The FN SS-197s in 40gr only go about 1700fps. They are pretty watered down. Only the SS-195/198 get close to 2000fps. Get you so Elite Ammunition and those numbers come way up, even with their 40gr rounds.
It’s crazy how the 10 mm is moving at speeds fast enough to cause hydrostatic shock APART from any fragmentation. That’s CRAZY! I’m buying some of these 10 mm rounds asapmediately!
No question about it, the 10mm trumps em all in my book. Outperform the venerable .357mag, and carryin 16 in a stock 15rd g20 mag. Yes Sir, that’s my sword, an I’m stickin with it. “Say g’night Gracie.”
@@closer71 🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️ someone needs to do some more research, how about go to ballistics 101 and tell me again how over 3/4 of 10MM manufactured ammunition is putting 357 to shame.
I am firm believer in having as much energy dumped in your target over penetration. With over penetration you have excess energy and danger to those around the target. Both of these rounds dump really fast. It is scary to imagine the bone fragments from a chest shot or how these would liquefy a gut shot.
For 2 legged threats, energy dump is what you want, for 4 legged threats, you want to carry that energy as deep as possible. I usually carry a 10mm for both, Underwood Lehigh defenders for 2 legs, Buffalo Bore hard cast for 4 legs.
@@stephenclark6961you beat me. 10mm is my favorite pistol round. There's a round for low penetration and a round for maximum penetration. 10mm has the best selection for the job
I once saw a video of a guy firing those 10mm liberty defense out of a 10mm carbine he was at 2800 to 2900 fps. Thats one hell of a round tools is great for showing the ballistic gel tests. HARD WORKING MAN for sure.
That over head view of that 10mm looked crazy. It would cause so much damage. What a great video. I need to go get a 10mm now. Don’t tell the wife. Lol
I was just back checking some numbers on this video for the weight of the small discs that made it to roughly the 12” mark. Saw a few people mention that it was time to buy a 10mm lol. Hope you did pick one up this past year. Best mm 🏆
Wow those fragmenting rounds to me are the scariest. With every piece straying off it just seems like it would increase the probability of striking something it really shouldn't and increasing the severity of the wound.
Honestly, I own the 10mm Liberty, and it is far better for 3A penetration and energy, but objectively I like the wounding of the 45ACP better in this load. Wider, deeper track with useful fragmentation, each fragment being heavy enough to create separate wound tracks, where as the 10mm basically explodes on impact and the nose of the bullet turns to dust.
Dude, youre talking millimeters difference in width. A big nothing burger. Penetration is better with 10mm. 10mm has More Energy at 100 meters than 45acp at the barrel. Thats all you need to know.
@@nicholasthomas4382 You said in both posts EXACTLY how I felt about this test. Using only this ammo, I'd choose the .45 for the exact same reason. Using something like traditional HST or Gold Dot, I'd pick the 10mm.
Both rounds moving very quick, I was was especially impressed with the speed increase of the 45 ACP round as they are notoriously slow yet hard hitting rounds, good testing as usual
@@angfabiani4284 The big upside is that it can be slower while the weight adds to the energy and that's why some military groups like them still for muffler use (evaded all correct term BS^^). Some argue that it doesn't have to expand cause it already has a bigger cross-section. A lot of calbers can work out fine. Shot placement will always be King.
I liked the .45ACP in the jell, a more controlled separation of the bullet fragments. That 10mm was like an explosion... Would not want to be hit by either one.
Between 10mm and 45 ACP I would choose 45 ACP just because I like 45 and the segmented pieces are bigger but there is no doubt that 10mm is an absolute monster of a round. Can't go wrong with either round no doubt. I am gonna pick up some of these rounds after seeing this test. Really impressive !
10 mm smokes ,a,45. It wount go Thur a llla vest or glass 44 mag wount and 357 sig all fall short I seen a 10 mm go Thur over five foot gel all as to what u feed it but beleave me a 10 mm beats all the about in power Ventura extreme defense ammco or pentrater types go Thur level llla boby armor with a 10 mm 45 falls over test
I'll stick with conventional ammo. The velocity of the 10mm is enough to surpass the threshold to permanently tear human flesh beyond the temporary stretch cavity. In other words it's like a rifle round at close distance. MAGSAFE has fragmenting rounds that are filled with bird shot and epoxy which are very devastating. I'm still sticking with my 230g +p 45acp hollow points. Another EXCELLENT EXCELLENT VIDEO..
I just want to say thank you. I appreciate how much work you put into bringing some good content. Especially with the work you have to put into melting and setting up the gels for the tests. I get why you use them for several tests. I would be the same way. Kudos Tools!
Dang they rocked your gel block pretty hard and made some very interesting holes to put it mildly thanks for sharing your test I don’t own either caliber but I can certainly appreciate the devastation of 10mm & 45 acp
This is an older video and post, but hoping that in the past year you gave into temptation and picked up a 10mm! Or both. I have and like almost all calibers whether handgun or rifle, but 10mm is really a great round for either defense or hunting. One of the most versatile because one (properly built) gun can do so many jobs by swapping ammo. These light ones have less penetration and recoil, others have more standard carry performance, plus many great hunting rounds. And the big slow heavy ones for suppressor use. It’s become my main edc these days.
Very good video! I've always wondered about this ammo. By the way, I really appreciate you not using vulgarity. That makes your videos a lot better than a lot of other people's.
You're gonna have to drop that sir thing 😁. I'm just an old country boy from Kentucky about 20 miles from the Tennessee border. I originally am a Eastern Kentucky guy. I tend to use sir and ma'am a lot too, so I'm just cutting up with you 😉
10mm @ 729 ft\lb!!!💥💪 That's more than any of them I've seen so far, & don't expect anything to beat it! I've got some 9mm already & I'll be picking up some for my Colt 1911 10mm! When i can afford em bc the 9s weren't cheap so im sure the 10s are really pricey.
As you know I have been waiting for this test for a while. It did not let me down. Reminds me of the Glaser Safety Slug. Fast speed, fragmentation and devastating energy. Overpenetration would not be a problem. And imagine the trauma surgeon trying to deal with that wound. Only thing I wonder is did the light weight affect point of aim? I like these rounds. Seems even better than the modern version of the black talon rounds you recently reviewed. I think these rounds could really make a .380 work. Thanks for doing this test. I am going to get some of these in different calibers. Also these rounds are lightweight. The boxes of ammo feel like they are empty. A great test
Great video! Both rounds seem very effective. I would like to see a tiny bit more penetration out of the 10mm fragments though. On a large individual with thick layers on, those fragments are gonna start running out of steam in a hurry. By the time you get through a jacket, a shirt, and an inch or two of skin and fat, that doesn't leave a whole lot of room left for actual organ damage. Seems like a bullet that would benefit greatly from an extra 10-15 grains.
Wow. That 10mm looks like a grenade went off. That would be a lot of fun for a doctor to remove those fragments. Those higher velocity rounds are devastating. Either round is awesome! Heal up soon!
Good stuff Wildman 👏 but I wasn't impressed with the devastation of these 2 high speed rounds. I would like two you to test these same 2 guns using their regular hollow point bullets in normal weight range of 230 and 180 grain hollow points of you choice. Thanks for all the time you put in to do these test for us. Stay frosty, its go time.
Man those are some hot hot loads, with all these different devastating defense rounds it is a bad time to be a bad guy! You said in this video your gel is gonna be angry with you after this test and that it's gonna have to take one for the team, well it certainly got you back in a bad way lol. Have a good on my friend and I will see you on the next one.
I'm like you, It's awful close. The wound channel looks bigger on the 10mm tho, so I'm going to pick the 10mm! Great test! I've been waiting for this one!
Immmm-Pressive!!!! Wow! Ammo technology has come a long way. I own both 10mm and .45 ACP handguns. It's nice to see that there is spectacularly-performing ammo for both calibers. My home defense gun is my 10MM Colt Delta Elite stoked with Buffalo Bore 21B/20 Heavy 10mm 180 Gr. JHP (1350 FPS/728 Ft.-Lbs). I feel sorry for the poor, misguided soul who breaks into my home 😮
Another jelly test in the books! Those are some fast rounds right there!! I would go with the 45 just because I like that round and I have that Rock Island like you 👍🏼 keep up the good work Tools! Glad to see your hands are healing!
Regular HP surgeon goes in knows exactly how many pedals he needs to find. These reminds me of a 5.56, surgeon is so going to be pissed when he gets into that wound. Just like its a nightmare to clean out of the jelly. And that speed man those are going to hit real quick and in a hurry. I like both of them for sure would be great round to have. I've had my eye on these thank you sir for the experiment and your time.
Years ago (1980’s) the Kentucky State Police adopted a cartridge from France for executive protection. It was called the “Arcane” round and averaged 2400 feet per second from our 4” barreled S&W Model-66 .357 Magnum’s. The projectile weighed 45 grains and was composed of copper. What was particularly interesting to me was that it printed POA = POI at 50 yards.
That stuff is wild😲. I've Never seen any projectile come out like that. RU-vid up to their crazy stuff again they turnt my notifications off smh. Nice video bro, i still gotta stick with the .45👍
Both the 10mm and the 45ACP seems to have done an incredible job. It does seem to me that the 45 did more damage over a slightly larger area. It was however a close contest and I wouldn't want to be hit with either 😁
I asked my buddy down at the Local gun store about these rounds last year, and I kid you not he pointed at his pistol hanging from his hip and said " That's all I carry".
I like to shoot them for fun, but I wouldn't carry them for defense. Just can't trust a fragmenting pistol caliber to get enough penetration to stop someone in a real world situation.
@@pewpewTN The base plug is actually designed to penetrate to standard FBI recommended depth after the hollow point segments frag out, It frags and penetrates.
one shot stop with no collateral damage. having used a 220gr 10mm irl, 1 shot, center mass, got 5 inches of penetration in the stand behind guy. . i shot 2 kia. not a good high density situation solution. i will take the 60gr at 2300+fps, neighbors are safe. great demo!
I really got a charge out of the tests. I would use the 45acp since I already own a Colt 1911. I was thinking of getting a 10mm until I saw these tests. That plate that was left over from the 45 was impressively larger then the 10. Another thing I noticed was the pistol recoil seemed minimal compared to a 230 grain + p blast. Great video. 1st time watcher.
Another great video, It was very interesting, especially as a .45 guy, people are always poking fun that it’s an old, slow round, but I just like it, nice to see it win a ballistics competition finally 😂. I’m curious about the recoil you felt from these 2 rounds compared to standard factory loads? Keep up the great work Matt
Thank you sir. I was blown away by the speeds of these rounds. The recoil was much lighter than a standard weight bullet for these and It also had a very unique sound.
The 45s penetration and delayed fragmentation was due to it’s passing through the hole made by the previously shot 9mm. A second shot through the 45 in virgin gel was warranted.
@@fishhunt9874 It definitely didn't follow the same path as that 9mm shot. If you look closely, you can clearly see this. It had it's own independent path and wound channel 100% of the way.
I have a Glock modded for 45super and i carry these rounds for edc with 45super as backup. Honestly, i would rather be shot with a 230 grain gold dot at 1100fps than be shot with these fragmenting rounds, they are nasty.
For all you guys looking for something better from your 45 ACP take a look at the 460 Rowland conversion. Then you can shoot these lightweight fragmenting rds. as well as 45 super (28,000 PSI VS 19,000 for 45 ACP). And if that doesn’t meet your needs then you can step up to a 460; that’ll push a 125 grain 45 rd at 1850-1900 fps. Or a hardcast 255 gr at 1300 fps, that’s a grizzly stopper. The ballistics are equivalent to a 44 magnum but when fired from a semiautomatic with a compensator it only has around 1/3 to 1/2 the recoil of a 44 magnum revolver. Ammo isn’t cheap (about $1.50 a rd) but neither is 44 magnum. 🎉
I carry the .45 rounds in my HK45C, makes the firearm much lighter to carry than 230 GR ball rounds and the effect is clearly devastating. FBI says you need like 15" of penetration but the real effect of these rounds are cumulative, being that the .45 has 5 wound channels, 4 of them being 4-6" and one at 12". This would be a massive disturbance to anything struck. I'm planning on trying some of these out on my High Point .45 Carbine against a pig to see how they fair. Also, it appears to me that these rounds could be pushed a little faster, at least another 100 FPS, for added shock and awe.
These did quite well - frag grenade in a pistol round. These do deliver the goods. Won't want to be on the receiving end of things. Excellent testing and shooting Tools!!!🎩☯️♠️🏁
I bought some Leigh 50 cal . Bullet tips for my inline optima 150 magnum rifle! And the Leigh 50 cal. Bullets are lite bullets with a big hollow point hole! And I have to say they are super fast and very devastating on impact! With 150 gr of powder charge the Leigh 50 cal . Hollow points must be going around 4000 fps. I'm not sure I don't have a chronograph! I hope you could test these Leigh 50 cal bullets with three 50 gr. Triple 777 pellets to find out just how fast they are and impact damage! With a inline cva optima and Leigh lite weight bullets !
Those rounds are amazing fast, and the frag hit would have pulverized anybody! The only defensive rounds I can get here are Federal HST or Hornady Critical Defense. I do order up various hollow points for reloading, but I can’t test them like you do. Hope your hands are healing up OK. Appreciate all the work you do!
Appreciate that brother. Healin up pretty fast surprisingly. I have quite a few rounds I wanna get loaded up to test myself. I just gotta find some time.😣
Might be a good choice for home defense. You wouldn't have to worry about over-penetration. How was the recoil? Was it any lighter than a normal round? Would follow-up shots be faster than with heavier bullets? Thanks for another fun and informative video.
Nice! I couldn't decide on these rounds either so I got a G21 in .45 ACP. 13 shot striker fired carry gun. Shoots 200 lead SWC at 800 or 200grXTP at 1150. Easy to reload too with standard powders.
its easy to convert to .45 super as awell. Just need barrel with fully supported chamber, Higher strength guide rod 22#, Higher strength striker spring and gtg; Able to fire .45 and .45+ as well just use uncaptured guiderod can quickly change out spring weight.
I was concerned there would be just a massive overpenetratio with those bullets going that fast. But no! They just explode for the most part, and not too deeply. Personally I'd opt for the 10mm, because I read that projectiles that go faster than 22000 fps cause massive damage from the temporary cavity exceeding the flesh's ability to snap back from, resulting in one hell of an enhanced permanent wound. That's what makes the 5.56mm so effective despite it's small size and weight.
I own 2 boxes of these, their expensive. I payed $40 for them. I tested them in my EDC with a mixture of defense rounds, the Liberty was much louder than the other defense rounds. It's a good looking round.
@@ToolsandTargets Yeah the cartridges must have the maximum amount of powder that can fit. I carry a S&W Sheild Plus, I recently traded my old Sheild for the Plus and was testing to make sure defensive ammo of choice cycles properly. It would be nice if S&W would put out some spare magazines for them, nobody can find them anywhere. If I would have known I probably would have gone with the P365, upgraded to the Sheild Plus because it also fit my Sheild 9 holster. S&W released the Sheild Plus in March and still no spare mags anywhere. P365, Hellcat, and Glock 43X mags are everywhere but not the Sheild Plus.
@@ToolsandTargets I found a guy online who owns a FFL in Massachusetts who had 20 of the 13 round mags that came with his shipment of Sheild Plus's, they have that dumb 10 max limit law up there. He wanted $80 for a 13 round Sheild Plus magazine. Passed up that crazy price, lol Just going to have to wait.
@@andreawhalen4142 makes me want 10mm…or big horn .500 spike driver lever action…destroys bottles better than any other round…460 xvr with 2200fps hornadys hit hard too..
I may be off by a bit, but what is that 10mm's sectional density? 0.05? Something close to that, I think. At that speed, it will pretty much explode on impact whatever it hits. I think I would rather use regular hollow points in both 10mm and .45.
@@ToolsandTargets I’ve killed 100+ hogs with my 10mm and liberty ammo drops them as fast as my 6.5 Grendel sbr with chest shots. No other handgun ammo even comes close. Hydrostatic shock becomes deadly over 2000 fps cause far greater internal damage with body shots. Slow bullets are the gimmick
Just to put it out there, Wal-Mart has been getting ammo in every few days the past 2 weeks in Florida. I'm not sure about the rest of the states. This last week scored abunch of 22LR, 12GA, & 20GA. Check up on your local Wal-Mart, they've been getting more than usual lately.
You don't get the advantage of hydrostatic shock like rifles though. The reason M16s etc are so dangerous is it launches a small rounds at over 2100fps and damages human tissue not even part of the wound paht. Massive advantage.
No it doesn’t. 2400fps @ 60 grain is 767 ft/lbs of energy. Energy is the key. You can get +800 and +900 10mm rounds easily. You’re average 223 rounds is 1200+ ft/lbs of energy.
@@adamjhuber Yes, Energy is certainly "A" key but doesn't tell the whole story. In the first place I am assuming that the purpose & resulting conclusions of this discussion and test is to determine the best characteristics of each bullet to perform its intended function. To rapidly inflict the maximum amount of damage to a "body" in order to halt its ability to function. Correct ? How a bullet accomplishes this a few different ways. Tissue Damage, piercing & ventilating the body allowing vital body fluids to escape. as well as the overall shock to the nervous system resulting from the sudden transfer of kinetic energy delivered by the impact of a high speed projectile. So i'm assuming that you realize that Energy is meaningless unless it can be transferred to the target. Like shooting a .50 caliber BMG at a oil drum or giant Styrofoam block. Both will barely move due to the .50 round passing right through transferring very little of its energy. Hence the creation of the "hollow point" bullet. A FMJ .223 traveling 3,000fps. is more than likely going to wiz right through dumping very little of its energy unless it strikes bone and disforms which will begin to increase the surface area which will in turn begin to increase the transfer of kinetic energy to the target. . The .223 & 5.56 was chosen by the military due to its very ability to mimic many of the characteristics of a hollow point. But since hollow points are illegal under the Geneva convention for Military application they were looking for a "Legal" round that could accomplish many of the same things. Enter the 5.56. So basically it comes down to this. You are correct in your raw energy estimates of the .223 -vs- the 10mm. But the .223/5.56 needs Help to exceed or even meet the amount of trauma a high velocity 10mm bullet will consistently deliver on a target. This "assistance" the 5.56 FMJ round needs in order to slow it down & NOT over penetrate upon impact. Like the striking of bone or tumbling effect to Dump its kinetic energy and increase the size of the wound channel and ventilation effects is completely external and cannot consistently be relied upon to deliver -vs- the 10mm which can. By its very nature, size, shape & design the 10mm HP within 100+yds is going to be able to predictably & repeatably deliver more trauma to the human or animal body than a 5.56 FMJ. Of course everything changes when you introduce a 5.56 hollow point or any of the other crazy new bullet technologies that are available on most of the self defense pistol rounds. Like the Devastating & Frightening "RIP" rounds that fly apart and basically send razor blades in different directions throughout the body.
@@adamjhuber ok but put these rounds in a carbine with a longer barrel and you'll increase speed and energy. He's getting crazy numbers out of pistols and creating more energy then you would get from a 7.5 inch ar15.
"turns a tummy into soup" -- For some of the "gangsters" in my area that would just mean a free liposuction. Nah, I will take a regular HP to get past their fat layers. In fact, with some of them, a .45 FMJ would be advised.
@@ToolsandTargets great book, .357 was number one , in one shot shooting , on a human being, beat 44 mag and .45? I wonder, if you took modern data, with modern bullets , if that would change?
10 mm gos Thur a level llla vest but 44 mag 45 acp or 357sig dount 10 mm is over twice powerful as a 45 is lok.up vest test see witch gos slap Thur vest or glass
i've used the same round in a g29 on a 160lb hog. hit in the neck... was a home grown meat hog.... it dropped and was gone with a single shot. they are in my top two for personal defense along with the BB 180gr.
Physics plays a large part in this video. Usage must be considered when drawing conclusions; it looks to me these rounds are excellent for the intended purpose. It is important to keep in mind that is a fairly narrow purpose, but those speeds are amazing!
Both were insane. Use depends on need. Both seem able. I do stick to 45 but 10 mm is another greaT option. Like an F-150 or a Tundra. Yep the 45 overall is 😃👍 but the 10 is actually better in some main ways. To match the 45 has to up grade. But lasts long. The ten will crank them out.
