Hello everyone and happy 2024. It's been a while since we've uploaded a video but that's just because we've been super busy in the field and in the shop. We're all alive and well :-). We plan on having a regular question and answer segment in the future but for now keep the questions and comments on the videos coming. I'm also currently working on a Technical Field Guide for techs to use while in the field. More updates on this as it comes along. I started this channel not to be some sort of "RU-vidr", but as a way to help emerging techs and I'm always willing to help answer questions if I can. Feel free to email your questions at www.mrpianotech.com. Thank you everybody for all the support.
With modern software, I don't see the point in tuning or even checking ANY intervals by ear. All you need to really learn nowadays is doing your unisons by ear and really you don't even need to learn that. I paid $100 for a feature-limited version of a $700 piece of software and, yeah.....forGET that ear stuff. I have a very GOOD ear but, I mean ...what's the point? There isn't one.....the apps are out of this world.
@@SomeDumUsrName Not true due to inharmonicity. The primary piano tuning apps will have to listen to the piano, a few notes in each octave, and you’ll have to tell it where the bass/treble bridge splits are and it can get pretty close but it won’t be perfect. Each piano needs a slightly different tuning as the scale design, length of the strings, and other factors make it necessary to apply a “human ear” to make decisions as to what sounds better…the intervals or the octaves and the preferences of the player themselves. There’s much more to piano tuning than most people understand. Unfortunately because of these apps around nowadays people think it’s easier than it really is, and I’ve compared many of them and I was amazed how far off most of them were, even up to a few cents off in the temperament.
@@MrPianoTech Well the software I chose builds an inharmonicity map for the piano being tuned...even the abbreviated version I have. And speaking of perfect, there is no such banana....not even with the best human ears and ability. Using this app, I can out-tune many good by-ear tuners I've sat down behind. Not saying it'd be good for a 9' concert grand in a high-profile-classical-performance setting but, hey.... just not many out there playing at that level and of those that do - audience included - half or most of them problem won't even be able to hear what little discrepancies there are from tuning using good software. It's like anything else: Only the person who does a particular thing professionally is going to notice the teensy tiny things that are wrong with it.
IMO it's not possible to get a good profile when facing each hammer 'in situ.' For this reason I always take all the hammers off before re-facing (re-shaping) worn hammer felts. With an upright, it helps if the piano in question has butt plates. Fortunately for me, here in the UK there are not too many 'Spinet' type uprights, because with this type of upright, usually the action is connected to the keys via connecting rods, just to add to the lenght of time such a job can take. Of course, with most grands it's easy to unscrew each hammer in turn to do this, though a little harder with a Simplex (D-Section) action which some baby gands have, due to the spring-and-loop system where the loop passes trough a hole in the jack and has to be 'uncoupled' before the hammer can be removed. On an upright where there are no butt plates, one has to dismantle the action - but in any case return tapes and balance hammer leathers need to be replaced at the same time, depending upon the age of the piano and the amount of wear. And damper cushion felts often need replacing due to wear against the damper spoons. Needless to say there can come a point where the hammers are just too badly worn, so it becomes necessary, or at least highly desirable, to install a new set of hammers.
I’ve never had a problem accessing the entire hammer, just takes some practice. It’s even easier in a grand since you can just pull the action, turn it around, and place it back in the piano to work on it. You run the risk of damaging, losing, or misaligning things not to mention the time it takes to do it properly. And, not everyone can afford to have the entire action rebuilt just because it needs a voicing.
@@michaelbarrett3926 Where there's not much wear on the hammers, and you're only having to voice, of course with an upright you just voice in situ - though sometimes one needs to tilt the action back for access. HOWEVER: Where re-facing is required, due to wear and flattening of the hammer, to get the correct profile, one often has to take some felt off the shoulders. To do this properly on an upright, each hammer has to be taken off. If you're none to fussed about getting back the correct profile of each hammer, then that's up to you, but I like to maintain the highest standard of work that I'm able to do. As for re-alignment of hammers, in an upright with butt plates - assuming the alignment was correct in the first place - then that's not an issue. Although, if the hammers were not correctly aligned in the first place, it's essential to re-align, which in any case necessitates the removal of the dampers and the levers (whippens) in order to be able to align without risking breaking any of the whippens/jacks. But when doing an action rebuild on an upright which does have butt plates, as we know, the hammers have to be put back on first, and aligned with the strings, prior to then putting back the levers (or whippens as you call them) and aligning the jacks with the butt notches and then replacing the dampers and aligning them properly too. It has been my experience that if hammers have enough wear to necessitate re-facing, more often than not one has to replace return tapes and replace the balance hammer leathers at the same time. However, I do take your point about the expense - therefore the owner of the piano has to weigh up for themselves how much they want or can afford to have done on their piano. Certainly some cases are 'borderline,' where in an ideal world one would re-face prior to voicing - which is of course my usual practice. But where there is not too much wear/flattening of hammer felts, one can just voice the hammers. I did this a few days ago for a customer with a Welmar 5' 6" grand (in essence a Bluthner grand with a different name on the fall-lid, the frame design being identical to Bluthner). My customer was pleased to avoid too much expense, and the wear on the hammers wa mimimal. I've had 46 years experience as a piano tuner/technician.
Setting the pin is still required but I mentioned in the beginning of the video that this video doesn’t cover that. It could really use a whole separate video as proper pin-setting is incredibly important. In this video I go through my process of tuning and is meant more for tuners who already have a good handle on proper pin-setting technique.
Some of the big uprights of that era, like this one, were absolutely splendid, though needing a lot of rework to bring back to new condition. I had another one made in New England, a Huntington from Connecticut. We couldn't afford a refinish of the now rough outside or new strings, but still was able to get the works reconditioned and felts replaced, and it served well for years yet till basement flooding took its toll. Still it was rugged enough that it took several of these floods before the cabinet came unglued and gave up the ghost. That was a prosperous era and pianos like this were built like tanks.
Thank you. Very useful info! I have been able to solve all problems with my Yamaha upright's action except one. One key, G3#, produces an intermittent "twangy buzz" sound on top of the tone when struck. I don't know how to describe it any other way. It's not always there, and not at all force levels, but it is enough to be noticeable on pieces like the Moonlight Sonata. The piano was recently restrung and refinished. Could that be a problem with the new strings or the action? Thanks!
Usually when I run into this problem it is due to a bit of debris touching the string. On an upright the most common place for this to occur is at the bridge. Take off the bottom board and look at the string where it meets the bridge, behind the bass strings. You may find there’s a little bit of wood or something hanging out where the string meets the bridge. It may be hard to see but it sounds like something is touching the string whenever it vibrates hard enough to make contact with whatever it is.
Hello, thank you for your videos and greetings from Germany. I am a pianist and I bought an old Carl Mand piano but it sounds very good, I have been adjusting it and I noticed that the distance from the hammer to the strings is 51mm I reduced it to 44mm because I play repertoire with many repetitions by adjusting the capstan but sometimes it plays well and sometimes there are dead notes, also notice that the release button is closer (which modifies the escapement) so the notch feels "harder" when bringing the hammer closer to the string the knuckle is misaligned from the famous "magic line" Should I align this as you mention in your video apart from bringing the hammer closer to the string? If you see the machine in profile, it is easy in the first and last part because it is visible , but how do you do it in the rest of the keys? Wouldn't it be practical to disassemble one by one, or do you just use the tool to try it as trial and error? Thank you so much :)
Hello Dylan. Yes, once you make one adjustment you'll have to then make the others. You can do all steps per note one at a time but I find it quicker to adjust one setting all the way through the action then move onto the next. For proper repetition pay special attention to the placement of the jack on the knuckle and the repetition spring tension. Also, check the condition of the knuckles, if they're a bit stiff you can use some teflon powder on them or they might need to be replaced if they're not working smoothly.
@@MrPianoTech Thank you very much for sharing your knowledge, it really helps a lot. The knuckles are fine and the action in general is in good condition, I assumed that by bringing the hammer closer I had to adjust everything but it is better to ask an expert like you 🙂with some adjustments I have managed to make it respond better to repetitions, but I feel still something strange on the keyboard. (Maybe because I haven't reviewed the repetition spring yet, I don't know how to do that and I don't want to ruin it) I “Adventured” myself to do it because it is my piano and I can experiment, but I wouldn't do that with someone else's piano!! It is a lot of work and knowledge that you need. If I had a question, could I send you a photo by email?
@@dylanmcqueen4656 Absolutely, email is fine. I find once you go through all the steps it should work fine. If it doesn’t then it’s usually time to either replace parts or a repair is needed somewhere.
What type of wax do you use in the wood bedding in order to the glide the una corda pedal? Some un cordas stop functioning because of friction between the wood bed and the piano wood. Is there a special wax?
I don't recommend using wax as it will collect dust and other debris over time. I prefer to use Teflon powder. In a pinch you can use a graphite pencil to draw on the keybed underneath the bedding screws to keep things moving.
At the 31:00 mark, you have one string that goes down and back.. is that string actually for two different keys? In other words, each hammer hits 3 strings and it looks like its the long string on one set of three and then it comes back and is the short string on the next set of three?
Michael, Can you explain a bit more about the twists you gave the new bass string near the hitch? Why do you do it and how. The video was a bit unclear there.
Sure! So the copper winding on bass strings is wrapped around the steel core. You want to twist the entire string in the direction of the winding to keep it tight. Sometimes you’ll encounter a piano with bass strings that make a buzzing sound when played, that’s the winding coming loose. When a piano that I’m not putting new strings on exhibits this problem I’ll loosen the tuning pin, about one full turn or so should do it, enough so that you can remove the string’s loop off the hitch pin at the end opposite the tuning pin. Then, using pliers, you’ll twist the string in the direction of the winding, one or two full turns usually does it, then slip the loop back on the hitch pin and retighten. The buzz should be gone. When installing a new string, after you attach the bass string to the hitch pin, and have coiled the string onto the new pin, you’ll do the same thing but from the end with the tuning pin instead. So before I pound the new tuning pin into the pinblock, I’ll give it a solid full turn or so in the direction of the winding. If I’m doing a field replacement of a bass string, after I put the wound loop onto the old tuning pin, I’ll do the twisting as if the string was buzzing, as noted above, at the hitch pin. It just keeps the winding tight.
Thank you very much for sharing your knowledge, I am a pianist and the tone of my Grand piano is very bright, even though I bought it, it is old but I want the mellowest sound, so I will carefully try this technique!! Thank you for your time and contribution. :) Sorry my EN. Best regards from Germany.
it’s so useful to see the tuning hand. i was quickly taught and loaned a strobe tuner in 2001 when i was in high school and secretly taught myself piano. i’ve tuned many other peoples pianos. this was before youtube, facebook groups, etc to have a community to draw opinions from. i came from guitar tuning which is great because we use often use harmonics and listen to beats. i was taught to go sharp and then flat, but wasn’t taught to jiggle or have sharp movements. my hammer etiquette has been like yours. it was also before aps and i wasn’t serious enough to buy a strobe. i tuned A4 and turned the tuner off. i put an ad out to tune a piano for 20 bucks. obviously it was people that wanted it majorly tuned and didn’t want to pay much. i definitely did a good preliminary tuning, but got a good experience. eventually i was tuning one a week for more money. now i have a nice ap for $30, people to draw knowledge from, and i might try to be more professional.
great demonstration. i used to tune the middle octave using 4ths and fifths and checking with my 3rds and sixths to get temperament. i then when down and did mostly the same, but used 5ths and octaves moreso. as i went up i used more 5ths and 6ths. ps: Db and F is a major 3rd. i don’t even know what to call a C# and an F. haha. perhaps dim4, but that’s not part of a diminished chord. aug5 descending?
My english is bas sorry ,.About the base section you made, for the regulate. I understand that lever tool height, is in the hight of the strings. Τhe height is adjusted in this way as if the mechanism were inside the piano. So, if I want to make something similar for another piano, I will have to measure inside the piano between the distance of the strings and which point? Thanks you for the video, is very helpful.
my distance from hammer to the string at the left side is 21,5 but my hammer distance is not at 46mm. Is 50mm. Should I lower all the hammers to 46? .My problem is that when I play, very softly, the keyboard doesn't always pick up, it's like I have to put more power in a specific point otherwise it won't be heard. At this particular point, the keyboard also makes a click, but without sound, if I put less force than it wants.@@MrPianoTech Thank you for your time.
If your hammers are 50mm away from the strings that's likely too far. Try reducing the amount by moving the hammers closer to the strings by adjusting the capstan underneath the whippen. With the hammers a bit closer and the letoff set properly it should be easier to play. The hammer shanks should not be resting on the hammer rest felt rail, that's just for the rebound. If they're resting on that rail the hammers are too far away. Also, if that rail is set too low, or if it's loose, either the rail can make a tapping sound or the hammer shank may hit the adjustment screw that will adjust the repetition lever height. @@orfeastops1408
Greetings from Toronto Canada. Thank you for your amazing videos. A very good way to learn more about this wonderful profession. I wish you were in Toronto. I would have offered to help, in the weekends especially (free of charge of course) - just to learn more and maybe you might have needed an extra hand. Cheers and all the best.
You deserve all the love. This is the kind of instruction that will be worth its weight in gold if, godforbid, piano techs ever start becoming even rarer.
Thank You so much. I care so much for my piano, but also not anxious to let anyone work on it unless they truly know what they're are doing!!! Your videos have been SO helpful.
Oh my gosh you are so underrated, I would've easily dropped A couple grand on a course to teach me what you just taught me in a 23 minute video, you're a real one! ❤❤❤
Thanks! I’ve considered it, I’ve had a lot of people ask about it. What I did for now was I put a link in the video description to photos showing the measurements of it. Hope that helps for now but since I’ve had so much interest in it I think I’ll put something together in the future.
Such an awesome comprehensive video. Thanks so much. I learned so much and you explained the concepts so clearly. Just subscribed. Looking forward to watching more!
If youre just starting can you tune a piano in multiple sessions? Or is that bad for the piano. My piano is relatively new and usually gets tunned once a year. Ive tunned a few notes here and there successfully. I just want to tune the whole piano because its quite rewarding.
It’s best to do it all at once but if you’re learning I don’t see why you couldn’t split it up assuming you’re not doing a pitch raise, more than 2 or 3 cents, so that the tension balance doesn’t get thrown off across the piano.
