Got the first game with a nadu player, i counter the thing, bounced than turned into a merfolk 1/1 with mystic reflection. It tassa’s oracle us after a 20 min turn. The problem is not strong, its long turns to do the generic “you win” stuff
My problem is less the power level (although that does raise my eyebrows), it’s turns taking forever. We had a Krarkashima player in our pod who we’ve since refused to play against that deck because the turns just go on and on. As to whether or not Birdboi should be banned, I’m largely undecided. It does feel a little insultingly silly that in the case of Nadu, you cannot in fact, bolt the bird.
A good point. Turns taking forever is the reason I took my Obeka apart. I've been surprised recently at the amount of people playing Nadu at full power in casual games. Members of my play group have said it's all over Arena. I think I'm quite spoiled by having an established play group that's worked hard on the idea of what casual means so yet to face the never ending turns of an optimised Nadu build. Maybe Magic Con Amsterdam will change that 😬
I do enjoy doing a scaled down build. But it’s hard to convince a playgroup you aren’t doing the thing they’ve learned to fear. I find these decks usually get targeted just for having these types of commanders in the zone.
Agreed. I'm pretty lucky, having a play group that's worked really hard on establishing rules that safeguard everyone's weekly trip to our LGS, to the extent, no one would want to sit down and pretend a deck is something it's not. A random pod - different story, I'm sure. But, it's beyond me why anyone would lie about a deck just to win a casual game. The worry is - can the deck building restriction I put on Nadu really restrict it's potential to make someones rule 0 presentation of it accurate?
I can imagine it's a hard sell for a random pod. This comes from someone who used to pilot Atraxa but as a sagas build. Players still saw Atraxa and painted a bullseye on my 40 life.
This card is taking over cEdh tables, a powered down version won't make a difference. The only way to truly control it is to force the blue player to "waste" their counter spell in hopes the nadu doesn't have a counter of their own. Or a board wipe, once again hoping for no counter spell. Removal just helps Nadu. This is dumb design and shouldn't be defended.
As a massive Ravnica and Niv-Mizzet fan, I loved this. However, considering this was an hour-long battle, the ending felt very anticlimactic. I suggest a simple stylized edit of the winner and commander at the end, similar to what's at the beginning.
I think it’s clear out of the 4 they put less effort into the Energy One, knowing that another Jeskai Energy Precon was coming a few months later in MH3.
Definetly a 'seed' product. Did introduce me to my big boy, Liberty Prime - question is, do I upgrade my LP deck with MH3 or keep it all Fallout cards?
A few pieces I'd recommend would be; (A good chunk of these are budget includes) Troll of Kazadum, Oliphant and Generous Ent. Not only they find you land drops, they also make Coram's power go up. Gravebreaker Lamia-Entombs any card and reduces casting costs from the yard. Six-Mills and allows retrace. Phyrexian Dreadnaught-1 mana to make Coram a 12/12 and Rubblehulk-Not only increases Coram's power but also can double it for one combat. Tortured Existance-If you need to put something larger from hand to yard, or the otherway around. Mincrank/Syr Konrad/Bloodchief Ascension-Either for combo or synergystic use by themselves. Anger-Huge in this deck alongside Filth and Brawn. Entomb and Buried Alive-Very useful Essence Harvest-Can kill someone if Coram's power is high Underrealm Lich-Great card selection Key to the City-Not only makes Coram unblockable but also allows you to put something with large power stat to yard Aftermath Analysts-Mill tech also can bring all your lands back Nature's Will-Allows you to use your mana to cast stuff from yards after Coram connects Lord Windgrace-Great rummage tech, also allows you to return lands from yard to field
Yes, definitely the hardcore option. I went the rads route; I've seen what a Mesmeric Orb does to the pod's morale haha - would def. have it sleeved up ready to swap in for random pods though.
How are you able to drag cards from Scryfall into Archidekt? It doesn't work for me. It basically just opens the card on Scryfall when I drag and drop it into Archidekt.
This would be insane with blue! I like the building restriction without though, and it let's The Wise Mothman shine, as it was a milly boy released quite recently. Hope all is well over at @Camp_MTG!
Troll and Oliphant are good fodder Stat holders. While gold fishing my version of the brew. I found it even better with terror of the peaks/warstorm surge and rakdos joins up. U get the burn of power from coming in to play and going to the yard. Tainted strike berserk and soul's fire is crazy.
I remember clocking Titanoth Rex and thinking it was a similar design to what the were trying to achieve in 'Scourge' with Decree of Pain etc - stuff to do early and late. I love those types of designs and they rule in reanimator.
Terror is such a scary proposition and really validates the red in this build because it could quite easily be a Yargle and Multani build if the red is taken out. Love these suggestions.
I like to think I would play any deck except STAX but I think I would just scoop versus this Commander unless it is CEDH. This is not an EDH commander.
Thanks for this comment. There's so much back and forth on where the commander fits; there's another comment saying this isnt Cedh, so clearly it's quite a divisive card. I'm wondering if you can build interesting, casual decks with commanders who have such a competitively high ceiling? Is that worth investing time in? I think it might be but it's clearly not a path everyone wants to travel.
@@mtgspecs It’s a deck that I would expect to reliably be able to win by turn 4 (you draw your deck and put all your land into play). I don’t expect it to be the most powerful CEDH commander but it is without a doubt a CEDH commander. The problem is that this commander is like training wheels for bad players. Remove all nuance and skill from the game and give players a commander that they can succeed with in spite of themselves. It’s the opposite of taking a relatively weak Commander and building a competitive deck around it to showcase your skill for playing the game. You have to go out of your way with this Commander for it not to be broken. It’s like playing Urza, Lord Artificer without any artifacts, where you are only playing it for its 3rd ability. You could for example build this deck without any abilities that repeatedly target your own creatures, but almost no one is going to do that. It’s designed to be a pubstomper commander.
It's sad, that simic has just become a damp land/card smoothering of value and busted cards. Whenever I've build a simic commander deck, it has been one of the easiest things in magic ever. Granted, there are a few fairly unique commanders, but they do still profit from the busted cards available to simic brewers. And having to artificially reduce the "natural" power of a colour combination just so others can hang with it, shouldn't be the solution. IMO simic should just not get any new busted cards, unless the other colour combinations are on an actually equal playing field.
I feel reducing natural power is not the same as building with restrictions but it is very telling to me, as someone who gravitates towards restriction, jank and theme when building, that I don't have a Simic build in my own roster. I had Gor Muldrak, and the card draw was very niche, in an attempt to not go all in on staples and overwhelming power - it just couldn't compete. The balancing act is very difficult for sure, you can stumble into high power quickly with Simic just by playing the baseline it offers. Then there's arguments to be made for LD balance effects to keep it in check, playgroups discussion about acceptable builds - if those arguments exist, inherently there's a problem. But I do believe there are unique options as you say, and Simic is the excellent entry level for new people.
Honestly given that the busted decklist doesn't sport the tutors and pods and the game enders are not as simple and unstoppable as Craterhoof, and how the busted decklist still wins turn 4~5, it makes me think Nadu was made to help Simic in CEDH rather than just a regular high power commander
I really appreciate this comment; opens up a respectful dialogue. I spent a lot of time researching CEDH for this video, what counts as CEDH and how my first list would hang with that crowd - I think it's inconsistent in that it can go off in a few unplanned directions and does not take full advantage of Nadu as a CEDH commander. That list wouldn't be competitive with super tuned CEDH decks but I think you are right - those inconsistent paths lead to the same consistent turn 4 win by sheer volume of cards and ways to play them. It's like it 'tsunamies' its way to a win. A low tiered CEDH deck it may be. I do like how it might be the gateway to that type of play though. Appreciate your thoughts.
@@lukelee508 Oh, no, not designed for CEDH. I was having a conversation with someone last night about decks winning on turn 4, they felt that was CEDH.
I've been playtesting it and yesterday I was pretty low on it as a decent list but today, the playtesting has shown it's exactly like a casual list should be - sometimes it fails, sometimes it does just fine and sometimes, it goes completely nuts. I like energy, it feels like a good match. Maybe need to take out a few energy creatures for some more interaction, time will tell.
The biggest issue I see is the length of turns you could be taking, if you have any landfall effect that spits out a creature on etb and 0 equip artifact you could in theroy dig for a long long long time.
This is 100% right. I filmed some 'gold fishing' of the first list to include in the video but it went on forever; by turn 3/4, I was seeing 20+ cards and dealing with multiple triggers - the video would have been twice as long.
Immediately loved the art and the style of the card. A bird wizard. I want to build this! Then I read the card. I though, it can’t be that bad, I can still build it. Then I read it again.
I hear you. It's in this wierd place where not building to its full potential, and this goes for any commander, feels like a waste. Recently, I've had a shift towards theme, flavour and setting deck building restrictions; you absolutely could build this with restraint, but Nadu's PR is obviously terrible and is anyone outside of your usual play group going to believe that it's 'not that type of deck?'. But that art is STUNNING.
@@mtgspecs 1. Ugin’s Binding 2. New Ulamog 3. Warren soultrader There’s so many to pick from tbh. Usually a set has a few insane cards but this set feels like they cranked the dial too much
I don't want to build it cEDH but I don't think I can build it to the extent that the more casual tables would be okay with. It's just inherently a bit too good.
It feels like a lot of work to make it fit somewhere. I'm intrigued as to where design saw this finding a home. The 'neutered' list has been fun to playtest but there's this nagging feeling I could be doing more. I just know, with all the work my play group has put into making game nights fair and fun, Nadu wouldn't be welcome in one form and wouldn't survive in the other!
@@only1sn1not1taken it has a really slow start, and then flashes of Nadu's potential as it gets to. Turn 4/5 and from there, I see it start to come alive. It needs work, I think I may take out a few of the energy cards and exchange them for some ways to stall - Propaganda, Crawlspace. Potentially, in a 4 player game, you'd be overlooked and then have a huge turn. Adventurers Gear is lethal when attached to Nadu. It needs tweaks, may be worth that effort.
It sounds excellent. Chishiro is cheaper and way more impactful than Preston in this list. Preston is a top down, flavour led design that deserved its own deck. Great choice.
I've also got a Tom Bombadil deck that has a hard time justifying actually casting Tom most of the time... I did recently learn something about sagas that I didn't know, though, and it's going to have me playing Tom much more often: if you have counter removal that's instant speed, you can wait for the final chapter of a saga is on the stack and remove a lore counter. The state based effect that determines if you sac the saga checks 2 things: Has the final chapter trigger left the stack? Are there still lore counters equal to or greater than the final chapter's count? This lets trigger the final trigger of a saga, which trigger's Tom's ability, but then you remove a lore counter after the final trigger is on the stack, and you get to keep the saga that should have been sacced as well as "cascading" for a new one. Kinda nutty. My List: archidekt.com/decks/5042448/hey_dol_merry_dol
You are absolutely correct. I believe it didn't change the outcome of the game but well done for catching that. And thanks for watching, much appreciated.
GREATLY enjoyed this gameplay video! Eris is a new favorite of mine and was very excited to see how this would play out. Looking forward to more battles on this channel!
With chronatog, you can cast the one ring, giving you protection from everything until your next turn. Then, you activate the ability in your end step, skipping your next turn, pass the turn, and activate it again in your opponents endstep. You then keep activating it again and again in each of your opponents end steps, as you can activate it every turn and the effect stacks, essentially locking you out from taking another turn, allowing you to maintain the protection indefinitely. Obviously if chronatog gets removed you wont be able to use it anymore, but still a funny interaction to pull off,
in many ways, I would suggest that science was loosely inspired by buckle up. One example that comes to My mind is the backup Commander, Liberty prime. and for the upgrades, I only have three in mind. academy manufacturer, Piper and junktown
@@mtgspecs The best part is, the big guy generates energy and card draw simply by sacrificing token artifacts. something which, this deck conveniently generates lots of. Madison only get you one energy and even then, it's pretty much contingent on casting artifact spells. so, simply creating tokens like food or treasure probably wouldn't do it I imagine. we're not getting my signs that, Liberty prime is going to be my commander. I have seen someone play the backup Commander for buckle up and he does a really good job with it. and as I've said, Liberty prime is pretty similar.
@@mtgspecsan update on my end... I got to try out science with Liberty prime as the commander and it works out beautifully. there were definitely some synergies that people do not consider for this deck, like combining the vending machine with academy manufacturer and Liberty prime. Liberty prime as well as every other creature will definitely get super beefy in this deck as well.
My only gripe so far is that you keep saying kyzar instead of Ceasar? It’s not kyzar…it’s ceasar, like ceasar salad. It’s so cringe when you say it wrong.
I'm not sure if you've had an opportunity to play the masterpiece that is New Vegas but depending on your faction, that's how his name is pronounced. If not, you totally should, it's a great game. Otherwise, hope you got something from the video, this deck is scary good.
“Kyzar” as you put it is the original pronunciation in Latin and is where the Germanic “Kaiser” comes from. Both pronunciations are true just in their subsequent origins
I tried to include cards w/ scry triggers to control the flow. But, yes artifact & enchantment creatures plus low to the ground battles and a planes walker or two were part of my Loot build as well.
I'm currently editing the match featuring Loot and man that deck goes off. Next on my list is battle research - the blue kraken convoke one would dominate in that list.
Putting some nice additions from this into my Shelob deck. Thanks for the insight! My only problem is i have about 150 cards i want to put into this deck now :S
Sure, no problem. I played against this build yesterday and had my commander bounced with one of these spells - the decision to return to the command zone and incur command tax vs leave on top and take the tempo loss, I. E. not being able to draw a new card that could help while I was behind contributed to me losing the game. With non commander creatures, the same tempo loss occurs and I've found it an interesting way to look at removal - in a sense, if your opponent can't draw more than one new card, you've 'time walked' their ability to bring a new element to their game plan or to the board state.
