In all honesty, foxes are the least aggressive of the canine family. They are less likely to attack you than a dog. They are very skiddish though and will attack if cornered or provoked (like dogs). But they will more than likely run rather than attack. I don't like that the foxes are kept in small cages in this video, but they seem healthier than puppy mills here in the US. I have ALWAYS loved foxes and want one, but I will wait until I know I can properly take care of one. I do not suggest that people go and buy these foxes unless they have educated themselves on fox behavior. They may be domesticated, but like dogs, they will have ancestral instincts. This way, the owner will know if the dog is sick, hurt, happy, upset, etc.
The thing is these foxes have been domesticated through severl generations, if you left them outside the cage they would most likely die within a short period of time. They have no sense of a wild fox anymore, they are not tame they are completely domesticated.
But look at dogs. They have been domesticated for many millennia. I have seen dogs run in packs, circle their toys, and show dominance over one another. They are faint hints of ansatrial instincts but nevertheless they are still there. Any animal that has been domesticated and left outside could die, sad but true. Though there are others that leave and wonder. Those animals will begin to scavenge for food and hunt once they become too tired or hungry.
Well that's purely logic that one shows dominance over another when they still have a personality.. It's not ancestral instincts for a dog to have a personality, they are not suppossed to be freaking lovie dovie zombies you know.
Aw but lovie dovie is the best. I know animals have personality. I have a house full of animals with personality and I love it. I'm just saying that you never know. And it would still be wise to research any animal that one is considering having as a pet.
What a dumb intro. "Is it possible to breed the savage out of the beast?" Uhhh, that's where dogs and cats come from, humans took wild animals and bred them to be more docile.
***** In this particular experiment, they did it with foxes in less than 50 years. Other slower breeding mammals would take longer. Personally, I'd love to see a domesticated lion.
+Hugh Hughes I work at a zoo and we have a few lions and tigers that are domesticated. They love people. They act like a huge house cat. They even try to rub up against there trainer's.
Jaisa MCclain That's not really domesticated. That's tame. I wouldn't really trust those lions/tigers around my children. The process to domesticate animals is pretty simple though, pick the tamest specimens of the species you can find, breed them, pick the tamest of the offspring and breed them, and repeat the process generation after generation until you have a reliably docile breed. Just like domesticated dogs, cats, horses, etc, there would be physical changes that come with the domestication process. Lions would make a good pet IMO because they are social animals (unlike most other species of cats that are solitary). I imagine a domesticated lion would be more like a dog (also a social animal) than a housecat (whose origins are that of solitary wildcats). After a [long] while, you could even have different breeds of domesticated lions with unique features, giant lions, miniature lions, black lions, brown lions, etc.
+Merchaant Many people think foxes bred in captivity are domesticated, which is NOT the case. Domestication takes hundreds and hundreds of years of selective genetics. Breeding foxes for a few years makes them tame, but not domestic. Their genetic makeup, biology and instincts are all still hard-wired in them, and when combined with intelligence, means destruction, aggression, depression, frustration, and fear.
It's not like they have to be domesticated or socialized. There are plenty of dogs that need a good home, especially working dog breeds (sleed dogs, hunting dogs, guard dogs, etc.) that serve a purpose other than to simply amuse the owner.
I see what your saying. I mean a pet fox would be freaking awesome, but I don't like the idea of them in cages their entire lives unless their sold. There are enough dogs doomed to that fate already.
For out pleasure they are great animals. Ideally they'd be left alone totally, not domesticated. The best you can do for any animal is to leave it be. But yeah/ I'd totally want a fox. I am human.
Mark Moore That's a messed up reason to domesticate. Zoos use the same argument. It's all about entertaining humans, not about extinction of the animals.
Mark Moore Let's address the fur and fascist hunting practices, HARD. To take a fox in your home so another can effective shoot the next and wear is a lazy way to care IMO. These fox farms just found a way to profit more that with merely shooting/farming for fur.
why did they not talk about the Russian geneticist Dmitry belyaev who was hired by the fox farm to create the first generations of tame foxes? They wanted a more tame Fox to be easier to deal with for the fur industry, however when breeding for tameness it directly affects the adrenal glands and thus subsequently affects the pigment of the fur which made it useless to the fur industry but created a very reliably safe and fun pet. This is all important information that they should have included
Yes, I was looking for this information! These are not "wild" foxes at all, and in fact couldn't even survive in the wild. The BBC did an amazing article on this - www.bbc.com/earth/story/20160912-a-soviet-scientist-created-the-only-tame-foxes-in-the-world?ocid=fbert
+Amy al That would be a mistake. Just encourages more and more breeding. If they don't sell any then they go out of business. Anyone that buys from these assholes supports the conditions the foxes live in.
These imported domestic foxes from Russia are not only expensive, they are also neutered to prevent founding new colonies overseas. That will forever keep prices high, and gene pools small. If you really want to domestic the fox (the way the wolf/dog was domesticated over 30,000 years ago), you have to allow them to reproduce and spread, and not monopolize the market.
sinder wolf Interesting, and kind of too bad. Why should the wolf (dog) be the only domestic canid in the world? I think it would be nice to have domestic foxes around, too, assuming they are properly cared for.
Suhe Bator LOL ... my children are only as domesticated as my wife and I are. :) Seriously, though, wolves and dogs are my favorite animals, but I think it's cool that there are domestic foxes around, too.
Uh, these foxes aren't exactly "wild" anymore since they behave and almost look like dogs. I don't really see what's wrong here, yeah it's not right to take an animal out of its habitat and put it in a cage, but it's better to be sent there rather than getting killed and be stuffed and used as a fur coat or rug. Think about it, dogs, cats, cows, pigs, chickens, sheep and goats were all once wild animals too so I don't see what's wrong with trying to domesticate other wild animals. It's better for them to be accepted as a family member rather than as a pest that needs to be exterminated...
noname144able Um how are you saving them? They aren't endangered and it's not like by domesticating them your doing them a favor. They are doing this in Russia, not the US, so your not saving American foxes by domesticating them.
no they are behaving like a dog who's spent their whole life in a puppy mill & has no social skills. Amazing that people will pay 8 grand for a wild animal that acts like a dog from a shelter who's spent their whole life in a cage themselves.
***** they were never on the endangered list... do you even read anything before responding? How are you saving them exactly? They spend their whole lives in cages to then go to some rich person who could've just bought an anti social puppy mill dog to save. And this is Russia, not America this is being done. So how are you saving American foxes exactly?
It only seems cruel at first, you just have to give it time. I'm pretty sure if you were to go back in time, you would say the same thing about humans domesticating dogs and cats. Would you rather let them let loose in the wild and be used as a fur coat or a trophy? Or would you rather let them be sold and at least be accepted as a pet? I think it's not right to keep them in cages as small as those seen in the video, but I would rather let them live longer in those said cages rather than them getting shot and be used as the next fashion statement. People like you should give up on your fantasies where animals are left alone in the wild and humans love and protect them because it's not gonna happen. Life is not like a disney movie where everything is kind, friendly, gentle and happy all the time. You should realize that letting them be in the wild won't save them anymore. We humans have done enough damage to the planet and its wilderness that protecting them is not enough since there are a lot of people out there who kill them illegally one way or another either for accessory purposes or money making purposes either way, it's much worse than putting them in a cage and not to mention that we are slowly destroying forests, so letting them live in the wild will only save them for a moment until their habitat is destroyed after a few years to make way for cities or villages
Have you ever seen how commercial chicken or hog farms operate? How about people who raise rabbits in cages for the market? Of course we don't eat foxes now do we? But they are animals none the less.
Salpeteroxid That's the only way to go. If you can raise your own meat, eggs, and vegetables its a lot healthier. Rabbit is very good in my opinion only if you know they are farm raised or wild ones. To many GMO feeds fed to store bought meat.
Larry342516 GMO is banned in my country, also antibiotics are banned and only used on animals that really needs it not as a prevention. My aunt had rabbits, but they were to be sold as pets, she doesn't have them anymore but I don't think I could've asked her to give one to me for cooking ^^
Salpeteroxid We need the same laws here in the US. Hard to believe the FDA allows cancer causing GMO's to be sold. But, the big chemical and pharmaceutical companies are paying to have their products approved. Our government sits back and does nothing to control the FDA. I hope some day things change here. Take care.
These are not wild animals, and they would never survive in the wild if they were to be released. They have been domesticated for generations. The money raised from the sale of pet domesticated foxes helps fund this centre and its scientific research. Biologists have already learned a great deal about the process of domestication from the work being done here.
For all the people that say that this is "inhumane" "cruel" or "stupid", I have a question for you. If you went back in time to the time when people where domesticating dogs, would you stop them? If you say yes, then that would radically change history and possibly ruin lives. If you said no, then you're a hypocrite. This is the same as when people domesticated dogs or cats, only this time humans are trying to make this happen. That is nearly the only reason, and the other ones are insignificant other than now, there isn't much wild left for the animals.
well i doubt that the cromagnam caveman would even understand what we'd be saying anyways. But if you went back to the beginning of slavery would you think you could change their mind about how wrong it is? In any case, people domesticated dogs back during caveman times and in my dog training studies as well as my wildlife and forestry background, its likely that it was mutualy beneficial for wild dogs and humans. Wild dogs followed around humans to pick up bones and scraps from hunting parties and inadvertently led to dog working for humans protecting them from other predators and other enemies. Now we have dogs that herd, hunt, protect, sniff out bombs, work with humans and they thoroughly love what they do. I don't see a fox being any type of working animal and I prefer working breeds because I hunt, have livestock and tend to do more hunting/gathering then just letting my pet get fat and lazy like most humans do. Cats I don't have any use for, but there again cats were domesticated by fat rich people who needed an exotic animal, just like these rich people need an exotic animal like a tiger or lion or fox... The backstory to this domestication of foxes is that they started breeding foxes for the fur and decided they could make money on also selling live foxes.So no, as a dog trainer and someone with a degree in conservation and fish and wildlife, I can't say I'm a fan of this.
even so, domestication of dogs and cats happened over thousands of years. foxes were never domesticated until about 60 years ago. it takes more than 6 decades to completely domesticate a species, and it is a delicate and fragile process that just cannot occur naturally anymore. that is why i feel it is wrong to domesticate wild animals. dogs were used for hunting and protection, as well as companionship, but that was a bonus. foxes are adopted as exotic pets that most people just want to show off and they end up not being able to care for them properly. then it's the rescues and refuges that shoulder the burden
These are NOT actually domesticated, even though they use the term in the video. There are Russian ones, but the video erroneously links those to this case. They're tame, not domesticated.
Last year I went down to Georgia to see my brother graduate from basic training in the national guard. Honestly can't remember which state, but I stopped off at a rest area with a dog walking park and met a guy with a pet fox named Tails. He said he bought him from Russia for close to $10,000 and that 2 years later it was one of his favorite decisions he's ever made. Tails acted like 80% dog and 20% cat and he was perfect. I've wanted one ever since.
Hmmm, turn foxes into pets and lavish them with attention and love...? Or throw them in fur farms to kill them just to make a coat? I would rather have a pet fox. Besides, life in the wild isn't 'freedom', and having them as pets isn't 'cruelty and enslavement'. Life in the wild is all about the constant struggle for survival, which is natural, yes. But many foxes are killed by predators or by natural diseases (because that's the wild for you). Honestly, the cute little buggers are better off as adorable pets...
Indeed a fox is very lucky if it even reaches 3-4 years. And this is basicly the case with almost any animal. Its rare to see an old specimen even more rare seeing one dead from old age.
Ashema Bahumat Sooo, we should release our cats and dogs into the wild? We're not talking about a person here, they have no sense of 'self' like we do.
MayFlower Ann Did I say that? I mean, they can live without us just fine, albeit struggling in an urban environment. I just refuse to look at it with the "They're better off this way" attitude since its literally wrong- they can do fine without us outside of hunting restrictions. And I think them having personalities, being capable of love, and being able to solve/plan out situations shows that there's enough awareness and intelligence there to give them more credit than you did.
I would never get one, but assuming I did & I walked it down the streets of NYC, someone somewhere will walk by with a fox coat & say "Aww, so cute! Can I pet him?" & I'll say "can I pet them, too?"
it isn't bad to kill an animal for its fur. we have been doing it since we figured we needed clothes to keep warm. the problem is that people are killing them needlessly. like to make a scarf that they will wear once or twice. or other useless things like miniature handbags that cost tens of thousands. taking their fur humanly and for very good reason is fine in my opinion but when we kill them as a way to show we are rich it crosses the line.
Kutoki oi you just said " it isn't bad to kill an animal for its fur. " actually it IS wrong. people don't KILL sheep for their wool! they only shave them because they will be too hot in the summer anyway. But killing is NOT an option.
ok, then we needed their skin. I'm not an expert but the killing of animals has played a key role in the survival of man kind. but with the technology of this day and age it isn't necessary. Tbh id much rather live with nature in peace with no killing and infinite peace. but that isnt a possibility.
All this talk about how they're wild animals makes me think, weren't dogs at one point wild wolves and soon bred to be tame? Why can't the same go for a fox?
thats actually exactly what the video said... lol but besides the point of that question. Don't you think humans own enough? when do we call it quits? when do we just let animals be animals and live and evolve the way they are meant to? Isn't it enough we hardly have wolves anymore but we have an over population of dogs? isn't it enough that we have snatched wild parrots out of the forest to put them in cages and clip their wings so they can never fly? i mean seriousl humans are so greedy. thinking everything on earth BELONGS to us. its sad and i want to cry. i wish people would just go get a cute little dog like a sheltie or something and be happy with it. what do we want a fox for anyways? just to be flashy?
There's a dude back in my hometown that actually did that believe it or not. I don't know if he necessarily rides it, but I've seen pictures of him with it with a saddle on so maybe.
***** That's tamed, not domesticated. These foxes are domesticated, in that they were bred specifically for docile behavior and are genetically distinct from their wild counterparts.
Many people think foxes bred in captivity are domesticated, which is NOT the case. Domestication takes hundreds and hundreds of years of selective genetics. Breeding foxes for a few years makes them tame, but not domestic. Their genetic makeup, biology and instincts are all still hard-wired in them, and when combined with intelligence, means destruction, aggression, depression, frustration, and fear.
gladitsnotme by well socialised you mean very casual in their thieving ways. x3 Also it's not comparable, Russia was experimenting. Japan was just being Japan and thought that a cat and deer village wasn't enough.
+gladitsnotme Those foxes are still wild. You cannot train them. You cannot take two of them get them home and train them like dogs, and start a company which sells 'trained foxes that act just like dogs'. Russia did something amazing there in my opinion.
***** not really... Domesticating an animal isn't an amazing feat. Our ancestors have been doing it for centuries. It's simple controlled breeding, selecting for preferred traits in each generation.
***** It's not that amazing, it only takes a few decades. You can likely domesticate any mammal within a few generations, though there's no reason to do it because even a domesticated animal can get agreesive. It's safer to do it with foxes than say a Siberian tiger.
soVia I am sorry what? Humans are born omnivorous which means we eat meat as well as plants we are not abusing animals we are just surviving off our diet given to us by Mother Nature
The fox you bought is tame, not domesticated. It still has wild blood in it, and it not genetically changed over time like the foxes from the institute of cytology and genetics in Novosibirsk, Russia. There is only several of those foxes in the U.S.
This is terrible... Wild animals belong in the WILD! People need to stop trying to tame them and keep them as "pets". Wild animals can never be tamed and never should be! It's just plain greedy... Ugh, this just makes me sick. Those poor foxes... The breeding and selling of exotic pets needs to stop!
Dogs used to be wild animals and pretty much every animal used to be wild until we decided to domesticate it. You say wild animals belong in the wild. Well, many many many years ago, that part of land that used to be your house was barren and considered to be "the wild". Having an "Exotic pet" such as a fox isn't bad and greedy. People as humans were greedy and took land from animals homes. It is only a matter of time til some of us want foxes to be welcomed on their once existing homes
***** How is that not greedy? You're taking them from their homes and acting like you own them or something. Sorry, but I do not believe humans have the right to "domesticate" any other species. And yes, I know dogs used to be wild, but that was hundreds of years ago and there's nothing we can do about that now. Well, I mean, there are feral dogs out there who live just fine in the wild... But some dogs might not. They're used to the house life and living around humans. But these foxes act differently from dogs. In this video, they're talking like if you buy one of these foxes they'll be just like a dog, but that's not true. People should just get dogs and cats for companions and not wild animals. The exotic pet trade is terrible. They take baby animals from their mothers and other things like that. Some exotic pets they sell to people are endangered animals like the slow loris. But people just want them because they're cute and want to show them off like they're some sort of new purse or something. It's disgusting.
Destiny Torres I don't want to be selfish. Only worrying about yourself is selfish. I'm worried about the foxes because what these people are doing to them is cruel. It's just like puppy mills. They're the ones being negative. It's the video that's not positive, not me.
All animals that have been domesticated were wild once, the same is true about these foxes. They are domesticated, not wild and not tame, been bread for over 60 years. They are genetically different than wild foxes they would not survive in the wild. And how is taking care of a domestic fox as a pet, being loved who generally want to be around people, a bad thing? Would you rather these foxes end up as fur for clothes, because thats what would and dose happen. And saying that it shouldn't happen dose not mean a damn thing. So having these foxes as pets and maybe making people think twice about buying a fox skin coat is a good thing.
Actually I have just found an article that states Ron was only tame, but not domesticated: www.popsci.com/science/article/2012-10/fyi-domesticated-foxes Considering his bringing up and the conditions he was kept in, it sounds reasonable. Ron was not really a pet, but a friend of the owner, a playmate. I have never seen him in the owner's arms, or hugged, or anything too constraining.
Even normal foxes are nice and easy to tame, especially if raised by humans. Of course I guess it's even safer and easier with those domesticated breeds. To me, the real mistery is : why hasn't fox domestication been common like with dogs and cats ?
If you research a story litle deeper. Well those foxes doesnt live in a "farm" it's and territory of Genetic Science Research center. And they don't have enough space to keep all of them probably. They researching a way that dogs became domesticated from wolves. And they have three groups of foxes. "Agressive" also selected as a control "wild" group and less agressive (domesticated line). Those foxes who born in domesticated line not only more friendly but more likely to reproduce near to human. Thats why they are selling them. They dont have enough space to keep all the foxes. Thats sad of cource but those animals dont grown for sale. They are part of science research.
They're tame but they are kept in cages almost smaller than rabbit cages. What's the point of being tame if they can't even interact with humans? This is animal cruelty and needs to stop. I don't have a problem with domesticating animals as long as their wild counterparts are kept alive and well, and aren't hunted. But these foxes are being kept in tiny cages all their lives and are sold for crazy high prices for human greed! I can't believe people are buying them when they know they were kept in these living conditions! SOMEBODY SHUT THIS COMPANY DOWN!
+Thoben Carnex No one should be supporting this cruel industry. At least they are not being skinned alive for coats like millions of other foxes, but buying from these assholes just encourages more and more breeding. Don't buy them, they don't make any money and they go out of business.
This report is wrong. The Soviet experiment was not about understanding domestication, it was about breeding more placid foxes on the fur farm (that's what that farm was). The domestication study was accidental. The real interest came with the fact that after a couple of generations, the foxes started developing patchy coats, floppy ears and started barking and behaving like dogs, which was amazing because we had always thought genetic change was a slow and steady thing. It was surprising how quickly wild foxes turned into 'dogs', suggesting the same might be true of wolves (all domestic dogs are descended from grey wolves).
These animals were bred in captivity by fur farms way before the Russian experiment ever began. Cows don't do well living in the home environment, but we say they are domesticated,.
OF COURSE you can breed the 'savage' out of an animal. Have you people looked at your cats and dogs? They all came from wild sources, and they were all domesticated BY HUMANS. A tame fox and a domesticated fox are two completely different things.
Beast? What complete and utter shit. Like any other dog or cat, give them enough love and attention they will care for you back. Dogs were not the same hundreds and thousands of years ago when they first met man. Therefore nothing is different now. Foxes can be a loving pet. I want one.
+techtalk Dogs descended from wolves. Same way as we descended from the first fish that learned how to walk. Don't correct him saying ancient dogs aren't wolves because technically they are.
I've never considered these animals to be truly dangerous ever since one approached me as a child and caused me no harm. It simply left and went about its business.
I feel like a lot of people are forgetting that foxes are dogs too! They're in the same family. Dogs were wild animals once too and I don't see why we shouldn't be able to take care of and love a fox just like any other normal house pet. As long as you keep it in a good environment. I do have to say I disagree with those cages on the farm though. The poor thing trapped in small cages their whole life.
Oh thank God. Because all of the animal shelters are closing due to lack of unwanted animals. We definitely need to domesticate wild exotic pets as vanity items for rich idiots. Good job.
zammmerjammer Yes, it's heartbreaking how many animals are put into the shelters every week, but the population of those animals is ever growing and will never be quelled. There's just too many. Yes, each shelter has a certain housing limit, but guess what? Those are not the only animals out there. There are several out roaming around from the back alleys to the forests in your backyard. If you want to adopt the whole animal shelter, I say go right ahead! I would applaud you for taking on such a task. Stop sitting there behind and a desk telling people that they are a major factor in this problem and get proactive about how you feel. By the way, I understanding your feelings on the matter, but I've always wanted a fox as a pet even since I was little.
I'm part of an animal rescue org have had 6 foster cats in the past year, so I AM "out there taking on the task" actually. And I always wanted a pet wolf, but even as a child I knew that was a pipe dream. What's beautiful about those animals is that they're wild.
All your dogs and cats were wild once. I don't see anything wrong in domesticating a wild animal to become a pet. I understand there is overpopulation of dogs and cats, which is wrong in every specie. These foxes are beautiful and I would buy one. When they are killed for a coat, people don't like it, when they are sold as pets, people don't like it. you'll always complain about something....
+Caitlyn Joys Many people think foxes bred in captivity are domesticated, which is NOT the case. Domestication takes hundreds and hundreds of years of selective genetics. Breeding foxes for a few years makes them tame, but not domestic. Their genetic makeup, biology and instincts are all still hard-wired in them, and when combined with intelligence, means destruction, aggression, depression, frustration, and fear.
+Caitlyn Joys don't believe everything you see on the internet. Of course they aren't showing you the aggressive ones that they wind up putting down. It takes far more than a few generations to domesticate an animal.
This is so wrong. People like to think just because something is cute and fluffy it's okay to stuff into a cage or keep as a house pet. The way those foxes are being cared for is appalling.
many people think this is cruel. Those people probably also don't realize, that if humanity didn't do this to wolves, we wouldn't have dogs. And dogs are great.
I dont think having foxes as pets is cruel IF you do it right. It`d definitely be better than making fur coats out of them. What i do think is that it is wrong how this farm breeds them. Its extremly cruel to keep them in these tiny cages for so long.
I was born and raised in Florida, Been having "Wild Pets" all my life. You can tame all animals some, but you got to know, they are still animals with survival instincts God put in them!!
At $8000 a pop this will mean that there will be a thriving black market of people selling regular foxes as domesticated ones just in need of training as they've all been kept in cages anyway. I remember the original experiment but it's sad that it will just to lead to more misery for more animals at the hands of greedy humans.
This made me so sad. The poor foxes look so stressed in those cages. I hate people who insist on buying animals, especially ones who should be living in the wild.
I have mixed feelings. I would rather see them have a lovely life then as part of a coat. However, what is best for these beautiful animals is freedom in the wild.
I understand where you are coming from but they are actually domesticated foxes (50 year experiment that started in the USSR) so that would be like saying, domestic dogs deserve to live in the wild. These foxes are basically man's best friend part 2
I do not feel they should have never been domesticated in the first place. Especially when their lives start out so bleak and in cages. That is what I am saying.
Carrina H The alternative for their wild cousins is a very rough and tough existence. It is survival through reasonable fear that keeps them away. I think a lot of those animals are going stir crazy locked up. Obviously for breeding only. :( Family life and love is tough on animals too. A good reason why they wander so they only look forward. The face you see with me is that of a part feral local wild cat, who was family to us. We weaned him. Vets were terrified of him. He learned to use commands in English and his later days learned of loss when the tabby next door died, After that only watched, let other animals, (birds etc.) to hop around him in the garden as he basked there. He gave up life a month after my dad died. He knew when I told him "Grandad. All gone". He simply dropped his head, turned around, went under the stairs and just collapsed, he only came out to occasionally eat and go outside to the toilet.
"I would rather see them have a lovely life then as part of a coat." sounds like you'd rather see them have a lovely life and _then_ end up as a coat. I know what you mean though.. it was just ironic and mildly amusing. : )
I had an arctic fox, he was born in capitivity, but he would never stop biting, even after years of owning him and never doing anything to provoke him. Finally gave him to someone else who figured she could tame him.
This doesn't set well with me , for some reason I feel worst about this than I do seeing tamed lions , I think it's because I can sense that these foxes seem like they still don't like it domesticated & all . Even the big cats seem to adapt but these foxes don't seem to be adapting they don't appear comfortable , the lions & tigers basically still trample the humans so they seem cool but this seems a bit over bearing for these foxes not that lions & tigers need to be lounging around in the narrow hall way that leads to the living room either .
Tame and domesticated are two very different things. One is strictly about learned behavior, while the other is genetic. Domestication only occurs to a population of animals, across numerous generations. This is no different from the artificial selection performed on farm animals or domestic dogs and cats. It could be argued that it's more humane than either, since they're breeding for temperament and not for appearance. Google "Russian silver fox experiment" for details on how it was carried out. These animals are not as thoroughly domesticated as cats and dogs, but they're still a long way away from their wild ancestors. They also found dramatic and unexpected phenotypic changes as a by-product of breeding for temperament, like floppy ears, odd color morphs that wouldn't be adaptive in the wild (like black and white in cats and dogs), etc., in addition to shorter legs.
I wouldn't try that. The scientists on the domestication project created two breeds of foxes, the one you see here which is tame and a separate breed that's the opposite, bred to be absurdly aggressive to prove that it wasn't being close with humans that lead to domestication. Which was released to the wild when the experiment was over. Certain groups that sell these things can't tell or don't bother to check which of the two physically similar breeds they have before they sell.
well, im just not sure if it's a good idea to domesticate them...i mean we have plenty of dogs anyway...too many actually...some of them dont have owners....before we domesticate foxes and wolfes we probably should take care of those dogs we allready have.....but dont get me wrong, i love foxes very much....and i want their best.
Van Drare That is a very reasonable opinion. Cats, dogs and other domestic animals need to be cared for first. However, there are just a few hundred of these foxes in existence, they are luxurious goods, costing thousands of dollars each. They are kept as monopoly, because each fox is castrated before selling. There is no easy way around that copyright protection :(
im a woman first of all. well yeah they look happy, but i ask myself if its the right thing to do. because they really are sweet. but like wolfs or certain dogs they have a crazy amount of energy and they need to walk and run often. so people should really think well about it before the get a "pet" that is so "wild"...
I wonder how many of the hippies saying "OH MEH GEHD THOSE POOR WILD FOXES ARE WILD AND SHOULD BE FRRREEEEEEH" actually watched and learned about these tamed foxes and realized they were cross breeded with pet dogs for years. These foxes are almost a completely new type of fox specifically cross breeded to make them good house pets. Don't try and start an argument with a statement deep down you know is right.
+Walter Black No, not entirely true, it's a little ignorant to say all wolves will kill you, you'd just need to be a VERY good trainer it would still be dangerous and you you'd have to make an "alpha" impression. You could also get a low content wolf dog.
you could get a wolfdog ^^ You could be also interested in Kathryn Lord's study about why puppies are better tamed than wolf cubs: www.umass.edu/newsoffice/article/lords-study-may-explain-why-wolves-are-forever-wild-dogs-can-be-tamed It says "why wolves are forever wild", but it contains an information, important for getting a wolf more used to humans :) Good luck in archieving your dream ^^
On the one side I love how the recreated the domestication of a wild animal.On the other side I really don't like the small cages... Isn't it possible to sell these beautiful foxes to somebody who can afford to offer them more space while breeding them?
I've owned a pitbull, friend. And while he was lovable for a long time, he definitely began exhibiting more aggressive habits and we had to put him down. If you learn anything from this fox experiment, particulary the aggressive breed they raised, is that genes can affect behaviour, and some dogs have more aggressive genes than others.
***** My cat is in a shed with a hole in the side for entry and exiting as she wishes, my dog is in my home where he is happy and healthy. A tiny cage in fucking Siberia isn't a great life, is it.
***** the point was they took them out of nature and into a CAGE. They're lives have been made significantly worse by the actions of man. Not true about my dog and cat. Yes, thousands of years ago dogs became domesticated, doesn't mean i need to banish my dog from my home to not support locking up wild foxes in cages for very little gain in scientific knowledge.
How interesting.... It never occurred to me that foxes could be domesticated like this.... I wonder if Raccoon Dogs can do the same thing. The stages of domestication are fascinating.
Dude I love my dog and I think pets in general are great companions. But seriously, shipping animals clear across the ocean in little crates seems so traumatic.
This is exactly the same a puppy mill except with foxes. The sad part is America is creating a market for these animals as well as other countries. Just be happy with a good ol' reliable dog or cat and stop trying to tame non-tame animals.
Stop just stop if someone wants one why can't he? That shits annoying it's like someone telling you ,you cannot do what you really want to do you're biggest dream could be a reality, yet theres someone saying no,thats why our world is in chaos over ruled over lawed, its a animal it only cares about eating sleeping staying alive, dogs and cats are smart why us, foxes lions tigers bears can all be done the same way, too if people have the money and the time and it is not hurting you then stop .
Yeah it's alright while you are alive, then what happens when you die? The animals are then put down, do you think they would want that? D o you think it is fair that a long ranging animal is kept in a small cage to live out its life because it's too dangerous to be controlled..but you wanted it to boost your tiny....ego? See Brad that is the problem right there, life is not about what you want. Hopefully one day all the wild animals that people are keeping in America will take them out and stupidity will no longer be part of the human race.
If more and more people take foxes as their pets, maby at some point it'll finaly end making these animals into coats, because people would better have a pet fox than coat made out of foxes. And that would defintly be good for them. I, personally, would like to have a fox as pet, but I, m from Europe and in the country I live I can't get fox as pet, but I hope in the future it will change.
Neo TSV first off, people (sadly) are still going to skin them, and when I own a fox myself it is not for some shitty ego, actually screw my ego, I am going to own a fox to give me and him a wonderful life and if I die I will make sure he wont get put down and live his life, and like Baiba Strode said, more people having them as pets means less hunting them for fur which would greatly increase their population. but it wouldn't be a prop by making them domesticated because their is so much of them, though their numbers are decreasing. I know I sound like an animal activise (which im not, check my google and instagram account at mitch_snitch1) but this is good, just maybe lowering the price of a fox and let states unban them
Neo TSV See that makes you no better than anyone else,we are masters of this planet caretakers as well for ego? I want a fox as a friend not for my ego,Too often we see and hear people fight for animals often times than not a animal is better fed than humans why because people care more for a animal than a human because the human can take care of themselves we say,yet we see homeless people fighting to stay alive we think oh they do drugs or this and that but more often it's because of how he was treated or had a parent who did not give a damn, Animals can take care of themselves yet we take care of them when we should be helping fellow man alot of people are sadistic towards other man why because of fear, not knowing,not caring that is what is disgusting about the world forcing ideals,laws instead of compassion and caring offering help that is what is going to wipe us out,not animals that is sad too.
***** Then, pray tell, what were they domesticated from? Cats were domesticated in Egypt yes, but around the world as well. And I am pretty sure they didn't domesticate tigers and then the tigers shrank.
how is this different from a puppy mill?!?! As much as I would love to have one, I don't believe in keep something in a cage that small. If were normal kennel runs It can be a lil easier to say your a breeder
I dunno. The cages are indeed on the small side, but the foxes seem to be in very good health and mood considering how beautiful their coats are. My guess is that they have a much larger space for exercise and are at other times kept in the cages so that they won't mate randomly.
Yeah, but the mental and physical health go hand in hand, as they do with cats and dogs. Happy foxes have fine pelts in the same way that happy cattle tastes better than poorly treated animals do.
Also, fun fact: not mentioned in this video, in the same experiment the Soviets also bred all the most undesirable traits into another group of foxes, creating a group of hyper-aggressive, bloodthirsty foxes. Because what's a Soviet science experiment without a cartoonishly sinister, mostly pointless, side to it? But hey, domesticated foxes: incredible what science can do.
+Yasmin Martinez or you could just leave them in their natural habitat. You might as well be saying " slavery has to start somewhere" what an ignorant comment.
"It's wrong to domesticate foxes! God and religions and morals beliefs blah blah" Me: but what about dogs and ca-" "SHUT UP THATS DIFFERENT BECAUSE GOD AND BLAH BLAH"
1cjtate No there are comments like that. It's been awhile and i don't remember which exact videos those comments are in. But you can find videos of domesticated foxes and someone will bring up how wrong it is and bring up religion. The most common one's are people saying they would kill it, how sad the fox looks because its not "with its kind", how cruel it is to force it into being a pet (what?) and so one. I have seen one's of people saying something along the lines of "they are wild animals, god never made them to be tamed" and so on. You just have to look for them
For the people who are against owning a wild animal as a pets should just shut up because all animals even your pet cat and dog were once wild I don't see anybody complaining about that. I prefer these beautiful animals to be someones pet than someones fur coat or rug.
Still are slaves though. If they aren't free to run in the wild and have their balls cut off they are slaves. Some are just treated better than others.
ryan johnson Exactly, when he says slave i think of a stressed out and malnourished dog, which sounds more like a stray dog to me. Most dogs love the company of humans and enjoy the mental stimulation. The only dogs i would consider slaves are service dogs and lab testing dogs.