Geostomp I think it could still be intense definitely shorter though since the Separatist would have been able to steamroll most of the Republic faster with numbers
The war would have still happened maybe not in the timeline we see but eventually. The separatists would likely have also won the war quickly as the republics lack a military and the Jedi refusal to accept the prophecy and visions that said it was coming. The republic may have started to build up their military slightly but they would have delayed for too long giving the separatists more time to build up.
I strongly disagree that they're interference escalated things, since Palpatine was essentially in control of everything he would have actually mitigated the damage to ensure his meteoric rise to emperorership. In fact I believe that without Sith interference it would have been an even bloodier war than it was. After all the Sith wanted to consolidate power, wipeout the Jedi, and transform the Republican into an Empire. Things that we've been far more difficult if they didn't control, but at the same time they had to give the image of not controlling the war leaving the Jedi in the dark until it was too late!!!
@@JabezFuutonSpecialis without the sith, the republic and CIS would have been able to negotiate. The CIS plan of strongarming the republic into accepting their withdrawal may have worked, too. One way or another we know that the republic and CIS were willing to negotiate during the war, but then sidious and dooku sabotaged the peace talks. Without sith interference, the republic quite simply does not have the stomach to force a war on the separatists who only want to be free.
My short answer: Yes. But it would’ve taken more time and would’ve looked completely different. Arguably the “Separatists” would’ve been the “good guys”.
Republic isn’t exactly innocent in terms of war crimes. They’re literally using slave soldiers, and constantly break rules of war through false surrenders. And most actual separatists don’t do war crimes, it’s mainly the companies like the techno union. And if you want an example of the faults of the republic, look at the battle of Atrakan
That's right. I thought Anakin would just remain a slave but you reminded me that without the Sith, Anakin will never be born. This of course means that Luke and Leia will never exist, Han will have a different life, no Ben and of course no Rey
@@cormacmacsuibhne2867 You mean Jacen, Jaina, and Anakin Solo were the kids of Han and Leia. Luke Skywalker married Mara Jade and they had a son named Ben Skywalker.
Without the Sith influencing things groups like the Trade Federation would’ve turned into Hondo once the Jedi showed up. “This effort is no longer... profitable!”
It's such a shame that so many people are panicking over food and other essentials. Here in the UK the supermarkets, despite what they tell us, are buckling under people hording food when experts are saying that if everyone just went about buying groceries like normal everything would be just fine!! Food hasn't stopped being produced. Toilet rolls are still being manufactured. This is NOT a zombie apocalypse and yet people are acting like it is.
UK Media Warrior They arent buckling. My cousins husband is a delivery driver and he says the warehouses are full of food. The only issue is getting it to the shelves.
I would invest in grocery stores right now. It seems like business has never been better for them. One of the few markets you're sure not to loose money at the moment.
That makes sense. It also makes sense to get a bunch of supplies so you have to go to the grocery store less, which in turn lowers your potential exposure to the virus. The UK is a free country, so people can choose which way they shop. Such is life. People tend to have an optimism bias. They don’t prepare for things ahead of time. Despite the fact that blizzards and tornadoes are a thing. Stay safe.
@@danielevans5286 Thats what I was referring to, the empty shelves. I saw a news report of people queuing around the block at an Asda at 6am waiting for the doors to open and then running through with trolleys to get to stuff they need. Shelves empty a few short hours later when others turned up hoping to find food but the stores had nothing left in the warehouse and were awaiting delivery. If people just stopped panic buying everything would be fine.
@@bigredwolf6 I read a report from a retail 'expert' who said that how supermarkets operate has changed over the years. Decades ago they kept stores of food on site in warehouses to keep shelves full, these days they run on a 'just enough' policy and have to wait on trucks to arrive with new deliveries if a shelf gets empty. The problem is those who hoard prevent others getting much needed supplies. Yes, if you buy a ton of stuff you don't need to go out again, but what of those who now can't buy anything because you and people like you hoarded it all? What do they do? They have to keep coming out or going to other shops in the hope they can find food and so the chances of them getting infected go up. And no, people don't prepare much in the UK because unlike some places in the world constantly hit by environmental impacts the UK has been, up till now, pretty steady and free of such things so no real reason to. Which is why we look so stupid when an inch of snow falls and people go crazy to buy bread and milk, lol. But as I said if people simply stopped panicking and went about their shopping as per normal everyone would get food and other essentials easily. Being free to shop how you like isn't an excuse for panicked behaviour when there is no need to panic
There would doubtless have been *some* kind of alien collaboration and uprising in the Outer Rim at this point but without the Clone Army to combat the Droids, I don't see any situation in which the Republic could have prevailed as the Jedi could not do that on their own.
There likely wouldnt have been a droid army in this situation either. Youd see both sides putting together actual militaries which would make the conflict much bloodier.
It is true the republic would have the clones with out the sith interference. But, would the separatists have had he droids with out them? Remember it was the sith the made the whole free trade zone situation, and set it up to where the corporations were arm8g themselves. While I think they still would have had some kind of force for protection, with out the sith interfen e, I don't think they would have had the big Droid armies.
6:42 "This system was designed to weed out the weak and _install a healthy hoarding mentality…"_ So basically they started a panic on toilet paper for 7 year old Numoidians.
Yes and no. War was largely innevitable by 23BBY. It just wouldn't have been the CLONE Wars. It would have been more chaotic and likely ended in a crushing CIS victory. There would have been no Clone Army as it was the Sith who manipulated Sifo Dyas to commission one in secret.
I dont think there would be a war. I think the CIS droid army would succesfully strongarm the republic into accepting their secession peacefully, as they originally intended. The republic has neither the stomach nor firepower to resist.
@@lenkagamine4145 Oh there would be war. A CIS Civil War might have followed suit as trade disputes erupted between it's disparate corporate leaders no longer united by common cause.
Anakin: I got a present for you Wrecker. Wrecker: Oh! Seriously? I get to blow it up!? The whole stinking thing!? (Anakin smirks and hands wrecker the detonator. Crosshairs on the other hand was a bit jealous on what Wrecker was allowed to do.) Wrecker: This... (sniff) ... is the happiest day... (sniff) of... my life. (Wrecker presses the trigger and blows up the ship and some of the fleet.)
@@chrissnyder8415 Do you often decide to spew your noxious presence into YT chats, or am I just lucky today? The only luck I feel is that I don't know you in person.
*_"Things fall apart,_* *_the centre cannot hold"_* While the Clone Wars wouldn't have happened without Plagueis [he really should consider changing his name, it's kinda awkward in the current climate] and Sidious, the Galaxy was still unstable and deteriorating. But instead of a grand conflict that would've encompassed the entire galaxy, there probably would've been further slow decay and just a gradual loss of control and the will to do anything about it. The one thing that would change it in 4 ABY [although they wouldn't be using _that_ dating system] upon the death of Yoda. It can be argued that is was his failings that allowed the destruction of the Republic, the Rise of the Empire, and the virtual elimination of the Jedi. That does not look good on your CV! Which could explain why the only job he could get was swamp attendant… But in this *alternate reality, the Republic still exist, but is even more tired, corrupt and indifferent. But with Yoda no longer in charge of the Jedi and no longer in charge of molding young Padawan minds, there is a chance for renewal. A reformer in the vein of Qui-Gon Chin or Dooku, that wasn't so ossified with a 900 year old attitude could reinvigorate the Jedi order. And they could save the Republic, first by fighting the internal corruption plaguing it, and then by fighting the criminal elements and chaos external to it that drove desperate people to align themselves with authoritarian figures in the hope of stability, safety and order. It would require dedication and a purpose, but if the Jedi order shed it's dogmatic willful stubbornness and extreme conservatism imposed on them by Yoda, it could be up to the task And having a rebuilt Republic Patrol fleet to police the Outer rim and help the Jedi protect the population from pirates and slavery would also help. *Alternate Realities are good, they keep JJ Abrams away from destroying the spirit of your fandom by making _his interpretation_ occur in a different dimension to the storyline you love. If only there was a Star Wars Kelvin timeline, where all the ridiculous power creeps could be kept away from the main universe.
Personally I am sceptical that there would be some kind of reform after Yodas death. He was just the last of several similar minded Grand Masters since the End of the War against the Sith. The Jedi as institution were very hard to reform and very much hold on to their traidition, even false ones. I would say it would had needed a greater crises to work as a signal for change - but it is a difficult balance between a crisis which the traditional Jedi see just as confirmation that their way work, and one that hit not so hard the Jedi and the Republic (almost) fall down (like for example the Exar Kun rebellion or the Mandalorian Wars which almost brought the Jedi down and maybe together cost more lives than the rise and fall of the Empire). Some Sith would say the Jedi know so much and understand so little. And I am not sure that after Yodas death this would have changed.
@Gaius Wyrden Than he could not be THAt incredible wise and powerful. The Sith were just a few, while the Jedi were many - but they were even not able to notice that the force was manipulated until it was almost too late. That is not very impressive for a said to be strong organisation with dozens if not more masters and many, many more knights...
Technically there's always riots going on _all over the planet_ not just the US, there's injustice and war constantly in motion thousands of miles apart.
@@diegocardenas1452 that's because the Chinese people are smart, they know what will happen if they riot, they will be punished severely and it will be covered up.
There might have been a different sith that will not be as smart as palpatine and just start another sith war because Darth plagues the widse would not find them
@@fishyf5603 True but if they were less effective than palpatine the conflict could have been shorter and the Sith Lord pulling the strings found a lot sooner before they could gain control of the senate and be arrested for crimes to commit conspiracy and against the republic. Legitimizing the efforts of the pacifist and diplomats on both sides looking for peaceful bloodless solution to the issues they had with each other possibly allowing for the CIS to be a legitimate government in the Outer Rim. While at the same time discrediting the War mongering sub factions with in the two groups dismissing them as nothing more than fear alarmists and Traitors to sold their soul to a Sith Lord who promised them power and influence if they were loyal to the evil space wizard. lol XD,
It’s a high possibility but it would probably be a very different war. Even finding the clones is something that Obi Wan only achieved by pure luck(which he doesn’t believe in) but still chances are the separatist probably would have won cause the Republic did not have a huge army at the time and chances are considering their numbers and the need to prevent more loss of Jedi lives they would let them go. A peaceful ending without the corruption of O’l Palpy.
What most likely would of happened is the battle of geonosis would of never happened and the jedi would not of been captured because jango would still be bounty huntering so the republic would of probably accepted the cis as a legitimate government
I love the way you concluded this video. Politics has become far too much of a polarised institution with people blindly supporting their 'team' rather than holding the government to account. We will see that the lies and spin about our how great our services, such as healthcare, really are when they are tested to their limits.
I think it would still likely happen but in a much different fashion. While Palpatine was responsible for many aspects of the war and its outbreak the Republic would still be incredibly corrupt without him and all of those reasons why many planets chose to leave would still exist. I would say many planets would still, at some point in the future, secede but without the clone army(which was only created due to Palpatine) either the Republic and Jedi would let it happen or they would militarize.
It would be a hard sell to get the jedi to resist the separatists militarily, when you remove Count Dooku and the capture of Obi-wan from the equation. The sith really forced the hand of the jedi, they couldnt just abandon one of their own. In a situation where the separatists try to seccede peacefully by strongarming the republic with their droid army, it would be hard to convince the jedi to lead a pre-emptive strike against them like they did in our timeline.
Yea a survival rating of 95% for people in their 80s seems not worth a fuss over.. simple immune supplements to boost the immune system work just fine.
Thank you for your comments at the end of the message unrelated to Star Wars - your optimism and hope for the future is inspiring. Also, as always, love your videos
I mean I can definitely see people in the outer rim purchasing B1’s for protection, since they were very cheap and proper protection was lacking for the settlers in the outer rim
Hey What would have happened if Luke joined Darth Vader at cloud city? or if he missed the escape hatch and died, how would it effect the Galactic civil war?
Maybe the Sith started all mayor conflicts, but even without the Sith, the Republic had many problems. Sifo-Dyas would have created the Clone Army - and survived to see it. But I think, the Confederation of the Independent Systems would have looked different. Maybe the Corporate Sector would be the new heart of this? But I think, maybe a war could have been avoided. The clones would play the role of sheriffs and the troops could bring security to the galaxy while the jedi order would change too. This could be an interesting what-if-story. But Anakin would not be present in this. Instead, we have the love story of Obi-Wan and Satine, whose children would be raised as Mandalorians.
Kudos to you for trying to put a positive spin on our current situation. I see many people trying to spread fear and panic and others like myself and you trying to reassure others that we will make it through. Thanks for being in the corner of rationality!
Hands down the best movie speech ever. Period. And you just perfectly used it here. Loved that. Good message, I hope you are right about us coming out the other side better. Thanks for the content.
@Generationtech thats a very heart warming message at the end guys i hope so more people understand the problem with the whole world in these days humanity first
I honestly doubt it. While the Jedi may or may not have fixed the underlying problem, without the Sith, a war on the scale of the clone wars would not have happened. The separatist alliance was mostly kept together through the Sith, and they were not always the most supportive alliance. Member states routinely went for their best interests over the good of the Alliance. More likely, you would have continued seeing small scale conflicts in the outer and perhaps mid rim. Change would have happened in the very long term, with small pangs of violence erupting with some consistency.
Yes i totally agree with that. Also since CIS had less radical members they would want to work for a practical solution with republic and same on the republic side we saw attempts to even with the Sith involved however alot less successful and dam near impossible to achieve with old sheev controlling everything from the shadows. Without the Sith it would be more successful still not a guarantee. But the odds would go from like only 5 percent success rate to like a 75 percent over night. It also means less indoctrinating propaganda on both sides so the issues won't just be Republic or CIS itself depending on few points citizens will be more aware of the internal issues of both factions on both sides to. Meaning that if both the CIS and Republic can resolve their external issues with each other and the republic respects the CIS's rule in the out rim. Then Ironically they can help each other clean up the internal messes with their respective governments. possible improve the galactic economy with more trade and if the republic wanted to set up some out post and colonies on undiscovered systems in CIS controlled space they might be able to permitted to do so which could benefit both factions. And the Republic might not have send a security force over long distances If on good terms with the CIS because they could provide security forces against pirates and other external threats. And if another 3rd party faction that is strong enough to challenge both the Republic and CIS that wants to conquer the galaxy then could have common enemy in another large scale war and if the republic was allowed to have small forward bases in CIS territory they could have initial reactionary force against this new threat until the main fleets were to arrive and reinforce the republics military ranks to effectively aid the CIS. but only one can speculate as again tension and smaller conflicts could still have happened but it would be easier de escalate tension and possible allow for the 2 factions to co exist in the galaxy and possibly become allies instead of bitter enemies. meaning if other external threats arrived their combined efforts could keep the galaxy defended indefinitely i predict.
Well I think the galaxy would have seen a major conflict in any case but a different one and maybe a few decades later. The Republic as they were would never be able to react to some dangers that occurred both in legends and canon. I ignore the Vong, but the Ssi-Ruuk or the Grisk alone would have created huge problems for a de-militarized and corrupt government like the Republic. Very likely the Republic would have done nothing against mounting attacks against border worlds, which would have resulted in more and more frustration in the Rim. In the end some kind of popular leader may have risen in the Rim - maybe a local commander or politician, maybe a rouge Jedi. That may have led to another type of war when this local hero become figure-head of some kind of secessionist movement (since I think the Republic would have not ignore him and the Jedi would not reacted friendly to Jedi who went a path similar like Revan)
The war probably would have been less bloody since Palpatine had the CIS commit atrocities for the sake of committing atrocities so that he could grab more power within the Senate.
To answer the literal question in the video title, Yes the clone wars would of still happened just with someone else as Darth Plagueis apprentice. Without the sith influancing events, a war might of happened but most likely is war not happening and the galaxy spliting between the outer rim and the core peacefully.
Honestly I am not entirely sure how it would pan out. On one hand tension was inevitable but maybe not the extremes that is was. We probably would have seen more smaller conflicts or short term proxy wars. But maybe not a galaxy wide event. Simply because Sidious was an evil space wizard that could persuade even the most sound minded individual to do something out of character. If you had a Sith Lord who told you I have your back on any decisions you make that can control political legislation or government then basically you can't be accountable for anything because he will just bail you out. However the only downside is you have to be of some use to him if he considers aiding your ambitions which means you will probably be killed off on a later date when he sees you no longer as an asset to have but a liability that could hinder his plans of having full control of the senate and ruling the galaxy with an iron fist. Without that even the most selfish and greedy politicians or mega corporation owners would know that open conflict can be bad for re elction and business for sure. It also means that you have no get out of jail free card if your caught or accused of committing a crime/crimes in the legal system. Meaning your are accountable for your actions and their are negative consequences in the end result. Sure you might be able to have some influence by either bribing or working at out plea deal with law enforcement officers. But your still having to pay fines or go to jail for a certain amount of time and your reputation will be hurt. Making you less creditable as politician or hurting financial as a business or mega corporation. Also because both sides have members looking for a peaceful revolution than all out war it might be more effective. Because you don't have evil space wizards interfering with the efforts and causing lies and fake drama to cause chaos. Like fabricating Bacta shortages or staging false conflicts or causing civil unrest based on deceit lies versus the actual facts. This means their won't be as much wide spread brain washing propaganda and you might even see more debating on issues in both Republic and CIS senates. Their will be more dialogue and voting on decisions that may take more time but are more rational to solving issues between both factions. The Republic might have been okay with CIS wanting to be independent but maybe they had to make some concessions on both sides. Allowing for trust worthy leaders on both sides to find solutions to problems for each other. CIS and Republic officials might have been able to work together and gain leverage on the greedy corporations that oppressed the outer rim. By enlisting heavy sanctions against them or convince investors to boycott them for more reputable companies. Forcing the corporations to go through reform phase and exposing the corrupt and fraudulent leaders such as Nut Gunray of the Trade Federation and having them replaced chair members who are more ethical and stand by the corporations mission if its meant to provide security for the outer rims citizens or trade routes they are going to use their security forces as intended and not has hire goons to collect debt owed. Or if your corporation is involved with helping people get off debt like small businesses in the real world then people only have to worry debt collectors threatening to garnash wages or eviction letter notices or even fines/jail time if the debt owers are committing fraud. Versus having a Hellfire Droid or Homing Spider or AAT threatening to kill you or blow up your home because you ow money. I think that is too much over kill. Harassing them via holo net projection is punishment enough lol. Or things would just been the same but taken longer who knows for sure. But these are the kinds of things I would want to happen at least in an alternate star wars universe with no evil space wizards to pull the strings from the shadows like a puppet master or playing 4 dimensional chess while having epic evil laugh. Then saying everything has transpired as a have for seen. But to then only be trolled later by assassin droid named IG 88 who hacked your second evil death sphere and wondering why the door keeps slamming shut on your face as your about to enter your personal quarters lol.
I like how you point out that Trump can be incompetent, but also show that the opposition to him is equally incompetent and unrelenting in unreasonable attacks. That's a pretty fair view of things.
He ordered a travel ban in early January but was called a racist and blocked by liberals yet this idiot on gen tech claim he waited to act. I dare him to go look at obozo's response with the h1 virus. He waited 6 months to act all while millions were infected and over 12k died in the US. It's easy to trash Trump when you don't care about facts
@@yourstruly4817 Dyas started it with Dooku who was under Palpatines control. Dyas only did it because he sensed darkness coming in the galaxy, which was the sith and the war. Without the sith I dont think the clones would have ever been made.
I'm commenting this before watching the clip. I think it wouldn't happen since it was all Palpatine scheming. I believe that at some point, there would be a war but for several other reasons: Discontent among the Senate, discontent among the people, the Jedi Order would eventually decline as it happened before, not only due to inside issues but also exogenous. In sum, a conflict would happen but not revolving around the clones, which, at some point, could start being employed. Now, by which faction, that's a whole different matter.
While war may break out, there would not be a united Separatist movement. The CIS was far too diverse politically to unite on their own and likely would have fallen to infighting. The CIS was far more decentralized which would have allowed rich worlds and the Separatist Council to use money and armies to influence poorer planets. While the CIS did believe that the Republic was far too focused on the Core Worlds, they seemed to somehow forget that the strong if motivated can and will pounce on the weak. Yes, centralized government can become tyrannical, but at least you can easily identify your enemy. The CIS would have become divided without the Republic as its common enemy.
One thought that I had in mind was what if the new republic wasn’t destroyed by the first order by starkiller base. Like what if they missed by a hair and the resistance reaches out for the new republic to declare war on the first order.
Without the Sith eventually a popular Uprising would occur in the outerrim and exploited midrim worlds. This Uprising would likely have been against the corporations and their security forces. Those corporations would have tried to pull the entire Republic into the conflict behind them. This would have broken the Senate without manipulators like Demasc and Palpatine nudging things the pacifist faction would have too much control making the Republic no longer matter, the corporations we'd ould turn to the Core worlds that they had close ties with and continued to do there own thing. This would result in the rest of the mid rim realizing what the outerrim knew all along the Republic has no power, with out the ability enforce ant decrees. Individual worlds and systems would side with or against the corporations while the Senate debates. The Jedi as shown if the novel Master & Apprentice, would try to stay out of it initially, they would claim these are local disputes between the individual worlds and the corporations. This could destroy the Jedi order almost as well as the Clone Wars and Order 66, when the Jedi are forced to choose between the Republic and their individual moral compass. However, it happened their wouldn't have been any Skywalkers, nor Thrawn, involved.
Considering that the meddling of the Sith on the Galaxy's issues started way before Palpatine and Plagueis, who knows? Maybe no, the Republic could have been an entire different thing without the Sith screwing with it for millenia, a civil war could have erupted at some point due to political reasons between some worlds and the whole system, but i hardly see it escalsting into a full known Galactic conflict.
Actually, yes, a nascent Separatist Crisis that would blossom into a massive war would still have happened, even without the Sith. There's too much bad blood between the Outer Rim and the Core Worlds that lasted LONG after the Clone Wars. The Core Worlds see the Outer Rim people as disloyal yokels, while the latter see the Core World people as snobs who monopolized senate power. Instead of having armies made from clones and droids, though, you'll have pissed-off militiamen on both sides forming the backbone of both the Separatist and Republic armies. As for the Trade Federation, the Corporate Alliance, the Techno Union, the Banking Clan, and all those other corporations, since Dooku didn't push them to join the Separatists, they would just be selling arms, war machines, and other stuff to both sides to make a big, fat buck. You might even see Trade Federation Droidekas, Corporate Alliance tank droids, and Techno Union Octuptarra Tri-Droids being used by both sides on the battlefield. So instead of an organized war with minimal civilian casualties due to both armies being artificially made, you'll have natural-born recruits on both sides getting drafted into armies by the tens of trillions and gutting each other, with a chaotic free-for-all, a see-saw war that would never end until both sides' populations have been exhausted by war. Think of something similar to the Jedi Civil War, the Mandalorian War, or the Great Galactic Wars, except with less Jedi, since the Jedi wouldn't be so peachy-keen in entering a war against other living beings and would likely stay neutral like they did in the Mandalorian Wars, with only a few remaining loyal to the Republic and joining in, while some will feel sympathetic to the Outer Rim systems and defect to the Separatists, creating their own Jedi Order that would be targeted by Republic-Loyalist Jedi as heretics.
I think it’s inspirational that you were hopeful about the outbreak, but I think you might want to be careful at labeling it as an opportunity. I know this wasn’t your intention and all of those things you said are true and will help society, but for the people losing loved ones I don’t think they see it as a silver lining scenario. It’s easy for us to look and say less pollution, strengthening of our health care systems, etc., and right then off as positives cause they technically are. But for those who are having to watch their families fall apart and struggle I think they would have much preferred we didn’t have this “opportunity”, even if there is a lot of good to come out of it. Love your vids btw, keep it up!!
I have a question for you all. In Legends, at year 1,000BBY was the first time in a while that the Chancellor wasnt a Jedi. My question is, Why werent the Jedi Chancellors or even really in the Senate, like before the Ruusan Reformation?
Hey Allen I was wondering, what if the Jedi had kept out of the war? Instead of fighting, suppose they went into hiding. I wonder would they try to broker a settlement, let the galaxy burn or would they perhaps split apart. What's your take on this subject?
