The maw has to be the worst zone they've ever done. I even got that corridor creeper mount from the twisting corridors THE DAY it came out. I was sick and literally did it all day. I hoped it would make the maw more bearable being able to mount... it didn't. Then 9.1 came out and that mount collects dust 😂
@@DefinitelyNotDefinitiveGames It's just the ingame mechanics. ^^ There are some zones in WoW where you can't fly with your mount and The Maw is one them. But there are other creatures (NPCs) who can fly, so the owl will also be able to.
Fun fact: From start of the expansion to the finish, the Jailer had roughly 37 lines of Dialogue, that's it. He was a tremendously boring villain, and ultimately entered and left the story with a wet fart of worldbuilding, having stolen most accomplishments of most other villains from the Lich King to Sargeras as part of his "grand scheme" only for that all to amount to nothing except a vague overture that there's a 7th cosmic threat, but never confirming anything regarding it. It was also maybe the third or 4th time we've had "This villain is a well-intentioned extremist trying to save the universe with desperate measures", and maybe the 3rd layer of a well-intentioned villain turning out to be trying to stop what ends up being ANOTHER well-intentioned villain.
That's not entirely accurate anymore. The new Golden books makes clear that Arthas acted on his own and therefore against the jailors plan. Besides that, yes the jailer was prolly the worst villain. Sadly, I do not expect Gaunter O'dimm levels of villains in WoW or any MMO in future. :(((
Having a certain number of lines means nothing. He is far more fleshed out than any other character in the expansion. You just choose to ignore it and use facts that are irrelevant to your point
@@cptvtd-gg ah yes they retconned the legacy they didn’t write to fit their terrible narrative and lessen and destroy the lore from before. Just because it “works” now doesn’t means it’s good writing. The fact that 90% of the story is in the books confirms this. WoW isn’t a novel series, it’s a game. The story should be in the game.
@@DeeFourCee whats wrong with you. why so salty? I didn't say anything about that. xD I just said, that the detail he mentioned was not accurate. xD In no way I defended anything xD whats wrong with you mate.
Not most, the minority that got as hobby to hate on everything. They can't judge anything, since they don't even play the game and only watch cutscens out of context.
@@miriamweller812 I think most is a pretty appropriate statement. Especially since we've watched every bit of story telling from Warcraft 3 become retconned this expansion. Shadowlands had great story telling potential but, the ball was dropped and many can see that.
@@miriamweller812 Definitely most this time. I agree that wow community is EXTREMELY negative but the lore in SL has been pretty much a bad marvel comic + people are tired of Sylvanas being the main character of Warcraft.
Every game community has its negative people, in games with competititive systems, these people tend to be the ones who have been stuck in silver for 4 years and blame it on the game's balance, but in wow's case, these people are everywhere, as there is no ranking system
Love your reactions as always. But as a long time Warcraft/WoW player and fan, the Shadowlands was a dumpster fire of horrendous writing and mangling misuse of long time major characters across all of Warcraft's history. It had so much potential. But all of it was wasted on a narrative built on the foundation of trying to retcon everything into this shiny new big bad major villain. A villain who had no development, no inherent motivation, no personality and no interesting qualities.
It's fodder for lots of "Sylvanas gets to do Maw daily quests for Eternity" jokes, but I think they pulled off a satisfying conclusion (for now) for Sylv. The Maw no longer has a Jailer; it has a Custodian. Ok, Sylvanas is the Maw's janitor. But hey.
Guess you never heard when they said the Maw wasn’t always a Hell... but was made a Hell when Zovaal was imprisoned... he wasn’t the jailer of the Maw instead the Maw’s biggest inmate. Apparently they tried their best to punish and redeem even the worse souls but when they made the Maw as it is now with Zovaal, they began directing those they couldn’t redeem there to be eventually destroyed and their anima be recycled to the Arbiter to send into countless afterlives hence why they had those mana pods to feed the reincarnated souls and themselves but then Zovaal began to redirect it to Torghast where he languished and began his work with the Anima Drought.
The two elf women she looked at before jumping in are here sisters, Basically the only people who never fully gave up on her when she didnt have a soul
Story telling is fine, you are just used to shit story telling with cartoonish characters and absurd story. Rule of cool is okay, but it's not good story telling, it's just rule of cool.
@@miriamweller812 Miriam, the story is really bad, if you and your friends like it, fine, we are happy for you. But almost everyone is talking about how bad the story of this expansion is, even many pages have made post about how the community hate the story telling of this expansion. I repeat, if you like it good for you, but you cant deny the VAST mayority of the community hates the story of the game right now, it's a fact.
@@pence089 Explain what is bad. See: I listen to people who are not assholes about it and they got no prob to understand it. I see it myself and it's quite a lot of good work to keep things over such a long time together and even improve it instead of just creating more plot holes, something most 90 minutes stories do not even manage to avoid, even less a two decades story. When I see the "everything is shit" crybabies, those generally do not give ANY reason at all for that judgement, or they make up some bullshit that is not in the story at all, like "Yeah, sure, good Sylvanas is back, all forgiven" or "Yeah, sure, the Jailer just controlled everything" and alike. So just stupid nonsense and with that level of hate, well pretty much EVERY story sucks. Most beloved stories got big problems with logic anyway, for example the whole Star Wars Empire is pretty much idiotic and pure cartoonishly evil - who detonates whole planets for example? Now add someone to it, who even makes up stupid stuff on top of that and something endless millions love is just dumb crap. People like the Star Wars story (and many others), because they ignore many stupid things in it and that's fine, SW does not even try to be deep anyway, it's a fairy tale in space. While in WoW people hate on it, because they simply WANT to hate it.
There was so much about this which was disappointing/anticlimactic, there was so much build up to Arthas returning, all to be a blue LED, Jaina and Uther had next to no reaction to the last part of the soul of someone who they both used to love, the Jailer was just made up out of nowhere and has been made out to be this mastermind behind a lot of major things that have happened throughout Warcraft's history, which falls flat for me because there's never been anything in any of the older expansions that eluded to there being this supposed almighty and powerful mastermind behind the other masterminds, it just seems like one big sloppy mess to me
Thing is what buildup was there to arthas returning? we had litterally no build up. Also both uther and jaina put their greivences with arthas to rest long ago, uther during the questing experience and jaina back in BFA, so there is not much for them to say anymore really.
Well, in terms of build up I mean with stuff like the Bastion cinematic, and all of these parallels that people have been pointing out with Anduin and Arthas, with the whole mind controlled deathknight look, to the siege of lordaeron cinematic where they basically remade Arthas’ return cinematic from W3 but with Anduin and the others instead, with people knowing that there’d be many returning characters in the expansion, me, my guildies and friends didn’t think it was too far of a reach to see Arthas (and even Garrosh) to have more of an appearance considering they were in those initial zone promo cinematics, and I know what you mean about the fact that Uther and Jaina rested their grievances, but I’d still have thought that they’d show a bit more emotion/have more to say at least
@@forcedge2302 You know the people who were doing the abuse were the people who had been with the company back when it was formed and were fired a couple years ago right? Its not a "new thing in 2022" its a thing that went on from the early 2000's to recently.
“Death would be a merciful ending, Tyrande” - Sylvanas Windrunner These writers are unqualified to write for Warcraft. When Arthas (The Lich King) died, Sylvanas threw herself off of Icecrown. On her way down, the valkyr arrived and showed her the hell that would await her in death. She was terrified, and one of the Valkyr took her place in death. She’s tried to escape death since then, until now it seems… These writers have destroyed this game since the end of Garrosh’s reign as Warchief…
Basically The Jailer Divided the Cosmos for his end goal which was to ..... unite the cosmos....... yes the story is utter garbage that they wrote in Shadowlands to the point that if our character canonically woke up and thought it was all just a bad dream the entire fan base would cheer with joy
It's actually pretty cool to hear Sylvanas of all people calling Andin's name in concern. What people doesn't seem to get is that, when Arthas killed her, he fragtured her soul, so the Sylvanas we've had since has been fragtured. She'd lost her compassion, her empathy, her "humanity" for lack of a better word. The Jailer returned that fragment to her, and now she is whole again. So now that she has regain her "humanity" she feels regret, shame and all sorts of emotions again. This is the real Sylvanas, who she was before Arthas stabbed her. And while she has done a lot of bad things that needs to atone, you can't blame he entirely considering the part of her she had lost and she wouldn't have done any of that, if she'd had that part of her soul. I'm actually excited to see where her story goes from here.
If you want good recap on why people don't like shadowlands lore. There is good video made by Platinum wow called "The Problem With Shadowlands (What Makes Warcraft Lore Good?)".
I feel bad for them watching the cliffnotes when the people who playued it are jsut as confused. we DONT know what the jailer was talking about. we DONT understand why sylvanas did what she did or what she thought to gain. The ambiguity of this story is off the charts and is NOT fulfilling. Arthas got turned into an Emoji and is gone, and we all want to know why the hell any of this happened.
We dont know what the jailer was talking about = true, but that is because it is coming We dont know why syvlanas did what she did or what she thought to gain= yes we do, its literally in the cinematics we saw at the start of the expansion when she is trying to convince anduin to join her.
@@RazanaArcclaw join her for what? we have zero idea what she hoped to gain or what it looks like. WHAT does the universe even look like without life or death its all just a concept theres zero tangible story here sorry about it.
@@Cheezeblade Gotta read the Sylvanas novel to learn her motivations! IMO it does actually explain a fairly reasonable motive for why she initially joined Zovaal, but doesn't excuse it. Which is itself yet another massive criticism of the WoW storytelling when very important plot details continue to happen in out-of-game media that costs money.
I think the Jailer was very poorly managed and wasted. I believe that going beyond the veil of death and the afterlife had a lot of potential but it did not materialize. Sylvanas's destiny, considering all things, I think it's not so bad, I would say it's satisfactory, in a kind of middle ground. It makes enough sense and is much better than "we forgive you once again for no reason" or "die, die, die". Sylvanas, hell janitor isn't exactly what expected but at least it makes sense and has potential.
Sylvanas' judgment is honestly the best possible outcome of the story. There was a lot of skepticism about how that would end and honestly, everyone thought no matter what they did, it would end up pissing off a huge portion of the community, given how divisive the character has been. However, it was as excellent as it could be and kind of ended up being awesome for everyone. For Sylvanas' enemies... She is getting a pretty harsh punishment, and being made to clean up the mess she made, in one of the worst places in WoW. Actually, there is a big joke about the harshness of her punishment. The players experienced the maw first hand, doing quests to rescue souls ourselves there while traveling that hellscape on foot. The maw is widely regarded to be one of the worst player tortures this game has come up with, so knowing that Sylvanas will be basically doing what we did for years to come is quite satisfying. It would have killed the mood of the moment but if Tyrande had added "AND YOU CAN'T USE ANY STEEDS" I would consider the punishment too severe. For Sylvanas' loyalists and family: They get to hope that Sylvanas will one day return a better person and the fact that she is not dead kind of means one day we will need her again. as for me? Tyrande saying goodbye to her owl gets me the most, she has been one of her loyal companions since 2002, and would not hesitate to wipe the floor with anyone who tried to harm Tyrande since vanilla WoW. Goodest girl Elune-Adore Dori'thur, you will be missed.
I revisited your WoW Journey videos as a retrospective. An interpretation I've settled for Sylvanas waking up is a full circle moment of 'Afterlives: Bastion' & a redemption of sorts for Uther dooming Arthas to his fate. Like Tyrande, breaking the cycle of vengeance. The Arthas he punished was no longer controlled by the helm of domination. I think a parallel can be drawn to a lot of them willing to punish Ranger-General Sylvanas as collateral damage for their satisfaction of seeing the Banshee Queen in eternal torment.
Shadowlands might possibly be the worst expansion of all time but I think we can all collectively agree seeing Saurfang and Varian was the highlight of the expac
Arthas not only had 2 full length campaigns in W3, but he had an active part in his expansion. Arthas was there and we saw it. There was a dungeons where you actively have to run away from Arthas with Sylvanas because you can't even touch Arthas. The wind around him will literally kill you. The Jailer had about 35 lines of dialogue over the whole expansion and almost all of them were just saying reality is stupid. Horrible villain in an expansion riddled with horrible choices that are hard to believe anyone who actually plays the game would make. To make matters worse Blizzard blatantly lied to us and in one case where they couldn't hide anymore the game director literally said "I didn't lie. I just told everyone what they wanted to hear." WTF?! It's unbelievable. For a while now most expansions have had 3 major patches and Shadowlands only has 2 and this is the final patch. They are now claiming they only planned 2 from the beginning. It's another obvious lie and there's so much clear evidence from the bad story that somehow got more bad and rushed to the out of game legal troubles and walk outs they've had + delayed patches and employees leaving at high rates to go work for the former founder of Blizzard at his new studio. This expansion reveal better be god tier cause they are seriously out of options at this point. They're bleeding to other MMOs too much now to sustain the half assed horseshit they've gotten away with. Especially on the finances. Full priced expansions, a monthly fee, and an in game store. Talk about greed.
Yeah we keep hearing that Final Fantasy 14 is king mmo right now. Another huge franchise we need to get into regardless but it’s a style we are less familiar with than this fantasy style
the current narrative lead steve denuser, seems to have a huge grudge towards the old guard of blizzard. the way he has handled the original characters, like arthas, who is probably the most beloved character in the entire franchise, is just down right insulting. I honestly can't believe he did arthas this dirty. arthas is barely mentioned, never shown, and then literally dissapears from existence, while his queen sylvanas, may aswell have looked right at the camera and told us to forget about him. it makes me worry about the future of the game, shadowlands was the last passed down storyline from chris metzen, from here on out, its all from the mind of denuser, who might i add, thinks game of thrones season 8 was brilliant. 👎👎👎
WOW storytelling went to shitter, its so disapoionting, so shallow - they explain NOTHING... things happen and characters appear for no reason they decided to milk playerbase and put ony small bits in to game so that you have to buy books to have a glimpse of how things are supposed to work, yet they are so disapoionting sylvanas is so badly damaged as character that i had literally zero expectations about her judgement, i was awaiting a flying saucer kidnapping her but at least in this one regard they didnt fail us AGAIN even blizzard employee (main loremaster) left company recently, its SO BAD i pray that next expansion (wchich weill be announced in 11 days will AT LEAST BE MEDIOCRE because problems started with battle for azeroth, and shadowlands in case of game systems, content release schedule, story was the worst expansion ever
They do have platinumWoW on the radar if I remember correctly, but nobbel unlikely, while his videos are good lore dumps, they dont make for good entertainement, they are more akin to reading a wiki article, so while they are great for learning the lore, they dont really work well for "reaction" content, as it would just be them sitting there for 40 minutes with blanks stares absorbing information and not talking as to avoid talking over and missing info.
i feed sad for arthas. they just ruined on of the best written caracter on the entire lore. arthas was never evil. he decended slowly.. you know that sayin : the road to hell its paved with good intentions ? that is arthas. and the story it was amezingly written to the point if you play the game you actually root for arthas even when he is not the most good of all ppl, because his intentions where good. and there is that line that he crossed but its so tinned and so good writhing you barely even see it until its too late. when arthas becomes pure evil its already in lich king grasp. so who is to blame really ? they could have easyly turn to sometin like next lich king instead ruined it with no emotions shown. its just sad.
Arthas is clearly an evil person... At least after the human campain in Wc3. And even before that you could see him as an arrogant ass. Books make that very clear. Its a good thing, that they ended his story this way.
Kinda disagree. The Jailer, however badly written it was, never forced anyone to do their choices until he was free. It was more "push someone here, push someone there, and let the rest unfold". While being more or less in the design the Jailer envisonned, Arthas choices were his own. His story being part of a bigger plan dosen't diminish the story in itself.
the Anduin scene with Varian and Saurfang was basically 1-1 Copy from FF14. What a clown writing it has become in the game. If you wanna understand more, you need to buy the new overpriced books. What a memeshow
If you guys are interested in more of the lore. I would recommend watching the Warcraft 3 story, it provided a lot of the world building foundation that WOW is based on. It is also the main lore of the Lich King and Arthas.
the problem with shadowlands writers was a huge mistake full of big hole plots. the history was very bad. and the ending of this boss was very stupid. sylvanas story too.... a lot of mistakes.. i hope blizzard fix this problem on the next expa. ps: the 19 of this month they gonna release the date of the new expa and gonna show us the intro cinematic. :D.
yeah The Jailer was basically Thanos, a poor copycat at that, the Story this expansion has been the weakest in all the game's history, it can only improve in the next expansion.
I hate the maw because you can't mount up and almost everything is aggressive. The game play for shadowlands expansion was crap. Hopefully blizzard learns from their mistakes with the next expansion and not do the borrowed power crap.
The Maw Sylvanas jumped into is basically Warcraft Hell. Sylvanas was working with the Jailer to send all souls to Hell as a source of power for the Jailer. So the judgement is to basically scour all of Hell and rescue the tens of thousands of souls she sent there. Unfortunately you haven't missed as much as you may think. Shadowlands has been a lore nightmare...It cheapened a lot of existing lore with unnecessary addons, and with an utter lack of proper exposition most players had absolutely no idea what was going on in the game either (Even those of us that are lore fanatics barely have any idea of what was happening with how much of a mess they made of the narrative in this expansion.) That said, what the Jailer seems to be referring to at the end is this, and note a lot of this is inferred speculation because we do not have all the answers yet: The cosmos of Warcraft is made of opposing forces. Order opposes Chaos, Life opposes Death, and Light opposes Void. These cosmic forces are the foundation of all reality, in a system of checks and balances. A seventh force is lurking however, in the Shadowlands we came across creatures referred to as Devourers that, as their name implies, consume all things, all reality even. They appear to come from outside of our reality, from a dimension between the perceivable reality. There's been Doomsayers in WoW for years who talk of prophetic nonsense and babble incoherently but they have spoke of a great serpent in the dark devouring stars etc. This seems to be reference to the leader of these Devourers. Long and short The Jailer seemingly saw these creatures and came to the conclusion that with the forces of the cosmos operating in balanced opposition to each other (The denizens of Light and Void, the Void Lords and Naaru even seem to be in outright war with each other and have attacked other spheres of Death, Order, etc.) it will only be a matter of time before the Devourers literally consume everything unopposed. So he was attempting to use the reality building engines the First Ones made to create everything to actually rewrite the reality of the entire universe to be something different and cohesive, effectively erasing things such as Life and Death as a concept for example. Next WoW expansion will have it's announcement on April 19th.
@@DefinitelyNotDefinitiveGames it’s probably the best outcome of a bad situation, that situation being the current state of wow story telling…but what’s worse is in the novel it states that Sylvanas WANTED to go back to the Maw so even in the end she is doing what she wants because she wants to find her dead lover. So is it actually a punishment if she actually wanted to do it?
To play Shadowlands over and over and over again. What a horrifying fate for Sylvanas. Considering the Shadowlands has been functioning for quite a while there are a LOT of souls condemned there, factoring in the corruption of Revendreth’s system and all the souls killed during the war against the Legion and the 4th War.
Words cannot express how awful this expansion was epsecially in the story department. The way they basically said "Hey this is the last remaining part of Arthas, the guy who arguably made Warcraft into what it is today and is basically the most popular Warcraft character ever and we will do our best to completely forget about him and make him as insignificant as possible." It basically represents 2022 Blizzard, basically forget about the past when we had talented people who actually give a shit about the story and the game and now embrace this retcon filled mess of a story and less and less fun gameplay. I we can all agree that the best part about this epxasnion was that it finally ended. :D I'm not holding out much hope for the next expasnion becuase as many people have already said in the community: In order to get people hyped for this game again and get them to play it, you must first completely change the company of Blizzard as a whole as the people currently working there have no idea about good game design or good story telling. Also you need to completely rebuild the game and get rid of a bunch of universally hated features they added in recently, especially in Bfa and Shadowlands. So as long as that dosen't change, there is no point in hoping for a good expansion becuase Blizzard has already proven time and time again that they can't deliver in their current state. Even though I have officially joined the millions of players that have left this game some time ago now, I still wish the best for the game and want it to be good but major changes are needed and i lost hope in Blizzard long time ago, the recent controversies of sexual harassment and unequal pay among Blizzard employees were the icing on the cake basically. Once Blizzard was looked upon with so much love by the fans and the gaming industry. They were basically gamers making games for gamers. But now, Blizzard is universally hated in the gaming sphere and is compared to EA and all the other scummy and money hungry companies. It's just sad and honestly heartbreaking.
That's honestly as close to perfect a summary as I could ever get to myself. Can't even think of anything to add that isn't just details. Like nuances in the gameplay, destroying the integrity of the in-game rewards for more profit and sacrificing the story to instead have devs "moralize" the playerbase with politics and anti-consumer jargon. Many/more upvotes deserved!
Better to have him peter out and die then try to mess with his story and make him into a main character again. Arthas was such an amazing character who ended amazingly, trying to do anything with him would just be criminal, so best to just leave him as is and have his story end once and for all. Also it is funny how you bring up "When we had talented people" but at the same time bring up the controversies, when the people you say are talented are literally the people named in the lawsuit...
@@AceofHearth If that headcannon makes you or anyone else feel better then go ahead. I myself Try to think of Legion as the end of Warcraft’s story. But since I still play the game despite having hardly any hope for the future, I’ve got to put up with the actual story that is being presented.
She was our first “in” for World of Warcraft so will always have a special place in our hearts for that even if we didn’t end up liking her for what she did 🤗
I too like many other played WoW around 2005 and I stopped playing roughly 2 months into the release of Shadowlands. From I've read in the comments of this video, it was a great choice to have stopped playing 2 months after Shadowlands release. Thanos from WISH, LOL. Oh man...how I miss the old gaurd of Blizzard. That's why a lot of the story has gone down the drain.
it's cool how you're kinda more specialists than the average wow player, regarding the lore after viewing every cutscene, and yet you didn't play the game at all (or did you ?)
In case you guys didn't know. The 2 women Sylvanas glanced back at at 17:45 are her sisters. Alleria, the blonde one in green and gold being the oldest, and Vereesa, the platinum blonde one in white and blue being the youngest. Sylvanas is the middle sister.
Still pissed off in what they did to my boy Arthas, he was literally a victim like Anduin and i guess sylvanus yet he's treated like that... didn't even get to see him interact with Uther or Jaina or even his father lols.
I recommend you watch the hearthstone trailers. These are a lot of small funny trailers for a card game based on the Warcraft universe. A lot of add-ons have been released for the game, a trailer has been made for each of them, viewing them all will take about an hour and a half, maybe less. Thanks for your work)
In case noone ever mentioned it, Azeroth, the main world in Warcraft is basically an infant Titan still in her egg/planet/thing. And she's not just any Titan, she's the strongest Titan yet. Sargeras, the leader of the Burning Legion, wanted her dead if not on his side and he had to do it before she could be born. Why? Because if she was born or worse, corrupted by the Old Gods and then was born, she would completely body him, his Legion of Demons and probably all life in the universe if she was corrupted.
@@DefinitelyNotDefinitiveGames It's the main reason why so much happens in and around it. The Void Lords sent the Old Gods to corrupt her, Sargeras wanted her on his side and if that didn't happen he wanted her dead. The Titan Pantheon put the Titan-forged races to protect her (Vrykul,Dwarves, gnomes) and her latent power is what attracted Zobald, the underwhelming Handsome Squidward/Thanos wannabe in Shadowlands.
Such a weak ending to the expansion. The cinematic with Anduin was great up until the point Arthas appears. It was such a poor send off for such an important character. Arthas' soul was taken by Frostmourne the moment he picked it up, which is I suppose similar to what happened with Sylvanas and Uther's souls been split. Instead of a satisfying conclusion, we get him as a blob of anima that does not get to say anything, gets monologued to by Sylvanas and neither Jaina nor Uther say anything. Just disappointing... Great reactions and discussions though!
The way they treated Arthas in this has broken any interest in continuing with Warcraft for me. They screwed up his legacy royally and just told us 'we don't care, forget him'. Sure, I can forget you while I'm at it.
unfortunately it's not that you haven't followed the story quite enough to fully understand what's really happening but that the new team made a terrible job with the story. It's the end of an expansion and players still have the same questions from it's beginning.
As much as I typically like the World of Warcraft story, the Jailer's death was kind of disappointing to me. There's an interesting theory that states that the Primus (the last one talking to the Jailer before he got Jailed, who, interestingly, does not have a cinematic model) is really evil and was controlling the Jailer the whole time, but we don't know yet. I did like the other cinematics, though! Also, the new expansion is being announced on April 19th!
BTW with the amount of souls that are there due to her actions, she is going to be there for a very VERY long time. Countless millions were down there since her and the Jailer intervened with the previous Arbiter.
It's interesting to me how "Illidan went out dancing with Sargaras" the cause of "Demon invasion" And Sylvanas went out with Arthas which is "The Jailer" Cool duo of opposites yet same.
Almost the entire player base hates this ending, depending on what they reveal later this is almost unsalvageable and most people just want the next expansion to be on Azeroth and disconnected from the Shadowlands. There are a few theories about things that haven't been revealed yet but nothing is certain.
They forgave the Sylvanas due to her fractured soul, but not poor Arthas for being manipulated and corrupted as well. What makes it worse is that she was the one to do the send-off the way no one wanted to hear. I would have been stoked to see a Arthas pseudo redemption. I'm definitely not hyped to go through any more expansions with Sylvanas, she had plenty of time. There was still good trapped within Arthas. If only his companions back then had the means to pull him back like they did her. You can say they at least learned their lesson and used that to help Sylvanas at the end.
The lore in-game didnt make sense because stroytelling was very bad this expansion , maybe cause of covid and cut content , but the book that got released recently makes the story very good and much more interesting The Jailer is explained there since he had nearly no screen time in game and makes him an interesting charachter, but yeah the story telling in game was very bad
Zovaal would have been a much better villain if he had just been a bitter power hungry baddie. The "there's a bigger threat" thing kinda waters it down. He should have just been power hungry and bitter that his siblings didn't join him and decided to rally together to imprison him. Sometimes mustache twirling evil is the right way to go.
Personally the lore was great in Shadowlands all the way up to this chapter. How Anduin freed himself because of ghosts, and the 'mystery' of the Jailer being he was doing it to unite everyone (yet acted like an asshole towards everyone and generally acted in a way counter to being a morally grey Thanos type). Had they given Arthas a proper send off, Anduin a little better 'freedom' arc and just kept the Jailer an evil asshole it would have sat a little better.
Movie Thanos is an absolute stupid character and was ruined. His idea to cut life in half did not even work in itself, since overall that would for example bring earth back to around the 1960th. So you have to do that ever 50 years or so, wow. The original Thanos in the comic story made much more sense, where he was in love with "Lady Death" the personification of Death and 'she' ordered him to collect all the infinity stones to bring balance to the universe between life and death (Death though that there was way too much life in the universe in comparison). He himself did not really care at all about that, he just wanted to impress her and even forgot about the whole cut life in half part, what pissed Death of a lot. His finger flick to then still do it was not even a big story and the whole fight against him much bigger and brutal up to all galactic aspects (on the same level as death) try to bring down by sheer force, while all the 'normal' super heroe were not even a match for him when he took some of his own power away still trying to impress Death by flexing his prowess. The reason he loses in the end is also way more interesting than "I am Iron Man", what was overall pretty stupid, like the whole Time Travel thing. Thanos is a genious, he would never have forgotten about something like "they could sovle it with time travel", especially not with the infinity gauntlet that also rules over time. Zovaal/Jailer meanwhile: he does not care about mortals at all. That's his whole point from the start. Sylvanas fell for him, since she thought he wants to get rid of the system to free mortals. That he wants to free mortals by just getting rid of them was a little, but very impactful detail he left out. Imagine it that way: you got a family of people living in desperate times with spare food. Now there are some pets, which also consume quite some of the little food. Now one of the family says: We can't feed these pets anymore, we don't have enough food for ourselves, while the others say, no, those are our pets and we get some milk from them and when one of the older ones die we can still eat it and whatever. And then that person against the pets wants to kill all of them, so they can eat the pets and save the food. That's pretty much Zovaal and the pets are the mortals. From his PoV he might not even be wrong. The idea to have as much power and resources as possible to be strong enough against other threats is a logical one. That he does not care at all to sacrifice others for that, make him evil (though a question would still be, how brutal the impact of the domination magic from the other death god was on him and how exactly his first plan had been - the story is not finished, the othder death god for example, his strongest ally, was freed and he might have been a much bigger mind behind all this than the kind of enslaved Zovaal - wouldn't surprised me, if he was a puppet himself and you could see his end as a little handwave to that).
I can only guess what the hell was happening behind the scene in the writers' room with this expansion. Still a low point in many ways, but the last cinematic was at least competent.
Sylvanas' punishment is amusingly similar to a weekly quest given to the players in the game. The player needs to jump down into the Maw and rescue 20 souls. Being forced to do this boring quest forever is pretty funny.
17:47 btw those were not some random people, those were Sylvanas' sisters, Alleria and Vereesa, she really cares for them, at one point she planned to killed them so the three of them can be undead together but in the end couldn't bring herself to do it.
The really dumb thing about the Jailer revealing "oh no there's a bigger baddie", is that its not the first or even second time they've used that justification/motivation. First, it was Kel'thuzad/Nerzul, then they revealed it was the Dreadlords and the Legion/Kil'jaeden and then they zoomed out, and oh no Sargeras was actually in charge the whole time. Then Sargeras was actually just doing it all because the of the Old Gods, then oh no the Void Lords actually made the Old Gods. Then oh no the Dreadlords were misleading Sargeras and working for the Jailer the whole time. Now, oh no the *insert new baddie* was actually the bigger threat all along. The first 4 times they did this it was slightly different each time and still felt plausible. Now, with Shadowlands it rings hollow and feels like just copied their old homework.
I understand that blizz has taken the route of "the path to hell is paved with good intentions" a lot in the past, but the other possibility would be a bad guy whos bad because hes bad, which is just as boring. And even though they did a bad job with it with the Jailor, Villains who have good reasons for what they are doing and think that they are the good guys offer much more narrative creativity.
"First, it was Kel'thuzad/Nerzul, then they revealed it was the Dreadlords and the Legion/Kil'jaeden" What? We literally knew from the start it was them, did you not play warcraft 3? Kelthuzad/nerzul were literally sent with the help of the dreadlords to summon archimonde and the legion. Also again we knew sargeras was in charge... Out of all the things you list here the only new thing is "The dreadlords worked for the jailer and were misleading sargeras" the rest of this has all been canon since wc3 and vanilla.
@@RazanaArcclaw I never said they just did all this. I said they've done it before. Which as you said they did. In WC3... At first the bad guy is Kelthuzad, then you later Malganis pops up etc.
Great video! By the way, World of Warcraft is revealing their new expansion on April 19th, and is most definetly going to have some cinematic to come with it!
People have made massive jokes about Jailer being Thanos, on top of him gathering the different sigils of all the factions. People made jokes about "Infinity sigils"
I believe that the Jailer's plan as it was implied was that he anticipated a threat to the cosmos, something worse than someone of his level of power, and his plan for the Universe to succeed was a universe in which everyone serves under one unified will through his domination. Entirety of the cosmos acting in unison for one single purpose without any disarray or anyone having a second opinion. I find the idea that this bigger threat would be a rogue First One, the race that constructed the universe as we know it, are very similar to the Xel'naga that you saw in Starcraft, these ancient aliens that seeded various species, but Amon went hostile
While waiting next expansion, if you wanna do more wow videos, you could check out lore videos of your favorite characters to get whole picture of them (like Jaina, Arthas, Illidan etc) Nobbel, Hirumaredx for example are my personal favorite lore video makers :)
Platinum wow is great, highly reccomend. While Nobbel is good, he is not very good for "reaction" content as his videos are equivalent to wikipedia articles, they give you the info but they arnt good for "sharing" Glad you like HirumaredX, even if mostly talking about abilities and gameplay mechanics.
@@RazanaArcclaw maybe your are right, nobbel videos usually tend to be very long and would need a lot of editing in order to present them as reaction 😅 and yeah 😁 I especially like Hirumaredx villains corner videos, I think they cover the characters very well and the drawings also are so adorable 🥰
