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The ending of the PPV ruined the entire PPV for me, the WWE Women's Championship isn't going to get any prestige if they keep hot potatoing the title around every 30 fucking days.
This is planting the seeds for a Sasha heel turn soon. Which is great news. I mean, who could Sasha face next as champion? Only Nia Jax or Dana Brooke. It's too early for Nia and Dana sucks. With Charlotte you have Bayley, a face Nia, a face Dana (easy to turn her), Emma... Sasha will turn heel on Bayley when she wins the title from Charlotte, leading to Bayley vs Sasha at Mania. Right now you're pissed? That's great news, it means Charlotte is doing a great job
jp27fcp They could've easily had Sasha Banks turn Heel after retaining. Just have Bayley come out and challenge her on RAW and have Sasha run her down on the Mic talking about her "Not having what it takes" and stuff then punctuate it by having her attack Bayley and work on her injured shoulder.
Charlotte winning the belt back means this Sasha vs Charlotte feud is going to continue and that fucking sucks. ... it needs to end, they're starting to get boring now. ...
partyboytimes They've flip flopped the title too many times now, they've done this before where the champion loses the title but doesn't get a rematch because they've already had 3 matches
"They were girls so give them a break." Adam being a progressive wanted the women to do well so badly, but they didnt. They were NOT ready for the main event. I know that whatculture is politically correct af but let's be honest. The women didn't deliver and were outperformed by the men. I am sorry but I'm not going to "give them a break" for having vaginas. I respect them enough to hold them to the same standard as the men and it was not the match they needed to have to earn their spot at the top of the card.
Let's be honest, It was a better match than most of boreman's and we still see that bum in wwe just getting booed out of the building. Did he ever earn his spot ? Also, owens was in midcard with sami not too while ago and we gave it a pass even though they outperformed everyone.
There was no reason for this match to main event other than, "let's do a thing for the womenfolk" When it comes to the business itself and the structure of the card, the Universal title should go on last if it's your top title. After ignoring the belt for the last month, that title needed the main event more than Sasha and Charlotte, so much so that I totally forgot what Owens and Rollins were fighting for until the pre-match promo. I get that the Women's feud deserved the cell but beyond that, they booked it as a colossal failure. Lots of terrible bumps, the usual handful of botches, that long ass injury angle to start it off and a terrible finish that took the air out of the room and ended the show on a sour note. The girls did their part but someone needs to slap the agents that worked on this match.
Charlotte is the biggest female they gots, so she got the "first" ever hell in a cell win. That's why folks...simply because it's the first, and she has the lineage etc.
balancer182 ya she is talented but sasha banks deserves an actual title run with the prestigious women's title because it's being thrown around like a hot potato 😡
I'm glad that they've kept Charlotte's PPV streak, I think it will become a big deal in the future. And I agree, Charlotte is one of the most talented wrestlers on the roster (including the mens)
Nope. Sasha is the worst Woman Wrestler imo (except Nikki Bella and Eva Marie, they are divas for me). She is so fucking boring and can't deliver. I was so happy when Charlotte won
Nope. Charlotte is the best woman wrestler in the business right now (aside from Asuka) imo. So i was hoping Charlotte would regain the title but she now needs to hold it until at the very least the Rumble and possibly Mania
I really like Charlotte, and im not exactly a fan of Sasha. Charlottes got the raw strength, athleticism, and acting talent to properly perform her moves and sell like a champ. Sasha on the other hand, while she's ok and I like the brutality of the "Bank Statement", I don't feel she's very good at her setups and really requires her partners in the ring to do most of the work for her (Watch Charlotte as she has to RE adjust herself in the corner ropes because Sasha couldn't set her up properly. "Fakest" moment of the night right there and really zapped my suspension of disbelief. But then, I notice this all the time with Sasha matches) Charlotte is an excellent performer inside and out, an excellent heel, has a badass entrance and song, and makes that title look good. I was desperately hoping she would win legit. It is a shame about the table bumps though :\ it's liek they were told after the announcement table spot to take it more gently; you know, for the kids. Because that first one, was awesome and deliciously chaotic
thefreedude they even messed up the announce table spot I'm pretty sure, I think charlotte was supposed to just push her off the cell but she held sasha in the powerbomb position for too long and it just looked like a regular powerbomb
The main problem I had with the women's match was the opening, Sasha took an ordinary powerbomb through the announce table and the match nearly had to be called off, after an hour earlier Kevin Owens getting powerbomed outside the ring through two tables and was on his feet after 30 seconds. It would have been a lot better if they did a kind of Rollins/Ambrose spot and they went up the cell a bit. I think it was supposed to look like it was off the cell, but it wasn't, it was just a powerbomb.
there is a history that the fans know of with KO going through tables and ladders, its not really known for SB to be doing that. so it makes sense in a way. kind of like the more used to it you are the less it hurts
***** and? The point of the woman's revloution is to make them look on the level of men (which they are) owens went through a lot worse and was fine earlier on, it just makes sasha look really weak and doesn't make much sense
Dylan Byrne 1. Sasha has a history of back and neck injuries. 2. The women aren't really used to this level of hardcore yet, as it's still a budding revolution. 3. Sasha landed HARD on her shoulder/neck region.
Dylan Byrne I don't disagree with you but tbh K.O recovered a bit too quickly. In the past, any person that got put through a table would usually be out for the match and lose. There used to be table matches with the sole aim of knocking a person out just by putting them through a table. K.O only took 30 seconds to recover which is awesome but not really in line with kayfabe and object damage. I can't say much on Sasha's impact as I tuned out after 2 mins for her match though.
This was easily the worst main event all year and Adam's excuses for them are just insulting honestly. It was not a good match. At all. So fucking awful. I will say this however. Charlotte is so much better than every other women wrestler on Raw that it is kinda hurting the other women. Seriously, no other woman on Raw feels like they should have the belt. Sasha is still too green to even be in wwe.
Just Roaming They just don't even sell the moves really. It's like they get hit, take the bump, sell for a second, and then just move on to the next move. For instance Sasha should have sold her back throughout the whole match, but she really only kind of grabs every now again. Even though Charlotte targeted her back the whole time Sasha barely sold the damn thing. Also, this wasn't their fault really but the end didn't even look like the end because of the camera work. I didn't even notice Charlotte used natural selection cause the second table was in the fucking way.
The issue for the women's division on Raw is that they really only have Bayley, Sasha and Charlotte. That's all they got. While we can see Alexa Bliss vs Becky Lynch on Smackdown and it makes sense, can we really watch Dana or Nia fight Sasha? Smackdown just had a better women's roster...
ljaquos true 4 women can't possibly carry a division by themselves. They have more women but they aren't using them Nia Jax is missing and Alicia Fox too
The worst decision since they left Bryan out of the rumble and had Batista win. It's sad and disappointing, and if Banks won like she should have then, as Adam said, the event would've meant so much more. Not worse than Nexus. That's almost impossible.
I call bullshit when Adam said "If it were a guy's watch you would hate it." If we want women's wrestling to be legitimate, then we need to treat it like men's wrestling. No amount of context can turn a shit match into a good one. If this match would suck if men were involved, then it would suck if women were involved. No difference. If there is a difference, then women's wrestling is not as legitimate as men's wrestling.
The table spot shows why you can't just treat them like men! Women are, on average just not as big or as strong as men. However that's just a counter to one of your points, I do agree with some of what you said. One thing however is using a certain word. Now I'm a fan of the sport, watched rasslin since I was little, but arguing the level of "legitimacy" in the particular medium of entertainment is a fools errand at best.
the dan hibiki Legitimacy might not have been the best word to use. I don't mean legitimacy in the sense of UFC, like a real fight. I mean wresting legitimacy. For example, AJ Styles vs John Cena is the type of match that everyone will take seriously. They will take it seriously because everyone knows that both opponents are strong and a lot is on the line. Their matches are judged critically. There is no excuses for their matches. No one goes "well it was good for an AJ match" or "it was good for a Cena match." That is what I call legitimate in the context of wrestling. If women's matches want that same level of respect, then we HAVE to cut this bullshit of "it was good for a women's match." That's why I have a problem when Adam says that he would hate it if it were a men's match.
Julian Bell Well said. That whole section seemed like he was making excuses for an underwhelming main event, just cause it was a women's match. Just seemed kinda patronising to me.
Who else didnt watch hell in a cell then came to whatculture in the morning and saw adam wearing the undertaker costume and thought undertaker returned?
1. I'm pretty sure they are gonna withdraw this cruiserweight divivsion after seeing the reaction they get. 2. They are trying hard to make ppvs unpredictable and thus there was charlotte winning the title!
So.. Adam B. won the series and "forced" Adam P. to wear as Bret Hart, but Adam P. refused and now Adam B. is wearing the Undertaker costume anyway. Just like the all Shane O'Mac - Undertaker thing!
If it was a guys match you'd hate it right? Well yeah! Do you not see the double standard there.Holding something to a lower standard just because its women is sexist. Its a disservice to both men and women . We all need to understand equality isnt always going to be beneficial but if you do believe in it you should always treat ppl the same no matter the circumstances. If it was a bad match it shouldn't be viewed different because it was women.
They're almost to the point that they have half of chynas credibility. maybe with another 5 years of hand holding they'll be ready to let one put on a match with a cruiserweight.
Personally I also hate token women where they put them on the main event simply because they are women. But as Adam said, considering the context, where the women are brave enough to do something like Hell in a Cell, something not even Trish and Lita dared to do, and where they are gonna kill themselves in order to earn your respect, they earned mine and deserve the main event spot because it is historic. It is the first time for the women. It deserves some recognition, and I'm ok with being the main event.
The problem is, no one wants real equality. If he actually came out and said, yea, the women's matches really aren't that good, then everyone would flame him for being sexist for that too. Women aren't physically equal to men, they weren't made to be, no matter how much we want to play the PC game, it's simple anatomy. Anyone who says differently is lying to themselves. There's a reason we have the NBA and WNBA, there's a reason that the Olympics are gender split, there's a reason you don't see women in the NFL or the big soccer leagues in Europe.
Taker has said on twitter that he's medically clear and it's just WWE management keeping him away from appearing back on TV, for anyone wondering about Taker after seeing the thumbnail.
Ending was Out of nowhere but overall the women's match delivered big time. It was a great match KO vs Seth : 2nd best match of the evening Everything else was underwhelming, Typical RAW matches
Perhaps for you Not for me I enjoyed the Women more. they have so much history with each other i watched them grow from the moment they stepped foot in NXT until now. i went along for the journey so to speak Seth & KO just started a rivalrly and i expected so much more from these 2. But creative managed to make this feud feel lackluster
Please Like Me i take a few botches for granted if the overall match entertains me. Which the ladies did. Not you perse but i talk to a lot of fans who praise Lita,Trish,mickie women who paved the way for the horsewomen,but they seem to forget they knew how to botch as well. But simply because they were part of better era's it's forgiven. Some fans are hypocrites. KO v Seth was pretty boring up until the Cannonball on the outside and the sequence that followed inside the ring. That moment is when the match became exciting. The women had me hooked from the moment Charlotte blindsided Sasha. Have to agree with you on 1 thing tho. The Foley spot was too much
Adam: "It's Halloween.... Hell in a Cell.... Helloween" "Helloween" is actually the name of a band. Not only that, one of their albums is called "Walls of Jericho" and it's where Chris Jericho got both is stage name and the name of his signature submission !
I feel like "fans" expect every superstar to do 450 splashes, moonsaults, and if you don't you're automatically a bad wrestler. There are different styles of wrestling and not everyone is build for each style.
+Sam “Crossfade” Smith I know dude. The match had to happen and it was good but it could have been so much better. However the women's division can build on that and maybe we'll see more of them in the Rumble.
Sasha actually set the table up wrong. It should have been set up against the top rope but it was set up too low and that's why Sasha rolled off it rather than going through it.
Biggest issue I had tonight was you can really start to see the small rosters shine. We have seen these matches already a few times and the 3 month long feuds are kinda wearing thin. And with champions losing it only means at least a few will go on at least another month as they get their rematches
Is it just me or is the WWE banking too much on Sasha and Charlotte carrying the Women's division? So far, anything "history making" involved those two! Nobody else? What? Are the likes of Bayley, Becky Lynch and Nia Jax just chopped liver? And what happens when and IF they call up Asuka? By the time she is called up or the WWE finally pulsl their heads out their asses, there won't be anything groundbreaking for the women do accomplish because Sasha and Charlotte would have done it all! So not fair! Some women's revolution! It's more like the Sasha and Charlotte show now!
The fact the women main evented a PPV is a significant moment, but you have to separate that from the match itself. The match was full of botches, production mishaps and poor ring psychology. It was an utter mess. By any measure it was bad. The more you guys deny this, the more agenda driven and impartial you guys look. It was a bad match, it's ok to admit that and still recognize the huge moment it was for women's wrestling.
tbh they made it look like the women can't hang in hell in the cell matches and having charlotte win just made it obvious that she's only main eventing cause of her father
I was there, the issue with the Main Event was they started off high and the energy was good until the last 5-10 mins where it just fell off and the table breaking would've helped. Either way it was a good PPV. What didnt help the Cruiserweight match was that the big screen was blocked by all the banners and no one could see everything actually going on.
killer memestar if people can say "Murica", then it's all fair to misspell England any way possible. MegaGaming leather is generally expensive, unless you're like me and get full length trench coats, for free.
wwe seem to like seeing people lose in there hometown and charlotte winning keeps up her ppv unbeaten streak she will drop the belt to sasha on an episode of raw like before
Yanssy Rodas Dubon i do see y your sticking up for ur gender but us men can't stick up against women any more if they do they apparently have sexually abused a woman no If man hits a woman or rapes he deserves to die
Putting the women's match on last was a great move, but I was really disappointed by it, because I know both of the ladies can do a lot better. The in-ring work was good, but this kind of stipulation lives and dies by the 'wow' factor. They teased a cage climb, teased a suplex to the outside and teased a moonsault onto a table and none happened, while the actual spots that happened instead were nowhere near as good. The stretcher sequence at the start was also wayyyyyy too much. It looked Super-Cena levels of cheesey... it would have been better if Sasha didn't sell the powerbomb quite as much, and just flipped the stretcher and everything else when offered to her rather than getting all strapped up before resurrecting.
Yeah, the ending was so disappointing. Plus it just ruins any future wins where Sasha gets the title, as Charlotte's always going to be haunting the background. This is the second time Sasha won the title on Raw and lost it at the next PPV, and both times it didn't make sense story-wise. You'd think they'd fix the unavoidable problem at SummerSlam by having Sasha win here, but... guess not...
I think they should have just kept the title on Charlotte all month and then let Sasha win it at Hell in a Cell. That's twice now that Sasha has won the title on Raw and then lost it 27 days later at a PPV match. It makes her and the title look bad. I think a title change was probably a necessary ending to a historic match like this, but Sasha should have triumphed in her home town and won back the title there, that would have made the whole thing a lot better, I think anyway.
Just for fun, but the important thing was : The loser had to wear that costume an entire week 24/7 while the real Adam can just wear it whenever he feels like it
Adam Adam Adam... I felt the same way man, everything was good but the landing was off. I wish I could go back in time and change what happened but we can't do that :(
I think the issue with the tables in the women's match was they weren't gimmick'd properly or weren't gimmick'd at all. The women weigh a lot less. Sasha Bank weighs 114 lbs, Charlotte is 144 lbs. Most of the male wrestlers weight over 200 lbs.They just naturally fall with like twice the force behind them. The women weren't hitting the tables any differently than male superstars do, they just weren't breaking. To break those tables, they really needed to physically slam the other woman through it like Charlotte did on the announcer's table outside. Honestly, though, even with the tables not breaking, it almost looked like it hurt more as they're just slamming into wood with no give or soft mat on it like the ring has. It reminds me of martial artists breaking boards. It always hurts way worse when you hit a board and don't go through it.
I agree with the problem with the main event is that you can see that the WWE is trading the Women's Championship back and forth between Sasha Banks and Charlotte, it just devalues the title in my opinion.
I think Hell in a Cell matches usually only work and should only happen when at least one of the wrestlers are built up and accepted as a monster. Otherwise, its just a regular wrestling match in a cage. The storylines need to have weeks/months of one wrestler running away from the other. Or the 2 needing to be kept apart until the match for a Hell in a Cell to hold any merit. All those Hell in a Cell matches on that PPV would have the same response if it was a regular match. The Cell needs to be built up as an intimidating feature again.
Or the heel being part of a faction that consistently wins due to interference. The Cell serves to keep them out of it. In fact, if memory serves, the original match was invented to keep HHH and Chyna out of Taker's way.
I love seeing Adams reviews they are so much more positive than so many other people in the wrestling community, even when he's saying he doesn't like something it still sounds nice somehow lol.
I was in Boston for it, naturally rooting for sasha, and when it ended, the entire building went quiet. It was pure shock and devastation. Immediately people got up and left on the spot.
The atmosphere in the garden last night for the Womens match was so bad. Everyone could feel the buzz when the Owens/Rollins promo started and we all knew the Charlotte/Sasha match was last.The entrances were electric and everyone was on their feet... then the stretcher spot absolutely killed the crowd. After that (apart from the Eddie tribute) neither of them were getting much from us. Even though the table spots were funky I feel like they put on an amazing match for what they were getting from the crowd, from what I can see after watching the replay on the network the match came across really well evn though all of the air had been left out of the building. I think only time will tell how we remember this in a few years
There are some gimmick ppvs that are important like Royal Rumble Money in the Bank, Elimination chamber, King of the Ring and Survivor Series because they have or used to have WM or Draft implications, but others like TLC and Hell in a cell need to be changed. Halloween Havoc, New Years Revolution, Armageddon, December to Dismember etc. could replace some of the other ppv names
