Jango wasn’t actually mandelorian. He was just a bounty hunter with stolen mandelorian armour. Though you never get to see a mandelorian in the original saga in the clone wars tv series the mandelorians and clones look nothing alike.
Minuteman General We’re talking about the OG EU here, dude. I think pretty much everyone agrees that version of the Mandos was a billion times better than what TCW made of them.
Compared to the Jedi Covenant thing, that's peanuts. Plus, it allowed Ashoka to make the decision to leave the order, which spared her from order 66, so it wasn't that bad...
The righteous arrogance spoke of... yoda's words, "too sure of themselves, even the older, more experienced ones" including himself, who also fucked up
Obi Wan: "You were the chosen one, you were supposed to bring balance to the Force!" Palpatine: "Two Jedi left and Two Sith left... seems balanced to me, bro."
there were actually around 100 jedi left after order 66, Vaders main mission before episode 4 timeline was to go around the universe and murder all jedi that are left. he still wasnt able to get all of them.
It is a problem in our society that people base weather some one is good or evil on what side their on, and not on what they do. "He's on our side, so we'll ignore that fact that he's throwing puppies of a forth floor balcony." "He's not on our side, so we'll give him the death penalty for walking on the grass."
But what about the Sith Genocide, where the Jedi attempted literal genocide against the Sith purebloods and turned Korriban into a tomb world until the Sith Empire could return and reclaim their home
Palpatine started a war that probably killed hundreds of millions and he staged the entire war, including the creation of the slave army(clones),he deserved more than even death at that point
Right? He worded it like the Jedi rolled up to assassinate him as the chancellor, and not arrest a possible (probable) sith Lord. Mace is totally going to still try and arrest him after he casually murdered three Jedi Masters, to be tried in front of the Senate he ran. And helped fill. *Rrrigghhttt.* Sound logic.
Whenever people talk about this I’d like to point them to another fictional series: Assassin’s Creed. Though not the exact same the Jedi had more in common with the Templars (control and obedience) while the Sith had more in common with the Assassins (individuality and free will). Only in AC, the assassins are the protagonists. By twisting narratives the same ideals can become good/evil.
I agree about the Jedi being like the Templars but the Sith are more like Nazis imo. Only a few really believe in and control their ideology the rest just are following out of fear and survival.
The sith tried to destroy the Old republic and they had enslaved many innocent alien species(not figuratively: they actually practiced slavery). As extreme as the Sith holocaust was, you can't say that they didn't have it coming. They were cruel and horrifying. The bad things that the jedi did pale in comparison to the sheer level of horror and depravity that the Sith civilisation had demonstrated.
yeah, the people in charge actually did something wrong not the average Sith Species, they have nothing to do with this and the wars, but the Jedi decided to glassed the entire Civilisations.
@Troy Goldberg but that doesn't make them evil. It makes them more twisted the more they seek for power. Both fueled by fear, hate, and pain, they would seek to gain power to prevent themselves from ever falling prey to anyone.
As for #1, the Jedi saw the Clones as expendable because the Jedi saw THEMSELVES as expendable. They were all ready to charge forward and die for the Republic, as was evidenced in that big free-for-all in the Geonosis Arena. So they expected the same thing from their own soldiers. Each Jedi is taught that self-sacrifice is the highest goal, to sacrifice oneself for the Force, for peace, and for justice. The Jedi expected the same from their Clone Troopers or even the Republic Troopers of the Old Republic Era. So that isn't a crime. This is just the Jedi being lemmings ready to die for the cause because that's how they were raised, so they treated their soldiers the same way. Most Jedi Commanders weren't heartless assholes, they weren't like the fucking Imperial Commissars from 40K, they were more like well-meaning naive Leeroy-Jenkins types who were ready to meet death on the battlefield and expected their men to be the same. Pong Krell doesn't count, because by the time of Umbara, he was already a Separatist agent, so he was just getting Clones killed on purpose so the Separatists can win.
Kamikaze attacks have been military strategy for thousands of years so the jedi really weren't doing anything that was unheard of but still it was kind of a dumb move to go all Leroy Jenkins as you said haha
Very true, the Jedi dogma caused most of the Jedi to behave like Androids rather than living beings, basically sealing their own feelings and not having any attachments.
You're mistaken in thinking that the Jedi are above the laws. While they do have several authoritative powers granted by the Chancellor, they can only act within their assigned jurisdiction within the Republic. Qui-Gon had absolutely no authority to just take a Slave off of a planet where slavery is legal. He only took Anakin after securing his freedom, and after getting consent from his Mother, and because he felt compelled to by the Force. And even if he did abscond with Shmi, what then? She wouldn't be allowed to stay at the Temple, and without any funds of her own she would more than likely live in a state of poverty on the streets of Coruscant. At least under Watto she had a home and the promise of being fed everyday.
Nothing in the Jedi Code requires that they not be evil. They have to be un-emotional and serene. Nice is not mentioned anywhere, as far as I can see. Universal love and compassion for all is the same as love and compassion for none.
Generation Tech I think you would agree that there a few jedi that stood out above the rest of the order that showed great compassion for the clones they commanded. Yoda, kit fisto, mace windu, plo koon, and of course obi wan and anakin plus asoka. Each of these masters, throughout the main series but also through the cannons showed true feelings they had in battle and down time. And after watching this video I love how you tie everything in together. Keep up the neutral position I love it and frankly describes how I view everything.
The difference between your funky dreams and force visions is that force visions are real. In the case of the Jedi Covenant the very attempt to prevent their vision from coming to fruition was what brought it to fruition.
What was Palpatine guilty of? He literally murdered 3 jedi knights in front of Mace Windu as well as tried to kill Mace Windu. Windu wanted to arrest Palpatine to interrogate him... Palpatine answered by killing the jedi... Of course he had reasons to kill Palpatine... considering Palpatine has lightning powers... it is more of a reason to kill him.
Allen, I love how you continue to question, challenge & expose the Jedi order! At the end of the day, Jedi & Sith are just two sides of the exact same coin!
Actually in the Revenge of the Sith novel the Jedi was gathering intelligence and investigating a Sith Lord within the Senate when count Dooku told Obi-Wan of Darth Sidious. When Anakin told Mace of Palpatine being a Sith Lord that, fight with Darth Maul, and knowing that both Dooku and Ventres was associated with the Sith, yes they wasn't going to take any chances since they were sworn enemies.
I don't consider Ezra to really be a jedi in the same way the others were. While he was trained by Kanan (whose training wasn't more then a padawan's) he wasn't fully indoctrinated and drifted toward the dark quite a bit. I find him to be slightly in the middle but not gray. There's also the fact the rebels are terrorists so he really couldn't get out of it.
I think the series could have been much better. In Rouge One they did show the nasty side of a rebellion, while in Rebels it was weird...like killing people without hesitation because they´re on the other side and still being well...innocent?
I do find it kinda funny that Jedi encouraged emotional control while basically telling you that some emotions are just outright bad Like wow, way to not only CREATE a fear of falling to the Dark Side for something every intelligent species has naturally, but to then roundabout that problem into a snowballing effect (fear your emotions --> fear the dark side --> Dark side = bad --> emotions = bad --> feel emotion --> fear the emotions --> fear the dark side even more)
The Jedi were responsible for many unforgiving deeds throughout history. However, I'm surprised that the Sith Holocaust wasn't included on this list. The Jedi literally agreed to assist the genocide of the entire Sith species, alongside Republic forces as a means to punish them for starting one of the most possibly devastating conflicts in the Republic's history. This does seem like a worthy event to be placed on a list of the most terrible things the Jedi order had done if you ask me.
I've always thought that Obi Wan cutting off the arm was way out of character and not something a jedi would do. Plus he exposed himself by taking out his lightsaber in front of a room full of bad guys and bounty hunters in a time where killing a jedi would be worth some credits. Mind trick would've been the way to handle the situation.
#6 is incorrect. They attempted to arrest Palpatine before Palpatine drew his saber and killed 3 Jedi before attacking Mace Windu who, in true Samuel L fashion, kicked his ass and was going to finish the deed since Palpatine revealed himself as not only a Sith Lord, but a powerful and aggressive one
I'm sure someone else has said this and I am well late but you seem to of forgotten how that FIGHT with palpatine went in revenge of the sith. They did go to arrest him, only attacked when he resisted arrest, and only moved to execute him post him straight up killing three jedi. It was a daft move on the jedi to move on him the way they did but it wasn't an extrajudicial execution without reason. I'm not sure on all the lore for this but I'd believe the jedi do have the power to arrest people and frankly I don't mind when the police fight and even kill people who start shooting at them.
Shmi had a microbomb in her neck that would kill her if she was taken or escaped. To truely save a slave from Tatooine you would would need to disarm the bomb. Anakin had his disabled because they technically “bought” him. But not Shmi, So they couldn’t just “whack out” anybody. A better idea would be for Padme to go back later and buy Shmi given that she was a queen and rich AF
The imperfect Jedi Order was far preferable to anything the Sith could have ever offered. 1. While a bad law that gave the Jedi Order too much power, I am sure few abused. The abuse was the exception not the rule. 2. Five force-sensitive Jedi all having similar visions are not random hallucinations and does not relate to anything in our own time. 3. While friendly fire is terrible, those actions didn't define the Jedi Order. 4. Was that a punishment though? Sounds more like a precaution from someone that was clearly a threat but was more useful alive than dead. 5. Perhaps most Jedi discovered to difficulty of balancing the two sides of the force and the danger the dark side posed in those that failed. It also took both sides to be uncompromising. 6. Really? The Sith stage a silent political coup and threw the entire galaxy enter a war for personal gain and the Jedi were the political force? 7. Totally agree actually. The greatest imperfection and the exact balance Anakin almost brought back. But Qui-Gon did try to fight for Shmi. He wanted to bring. He didn’t just leave her behind. If Qui-Gon fought Wato in any illegal way, the Hutts would have become the enemy of the Jedi. Not very smart. While slavery was good, morally speaking it would be worse to some one woman and leave the rest of the slaves to their fate. He would have to start a whole campaign against the Hutts to end slavery. Slavery was endorsed by the Sith though. Also Anakin still had a choice in his turn to the dark side. 8. I think it was suspected early on that this new secret re-emergence of the Sith had likely embedded itself in Galactic politics as was the case with Chancellor Palpatine. Maybe at first Darth Maul existence should have been made known, but alerting the Republic forces of Palestine would not be wise as he could just rally his forces and fight off the Jedi. 9. Prime example of how the wars shaped and largely destroyed the best qualities of the Jedi. But the Confederacy were committing war crimes on the planet they blockaded forcing Anakin to destroy the blockade by any means necessary. 10. The Jedi erroneously saw the Separatists as the biggest threat, so they needed an army to match. Many Jedi fought fearlessly by their clones side and most clone expressed great respect for their Jedi commanders. Krell on the other hand was the perfect example of how the dark side could corrupt the Jedi Order.
I loved the Jedi when I was a child, but the more I learn the more I agree with the "The Jedi must end" mentality. As least an end to the Jedi as they were at the time, despite how sad it was when they actually did fall. It would have made the prequels (of which I do not hate for the most part... but yes, Def could have done with some improvements!) so much more in depth had they explored these themes further (aside from the confrontation between Anikin and Windu which is sort of hard to take seriously in the moment). They hinted at it, yes, and the clone wars series touched on it very well later on, But it would have really lifted the theme. Of course, the point of SW is the classic fight between light and dark, so maybe it's just me grasping at straws trying to imagine how the prequels COULD have been better!
Revan ended the Mandalorian war in a single instant , victory by any means necessary. Had Revan not betrayed the will of the council the Madalorians would've set the universe a blaze with no one to stop them.
Wasn't it just four Jedi masters to engage Palpatine? I believe you said five. And yes, the way the Jedi acted in the galaxy was more than arrogant. They deserved order 66.
He's right though. Sh'mi was totally down on Qui Gon, and I think it might have been reciprocated ;) Which begs the question, was Qui Gon really Anakin's daddy?
So basically the Star Wars storyline revolves around organizational culture issues, primarily excessive hierarchical and market types that take hold over time.
Ohhhhhh when you said Shmi was totally down with Quigon maybe that’s why he didn’t take her with you he was down with her too that smile he gave her and when he greeted her and helped her down. He wanted to take her but maybe he was afraid to love again due to the fact that his former love interest was killed he didn’t want that to happen again
Very good video. However, you should rewatch the scene of mace windu vs sideous. Mace said "Chancellor Palpatine, you are under arrest. The senate will decide your fate". He didn't try to kill him and was going to have him go through due process. Then Palpatine charged towards the jedi and killed a jedi. At that moment, mace and his men had all the legal reason to kill him. Same as if a group of cops tell a man he is under arrest for robbery or whatever and will have to go to court. But if the man kills one of the cops....the cops are going to try and kill him now. On the other hand, I agree that there was no hard evidence on him being a Sith, and it's not illegal to be a Sith but there was plenty of speculation in regards to crimes he was potentially tied to. He definitely conspired in killing master Qui gon and othe things he ordered or was a part of. The senate would put him on trial and decide if the evidence proved him guilty of something of the sort. I don't think the Jedi are all good, but in regards to obeying and enforcing the law, they only came to arrest him and were warned that he was potentially dangerous. Their weapons were drawn only because they were warned he was dangerous. They told him he would be judged by the senate....not them. Jedi had every right to take him down once he killed a jedi and proved he truly was as dangerous as warned. That was the only point you made that wasn't truly objective. Palpatine attacked and drew blood first.
jagarcia0705 the Sith had a massive purging within their own ranks. The schism literally reduced the number of Sith Lords to 2. They had a few other sith/dark force users, but still. From then on, the Sith were using subterfuge and trickery to gain power. Probably starting gang wars and the like. Also, the Jedi are an authoritarian theocracy, those are good at keeping people in line no matter what.
From a certain point of view, the Jedi and Sith were to some a highly specialized galactic militia; to others they were a type of religious presence; the rest combine the two and expect the Jedi to rush when they call but get called out by the senators, etc. It's content like this that makes the REAL Star Wars, not the 'legend of Rey' in their non canon universe. Just one man's opinion. Really enjoy this channel; well done. Sit vis vobiscum.
For #6 they did have proof palp was part of the separatist alliance. Specifically the fact he was a darkside user meant that Duku and Maul were his apprentices because of the rule of two. Even if the Jedi don't know the rule itself the fact there's only ever been two dark side users at large in their time would be the big indication. Thus they're justified in that aspect which only means palp rigged the war on both ends for his favor as a sith would. Thus logically reasoning that he had to be stopped before any hidden order be enacted.
They didn't actually break the law when trying to arrest Palpatine The Jedi are allowed to arrest people They told him he was under arrest And then went in the emperor attack them they attacked him back in self-defense
Yeah, feigning surrender is never a good idea. It may give you the upper hand once, but your forces will never be able to truly surrender - they will always have the suspicion on them and likely just be executed. If the CIS had been any more competent, Anakin's false surrender would have screwed the Republic. If some no-name ship captain had done it maybe there would be no problem, but Anakin was one of the most high-profile Jedi of the time. That news would have reached every corner of the galaxy. Also I'm really glad somebody pointed out how terrible the Empire's defeat at Lothal was. Sure, yeah, Empire bad guys or whatever, but seriously? Loading them all into a ship and making it self-destruct, after Ezra and the rest of Phoenix had made a big deal about not killing?
Reminds me of the Deep Space Nine episode Duet, where a file clerk pretends to be a war criminal, because he feels horrible about what happened and he could not do anything. On Lothal he´d be among those blown to bits for being a file clerk for the wrong people, just like any conscipt, blue eyed patriot, low level repairman and janitor. I liked Rouge One for being a bit more honest there as the informant is murdered by the rebel in the beginning. If you´re willing to kill people to achieve your rebellion you´re not gonna be a saint. Rebellions are usually dirty and bloody things.
8:36 In their defense i will tell you they were right. The Senate would never dismiss Palpataine from office. He was too popular and had too much influence. Besides, you must have strong and irrefutable evidence of his guilt to do so, if I remember being Sith wasn't a crime in the republic.
I could point out two or three fallacies here, but the biggest is obi wan. You in the same breathe criticize the jedi for being to lightside focused and criticize obiwan for disarming a deadly attack with force. You may claim he had the bigger responsibility to simply disarm the attacker, but he had every right to defend himself and even destroy that man in the catina.
Most of this is likely from the Legends timeline anyway so I'm not fully convinced the Jedi are "evil" as Aaron claims. True, some of them have committed atrocities against their own people but they either stand trial and get excommunicated or turn to the dark side to avoid conviction.
Good points and it depends on what timeframes we are taling about. At times the sith actually promoter business and trade in the universe. At times the jedi were authoritarians and stoke children from families. Both are sides are not completely evil and this duality is what makes the universe so fascinating.
If you read like any of the books you would know that the Jedi actually did treat the clones under their command as individuals. They thought of them as children, in fact.
Sometimes it takes extreme measures to win a fight, a battle, or even a war. I personally have no problem with mass murder if it ensures ones victory. After all a war is meant to be won. Regardless of the cost.
EXACTLY! I agree. Everyone is an individual. That's what I keep saying, but for some reason, a LOOOTT of people like to think in terms of "groups" and all guilty by association and crap....
let's just remember that later despite everything Revan still chose to follow the light, and let's also not forget the Jedi order refused to do anything against the mandolorians, it was only because of revan and his actions they didn't take over the known galaxy. you call him a murderer, I call him someone who has the will to do what is needed to be done regardless of whether the choice in its self is right or wrong it brought about good change. just like Jacen Solo and his turn to the darkside and with his death he brought galactic stability and peace.
Gotta say something, yes Anakin did fly his ship into a ship under the flag of surrender, but you gotta remember one sentient life form and thousands of droids would be nothing compared to the reverse of Anakin's maneuver. If the trade federation crashed a ship into a station full of clones under the flag of surrender you'd have thousands of casualties. So in a long winded way Anakin did the right thing.
If Qui-Gon would've saved Shmi, it's a safe bet she'd have shown him things that'd make a Hutt blush. Some guys would like to have an Alderaanian Royal pal, but every guy needs a Tattooinian gal.
"in the name of the galactic senate of the republic, you are under arrest Chancellor". "the senate will decide your fate" up until Palpatine drew blood, all four Jedi wanted to arrest him and go through the impeachment process.
"10 horrible things the Jedi order did", has thumbnail of Jedi Master Belth Allusis who fraught and died along side 4,000 republic forces and a few dozen other Jedi Knights defending a shield generator from 50,000 imperial forces taking out most of the imperials in the process.
Tap water not to appealing. But Alien tap milk dude that's just wrong and embarrassing. I will never forget that image of Luke looking that miserable it hurts
The Jedi have caused like, 90% of the Galaxy's issues in Star Wars. Also I'd give Ezra a pass on his actions, he may have been trained to be a Jedi but he was closer to the ancient way than most others.
Some of these have validity and do prove that the Jedi did terrible things. However, many of these are taken out of context and must be viewed fully. For example, he claimed that Pong Krell, a jedi hated clones and deliberately sent them to their deaths. That's because he wasn't a jedi. He hated the jedi and clones and intended to leave them as soon as his plans of were discovered. (his plans being to kill as many clones as possible) He wasn't a jedi, he was merely disguised as one.
Revan’s deed was his decision and his only, I wouldn’t put that event on this list since it was just one Jedi’s strategy. But what the Jedi did to him should never be done, I can’t believe that you forgot about the Jedi committed genocide of the Sith race even if they were Jedi or not Force sensitive!
I was never a huge star wars fan. I fell into watching this channel because I like literary backstory, which this channel really covers. That all said, I have become less and less enamored of the Jedi as a force for good. It's amusing to experience such a switch.
The Jedi were a force of good but just like the nation that they served centuries of tradition and being the top dog had created a mix of arrogance and inability to notice his own problem. The sith on the other side are always bringer of death and destruction.
Palpatine IS a sith and evil and responsible for running the entire galactic empire. If he was killed, millions of lives would have been saved. It would have saved millions.
I just hate how my boy Kitt Fitso went down so easily....that big smile of his was awsome. He always seemed like he be chill Jedi too hang with. Kitt: :D
Yeah, although Kitt Fisto was one of my favorite characters... so I was a little upset about you killing him. But you at least gave him a quick death, so I forgive you...
The Jedi lost their way when they decided to act as agents of the republic instead of agents of the force. There is not a single reason that the Jedi should have opposed the separatists attempts to peacefully leave the republic that doesn't involve their beliefs that the republics needs must come first. The republic was largely failing to protect and provide for the separatists and they should have had the right to shape their own governments. The Jedi could easily spent the last 1000 years challenging slavery or exploring the unknown regions or doing what the force guided them to do instead they became glorified bodyguards for the core worlds. I believe that by taking orders from the senate instead of focusing on the will of the force the Jedi began to loose their connection to the force and the whole order became blinded by arrogance and became unbalanced. When the Jedi backed the republic they all but ensured that the separatists would need to turn to the Sith in order to not be immediately defeated. Yes Sidious was largely involved but the resentments of the Separatists were legitimate. The handling of the blockade of Naboo honestly makes me wonder why Padmae was such a Republic loyalist.
@@airplanenojutsu They sent two Jedi. Not much, but what else could they do besides kicking out the trade federation out of the Republic and sanctioning them.
Yeah, one problem with your thesis: the entire Separatist Council (the ones actually in charge) were war profiteers. The Separatist Parliament didn't want war, but the Separatist Council did. The Jedi were on the right side of the Clone Wars.
11:37 I don't know if Obi-Wan cutting off a dudes arm who's holding blaster at Luke's gut in a lawless space bar is even ethically questionable, It's self defense. He even tried to deescalate the situation by buying them a round. And as far as Ezra luring Imperial combatants back to their base to blow them up, I don't think that holds much water either. Imagine a French resistance fighter in WWII luring Nazi's back to their base to blow it up, I'm not sure if I'd call that foul play. I like that you play devil's advocate in these vids Alan, but sometimes I think you stray a bit too far into unreasonable territory.
you also have to account for the fact that in the star war universe great prosthetic limbs exist, so cutting off someones arm isn't quite as bad as it would be in our world.
