This has been very informative thank you. I am very sorry for the environment but I can’t deal with the popping (and people talking about the popping) and flames with my Cobra Shotguns I am stuck with thanks to the previous owner.
Very interesting - the holes don't work! The other aspect I'm curious about is shortening intake tubes - it allows a little more flow but also changes their resonance so the intake snorkel resonance boost moves higher in the rpm - in this case probably from about 1,800rpm to 3,600rpm? And is more noticeable at higher rpm. Would a shorter intake move it further up and also increase the benefit? And does this require any air/fuel modification to realise the gains? Of course I'm wondering if we can copy this and get an easy boost... what do you say David? :-)
@@vcyclenut Thanks - I saw that but thought it only covered the high rpm not the bump at 3600. But it's good news so thank you! Very decent of you to share that with everyone when some testers want to keep it secret. Thanks! :-)
@@vcyclenut Velocity stacks are the most important by far but all pipes resonate so there are several resonances happening in the box at certain rpms. The most important is the velocity stacks, esp in conjunction with the cam profile. I think that's why this engine has a double peak in the torque curve - one is the cam and the other is the stacks. The intake snorkels will resonate too but this will be so low rpm as to not have any real effect on flow - they are tuned that low to suppress and characterise the noise not give a boost to flow. By cutting them shorter, their resonant frequency becomes higher which means they suppress noise less, esp lower frequency noise. A shorter pipe flows more too. It also means they can start to offer a small boost to flow at their new resonant frequency. This is what the torque curve shows too at 3,600rpm. That boost can spread a little by having different lengths on the intake snorkel pipes. At least, this is what the theory suggests and your testing seems to support this.
It's all in the restricted head. Heads only going to flow so much. David have you done any pulls with the filter box pulled running open intake or pod filters with stacks? It would either fall on it's face or make a bit more on the top end. I've read of cams giving up another 8 to 11hp which would add credence to the head being the choke point. But without a local tuner that can dig on the tune I've taken cams off the table for now.
@@vcyclenut Well they always worked on carb setups and allowed a bit more resolution in the tune and better syncing. Far better than any oem filter box, modded oem filter box or custom filter box. But time and tech has changed.
David, hope you get this brother. A few questions if I may? I have same set up on same bike. Without gear I am 184lbs. What do you have your sag at front and rear. Also my front is pretty dialed in with everything but with my rear I’m turned all the way in with rebound and that’s where it’s close but still has pogo effect. Was just curious as to how many clicks you are at on rear.
I'm guessing the hole saw holes in the sides of the intake area hindered the acoustic pressure inside the box. Really curious if the power would jump 3-4 hp if the airbox internal volume suddenly increased (while remaining closed) by about 15-20%. Not sure it's an actual airflow vacuum that's the choke point, more than it is simply acoustic timing of the intake wave bouncing back and forth from the valves to the airbox. Cool stuff. Fun to see someone with instruments quantifying things by testing. Something of note, a competitor found that the SC Project exhaust (the shorter megaphone style) grabbed a pretty significant little piece of power over other systems in testing.
I tested both sc configurations on the 21-23 and they performed virtually identical I don’t trust anyone’s testing but my own lol www.vcyclenut.com/sc-project-testing-cr-t--s1.html The sc was the first system I tested in the 24 ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-YM1jtK_N8U0.htmlsi=J-17G61uFPUodo2Q
The reason for the long snorkel is to keep the heavy dust particles at the bottom of the airbox. Of course you need to clean the air filter often. That is why I am using DNA filter. You clean them and back again like new. I also experimented with Sprint Filter P08 F1-85 air filter on my 2024 MT-10. It is terrible!! Allows a lot of dust to pass through, and as they state on their web, it is only for racing purposes. This one is a BIG NO filter!! ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-87rkzaHVevs.html
That fine dust is likely not a problem normally, unless you ride miles of gravel roads. People who wish to use their highest flowing filters are going to be on racetrack or drag strip. There comes a point of diminishing returns with air filters, where you can flow almost as much as no filter at all, but it's not going to trap debris either. I've had a read of their literature, I understand how their technology works compared to conventional paper filters.
@@exothermal.sprocket Who said dust is not harmful to the engine!? You attended a wrong school. Dust is a big enemy of the engine. Racing have a cost and the aim there is to win at any cost. Racing engines are serviced every several hours, not several years. Yes Sprint Filter have a different technology that works as good as DNA, BMC, or any other filter on the market. With F1 filter, they just have a more opened filtration, but there are way too many other factors to gain power while maintaining engine integrity. Be careful with what mods you do on your bike.
@@KHIJAPAN Are you talking about particles of beach sand or fine dust? Because you breath dust into your lungs every day. It's all relative. Engines safely consume a lot of dust every year and are just fine. Just depends on where the dust goes and whether or not it acts like an abrasive. Also, a byproduct of petrol is water. Engines produce a lot of water and don't rust out or dilute the oil. Filters allow all kinds of dirt through that's like 15-20 microns in size. People would do much better to focus on timely oil changes than to obsess over a little bit of dust.
@exothermal.sprocket Obviously, I am not talking about that dust, but the dust that accumulated on the throttle bodies after three days of fast ride with the Sprint filter F1 filter. Only this case. The fine dust you are referring to is not possible to block and at the same time have a decent power output from an engine. If you read carefully, you will see that I clearly talk about F1 filtration capabilities and possible problems. Of course, it is anyone choice of what to do with their engine. As an engineer and a tuner, I share my long experience.
weird that shortening the snorkels helped as well as removing the bodywork but cutting the holes did not. When you look inder the tank it even question how benifitial even the stage 2 kit would be given the the square inches of available air path between the tank and inlet. Maybe the side holes upset the air path by imposing a perpendicular air path. I'd have assumed that the air filter itself would laminer flow any disturbences of the air post filter and the inlets would smooth out the rest. Sucks that the factory engineers have so much more resorses at designing air flow than guys like us but they are too tied down with things like sounds to focus on pure air flow and performance. I pretty such I got just just a noticeable amount more of inlet sound by removing my snorkels like you saw on my facebook post but it's had to tell exactly without a stock bike to compare to back to back. Once I get an exhaust the inlet noise won't even matter.
Great to see this testing eh? Very interesting results! It seems that David has found that the snorkel intake area is already ideal, so extra intake area is not needed, and is actually detrimental because it has opened the box up too much to atmospheric pressure and this has reduced the resonance boosts at low and high rpm. What's also interesting is that this Yamaha behaves so differently from GSX8 he has tested. Is Suzuki not designing for any airbox resonance boost? Hmm.
Hi Vcyclenut! I just purchased your stage 2 airbox mod for my GSX-8R and will be getting around to the Akrapovic exhaust before the end of the year and mailing in my ECU. One of the questions in your sheet asks if we want decelerations pops, which I'd love, but I haven't heard one single deceleration pop from this engine via social media. Could you touch on what I should expect when flashing the ECU with this option? Love your work, thank you!
I have had a few customers confirm they have decel pops. When you install your full exhaust you will get them. I’ll just leave the pair valve active so you can still have them.
Hi, I got the new gsx-8s and was wondering if it's safe for the bike to do this air box mod and put something like a DNA filter instead of stock filter? Thank you for sharing! 🙏
@@vcyclenut hi i live in Denmark. And before my 8R i have a sv 650 new from 2020 and there wasnt any problem with that one. I have puld the snorkel and the foam. I dont race but drive a lot, 3500km so far. But in lov speed it jerk a bit and it is irritating, does your flash fix that problem or is it something else i can do. Best regards Jens
I’m picking up mine Tuesday and all they had is blue. So that’s what I’m getting. Damn it looks nice! Can’t wait for mine. Just sent my FZ09’s ecu like 6 months ago😊. Trading her in. This video now got me extra hyped.
How much shorter is the new end can? I have a 23 and love the akra sound, I just wish the can was a little shorter. I’d consider this new 24 model but it looks like the rear bracket is different. That and I only have 1 o2 sensor. I wish I could request this new can on the old piping/bracket haha
Man great work! I love that you show results before and after the tune. I have a 2023 mt09 and am wanting to add an SC S1. (with silencer) Only problem I have is I’m American… but living in the Philippines, so I’m not sure you can tune my ECU? 😢 I am perfectly happy with the power as is since we can’t really ride super fast here much. Top of 2-3rd in the twisties at best. Too many stray dogs and scooters! 😂 But lots of cool features you offer. Since you have real world experience with the S1 before tuning, would you say it’s dangerous? Crazy lean or anything? Do you think it would be safe to run with everything else stock and no tune? I’m sure there are tuners here but I honestly don’t know enough about them or speak the local language. Anyways, great work! If I were closer you’d be an easy choice!!
Talked to you on the phone today. Did this stage one mod in 10 mins. Worth 3 hours of work for just the sound alone. All I can say is wow! Thanks brother!
That's not a bad looking system at all for the price. I'm very mechanical, and like you I would be able to make the bracket, but they should really correct that issue because the average person is going to get to that step and then kind of be screwed. If they advertise it for all of those models, then it should be a "Bolt-On and Go" with no issues for all those models. Thanks for the content!!!!
If i don't buy the exhaust from you, can i still send ECU for flash? (for a fee obviously) Found an Italian place that will save me 400 bucks on price and cost 75 for shipping.. seems like a good deal.
I have to ask - whats the best tone in person in your opinion? And i mean for all riding conditions, idle through to highway drone? Microphones can be terrible at picking up real world sound pressures, and generally i like your taste... For example the Arrow i agree sounds lovely, but then you say this is nice as well during this vid, and im left wondering which is the best oit of the whole lot so far? I think sound quality matters as much to me as performance.
Black widow have a pretty large selection. I have have Gen1 with a 200mm shorty. For the price of an Akra I was able to get the Widow , a Woolich tune plus a QS/blipper for less than the Akra (I know a guy). Not as many options for exhausts that hold the same position that are available in New Zealand. Didn’t get it dynoed so seeing your results, I guess I made a good choice? Thanks for the clip, really appreciate it.
@@2hase only the European sp is in the software now but I’m sure it won’t be long before the usa market ecu is added. Contact me through the website and I’ll reach out when it is www.vcyclenut.com/contact-me.html
Just my prerogative. I don’t tune to an air fuel ratio, I tune to a power curve on the dyno. So when I’m posting dyno’s it’s the curve that I show. When I posted my h2 runs I show air fuel to show I’m not leaning it out to pad my numbers but on a naturally aspirated motor it doesn’t work that way. When it’s lean it makes less power.
my method to block off: remove valve and short tubes from between plates, remove longer hose to airbox, cut hose from airbox to fit between plates, connect both plates to each other without valve using the cut piece.. fill the hole in the airbox with a dab of silicone
no nothing like that at all, I had to get a new mt09 for development and dont have the room to keep adding bikes to the stable. I bought the gsx8 mostly for flash development and know I have tested enough different exhaust configurations that I can flash for any exhaust that is out or coming out
They are both good choices Quality I’d call a wash Sound I like the arrow Looks I like the arrow The arrow is lighter Me for my bike i would choose the arrow
Guess I will keep my KTM 690, was really hoping for more power and torque but looks less than what I already have? was hoping the duck would make power to around 10,200 rpm. Will be interesting to see what a flash and exhaust will do for this bike, maybe really wake it up?
I have my termis installed and am bringing it in for the reflash Tuesday. I will Be doing a full review with dyno runs. Make sure to follow the channel to catch it
Hello. I picked up a used graves headers for cheap so i figured I would install it on my 2020 R1. I notice the graves header do not have crossover tubes between 2-3 pipe like the stock headers. Base on your dyno it did not make any huge difference would you say it’s safe to run long term
As always, your through research and comparisons of incorrectly installed vs correctly installed vs stock figures, is extremely helpful. My 4RR was flashed by MooreMafia, however, when I do velocity stacks and a full exhaust, I'll be sending my ECU to you.
Did you wrap your bike black? And how much did it cost you? And in what state? Thanks. I have the white and blue one and it looks too much like a kids bike with those colors and i was thinking of wrapping it.
