I think it's really essential to mention rotation/prioritization when it comes to PvP guide. Especially speaking about DK, it's really important to know when and how to keep diseases, how to make them unspellable, "the ideal rotation", burst etc. The information you provided here can be found in multiple PvP guides or in Nibbai's videos. If a newbie DK player watched your guide, they have no idea how to play the class.
Yeah if a brand new player who's never hit chains of ice before they need a different guide that will be 10+ minutes in length. I could throw that in this but then I'm splitting people who are brand new dk babies and then everyone else who needs to know useful dk information. And there is a lot of misinformation out there
i don't think trefort90 was talking about the baby stuff. this video IS the baby stuff. it's easy to look at pictures of talents and glyphs and professions and copy them. anyone can enter the arena with all the right talents and glyphs. what determines whether you win is how you play the game. the combat decisions you make. not equipping the items that say "Class: Death Knight" on them.
@@apexanalysis8348 Playing on the pre-patch right now and the Pet stun Macro isn't working like its suppose to? Seems that leap + stun are both on GCD's and in the past they weren't?
@@apexanalysis8348 I watched your whole video, tbh I was looking for how to use the class. I can find enchants and gearing guides as well as talent specs and glyphs and even arena comps on WoWhead. Or Icyveins if I want something more reliable. I need to know what to do against every class, how to counter them, and when to switch up rotation. You don’t find that on Icyveins.
Theres little to few content creators for DKs, i really hope you become a little bit more active, this video was amazing, easy to understand, and very informative. Amazing content. Looking forward to future videos.
Thanks for the support! I just started youtube a little under 2 months ago and I've had to learn a wide range of skills thus far on top of regular life commitments. I'll only be improving & getting faster at making content as I continue! DK's are one of my favorites so certainly expect more out of them down the road as it will be one of my main toons in wrath classic too.
Apex man, you came outta nowhere with these WOTLK vids and it's providentially perfect timing haha, anyway love the vid and one for war and ret would be insane. I know you're busy.
Just some optimization when it comes to [target] conditional [target=apexhero] can become [@player] [target=pet] can become [@pet] [target=target] can become [harm] or if you have mouse over macros [@mouseover,nodead,exists,harm][] with empty brackets at the end this is just clears the conditions making it open for anything if no mouse over you can also use [harm] instead of empty brackets [modifier:shift] can become [mod:shift] and so forth also [nomod] to replace [nomodifier]
@@apexanalysis8348 apex... Where's a link to your DK macros?? It's hard to read them perfectly from the screen and we might do lots of type errors... Pls link the plain text for the macros. For the rest, awesome content. You earned a sub.
I like all of your videos. Hopefully one day you will do a video about a rsham in 2s and 3s and a firemage in 2s and 3s. You are the best in doing these sort of Videos
Thank you! Those will be far down the list as I barely have even played fire mage. BUT I will be doing a frost mage one which covers most of what you'd need to know for fire as well soon™
I’m a glad rogue coming back to the game for wrath, my friend plays shadow priest, I watched your other videos and saw how rogues aren’t top tier (save for 2s with sp), I’m taking a liking to dk sp for 3s would you recommend that over rogue sp 3s? Great channel, thanks.
Thanks Storm! Interesting. Well I would still suggest going rogue as the shadow/rogue synergy truly is amazing and really just requires the gear and skill which a lot of people can't get. But DK/shadow is a very fun comp that I have a good amount of xp with. It struggles with a lot of the comps that shadow/rogue can just roll over but in 3s they are about = in their best comps. So up to you and easy to play both even as DK gearing isn't as intense as rogues.
@@apexanalysis8348 Thanks for the quality reply! One more quick question - I’ve just started leveling a mage as I’ve always wanted to play it. I keep seeing videos with people emphasizing how great shatterplay is, would you say it’s truly far better than rogue sp? I also recall you saying mage is far easier to gear as well. Thanks again.
what you think of rolling night elf DK for the shadowmeld cheese plays ( cc/spell absorb) I know human is mix max but trying to not be so try hard these days! Plus adds a whole element of gameplay to the class haha
I say do what you like as that is more important than min-maxing unless your goal is to do as well as possible. Personally I think shadowmeld works far better on classes/specs that are ranged as they have more time to react and shadowmeld things like chaos bolt, lava burst, death coil, etc since if you're up in their face as a melee you can't react with meld as quick. Shadowmeld is probably the coolest racial out of all races as well!
Hi Apex, could we please request three versions of gear (PreBIS arena )(BIS Arena w/ pvp gear) (BIS Arena w/ pve gear) for s5? Looks like eightyupgrades got setup. I am rolling DK because an irl friend is rolling HPAL and I saw your videos re 2v2,3v3,easy comps, and effectiveness for no PVE gear (I hate raiding!). Also, in your warrior video, I get the feeling you suggest JC+BS over JC+Eng. Here you suggest JC+Eng to slightly edge over BS. Is there a specific reason the decision is different? Thanks! Lastly, what level do the professions have to be to reap the rewards? 400? or 375?
Hmm I can maybe put that together in the vids. I'd say though if you just take the bis list for S5 it's easy to swap out for the other 2 lists. Just swap pve pieces with pvp alts or BoE's and then for Prebis pretty much the same thing just downgrade from the arena gear to honor. Rewards for most profs are 400. BS for sure is 400 - But JC might be higher I don't recall exactly what was required
Hey Kogeta, yeah I've played it a decent amount in solo queue with some good players. It has the best healer and caster along with one of the strongest melee... I've never felt impressed by it or against it but I definitely don't have a ton of experience with it. So my answer is still undetermined but I know it's viable at the bare minimum. It could be as high as 2nd tier I think but maybe 3rd. I'll hopefully get to practice it more before wrath is out to have a more solid answer
@@apexanalysis8348 some DKs in the blight club discord swear by it. i've never ever heard of DK ELE being a 3s comp until a few days ago lol. i was.... "shocked" by it. xd
Yes, unholy is very powerful both offensive and defensively. But ele/destro in particular is one of the scariest wizard combinations and can EASILY destroy anyone if they don't have defensive CD's up like AMs/AMZ.
Just found your channel going to subscribe seems informative! I do have a not related to the video question though and it's a bit of a odd one. I know it won't be meta but I'm looking to play mostly 2v2s with my friend I main arms warrior and will stick to that. He however has said he will boost anything to play with me that is not a healer or shadow priest. What's my closest chance at a decent team here not sure what to tell him ret maybe?
@Archaon The Everchosen Probably Ret/Preg will be the best option. Warriors only strong 2s comps are all with healers so bear that in mind. But ret/preg does a good job of somewhat fulfilling that role. I will have a pally comps video coming out soon if they're particularly interested in that class
great video! i have a question tho. isent Titan-forged plate helm of triumph better in phase 1? 10 more strength 18 more stamina 23 more resilience? you dont missout on 4set bonus
Glad you liked it! I don't think so, it's only ilv 200 with no crit rating on it at all. Better options to keep 4 set and swap a different piece out with a 213 or higher
Also, me and my arena partners are mixed between what to play season 1, Eleshammy, Warrior, Hpala -- or -- Eleshammy, Destrolock, Hpala/restrodruid. What you think will be the best choice with very limited raiding?
Hey check out my videos where I cover specs/classes w.o pve gear: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-_cqMhsCXL6Q.html&t & ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-ijXhN1o5XOc.html . I will be doing a 3v3 one sometime soon™ - But to answer your question ele/destro paired with an hpal OR rdruid are without a doubt the BEST options pretty much in general. The warrior variant (thundercleave) the warrior needs some pve gear but early on in wrath there isn't as much pve gear available so it's not hurt as bad as later on.
Do you use Rune Strike or Obliterate at all? Also when should you be using Rune Strike or Death Coil and when should you be using Corpse Explosion / blood tap/ Pestilence/ Blood Boil. I cant seem to find a good guide on abilities or pvp "rotation"
Never use obliterate. Death coil being ranged with talents like morbidity + dark death glyph + death coil sigil + fast globals with unholy presence make it absolutely deadly. So rune strike will basically never be used. Blood boil never use in arenas, rarely in bgs, Pestilence will be used quite a bit to spread whenever possible that won't break CC. Blood tap is useful for death striking in a clutch situation or whatever is needed at the moment. Corpse explosion just use to help land a kill with heavy burst
Can you please provide your keybinds? I know it's preference, but judging by your videos I guarantee you thought about ability sequencing when mapping out your keybinds! Thanks!
Interesting I've had a few requests now about this. I've gone through a few iterations of different binds but these certainly have a lot of pros in them. But they aren't perfect I'll get them up in one of my description boxes
@@apexanalysis8348 Thank you so much! I noticed a lot of other class mains (like rogue for example) really dive into sequencing of combos (trinket, cloak, shadowstep, vanish, cheapshot) when mapping out.
You use it most of the time. 90%~ the rest will be frost. Never blood presence. Frost makes it so you can't death strike as quickly and of course use as many globals/pump damage. But it does help a lot with a warrior/ret/feral/enhance beating you up
Thanks for this guide, it was super informative. You mentioned DK and SP have a lot of counters in 2's? Could you list them? Me and my friend are thinking of rolling DK and SP for WOTLK Classic.
No problem Charles, sure thing: Warr/hpal, DK/Hpal, DK/Disc, Disc, Feral, Sub/SP. Those are the main ones that are extremely hard to beat. So in general it's warrior/dk teams that will give you the most problems.
thank you the Video,can u help me out with corpse explosion in Arena you use it on your own Ghuul right? so i have to Target everytime my Pet that i can use it do you use a Macro for it or do you use the explosion in a other way?
No problem Reyel. Use this macro #showtooltip /cast [target=pet, exist] Corpse Explosion It will sacrifice your ghoul pet without having to target it so this helps quite a bit
Apex, solid info! It seems like most people are going unholy currently. Do you think blood will be decent in pvp at the start of WOTLK classic or does it require a ton of armor pen from the later stages of WOTLK?
Hey Glad it helped, unholy is by far the best spec. Frost can be good too but blood is not very strong. It's main plus is just having much higher survival than the other 2 specs. But it's damage is just a fraction of what the other two can do. In the original Wrath DK's were busted early on and they could play all sorts of specs. But since we will start on the final patch which was after many dk nerfs - unholy will be #1
@@apexanalysis8348 Just got beta access and this video has been a huge help. UH DK was extremely clunky at first but I'm starting to get the hang of it. Blood is much easier to pick up without thinking about it too hard, lol. Really appreciate your time with this!
Blood presence is just bad. You won't ever use it once you unlock unholy at level 70. DK is _sometimes_ the kill target. And when they are you will need to use frost presence against melee. Unholy presence is used 90% of the time, frost the other 10%.
@@apexanalysis8348 I feel like the extra gcd speed of unholy presence just makes me use the spells faster and then be rune starved for a while, while blood presence let me keep the improved unholy presence bonus while still dishing out 15% dmg, and you can always go frost presence as soon as you see they will switch on you?
You are right in that if your on a static target then you do just run out of your runes quicker. But since you typically don't have the 100% uptime being able to dump your runes quickly then have all the runic power to then maybe death coil them if they got away somehow, or you get CC'd and your runes can come off CD while sitting them.
I rarely use it myself, but it can add slightly higher burst if you use it when you're trying to burst someone down. But death coil + fast globals allows you to hit from ranged fast and with power so it's not really that important. No need to macro it with anything
Very interesting vidéo ! Super interested about ele shaman :-) Dk seems interesting but it takes a lot of attestation regarding runes and always keeping an eye on coil to protect diseases. You could also make videos in 1v1 situation explaining how to beat other classes :-)
Thanks. Yes ele shamans are extremely fun & good(actually all shamans)! I could try and fit in a 1v1 guide into the video but with 30+ specs to cover even if I narrowed it down to just 10 classes it would take quite a lot of time I think. But I will be doing a 1v1 tier list at some point where I hopefully can explain some key things without it being an hour long haha
@@apexanalysis8348 i completely agree 😁 my heart is still balancing between dk and ele for arenas. Maybe dk will fit the best because it’s strong in v2 comparing to ele. Hard part is finding mates on a french pve server 😒
Well..... I LOVE blood elf female animations myself and would do that if it was purely cosmetic. If you want the best horde race.. it's going to be orc no question.
Hey Stony. They are both extremely strong but have their own strengths/weaknesses. If we're talking 1v1s then yes dk's better, if it's BG then they're close. And both have 1-2 top tier 2v2 comps as well. The best double dps comps are definitely Unholy/Ret (also the ret can play preg) and then Unholy dk + Shadow priest which I've played the ladder a bunch. It can struggle with melee cleaves like enhance/preg
Hey I'm only planing raiding 10 man heroics with my guild is it still worth it to run the 264/271 ilvl gear from heroic ICC over the pvp gear? Even if I don't get the Halion/Saurfang trinket is it still worth it to roll human or just go gnome/dwarf.
Yes I think human is still best. But a little less so with some of these changes they've made. I'd still play your favorite race because at the end of the day it's not going to make a massive difference, maybe 100 rating higher~ with human racials over something else. BUT with that in mind a huge chunk of the great dk pieces are from icc 25, so if you never do 25's there won't be as many pieces available
Hey Apex! There's a lot of buzz right now in the PvE scene about Unholy going dual wield over 2H and it simming at much higher dps. Do you think there's any viability to this in PVP as well? Really interested on your thoughts!
That is crazy to hear, but that would be very interesting to see if that were to happen as I'm sure it would spill into pvp as well. I do think there is viability as there isn't any talent in particular that gives a bonus to 2her damage for unholy(besides the talent in blood) but we can't afford to get that with any good pvp build. So definitely something I need to look into/look out for. Thanks for this!
@@apexanalysis8348 Appreciate the reply! If you're interested I'd recommend checking out the deep dive on dk podcast with Sarthe that came out, they talk about it at length there. Definitely worth investigating I think!
Take a look into this spec. Let me know your thoughts. (DW UNHOLY PVP) Deathknight - 10/8/53 - armory.twinstar.cz/talent-calc.php?cid=6&d=wotlk&tal=2305000000000000000000000000023003000000000000000000000002300323041032152230101003133041
@@calebragatz No. This is not viable. In PvE you can sit there and hit with both weapons. You are not being kited. In PvP you will be kited at all times, and your white damage is not going to account for the majority of your damage unless your opponents are brain dead. Thus, you want the increased burst damage from a 2h weapon (higher front end weapon dmg for strikes)
Hey Apex, do you know if it is worth to get the stun duration meta gem on orc and stack it with the "on a pale horse" in the talent tree + orc racial? Or should I just get the crit meta gem
Is DK a good choice if you don't have time to pve whatsoever and have like 2 hours each evening to pvp casually? I mean it doesent look like it's much dependant on pve gear is it?
Yeah DK is a great choice if you don't have as much time on your hands. It would like to have some pve pieces but it doesn't suffer anywhere near as much as hunters, ferals, warriors, rogues.
Hey mate, whats good alternative if u cant get betrayer? Can u make a fast ranking of other 2hand weapons? Just got black ICE from eoe 10 and im not sure how good it is.
The melee really need dispels badly for roots, cc, slows, so they don't synergize the best. I would rate TreeSG(dk, war, rdruid) probably a Tier3 comp and then Unholy/rdruid a low T2 comp at best but more likely a T3 comp. Rdruids in wrath really want to be paired with wizards in general
I would say arms warrior is the hardest to play optimally. BUT you can be mediocre and still do well which is the silly thing. If we're talking 10/10 perfect play I would rank it Awarr>Ret/preg>DK
Hey, going into wrath me and my friend will play dk/hpala in 2v2 but I'm a little worried about all the war/hpala teams, whats the best strategy against it as dk/hpala ?
Yeah that will be the toughest matchup. But in early Wrath warriors aren't as scary as they become later so that is a big plus. The best chance to land kills is during each Gargoyle so lining up HOJ on the hpal when you're popping it or strangulates is _key_. I'll probably make a comp guide once my dk is 80 since I will be playing that comp :)
It's amazing for DKs actually! I will likely be using that myself (the heroic version) as it will be far easier to get than shadowmourne while still being very powerful.
I used to but it would cause problems randomly, like when I would want to pet explode and it was in the wrong place. So now I just hit T for my pet to attack and then shift+y to put it back on passve
I think it's just the flat damage number on one of your bursting moves where you can go 3 coils and quickly a 4th to pump some damage. I don't know for sure which one is better. as 200 strength is great and I was using that one too but I never did any in-depth math to find out which is better overall.
For the S5 portion at the beginning of wrath pretty much the same. Instead of that pve ring though you would rather run the 213 one from Malygos which is a BoE luckily. But by ulduar-end of wrath dks/warriors gear starts to diverge.
Haven't played it myself but cyclone interferes with the dk's aids damage and no MS will hurt quite a bit. Nonetheless it definitely will be at the very least viable as you can insta clone for peels and the druid/priest can kite through desecrations to stay alive
Is this the class u gonna play in classic? i want to try dk but sadly this guide doesnt cover the basics for this class and i know im gonna suck at it lol
I personally don't but there might be some circumstance where it's usable. Death coil with morbidity + dark death + being a quick ranged runic power dump is already so powerful it's hard to imagine a competitive alternative
It just isn't great. As a dk you have plenty of defensives and healing so the active effect from it isn't very useful(really for anyone). It's not as bad as something like mining though but as a dk your whole goal is damage and pressure.
Well it becomes IBF once cata hits haha. If I said dks have 2 stun breaks I probably mean just cc breaks/prevention like trinket a cheap to IBF a kidney or any other stun. Plus lichborne to break fears, ams to prevent, lichborne to prevent polies, etc. Very hard to cc dk's and on top of that their pet stun + death grip + fear is absurd
Yeah it's just showing what your best setup would be. I'm not even going to have that either but it shows what to aim for and then you can adapt the rest of what you can get.
Check out my arena guide video: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-PscnlMVWh14.html - Where I highlight the main important ones. Besides the mentioned in that video I also use omnicc, doom cooldownpulse, xperl(although this one i don't need).
Tried to keep it on the "shorter" side. I planned to make a noob dk guide after this one which still might come and cover some other more advanced things
Can we all agree that his UI is a complete mess for pvp.. Way too cluttered and those Bars in the middle that indicate runic power/hp are so distracting
Just like keybinds, addons are personal preference. It works for me, and some of the things overlapping are intentional (less distance between party frames makes it easier to see everything at a GLANCE.