Many would feel better shutting off the power to their equipment, yet Paul is telling us no, no, no! And check out our newest RU-vid channel / @octaverecordsanddsdst... Octave Records.
I worked in IT for 20 years. Nothing to do with audio, but the computers lasted longer if you left them switched on all the time. When you've got rooms full of racks of computers, you don't want them to die on you, because it's a pain to change them out in a hurry. So we left them on, for years and years and years. Of course, I wasn't paying the electric bill...
Of course in the business case you have the servers on 24/7 because they're in use 24 hrs a day in many cases (like a bank with customers in all time zones). You can put them in 'sleep' mode at home, you aren't really turning them off and you're still saving almost all the power of turning it off. You eventually have to reboot to pull in new patches for security updates though ignoring stuff like ksplice
Some audiophiles say that always powering off amplifiers causes micro-cracks on top or inside of capacitors. However, this is not true. The ultimate enemy of Class A amps is heat. A well designed amp will not overheat and damage itself (has vents and heatsinking). Just to be sure, I run a desk fan overtop the vents of my units after a listening session. After a relay was failing, cold air on the relay (cleaning) and some more inside solved the problem. A good amp can probably outlive the average person.
I only power off my pc for upgrades. They run continuously until they are obsolete and can't keep up with new tech. I never have any breakdowns. 3 pc running 5-3-1 year without powering off.
I never turn off my PC's either. But just out of laziness 😂. When i sit down at it i just want to use it without having to start up stuff. For the last decade any PC in my possession didn't know what 'off' means.
This channel & comments are "to die for" there's an AES paper on grounding&shielding where this company features as an example of how not to do stuff ( electrically & electronically ) - they had the "brilliant" idea of makinga power plug where you could unscrew the safety ground - go figure...
there's a longer version of this but it's been moved somewhere - page 4- www.scribd.com/document/345180522/hum-buzz-and-ground-loops-new-insights-into-and-old-problem-aes
I would imagine his products are energy star compliant to meet modern standards in which case they use less than 1W per hour in standby, a tiny amount of power. Really if a person is concerned by what amounts to less than 2 bucks per year in actual electricity costs for a single ES compliant product to remain in standby they certainly cannot afford to be purchasing high end audio. If the waste of energy concerns somebody, solar solves that and significantly reducing someones CO2 footprint as well as running costs too. Older non compliant equipment is an entirely different matter.
Philip Cooper The power consumption is less than a TV set, your gear sound better if left on, High end manufacturers do not have a power switch, I wrote this comment before listening to the explanation. I unplug my gear in the event of a lightning storm or I go away on holiday
When I spoke to a factory rep from Yamaha about this, he told me that it's better to leave most components turned on, with the exception of receivers and other units with displays, since the displays dim over time if they are left on. Accordingly, I leave my power amps on (they only draw a trickle of power at idle, and they're Class D, so it's an even smaller trickle), but my receiver is only turned on when it's time to listen to it. As for the plasma TV, it gets turned on when it's being used, and turned off after.
Class A poweramp here as well. Usually keep it on during the day when i am home. Otherwise it's off. I am not a millionaire.... Love that sound though;)
As an aerospace electronics engineer, I fully agree with you. Inrush is damaging for capacitor, and a soft start is so simple to design than I can't trust a company not able to design one.
I'm not sure that PS Audio consists of actual engineers. It's 99.999% marketing and foofery, it seems to me. Leaving your equipment on 24/7 is a great way to waste money and further fuck up the world.
@@UPR91 We used a HP signal generator with a cavity oscillator that performed better when left on. That's the only piece of equipment I've ever seen that performs measurably different after a very long warmup. All audio gear is millions of times less sensitive than the kind of testing we used that equipment for. If you can't measure it, you can't hear it either. But of course, if you *can* hear an unmeasurable difference in any piece of audio gear, then by all means do what makes it sound good to you.
Whilst true, the cheaper electronics won’t have this feature most likely. And since they’re cheap, Class D probably, better to leave them on and in standby when not in use. Leaving things in standby will avoid the in rush current and not waste considerable amount of energy either For DACs not to be bothered turning them off unless they have a screen that can’t be turned off separately. As the leds dim over time
Here in the UK we were told years ago not to turn off our hi fi at the mains but to leave equipment in standby mode for the exact reasons you give. The amount this adds to your electricity bill is miniscule. Less than the cost incurred in the items reduced life expectancy.
I’m in Australia too, Another thing that was drummed into me when I was a kid was to not only turn it off at the wall, but pull the plug out too because not only is the cost of electricity ridiculously high, here in Queensland, and most parts of Australia for that matter, there is always the chance of a severe storm hitting while you’re at work or away from home. Both my Neighbour and older sister had their tv’s fried because they didn’t disconnect them before a storm and the result was that lightning struck the transformer boxes on the power poles in the area.
Fat Rat yeah see Sydney is alot more with the times when it comes to electrical safety, and i don’t doubt whatsoever what you’re saying. With Sydney being such a big and densely populated area, regular maintenance and safety precautions would be constantly updated and implemented, which would probably be why you’ve never experienced any dramas. I’m in Mackay in North Queensland and lets be honest, there’s alot to be desired in terms of safety and reliability of electricity and the maintenance by the local council up here. We get blackouts at least once a month and the lines are forever coming down due to overhanging tree branches or impact by tropical storms. Just about everybody I know up here has a generator on standby because the power supply simply isn’t reliable. In summer, when every man and their dog has their aircons going, it’s not uncommon for half the town to black out. All that being said, you are definitely right in saying each to their own, but I’d have to add in that where you live and the quality of infrastructure in place where you live would undoubtedly have an impact on your decisions to either leave electrical appliances either on standby, switched off or disconnected entirely.
here is one about "surge protectors": they are not completely useless but not the be all / end all either. circuit breakers (at least the ones i have seen installed in houses) are protecting against over current - not over voltage. that is where a "surge protector" comes in. it may protect from voltage spikes as they might occur during a thunderstorm but would most likely not protect anything from a direct lightning strike. in the village where i live, there is a good amount of houses recieving power from wires dangling through the air, the newly built areas have their power lines under ground but our house is an older one and we get power from dangling wires attached to a mounting pole on the rooftop. the power lines going into the village are also over ground on poles. if there was a thunderstorm going and lightning would hit such a pole a good distance away from the village, it would probably result in a hefty voltage spike wich would trigger the surge protector to cause an artificial "short" that pops the breaker by over current - all good. but if the mounting pole and cables on the roof of our house would recieve a direct hit from a big old lightning strike, the surge protector and the breaker would not be much help. the more likely scenario would be that the whole breaker box will be flying across the room and the wires in the walls get vaporized along with the fancy "surge protected" power bar and anything connected to it. pretty much like this: www.ctvnews.ca/polopoly_fs/1.3373003.1492512235!/httpImage/image.jpg_gen/derivatives/landscape_960/image.jpg
Don't leave your Class A amp on. The heat alone will degrade the parts inside over time much faster. Not all components have stand by switches, only on or off. What then?
@@genez429 I own 5 traditional integrated amplifiers and not one have a switch in the back. The other one is a Naim Atom that also has no switch in the back but i believe goes into a standby mode when turned off.
@@yippie6862 If its a vintage unit? The front switch will kill all AC. Apparently, some newer manufacturers will not offer the full kill option, and it appears say nothing as to avoid the type of worry some show here.
@@genez429 These are not vintage. They are mainly recent British integrated amps like the LFD and Sugden. I'm pretty sure when the front power button is set to off the entire unit powers off. I'd be surprised if they are left in any sort of stand by mode.
@@yippie6862 Many power buttons on hi-end equipment are actually turning off only the outputs of the amps. My Nuprime ST10 has that feature, but only says "Power." Your equipment is exotic in the states. I looked online. Is your Sugden class A? As far as I know? You will need to email the manufacturer to see if there is a standby mode without you knowing it. The LFD, I found one review for a preamp of theirs. It has a switch on front as a standby mode. Note the following quote from Stereophile Mag. Step forward to the present day. The Masterclass LA-4 is not full-featured but minimalist. It's line only-no phono. It has inputs for up to five sources, all but one with unbalanced connectors (RCA). The Bypass input sidesteps the volume control, and an output with the antiquated label Tape bypasses the volume control for whichever input is selected. *There's a Standby button on the front panel and a main Power switch in back, because transistor-based amplifiers-including preamps-sound best when they're always powered up. www.stereophile.com/content/j-e-sugden-masterclass-la-4-line-preamplifier
I always turn my equipment off after use, never had any problems. Best to turn off equipment by plugs to keep electricity bill down and don't want a fire in homes
You're equipment will last longer and sound better just as Paul stated. This isn't debatable. If you listen to your system everyday, it makes sense to leave it on. If you own Bose or equivalent flea market gear then by all means turn your gear off.
Another reason is that transistors and other solid state devices are most prone to failure during thermal transients. Back in the 80's I left my computers on all the time because they were so expensive, the power consumption seemed trivial compared to the threat of an IC failure ruining it.
DEBUNKING TIME! I used to leave my Sansui AU-710 amplifier on 24/7. The only noticeable effect of that was a higher energy cost. The filter capacitors went bad anyway, so there was No Benefit.
There's a couple common capacitor failure modes. One has to do with the oxide layer on the foil itself breaking down (which takes an extremely long time to happen think years) and the other has to do with the electrolyte in the separation layer. Leaving the power on only protects you from the first mode. Leaving the power on hastens the failure of the second mode. So you lose either way.
@@spacemissing not being able to buy in bulk like manufacturers can most consumer electronics are not worth the cost of recapping. Heck we can't even very reliably source parts in today's market. You can get bogus counterfeits even from so called reputable suppliers. It is just that bad now. I was watching a video where squeaky Dave got bum parts off Digikey. Crikey!
@@CMDR_Birb thanks. With access to the Internet a lot of information is available. More than when I got started with stuff. I used to have to buy books. Today you can download everything you could want to know. Which is amazing. There's something to building your own gear too. I never made a hi-fi stereo but I made some amps. It is pretty thrilling to listen to an amp you've made yourself. Might not be the best amp in the world but it's still something of your own hands. It made things more real to me personally.
Generally, I disagree that you can benefit from leaving audio equipment turned on when not used. I cannot argue on sound quality compared to "power cycled" devices because it's subjective to Paul. This can be proven by measurements of course... But I see two downsides. One is increased power consumption. Secondly, is aging of solid-state parts and caps. Typically, manufacturer specifies cap's lifespan when rated voltage is applied, time can vary from 2000 h to 10 thousands hours. Then the cap will most probably off-spec by one or more parameters. So, this is exactly what happens in switched on equipment. Your capacitors ages faster when voltage is applied (device is switched on) vs switched off device where your lifespan is equivalent to shelf life.
There are 50,000 hour caps and beyond. But you're not going to find them in a whole lot of gear. Might find them in some high end audio gear though. Like Black Gate Rubycons. Although if they're legit is another question entirely. You'd be surprised what some folks will do for money.
Had just the opposite experience with Crown iTech 4000 amps. We had a rack full of amps that were all on standby power when not being used except for our main FOH amp that was on a relay switch. In caparison to the main FOH amps the others were hardly used at all but one by one they all started failing on the power input section, same exact problem. Our FOH amp is still working fine because we shut it off completely every night. We don't make that mistake any more.
As an engineering technician in R&D, Failure Analysis, etc, many components age and have age related failures, so power on or power off have the same defect rate. We have some equipment with failing parts and new old stock parts have the same defects showing as in use parts. The parts are end of life due to age. Power supplies and linear devices have heat baking failures. The plastics outgas and the capacitors fail, regulator IC's go out of value, and become electrically noisy. Thermal cycling breaks solder connections on power devices installed in thru hole board designs. In newer components, multilayer ceramic capacitors crack and short resulting in failures. In very humid locations the heat reduces corrosion. Power switches and relays subject to high inrush currents have a limited number of operations before the contact resistance becomes high and fails. Summary, Keep the equipment cool, dry, and avoid age, thermal cycles, and power cycles. If you are not going to use it overnight, or longer, turn it off. If going out to the mailbox, leave it on. My backup scope is a Tektronics TDS-220. My main scope had a voltage regulator fail, so I had to troubleshoot and repair it. Completed a calibration test on the scope which had intermittent use over the years and had about a decade in storage. No issues. It passed a calibration test and has zero problems. I can't say the same for most always on electronics of the same age. This was bought in 1999 brand new. On the bench it was used for storage functions as the analog scope was brighter, and had higher resolution. The storage scope was used for single shot capture mostly. If you are not using something for an extended period of time, shut it off. I power down my workstation, computer and all at the end of the day.
Hi Paul! You must always turn the equipment off! At least I have a very good reason to turn them off, even if it is a once-in-a-life-time thing. And here is why: Back in 1985, I was working at a great record company as a Cutting and Mastering engineer. I had been trusted to exclusively work on a state of the art Neumann VMS-80 lathe, with all the audio equipment also from Neumann and an MCI player with delay hubs. Every single day I will turn the machines on in the morning and off late in the afternoon. When it was lunch time from 12 m to 2 pm, I went away to eat and back to continue work and during this lunch time I never turned off the equipment just because it was better to have them warm to immediately continue working. This had been going on for almost one and half years. One day I felt very sleepy and decided to take a big nap during my lunch time. Therefore, I just sat down and leaned over a deskto sleep. At about 1:30 pm, I happened (by pure chance) to open my eyes and watch the control console beside the lathe and saw a thin plume of smoke coming out of it! Without thinking, I threw myself directly at the mains and turned them off. If I wouldn't have been there at that time the whole studio could potentially have caught fire, and been surrounded by flammable materials (plastic, wood and vinyl) the whole studio would have been lost, to say the least. The plume of smoke and a little flame, was due to a tiny faulty tantalum capacitor.What would you know that this possibly could happen to a state of the art machine with the finest electronics money could buy and that it was only 2 years old!!! My boss then and I learned a good lesson that day: no electronic equipment should be left on unattended! And if you are going to leave it on unattended then you must have extraordinary fire prevention measures in place. You could say that this happening is just one in a million but it did happen, so unless you are prepared to fend off any possible occurrence of fire, no matter how small, you should not leave your electronic equipment on. That goes for computers too! Cheers
Completely ridiculous. I have been turning off, un-plugging for 50 years. Saving un needed juice is MUCH more important than snake oil ear responses. It is a big deal. Not to mention safer. All the morons leaving the stuff on multiplied together equals how many amps? Remember the old quick picture TV's ? They kept the tube heater going on the sets, so the picture would be near instant on. Horrible idea. Transistors WILL degrade over time. Tubes amps may be better left on due to mechanical stresses created by thermal changes, as well as transistors indeed, but in the real world observation of the average home use equipment, turn it off, you be better OFF.
@@Turtleback8024 That does make them the all knowledgeable expert on the subject of coarse though indeed. This is nothing against PS, it is against BS, that many have learned over the years :) I'll take first hand info, my own engineering knowledge, and repeated results from thousands of real world functions over 50 years, thank you.
did you even watch the video? The advice was to turn tubes off - it is a well known fact they degrade over time, they get pretty warm even without a signal. If you really wanted to know how much power a transistor amp uses, you could google it. it's negligible extra amount, especially if you're powering it up to listen most days anyways.
That all depends on what it is that you are leaving on!? Just having certain things plugged in draws power even if you are not using it, like a toaster or coffee maker, etc., but I have all my gear running into a Furman Power Conditioner that is coming out of a Furman Voltage Regulator and I have never seen a big enough change in usage or monthly costs to sit there and shutdown every piece of gear separately and then let the conditioner shutdown in stages because it goes through 3 different stages of shutdown.... every month when I receive my little postcard in the mail from my electric company and every month they have me at below average as far as my monthly electricity usage goes and I've got a ton of shit plugged in all over, whether it makes a difference or not, I do have all my electronics running through conditioners, regulators and surge protectors, but those are all plugged in and turned on 24/7! It's not the 1940's with WWII going on and a shitload of unbalanced electrical wires and cables hanging out all over the place! I can hear my grandfather now..... 'hey... you wanna close the goddamn refrigerator door or do you want to go get a job to pay for that? If you're paying... you can stand there all day and dance in front of the refrigerator with the door open for all I care, buddy as long as I'm paying the bills you better figure out what it is you want before coming in here and opening the refrigerator door!' Lolol oh gramps it's going to be ok. Lol Poor gramps he was in WWII, times were a completely different story from today, except that everyone is still broke, no work and no food, this time it's a world war over a damn virus instead of Nazis, but the reality is that they both suck just as bad!
That would be a hefty electricity bill for all the class A guys. Even my 3 wpc tube receiver with single ended class A drains about 60 watts just sitting there doing nothing.
Yes because this is the alternate reality of the twilight zone, where Tesla was revered for giving the world free energy & wifi, and Edison died destitute & forgotten in a crummy old hotel.
Back in the 90s I figured out that the thermal cycling, due to ON & Off switching, was what shortened the lifespan of equipment. So in my new found brilliance I left my NAD 7240PE receiver on and after 3 days the tuner had gone out! So much for that theory!
He was right when he said it sounded different the next day and thought maybe It's just my ears are fresh. He should have left it at that. It's well known that the longer one listens the more the ears adjust to the sound. It's also well known that audio memory is very short seconds or minutes at the most. So, overnight is too long to remember what something sounded like the night before. Put those two things together and that explains it; not whether the power was turned off.
I would think that the thermal expansion and contraction that occurs when going from hot to cold (or the reverse) would also be an important consideration for longevity. Limiting the thermal expansion and contraction should also limit connection issues that can arise...like bad solder joints.
Yes this especially applies to transistor equipment, making the sound more warm/smooth/big/evolved. But on tube gear, many times it can sound better if you just turn it on when you use it, and wait like 30 minutes to fully evolve, to give it more edge. Leaving tube sound on for many days, will not only cost a lot of money in regards to your electrical bill, but will often create a more flat and not so correct type of sound being too warm some times. It's all relative to the gear and the conditions so one has to just find out what is best for ones own self. But yes especially tube sound that is on for a couple of days, will normally go through a couple of sound development stages within the first 48 hours, and then it's a question what you prefer. So if I had for example a mcintosh mc275 tube amp that I personally think is boring and too conservative, I would then personally turn it on, and may listen in 15 minutes time, and turn it off after an hour or 2, because I would personally not want that sound to get even more warm in sound. Unless I maybe was using a cd player that naturally has a thin ish type of sound. But yeah something to think about.
I use remotes to turn off my equipment into standby mode. I avoid leaving them operating in the "on" state. The subdivision I'm in for some reason is horrible for Brown outs and surges especially during thunderstorms, but sometimes for no obvious reasons. I use a 1990s vintage Rack mount MONSTER brand line conditioner and surge suppressor that trips several times a year requiring resets. If it wasn't for that, I suspect my gear would be fried many time over. So, if you do leave your gear ON, for goodness sake make sure you have a quality piece of equipment to protect it all. And NO, a $10-$20 Wal-Mart surge protector is definitely NOT adequate!
i imagine you have to deal with power outages on a regular basis then - that would justify purchasing a UPS that also has all the surge protection and stuff built in and - as a bonus - outputs a pure sine wave
@@KenjiUmino - lightning blows up Ups’s also. If you aren’t using it, turn it off and unplug it if really don’t want to repair it. South Fl storms are wicked.
🎧 📽 I Don't Think That I'll EVER Be Convinced That Leaving Audio, OR Video Equipment ON INDEFINITELY Would Be BETTER OVERALL, OVER Turning It OFF After Use. I Think That With The Increased Risk Of Power Surges & Lightning Strikes Alone Is Reason Enough To Just Turn Your Equipment ON Say, a 1/2 Hour, Or Hour BEFORE You Actually Intend On Using It Would Addresses BOTH SIDES Of This Argument? Besides, I Would Think That TODAY'S Audio & Video Gear Are BETTER SUITED For Quick Startup & Playback, & Are Better Equipped To Handle Playing When "Cold", And At Lower Volumes Too. When I Think Of Gear That Really NEEDS To "Warm Up", I Believe It's The Older, Non Solid State Type Equipment With Components That Use Vacuum Tubes, Or, Of Course, Some Of The More Expensive Audiophile Type Equipment That's Sold Today, But People That Invest In Audiophile Style Equipment I'm Sure ALSO Purchased Good Power Conditioners To Protect Their Investments, And Allow Them To Just Leave This Kind Of Vintage Style Of Equipment ON All The Time Without Worrying That Something Bad Will Happen Leaving It ON. THIS IS MY OPINION, ON THIS GOOD & STILL RELEVANT TOPIC!
It likely has to do with heat generation and as you said, burn in. Circuitry, wood, and things like speakers, these things expand and cool every time you turn it on and off. Also, the switch itself is a point of failure. It's the same reason servers are left on as much as possible, it's the same reason live audio people at live venues come in and set up, test real quick, then put in standby as opposed to turning off - the wear and tear on the caps with adequately cooled solid state power amps and digitally remote controlled sound reinforcement fixtures from that initial surge of power. Stage hands, local crew, and career concert runners understand this kind of stuff, too, as do electrical engineers. People's concerns with leaving things on is likely from the electric bill, or risk of fire if damaged by a pet knocking things over while they are not home. Some units are prone to overheating, if left on indefinitely. There are other things to ponder or put into consideration with consumers living in reality, as opposed to controlled environments, small businesses, or people having to meet the standards for being on the road with the live entertainment industry. There is no "one size fits all" solution.
Paul....you say the warmed up amp sounds better. Yet no blind a/b comparison??? Youd need to do that first to compare. I'd do it with multiple ears too. Also, not a 73 year old set of ears.
well you've ignored the most important aspect of the degrading of a capacitor (electrolytic), which is heat. makes caps dry out. for example, the big 90ies neve vr recording consoles run so hot, all few years you have channels and sections go out all the time, they were maintenance monster. the even more famous neve 80series consoles from the 70ies,even class a tough, run only a bit warm, after a recapping you have peace for 10-20years. so yeah, depending on the ciruitry, the location and heat sourrounding the cap, the lifespan of a cap varies greatly
hey man, since you seem to be working with audio equipment, may I bother you with a question? should I not turn off my Audio interface and monitoring speakers too?
@@aryanz66 they should not break. but a manufacturer can not do longterm testing when putting out a line of products, they have to rely on proven circuit designs.
@@pongmaster123 hmmmm. Thank you. I guess you're absolutely right. I've never had any of my pro equipment die as their lifespan ends. Consumer stuff tho, have had a few of that
As a Technician for the last 50 years, I will tell you that leaving it on is better because of what is known as SURGE. If you leave in standby then all is up and running. When you power up from off, there is large surges into the filter caps. This surge damages your power supply. lol just listening to you say this... but the major strain is on the semi-conductor such as your rectifiers. There is a second problem with leaving on and that is dust. In standby all fans should shut down or your equipment becomes a very expensive air filter.
I do not agree : 1) All Vintage equipment had turned off button and do sounds good (I know they were class A) 2) Standby only leaves a small part of a receiver running. So it can respond to the remote control really. Everything else is OFF in standby mode that's why it uses very low power. 3) When you turn ON any modern equipment they do not make any noise which means no power to main circuit until you press the standby button so it is wrong to say that caps get short life if you turn off the main. 4) More risk to damage your equipment during a Thunderstorms.. specially when you are not at home. Please correct if I am wrong and sorry for my english. Thank you,
Interesting. So you're saying an option to protect both the caps and the device during a storm is to leave the standby on and flick off the power button on the back? Would that be much different than turning off the standby and then flipping the switch on the back to off for a thunderstorm?
You have seen lightning, haven't you? Now imagine how wide the gap is in switch contacts. Think that's really going to stop a lightning bolt? A million volts is going to jump across there like nobody's business. It's going to look like that Scene in Star Wars where the Emperor was fighting Luke. ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-PqaiKmm8gsY.html
At 22 cents a kWh (todays rate + delivery), it costs about $135.00 a year to leave a 100 watt load (Tube amp at idle) on 24 yours a day. Unfortunately, POH (power on hours) and thermal cycling gets really complicated. Some components are very thermal cycle sensitive, some have a greatly decreased lifetime at high temperatures, some degrade simply sitting unused or powered off, and still others are very insensitive to temperature, POH, and thermal cycling. For example, many capacitors do very poorly in warm/hot environments but are generally insensitive the thermal cycling. Some large ICs with sophisticated power management my develop thermal hot spots leading to failures under certain computing work loads. And tubes running at high temperatures may have thermal cycling issues. It's sort of hard to say that all electronic and electronic components should be left on all the time. Take smartphones for example. They have many 'mini thermal cycling' events spread all over the components in an attempt to save power and increase battery life. Engineering these days should consider these failure mechanisms and NOT require them to be powered on all the time for the sake of reduced failure rates. Such designs are simply BAD ENGINEERING. But hey, this is "audiophile territory" and not engineering.
How much extra electricity does a stand by device use? I love your channel but in this case you are very short sighted..... You claim that you are better of leaving the equipment on. Most your costumers are 45/50 years and older.... They are the ones who are in fact for a big part responsible for the climate problem we see today. When you made this video there where big bush fire problems in Australia, due to that same climate problem. Most of your older costumers including you will not be there anymore when the climate problem will fold out as humans biggest nightmare and problem. You should not learn people to leave their devices on, you should advice against buying A-class devices. You should built more energy saving devices. Not for yourself ore your older costumers but for the generations after us. Those ones have to live with the consequences we leave behind. In my video's I measure every device on power usage. In my house I use only led light. My house will never see a A-class amplifier...If today people start thinking different and behave different in energy and fossil fuel use maybe the next generations can have a good live too.
Future generations; not my problem. No I agree. Also caps stress if turned on with a power surge but also wear out with heat. So either way you will have to replace parts. But turning off saves you enough money to buy those new parts in 20 years.
A McIntosh engineer I know says that they recommend turning off their gear if you're not listening to it. If you wait the 20 years leaving it on just for a dreamed-up better sound by not waiting for warmup, you may save some solid-state devices, but the capacitors are still going to go bad after that length of time. I think that your belief in better sound is psychosomatic. Your brain believes it so it tells the rest of you then that must be a fact.
With computers you have a bootup process, long in screen, etc.. which makes shutting them down impractical. That's computers though. NOT audio equipment. To apply that to audio equipment would be a false equivalence.
In my opinion this is not true. The stress from charging the main filter capacitors during the turn on phase is way less than the stress of leaving the the unit in the ON state indefinitely . Your capacitors will bulge your resistors especially ones in the power supply will become discolored and depending on how hot these parts are the copper trace on the PCB can be affected. Leaving the unit on throughout the day while its in use periodically or constantly is totally fine but indefinitely is not wise at all . There is a very important reason why capacitor manufacturers such as Nichicon , Panasonic and Elna lists the MAXIMUM and MINIMUM OPERATING TEMPERATURE example105 deg C - ( -40Deg C ) , AC RIPPLE Current example 950mA and LIFE of the capacitor which is quantified in HOURS example 5000 hours. . I like Paul and think he a pretty cool and a very experienced guy but , he is starting to sound more like a very strategic audio salesman than a technical person . To all those who don't know that every electronic components both passive ( eg Resistors ) and active ( eg Transistors ) components are affected by heat and will ultimately affect its life and performance of that part , It you want longevity out of your equipment turn it off and let it rest don't follow Mr Paul on this one he is a rich guy . ( Rich Guy is meant as a complement ) .
Hi Paul. I fear the risk of fire. I turn my A/V gear off at the power. There have been plenty of warnings from the fire authorities about this sort of thing. Even though my house and wiring are modern, I fear fire. Especially at night. Can I ask a question? I'm using a remote control power thing I bought form Aldi which plugs into the power outlet and power board plugs into this device. Are these safe? I know your thoughts about purity of power and I am very far from that but what ere your thoughts about safety. Thanks... Bruce from down under😊
I'd be more worried about a remote control socket catching fire than an amp! They are generally powered by a capacitive dropper or switch mode supply. You are at the mercy of the 'build it down to a cost' quality of the caps and if they have MOV's, they are generally very small and they will degrade over time with every voltage spike and turn into nice little heaters. And they are ON all the time! (although I do turn off all my gear at night)
Wait... but for example my Cambridge CXA81 amp is warm-to-hot when I don't turn it off, even on stand by. Are you sure constant heat won't damage my amp over the years?
Turn that sht off! Some manufactures subwoofers have been known to malfunction from being on in standby constantly. When people say things like this they cost you so much more than just falling for bs! Save your equipment and electricity!!
Exception: When you buy a new electronic device, such as a tv or stereo, turn it on and leave it on for 2 weeks. This used to be called "burning it in" prior to solid state devices, when vacuum tube were used, and they needed to be "burned in" for creasing I wont go into here. Today, it's still good way to weed out defects. By leaving a new device on, you are testing, or proofing the equipment for any defective components during normal operating conditions. Then turn it off, let it cool a few hours, then back on. Do this thermal cycle a several times. Any poor comnections, solder joints, bad components etc will usually be revealed, and importantly, during the initial 15 or 30 day return period. Warranties are a pain. If your device passes the above, it will likely last a long time. From then on, leave it in standby mode or follow the manufacturers instructions indicated in the user manual. Note: Ever had a light bulb blow while on? Probably not. They blow when turned on or off, during power surges and thermal shock. In fact, incandescent bulbs are designed to only last about 1000 hours on average, on purpose. They could be built to last 100 years. But the bulb factory would go out of business. You can cheat them, though. If you install dimmer switches in place of on/off switches, your bulbs will last many years. My 6 porch bulbs are 23 years old because the dimmer switch I installed back then prevents initial surges, and lowers the voltage to the bulb.
Ughh, I have the habit of unplugging electronics when I'm not home, especially for days at a time. I'm always afraid of voltage spikes and surges plus usage.
I don't know about this as a universal rule. I have a vintage (circa 1991) Conrad Johnson Mosfet-based power amp that I know draws a lot of power when on. My electric bill usually reflects months when I've played the system a lot - which in my instance might amount to 50 hours during the month. I can only imagine what leaving this amp on 24-7 / 7 days a week would do to my electric bill (or the collective demand for electricity in an era of climate change). That said, I have definitely observed that my Schiit DAC begins to sound better the longer that I have it on. C'mon Paul, as a Boulder resident, aren't you supposed to be environmentally conscious! Love your videos otherwise. My first real audio rig had a PS Audio 4.5 preamp.
There are several aspects to this climate issue. If you leave your equipment on all the time and it therefore lasts longer, you save the environment because there is less electronic waste
Most aliances today are EnergyStar compliant using get, very, extremely little current. In broadcast we never turned off equipment. It just lasts longer because most notably it's at a near constant temperature and at one time heating circuit boards caused flexing and eventual failure. Today's computer-grade electronics are unaffected. Turn it off if you want. It won't hurt it.
Yeah, get pulsed by as many EMFs constantly as possible. Put it all on power strips and shut them off with and a simple flip of the switch...other than the the "smart" technology that will keep running. You are not that important that you cant wait to power up your equipment. C'mon people, use some freakin' common sense. These puppet youtube clowns are laughable. Good day maam.
'm not sure about this. Heat destroys. My current devices lasted longer than my previous ones whether PC or audio devices now that I unplugged them from the wall when I don't use them.
I had an amp at all times as you describe, and it made my caps dry out faster than if I just had turned it off after use. After the first capacitor was destroyed, I started to turn off my amp completely after it was repaired. If you have a very high class A power on the amp the capacitors will begin to have trouble. It does not make it last longer by having it on all the time. So my experience is the opposite that you have Paul. ( I'm not talking about sound quality, because it can well be a better sound quality by having the equipment on at all times, but I'm thinking about component wear and tear by having the equipment on at all times versus power it completely down after use. )
@Fat Rat there's lots of different caps and environments they're used in. So there's no way you can say definitively what's going to happen. This happened to me or that happened to them is purely anecdotal.
@Fat Rat doesn't matter. What happens to you has no bearing on anyone else. It probably doesn't even have any future bearing on you for that matter. It was a unique event. You may have just been running plague caps for all anyone knows.
Just do what the operating manual says. you'll be hard-pressed to find any manufacturer suggesting that you never turn off your amp. it's almost comical then Paul would make this suggestion. and a big thing that he kind of lost over and a lot of commenters seem to be misunderstanding is that standby mode is not the same as powered on mode. some devices well switch to standby mode automatically after a certain amount of time of inactivity. but this is not universal. some devices, like computers, depend on the user settings for standby mode. a lot of people seem to be under the belief that their computer is always on standby mode when not in use, but if you go to your computer and move the mouse and almost instantly you're right where you left off, then your computer was not in standby mode. maybe you're monitor was but your computer was just 'ON'... I do sound/lights at a nightclub, and we shut off our amps after every show. but we leave the DSPs 'on.' they are programmed to enter standby mode automatically. shutting them off risks wiping their memory of our club settings.
I guess you don’t experience damaging lightning strikes and ugly power interruptions from the power company that threaten to destroy your precious gear.
It's barely on. About $1 per year in electricity cost. Just enough to keep your caps charged, so it reduces surge and sounds better faster upon turning it on.
@@LarryB And by leaving a low consumption device on it wön't need replacement for a very long time. Replacing stuff takes a toll on the environment too.
I think most audiophiles listen to their system a lot more than a hour a day. The ones I know have their system playing music most of the time that they are home.
Aug Ren No. What private people do or do not do, is peanuts to heavy industry and even government and office buildings. Even then, the things that would really matter, if only a small amount with private power use, like badly frosted freezers, badly maintained fridges and electrical heaters left on for too long or faulty, is stuff that never gets addressed, because it’s simply too much work and cumbersome. The rest is just virtue signaling from goody two shoe Nancies. Or politicians trying to appeal to naive woman and said Nancies.
I have all my stuff hooked to one power conditioner so I can leave all my switches on and power everything on with my power conditioner so I don't wear out the switches but I don't leave it on I also don't have tube amps only newer crowns
That "warm up time" is most definitley true with power amps. Most modern devices leave the low-voltage/low current circuits on (and the main caps fully or partially charged)
The front end of my system - CD player, preamp, phono preamp - are ALWAYS on, both because of the transient strain Paul mentioned, but also because the equipment does not sound anywhere near as good cold as it does when it's fully warmed up and at a stable temperature. Now ... I DON'T leave my power amps up all the time. They are Mark Levinson ML-2s and they draw fully *FOUR AMPS* each, whether they're playing something or sitting there idle, and no, I'd just as soon NOT have that show up on my electric bill. As for transient problems, I've had to replace two output transistors in the past not quite 40 years. I can live with that!
He is always answering questions when people mention , that they are using PS Audio equipment , or read his boring book . Good luck to have your questions answered to people who have Technics , Yamaha , Macintosh , Parasound etc .
Finally, a human being!! Who believes in the real world!!! This Paul fool!! Believes in this "Snake-oil" BULLSHIT!! By the way, I've got a Yamaha a-s2100 Amplifier!! And I NEVER leave it on standby!! I've recently watched one of his video's, he was chatting about "Expensive" Cables!! He was saying, they matter!!! But, he wouldn't give a "Proper" reason!! 🤦♂️ Shocking, I know. 🤷♂️
Heat is a big enemy of capacitors. If you leave things on all the time caps dry out faster and fail. Properly designed soft-start circuits can minimize the inrush damage. Big amps left on all the time use a LOT of power in idle.
What about the speakers sitting motionless overnight? You need to sell a product that silently works speakers to keep them "limber" and ready for the "warmed up" amps and sources. As if a half hour warm up recommendation in the manual would not suffice. Slick way to save on spendy high quality switches. Unnecessary eccentricity in my opinion.
I agree that my stereo sounds better when left on for long periods of time but have always turned my gear off for fear of “wearing out” my caps. Now that I know that is not going to happen, I plan to become my power company’s new best friend. Thanks Paul, love your passion, love the vids and hope to visit one day soon.
Capacitors are rated in hours of lifespan. Leaving them on will stave off one kind of a failure (that wouldn't impact you in normal use anyways) but not another. Several things are responsible within capacitors for them to do what they do.
Paul uses his imagination sometimes in these videos. It depends on what Class A, Class A/B or what your amp is. Using caps a little all the time is worse than the little startup current, that just gets dissipated in the aluminum case anyway.
@@EnigmaVideos I'm glad I read your comment. I live in Germany and due to possible energy shortages my univesity heats its rooms to 19 degrees C only. Public swimming pools are heated to three degrees less than usual too. Public buildings don't switch on lights during the day if there are windows etc. So I would feel a bit bad for leaving on my amp 24/7 because it could apparently improve the sound or longevity. I can imagine a sound difference between a cold amp and one that's warmed up a bit though.
@@tobiasthiel5291 I'd worry more about hard drives sleeping after 3 minutes. That is what ruined mine. And external drives usually don't have a mode switch. However, it was a Toshiba drive. So take what you will
Great advice. I leave my digital stuff on 7/24. My streamer/clock/DAC has been powered up for seven years. It has a triode output stage which has it's own switch. I turn that on as well as my tube power amps about an hour before I want to listen.
In my opinion the main topic of this video should be electricity consumption. I'm disappointed he didn't even take it into consideration. Does anybody know how much electricity studio monitors (with integrated class D ampifiers) roughly consume on average? I'm not concerned about it for financial reasons but for environmental ones...
If you are concerned about the local environment, when electricity is generated, I recommend you watch Ken Sorensen's lectures on Thorium reactors; no carbon pollution, all waste is self contained.
I usually leave my computers on 24/7. Last year I went away for 2 weeks and decided to shut my my rig off. I left it plugged in and the monitors (2) attached and plugged in but in standby. That combination fried my video card. After 10 years of virtually 24/7 on, my system was done. Finding the particular video card has been an on going search. Next time I will leave it on or unplug everything including power cords
Volt definition Volt is the electrical unit of voltage or potential difference (symbol: V). One Volt is defined as energy consumption of one joule per electric charge of one coulomb.
As long as the fire is inside the steel amp box and there is nothing flamable in reach of the amp, then i’m willing to take that risk. But it’s a waste of energy.
@@davidirvine4294 even the steel cabinets have plenty of vent holes. So no way it's self extinguishing. Yes it will mitigate it, but not extinguish due to lack of oxygen.
While one can make a logical argument for leaving devices powered on (on rush current), your device is more likely fail due to other factors (poor design, weak components, electrical surges) than accelerated stress/wear due to power on events. There are more important things to worry about in life than this. I would suggest worrying about those things rather sweating this question out.
I keep my gear off except for things that need 24/7 power. Modern electronics is stable enough to reach proper operating condition in at the most minutes. Tube stuff takes longer. One major disadvantage of leaving gear on is the exposure to line spikes. If the device is hard off, it can't be damaged except for a direct lightning hit. Unless you use your system over 12 hours per day it just doesn't make sense wasting the power and equipment life IMO. I have two UPS units in my HT. A 3kw for servers and a smaller 750w for house networking stuff and the dish receiver. The 3KW UPS only runs when I need it like when using the media servers. I shut the 3kw UPS completely down when not in use. Why? It's a true online double conversion unit. It consumes 300 watts with no load just sitting there. I don't want a 300 watt load on 24/7. That will add up. Yes I have solar but 300 watts is 300 watts. That's still 300 watts I produced the utility doesn't buy back. So the solar excuse doesn't fly either in most cases.
Personally, I turn it off. But i make sure my tv, sound system, etc. Is put into standby mode first, before switching off the power. You will find most equipment will save this state. So when you switch it back on again, it will turn on in standby mode, instead of coming on immediately. I've found this a safer method in the long run.
My dad was a electrical engineer and when I asked him this question he thought leaving it on was a complete waste of electricity. He also thought it would add to the wear of the electronics. I also asked A.P Vanmeter the head engineer at the old Phase Linear corporation also thought leaving stuff on all the time was a bad idea. These individuals are highly educated individuals. I think I'm going to go with what they say and turn off the electronics when not in use. Which make sense to me for it's the heat thats bad for electronics and I believe heat is accumulative in how it wears electronics. This being said I'm all about minamising the wear of my stereo equipment for it's very expensive to have it serviced.
Your wasting your time speaking science, logic, and sense. These guys go into an argument, knowing the answer, it’s whatever Herr trump , and the Republican Party tell them to think. They have NO room in their heads for truth!
@Norm Macdonald Show Buy a power strip with a surge protector and a on/off tab. A good one will cost $30, but you gain 5+ inlets. :) It saves wear-and-tear on plugs and inlets. www.monoprice.com/product?p_id=15874
@@54tristin Are you going to force your beliefs into every possible situation in life. Not every situation is that deep bro. Most of what we think has been indoctrinated into us from past "systems" or perceived "social norms" of what we are born into. Thinking that Trump or people that stand behind a publicly know party are the "end bosses" is laughable.
This is why I look for clean power surge protectors. It may not ever be perfect but when your using expensive gear I prefer something more than a budget protector. I've heard of amps frying during lightning storms because they went straight into the outlets in some places.
I have Parasound equipment that is 20 years old, has been on for the last 10 years(I bought it used) solid, I never turn it off unless there is a storm. Sounds wonderful, no degradation that I can hear at all, will probably last another 10 years
I used to live near some big electric cable towers (without any issues). And when people would comment about my tube mono amps consuming so much electricity, I would open the curtains to show the towers and say There's a lot more where that came from... haha. That separate cap warmer sounds sweet!
I have a couple of Monarchy mono blocks that are pure class A. I always turn them off, they draw 100 watts each. I have Schiit freay+ has its power switch in the rear, I hate the power switch being there, even if it is supposed to be left on.
He prefer to tube equipment. These ancient equipment need to warm-up at least 1 hr before use. But then again he advised not to use this technique on tube. This is completely bs, not to mention he doesn't care about environment. Hopefully he does leave his car idle in the garage all night because it will accelerate better in the morning.
@@demonreturns4336 He's not going to see any numbers because they would show there's no measurable difference. Believers don't believe in numbers. Ironically.
When you start paying my electric bill i'll leave my stuff on. They put cooling fans in them for a reason...heat kills components .shit is designed obsolescence anyway ....usually obsolete and in need of upgrade by the time it e.o.l. i have this same argument with people all the time ....I think that was a rant because i feel better .😖 still an informative video.thank you
Hello Paul.. i turn my equipment off at the wall because i have an EXPOSURE X pre-amp which i love .. & if i turn it on from the front it will blow the small fuse in my main connection block.. so by leaving my pre-amp on at the front & turning the whole system on from the wall stops it blowing the small fuse .. any ideas from you would be helpful sir.. Paul
If I had tube gear, I'd use a Variac to "soft start" and greatly reduce the surge shock to the components, just as you would do with a vintage radio from the 40's.
Soft starting old gear has to do with not blowing out capacitors that have become unformed over time. Google capacitor forming for more info about what that's all about.
Soft-starting solid state equipment has the same or greater value. It isn't tubes that are harmed by inrush current, but rather capacitors and silicon rectifiers.
use ice power amps, lowest idle powerdraw i know of. or have auto standby feature, 0.5watts is pretty standard. think standby mode if heat enough to make it sound good
In Britain we haven't got money to burn on electrical gear that's not being used. Oh, and I'm surprised some blue haired student hasn't shed tears over your carbon footprint lol 🤭
Paul, would you please make a video on the power consumption of gear at idle, because that's the main concern here. In the manual, it says my receiver is 750W consumption, but i don't see how much at idle or standby. I always try to turn it off when not using to save on electricity. Does it consume more W when I turn up the amp vs lower the volume down?
receivers and everything avr or surround related is known for bad spec sheets. your 750w is probably maximum power draw for a short burst. i agree that idle power consumption is the most important. anything below 1 watt in my use is very common. some amps gets into standby by themself. standby watts is about 0.5 watts on many amps. think idle is about 10 watts, idle is the lowest watts an amp uses when its turned on. most amp uses a lot more. class d that says 90 percent efficiency measure that at high watts because it looks better on paper. have a class d nad d3020 amp here its very hot doing nothing and uses 20 watts i think. playing music at 10 watts loudness whoud com on top of the 20 watts idle coming to 30 watts total, think you can then subtract the efficiency from that volume watts you are using, class d amp at 70% efficiency would waste 30% as heat.
@@sudd3660 thanks for explaining, my receiver is A/B and I keep it on 54/100(i think -28db from 0) volume on idle quite often. Does the power consumption change if I leave it on idle on max volume vs low volume or does that only change the power delivered to the speakers? The amp gets quite hot. At the end of the day, i have no idea how much power this thing consumes and wether is worth it to leave it on vs turning it off
powerdraw from amp increases by how much the speakers draw watts to play sounds. no sounds from speakers and its the same as idle power consumption, all watts then drawn by amp is converted into heat. an a/b amp runs at class a at low watts, basically its the hottest class of amps. idle watts should be high, 40 watts perhaps.
@@sudd3660 so we have standby (let's say 10W), idle (40W) and depending on speakers connected and level my receiver should be 40W to 750W(peak). If the idle for my receiver is 40W and I leave it on 24/7 then that would be about 2.5usd a month for me. That doesn't sound bad at all and if it's true I could just leave it on like Paul is saying! Now I just need to find out how to be sure how much it's actually drawing, i mean, it's considerably hotter on idle vs standby!
go to amp brand website, looks for and pdf you can download or view, there should be something to let you know at least some of the specs you want. it can be a bit confusing figuring it out if its a surround receiver, those have so many parts, amps dac, processing, video conversion doing work even if audio is off.
How about the waste of electric, heat dissipation, potential fire hazard. The spike thing I agree with but with over 20 years of wasted electric you could of purchased a brand new unit. Standby mode for some things like TV's are a must but before leaving the house turn off as much power as possible, it is safer.
My own experience is that there are definitely gains for the first two or three hours, then you're into diminishing returns. That said, when my Quad 57s are used in my speaker rotation, I have to keep those on as they need to stay charged to reach decent gain levels, optimum sonics etc. The argument about caps is moot, because over decades they would need changing anyway.
