Adventure flying - hangglider thermal tips 

Awwww thank you! And... well you're never too old to start. One of my flying friends just had his 79th birthday!

Thanks Pete, that's not to say that I'm doing it right - but quite happy to share what little I know!

@@MooSurfer I dont know if they consider it a compliment to call you a badass out yonder way, but your a badass!

@@KissingEmbers I'll take badass as compliment any day! Though my ass in actuality is really good.

I'm sorry for my English, Do you ever tried to towing using car until lift higher?

Thank you so much for your kind words! Glad you enjoy and hope to get some more videos on soon....

The hang gliding community in Arizona is still going strong, actually grown over the last few years. Oatman is closed, but mingus is still a busy spot. I live below elden and fly the craters as often as possible.

I think that's really good advice... So many people don't turn tightly enough, including me on my latest glider. It really depends on the thermal though and how good it is. I did a course with Gerolf Heinrichs - former European Champion, physicist and chief designer for Moyes Hanggliders. He said the optimum was 42 degree bank. Though I have no idea where that figure came from!

Thank you H.Wirz... I'm so glad you enjoy my videos :-) 69... not too old - some of my friends are in their mid-70s and still fly in competitions!

He once stole my harness too... took the wrong one by mistake and buggered off to Scotland!

Thank you Iaszlo! My biggest advice is - keep trying and practicing, it does get easier :-)

Yes I will do so!, Thankyou Darren Brown 👍and looking forward to watching Your other videos!! 🤩

You're welcome!! I'd love to hear how your training is going... and maybe see some vids of it? I'm hoping to get my son trained next year too...

Thank you Jakub! What lovely things to say :-) Next year I hope to do more thermalling tips videos and in different locations.... We're all learning all the time - I always look to improve my technique. I'm very glad I could help you!

Thank you! Look forward to seeing YOUR hanggliding videos then! ;-)

Thanks Rubens - so glad you like it! There are more videos to come...

Thank you John!! Really lovely comments - I very much appreciate them. I'm hoping to do some more videos like this one this year and hopefully add some more to my thermalling tips / ideas.

Thank you - I'm glad I helped. The biggest tip is to keep practicing the thermalling and learn what it 'feels' like when it is going well.

Thanks Cheryl... the interview was a little difficult because I don't think Marco fully understood what I was asking (though his English IS excellent) and I'm also cognisant that a long interview might get boring for some people. I do have some more interview with Marco (and others too) though which will be getting posted soon. Regarding putting tasks into my GPS and downloading them - I could do that, but it is a little different for each different type of instrument. Maybe I could do one for mine though and that might help other people with the same instrument. Yes a LOT different to the good old days with maps. Though I do have a map now it's electronic and shows my position live time, together with airspace!! As for the background... I actually hadn't noticed that until I posted the video today. Ah well... I've got an interview with him too!

@@MooSurfer All good Darren. Love the video's. Keep them coming. Regards Scott (Cheryl's husband- I don't have an account)

You're welcome George! Glad you liked it and thanks for watching. I do plan for more like this...

Coming from you, who is THE certified nicest bloke in hang gliding, I'll take that as a big compliment! Cheers mate :-)

That's the way to do it ;-)

It was my first trip abroad too! With Stuart Bond, right after I got my CP. It was quite scary!

He's just an attention seeker! ;-)

Lol

Ha!! Trust me, summer thermals are much more fun!

I hope that wasn't going at 6-up!

They say that more than two shakes is a wank! I flew here back in 1990's as a novice pilot...the place was fantastic, unfortunately I was more than two shakes😂

You're welcome Jeff - none of us ever stop learning.

Thank you Bigfoot! Are you related to the Sasquach? 1978... wow!! I was 7... ;-)

@@MooSurfer i worked for ww competator electrafljyer and american aerolights my first glider was a spirit 200 but i always lliked the streak anyways i love how your helping to keep this greatt sport alive.

That's a scary story Peter, the kind it's great to tell over a beer after a day of flying :-) I have a similar tale in a comp in France, where the task got cancelled because of approaching storms. As I landed at Annecy there was a big black cloud approaching and I actually caught the lightning on video as I was coming down. Moments after landing I was being helped by 3 others to hold my glider down in the barrage of rain and wind... Great times!! ;-)

@@MooSurfer Thanks for replying. Let us both, and other fliers remember with respect the terrible accident in a competition in the alps, I think Italy, a long time ago when some fliers were sucked into a thunder cloud and at least one died and his body found frozen, I think one or more used their emergency parachute. Do you remember that incident?

@@peternicholson4417 the incident happened before I learned to fly, but I have heard about it yes. I think 7 pilots were sucked into the cloud though I'm no sure how many died. I also heard from someone who was there, apparently it was such a freak thunder cloud that pilots who were almost on the floor were sucked up.

You're right Garry, there is a slight lag with the vario. You do come to anticipate this with experience and often know when it's about to beep. Good luck with your aerotow and foot launching... You'll never look back!!!

The lag depends on the vario and the settings. It's important to pay attention more to your feel of the air than to the vario. The vario is important as an averager and verification of what you feel. When I really need to focus on climbing or not loosing altitude I'll count and call out the the altimeter as I climb so I'm always very aware of any amount of altitude I've given up or gained back in a circle. A lot of thermalling well is about feeling the "kind" of air you are in at any given moment, using the little features of the lift to beneficial effect. Some surges you might push out a bit in, others not, some things you feel might cause you to abruptly tighten in, while others will cause you to flatten. One of the hardest parts of thermaling is identifying lift that cannot be effectively climbed in, but rather is useful to extend your glide, it tends to be ratty, bumpy, and often found over cities. At first though, particularly on a single surface glider, if you are aerotowing in the flat lands, don't chase faster gliders around, cling onto the first lift you find and never leave until you absolutely have to, you'll maximize your airtime and your experience that way. A falcon is slow enough that with some wind you might find that once you leave a thermal upwind you might ride the sink associated with that same column all the way back to the ground.

Sound advice! Thank you Entelin.

Good luck with that Max - thermalling is an art form in itself and you never stop learning. I'm glad I could help :-)

Thank you David! When I first saw your comment I thought, well that doesn't happen much in the uk as we have weaker thermals. Then yesterday and the day before it happened to me loads and I thought about your comment. Especially in the mega conditions we had where I had a 15up climb and REALLY knew about it when I went over the falls! I'll add this to my list, thank you.

@@MooSurfer My flying has most often been in California. Perhaps with you association with Wills Wing, you've flown in Southern California or the Owen's Valley? Your videos are a great resource for new pilots and for everyone else to brush up using your knowledge and photographic skills. Keep up the great work. 👍 It was such a shame that your audio experiment on the tandem flight with your lady friend didn't work out. I was showing that to my girlfriend to get her interested in hang gliding. The conversation was similar to our rock climbing back and forth. Hopefully you will make a similar video with good sound.

@@Davidadventures thanks David - I'm afraid I've never been to California, though I do want to come. I particularly want to do a big flight in Owens Valley. My only flying in America so far has been a Wallaby Ranch, years ago. As for the tandem - perhaps I'll do more of that this year, though my main focus is cross country flying and competition.

Thank you Job, I'm glad you like the videos :-) I know what you mean about the vario sound, although I particularly like mine. It's like music when it starts beeping fast at me - I think it's like Pavlov dogs - I associate it with going up and having fun! Though the downward beeping makes me depressed... ;-)

Ha! Thanks for watching Caroline! I hope you both like it :-). It's the BEST fun in the world!!!

Ron, sorry I missed your message. I'd like to hear how you got on? Are you managing to thermal successfully now?

Thermals like that are AMAZING aren't they! when your vario just sings to you...

@@MooSurfer yes indeed.

Yeah he stole the show!

Great video! I wasn’t sure, until he started shaking. He was the shows finale ===D - - - -

There's already a visual indication but you can't look at it all the time, the audio is making it easier to find and use the thermals. The bar needs its strength, not a good idea to cut into it or storing the vario with the glider.

Tormod is 100% right Joshua - there IS a visual representation, but you're generally spending your time looking where you are going, especially in a competition when you are thermalling in close proximity to lots of other pilots. To be fair, the noise becomes like music to a hangglider pilot and we love it! Because it means we are going up.... :-)

Hi Colin - sorry I missed your message. Turning into the lifting wing - good point. I will do another thermalling video at some point and will mention that, thank you. 5000' gain sounds great - especially on a trike! The amount of lift you turn in also depends on the conditions of the day - sometimes in the UK we don't get as much as 300fpm at all! But if you're in racing conditions, 300fpm may very much slow you down if the average for the day is 500fpm. All good ideas here for another video - thanks Colin!

It's hang-glider music isn't it!

Have you seen my results?! Clearly I DON'T manage to focus on competing well enough ;-)

Hi Ray, sorry I missed your message. To answer your questions - 1. 'Air pockets' are a bit of a myth that powered pilots talk about. There is actually no such thing as an air pocket. They are used to describe the movement of the air and to a powered pilot flying along in a straight line, it feels like a 'hole in the air' - hence the term air pocket. In actual fact it is this movement of the air that hangglider pilots use in order to stay up and to gain altitude. So when you see me talking about thermalling in my videos - an aircraft pilot flying through these thermals may well describe them as an 'air pocket'. 2. Emergency landing - yes I carry a parachute. You can see the red handle on my harness in some of the videos. In an emergency I would throw this parachute and it would bring both me and the hangglider down to the earth. I have been flying for 20 years now and haven't used it yet. Touch wood!

The weight of the pilot is only relevant in relation to the size of the glider. A heavier pilot on a smaller wing will find it easier to make fast control movements and stay centred in the thermal. Though a lighter pilot on a larger wing may go up a little faster when they actually are centred. It's to do with wing loading.

I'll try to keep more good ones coming...

Glad you enjoyed it!

Hi James - thank you I'm glad you liked it! Hanggliding has a certain pull doesn't it - you just can't stop! I have a few hang-gliding friends in their 70s. Two fly competitively still - Johnny Carr and Trevor Birkbeck. You might be able to look them up on Facebook. I also knew a chap who was as old as the hills (must have been nearly 80). He only flew in smooth conditions, had 2 teeth and could barely see - When he took off everyone else landed! And when I learned to fly there was a guy on the course who was 60. I met him maybe 10 years later, we bumped into each other at Wallaby Ranch where it seems he was practically living! I have never flown the Sport 2 so can't really comment, however I can comment on going from a lower performance wing to the T2C. It is trickier to fly the T2C in a few ways - it requires less control input, but that input needs to be more precise. For example you need to co-ordinate pitch and roll for effective turns. Also the T2C needs a bit of speed to be able to instigate a turn, whereas many lower performance wings you can just mush them round fairly easily at low speed. The T2C tows very well indeed. I haven't experienced loads of yaw, but it's pretty straight and behind modern (slow) tugs it's really good. I'm not sure what you mean by a vertical stab? Is that an addition to the hang-glider or description of a control input? I would advise to make your first flights in benign conditions on your Sport 2. Spend time building back up those actual muscles and practical confidence. Gradually go into stronger conditions and only when you feel fully flying fit and current to consider changing to a higher performance glider. But from experience with my friends - I see no reason why you can't fly hang-gliders at 76 so long as you have a reasonable level of fitness and general good health. Good luck and keep me posted!

@@MooSurfer Hi Darren, well, my second post to you in the last month, I promise not to make it a habit...but this is a bit of a senior moment share I guess that won't keep... I just watched this super video on thermaling and thought, "Wow, this is some really helpful advice and tips, plus it's just fun to watch that youngster Darren back when he was a wee toddler 5 years ago ;-), tooling around high above the exceptional sharp ridge he launched from." Then I went to post, starting with, "9000 feet, woo hoo, fantastic..." and then I happened to glance down to an earlier comment someone made. That someone was me. Two years ago. And I started it off with the same comment! Doh! So there we have it. Weight shift senior moment. When I wrote that post 2 years ago, I had long since sold my Sport 2, alas. Two low-bank turns around the sun for old planet Earth since, I'm still hanging in with the hanging high mentality . I bought a La Mouette Alpha 16 super cheap in June (2023), a model I'd last flown in 1980 in competition (and loved it) and thought it would be a good way to ease back into it (since I"m now 78 and still counting). Alas, lots of problems getting a new set of downtubes made for it, replacing a LE tube that FedEx put a nasty dent in during shipment (the glider had one day total of flight time oin a training hill. It was a brand new Atlas from probably the 90s!) And then a cold/flu thing that shut down my plans for a final fall fling in Tennessee. So here it is now with yours truly watching videos including this corker on thermaliing you did a ways back, vicariously getting what I can't get here in person because, well, I'm 78 and in Massachusetts now it's lucky to get up to 40 degrees F during the day. Brrr. So your videos like this one keep me dreams alive until Spring, when I will take my new/old Atlas down to Lookout Mt. in Tennessee for a couple weeks refresher training, and see where I'm at. I can still run fast enough to launch in no wind. But can't seem to get myself to go to the gym this last two weeks . I blames it on Thanksgiving. But we both know the deeper truth - lazier as I get older. So next Spring, I'll give you an update from TN, or from the Great Beyond by way of a psychic medium. Firmly convinced of course it'll be the former. Thanks again Darren, this video (like all your others) is worth watching over and over. A wealth of knowledge and insight, so valuable. (PS: I do have a glider/motorglider rating and a fair amount of time in fixed wing aircraft so it's not out of the question, knee and hip joints nothwithstanding, that I could fly a T2C some day. It'll keep my dream of wings alive.)

@@skypix777wow! 78 and can still launch in nil wind - I know plenty of people in their 40's who can't do that! Or not well anyway. ;-) Glad you still like these videos - I want to do some more instructional ones like this. When my own senior moments and also opportunity give me the chance! I'll be interested to hear how you DO get on when you fly that Atlas. But you know - modern low performance wings are MUCH easier to fly than those old ones. And wings like the T2C are easier than you think too.

Easy peasy!!

I know! He stole the show right! I didn't notice that until later... his partner thought it was hilarious!

Darren Brown Extreme Sports, typical photo bomb style. 😂

Yes... it was a bit naughty of me to show it - Gerolf normally has a perfect landing. I guess it just caught him out that time. It did give us all a bit of a chuckle though ;-)

No, it's a T2C - not sure when / whether to change to a T3 - this glider is still going strong to be honest.

Darren Brown Extreme Sports, I totally understand; it looks so durable. The T3 seems to be a rebadged name for the T2C because both look very similar on video. I checked out the price for T3 on Wills Wing. It's expensive - just over $8K.

Hi Chainanalyst - yes we do cover some distance in the cross country flights. My personal best is 202km from a site in Shropshire. The British record is 338km from Wales to Norfolk. In the competitions, the distances can range from anything around 30 / 40 miles up to 100 miles. It is dependant on the conditions of the day (bearing in mind we have no power but purely use the power of the sun) and is set by the meet director who aims to make it possible for at least some of the pilots to make the goal.

@@MooSurfer fantastic. Thanks and wish you safe flying.

@@MooSurfer so do you need to keep stopping to thermal on a long trip?

Yes that's right - I stop in a thermal to gain height, then glide further once I am high. During a glide I am losing height. Stopping in a thermal is a bit like refuelling your car!

The profile of a long flight resembles a sawtooth. Climb a thermal, glide out, climb again, etc.

Ha!! No it's just to stay cool!

I guess the missing word was 'wait'! ;-)

Ahhhhh why didn't I think of that!! Would have made for a very short video though ;-)

Sorry for the delayed reply... a friend of mine did make something like that once - a fairing that went over his shoulders. Not quite as big as your idea, but similar. He looked like Buzz Lightyear!! it made no noticeable difference though.

Hiya Super! No, I've never felt like I'm going to pass out during thermaling (that sounds rather scary!). I have felt sick one or two times in the past, but I put that down to dehydration at the end of long flights where I haven't drunk enough. A tip for dizziness is to keep looking in one direction and to focus on a static point.

@@MooSurfer Thank you, I think it is because dehydration, I forget to drink while flying. Good flights! Your video helps a lot in XC

It's FL 195 in Europe

He WAS one of my friends, until he hijacked my video with his antics! ;-)

Sorry, I thought I was speaking with beginners but I'll try to make it a bit easier in the future. This video gave an explanation of how to use thermals when you are flying but it seems you want to know more about the planning and when is a good time to fly and find thermals. Is that right? Did the video explain well enough how to actually use a thermal whilst in the air or was there any of it that wasn't clear?

@@MooSurfer So highly thankful to you for your nice reply.. the video is so useful, it needs several times to hear to get more info despite the sounds of the winds around you there besides your English accent, and still needs more in scientific information to understand on how every physical factor would participate with other factors in the Hangglider lift process

haha

That depends - where are you based?

@@MooSurfer I am in United Arabic Emirates Abudhabi city at the moment but accelly i am from Moldova

@@MooSurfer please (

@@MooSurfer Republic of Moldova

Ahh I don't know Moldova. The best thing is to get hanggliding lessons then your instructor will recommend the right hang-glider for you

The place is called Laragne Monteglin, in the south of France. Near to Sisteron.

@@MooSurfer thank u mate !! im going to start this (Magnific!!) sport : my next motirbike will be a hglider

@@MooSurfer (ok, the second one, first the fly training oc 😅) but truly i know All from years.. 😆

It depends very much where you are in the world?

That's exactly right - although we can't flap!

Downwards

Thankfully no I haven't! Though I have practiced getting it out and throwing it in parachute re-packing sessions.

Marco è tedesco ma vive in Austria

@@MooSurfer 🤦k , thank u

NINE Thousand feet! I loved it!

@@MooSurfer Now, you're absolutely confident about that figure? I'd hate to leave any doubt or ambiguity here. =]

@@foodini well now you come to mention it, I'm not certain I was ABSOLUTELY clear in the video. Perhaps I should have lowered down a tape measure to be certain.... ;-)

I'm not sure what you mean?

Excelent VIDEO. NICE EXPLAINED. I MEAN THE ( BIRDS ) . THE Birds can fly and we human it is possivel to fly with ...hanggliders...paraglider ..etcthat is what I mean!

The birds get more practice than us...