Yup! Apparently, Lularoe started when a merchant saw that Deane did a wonderful job of selling their products and said ‘oh gee, there’s demand for my products, here, have it all and take the profit’. As all savvy business folks tend to do 🙄 Edited to add: unless I misheard. I rewound that a couple of times to make sure I didn’t misunderstand what I just heard
Yes I saw it. I don't know why any sane person would buy those clothes. They're ugly, ill-fitting, poorly made and expensive. So many shops carry better and cheaper alternatives.
Thanks to you, I just watched it, I'm in the UK so hadn't seen the hype. Thanks so much it was fascinating, heartbreaking and disturbing in equal measure!
It could be the year 3000 and us all heads in jars and I still won't be over the fact that Mark interrupted Deanna and asked if he could answer the question about female empowerment for her.
Telling women to please their husband's sexually in order to get their way was something my pastor said once upon a time. Now I realize how creepy that was. 😳
someone who was there when she said that and was a former retailer for lularoe said she was talking about praying cuz she's morman but that deanne is just really awkward and talks weird
@@briardan9226 it was in context of men not wanting their wives to go to church. Basically it was "after church go have sex, and then after a few times he'll be begging you to go to church." It was really weird
Deanne gives me the Michelle Duggar vibes. The "sweet" soft voice, letting her husband take the wheel when he is there and giving nonanswers to questions.
It's almost like they wanted the designers to feel so much pressure they would go and steal other people's work to claim it as their own. Without having to tell them to go steal
I had come back to the US for a funeral five years ago. I was so distraught that I don’t even remember packing. I opened my suitcase to find one pair of shoes and two shirts. I had to buy some bottoms to wear, something quick and easy. And proper shoes for the funeral, as I brought only sandals. I found some leggings at a shoe store called Payless, famous for having very affordable shoes. Those leggings still fit the same and never ripped, even some years later. I paid maybe 10 USD each for them. It amazes me that some cheap leggings I bought out of sudden necessity at a shoe store were still cheaper and of better quality than an MLM allegedly famous for them. Really tells you how terrible they are.
Yeah the reason the cheap looking leggings cost so much - like most mlm products is because so many ppl have to be paid up the line. I actually like a lot of arbonne products but they are 10x what the corresponding P&G product would be because of this.
I had a Fb friend selling LuLaRoe online and it amazed me how hard she worked, how enthusiastic she was and what ugly the clothes were, especially at that price. I mean I was thinking back then that it was literally cheaper to buy a T or a pair of Leggins from Adidas or Puma or any other professional brand
To be fair, Joseph Smith was also an unabashed con artist. If he wants to compair himself to the founder of his religion, I think he's doing a good job emulating him.
I feel like I’d utterly fail at the “little weak lady” part of the MLM. Me: “aww I’m just a lil lady, what can i do?” Guy: “uhhh, what? You’re a Marine..?” Me: “oh, uhhh, but a widdle biddy Maween”
Yeah, I remembered hearing that, too. Even without being a sewing person myself, it just seemed way too ridiculous, even for a simple circle skirt that a total novice like me could make.
The way Kenny chokes up with tears reminds me of my upbringing in the Mormon church. Whenever members share their convictions, i.e. “bare their testimony” of the church in any capacity, it’s considered highly spiritual if they are moved to tears. I get testimony vibes from Kenny.
I can't take credit for those terms! Jill Filipovic used similar language in the doc, and there was also a speaker at the MLM Consumer Awareness conference that spoke about the co-opting of feminist language by MLMs who also support regressive images of gender roles. I've learned from them!
There is a video out there on youtube that actually talks about the very begginings of MLMs, and guess what? MLMs started from religions people using religion to rope people in. The apple doesn't fall far from the tree, does it?
I remember meeting Deanne and her family at a 'special LuLaRoe' gathering a few years ago. She was actually very sweet and easy to talk with, but her husband Mark was such an asshole (sorry for the language but its the only word to describe him appropriately at the get-together/meet-up). I had brought my 12 year old daughter with me and Deanne was talking with her about "what grade are you in", "what do you want to do when you grow up", and "you are so much like my granddaughter you two would get along so well", ie regular conversational things. When out of nowhere, Mark walks up and grabs her arm, saying "what are you doing? You're supposed to be over there selling our new product line to the executive sales reps!" all the while forcefully dragging her off to the other side of the banquet room. He also interrupted her numerous times when she was speaking to the group, talking over her and actually being demeaning towards her. It was sooo awkward and I wasn't the only one to notice. I remember coming home and telling my fellow LuLaRoe rep-friends that I felt like Mark was going to run the business into the ground. It was shortly thereafter that I quit selling LuLaRoe. Unfortunately I lost almost US$10,000 from this MLM venture. I know many others who lost more than that! Overall, I feel like Deanne was taken advantage of by Mark and that while she originally started LLR for good intentions, Mark was in it only for the money 💰
Also, another really strange occurrence within LuLaRoe was how the only people advancing, making money and given extra 'bonuses' were those who were Mormon like Deanne & Mark. I noticed it early on, but kept telling myself that it wasn't possible for LLR to be biased towards only helping fellow Mormons. (Just my personal perspective)
Not only do most MLMs prey on vulnerable women, they manipulate you into thinking that buying $5000 worth of stock doesn’t mean that you’re an avid customer, it means you’re an “employee” investing.
I think the saddest thing I seen because of Lularue was seeing 20 plus women at a flea market selling off all there stock at 50-75% off just to be able to get some of there money back. One lady I know is still trying to financially recover she lost so much 💔
There was a phrase in the temple that wives were to submit to their husbands I remember it when I went through in the early 2000s they removed it I’m an exmo now and have been for 16 years Maxi skirts are very popular in the Mormon culture because they are modest and cover garments Mormonism is the ultimate MLM IMO
@@yourtanktopfriend777 A lot of huns are Mormon across most mlms, which I'm sure was the case when you were in the church back then. Plus they're big donors to Mormon political candidates, meleuca or however its spelt was a major donor to Mitt Romney
Well, it makes sense because Christian Taliban women are one of the main target demographics for these MLM’s. I’m not exactly sure WHY other than the obvious gullibility factor.
@@yourtanktopfriend777 JW’s still use the scriptures about wives being submissive and don’t believe in marital rape. I mean they don’t believe victims full stop but they believe it’s possible to be one, not inside marriage though.
just to warn you someone is going to be offended about you saying anything about selling breastmilk. I saw someone flip on someone else who mentioned it about how "selling it helps women and can save babies" while totally missing its the fact that the COMPANY was telling people to do it for an MLM!!
nothing wrong with donating or selling your breast milk but yes you're right, its the fact that this company was telling them to do so, not because they were making extra milk.
To be honest, I associate selling breast milk with fetishists. So, to me, it's hard to picture the people buying directly from those women as anything other than guys with a fetish. Sort of like how getting sperm from a sperm bank and buying sperm straight from Craigslist are two different things to me. One is for legit reasons, the other is a fetish thing.
I am so confused how Deanne looks like she's 70 years old but her voice sounds like that of a 7 year old. Every time she appears on screen and speaks, my brain suffers a blue screen.
Hello, thank you so much for this deep dive. My mother used to work as a Lularoe distributor and let me tell you it was not fun. I hated having random people go in and out of my house all of the time as a 3rd to 5th grader. Though nothing really bad happens to me I still have the trauma from when my mom did worked for them. Like I always have to lock the bathroom door and check behind the shower curtain before I go to the bathroom, I stay up at night paranoid that someone is in our house. The paranoia got so bad in 5th grade that I kept a knife in my closet. I know weird. Now as a high schooler I look back on it and hate what my mom had to go through. So much that I’m making Lularoe my main topic for my fashion and interior design final. This really helped a lot! Thanks for keeping me informed.
I paid someone $5 to find me a specific pattern of Lularoe leggings in the many… MANY private sell groups. And once I had those leggings in my hands it was like the illusion broke all of a sudden. I know that I’m particularly vulnerable to MLM marketing-I like helping friends, I LOVE doing stupid party games for points that don’t matter, I get anxious when I feel like something is “running out” or “will never be seen again” (or any other false scarcity pressure), etc. And I’ve purchased from several MLMs… and now I stay away 😩
Thank you for mentioning how gross the Tijuana skinnies thing is in light of their marketing to women of all sizes. I bought a lot of lularoe because it was fun to search for the cute patterns in my size, and also because I loved that they seemed to embrace and empower all women. Really gross to find out otherwise
Honestly, not surprised they would. They're a MLM started by a snooty Mormon couple. That's a lethal combination. Everyone's got prejudices, but nobody's quite as proud of them as aggressively "family-friendly" middle-aged white suburbanite types. If they consider themselves "entrepreneurs"... run. Not to mention how mormonism is a religion literally founded on white supremacy, too, so... yeah, lethal cocktail.
Yeah what creeped me out the most was the dramatic difference in DeAnne’s personality between the interview and the deposition. My sister-in-law almost got involved with this company long term but she decided against it pretty quickly.
This is wild to hear, I remember lots of people blowing up my fb to try to sell me these lol. Also, to anyone wondering why many people in the LDS church are susceptible to joining up with MLMs like this... It's because the focus on family often encourages a traditional lifestyle, so there's a high proportion of stay at home moms in the church who are looking for a flexible way to occupy themselves & earn money while still having time for their children. So doing this as a way to "be your own boss" is an alluring prospect.
Actually the reason so many mormons fall for these scams is because they already show their gullibility by being a member of the church and once its understood they have a large capacity for believing fairy tales, they become a population that scammers find hard to resist....hence the large numbers of businesses run by mormons directed at mormons....food storage ringing any bells?
I'm going to say that a lot of the poor placement of patterns were just as much about not pattern matching the fabric when cutting the pattern and not just about how the fabric was designed. Pattern matching takes more time and uses more fabric, so I'm going to guess LLR did not pay the factory to do that.
Deanne probably really hates the gays because she knows that a lot of us would try to talk our friends out of buying the cheap, tacky crap that her company sells.
I thought it was illegal to marry our adopted siblings. When I adopted my son you are told they are your child and have all the rights that your natural born kids do. Plus you get a birth certificate saying you are the parents. So idk what going on
One of them was never formally adopted and came into their lives when they were past childhood. And they weren’t raised together. It’s really not a big deal.
Thanks! That's an interesting way of putting it. The "be your own boss" model does seem appealing and it would be great if it actually could work, but any company that makes its money off of it's employees/customers/victims being subservient to them would not be incentivised to promote independence.
Possibly if they set up on a franchise model: each rep gets an area, and there’s no recruiting. Maybe a finder’s reward if they meet someone to fill an empty area. Focus on the products (and have good products). Reps buy at wholesale and sell at retail, but can have sales to clear out inventory. But franchises are required to reveal a lot more information to prospective franchisees, and the founders can make money, but not as much or as fast as an mlm founder, and they’d have to actually screen prospective reps and actually train them. But that’s not an mlm.
It could never work because within a couple of generations, they would have outpaced the actual population of the planet. And since constant recruitment is a feature of the structure, you simply cannot stop adding more and more people to "the business". Forget market saturation, MLMs would need an endless supply of people to ever work as functional businesses.
@@therealpaulallen well I guess that’s kind of what franchising is. You could buy a McDonald’s franchise and it would be your own to some extent. You have to operate the restaurant to their standards and use their exact product or they won’t let you franchise. That’s different than an mlm where people are hired under you and you make money off of making false promises to unsuspecting marks.
What is it with Mormons and MLMs? I live in Utah and an ExMo. MLMs have been around me since I was a child, but why? Was it because DeVos was so religious and Mormons are desperate to be accepted by the main stream Jesus lovers? They want to be seen as "normal" and have regularly changed the doctrine to be current with the times. *look up the one drop rule I binged the show in about 2 day then later I noticed a lot of 5 star reviews and a bunch of 1 star reviews, the 1 star reviews were apologetics defending LuLaRoe and bashing the show. I piped up and said something like: you know Mark equated himself to Joseph Smith, the guy who married 35+ women, a couple of 14 years old girls, elderly and women who were already married to other men, Joseph Smith sent away on Mormon missions so he could marry them. How is this ok?
It happens with Mormons in Australia as well. I think it is stronger in areas where women are taught to stay home. Some areas of Australia (church wise) are a bit more progressive in that sense. In my area, mums tend to stay home and then join mlms because they probably need somewhere to put their natural energy and motivation
Nom- No need to be a bigot. Your answer lacks any sort of intelligence, or insight into the actual reasons. It gained popularity due to the stay at home role that women take on in these communities. MLM’s exploit this SAHM role; MLM’s promise to answer a SAHM’s particular economic constrains and familial pressures.
There is such an unusual but interesting correlation between mlm schemes and scams with practicing Mormons. Like the more I keep listening about these MLMs the more times the word Mormon pops up. I feel like that alone deserves more investigation.
I am an exmormon and I can't even count how many MLM presentations I went to. My mom got involved in several and I knew a number of people who went from one MLM to another. My Aunt actually made lots of money with MLMs. I think the secret to the MLM is they use the same manipulative mind games the Mormon church uses on their members. The Mormons who are aware of these mind games build the MLMs and the ones who are not aware of them become their victims. And Mormons are all taught to trust each other. It's a perfect feasting ground.
@@lieseljones2216 So its the community of trust and that's what MLMs need, people who trust despite the red flags and maybe warnings online and in person. Plus the fact mlms have a similar type of set up so I can imagine the familiar must be there. The promises of friendship and making things better for all. I know that religions in general have a problem with scammers taking advantage of these communities which is honestly terrible.
There’s an old movie from the 60s called If a Man Answers. The young wife uses dog training techniques on her husband. I always thought that was weird and kinda gross. That was before I saw the footage of the creepy guy starting at 18:33.
I did freelance design work for Agnes & Dora and she wanted to somehow sell the thousands of items she had in inventory after getting rid of the consultant program. A lot of reps were enraged. As I was trying to help her figure out how to improve her marketing and visual brand, I realized that I was trying to resuscitate a dying company. I had to call it quits after a while because nothing I could do would help it.
The money for a 10k starter kit is more than 6 months of my disability; the 500 dollar kit is like 10 months of groceries for me. That people can be taken for so much money and get nothing just kills me
As an artist and graphic designer, I highly doubt “just change it 20%” would avoid copyright violation. Either way, it’s highly unethical. As for storing open bins of clothes in the parking lot (or just covering it with a tarp), had no one ever heard of renting a pod or cargo container? It would have been such an easy solution! Even schools, with their tiny budgets, have figured out how to use mobile units!
Properly storing merchandise cost money and they want to spend it on luxury cars and purses to buy. In MLMs the product doesn't really matter. The consultants are in a cult like mindset and will buy it no matter what. And because the consultants are the real customers, the executives don't care if they can sell it.
Makes you wonder if the reason they are pushing the Tijuana trip is because they are getting kickbacks. Mind you, I have not seen the documentary yet but you have convinced me to watch it.
I had come back to the US for a funeral five years ago. I was so distraught that I don’t even remember packing. I opened my suitcase to find one pair of shoes and two shirts. I had to buy some bottoms to wear, something quick and easy. And proper shoes for the funeral, as I brought only sandals. I found some leggings at a shoe store called Payless, famous for having very affordable shoes. Those leggings still fit the same and never ripped, even some years later. I paid maybe 10 USD each for them. It amazes me that some cheap leggings I bought out of sudden necessity at a shoe store were still cheaper and of better quality than an MLM allegedly famous for them
Seriously. I spend about $6 on the leggings I get from Walmart and so far...not one of them have ripped. Are the patterns maybe a bit tacky (galaxy, Halloween tie dye), yeah probably to some, but I'd rather buy those patterns than the ones this place did.
It’s very funny to me how even in the doc it’s so obvious that while Deanne try’s to appear “calm and sweet” and lets her husband take the reins...it’s such a dead giveaway that she’s basically the puppet master and her husband isn’t picking up on that? 😂
The LuLaRoe documentary, LuLaRich, is so informative while also being sad. LuLaRoe is taking advantage of these women just trying to make a living working from home.
Well okay Deanne claims she made $20,000 in six months selling maxi skirts she made herself What the hell did she charge for these skirts and how the hell did she find the time to make them?
I literally just came from my local Goodwill store about 30 minutes ago and guess what was one of the first things I pulled out of the racks? A God-awful LuLaRoe print ladies top. I absolutely laughed out loud! 🤯🤯🤯🤯🤯
"I can excuse them for stealing from other artists because of the company policies" is a terrible an dreadful statement to make, and really damaginf for artists because we already struggle to get visibility, to get paid, to have our work paid at a fair price, and art theft is an actual, very real problem that we face. And when big companies like LuLaRoe steal from us, we cannot do anything about it because if we sue, most of the time, we lose. Stealing is never ever excusable. Especially stealing from a population who already struggles to make a living and who, most of the time, has to work more than one job outside of illustration to survive.
You’re quoting me saying something I never said. I said I place most of the blame on the company itself for having such unrealistic quotas - not that the artists are completely blameless.
MLMs are just sort of a more concentrated evil form of literally ALL Companies and Corporations. Just a question of how much they place profits ahead of people in the end.
Great video as always. Is it correct if I say: „Whenever a company makes more money from recruiting reps than from selling their products, it’s a MLM.“?
I think that’s pretty accurate, although there maybe companies that aren’t MLMs that make money off of recruiting, but I’m not sure what they would be.
I’d go so far as to say that if a company makes more money from recruiting its own employees than from selling their products, it is a SCAM. I can’t think of a single legit business that this applies to. Employees should earn a living for working at a company (independent contractor or not), not the other way around
@@omenala_ Exactly right. Employees should be busy promoting the products of the company, and that’s where the income should be. A company should always provide everything to the employee free of charge, such as the uniform and name tag (if needed). The only exception may be a delivery vehicle in some cases, but many companies also provide a company vehicle to do company work. If a company asks you to pay for your own uniform and starter supplies, that’s already a huge red flag. If you’re told that your main income is from recruiting rather than sales, just leave.
So in the documentary the only difference between a MLM and Pyrwmid Scheme was the fact they profited off recruitment and not not product. They tried to switch their strategy (when bonuses shrunk) but were too greedy to stick to it. That's how Washington state sued them under a pyramid scheme. If they officially profited off product it would me an MLM. Like a Avon or Mary Kay which is legal.
The contrast between how Mark and Deanne act with the documentary crew and how they act when they were being interrogated is very jarring. It's a clear indicator of how inauthentic they are. Something they forgot to include was that Mr. Ivanofsky made fun of someone with down syndrome.
Selling your bodily fluids for business startup on a pyramid scheme is a bad sign you make poor financial decisions. Also if their child married their adopted child but they didn't live together, I can assume with some evidence that their child is significantly older than the adopted kid, and than he married that child when she turned 16, so they wouldn't be the first Mormons to adopt a little girl to raise for their son but I think they did...so gross
i remember this really sweet girl from my summer camp as a child. when we got older we went our separate ways and she joined a missionary group, i got 3 group requests for Lularoe on facebook, 2 of which were from her 💀 it took her maybe 3-4 years to decide it was trash
I have never done a MLM, but I know many who have. It always looks good when you meet someone at the top of the pyramid. Everyone I know has wasted A LOT of time and money and ended up with boxes full of junk in their garage.
I always wondered why the thrift stores were full of LulaRoe merchandise. Always looked like some stuff had cute patterns but I don't like the cut and they seem cheap and flimsy.
I was in an MLM for all of 3 days. I missed two whole days of college for all-day training. I really should have known to be suspicious when my 'job interview' was with a group of people and not a one-on-one thing. The other big tip-off was when most of the training was about recruiting other people rather than, I dunno, teaching you how to do your job. I think it's easy to be so excited about a potential source of income and overlook some of the red flags just because of how eager you are. That was my first official job. I quit when I put 2 and 2 together. It was one of those schemes that preys on high school graduates/early college students because you're fresh out in the world and don't have enough experience to go 'hey, wait, this is bullshit!' Of course, I had to wait to jump ship until they sent me free stuff. Haha. I don't blame people who get roped into MLMs. I don't think it's a matter of stupidity so much as they're very good at sugarcoating things and making it seem like the perfect opportunity. Thanks for talking about this - the more people bring awareness to these schemes, the less likely it is they'll be able to lure in new victims.
This was such a great video, my stepmom (now divorced from my Father) went to TJ to get weight loss surgery. After she came back, she was never the same, she couldn't eat very much and was sore from the surgery, and was always in pain. Even, still long after supposed recovery. I remember even about a year after we had gone on a family cruise including extended family and grandparents. She stayed in the cabin the whole entire time. It wasn't because she was seasick. She was just in physical pain still from the TJ skinny surgery. I don't know if there's any connection to the group of women featured in this documentary. What I think the documentary lightly touched on but could have gone into more detail is how a lot of LDS affluent families operate these big MLM's. And perhaps engaging in the question of -- is this harmful to society. Thanks again for the great video! -- I'll be back!
Unfortunately, they are still in business! Those vampires are still worth millions and have not admitted any wrongdoing. The documentary is very good but just made me so angry that they are still smugly smiling at the camera and feeling completely virtuous
I very much like your presentation style. Its professional, clearly well thought out, and presented with calm aplomb. I share all your content which I can’t say for any other RU-vidr. I just started watching LulaRich. Five minutes in and I’m gobsmacked.
My aunt gave my cousin $5000 to start because that’s what the rule was. I never got on the lularoe bus but one day I noticed they made some leggings with Kermit the Frog. Yes I’m a 70’s baby lol. I was shocked to discover she didn’t get to order what her customers asked for, the company would just send her random items and she never knew what she was getting. She did it for 6 months maybe a year and we quit hearing about it so I guess that was the life span of a lularoe consultant.
I totally bought these maybe 7-8 years ago. My leggings got holes easily and were pricey for leggings. I liked some of the tips because I have kids and i was in post partum mode a lot back then, they always made me feel better about my body. But now, knowing what I know about all MLMs I don’t want to support them. This went through my church like crazy! Because church promotes stay at home moms more, MLMs are big within the church as a man opportunity to make money and still be doing what God calls of you by staying with your kinds and homeschooling ect. It’s weird to think I used to think it was all normal and good.
Listen, my husband and I have been together for 16 years. There’s nothing I won’t do for him in that way and I’ll do it whenever he wants within reason, however, he still can’t just throw money at me to buy a bunch of needless crap over it because we live on a budget and I wouldn’t want him to because I do that for free anyway. That is the dumbest most misogynistic crap I have ever heard in my life.
My daughter tried to be a Lularoe salesperson and unfortunately, or fortunately, didn’t last too long. While i have a couple of pieces that i like, for the cost, the clothes were very cheaply made!
I am 53 years old. I do not have social media. I had never heard of an MLM until lularoe. Frankly, I am shocked anyone falls for this, so I don’t have too much empathy. Not once in my life have I ever had a job that I had to pay money for.
I believe the rule is 30% for it to pass copyright. I vaguely remember a discussion back in Design school around this when we were creating logos. Thinking back, the hard rule may be 20% but recommended 30% to be extra safe. The real question is...how do you measure the percentage of change in an artwork, and eye test can only go so far.
Wow. Don’t know how this ended up in my recommends but excellent breakdown. I knew the company but never wore any of their ugly leggings. I thought that lularoe was Kate Hudson’s thing? 🤷🏻♀️ good video. Informative
I enjoyed the doc. I wasn’t familiar with the brand but I did remember seeing the name somewhere. This mlm did seem like the perfect storm. You had a devious charismatic and unscrupulous couple, the perfect marks (at home moms in need of income), and the power of social media to extend their tentacles. What I found most fascinating was the message at the end. They said mlm scams don’t go away, they just change their face and become a new company. This is true. I think channels like yours are very Important in educating the public on these predators. It’s difficult to compete with companies that hire Katy perry, but it can be done through education.
