to end like resident evil where a nuke drops. BOOOOOOO* LAME ENDING.
I don’t think its as much forgetting as it is just them picking setting in the story that aren’t rife with trees. In retrospect the super predators should have attacked from the trees more thst would’ve been nice but their tactics were already pretty unorthodox anyway. I’m more use to the lore that the toys say about the predators homeworld being some radioactive lava scape too.
@@GreaterGrievobeast55 Predator 2 did just fine showing it without trees. "Why can't these guys keep the ground?" I liked the film Predators for the part, but the preds reminded me football players.
The clicking noises using the mandibles and their teeth is one of those amazing details they had in the original that the sequels just didn't care or didn't understand. It just shows they don't understand what made the Predator such an iconic character and that's why most sequels fail.
This is easily the best and most refreshing critique of The Predator as it appears in every modern iteration I've seen in awhile. I can't believe I never noticed such an obvious design flaw/inconsistency. Beforehand, I only ever faulted the designs featured in the post 1990 installments for being cheap looking/lacking the texture and realism of the original.
Exactly my reaction. Now, how do we get the next director to use this kind of logic in approving the next design, assuming the franchise is not dead after the last debacle? Petition to have CorderyFX consult on costume design/effects in the next movie? He'd have my vote.
Same here. I always *felt* something was off about the sequel/spinoff faces that made them look cheap, but I lacked the knowledge and vocabulary to express that feeling into words. After watching this video, I can look back and realize that CorderyFX has articulated exactly what I was feeling.
I agree. Was kind of disappointed when their face was revealed in the avp movies. Avp2 was better but nothing tops the original first two movies. Great vid
@@gm9984 Prey is terrible too. I watched it this morning and the suit/makeup looked really cheap. One thing that made the original so good was the eyes. Never replicated.
I always wondered why so many of the sequels seemed to double down on making the Predator more and more of a monster when I'm pretty sure the point is that they *look* like monsters, but their danger is very human. They're hunters driven by their own culture and beliefs. They can leap insane distances and have super strength, sure, yet a lot of their power comes from their advanced technology, hunting strategies, and the ability to learn about their prey. As was brought up in the video, there's a significance to the medical kit scene. It not only shows how self-sufficient the Predator can be, but also how concentrated and aware it is. Once it was injured, it understood its limitations; humans could be far more dangerous than anticipated and if it continued with the strategy it was using, it would die. So, the Predator runs away, hides in the trees, and treats its injuries with better knowledge on its prey.
True, all the details in the original tell a story and for the audience, they subconsciously formed the Predator's character. In the sequels, it's rather a flat monster with its movie design falling into the typical Hollywood trap of trying to make it bigger, cooler, more badass via visuals but without making the character deeper.
You complete nailed the main problem with the predator franchise. Making the predator a monster and uncivilised…when it’s supposed to be an advanced sophisticated alien race who just so happens to value tribalism and hunting. The predator is not scary anymore when it’s true motivations are so obvious and it’s intelligence is neutered
@@angelsjoker8190 Not true he left out a lot of info on why they look the way they do such as their race and so forth and keep in mind there are many of them around 6 or so i think. the first movie is from the Jungle clan and most other movies are from the Elite clan. In the Predators movie were its an arena the ones that you see are Super Predators not Alpha Predators they look way different also the one that is hanging is a Elite clan Predator. This guy does not know his history at all.
@@deangeldhof2229 Some are like monsters like the outcast in the comics there vary evil and do nasty things to ppl like the Bad blood predator why killed anyone for no purpose and also would keep the skin on the heads of who he killed so he would look even more evil.
It's incredible how so many SFX teams in the past 20 years haven't been able to recreate something so iconic that Stan Winston took 6 weeks to design and build.
@@krampusklaws2238 He contracted HIV from a blood transfusion, not AIDS. AIDS only occurs after HIV has destroyed the majority of the T cells. *Just correcting misinformation, only because a lot of stigma against HIV/AIDS comes from people not knowing the difference.*
The thing that sticks out to me from the first Predator, especially compared to AvP, is the gums, strangely enough. The gums in the first look fleshy and wet with tiny blood vessels (although if they were blood vessels, they probably should be green instead of red) but the gums in the others (especially AvP) just look like cheap, dry pink rubber.
Somehow I never realized how weirdly out of proportion all the follow up films made the heads of the predators. They all feel like a dude playing dress up and definitely take away from the sleek hunter look and feel that was present in the original film. Great vid as always.
Also credit due to Kevin Peter Hall for putting effort into making the predator act like a fleshed-out being from another planet instead of a hollow visual.
@@Fallout4277 there is a certain biology to the mouth and the mandibles. It's fine to have different faces but the mouths need to look right, retract and dont have all that flap or broken open look lol and hanging like a joke come on now.
For all those saying it would be the same as humans looking different, that’s just wrong - you could have predators that look different, no one would have a problem with that. The problem is that these designs completely change how the face works. If a human had lips that hung open and couldn’t close, that wouldn’t be normal variance. You can make a predator look however you want, it would just be nice if the design made sense.
Exactly, you cant realistically change a predators function if you dont explain it. They could have Albino predators possibly, or just predators with different hair colours/sizes.
This what bugs me with how they explains the change in Prey-dator mandibles. They're native to desert area... so why would you want the inner mouth still be exposed like any sequel-dators while it has even more reason for this variant to have their mandibles cover it? They're still advanced species so I don't see the "it has bigger jaws to crush skull which is this subspecies' diet." reason, when they can, you know, use tools, like any sapient beings. Don't get me wrong, I love Prey as much as the next guy, but even they still fallen into sequelitis principle. It's my only minor complain of the movie.
Right. I think they displayed a nice variance with Predator 2. It def looked like a "different" predator with changes in skin patterns and color, but of the same species. Like it was from a different part of their planet, similar to differences in humans...subtle but the same.
@@Dr_Muad_Deeb it is of the Elite clan that is why it looks the way it does he does not tell ppl this as there are many different types of them, he also got the Alpha predators wrong there know as Super predators but yes Alpha predators are a thing but look way different.
Kevin Peter Hall is a fucking Legend. He was Harry, from Harry and the Hendersons, too. His creature roles have a physicality, stance, and posture that shines through the makeup, prosthetics, and suit. There are lots of people in schools, Hollywood, politics, and major corporations that can be called a predator, but Kevin is the only man that can be called THE predator.
The sequels are all revisited tropes that miss the point. The first Predator removes his mask because he sees Dutch as truly worthy of a fight. He lifts the mask upwards and slowly, then he roars to commence the duel. In subsequent movies the Predators are obliged to remove theirs mask so they can make a loud scary roar with their ugly open mouths, they do not understand what made that first face reveal a powerful moment.
I dunno, the only time in the sequels a mask removal felt out of place was at the end of AVP with scar. Well…there might have been a moment in the predator but I didn’t watch that trash. 2/3 of the super predators never take off their mask. And the third one does it to taunt classic. Scars gotta take his mask off to get blooded in the middle of the movie.
Not every predator is the same and not every sequel has to callback to older scenes. If they did exactly this people would immediately complain saying they copied the original. Pick your poison.
He judged Dutch worthy almost in the beginning of the movie. He took off the mask most likely thinking of more like ceremonial hand to hand combat without use of tech.
"Bigger doesn't mean a better hunter" True dat. I would WAY rather be hunted by the T-rex from Jurassic Park than the velociraptors. I can think of quick ways to hide myself from a T-Rex, I cannot do this so easily with velociraptors.
Well, with the T-rex all you have to do is get by something, squat down and stay still. With the Raptors you can't stand still and you can't outrun them. You might as well be like Don Diego Vega in Zorro the Gay Blade; HERE I AM!!!
Well, when you consider the fact that real life velociraptors were the size of turkeys and T Rex was as big as we see it in the movie, I'd take my chances with the turkeys.
@@EGeorgev You can outmaneuver a T-rex. Plus he's so big and heavy you can see/ hear him coming giving you enough time to hide. The velociraptors, on the other hand, are pack hunters. Like it says in the movie, one holds your attention while others attack from each side. I'll take my chances with the T-rex.
For the smaller changes, I always assumed it was like how we all look very different, some have bigger lips, underbites/overbites, smaller/bigger ears, wider/squintier eyes, ect. But I think the first 2 predators looked better because they look more intimidating, and I get they tried to make scar less scary because they’re younger and he’s supposed to be more of a side protag, but they still should’ve kept them scarier. And the outwards buckling/folds look weird
It's actually a good guess the one from Predators has a broken jaw. He was a prisoner in the camp after all, one could argue he was beaten by the outcasts before or even after he was captured. It could've been fixed in the movie if some blood were added, just to give a hint that his face was actually broken. Very good analysis mate!
Yup it’s a good analysis but i don’t know why they needed to add such a detail?, i mean these type of off-screen things or some scenes that have some sort of physical damage makes you think about the intern side of the character and if we’re watching a superhero thing when they take off the suit we can see the damage that we were thinking about... so it didn’t need any explanation unless you’re kind of slow or if you can’t think out of the box...
@@TotallyNotKanye they didn't. In the end it's just me and many others trying to make some sense out of details like these for simple love for the character. Trying our hardest to overlook bad design really. Look how they massacred my boy
Several symptoms of sequel-itis seem to be at play: - The Godzilla effect, where the antagonist creature shifts to protagoist/ally. This also happened in the original (excellent) Dark Horse Comics AvP series, but was handled much better. - The production designer(s) feeling they have to "make it their own," point their stamp on the existing design ("give the predator a spiky face, bigger mandibles, yeah!"... No, please). - Practical considerations beating out aesthetic one, such as the actor/stunt man probably complaining about their field of vision, so the eye sockets get bigger and we see of the predators' eyes (which makes them less threatening). - Not Doing Research. The FX team was probably like, "Yeah, we saw the earlier movies, we can totally do what they did!" Except without researching Stan Winston's design decisions, why the original Predator looks the way it does, the logic behind Stan's choices, the end result is what we get on the screen for the sequels.
@@pronpalunpo OG Godzilla was, and should be, a "force of nature" (nuclear power really but figuratively the same). Not protecting Japan or the world, not fighting for the humans, just a creature that appears in Tokyo and destroys it (like Jaws is just a shark that eat beach people). But then it became the kids friendly neighboor, fighting the real evil kaijus, and then that "personality" stayed. That's why I love Shin Godzilla more than any other Godzilla except the OG. At least I think that's what OP means, but I'm not him (obviously).
I agree with most of what you said except the Protagonist/ally shift. Ironically you using Godzilla as the DeFacto example kind of proves my problem with that being an issue. Both Godzilla and the Predator might have been seen as adversaries at times, but neither wherever intended to be bad guys. Both have motivations behind doing what they do that to them is justified and even Honorable. Godzilla fights things he sees as threats to himself and the environment where he lives which sometimes means humans. The Predators are hunters from a culture based around hunting ability who want to prove themselves by hunting the most dangerous game they can find. If they find something more dangerous to them than us it would make sense for them to change their focus to this new more dangerous target. It also makes sense that when humans stop running and also try to kill the new more dangerous creature the Predator would realize and respect that we to are a predator type species (as in the type of animal not as in related to them).
@@fran3ro well the OP commenter realistically shouldn't use godzilla's transformation as a example when his franchise benefited from him being a hero. Gojira was made in 1954 only a decade after the bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki so the memories of those 2 days were still fresh. Those memories weren't going to be fresh forever as Japan moved on with their lives and godzilla couldn't be a constant allegory for the dangers of nuclear weapons when Japan was slowly moving on from that tragedy. That's why godzilla became a earth protector especially when the issues of humanity causing harm to nature was a thing being discussed at the time. Why have a character be a message for something that everyone wanted to move on from? The message becomes irrelevant overtime to a extent. On top of that godzilla becoming a hero popularized him in America and is part of the reason why the monsterverse exist now. Godzilla is a character who works in ALL forms, whether he's a allegory for nuclear weapons or a manifestation of nature itself he's a character who works outside of what he was originally made to do. Shin gojira only works because it was inspired by another nuclear tragedy that happened recently in Japan a little over 10 years ago. Overall the person who made the OP comment shouldn't use godzilla's transformation as a example when his transformation made him a more fleshed out character who has variety to his franchise which is why it lasted for so long.
The first two movies were both done by Stan Winston and portrayed by Kevin Peter Hall, I love the subtle differences they both put into the creature. Different skin tone, slightly different face, the different armour and mannerisms, but they both looked and felt like the same species. After that it all went down hill fast and crash landed in a shit heap.
yeah, P1 and P2 are absolute masterpieces, when it comes to the creature itself. Theres a reason the Jungle Hunter and City Hunter are the 2 most famous and beloved Preds to this day.
@@thahoule7924 agree city n jungle are the best and more real looking predators ever and that's way back in time as years go on the stupider predator movies got
@@alexkoronec4326 stan winston wasnt the director...he was the creature designer for both movies. He designed the Preds in both of them. And guess what, the Preds in the first two movies are still considered unmatched by the majority of people. Thats what the OP meant
Well, 14 years passed between Predator 2 and AvP. I, for one, remember being highly excited while waiting for them to return and they were pretty cool. Of course, in retrospect, those movies weren't great but at the time they were fun to see back on the big screen after so long.
You've basically made a video about something I've always been annoyed with - and I agree 100% with everything - Nothing will ever top the entire look of the original Predator head to toe
@@williamloy1692 Did not like it at all from looks to attitude. They replaced a Hunter with raging barbarian. He also looked more like a monster than an alien species. Something more alike demogorgon from Stranger things. This video also mentions the aspect with the healing kit, that prevents the character from being dumb space monster. Predator in Prey has been hit more times than in entire franchise combined. That is just one of many aspects why it is a dumb movie.
@@fartloudYT To be fair, the filmmakers established it’s a separate species of Yautja and the idea of it being more barbaric is due to the creature’s attitude. Why is it when someone complains about the villain, in this case the Feral Predator, doing something arrogant they say it’s a dumb character trait? Like what is dumb about it when arrogance is like the #1 trait of almost all villains. Name me 5 villains that don’t carry the trait of arrogance, brash and hubris.
My favourite war mask and armour set is the City hunter/Ghost , but the best predator is Jungle Hunter When he takes that mask off you know he means business and it gives a sense of intelligence, and somehow grotesquely regal
I really like the design of the city hunter. I always thought that the extra spikes on the lower mandible Meant that he was older, Also the fact that he was allowed to hunt in a city and having more advanced weapons meant he was more experienced. not to mention, the predator species would have a pretty big problem on their hands if he had to detonate himself in the middle of a major metropolitan area.
City hunter was younger and was going through a rite of passage. That's why it preferred fighting h2h and close quarters combat(as apposed to the jungle hunter's patient snipe them from a distance style). That also explains why the city hunter went for anyone with a weapon(but still had a code not to target pregnant women and children).
@@johndexterzarate6663 Likely that it hadn't fully matured yet. Humans have facial changes as they grow up, the yautja skin might just be the same it tightens on the face as it grows older.
The covering of the practical effects by CGI of the 2011 The Thing movie is one of the most heartbreaking things ever. The practical effects were wonderful and already finished and filmed. Some higher up said it didn't look modern enough, so use CGI.
yea the overuse of cgi has become quite boring honestly... before big thing was always, how do the filmmaker top or improve effects and come up with new tech but now its just assembly line cgi after cgi...
@@joshua.merrill Man I totally forgot about that, what a waste, wonder if they'll ever release the "real" version of it?. My all time favorite is Carpenter's The Thing, nothing will ever top it I swear!
I always preferred the rich dentist idea. After all the tagline was "Man is the deadliest prey" Makes sense some hunter would take on some of our hardest guys. The way they went in the comics that they were a race of hunters just didn't sit right with me you gonna need scientists, physicists, and chemists, etc for all that tech right? Also, I'm with you on they just turning him into a scary monster gob with the strength of Ben Grimm and humans are just 9 pins for him to kill by sneezing!
The society in the comics makes no sense. Having it be a portion of society? sure. Hell you could even have them be some sort of spoiled elites, whatever. But the entire society being centered around hunting only makes sense if it's for sustenance, not for lulz.
@James Miller63 I just go by the first two movies that's it I really really hate what they did in the comic books making up these silly names for them and everything
It makes PERFECT sense. Look at our own garbage religions and how much time we a supposed "intelligent" species waste on them. How is having a society the believes in ritual hunting any more nonsensical than a society that believes in pilgramage to middle eastern rocks is worthwhile or that mutilating a newborn babies genitals is an acceptable use of time?
Did you know that the voice actor of Optimus Prime, Peter Cullen, created the iconic clicky noise? Peter said he tried to imitate the sound he heard during his youth, of dead crabs baking in the sun.
I'd be so curious to get an update regarding Prey and what you think of it's design. I appreciate that they at least brought it back down to size. The guy in there said he was trying to create his own unique character and it shows. There's a lot more personality in the movement and because it's smaller it moves with great haste, leaping through the trees with ease which is exactly what the Predator in the first movie did only we actually get to see it this time.
Well it’s also cause the predator in prey is from a completely different part of there home world, so it makes sense as to why this species of predator looks different from the typical ones you’ve seen in the older movies and what not
Predator was my dads favorite all time movie and I remember when he showed me the movie, I still remember the feeling of seeing predator take off his mask for the first time, To this day it was the greatest movie scene I ever saw. Thanks dad ❤️
The very first time I saw Predator without his mask, (he already was big and popular, my dad also had already seen it, I hadn’t.) was when I was watching the Predator with my dad, that moment felt perfect, and it definitely is one of the greatest pieces of cinema ever.
It’s in the way Winston’s team sculpted the Predator’s mandible skin flaps. It was casted in a specific shape to give the mouth a more organic quality. Whereas in the sequels it was done differently which makes the skin look saggy and rubbery.
Which one? This franchise has had the most repetitive naming convention ever which makes it impossible to tell which one a person is talking about unless they’re very specific.
Original ending of Predators, Bodie kills the rogue Predator, a dozen tracking lasers light him up, an elder Predator steps forth echoing the second movie to be revealed as being Dutch. Arnold said no to a one line cameo, however the shot was still used in the original trailer.
You’re absolutely right about the face! Would love to hear what you have to say about Prey! I loved it and think it’s the second best movie of the franchise, behind the original.
yea its easily the second best and proof that sometimes less is more. it was so simple and enjoyable. flawed as hell but still so good. excellent fight scenes. easy to understand. i wish it hit theaters
I've been saying the same things for years. I've modeled a lot of predator heads and designed some of my own in CG over the years, and always said, since Stan Winston, no one has managed to do the mandibles right. The city hunter, okay, the checks don't have as much flesh. Different ethnics group of the same species, by the looks of it. I love the city hunter design. Not quite as much as the original. But man, still awesome. After that, it's just dafuq?
@@joke_0 At first I was a little taken aback by how different it was, but then listening tot he director, and the artist, about how it's a different tribe, from the same planet, from a different climate, it made sense, and I've come to really like it. Not as cool as the original, but still awesome.
@@dominicdelgado1654 It's not a matter of looking different, its a matter of mechanics. The functionality, and how well it's done. ADI did a much better job with Wolf than they did with Scar, but we didn't see a whole lot of his face, and when we did it was poorly lit. The city hunter looks very different from the jungle hunter, but his mandibles are functionally the same. Diffferent individual, different head shape--the crest is a bit taller, less pulled back than the jungle hunter, has longer hair, face is a bit different, brows are very different. But when you compare how the feral was done in contrast to the super predators in Predators, or the big goofy fuck in The Predator, they did a much much better job, with both why it looks different, and the design decisions they made.
this is such a small feature that i feel like will never be fixed, i feel like back in old films the monster had these things that made it feel real in a way, like lips and a unique method of breathing and all that, but nowadays it is just "make monster scary" but no one gets what i scary any more, so it flops
@@hoznarygaming Truth. A monster doesn't have to be all teeth and slime and loud noises to be scary, especially if those features don't make sense and/or make the monster unbelievable. The scariest monsters are the ones that you can believe could exist in the real world. The OG Predators from the first two movies filled that - every aspect of their design had real thought behind it and that made them more believable. Compare that to, say, the monsters from A Quiet Place, which were designed simply to look scary but failed because their designs were very poorly thought out and they weren't at all believable.
I like that you photoshopped each iteration in an attempt to fix it. It's easy to say 'this is bad' or 'I feel like this is wrong', but that does little at the end of the day. Going over exactly what is wrong and how we might fix it is how we improve.
Ok, Im'ma say it. The whole kit in Predator 1 looked better than the sequels. Mask, forearm sleeves, shoulder cannon, all of it. The original version has never been topped.
The only one I think that is as good is wolf in avp requiem. Like he said in the video, sleeker and less armor as in the original. Too bad the rest of that movie is pure blackness bullshit.
idk, i think the city hunter is up there. stan winston designed him to look a bit younger and more tribal-like, to fit the city, and ithink he nailed it. he looks different from the jungle hunter, and yet definitely the same style.
As a HUGE Predator fan, I’ve always noticed this issue but was always told “They’re different just like the differences in humans”. So what the hell do I know.
I actually kind of like how each predator looks distinct from one another in the different movies. It makes each one feel unique in its own way, kind of like how Jason Vorhees looked different in each film. That being said, I do agree that the way they handled the mandibles in the sequels really made no sense. I think you did a good job photoshopping how they should look while still keeping their unique features intact.
I wish we had more film makers that would add lore to their universe but yet have it actually serve a purpose and not just be something for that one movie.
I've made a Predator suit of my own, and done many sketches of it and we were obsessed with the first movie when it came out. I 1000000% agree with you!. For me the KEY thing that makes him look intimidating in the first movie compared to the rest, is that the top mandibles/fangs are raised and very close to the eyes and slightly covering them, which gives the effect of snarling, just like a lion or similar animal would do to show aggression. The rest of the Predators they have made, simply look surprised and not intimidating at all. This is why I've come up with my own concept Predator that I may try build some day. Once I'm done the drawing I'll share a link and get your input maybe?!. Anyways great video, it definitely needed to be said for sure!. Stan Winston is still the man to beat!..
Not just the face tbh... the movement of the Pred is also completely wrong in the sequels. The second movie was ok... In the original, the Predator was agile and moved like an acrobat. You even see it jumping between trees like a monkey. But, every other incarnation of the Pred, they're like 30 stone bodybuilders with arthritis... hell even the AvP movies added camera shake when they run. Kevin Peter Hall was a perfect actor for it as he was really thinly built... yet all the actors they've used since are like, ex-wrestlers who are over 7ft tall but weigh about 20 stone before they even put the costume on.
Actually, most of the actors who portrayed the Predators in consecutive films after KPH were pretty lean. Ian Whyte who played the bulkiest Predators in AVP is a fairly lean guy in real life, hence why he was quickly replaced as the Mountain on GOT after his brief appearance at the beginning of Season 2. You would probably have a hard time believing that Ian Whyte also portrayed Wolf Predator in Requiem, who seems even leaner than the original Predator. It's less about the actors and more about the design of the suit.
The 12 year old in me wants to say "yeah but, yeah but", because Im such a Predator freak and I get the feeling to protect it, but you have to give the guy his dues, he's right, this hasn't ruined it for me, but even the Predator can't defeat Hollywood..
You want people to give a shit about the movies they make, I don’t think that’s nit-picky. It’s not life-changing, but it IS a super bummer to watch an excellent IP get sucked dry by people who don’t get it, or seem much to want to.
Shame it happens to pretty much every IP ever really. I can't think of one that has managed to stay consistent over a span of decades with the exception of maybe Gozilla or Gamera.
I hate to say it but maybe we'll get that now that Disney has the property. If they can get someone who actually gives a shit about the IP(like Kevin Feige) running the studio in charge of Alien and Predator we might get the universe we always wanted. Adversely though, we could also end up with another Kathleen Kennedy.
That's largely because the first entries in most of these franchises are so-called "passion projects" - they're ideas that the directors have been thinking about and refining in their heads for years or decades because they're very passionate about the concept. When they finally get a chance to make that movie, they pour all of that passion, refinement and love for the concept into the movie, which more often than not makes it successful. To them, it's not just "a movie" or "a way to make money", it's a piece of artistic expression that actually means something. Unfortunately, studio execs don't care about artistic expression or taking the time to think about and refine ideas until they're as perfect as possible - they just see movies as ways to make money. If a new movie is successful, they'll want to capitalize on that success as soon - and often - as possible. If the original director doesn't want to exploit their passion project like that, or if they don't come up with a sequel soon enough - then the execs will find someone who will, and they won't care if the new person has the same passion and ideas as the original director, they just want someone who will make a movie on time and under budget. Thinking, artistry, and everything else is secondary to making money for them.
@@symbiote1982pk i wouldnt really call Gamera consistent The 2 movies were... EH, then the rest were entertaining shit or boring shit, and then you get the trilogy wich is the holy trinity of all tokusatsu cinema ( or atleast kaiju cinema)
@@robertgray1365 " the movie will revolve around a young Native American woman. who goes against gender norms and traditions to become a warrior." That the plot of next movie, I am not against female protagonists I loved Terminator 2 and Alien but they doing the good old "women strong" stuff it seems, where she is perfect in every single way and can do anything. She most likely have 0 flaws and is just perfect, holding out hope but I seen this a lot of late, kinda sad now. www.cbr.com/predator-5-star-female-native-american-warrior/#:~:text=A%20potential%20synopsis%20emerged%20for,a%20young%20Native%20American%20woman.&text=The%20story%20will%20follow%20Kee,traditions%20to%20become%20a%20warrior. take a look for your self I hope I am just an asshole and it turns out well.
Wow, I thought I was the only one who realized that their faces looked so different and less frightening since the ORIGINAL 1987 Jungle Hunter. The face redesign takes away so much from the initial shock of the unmasking. Thank you so much for making a video pointing out this BIG MISTAKE.
I used to work in animation and this is one of the biggest issues I have with current movies. There is not character design. Nobody ever thinks how form follows function and each character should be built to accommodate what it’s supposed to do on screen. If for example it’s supposed to run very fast, don’t make a fat short legged monster.
You are absolutely right about the mandibles. I has always said that too, that the movie makers never got it right after the first 2 predator movies. Great video 👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻
Thank you for addressing how the sequels reduced the Predators to space monsters, as opposed to characters with personalities. It's always rubbed me the wrong way how the Predators behave in the newer films. They're not calculating, stealthy and quick-acting anymore, they're drooling Orcs who roar at and smash everything.
I always thought the Predator in Requim was the best part of the movie. His backstory of being a seasoned elite trusted with the task of hunting the abomination of the Predalien. As for the super Predators in Predators I always had the understanding they were cannibals. Which explained why they looked the way they did. They hunted and ate other Predators basically becoming sick deformed versions of their species. Also kinda explained why their brains were exposed, they were rotting away. As for the latest movie with the autism hunting engineered Predator, I absolutely hated it. Taking the Predators away from their established lore of being honorable hunters that only killed things worthy or ethical. Say what you want about Predator 2's Predator but he had a moral compass, when he didn't kill the pregnant chick. To "Urgh! Now we wanna engineer our DNA to make us super beefcakes that are superior to everything so now hunting isn't a rite anymore but rather sadism in that you have no chance in killi- Nani!?! The kid with autism killed me with my own weapons?! Oh the irony" the only saving grace to that plot point would be that the Predators are going through a cultural shift in how they hunt have a reason they are seeking to change themselves on a genetic level for reasons beyond turning themselves into super hunters. Like maybe a disease is spreading through their species and is wiping them out so now the only way to save them would be through genetic modification. Not perfect but a little better imo in that they keep their staple as honorable hunters.
You're right on top, man! For me Predator was destroyed immediately after part 1. In Predator 2 there was more quality but changes in Predator face already seemed to go bad. For Predator sequels, the faces were destroyed. For AvP series the lack of quality is 100%. I was wondering if only I see those cow faces with cow eyes that Predator has in the sequels, but here in this video you pointed out exactly the same things that I see all these years since the movies came out followed by another movie. The last Predator is terrible in every way. Not just a predator face, but also a plot, as well as silly jokes - just everything! You pointed out the stupid sound a predator makes. I also tried myself, couldn't they come up with inspirations from the original that they would push to the next level? Instead of destroying the already achieved success of Predator 1! But I think you forgot 1 important thing. Did you notice the specific movements that Predator makes in the original? When his hands press the buttons on his arm-bracelet? These movements have always been so authentic and original. They were not just human. These movements distinguished the Predator from human. Such specific movements indeed! And so wonderful! They are missing in the sequels. In the sequels, Predator moves timidly, uncertainly. He does not have this charge in his movements. p.s. I hope the new Predator movie makers take your, as well as many other notes, into account and do something quality, instead of them making junk for money.
I absolutely appreciate the (lack of filter) honesty... Like so much sequals froget the roots, keeping a subtle amount of unique details rather then a huge amount of repetitive details... thats what i struggle with in my art as well
A marvelous video that highlights how passion often outshines "passion." A movie maker may be a fan of the subject matter and enter into production with the best of intentions. But creating a monster movie through the lens of your own enjoyment can lead to a corruption of the concept. This video highlights such a corruption which, while it could be perceived as a minor thing, ultimately has a larger impact on the creature design and function. Consistency in design is important. Faces are important focal points in most movies and I'm glad this video took the time to highlight that fact.
I think that what they were going for in predators, was to make the predator look exhausted and tired. He's probably been hanging there for a long ass time without food water or anything. And maybe, as you said, his jaw is even broken because somehow he must have lost a fight to be hanged up there
Great video it makes so much sense now I didn’t catch this problem but now you’ve pointed it out. And I love that detail on how they make the clicking noise with there mandibles and they get it all wrong in the movies after the first one
Thank you! I'm so glad someone has finally said what I've been thinking all these years. Baffles me how they absolutely nailed it in the original and everything since comes up way short. I hope eventually someone will do this brilliant character justice again.
The mandibles changing is something I first noticed in the first AVP, and it has bugged me ever since! So glad I’m not the only one who was annoyed by the changes. Great analysis here overall. Would love to know your thoughts on the Predator from the new film ‘Prey’, given that it has a very different design than the Predators we see in the other films.
There's different types of predators, this is why I don't get this video or people just all of a sudden saying "you know, i always thought something was off" in general there's is going to be different looking yautjas just because that's how species work, especially humanoid sentient precies. And the feral predator from prey is almost a different breed in such species
@@jackwilkinson500 They could have made different species designs that still looked intimidating and cool in their own way, and not goofy and idiotic looking. It's plain and simple bad executions ever since the first movie. I'm sorry but I have to disagree with ya on this one..
@@jackwilkinson500 Ha ha ha!, seriously?!. Yes you did!, you said "I don't get" etc.... and explained your opinion as to why you don't get something, via your own OPINION. If you say something you think personally, and someone else says something counter, then that is a difference of "OPINION" lol. I explained why what you said as your "opinion" on the matter, did not make sense to me. Anyone else reading this would agree, you stated an opinion. lol
Recently in prey we saw how that mistake is repeated, but Michael Vincent clarified that at first the Feral Predator was going to have its jaws closed, and you can see that in one of its concept art
For years I’ve been trying to pinpoint what exactly was “off” to me about the sequel Predators but I could never put my finger on it & you’re 110% right, it was the mandibles! I feel stupid for not figuring it out🤦🏿♂️ great video man. Earned yourself another sub with this!
At first, I thought the faces were different was because just like people, we all have different faces. But when I saw the folds in the predator, hit me like a brick
Much love and respect for Kevin Peter Hall. Immensely talented, and what he went through to bring the Predator to life in the first movie deserves untold amounts of praise.
Its pretty funny you mention bigger doesnt mean better hunter - Because you’re absolutely right. Hunter gatherers were a lot stockier than pastoralists or farmers because of the distance they needed to chase their food.
I've always known and felt that the faces beyond 1 and 2 looked off but never knew why. Knowing they molded the face open rather than closed makes a lot of sense as the why they look so off. I really hope the next film, assuming they go with an urban environment again, is more along the lines of 2. We don't need good and bad preds. Just give us one pred that is hunting people.
I never really thought about it but I always felt something was off, this articulates the problem well, my only disagreement is personally I both love the movie Predators and the concept of a slightly different race of them. The super predator does look like shit though, maybe an interesting subversion would've been a _smaller_ version that like uses their advanced technology more and isn't as "fair" with its kills
That would be a pretty good explanation of why the super predators actors wouldn’t be as tall! Seeing the OG towering over one would’ve been badass! I enjoyed the movie as well but if definitely has room for improvement!
That's because while designing the Super Preador. I believe that some one was watching the Guyver:out of control anime. The last scene was the same anime
Yea I would like to maybe see like slightly smaller predators who would possibly use more tech that would allow them to keep up with the larger ones or maybe be more use more melee and hand to hand combat and be more agile. I loved the classic predator look and some of the predators in Predators as far as masks wise. The one that uses the sword was my favorite.
I don’t know why these people can’t get the continuity correct on these franchises. The worst is Alien, where the lifecycle has gone from several hours to mere minutes and, in case of Covenant, the man who brought the first Alien to life completely skipped the chestburster stage of the Xeno!! How can you screw that up!?
@@BlueMarsalis While I'm sure you're probably right, a species wouldn't devolve. It makes no sense for them to add a lifecycle when natural selection would favor a creature that comes out fully formed and ready to defend itself. It makes no logical sense. Besides, they know the people watching the film know the stages, so if they wanted to skip a stage, they should have made it clear. I feel like this is excuse making for the film.
@@BlueMarsalis It's not a case of being "spoon fed". It's a case of precedence. It was established that the lifecycle of a xenomorph was face hugger>chestburster>alien and here we have the same initial stage and final stage, it is perfectly reasonable to expect the middle stage would also be the same. Creatively they had to know that would create issues. A species would not evolve in a way that adds an extra step and leaves said special vulnerable for a period of time- that makes no sense. Had this been a later film in the chronology and they skipped the chestburster, that would make evolutionary sense, but this takes place before Alien...
@@BlueMarsalis Your last point there was one I was going to make as well. The emergence of the Praetomorph (is that what they call this iteration?) would be a lot different in that form. If it was that aware where it would mimic arm lifting, then it would also be aware enough to realize you don't want to just jump on out into a new world where there are likely predators waiting to pounce the moment you exit the safety of host. Look, I understand what you're saying and I respect it as your opinion, but I just can't agree.
@@MaryBrownIsTheBlairWitch That's possible, though, unless they grew the queen from birth, I don't know how they could genetically modify her to create those things.
@@BlueMarsalis One other quick point having more to do with verisimilitude rather than mythology, but the reason the chestburster was so effective is because, being snake-like, you can imagine it growing and hiding amounts your vital organs because it can weave around, whereas the Praetomorph and the back burster were far too large- the latter was pure absurdity in it's size and it's method of delivery.
I didn't think anything of it before, but I can't unsee it now. Personally I'd like to see a version of the Predator with a head that fixes all of the problems it would have, such as poor eyesight from the sunken eyes, or problems eating from having only 6 sharp teeth and a throat hole that looks too small to swallow things whole.
Now that my eyes has been opened to this revelation. Yeah, they do kinda suck as the series progresses. I understand the first one can biologically work, but as we get further from the original, it just doesn't seem right.
Exactly what I've been thinking. Please, Hollywood. I know you're creatively bankrupt, but please, please, for the love of God, just leave this one franchise alone. It's dead, don't disgrace it by butchering it further, post mortem. DX
@@highlyopinionated5611 It cant be that dead, the movies keep making a ton of money. Until they start losing money on them Hollywood will keep spitting out more and more. Like the Resident Evil movies, people keep saying how terrible they are but they kept making stupid amounts of money so they made freakin 6 of them.
@@garcher7169 *sigh * All to true... Personally, I pretend the 2018 movie, and its butchery of Predator lore, doesn't exist. And I fear I'll have to do the same with every Predator movie Disney is going to shit out. (I mean, seriously? Disney? Disney and Predator don't belong in the same sentence. Same goes for Alien.) I own the OG, 2 and Predators on DVD, they are not going to go away for me. And the AVP movies really aren't that bad, in retrospective. They can at least be a guilty pleasure.
@@garcher7169 fox lost money on the predator....maybe Disney wants to test the waters with the predator franchise so don't be surprised if the creature shows up in a MCU film
@@BlueMarsalis I completely agree, as much as I love studio ADI the resurrection through AVPR designs are not great to put it lightly, and I hope we will see a return of the big chap in the new Alien show but, only time will tell
I always hated the mouth in any sequel attempt, especially the skin flap between the top and bottom mandibles, the way it folds outward always grated on me.... Great video, glad to see I wasn't the only one who noticed these things, The original Predator is still my all-time favourite movie
Miss seeing more movie reviews & breakdowns from your perspective! Love your channel! And I agree with you about the mouth of the predator likes the best in 1& 2 movies only.
I've had this complaint for a while now, but the problem is that this started with Predator 2. Stan Winston put a lot of love and care into the original predator, and you may not realize it, but things like the moisture of jungle hunters skin, his mandibles constantly moving to convey the sounds he makes, the way his eyes dart around, all of this combines to make for a special effect that feels like a real creature who is living and breathing with thoughts running through their own head. The Predator in the first movie had a ton of different sounds, different clicks at different speeds, hisses, growling, groans and the iconic roar. The later films are trying to capitalize on how cool this original design is, but without including everything that made that first character work.
everything you said was soo accurate, I have made my own short story novel from watching your channel and have created the differences between the breeds and just chalked it up to different traits of there faces. But to be honest, I never noticed these things until you showed me. I remember watching the latest predator movie trailer and I instantly hated it. Not because the movie was bad but because I remember looking at the dreadlocks flipping in the air and saying to myself ' that is showing too much to were it looks ridiculous". And when actually saw the movie, I saw the facial structure and didn't even know what was wrong with it. But could tell something isn't right. Now I know, they didn't really studying the facial structure of the original.
incidentally this appears in some expanded materials too (the comics) this also reminds me of the Prometheus movies, where the supposed prequels look more advanced than their "sequels" for no reason. if i had to give a dumb and cheap excuse...different Preds, but yeah, they don't look most often than not as well as the original. i think the Classic Pred from Predators looked good enough. EDIT: ok you now what...he's right about everything. the faces were getting shittier and shittier
Well, the algorithm chose the absolute perfect timing to show me this video. It's weird, I've never noticed these things before, maybe because the Predator unmasking has never really been the same "event" since the first one, but maybe because I wasn't really looking for it, just content with it not being fully CGI and thought that the same kind of species can have varieties. I mean, people have more or less pronounced cheeks and chins, but yeah, the extent to which the predators vary just goes way overboard sometimes, especially in Predators with the trio of assholes. I'll be curious to see what comments you have on the latest one.
I've always considered the Predator 2 predator to be an old individual nearing the end of his hunting career. As for Predators, I liked it, but felt the 'bigger predator' thing was daft. It didn't need to be bigger, just a different clan or some such with less honour in their methods.
Or different hunting styles. Imagine a predator that uses different poison tools to incapacitate or kill humans. Think of the different tools it would use and various tactics it would employ. There could even be some visual storytelling with that predator, making it appear smaller and more fragile than its kin, perhaps even some scarring or markings denoting it as a disgrace among its kind for using such easy and dishonorable tactics. Or perhaps a trapper, one that sets up simple snares and such to weaken prey so that the main job becomes easier. Say that one of the predators got trapped on earth and was left stranded without much tech, so it had to rely on more simplistic methods to ensure survival while conserving as much of its remaining arsenal as possible. Or maybe a tracker, using animals from its own world(and perhaps some from ours) to aid in tracking down prey so that it can kill them. Just adding different tactics that we use already could make the threat more versatile.
Great video! I was pretty obsessed with Predator/Predator 2 and the dark horse predator comics as a kid, and in your video, you successfully articulated why I hated the appearance of the Predators after the second film. I remember complaining to my friends about his mouth being stuck open, about the random lion sounds and goofy roars. I haven't thought about that in quite a while, but your video instantly made me remember how pissed off I was with the AVP movies lol. Obviously, it isn't just his face that they completely boned, but I don't think that needs mentioning. This seems to happen in movies and video games a lot: the new and 'improved' popular character who becomes a caricature of themselves, and thus loses what made the character appealing to begin with. "Predator roared once right? Now he constantly does it, and it sounds like a robot lion. Remember that time he disarmed himself to fight Arnold? Well, now he's a lovable mentor who is obsessed with honor.... Make him bigger, stronger, and more retarded... Predator 1 predator is probably my favorite unmasked look, with predator 2 unmasked being a very close second. After that, they really took the alien quality out of the predator and just made him a monster a la Jurassic Park sequels. The floppy mouth Predators are to the original as the Hellraiser Cenobite (with the chattering teeth) is to a human.
So overall, mold the mouth in a closed position. So when it does actually close from roaring, it looks more natural, and don't have them too low? Seems easy enough. But I'm sure we're due one more bad design.
Spot on dude. I’ve been saying this since AVP. The face has never been right. Also I might be one of the few who loves predator 2. The new weapons and lore added was perfect. Danny glover was an amazing choice as well.
This reminds me of another issue I have with the Chestbursters in the Alien franchise and how over the movies the chestbursters have become less and less of a traumatic event and more of just a minor wound in a sense.
That's because we've gotten used to the Chestbursters now. After years of Alien Movies, who wouldn't? They're always going to be fatal, but different Xenomorph subspecies (like the Protomorph in Covenant and the Neomorphs) will exit from their hosts in different ways, shapes and forms. Even Xenomorphs have been shown to have different exit strategies at times (the AVP Game where Six chose to burst from the mouth instead of the chest).
@@BlackRoseRhamnous Well I meant traumatic in the sense that before it was a lot of convulsions and jerky movement, cause there's a creature breaking its way out of your sternum. But in recent movies like AVP and Covenant it seems to be more of "ouch I got a bit of chest pain and then it bursts out
I'd love a predator where he is out game hunting alien skulls with his faithful pred-hounds but then a human kills one of his hounds and he goes full John Wick on the humans
