Using a Camry 5S FE short block with an Altezza 3SGE dual VVTi Beams cylinder head, I start creating the ultimate S series engine for the Celica GT-Four ST185 Rally car
I’m so excited for this build! I’d been looking on RU-vid for a good example of a 5sgte project but nobody has done it correctly or even completed any documentation of it so I’m happy to see someone with your know how and Toyota Knowledge pulling it all together! Cheers mate can’t wait to see this all complete and in the celica
I am currently running an unbuilt Manual Blacktop Beams in my MR2 (only full swap I'm aware of in an MR2). I will build it now that I am confident I got the swap in there correctly. I was considering using the 5S block for a big power build when I realized the blacktop block was made in the same generation as the coveted 98+ 5S block so casting material would be of similar quality. When i compared the two blocks side by side, I wasn't able to see why the 5S block would hold up any better than the Blacktop block. Having said that, I didn't do any sonic testing or any other in depth analysis comparing the two blocks. In my opinion sticking with the blacktop block may be a more straightforward build for anyone considering running the blacktop head. Either way I love the 5S + Blacktop combo idea and am very interested. Cudos for taking on this project and for sharing!
nice, in a sw20 or aw? the backtop block certainly makes things easier. I have ultrasonic tested both the late model 3s and 5s blocks. the 5s has on average 1mm extra bore thickness and is a harder material. the 3s block will hold around 500hp depending on cylinder pressure.
Keen to see progress. I just used redtop version in my 165 for my first build. But have a BT head and 5s block for rnd 2. Esp keen to see how you mod the big breather/drain in coolant neck and externally feed the vvti.
@@hawes_power5590 thanks bro... Will probably be a couple of years before it is ready for the road.... Am only wanting 250-300hp out of it... Do you have any tips on what I will need apart from the turbo and ecu... I would like to stay relatively high comp and low boost if that makes sense
@@nigelsmith7366 you can run that power on a factory engine. use a big turbo running low boost to keep the engine alive down low. but anymore and you want upgraded rods, pistons and head studs.
This is an interesting build, looking forward to seeing how it turns out! Question: Isn't it recommended to use a torque plate to clamp down on the block before doing the cylinder walls and headstuds so it will "preflex" into it's final shape? Or not necessary on iron blocks?
There isn't much choice for 5S rods, these maxspeeding rods are underrated. The custom pistons were well priced, and they had all the 3s specs in terms of valve angle etc. hopefully it all holds together
Finally someone ballsy enough to take on this challenge and put the info out. Been contemplating this set up for my tezza for a while. P.S. Got a link to those valve springs? And are you retaining VVT-I?
haha. Yeah I'm sure it has been done before, but as you say, no one has documented it. i got them from Kennelly cams in NZ www.kcams.co.nz/ Yes defiantly retaining the VVTi, its the main advantage of this head. although the do have superior port design etc
Would it make sense to utilize 5sgte pistons and have them machined for the valve angle ? If not, what are the necessary measurements for this kind of custom piston ?
I wonder if the stock 5s pistons wouldn't work with the beams head/valves? The 3s pistons have way too much of a dome, but the 5s pistons look pretty close. Don't know what they would give you for compression, but they would be more likely to work that the gen2/3 3sge pistons.
the 5S pistons do have a lot of dish so you might end up with a reasonble CR. Im not sure what the valve angle of the 5S is would could be an issue. anyway, the 5S pistons were never designed to handle boost so it was never an option for me. they may work as a budget low boost setup
@@hawes_power5590 For sure no boost, or minimal boost. I was thinking in the context of doing a really cheap 5sge, could you do something so simple and see good results?
valve angles are completely different from the Beams to the 3SGT head, if you use any non Beams pistons make sure to clay the head for piston to valve clearance
Hi I am trying to Follow and copy most of the build for my altezza With the J160 trans. Would you be able to give me some more info on the pistons? Who I would need to talk to to make me some? I have the car and a Running 5sge, so just need to buy the Beams head and other 3sge parts.
it is possible, but the engines are very hard to even lift, let alone throw on top of another engine. you would have to be very strong. all jokes aside, I presume you mean a beams head onto a 3sgte block. kind of, the head will bolt on but the valves will hit the 3sgte pistons due to the different valve angle. so custom pistons are require
Hey fellow kiwi here. I built a 5sgte around 2018 using the manual blacktop head, custom rods, pistons, full cnc head, cam upgrade, full ferrea valvetrain. Running ext. oil pressure ported using an line to activate the variable cam timing. Partial grout filled block, stud kit etc. Stuck it into a TA22 and a built R154, LSD streeter
clearly the 5SFE was never intended to be a performance engine, but it is underpowered compared to the 3sge, or honda B series or even a 4age from the same era
@Hawes_Power oh,of course,just saying it's within standard power for that market,not on the lower end; like say a D series. Certainly nothing that puts 100 to the wheels is exhilarating lol.
