00:00 Download the Conscious Spending Plan so you can use your money GUILT-FREE: iwt.com/csp-youtube Please remember: These are real people who had the courage to come on my podcast and ask for help. Would you be willing to come on this podcast and share every detail of your financial life? Feel free to leave comments based on what you think, but remember that we are here to help in a supportive way, not to demean and criticize.
facts!!!! im a musician who has gotten rave reviews in my past and made 5000 too. but it took me YEARS ahahahahah. five a month is fucking amazing. only if he enjoys the task though. i turned down a bunch of money because I do not enjoy a lot of shit i was being asked to do.
I normally find Ramit so insightful, but I think he missed some this time. I do think Gina expects James to make a lot more money. I think it's much more about dollars for her than the equal participation in decisions and planning Ramit insisted she really wanted. And that resonates with Gina's mom always saying her dad didn't make enough money. Gina brought up repeatedly how she wants James to be able to split the cost of trips, to save and invest, to have enough money he doesn't have to worry about it. But she never was asked to deal with the fact that no matter how responsible he is with his money, there is a built-in significant disparity. The two choices are 1) she lives the lifestyle she wants and comes to terms with either not including James in it or covering them both financially. OR 2) they significantly change their lifestyle together. She was never really asked to compromise there. And James wants to be involved. He brought this up many times, "Wait, let's talk about it." "I see these mystery plane tickets and I wish we'd discussed it first." "I feel pressured to keep up with her lifestyle, so I stretch myself to pay for things I otherwise wouldn't instead of saving and investing." These are all paraphrased from memory, but I don't believe unfairly. I also empathize with his expressing that it's hard to be involved, since any input he has would be a sobering "brake" that would take into account his income, which she has demanded stay separate, and he doesn't want to be this "brake" on Gina who can afford these experiences, or be the reason she can't have them. Maybe James is selling himself short when it comes to earning potential. But there are some harsh realities that need to be confronted when you have a 99th percentile income, choose to spend it on extravagant experiences, and want your partner to both participate in those experiences and pay for them via his strictly separate account, despite not having the money to do so. It seems like at the end of the show, the "reasonable" resolution was that James triple his already above median income very quickly. I think a more hopeful, more likely path would be the two of them embracing a concept of "our" money- and once that's done, adjusting expectations and re-evaluating what contributing to the relationship means, and some new goals for spending, saving and dreaming big, both individually and as a couple.
Thank you! I’m disappointed this wasn’t addressed. Tbh this episode grossed me out. She’s comfortable selling her soul to be a corporate lawyer and wants a ridiculously lavish lifestyle, but so she can feel good about it she trots out her starving artist husband at 5 star resorts (in countries that are impoverished). Also ZERO charitable contributions mentioned and no estate planning! So weird 😮
100% agree with these comments I’ve followed each of Ramit’s episodes from the start, really enjoyed his perspective, and this discussion was a huge disappointment. It really turned me off Ramit. This couple revealed Ramit’s own blind points, which seem to be gender bias (if the genders were reversed, wouldn’t he advocate shared finances??) and that Ramit seems to think that high income = morally superior (or at least way smarter) than everyone else. Not true. I expected better from Ramit. Would be happy to see Ramit review and react to these comment and see if, after everything settles, he has any different perspective on this conversation. He’s the one always advocating for self reflection….
Yes, how glib they were about ‘ok, you just need to 3x your income rapidly’ shocked me. He’s a musician! Do you realise how well he’s doing taking that into account?
Weird episode! I feel like Ramit lost focus of the big issues for this couple: 1. She's doesn't have fair expectations of her husband and is being stingy with her income - she's a huge earner and can afford to provide them with a nice lifestyle. He's an artist and brings other valuable contributions to the marriage. If the roles were reversed, we wouldn't think twice about a man supporting his wife. 2. They are seriously behind in their investments. With almost 10 years at a high income level, they should have at least 3-5 million put away. I feel like Ramit got distracted by how much she makes and didn't adequately address the underlying issues. The episode went by with no real lessons for her. Her husband seems great.
After this episode I cannot watch his show anymore. His advise is pretty clear, he’s probably also not combining finances with his wife either. Dave Ramsey would be a better coach for this couple
I feel like Ramit really missed the mark this with this one. For James to have to sit out trips when they are making over 600K a year is nuts. This is not a partnership
No way he would have told a wife: Look, your husband wants to go on these trips YOU can't afford, so he should go alone and you can use the time to hustle at home and finally contribute!
This might be the first episode where I haven’t agreed with the counsel given. The husband was made out to be the problem but he really isn’t. Even if he made $150k he would not be able to keep up with the lifestyle she wants to have and “contribute”. She makes more than enough for both of them….
Yeah that was shit when Ramit said that James here needs to work on his money scarcity mindset. James didn’t ask for Gina to buy him shoes, but she did anyway and then was upset that he doesn’t see things that need to be done? Doesn’t click. For the household items it does, he can shop and restock things too but is he paying for that himself or is she? As a musician, I’d expect him to have worn out shoes etc, that’s style lol and also he’s not bothered by it
How can he possibly keep up when SHE can't even keep up? Their net worth is abysmal considering their age and earnings. Pouring more water into a bucket with holes is futile.
I almost always agree with Ramit but this was the rare occasion that I felt at odds with his advice. Gina will always make more than her husband and I think they need to get on the same page about their partnership financially rather than blasting James for not making enough when he partner certainly does for the both of them. It does sound like they are moving in the right direction though after the call.
Why is he paying 40% of the rent and 100% of the utilities when she makes 10x his income? Why is she surprised that he is barely treading water and not able to save that much? This episode is so confusing. The man was struggling to pay off a $1k CC debt. What is this marriage? 😭
@@Capycorgi feel like he felt he found a kindred spirit in her..like he saw himself in her or vice versa...I really think that skewed things..created a bias.
Yep the diagnosis could have been that this couple has a spending problem. Yes, they can afford their lifestyle right now, but they can't continue to stay at 5* hotels and resorts when they stop working (in 10-15 years) because they aren't saving enough. That being said she could probably increase her income by 50-100% and as long as they save a good chunk of that money they'll be okay. I do wonder if Ramit let his biases slip a little here, if they were spending this money on luxury cars instead of travel, would he have been as forgiving?
Seeing this title I expected like 100k vs 10k. One partner clearly being a bum and holding the other back. That is NOT AT ALL what this is and I think the wife needs to come back down to earth and recognize 60k is a good salary for someone their age. It's amazing for someone doing music. *She is a societal outlier* and she can't expect her husband or 99% of people to catch up
Ramit I've watched many of your episodes, but this one broke my heart for James, who makes a decent income and probably busting his ass to keep up with his wife. I understand as a female geena may want to protect the wealth that she worked really hard for, but it's not fair for James to have to stress to keep up.
There was so much wrong with this episode! First, This couple and Ramit travel the same. RAMIT IS A MULTI-MILLIONAIRE! This couple is living like millionaires but they are not! He never called them out for not having enough emergency savings, they don't plan or save for vacations; they just spend on a credit card then pay it off? Also why did Ramit not highlight that she contributes 20-something percent towards fixed costs while he contributes 40-something percent? How is he going to contribute to their $45,000 vacations and retirement savings? ---and then they were bullying him even more about not contributing more to fixed costs? Then Ramit wants him go it alone and have the consequences. I kind of get it, but all of those things can't happen at the same time. What if his clients really stop working with him if he raises his rates? Should she kick him out, or not let him use the toilet paper? I am just beside myself. It felt like the Twilight Zone! There HAD to be something they left out of this episode.
I couldn’t agree more. I honestly can’t understand why she has a problem paying for him or sharing her earnings with him. I agree that Ramit seems to have joined sides with her because he felt a kinship since she spends money the way he does.
Was really surprised when Ramit didn't acknowledge her "his little money market account" comment. It was gross and he usually calls out jabs/comments like that. Does Geena really want an "equal" partner? She mentioned her prior husband didn't work (visa issues) and now she's with someone who makes 10x less than she does.
Exactly And I think she's frustrated that he doesn't go by certain things around the house and she has to do it. But at the same time she won't have a joint account with him. So it's not right that he would spend all his income on toilet paper and little stuff like that when they had a joint account and they just put money aside for household things. He could take the card and go buy the little stuff cuz I don't think it's right that he has to spend his income on there that kind of stuff
This! I was surprised how much rent and fixed costs he paid in comparison. It is a lack of empathy (or accountability) she has for him when she expects him to pay for fixed costs in an inequitable percentage along with the trips and then expect him to save?
@@Kevin.Grindel100%. Combine finances, there is no my money or her money - we make sure the bills are paid, savings is funded, and the rest is play money for both of us
I didn’t understand the direction ramit was going on this episode. The probable reason why James can’t invest or save is because he’s living a lifestyle that Geena wants to live. The solution for this is to have Geena go on vacation alone because James cannot afford it?? What kind of married couple can make this last?
Yeah, horrible advice all around. Ramit was off on this, blinded by his bias of the high earner. His elitism is showing in this, and it’s not attractive.
Thank you to Geena and James for sharing their stories. I must admit that I’m disappointed that Ramit put it all on James. She married a musician, essentially. She shouldn’t suddenly expect him to become a type-A personality like her. It’s sad that she tells him he’s thinking small. Did he agree to make a certain amount of money when they got married? Is he making less than he used to? If you’re truly a married couple, get over who pays for what. If she wants them to take multiple $40,000 trips each year and can afford to pay for them, great! But don’t get on him because he’s not making enough to pay any material amount of such a lifestyle.
I can’t believe they don’t have combined finances for things like these trips. Why should he have to pay for it at all if they’re married? Her money is his money!
Exactly, he’s only ‘thinking small’ in her terms, they seem unwilling to accept that maybe you can’t just earn 180k as a musician in NY through brute willpower.
Ramit, I hope you’ll maybe address this in the future. It’s really odd to me how you came down so hard on him while she refuses to combine finances and lets him struggle with debt and paying way more than he should while making nearly $600k. He has a role in it as well no doubt, but to act like it’s mostly on him is incredibly confusing.
She's getting him things and trips he doesn't want and didn't ask for and then is getting annoyed when he doesn't pay for those things. He has worn out sneakers, isn't bothered by it, she buys him new ones and it's his fault for not contributing?
He doesn’t get to pick where they go on vacation, either. It’s a weird dynamic and Ramit failed to acknowledge that he has a huge lack of agency in the marriage. Such a weird episode!
He’s supposed to stay home and work as punishment, for a couple of weeks a year to create wealth (in that amount of time?), while she goes away on elaborate vacations with THEIR money. (I had thought they were married.) That bothered me a LOT. A kind man was being bullied by both his wife and Ramit, who seemed to be in some sort of arrogant, exclusionary, rich-people club, that expects everyone else to have money as a number-one, or possibly only, value. Haunting.
@@CynthiaSpencer it was really telling when Ramit was condescending to him about how "it would be pretty hard to survive on $60k" if Geena disappeared from the picture (1:02:32). In what world is $60k literally unlivable? Median income in the USA is $37k. The elitism here smells like NYC garbage.
Ramit, you misdiagnosed this couples situation by a country mile. Geena is a Type A control freak who will never let James be her equal and is not willing to treat her money as "their" money. It's no wonder James feels inadequate. If their money was pooled into a joint account then they could actually have a discussion as equals about money, but she won't do that. And to top it off, they are not even splitting their fixed costs equitably. James is kicking in much more than he should and maybe that is why he isn't able to cover his other costs or fund a retirement account. Also, they will never by able to afford their rich life with over $200K of guilt free spending in retirement unless they plan on working much longer and dramatically increase their retirement savings. They are going to need more than $10 million to afford their current lifestyle in retirement. I can't help but believe that if the gender roles were reversed this would have been a much different episode.
The only thing you're wrong about is that it's not really "their" anything, it's hers. James seems like he does not need $10mil to retire lol. Jokes aside, fully agree with what you've said here.
I’m confused…. Are they married? Why is she “covering” when they’re legally married? I also don’t get why someone making $50k a month is worried about their household buying running shoes! Lastly… this was a big tell to me: she called his IRA “little”. She said she wants him to have a “little Roth IRA”. That’s so condescending. I feel the same way that I did about the recent episode with the American couple in London. Also, if she got hit by a bus he’d get a massive life insurance payout. I worked in corporate tech and they pay for a policy as a benefit; usually like 10x your annual. I feel like these two are roommates and she resents him and he’s complacent about it. Hope y’all can work through this, best of luck. ❤
@@cognitive-botanical-therapy I thought of last weeks episode too. That London husband also made $60 the previous year. The wife and Ramit made him out to be a failure. The wife wanted to keep their city apartment and buy a house in the country. If only the husband would make more! It was very mean and selfish. The husband did some unconventional things but he brought money into the household. Very sad to lack a loving partner in the financial side of partnership. Seemed like “just business”.
Rammit super disappointed that you just let this woman control the situation, this would have been a great time to explain that for a musician this is a good salary and that not everyone can make 100,200 or even $600,000 a year. You own this dude an apology for not sticking up for him... if rolls were reversed it would be a big issue. One day this guys gonna get tired of his wifes shit and find someone who loves his for his artistic side and not just look at his "normal salary" as a load.
I said the same thing. James looks defeated this entire episode, and he didn't have anyone advocating for him. He's basically being treated like arm candy instead of an equal partner. They don't want the same things. And once he meets someone who gives him what he's lacking here, which has nothing to do with money, he's out of there.
I am a fan of the podcast and watch it every week, but I did not like his approach on this episode, actually I found it quite unpleasant. James is doing just fine. He’s in the music industry and working his way up to making more and more. $5k a month for what he does is not bad at all. There are too many unrealistic expectations on him and I wish that would have been given more focus. It’s not fair for his partner to expect him to help out with extravagant trips when that’s not the realistic option for the path he has chosen. If her mindset around this doesn’t change and they stay together he will always feel less than.
I know, but I’m thinking how analogous it is to other couples in their 40s who make $100k/yr but only have a net worth of $120k or less. It’s so common. Doesn’t matter how much you make, the same psychosocial problems recur.
Living in NYC/HCOL is tough. City, state, federal taxes means an effective tax rate of 40%, so cut that to $350k post tax and she's using total compensation (inclusive of RSU vesting schedules). She's putting $90k away investments, paid off some of his 5-figure debts so that leaves ~$200k to live in one of the most expensive cities in the world (I'm not including his compensation as he says he makes $60k but then also needs her help paying for studio space? Something doesn't make sense/isn't clear). They have relatively low fixed costs... so as long as they get the psychological part figured out they're fine.
@@juliagulia8887 that's a moving target though, what if you made 70k then lucked up on an opportunity to earn 250k. You can't exactly snap your fingers and make your retirement account what it "should" be? Also, how realistic are those figures by age?
Yes! I wish he would have taken that somewhere, it seemed so obvious to me! How many husbands support a stay at home mom? They always combine finances, and no one bats an eye.
@@debbielockhart7762 I strong doubt she cares how it's done, it's what she wants, she feels like she's figured it out and "why can't he". she's not on a team, she owns the team and he's there as an employee that has to pay for the privilege of being on her team.
@@saeedhossain6099 yeah I feel like no one was listening to him. For example, his reservations about raising his rates: they're acting like it's ONLY a mindset issue and he needs to just do it. No discussion of market research, of when he last raised he rates, about how stable his client relationships are... nothing. Just go ahead and raise them, problem solved. It feels like something critical was edited out of the conversation by mistake because the approach in this episode was so weird and confusing.
@@milikoshki tbh she's living Ramit's mantra of work hard earn a lot pay rent, treat yourself on what you want, cut what you don't want, she just missed the invest and save. her lifestyle philosophy (and hair choice) aligns closely with his own and it's pretty normal to "side" with that person in a contentious situation. as for what the chap actually wants out of life, it almost didn't really matter until it fit. my last observation on the whole situation was in their CSP, they didn't explicitly include their travel budget in discretionary spending, nor did they carve out thr RSU (restricted stock units) from her income. RSU is compensation, but it's highly discretionary, it's really a bonus, it's likely got a target, but to ingest it into a budget as salary is not good planning in my mind.
He contributes to his “little money market acct”…. did she really just say that? 🤮 This is not a marriage. She is booking trips and he is struggling to pay off a $1k credit card. I wouldn’t allow my husband to struggle with this burden if I made $600k per year. He needs to find someone who is less consumed with money and who is more loving and inclusive.
He's living a life he can afford! your money is separate. When you are low-income you may have worn out sneakers, briefs with a few holes in it, worn socks - it's how you know he's respecting money. If you want him to have more agency, honestly, slide a grand or two into his account monthly. It looks to me that he's moreorless living in his means - which is hard to do when your partner outearns you severely. Things that mean nothing to her are extremely impactful to him. He can't just 'handle' things 'on-sight'.
I dont understand why he’s working at all. I make 1/3 her income and I told my wife she doesn’t have to work. Working sucks so why both do it if you can afford not to?
That’s a really good point. He’s been forced into his own little restrictive box by his ego, his demand for self sufficiency and equality in the relationship is forcing him to think smaller
she wouldnt even have to slide money to him even though thats fine and ive seen ramit advise this in the past. she should just cover EVERYTHING. ive done it when Ive made more. im also more generous than her lol
Bet she purchased their ridiculous matching shirts but is upset he couldn’t pay his fair share while he would have been perfectly happy in a white t-shirt…
I could NEVER see my spouse struggle with $1k cc debt while I make 46k a MONTH. If they combined finances he could so much more easily contribute to household things like cleaning supplies, picking up random needs etc than he can now with the disparity. These couples who refuse to combine make zero sense to me. It’s ridiculous
I don’t know what it was about this episode in particular, but I think Ramit really missed the mark on this one. She obviously has some amount of resentment that he doesn’t make more and he obviously has some amount of insecurity around that fact. Seems like they need therapy immediately and I’m surprised that that didn’t get touched on at all in this episode. Not to mention the fact that so much of this practically could be resolved by joining their finances and thinking about it as our money rather than his and hers. That she didn’t get called out for referring to one of his retirement accounts as “little” is also baffling to me. Putting it on him to change his perspective more than her seems entirely unreasonable when she seems to have a much more toxic frame on money in how she discusses “helping him out.”
Agree on therapy. I want to hug this guy, I think he needs to step it up at home but NOT financially, more logistically. Ramit does point out why is she the one ordering detergent.
Also agree here. I had a hard time watching this one because if they have just had combined finances, all of the problems would pretty much fix themselves. That mindset shift to 'our money' would go a really long way.
i feel a relationship takes a wrong turn when one starts to count how many times they ordered detergent (as per James, she was V mad about it over texts) , it will never be 50/50, which is Ramit's goal in most of the sessions, he is extremely impractical and unemotional (which he has himself admitted) ironically.
I am surprised that Ramit did not bring up the issue of combining finances with this couple, as he typically does. The wide disparity in income seems to make this particularly pertinent.
I haven't finished the episode yet so I'm definitely disappointed he never says this. At the beginning she's talking about feeling like his mom because she's buying stuff for him and it feels I imagine like doling out an allowance. If they just had combined accounts they could make more joint purchasing decisions and everything would feel like theirs instead of mine and his. It's a mental barrier that she can't seem to get past after 9 years of marriage.
Completely agree - this issue has come up with other couples before so I kept waiting for him to mention it. I feel like there was some explanation that was cut out in editing. She briefly mentioned a prior marriage with financial issues, so maybe that’s the reason?
The dude makes 60k a year, its not like its some awfully little money. If the situation would be opposite, the husband would be just generous to his wife and happy to share the income - or at least it would be expected from him to do it.
@@user-po9ne6tx1c To be fair it's not the first time we see this kind of dynamic transpire in the podcast when this situation is presented (i also've been a witness of this IRL for what it matters). I don't know if the generalization is really uncalled for.
@@dantouneto yes haha i have started to notice a trend with these couples where the wife is the type A control freak with the high income and shes "dissatisfied" with the fact that her easy-going, laid back, beta male husband doesn't display the same bull-dog energy towards finances that she has.
I feel like I missed something here? It's not about how much James earns, but also she wants him to split costs on luxury holidays, but also invest more and have no issues paying for studio rent and his other fixed costs? But at the same time she's booking crazy plane tickets without any consultation, despite the fact that James wants to be involved? But also James should stop feeling he's "the one who earns less"? Why is none of the conversation about how Geena's lifestyle is totally unrealistic and unaffordable for most people, James included, and if she wants to continue to live extravagantly and include James, she will be paying. I also feel like the investment conversation was a bit off- if 200K/year isn't enough, if you want to own multiple properties abroad and live here and there in retirement... girl! I also strongly disagree with Ramit that James would be screwed without Geena. He'd be fine. He'd wear his old sneaks and get some roommates or move to a cheaper city, and take fewer trips, and not have the pressure to contribute to a lifestyle that's totally beyond his means. I just don't really understand how if you're earning gobs of money, you wouldn't want to alleviate some, if not all, financial pressure from your partner, that you love and cherish? It's not like James is sitting around doing nothing. I feel like he's so busy hearing how everyone else feels, but no one hears how HE feels. If he needs to pitch in more with chores or buying detergent or whatever... ok.. but that's not really about money, other than maybe have a joint household account that you both have freedom to pay for shared stuff with shared money. All in all, this is like the opposite of the episode with the British couple, where one was a youtuber earning millions, if I remember correctly? She wanted her husband to enjoy the lifestyle they could afford, and he felt unworthy despite her constantly reminding him how critical he is to their family's success. Idk, but weird vibes.
She expects someone making $60,000 and living in NYC to split the cost of multiple business class airline tickets annually. Good on her for breaking the glass ceiling, but I’m not sure her expectations are entirely realistic.
@@holamissmusicaat fault for what, exactly? There’s no actual need for the guy to earn more money, other than her ego. It’s asking something of him that’s completely unnecessary
lol it’s funny cos there were a couple with the opposite scenario, and all the commentators were berating him to not make her pay some bills. People are unreasonably hilarious.
@@holamissmusica If he told her he planned to earn more when they got together, sure. But we don't know. She also could just be trying to make him into something he's not.
@@ThePetit1989your comment makes no sense. There have been several episodes with the opposite scenario. It’s called a strawman argument and it’s honestly a drain on everyone around you when you do this, fyi.
Geena is very savvy and entered this relationship with a great deal of awareness. She was not blindsided by the circumstances. A problem arises when she expects his income to change to become closer to her income after the fact. If she needed someone who made a comparable salary, and this is an important value for her, then she should have chosen someone else as a life partner. It is almost like attempting to make the partner you chose into your ideal through your efforts after the marriage.
@@sylviamurray7467 if by saavy you mean she found someone she can economically manipulate and use as an emotional tampon oh her beck and call, yeah sure, but as for savvy, I'd used a different word. maybe she was treated that way by her first husband and that wouldn't have been right, but she doesn't get a pass for her current poor behaviour.
I hate to say it but it seems like it wasnt so much she chose him but more the fact that he's one of the few men on the planet willing to put up with her nonsense.
She sounds like she wanted a provider but she didn’t marry one. That’s not on him that’s on her. She knew what she was getting with him. It was enough initially but now it’s taken it’s toll on her.
Once you make 600k a year finding a provider is going to be next to impossible. You are like the 01. percent of all earners in the world 😂 practically. In my case if I made 600k a year I'd expect little contributions here and there at best. Id pick someone for liking them more than anything anyways but especially with that kind of money coming in.
She makes $600k and now he can't go on trips with his wife because he has to work so he can make more money? 😢 That's really sad. Can't his wife just be content with less extravagant trips and be happy that she can afford to travel with her husband? This episode was confusing - seems like creating a problem where one doesn't exist.
If a man treated his wife like this woman treats her husband .... people would call it financial abuse. how the eff do they not have a shared credit card, jfc
This isn’t a marriage. They are roommates at best. She doesn’t respect him and he lets it slide. The money is the least of their issues. They need tons of counseling. You missed with this one Ramit
@@jaydubya9265 she had college and law school debt and then supported a husband who could t work due to visa processes. I wonder what that literally cost her, plus she sent money to her parents so they couldn’t hold it over her that she cost so much to raise. And then add in the expensive trips she likes, makes sense to me
@@IAmebAdger We also go on trips as a family with kids sometimes. That doesn't kill our net worth... We are using money that we have responsibly (so no 4 or 5 star hotels, no expensive fancy restaurants, etc.).
She should shake the notion that he'll ever make even half what she's making. Some fields have a ceiling and trying to chase money in a creative field takes a huge hit on any work life balance. Hopefully he doesn't feel the need to turn away clients that he may prefer working with that don't have the budgets he'll need with his higher rates
Maybe, but if he's only making $60k (and presumably was before they met) what the hell is he doing in Brooklyn? You can choose the job, you can choose the place - but if you want both, the economics should add up and they don't in this case
@@cmerr2 I don't disagree with that. And yeah realistically, James can probably get that number into something more comfortable. If he was living alone it sounds like even he acknowledges that he would need to leave the city, but he doesn't live in a vacuum. They've been married 9 years so I assume they were together even longer. Geena's career took off in that time and if she wanted to upgrade that lifestyle she absolutely should. Again, he can probably get his income up but what's the number they'll both feel good about? James should focus on the idea that he's not just along for the ride. Geena wants him to feel like he belongs in their rich life.
@@cmerr2 to be fair, when asked what he would do without Geena, he had the very reasonable answer of "move out of NYC." They clearly live there because she wants to live there.
@@cmerr2 a lot of music jobs are in HCOL areas. Brooklyn is a huge hub for music and recording. Making $5k a month as a musician there purely as playing/recording/producing is doing pretty well actually
I feel like this episode went off the rails and was focused on all the wrong things. Totally lost sight of what will help them achieve their shared Rich Life. They all (Ramit and the couple) seemed to think that teamwork = James making more money and contributing more money. I completely disagree. The idea that he should skip a vacation so he can contribute $4k to the household that month - what??? True teamwork would be thinking about what their goals/Rich Life are and how they can best accomplish them together. James making an extra hundred grand a year accomplishes....a 15% increase in their household income. It's nothing. They should combine their finances and use their amazing combined income to jointly enjoy an amazing life. I also thought Ramit failed to give a proper reality check about their savings rate. Their lack of investments is an EMERGENCY. Geena's comment at the end about owning multiple properties in multiple countries in just underscored her lack of understanding of the amount of assets she would need to be able to afford that lifestyle. They are way off track.
Yeah Ramit completely missed the mark. Way more attention should be paid to why the wife can’t share finances not him skipping vacations and buying cleaning supplies. Ramit usually is pretty good, but this episode was a flop. When one person is very high income he seems to cater to them.
I agree with what you are saying but this is ONE out of many directions he could have gone. I think he chose to focus the discussion of finding ways to make him more accountable.
@@rossmarymarquez4700 ‘Accountable’ for what though? She knew he was a musician when she married him. He’s doing really, really well to earn 60k. It’s unfair and unrealistic to say, ‘ok time to 3x that fast or you can’t come on holiday’
I'm a LONG TIME fan/follower/student of Ramit's. And most of the time I agree with what he says "to do" to address a situation. Like many others in the comments here I disagree with what Ramit said to do. First, I think it is amazing that Geena makes so much money and is so successful. If I were making her money, you bet I'd be taking the private pilates classes and having an Equinox membership, and all the other things. I think it's great. (I'd also be putting vastly more money into investments because who knows how long you'd be able to keep up that work-lifestyle for, but that's me.) And James - it's awesome that you are making that much as a musician in NYC and that that is your sole source of income. I knew many musicians in NYC who had multiple gigs in addition to their music work. It's not an easy industry, and I hope that you are proud of what you've accomplished. Secondly, here's where my gripes really come in... There are certain ceilings in industries. And while James could make more, it would likely not be through charging clients more money - especially in a saturated industry. Stating that he could simply 3x his earnings in a year is out of touch with the reality of the market (supply, demand, prices - simple economics, right?) As someone who was once married, who made more than their spouse, and whose spouse could absolutely not make more in their industry at that time: you have to be understanding of that and either 1. accept it or 2. walk away. That's it. There's no pressuring to force the other person to try to make more money, there's no belittling or making the other person "the problem" or anything like that. You (the married couple) are in it together, so it's your thing to work out without making the other person "the problem" in a situation like this. Period. There are indeed some gender dynamics happening: Geena does handle a lot, and she wants James to "step up" - and I see that she wants an equal partner, but she also has to be willing to receive the feedback and action from James. That, hey, James cannot afford to go to Siciliy or wherever unless Geena 100% pays for it. I agree with Ramit where James will have to speak up more about this - that's being more of an equal partner. And, that James will be more engaged with things around the house so that she doesn't have to think about it (because it may seem minor re: ordering more laundry detergent, but it's yet another thing on the endless to-do list, and for a partner to pick that up is HUGE.) I agree that Ramit got all starry eyed over, and related with, the high-earning NYC life with Geena. And so, a lot of the things that would typically be brought up and hammered in were just... not. And, because of this, James got the short end of the stick in this conversation. AND I am so curious as to WHY the fact that Geena makes $600k a year, and James $60k a year did not result in a 90/10 split of household expenses???? This was something that Ramit was so very on top of in the past, to make things more equitable within a couple so each can be contributing on a ratio-basis to the household. Keeping finances so separate means that Geena maintains far more control of the family's finances, which (if roles were reversed) would be seen as problematic. There needs to be a re-think as to how finances are logistically handled with such disparate incomes. I was frustrated that this was not addressed, along with how Geena's contributing so little to her retirement/investments. Retirement/investing is usually such a thing with Ramit, but this time he got a bit googly eyed over her extravagant trips and glossed over the importance of this matter (although we only see a portion of their conversation and not the whole thing but still!) I get it, they have something in common, but that got in the way of the nuts and bolts of this couple's money conversation.
I love your very balanced comment. I think James needed and advocate in this conversation. There were many stones left unturned in this one, I would really like to see a part 2. I think how they split the fixed costs needs to be more equitable.
I usually find this show very insightful and helpful, but this episode was a big exception. It honestly felt elitist, and materialistic. A partner does not need to be equal financially. Disappointed of the content and the host this time
My heart feels so sad for James :( And bc he wants to keep the peace he takes whatever is thrown at him. This is really so sad. I agree with the comment that they should have done separate CSPs since their finances are separate. Then it would’ve been so clear why James is in the situation he’s in in terms of contributing. I am baffled at these numbers; astonished that a rich partner would let their love be in debt for $1000…. $1000/$600,000 and she won’t help with that for her husband’s sake? Wow my heart feels so low right now watching this.
This is pathetic! Imagine your spouse of 9 years makes a fraction of your high income (honest work, no coasting), YOU insist on keeping the finances separate and then: - you resent your spouse for not buying laundry detergent - you keep calling for teamwork, while the spouse wants to be involved, but you won't let them - you keep booking luxury trips your spouse can't afford, you don't include them in the decision making, you pretty much make them go and then you wish they would split the cost I could go on an on. HELLO ?!?! 🤯🤯🤯 To be fair, I love Geena. Her journey has been the most inspirational to me so far. But as far as the her marriage with James goes I think her invisible scripts are running the show big time.
and then call it a "surprise" . its so reminds me of the old 90s movies, where the husband would be a rich callous b**tard and then to make up for that give a diamond necklace to his wife and he was the "VILLAIN" of the movie, however, we are applauding women for the same behaviour just because they are breaking glass ceilings? at what cost though? I feel for this guy!
Worst episode. Seemed to be biased towards her. He is a musician and she knew that when she married him. She makes enough money for the both of them. Get a joint account and call it a day. She seems unrealistic and selfish. I am shocked and disappointed with Ramits advice.
Geena is messing up a good relationship here for some stereotype, share your finances and let him treat you with nice things and surprises from your joint income
I think Ramit was really unfair to James. James is doing fine. Sure he could do more, but tripling his salary over 5 years is a very ambitious goal and it shouldn’t be downplayed. I think there’s much bigger/easier to solve issues here.
lets not forget how out of touch Ramit is with most other professions, but acts like "know it all", his various programs which claim to have gotten many people a bump in salary have such boiler plate techniques which even under grad working in big corp would know wont work! I laugh at his email promotions. No can jsut walk to their boss and be like: oh I made this quatifiable impact and hence I am entitled to 10% raise. IT DOES NOT WORK LIKE THAT! this guy has not worked in real world and needs a reality check and do some research into folks he is interviewing , its tiring to see the same old lables being rehashed: mid west , gender stereotypes etc. Its fair to build a business based on personal finance, but after a while all these finfluencers feel out of touch and repetitive.
At 1:00:00, he asked him what will happen if she gets hit by a bus. He said exactly what he would do which I believe he has no problems with. But the host just summed it up to he’ll be in trouble. And that she wouldn’t feel good knowing she left someone that cant take care of himself. This was a bit agonizing to watch
his cost basis without her won't be anywhere as high as his cost basis on keeping up with her spending. he's be fine financially, it's not an income problem, it's a spending problem. And that conscience spending plan having nothing in the travel section is very telling.
Speaking as a type A woman married to a more relaxed man - its interesting how we fall in love with creative, fun types who help us relax and then expect them to be more like us. My spouse and I work hard to lean into our strengths, but it's not easy when you have different personalities and ways of doing things.
My income was about 8x my wife’s income, and I’d always just transfer money to her whenever. She said it made her feel like a kid who is reliant on me. Once we had kids she stopped working, we combined finances and just share one bank account, and life is significantly easier now. It makes no sense to be married and have this weird ‘mine’ and ‘yours’ mentality. If the guy needs new running shoes, as a member of a household with a $660k income he shouldn’t even have to think twice about that. If the genders were reversed this call and these comments would be totally different.
I don't think the comments would be very different? I think most people agree that regardless of gender, it's pretty weird to nickle and dime your spouse (who isn't just sitting around doing nothing), when you're earning a maHOOsive salary that could comfortably cover the household. It reminds me of some eps where the mom is working part time but covering all child-related costs and spending 98% of her income, stressed out of her mind, meanwhile the dad is earning a nice salary and "investing" in his sneaker collection or whatever while telling his wife she could do so much more, lol.
Agreed. Receiving money from your spouse can feel infantilising. Their set up is not empowering right now. It’s wonderful that James said he ended the conversation feeling empowered after discussing different ideas with Geena and Ramit.
I hate when high income corporate attorneys complain about their spouses. They have what David Graeber calls a “Bullshit Job”. I think deep down they’re really unfulfilled by their work. Some may even be jealous or resentful that their spouse gets to spend time doing what they’re passionate about. Money is just the surface. These sort of people tend to have deeper than Ramit can’t fix.
I think it’s more of a gender issue. Don’t get the impression she thinks her work is so meaningful, it’s a means to an end. She probably shouldn’t have married an artist if she wanted them to earn 200k.
Really hated this episode. James was bullied. Btw, If she was hit by a bus, he would get millions in life insurance. Ramit made it sound like James would be in a van down by the river.
This episode really left a bad taste in my mouth. The way Ramit praised Geena and her taste in swanky hotels, etc. felt gross. At least he did say that people making $150K often invest more than she is. He didn't call her out for a lot of things he usually calls out people with disparate incomes for, like keeping $ separate. I agree with other viewers that if the gender roles were reversed, this would have gone a lot differently.
I agree, he was playing keeping up with the Joneses in his own marriage. Realistically he will not be able to keep up with her lifestyle at that income and he shouldn't feel ashamed by it. It's sad to hear he feels that he's not enough. Either they collectively reduce their lifestyles or she becomes okay with contributing an amount commensurate with her relative income.
@@Beatsmith2005Yeah, and honestly the way Ramit spoke to the two of them, sounds like he’s one. The guy may be grinding and doing fantastic to make 60k as a musician, that’s no mean feat. Applying yourself that hard in another field could mean many more x the income.
Yes, it’s actually very concerning how little she has saved and invested. She is going to have a drastic decrease in lifestyle at retirement if she doesn’t get into gear with investing.
I'm guessing she only started making this much money within the last decade or much less? So I don't think that would be in multi-millions, but maybe a million if invested well.
i think ramit identifies too much with the wife in this example. he's using his entire salary just to keep up with her and her expectations are way too high for him to be able to save enough. sure he should raise his rates, but how about making his contribution proportional to their salaries?
I make exactly twice as much as my husband; I never resent that at all. I imagine if that went to 10x I'd feel the same way. He contributes the same share of his income as I do (% wise) to the household expenses, he spends and invests, he doesn't want to overspend or get in debt, and he saves for retirement. Money doesn't define our relationship and we enjoy our friends family and travel time.
If one person makes way more the percentage they contribute is still unfair. The person with the larger income, especially a $550k a year one, has gobs left over even after paying her percentage.
This is an awful take. How is he being painted as the "bad guy" here? He makes 60k a year...That's higher than the median income which is something you often use as a barometer. Can't change your tune just because she's earning an income of a 1 percenter. Usually agree with your takes and appreciate your content!
Oh god, I've been in a similar dynamic. I wasn't making 10x more than my ex husband, but I was making 3.5x as much as him, and the issues looked like they were rooted in the money, but I've taken a few years of therapy to realize that it was all about emotional needs going unmet. Geena doesn't need James to make more money-- even if he made $150,000, he's not going to feel equal unless they find a way to bring Geena emotional peace. She's going to have to dig into why she feels the need to be so in control of everything, and he's going to have to step up and give her the confidence to give up some of that control. James throwing himself further into his job isn't going to bring them together, when what she probably actually needs is someone to take the day-to-day burden off of her shoulders.
So she wants him to split costs on trips, pay his bills without her help, invest more into his accounts and she is worried about not having enough for investing to retire? This woman is out of her mind I am sorry she is making 10x his salary and spending 10k on a plane tickets and she wants him to split it? Sorry if this was my wife & myself position I would scale back my travel expectations if I wanted her to contribute equally or I wouldn't expect any equal contributions. If she would scale back for just 2 years she could add an extra 500k into the investment account and then she can go back to the lifestyle she wants.
Not only that, but how does someone even get the time off work to do five trips a year?! And she said one of them recently was for three weeks. Most of us workers in the US get two weeks, or a maximum of three weeks off for the whole year. The fact that she can take that much time away and still make $46k a month is bonkers. And that he can make $60k a year in the music industry while taking that much time off is honestly kind of impressive as well.
Not everyone can or needs to earn gigantic figures. There is nothing wrong with earning a more modest yet decent salary, it should not be a source of shame. More engagement with the house needs perhaps could help him feel like he is contributing more
Sometimes it's small things. My ex-husband thought he had been using the same can of shaving cream for 5 years. Only after we divorced, he noticed that he was running out of shaving cream so quickly (esp. compared to the 5-year can). Only then did he realize all the things I had done for him he never paid attention to. I hope James checks into the partnership and Geena lets him take responsibility for things. That's the partner I think she wants. Not the one who makes the same income.
I don’t understand why he has to do more. They’re supposed to be married. I think she is spoilt and has unrealistic expectations. He comes across kind and grounded
Husband has high income and provides for his wife so they combine bank accounts, he’s called a leader and is praised by his wife and society. But a wife has higher income than her husband and she says she’s being treated like a mom, keeps finances separate, and demands that her husband increases his income.
I may be old fashion but this approach to marriage seems terrible to me. If she got cancer or became paralyzed she would expect him to stick it out and take care of her so why nickle and dime everything? Just combine finances and call it a day.
If you or your partner is struggling with their job or business, it makes a total sense to just skip the trip and get over the hump as a team. The fact that James talks as if he will stay working while Gina goes on a trip seems to be fundamental flaw. Who does that. Either pay for the trip and don't blame him or you let him work and don't entice him to go on a vacation
This is insane - I have a higher net worth than them at a younger age, as a single person, and I’ve never made anywhere near $600,000 per year. It really is all about how much you keep and not how much you make.
@@cognitive-botanical-therapy I don't think they mean it as a flex, lol. It's pointing out that Geena's net worth is surprisingly, almost shockingly, low compared to her earning history and current salary.
Same here… single with a regular corporate job. Younger than they are and have more invested. SHE is going to have a major issue down the road in retirement considering their spending habits. Their CSP was absolutely shocking and Remit glossed over it.
Why is my guy paying rent!!?? He should just be using his money for saving! I only make 3x my spouse and I practically pay all the bills (housing, insurance, utilities, transportation). My spouse just throws all her money in our investment portfolio. Bang bang. She doesn’t have to worry about expense part of life, just wealth-building
She's keeping a scarcity mindset with him to keep him motivated to bring in more cash (I think), which is just creating a toxic/stressful environment. I feel like they could both be much happier if they combine finances and stop keeping score how each is paying. Not sure if I heard correctly but he was also struggling to pay off a small debt balance, meanwhile living with a household gross income of ~$50k/mo. Wild.
@@RyChOr2005yep, at the end he says he has $1k of CC debt left and it's stressful. As long as he's not a chronic overspender (sounds like he's not) that's ridiculous
Why doesn’t he choose to think big and make more? Is he dumb? In all honesty, this is the first episode that left a bad taste in my mouth. She is dragging him along on a jetsetting life but then seems resentful about it. He doesn’t seem to be the driving force behind these lavish trips to the arctic/maldives/whatever, but at the end of the day Ramit and Gena (spelling?) get on him for not contributing more. $60k for a musician probably isn’t bad, and it doesn’t seem like he is asking to live a millionaires lifestyle, but what do I know. Also seems like their spending is higher and savings are lower than indicated on the CSP. If she’s made on average a half million per year since 2019, that’s striking that they have as little savings/assets as they do.
It is illogical to me to do the CSP together when the finances are separate. We need to see how HIS fixed costs are if she expects him to save money separately.
100%. If she's not willing to combine finances, he's putting 50% to fixed spending and the other 50% goes to contributing to their trips because she expects him to live this lavish life with her and contribute to it. He can't save. And she is barely saving either. If they simply combined all their finances she wouldn't have to feel like a sugar momma anymore because it would all be theirs.
Agree. I find it so strange that people are like, "let's get married which will tie everything together legally but then keep everything separate." Just don't get married then. How can you say you want to be separate but then set expectations on how the other person saves, or base your retirement on both of you, etc. Pick a lane.
i hear you but for brevity this was the way. many people forget this is still a show. and most people have never produced a show and little changes add to the logistics and tone of a presentation.
@@PrincessLolly1 I could be wrong, but it seems like she doesn't combine finances as a way to motivate her husband into making more money so he can contribute more. Seems like textbook financial abuse here.
I actually am having trouble finishing this episode because it's so biased and unfair. It makes no sense to me that she is planning all these lavish trips, but then is upset that he wants to be a part of it but yet wants to buy him sneakers. She sounds like she's trying to control things and has a very masculine energy. And he is emasculated.. Which is why he doesn't have self-esteem. Because she doesn't respect him as her partner. There is such a lack of respect here because of his income that both were me and her are not acknowledging that his income in America in 2024 is actually decent.
When you don't combine your lives and finances this is what you get. It's not my money and your money. It's OUR money! They are not actually even married.
I don't agree. There is no such thing as our money. My partner would never touch my money. He was already married, had combined money with his wife and that was one of the reasons for the divorce. She spent a lot of their joint funds. When he asked her to not do that, she said it's their money and she can do whatever she wants with it. He made much more than she did. I told him I don't want him to touch my money, I don't touch his. We spend on food and all common things, holidays 50/50 and the rest is ours. I invest, I save, I do my things. If he buys something, it's his, if I buy a designer bag, it's my thing. I don't have to ask. I am not a child to ask someone what I can spend or to discuss what I can spend. I'd hate that. We've been together for years and he's sooo happy, I don't want to combine our money because of bad experiences he had.
This was the most confusing podcast ever. Didn't understand the concepts. If he were the major breadwinner that would be the dynamics of marriage. I thought everything works together as a union.😢
I don't know what they're both doing in that marriage. They are a bad fit for each other whose goals and desires are vastly different. Seems like they're together simply for the convenience of it. James will ALWAYS feel less than, and he sounds very unhappy. He's only a character in Geena's world. Like many have pointed out, Ramit was not quite on top of this, and was very impressed by Geena's wealth
This was hard to watch. I feel like James is in a financially and emotionally abusive relationship, and Ramit just glossed over that. He delved more deeply into everything Geena said, and diagnosed James with things like "scarcity mindset" whenever he said how this huge gap and Geena's extravagant spending for them without first discussing it with him makes him feel. If they communicated about things first, she might see he actually doesn't want these extravagant trips as often as she does, and he might tell her to go ahead without him. But her actions communicate: I'm paying for it, so I'm just gonna book it. Ramit said they're not disrespecting each other, I couldn't disagree more. Making decisions of what someone is going to do, where they're going to go, without their input is so disrespectful. What if he had a gig or opportunity to "earn more" lined up, and she booked a 3 week getaway? Making decisions with no concern for your partner's schedule is so disrespectful. I'm sorry to say this, but I can totally see James running into a woman that makes him feel like a million bucks. She'll probably make a lot less than Geena, but he'll be a lot happier and feel more respected.
So 4.5% of her gross goes towards rent and utilities while he pays 34%. Maybe better to use percentage based on each income to determine contributing amounts - 90/10 split seems more fair.
I love Ramit and his videos, but yeah, it’s a little hard to relate when most of the couples featured are making $20K-$50K gross per month. It’d be great to see more average household incomes. I think that’s one good thing about Dave Ramsey. It represents the every day person.
If the wife didn’t do anything productive I could see the issue. It’s good for people to be active. But this guy seems to be grinding and he’s actually doing very, very well for a musician.
They married each other knowing the financial disparity between them. I don’t see why the guy needs to become a higher earner now. Not everyone values money the same way and that should be okay. He earns enough to support himself and a wife but obviously to a much lower standard than she can provide on her income. Both are compromising something with this dynamic but they love each other and they can make it work.
James has his issues no doubt. But making 600k a year(top 1% in America) there should be no reason they cant both live a rich life. He probably works incredibly hard and the fact he have to miss joint trips together to contribute not even 10% of their shared income sound ridiculous. We make even more than this couple and were in disbelief.
Wow. Notmally Im so into IWT episodes and look forward to them all week. It was hard to finish this one. I saw 2 type A individuals pressure and make a kind and sweet person feel bad for being that way. In no moment the husband was asked what is HIS rich life? I got the feeling that he would be happy living a simpler life, taking other types of vacation. He might much rather go camping but has to fit in a lavish lifestyle and fancy trips. Gender roles and no shared finances seem like big issues that needed to be addressed. Yes, the husband could help more with the mental load and household things. But they can obviously afford services and the convenience of paying for that kind of help. The choice of how and where to spend the money seems to be the issue that they dont agree. Husband is accepting a lifestyle that makes his spouse happy but maybe not him. Wife wants him to be in it with her and make more, but maybe has not asked him if that’s the life he wants to live. I hate making assumptions about people, but this episode just left a sour taste in my mouth. I hope this couple can have a conversation about what their rich life is and how they can work together towards that.
Crazy and unhealty marriage. She complains that she is buying cleaning supplies (that are pennies) and nothing wrong with spending thousand on wants, and nonjoint account or anything.
