8th Order Enclosures 

In an online world filled with self claimed "experts", it's so refreshing to see someone who actually knows and loves what he's talking about. Props man

I don’t know how actually useful it will be, but this channel has yet to be anything less than absolutely fascinating. It looks like I’m going to be spending the Easter break searching out the rest of your posts Thanks for your time and effort!

I wanted to thank you for your videos. I have always built sealed boxes just out of simplicity and never looked into ported boxes because of it. I have learned a lot binging your vids the past few days.

Nice to find somebody that really knows what they're talkin about in-depth! Been brainstorming for a while on what dimensions and type of cabinet that would work best for the forward cab of my Stepside bread truck. Thank you for the great educational content.

Just found the channel and it's great. Thanks for the simple and clear explanations on a variety of complicated topics. Keep them coming.

I really love your videos. I like the way you explain things, and while i struggle to keep up at times, im always eager to learn more and am usually sad when your videos end. Thank you for your contributions! You are amazing at what you do.

Peter, Thank you so much for these video's. I remember following your suggestions on the various forums many years ago.

finally someone on youtube that can explain the "voodoo" parts of bass enclosures.

Pete I'm always so happy and excited to see you and to be watching your RU-vid videos. 👍👍👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏

Another excellent and informative video. It is impressive to see how your video production quality has improved so much in in a half year. Certainly redoing the previous "Counting Enclosure Orders" one for the sake of those prone to motion sickness would be a valuable contribution, even if it was just an edit with the same sound track an diagrams only.

Amazing information sir. Subscribed. Been looking for content like this for soooo long. Keep it up

I have been a fan of your content for about 4 or so years. I live nearby in Tucson and my passion is car audio! I go to bed dreaming about different audio setups every night! I love your passion and knowledge of the subject. Maybe someday we will meet since you live within a hour of here. Thanks for the great videos!

Informative as always Pete. I concur with +Dylan Harrison. Taking into account that rooms and cars both have various sizes to them, how a larger or smaller box and design + location can all be pushed toward reaching your target sound. I think these would be great topics for vlogs. Hi Sophie!

Good to see you back man...always enlightening

Best videos on the internet regarding enclosure and loudspeaker design - really great content! Would love for you to dive a little bit more into the differences between capacitive, resistive and inductive loads etc. as well as how you may go about designing a sealed enclosure accounting for the 4th order bandpass effects of a vehicle cabin.

Ahhh, the knowledge (and Team Toxic Bass flashbacks). Thanks for the deeper understanding of design and how it can change the logistics of your build. Its not the gear, its having an understanding of what the gear can do. Audio tailoring.

Pete, you've done it! PS Audio is advertising on your video now! Awesome! Props to ya man!

Very informative! I like it! Id love to see more videos like this one!

Informative information, Pete.

This is the best I have heard this explained. I notice that you often talk about making an enclosure more inductive or capacitive. I am sure it has to do with moving those control points up and down a a decent explanation would be amazing. I have been searching the interwebs for what feels like years and I cannot find anything on the subject that doesn't require a Phd to understand.

You are amazing, love your videos, and the information you give is so cool and rare to find , if that makes an sense. Thank you 👌❤

About twenty years ago, I used WIN ISD software to design a 6th Order Parallel Tuned Band Pass with a Radio Shack 8 inch woofer. It was quite impressive, and I had people swear I was using a 15s in my enclosures. I still have one of the pair and currently use it for my PC sub.

A regular VLOG is returning!?!!?! I am excite!!!!

My new fav vids to watch...awesome ..the Yoda of sound

I love the group delay comment turning red.. haha. Great format and subject matter!

Miss the vlogs. Nice info

Thanks for sharing, you explain things in a helpful way.

Awesome explanation, thanks!

This answered some of the questions i had. Thank u.

I'm curious about the 8th order bandpass you made, do you have a link to the forum page?

I really enjoy your videos, even i dont understand everything. But this video is so good explained, i understood everything... almost =)

My wife too gets louder & louder & louder & louder & louder & louder & Poof !!!! Lol thank you Peter for yet another amazing tutorial video... Awsome & educational as always !!!!

At some point, please remake your 'Counting Bandpass Orders" video from the Audio Dynamics vlog. The content is excellent but it would be great to see it redone with your improved production value (and the lack of a shaky POV camera). It would also be great if you could delve into the capacitive, resistive and reactive concepts. Thank you for sharing your knowledge!

Love this channel

Love fabfilter plugins !!! This was cool! How does the acoustic order affect the sub’s power handling? How do you determine the correct amount of power for a sub in a ported or bandpass? I usually read about a sub in a sealed enclosure taking more power vs sealed or bandpass, can you please elaborate as to why? Also it may be good to have concrete info from an experienced designer like you to talk about on series vs parallel tuning. Just some ideas for content! Thanks for the vid!

I too would love to recreate the 8th order and and put it on a spl meter. I have so much fun using different different designs and driver's. Especially those combinations that really shouldn't be used together. Sometimes, though, they have surprising results.

I love these videos

Airspace and subwoofers. Give a nice explanation of how they truly correlate and if going bigger or smaller than recommended affects the output and logetivity of the driver?

One topic of interest for me: the dynamics of a sound wave propagating through a room. Specifically, topics such phase, delay, and waterfall graphs from measuring tools like REW, and constructive/destructive wave interactions when dealing with multiple subwoofers in a room. Thanks!

Your a cool dude I couldn't find much on band pass until i found your channel

yo Pete, nice to see you again.

It would be very interesting to hear you discuss the Western Electric horns (12, 15, 16, etc.), air column, horn length, and frequency responses. Another great vid. Thanks.

I have learned that there are some class d amplifiers that happen to be quite efficient. So, efficiency in a sub box is interesting as well. Some efficient subs tend to now go very deep and typically the ones that hit the bottom notes tend to not be very efficient.

You're correct about group delay (charge storage) with high order filters. But high order filters can also (especially when the damping factor is poor; eg, most passive networks) be synonymous with moving coil transducers "ringing" as they try, but fail, to follow the SPL-descent that the sharp Xover slope describes/defines. This 1 reason why (in speaker/monitor design) you often (but not always) see high order Xovers (4th order and higher) usually implemented in active systems; where there is no passive network between the amplifier output stage and the transducer itself; therefore optimizing damping and other Xover design considerations. Appreciate that here, in this video, you're mostly talking about acoustic filters, as opposed to electric filters. Still, there are always compromises, as high order acoustic filters introduce some funky considerations to the impedance/phase plots.

Thanks this gave me better insight in to the system I am going to build...

Thank you for sharing your knowledge, time, and efforts. I can see this as my "the place it started" point and good sense would make me run away right this minute but now I have questions... haha. I'm from the era where Jensen 6x9" coaxs and 20wpc booster were an awesome upgrade, and not surprisingly I still have the old Radio Shack book on speaker enclosures from about the same era (70's) One of the projects is a multiple chamber bandpass but I can't tell what order it is because the primary chamber is vented to the front of the box as well as the secondary chamber. Both chambers have a front facing port and it's a 2:1 ratio box they reported tuning to 35/70hz. I don't get what the primary chamber port to the front and speaker facing the front does to the order count though. My guess is 8th order because of the three ports, two chambers. That search for tuning math and a better understanding of order counts leads me to here and your excellent content. Now, after watching this a couple of times, I tried finding your 5.25 design. I fear it's lost in the webs. I'm really interested in the tuning part and I'd love to find it if the design is still posted somewhere. Any pointers would be fantastic. Thanks!

can you share your dayton 5" design and modeled spl?

Yeah. You are not drown out in this video with loud background music. I just subbed.

Question: Why are FIR or Allpass filters better for groupdelay on subwoofers?

You are the man win it comes to acoustic

Just discovered your channel and I'm really enjoying it. I watched your video on determining order and it is great. Is there also a correlation between enclosure order and roll off below the F3 knee? I always thought there was because the enclosure types that I have worked with the most bear this out: Sealed = 12dB=Second Order and Vented = 24dB=fourth order. Your thoughts on this would be of great interest to me and thanks again for sharing your knowledge!!

That was great video. How does the port in each chamber effect the sound spike, length and width, add what effect would a horn have instead of a regular port?

So basically sealed is 2nd order because it only has the subwoofer to radiate sound. Ported/passive radiator is 4th order because of the active driver and the passive port/radiator working together. 4th order bandpass has the active driver basically in a sealed box with a port/passive radiator on top of that. 6th and 8th are just more complex versions of 4th order bandpass. I’m probably dumbing it down but that’s my understanding of it. Or what I gathered from watching the video at least.

let's just be very real. I missed you man. Hope your back.

Are there any forums or "how too's" on designing 8th order enclosures? Ive heard of them, and even thought about constructing one for my vehicle, but there isnt any decent info on how to design one, from volume ratio's to port ratios.

I can't believe I didn't find this sooner.

good information

Hi! Love your videos... What is the smallest 4th or 6 order 12 inch sub box I can build for the deepest bass ? For a hatchback vehicle

Hello Pete: Can you recommend a place where I could go to learn more about designing an 8th Order enclosure that line up all the control points to make super efficient one note wonder for SPL competition purposes? Thank You

Man This stuff is fascinating. can you recommend a place, video or website that will give general guidelines on how to design an 8th order enclosure? I have 21.6 cubic feet of space I'm dying to play with.

Hope you and Sophie have been doing well.

Do Isobaric setups sound tighter / faster / better? i.e 4 cu foot encosure on one amp (w/one driver) vs. two 2 cu foot enclosures on two amps (four drivers) I assume having four times the drivers, and twice the power to get the same spl / response curve must come with dramatically more solid & controlled results?

If you make a box with t-line and 8th order would that work well together?

i have a 2002 325xi and want to do a sealed 15 and a ported 15 what would be the best ported box design for that

What are your thoughts on a folded horn enclosure?

Any tips on building an 8th order? Or how much do you charge to build a design for a (1) 15inch going in a 2000 outback?

So useful

I'm curious as to what a horn does with control points. It must be like a 4th order but with a port with multiple resonant frequencies or a continuous resonant range, although it takes up a lot of space to do this.

Cheers Bro

This is fascinating.

Ok ok I have to ask you a question or few. I have a small light duty pickup truck that I am using to grasp on to what was my youth. In this single cab s10 I have the intentions of a sound system that is not just loud (where my issues and concerns lay), but also be very musical. Is a 8th order hybrid or a fourth order enclosure something I should continue to explore? To do this, I am very aware that I would need to put the enclosure in the bed and cut through to the cab. Now as I am trying to grasp at my youth, I am not trying to bring along the ignorance I had in tow. Before I do something crazy like this I would love some solid advice. Anything that you could add would be greatly appreciated. If you would like any additional information, feel free to contact me.

I would love to learn about how to design higher order types of enclosures. Sort of a basic "how to approach the topic without getting too nuts" type of video, that would be quite nice^^

How loud they get on the meter?

I know this is an old video, and I have tried googling about more information, specifically the first style 8th order Bass reflex style box which I had never heard of before. I have seen the style where the sub is contained in the chamber (bandpass) but never one not in a bandpass style enclosure. If I get one built, how do I protect my subs from a masked clip or the group delay?

motional feedback drivers would be a nice topic to cover

Used to watch your "guess what's in the trunk" vids back in the day

Ya it’s still the old formula for bandpass boxes they hide distortion. But I figure since bass is glamorized distortion anyway-Go for it! Audio is such a kool hobby to have I’m always learning stuff especially from you. You rock!! Can you do a push and pull 8th order?? I like ultra low bass. I hear some people will build a “piston” type rig just to simulate low bass.

well said pete! you could also mention the destruction of transients in an 8th too as a bad point lol x

Is it possible to use a “free air” subwoofer to design only the front portion of a 4th order bandpass to fire into and then direct the port output to a rear deck in a car?

Good day... How exactly does one model an 8th order subwoofer? O.O (I only have WinISD which has some ABC enclosure, thing)

Thanks

So an eighth order is creating multiple frequency spikes per say as opposed to a t line which lowers the spikes and fills in the dips? Also which one is more efficient? Could either one of these be used in a high wattage spl build with the added benefit of having a broader bandwidth?

This is very intriguing! I'd love to know how to design these kinds of enclosures, but couldn't find anything about this niche topic. Any help is appreciated!

I Know this an old video but figured Id ask here since its relevant. You mentioned group delay and it makes sense to me on paper but when thinking about the way its been described to me it doesnt seem like it should change. It has been described to me as the mass of air in the port is essentially coupled to the woofer, if that is the case shouldnt the output of the port happen with woofer movement?

Pete! What software are you using for your enclosures?!

I've built an 6th and an 8th, the 8th is a triple reflex type, tuned to 39, 75 and 105 Hz. The driver is just an entry level Orion Cobalt 10 inch, rated at 200 watts RMS, with an F/S frequency of 39 Hz. I built if for my car, and it's by far the loudest 200 watts I've herd, and it compliments rock, especially considering the Bass Guitar's lowest note is roughly 41 Hz. It was very experimental, and i'm far from an expert. My 12 inch Alpine type R is in a 6th order, that is loud, but it it's only good for hip-hop, rhythm and blues, Electronic music, as it starts topping out at 70ish Hz, the 8th however gets well into the 120- 130 Hz. And yes it's a beast, like 40 Kg.

Is there any way to model/simulate all these acoustic orders? Also can you do a vid on the principles of how helmholtz's resonance ties into all the different orders? Loving these vids man

Live your channel.... What is that box tuning app your using?

Can you please share some resources where to study these things?? Thanks

Cool, didnt know that an 8th order are series too. That means when a put an 4th order in my car, the car itself lasts in an 8th order, thanks man;)

I just got a M&K MX 350 Sub is it just the polarity that makes it Push Pull instead Isobaric?

do anyone know any free enlosure design software to design 6th order bandpass? other than winisd

HEXI !! i love your vids, as a new car audiophile, i am learning a lot. please keep it up we are listening!

My head is buzzing I'ma 27 year custom car audio fabricator anyway I'm playing with the sound cubed hds2 10" Dodge guad cab box on seat wanting to do a single sub high spl with as good sq as possible what would u recommend for one sub and later a dual sub setup

hey hexi! is there any software that would help us design rather more complicated boxes such as this?

Do you recommend metal enclosure?

I don't suppose you could do a free consultation for me on what box I should build and what subs I should pick with my specific budget, space, and power constraints, could you?

What software do you use to calculate higher order cabinets and some of the crazier designs?

Scouring RU-vid, I can’t find a single video about designing boxes above 2nd order with the exception of 4th. I think I understand tuning frequency with port length, but is there a way to adjust the Q? How does one model this with free software or a good old fashioned calculator if necessary?

I need a 2 to 1 6th order box that is tuned to 25hz rear and 50hz for 2 12s. What i need is all the details to what i need to cut each board to and what ones in order to put them together. I need someome who has the ability to do so.