An Unexpected 50% Sound Improvement in Vinyl Record Playback 

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Great video and obviously a great product. Being a pensioner and a woodworker I built a wooden box about 4 inches deep and large enough to mount the turntable on. Filled it with dry sand and topped off with a 6mm plate glass sheet levelled carefully. Then two brackets attached to a sturdy wall completed the project and as you say, s--o--u--n--d s--t--a--g--e is so much wider!

Excellent ....isolating the table is vital, and the only thing I would add to that suggestion is to mount that shelf on an exterior wall, hopefully anchored in the studs that are resting on the foundation. Now you can invite the dancers into the room.

I thought you were going to say a stylus brush. Cleaning stylus from back to front gives me a 50% improvement. I set my turntable on the ikea cutting board, then the cutting board sits on top of 4 natural sponges. Works great for vibration feedback. Got idea from the gabster channel.

Thanks for the great video and recommendations! I didn’t have the patience to look online for a shelf or something similar. I found four furniture sliders for carpets and placed them on top of four rotoscrub pads that attach to your drill. Items sitting there in a drawer in my office. I am blown away. All the instruments are more defined. Soundstage is fantastic!

Great video. I’ve had an isolation shelf for my turntable for over 10 years now and I agree with you the isolation shelf was THE best piece of hi-fi equipment I have ever bought. I can jump up and down on my spring floor in front of the deck if I want to while a record is playing and nothing affects it at all, the shelf is as solid as a rock and I agree it really is one of the best improvements you can make to a system.

Good advice. I changed the footing on my turntable to Orea isoAcoustic isolations and the turntable mat to use Les Davies high performance slip mat. I also placed the system on the tiled hearth and off the sprung wooden floor. The response was evidently improved.

Steve McCormack had solutions for vibration in 1992. He sold them out of his Mod Squad outlet in Leucadia, California. His mods, including Tiptoes and Sorbathane mats, were the best bang for the audiophile buck.

Not surprised at the improvement from use of a wall shelf which is the ideal solution if space and decor allow. However you would have experienced a big improvement if you had just got rid of that massive heavy cabinet underneath the TT. It may seem counterintuitive, but large heavy cabinets are the absolute pits where vibration is concerned - light, spiked and rigid is the way to go if a wall shelf is not suitable. I haven't tried this myself but I have heard that worthwhile improvements are also possible by isolating the amplifier as well - lots of HiFi furniture suppliers make simple spiked boards available for this purpose. Another interesting and sensible video unspoiled by silly tweaks and HiFi jargon so thanks for that.

Totally agree! That is why apart from looking after room acoustics and a separate electrical ring mains for my listening room I have invested in proper isolating racks. I also suspended my main speakers and subwoofer on Max Townshend's Siesmic Isolation Podiums that decouple the speakers from the room. It totally works!

Hell yeah! That's why I love youtube. Awesome people you can meet. My solution to improve isolation and vibration issues is to mount a turntable with a four ropes from the room corners, tighten up a little and make sure all the electric devices in the house are completely off, including wifi network and your phone. Put some foil on the windows from the outside, it's gonna help.

I made a TT mat out of bubble wrap, you should try it.....

Been using a TT Target shelf since the 80’s, if your system isn’t on a concrete floor ie. basement of a house the only way to go is a wall mount. Another tip is to remove your dust cover completely when doing some serious listening. It’s picking up all sorts of vibrations. Playing around with turntables has always been the best part of audio for myself. Experimenting with arms, platter mats, cartridges, stuff that doesn’t cost big money but at times makes a huge difference. CD players and DAC’s just doesn’t give you the same experience. Great video, I’m sure it with help a few guys. 😎

I've been thinking of tackling this issue as I still have to tiptoe around my living room when playing a record. I hadn't imagined isolating my player would much a 50% increase in sound quality. I'm sold. I'm currently using rubber feet under my standard turntable feet. They've helped a little but not solved the issue. Great video. You tackle many topics that are rolling around in my head. Thanks!

Excellent video, I have a solid floor but my turntable sits on a wooden cabinet similar to yours, but I don't suffer from floor resonance as you do, but did have resonance from the cabinet itself if touched or knocked, so my solution was quite ingenious even if I say so myself, I bought a 2cm (3/4") thick granite kitchen chopping board from Ebay for £21 which is about $25 dollars, it came with six thick rubber feet, so now when I tap the cabinet no noise is picked up by the stylus 😊what with the rubber feet then the thick granite working together to kill any resonance getting to the turntable ! 👍

Two things that cut vibration Mass and Rubber. I have a rega P6 which is mounted on sorbathane 3" half spheres which makes leveling the turntable easy. Then mounted on a 15"x15" patio cement block painted black which is then mounted on an outdoor recycled stair tread cut to the size of the patio block mounted on my cabinet. And it didn't cost a lot .A good diy project. And you save a lot of money.

By far the greatest source of vibration in a record player is due to the stylus-groove interface. You can engineer away other sources of vibration such as motor noise, bearing noise and environmental noise but you still have to have the stylus in the groove. The energy from the stylus will cause both the tonearm and platter to vibrate in sympathy. The best products I have found to reduce the transmission of vibration into the arm and deck are those from the Funk Firm, the Houdini and Acromat. Cheaper, but less effective, solutions are available from Origin Live. As you have suspended flooring I would definitely suggest decoupling your speakers from the floor. ISO kinetics Gaia or Townshend podiums will make a huge difference. At the moment you are pumping bass into your floor which will be resonating and booming like a drum. And spikes couple, they do not decouple. Get rid of the spikes on your turntable shelf and replace with something that decouple.

As a vinyl DJ, the feedback effect of loud bass through the turntable decks is well known and a pain in clubs. Hence there are many things available to try and isolate the decks. I use isolation boots from MK Stands in clubs which dramatically improves the sound and allows the volume to be increased without feedback.

It depends also on type of construction of building. Here in Europe, the vast majority of houses are made of bricks and concrete, or even bricks made out of concrete. There is minimal vibration in the room walking through it if you don`t have cheap hollow laminate on the floor, but a wooden parkett.

👏👏👏 Finally a reviewer who acknowledged the only complete solution to turntable vibration problems. 35 years ago, when I bought my Linn LP12, I experienced all the problems you described as having, especially footfalls. The LP12 suspension, as well as the one on your Thorens, are notorious for their sensitivity to infrasonic frequencies, namely footfalls, as those suspensions are tuned to reject audio frequencies. That’s also why you can lower your dust cover while playing an album as the suspension isolates the tonearm and platter from the plinth, to which the dust cover is attached. A commenter below really nailed it by pointing out the ideal solution for mounting the wall shelf on the studs of an exterior wall, which sit on the foundation which extends several feet (or more with a basement) into the ground. And, in many cases, those studs are lashed to an exterior brick wall, further damping matters. My only suggestion, and it’s more a preference, is to mount the turntable at mid-torso height. That way, by not having to bend over to access your ‘table you are more stable when handling your vinyl and, especially, when handling your tonearm. I still like to hand cue. 😮 Thanks for the video!

Funny how the ‘ol algorithm works because until 15 mins ago I was unaware of your channel. Terrific video. My entire system, fronted by my turntable, has been mothballed for 18 months+ after the living room in which it was resident for 25 years was renovated. Next project under way is to renovate and re-purpose one son’s old bedroom into a somewhat dedicated music and listening room but still functional spare room. The funny thing is I am already trying to figure out where to put my turrntable shelf for when the system is reignited. Amazingly, I have had that 'table sitting on a "Target TT1" wall-mounted shelf (of near identical design to that Pangea) for over 35 years. Your video also made me realize that the TT1 shelf is the oldest component in my system. I likely haven’t appreciated how much of a contribution it has been making for the simple reason it’s just been there for so long. Great work and thanks…earned subscriber here.

I put up a shelf for my LP12 when I had it and it was night & day, the best upgrade to my turntable I ever did. As you said I too couldn't believe the differences.

You had me at Bark at the Moon, since 1986 still my favorite record along with Iron Maiden S/T. I owned a Rega P3 and I have the same issue as you. I do tip toe every time I go near it. I don’t have that issue with the Fluance RT-85. I’ve seen that Pangea on the web, but it’s fucking pricey and I’m not quite there yet. Kool vid bud! Cheers JC/Miami

Love the presentation and all the comments. I have a brick house built in 1915 with original wood floors, no basement. Horrible vibration to my Thorens TD 160 despite a heavy desk laden with bricks. After unsuccessfully trying a granite slab, a thick wood butcher block, various acoustical padding, ISOAccoustics dampening feet and spring dampening feet, finally achieved substantial improvement by reinforcing the floors from underneath and placing the turntable in a literal sandbox. But the Pangea shelf appears intriguing, especially after learning the dampening effect of brick. So much wealth of knowledge posted here, many things to try. You really hit a nerve with this video. Thanks.

I have heard Technics SL-1200 hooked up to a rack of amps totaling 7000W RMS in a nightclub built out of a prefab concrete basement lined with carpet so the vibration they were withstanding was phenomenal. The dance floor had 8 sets of JBL top/mid range ceiling mounted and 4 sets of floor mounted bass speakers as well as the old 8 dance floor ceiling mounted speakers relocated throughout the club. When the volume was raised to about 80% the coins were jumping in the cash drawers of the McDonalds on the ground floor upstairs. I wonder how the SL-1200 compares these days?

Folded towels underneath. Works for microphone stands/feedback too.

Hi from Australia. Being a DJ, Audio/Visual engineeer feedback is always a problem but you're the only person I've heard that did the obvious...isolate it from the floor by installing a shelf and brackets into the brick wall and buying a decent unit and you can jump around the whole room without any feedback. Cheers.

Many years ago I had a Denon turntable that was prone to feedback. I built a pier out of concrete blocks and located the turntable on that. I was worse! The high mass of the concrete actually stores rather than dissipates the energy. Linn always advocated a low mass table because it would dissipate the energy quickly. I built a frame out of 1 x 4 lumber topped it with 3/8 plywood and used some of those steel hairpin shaped legs from the hardware store. Worked great. The wall mount shelf of course is the way to go if possible and I am not surprised that you noticed a dramatic improvement on several fronts.

I am right on the foundation with a tile floor of the house, I have a medical steel cabinet full of books /magazines,and installed a 3/4 In birch top. On top of that there's these mats in the dollar store,and that was about it. The speakers were on wood tables. I spun records like that with no issues for many years..

I’ve placed felt under the feet of my turntables but the thing that limits my floor vibrations most are Furniture Sliders. I placed 4 sliders one under each foot of my turntable cabinet. I did it to move the cabinet across my wood floor but then thought I’ll keep them on and see if it helps decrease the floor vibrations. And it definitely did! I can practically fall on the floor and my records won’t skip. I used the fuzzy sliders they look like shag carpeting on the side that touches the floor. You can get them at any big box store and they’re cheap, and surprisingly look pretty good as well.

I bought the present house since it had a walk-out basement. I have a room in one of the corners where the 3 walls ( side walls and the wall in front of me are concrete) , and the floor is concrete , and I have placed rugs on the floor.. The ceiling and the wall behind me are not . I have Tube amps , Turn tables . A pair of speakers and a pair of subwoofers . A lot of power but no vibrations . My previous house had hardwood floors , had vibration issues.

Depends on what the wall that one is mounting the shelf to is on.

My second floor apartment's floor is concrete carpeted cheaply . I had muddy bass , which I wasn't very aware of . I installed Herbie's Audio Lab giant threaded studs into my floor standing speakers hoping to reduce how much Bass energy was disturbing my downstairs neighbor lady . About 2 weeks later I realized what was missing in my sound was the muddiness in the Bass .

The wall is acting as an extension of the bass speakers show coupling them together often works wonderfully

Yes I agree wall shelves do make a massive improvement, my 3 main turntables are all wall mounted.

Had my old thorens on my stand with all my gear on it.The amp weighed 65 lbs alone, I had no issues. My newer pro-ject acrylic has no damping anywhere.I was getting vibration from my sub through the stand into the stylus. I built an isolation stand with rubber feet and springs, no more vibrations into my stylus. My power chords improved my soundstage quite a bit, they are not for sale and if you don't believe they improved my soundstage, good for you.Been in this hobby for 45 years.

-I find it amazing that this design has only just come back to life because I have had the Target Wall mounted shelf for 30yrs & find that you will not get a better sound from this type of item because you will not get a better return from your system anywhere else & if this is the new design which is going to be the best way to go about sound vibration then I have been working with my Target for a lifetime & hope that this is going to be the way forward.

I remember visiting my dad's friend with my dad in the 80's. The guy was an engineer and did not stop improving his stereo until he had it perfect. I don't remember the whole system, but he had a pillar coming up through the floor from the ground below that did not touch the floor just for his turntable. I was really impressed. Myself, I've had good luck with a product called a Auralex turntable isolation platform under my Rega P6

I enthusiastically recommend the Isoacoustics Gaia speaker feet and Orea series of pucks under components. After decades in the hobby, these are the most cost-effective isolation devices I've tried.

I have a floating laminate floor over concrete slab. I have zero vibration through the floor. I suspect that would be a different story if I used this shelf. I have gotten some feedback that cleared up when I moved my floor standing speakers farther away from my equipment rack. If your record would skip just from walking past the rack, your floor is bouncing and probably not much due to the floating floor. If you have a basement and access to the underside of the floor, maybe you can stiffen the framing to reduce floor bounce from underneath.

Hi Rick, well done on finding such a good solution. In the UK our house construction is a little different to yours. I lived on Long Island for a number of years and my homes were predominantly wooden with suspended wooden floors. Despite being of oak construction, they moved. In the UK most houses are built on a substantial concrete plinth, often 4 feet deep with insulation. My first location for my new hifi was in a garden room with a suspended wooden floor and I had the same problems with movement. I looked at the turntable shelf which would have been anchored in a brick wall but in the end I relocated the hifi to a room in the main building with oak plank floor which is glued to a concrete substructure. I doubt that I have removed every vibration but the major source has gone. As for sound stage, I can’t judge as the speakers in my garden room were not ideally placed in front of me, now, following the move, they are. That shelf is a great solution and looks really neat in your setup. Happy listening, you only have 1,000+ albums to re listen to with their improved sound. 😅Best, Pat

I've got a solution for yah! Grab some of those foam mats that Harbor Freight has in a 4 pack, cut it to size to place under your speakers and/or speaker stands and this should completely dampen the base from reaching the turntable quite a bit if not blocking the base all together. Also, try your very best not to allow your speakers to be any where's near the turntable at a minimum of 2 feet or better and that they are completely faced away from your from the turntable and then of course off of an existing wall by at least a foot. Back in 1986 I used to put carpet squares that had rubber backing and that did help along with a changeover of the rubber feet on the turntable itself and with the use of a lower volume setting and the dropping of the bass down some, this helped me out.

Speaking of anti-gravity ... Back in my vinyl days, I used to get actual speaker-needle feedback. The system would suddenly come out with this dull roaring sound.. vibrations. The answer we worked out was a heavy turntable base, standing on 4 springs and, in turn on soft rubber feet, so the whole thing floated about a quarter inch above the stand. We could even stand in the middle of the room and jump up and down with a record on and nothing... no skips no boom from the speakers, nothing. There was also a ready to use turntable with a similar suspension that performed just as well as our DIY solution ... but for the life of me I can't remember who made it.

I actually keep my deck in the cupboard, it isolates it from speaker feedback as well. Yes even though i have a suspended wooden floor the grandkids can run around without me having a meltdown.

Hi great video, really well done, however, spikes only serve to maximise cupping to your stand/cupboard and depending on the stand/cupboard it will serve to absorb tiny vibrations from the record player. This is good but because of the mechanical coupling of the spikes it will to transmit external vibrations from the outside and into the record player. Simple physics. What you're hearing is the effective absorbtion of the stand/cupboard hence a wall bracket in your example sounds different and preferable. A decoupling solution is to isolate (not to make contact) with the stand/cupboard by using isolation tecniques such as soft rubber or complex air/magnetism specially designed for the purpose. As an example, on construction sites you can see how they install large A/C units or motors, they always use some type of syzmic isolation and deffinatley no directly coupled to the building.

I ended up building a shelf that hung from the ceiling isolating it from the walls and the floor eliminating all vibrations, definitely improve the sound twofold.👍❤️🇨🇦

The wall absorb the bass and it can also create a vibration. Even your dust cover can also absorb soundwave that can vibrate directly on your tt.

Wall vibrations are real! Better isolation between the wall brackets is a must.

I invented an isolation system for my recording system. It's not meant to playback through speakers just monitor headphones so it's the cleanest analogue to digital transfer unit - Speakers blasting will ALWAYS be a problem if the turntable is in the same room - not much you can do about that - you can place it in the least resonating position but it will still pick up all sorts of frequencies ..again if it's in the same room. Optimal if you have a listening room.. to have your turntable in another room.

I've done four mods to my Dual 506 and they all made a striking difference to the sound. First was the swapping out the stock Ortofon cartridge and going with a Shure with hyperelliptical stylus. Next was the elimination of the dust cover. Thirdly, I swapped out the crappy manufacturer supplied generic rca interconnects and went with double shielded modern interconnects. Finally, I installed set of Vibrapod isolators to control vibration. These changes completely transformed the sound of my turntable for minimal cost.

@TheJoyofVinylRecords Congrats on eliminating those most detrimental of vibrations and improving your sound. However, the wall shelf only helped to mitigate and dampen the majority of the vertical displacement of the floor's transferred energy, not any lateral displacement in the wall itself, which is important to minimize for accurate tracking and isolation from vibration as well. Unless your walls are solid concrete or of heavy masonry construction (heavy mass), with typical drywall or lathe & plaster on spaced vertical stud walls, the drywall or plaster (or any wall sheathing) will act as a large membrane, similar to a large resonant bass drum head, or a speaker cone, and the wall will be laterally displaced by sound energy and vibration. For example, when the beater of my kick drum pedal strikes the head of my bass drum when playing my drum kit, all of the other much smaller tom drums and snare drum also resonate even though they are tuned to different frequencies and are oriented on a different plane that's almost 90° to the bass drum. You could actually think of the wall as being a large, low frequency microphone, except that the wall does not convert the pressure differentials into an electronic signal for amplification, and only results in an acoustic signal and vibration. A wall section is simply a free-floating floor in a vertical orientation. A simple example of the wall being a large resonating membrane is the experience of your windows or window blinds rattling, or rattling hanging framed wall art when playing music or movies with high SPL output from a subwoofer, or from a nearby sonic boom, artillery explosion, etc. And regarding the rigid spikes used with the Pangaea wall-mounted shelf, they Directly Couple the two surfaces, they Do Not effectively decouple them. I can understand each spike's function as an individual height & leveling adjustment for the TT platform, but in regards to Vibration Isolation and Decoupling, they certainly Do Not accomplish that goal effectively. Using simple tennis balls in place of the rigid spikes would be much more effective at isolation and decoupling the two structures or platforms! The best approach for isolation, decoupling, and damping of acoustical/vibrational energy is a multi-layer "pad" that uses generally soft materials that combine several different densities of materials with a barrier type product sandwiched between them. As an example of such a product, look at the multi-layered acoustic damping sheet product made primarily for car audio use which is called ''Black Hole 5" from Orca Design or ResoNix. ''Black Hole 5'' combines a layer of soft open cell acoustic foam on one side that is laminated to a 1/8" thick sheet of 1 Lb./Sq.Ft. mass loaded vinyl, which is again laminated to a heavier & denser closed cell sponge-type foam (i.e. neoprene) on the opposite side. On top of the Black Hole 5 sheet product, you will most likely need a more rigid and stable overlayment that is still very dense and has further damping properties to be used as a platform for the turntable's feet to rest on. I use a 1" thick solid rubber mat/sheet which is available at industrial suppliers such as Grainger and McMaster-Carr. There are also large, ~1" thick rubber mats made from recycled rubber granules for use in horse stalls and corrals. These large rubber mats can be found at most Tractor Supply Co stores or livestock feed & care suppliers and can be cut to size with a common circular or jig saw. If you need something that's much more rigid and dense for your TT platform, you can purchase 1.25'' thick sheet of UHMW-PE in black or white, and have it cut to size, but it will be quite expensive even for this relatively small size. A "cut-off" or remnant from a custom marble or granite countertop may be an option as well. Of course, most of these solutions are not "High-End/High-Tech" looking or aesthetically pleasing unless you use some ingenuity... I covered my entire DIY turntable base isolator/decoupling platform with a stretchy high-grade black speaker grill cloth fabric (check at Parts-Express, Madisound, or Solen Online). The seams in the stretchy fabric grill cloth are simply "glued" to the surface of the platform on the underside where they are hidden from view using 3M # 90 or # 77 Spray Adhesive (rubber contact cement). Prior to covering the platform with the speaker grill cloth, I lightly painted the entire platform assembly with a deep, flat black aerosol spray paint so that none of the different material types or surfaces would show through the grill cloth. This is a simple but, extremely effective solution that should cost less than $100. Others have already mentioned purpose-made Sorbothane-based isolation products which are excellent absorbers/dampers as well.

That was a K.A. video !! Hell yeah thanks man !

Great video, thanks! Besides turntable isolation try the same on the speakers too. I put Isoacoustics Gaia under mine and obtained the benefits you already saw on the stylus plus a tighter and more controlled bass response from the speakers.

My Thorens TD 150 TT - with Rega RB 300 arm and Goldring 1042 cartridge - is on a granite shelf, which is fixed to the Gable End wall of my home. Under the TT are four rubber Castor Cups, designed for use under furniture castors, to prevent damage to carpets. These add further isolation to the TT. A NAD Neoprene TT Mat is on top of the Cast Alloy TT Platter, kills Platter Ringing. Tapping on the granite shelf with the Stylus in the groove, causes no interference. No thump, or other extraneous noises. World Design 3 Valve Phono Pre-Amp, with World Audio Design KLPP1 Pre-Amp and WAD K5881 Mk 2 Valve Power Amp, complete the system, connected to KEF iQ30 Stand Mounted Speakers. Previously, I had a pair of Quad ESL 57 Speakers, which were brilliant for Voice and acoustic music, but lacked depth for Organ Music and Rock music. The Rolling Stone 'Paint It Black' - or John Williams version of Bach's 'Toccata' from his 'Sky 3' album - just didn't cut it through the Quads. They also took up a lot of space in my living room, due to needing to be kept away from the walls, to allow them to 'breath'; being Dipole Radiators. I tried various layouts for the system, but none of them really worked, due to location of Door; Full-width Window; Storage heater and serving hatch. The location of Mains Power Sockets, all of which were on the Gable End wall, made it impossible to plug in the Quads and the system, without yards of extension cables. I loved the Quads through the Valve system, but needs as needs must and they had to go. Some days, Life Sucks.

Hey there very well done now try this if you can on the back of the speakers disconnect the base drivers and if you do you'll notice an improvement in The sound stage. You won't have Bass but if you can imagine the speaker cabinets attached to the wall Same the shelf is attached to you will notice The sound stage bass and middle tones will be that much clearer. Sometimes this arrangement puts the room into a positive phase state but you have to try it to see if that is the case.

Great vlog Rick ! and LOL, timely and uncanny considering my experience in just the last week: I am a set it and forget it player, I don't adjust the tone and equalizer settings for each type of music genre. My Fluance turntable has a built in preamp, connected to an equalizer then receiver. I personally like lots of bass and treble equally and also had the bass control turned up on the receiver, plus a powered subwoofer. Turntable on a bar height small diameter table, floor is carpeted, For Christmas I was given new album, CHER Christmas ( very fun Christmas pop LP with special collaborations with other artists like Stevie Wonder). This album has a lot of deep resonant hip hop thumping bass. During the Arctic Blast I was so grateful for no loss of power at any time however on a few occasions the breaker switch for my electric furnace flipped off and I would have to reset it. Pondering why this just started happening, when furnace all checked out, one morning when on first awakening this one word came to me VIBRATION... ? At this time also most record albums played on both sides beginning tracks with intermittent sound and or skips. I checked on all the turntable settings, new stylus cartridge, alignment, tracking, counter weight, etc. and all ok except for the tonearm lever rest arm, it had risen, most likely due to vibration. I also found that turntable had gotten off level. So after making adjustment for the tone arm I decided to zero out and recalibrate turntable and then i completely turned the bass and treble on the receiver off actually down in the negative range, leaving the equalizer settings as they were. WOW ! first thing I noticed was the widened soundstage and the pristine clarity of all music instruments and singing voice, all sounds tightened up and in its best sound space. So thrilled it is like I have a complete new sound system ! I have been playing several records a day, going through my entire collection with great joy, LOL. I also got the record clamp and that added improvement also. Now those beginning album tracks play just fine and my furnace switch has stayed on. So I will have to at least once a month check on all audio turntable settings and also get one of those turntable wall shelves. Well I have rambled on long enough, going to go play some records...The Beach Boys Good Vibrations !

A better way to improve sound quality is with Hi Res physical media like SACD, Blu Ray audio etc......and room treatments! Yeah, I grew up on vinyl so I know:)

My phono preamp has a rumble filter. Technics direct drive - amazing - no worries here. Or maybe my hearing isnt up to par w some folks lol

Everything you said is correct!!I won't bore anyone with the science but the will also be an inporvemt with a DC/EMI clipper on the Amp typically I isolate from the floor UP including each component ( P.S. the technique also work for digital) and those speakers

Love your honesty and easy going friendly manner. Delighted you found the isolation solution. I’m sure you’ve heard of Paul Rigby (The Audiophile Man) who is a huge advocate of the isolating principle. He’s also a fan of the Soundeck pucks. I too have those. I got 6 of the mini type specifically for my quarter wave Castle Howard speakers. Unfortunately no matter where I place them underneath the base I don’t get an improvement. I’ve tried two at the front and one at the back and vice versa in direct contact with the wooden part. The sound seems to harden up which I definitely don’t like. I haven’t tried them on my turntable as I already have it isolated properly. It sits on a Mana stand on a bouncy wooden floor with a four foot basement below. The needle NEVER skips no matter what I do. Yet my second turntable on a Target stand suffers from footfall issues! The amplifiers are the venerable Crofts and they’re sitting on the same Target stand. I did try the pucks with them but heard no difference whatsoever. Finally cleaning the stylus before play and after every side works wonders. I use my trusty VPI gel only at the start and a single run carbon fibre brush for every side. Brilliant!

One of a better way to mount to the wall (brick/concrete) to decouple the turntable from the table/floor. The challenges lies is as to how to isolate the absorption resonance from the wall instead.

My turntable sits on the cement foundation of our house on a tile floor atop a stack of 3 - 4 box shelving units that are separated from the floor and each other by jel spacers/pads. You can jump on or drop anything near it without issue, and I’ve tested it more then a few times on purpose and accident, lol! I have even “hit” the top shelve where the turntable sits during playback without interference so the only source that may be effecting sound is vibration from the unit itself and I’m not worried enough about that to do anything about it unless something becomes noticeable. Blessings

I agree about isolation and I also had a huge improvement by putting my turntable on a wall shelf. However, to imply that a wall does not vibrate is misleading. I think the floor vibrates more but both improvements are dependent on the effectiveness of the isolation itself. I have another turntable on a 3 shelf Pangea rack. But the turntable sits on top of another shelf isolated by Sound Addicted S Pods. And the results are every bit as good as the results from the wall shelf.

Wonderful lecture, and demonstration! The, "Pangea Audio Turntable Wall Mounted Premier SE Record Player Shelf MKII Black" also sold on the Canadian Amazon Web Site is certainly an efficient, and valuable hi fi audio product. This Pangea Audio Turntable Wall Player Shelf reminds me of a similar product made by Rega for a Planar Turntable. Certainly isolation for a turntable is important, and a functional necessity. However, there is also the, "Pangea Audio Vulcan X Add-On Component Shelf Rosenut Red", or the Black version, is a choice that I prefer; and is more affordable.🔉🎶

I had a similar problem with a vintage Thorens TD-160 sitting on a VERY heavy 6-foot-long wooden console cabinet that I even bolted to the wall in order to reduce vibrations from the floor. (My stand-mounted speakers did not touch the console.) I put the turntable itself on an extremely heavy 2-inch-think wood block with its own set of acoustic isolation feet for an extra layer of "decoupling." It worked OK, but when my 65-pound German Shepherd would get exited and run around the living room, there was no keeping the stylus in the groove. (She has a tendency to bump into things. Like walls and doorways.) I eventually upgraded to a newer semi-automatic turntable with a more sophisticated isolation system (a Music Hall Classic with a similar wood plinth) and that took care of it. I love the look and feel of my Thorens (for which I bought a new custom dust cover to replace the cloudy original), but I think it may be headed for ebay...

My house is “balloon-frame” construction on a concrete slab, so fixing the turntable to the wall would be a step backwards. Placing the turntable on sorbothane pucks (on an open metal equipment shelving unit) proved to be a good anti-vibration solution, even with giant subwoofers pumping and thrusting the air in the room. ;^)

Seems like the same speaker/floor vibrations would travel from the floor to the wall & up the wall to the wall shelf. But if you perceive an improvement, that's all that matters.

I have had acoustic feedback loop (low frequency) problems with every TT I have owned all the way back to 1973.... many GOOD turntables. The Bang and Olufsen Beogram 8000 was immune to that problem. I now have McIntosh MT-5 turntable. Still with that problem. Tried different things..4 inch foam etc. Gingko Audio has isolation platforms around $500.00. I could see they used racquetball balls. But branded with their name. Different color (springiness) depending on weight of turntable. I have green glass furniture coaster cups with green racquetballs under turntable. ($20.00 total). To level turntable I space them accordingly underneath to get level. Problem solved...also that bit of a muddy sound is gone at even lower sound levels. Now if you had talked about how speaker wire solved your problem..I would not be leaving any comment here. Good video !!

I had a Thrones too and I had the same experience when I mounted it to the wall. With subclass player that's the way to do it.

I also use a wall shelf for my Rega P10, I replaced the standard laminated mdf shelf for a granite shelf to make the platform as sonically dead as possible.

It’s a journey for sure… Congrats on taking your vinyl set up to the next level. I’m sure there are a few more levels to go, with vinyl you are never quite done! It’s kinda pricey, but the “Gravity One”, from Origin Live, took my vinyl playback to the next level. I was surprised how it improved the sound.

If someone likes to save money one can go to Menards or Lowes and buy two heavy duty wall brackets (usually in white) paint them flat black and mount them to your wall. Actually, I screwed the brackets to a nice wood cutting board and then centered the board against the wall with a stud in the wall and secured it to that with only two big screws. It's better than just mounting it to the dry wall. I put a wood shelf section from some Ikea style cabinet as the base to put on top of the brackets for my turntable to sit on. Between the brackets and the wood piece I have those little half rubber balls on each corner. But for $200 that Pangea shelf looks like a good deal.

Great video. Interesting how such improvements can be achieved. Cheers.

The best way to improve your sound is to never plat a Motley Crue album...

This has always been a delima for me as well. I have a wood subfloor with crawl space underneath. I also have a floating laminate floor. I have read that suspended sub platform turntables are best at isolation from vibrations and movement. However my Linn LP12 skipped badly. I did eventuall install a wall shelf which helped tremendously, but not completely. I eventually went to a Rega and then a Project xtension 9 with magnetic suspended feet. This seemed to be the best solution but I futhur improved isolation by building a "sandbox" I read about somewhere. I think this may be the best solution for all turntables and is cheap to build yourself. If it doesn't work toss it and no real loss. I have it on the wall shelf as well. I would like to try it on an equipment stand someday just to see if it would work as well without the wall mounting.

Now you need to isolate the speakers from the floor since they are sending vibrations to your equipment on the cabinet. Perhaps Iso Acoustics or Townshend podium platforms. Especially effective if you have a suspended wood floor.

Back in the day some of us created a platform for the TT that hung from the ceiling on chains at all four corners. Of course, if the ceiling is vibrating, it doesn't help. In my case, I just built a 30x60 shop building with a nice thick concrete floor, and devoted the last 16 of 60 feet to a mancave/rehearsal/listening room. Concrete floor. Problem solved. But I have to be honest. I spent too many years playing bass next to "too loud" drummers, so I sometimes wear hearing aids. The silver lining is that tape hiss is no longer an issue for me. 🤣

Yes I have a Auralex platform which is placed under the turntable. Which works great. Also I have seen others using a IKEA bamboo cutting board. I am not sure how effective it is.

I isolated mine with two IKEA chopping boards, eight 1/4” ball bearings, and a set of speaker spikes on Amazon. Works amazing

For $119 I made a similar wall shelf for my PL-7 that's in my living room hooked up to my surround sound system. For my other 3 turntables here in my music room that's not feasible. I used to have two of them hanging on a suspended platform. You'd have to see one of my older videos to see what I'm talking about. I finally got rid of it and set up a 3 individual platforms of MDF board with Adjustable Isolation Feet Pads Spring Speaker Protect Stands for each turntable. This is much better to manage and I only have a set of Klipsch's desktop speakers anyway so vibration isn't much of a problem. When I record I use headphones only and when I want to crank up my speakers it's still not a problem.

Sota turntables isolate like no others I’ve used/listened to. We have hardwood floors and in the past my Sota-Sapphire was on the audio cabinet below the flatscreen and between two 12” Rythmic servo subs. You can dance and stomp with no effect, it will keep tracking. In fact, you can pound your fist on the cabinet and it still does not skip. The extreme excursions do impact the sound instantaneously, but not audible with that level of ruckus. For straight listening it has always been great although it may improve with more isolation. I’ve driven myself crazy at times with this since my early career was in mechanical design and I spent considerable time in the vibration lab tuning the resonances out of circuit card assemblies. It is amazing what a miniature Bruel and Kjaer accelerometer can pick up. I guess that’s why the Danish make such great drivers and very quiet appliances. The wall mount is a cool and practical approach. One step further would be to suspend from the ceiling. It’s not so practical but easy to do. As an undergrad, we would do this often since it’s cheap and also tended to keep intoxicated buffoons away from the equipment at parties. Go vinyl.

Same same. Hardwood floors and a Thorens TD 160. I added a wall shelf (Pro-Ject) and all was right with the world.

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Turntable is only part of the picture. Put the turntable on a thick soft foam cushion. Then no vibration from floor or wall. Only from the air. Hang the speakers on fishing/ thin line from the ceiling so they are not connected to the floor. Put valve amplifier on soft foam heat proof cushion, so no vibration from floor or walls to vibrate the valves. However if loud enough sound waves might vibrate the sensitive valve filaments. Also wooden floors give echo and wreck good sound. You need lots of carpet on the floor and heavy material curtains. If you want room to sound good call in a recording studio sound experts to scan the room you listen to music in for echo points and install acoustic insulation ie on the ceiling. They have stuff that looks good these days.

I’ve been considering one of these shelves. This video gets me just a bit closer to pullin the trigger for one. Thanks.

A good source for anti-vibration tweaks is Herbie's Audio Lab. I have Herbie's products under every component of my system including speakers and rack. Isolation is important for clean accurate sound.

I had the same problem with my Oracle Delphi Mark VI. It's sits on a Bright Star sandbox on top of a Brightstar component rack. When I cranked the sound, the sound from my speakers muddied the sound from my turntable,it sounded out of focus. Now my Oracle has 3 silicone wells with paddles that when screwed put the paddles into the silicone. I started playing around with them and the focus came back in to focus. Well worth the upgrade. Another product that is The Mod Squad tip toe cartridge coupler that isolates the cartridge from the tonearm and that sucker flat out works but they don't make it anymore. I hand one mounted on a Denon turntable and arm. The coupler was placed between the tonearm and a Shure Ultra 500 cartridge and I was floored,flabbergasted. I have been looking for a Mod Squad coupler now for two years but with no avail😢. Anyway I thought I would share.

Great idea.. but won't it pick up potential vibrations from the wall ? Regardless, happy that you found something that works for you for so little cost !!!

And now you're ready for the one I discovered about 15 years ago: BBE Sonic Maximiser. I now have four of them and even one for my PA. The owner of Bass Northwest (sadly, now out of business) turned me on to them and he was dead right. When I bypass it, my system sounds oddly "duller". And it's not a treble boost. It's weirdly simply more "clear". It's as if I perfectly aligned the voice coils in all the drivers in my system. I have so many because they were so cheap on Craigslist. 😁

Circa 1980 ish, I built a 3/4 “ plywood shelf for my turntable . I mounted it to the wall with steel shelf brackets. I used long screws and screwed it into the wall studs behind the drywall. 16” centres, so my shelf was probably 18-20 “ wide. I covered the shelf in felt. You could jump up on down on the floor in front of the turntable and not affect it. So this video makes perfect sense to me. I’m curious to know if wall anchors were used or if it was screwed into the studs.

I use EAT dampers on the pre amp section and silicone rings on the power valves. Spikes on the chassis base and a vibration platform.

Now put your speaker stands on isolation pucks that block vibrations. The vibrating floor is resonating sound into the room and decreasing dynamic range.

I have a set of isolation feet, Thought they would be a waste of time to put on my turn table until I saw this video. I will be setting this up today:), Hope it makes a different.

My A/V shelf sits on carpet that is laid over a pad in my family room. My speakers sit on stands that are also on that carpet. Carpet came installed with my house. No vibrations being transferred that I can tell.

Have you experimented with mats? Another way to manage vibrations, this time dealing with the stylus/record interaction. The mat should act like a diode, allowing vibrations to pass away rather than reflecting them a moment later. Best mat I've used (and I've tried plenty) was made by the British company Collaro. It seems to add calm and order to the sound, it doesn't favour any given frequency, it just expands the space for everything to assert itself. Highly recommended, I've got one on my "big" turntable and on the more modest one. It improved them both.

I had exactly the same experience, plus my turntable is of the rigid construction type, no sprung suspension so it's probably even more important for a turntable like this. I went a slightly different route though, I had a chap here installing security bars to try and keep the burglars out, showed him a picture of one of these shelves and asked if he could do the metal work for one and he said he could. What turned up was better than I could have imagined, perfectly powder coated, every bit as good as those you can buy ready made, except I went for 3 adjustable spikes for the sub-frame instead of 4. I started off with a chip board insert to stand the turntable on, spray painted matt black and which sits on a small spike in each corner of the sub-frame, but later I changed that to a doped foam material sandwiched between thin bonded sheets of aluminium which is significantly lighter than the chip board but just as rigid, and after probably more than 35 years that's how it still is today, same turntable too. So yes I agree with you, highly recommended and definitely worth the effort for all the reasons you stated, plus if you know somebody who can do the metal work you can save a lot of money over what you'd have to pay your local hi-fi shop, if there is still such a thing in your area.

I used to use technique 1800 turntables to DJ which they weren’t heavy enough so I put them on the foam which would isolate them. Worked great

I'm lucky to have my system on the ground level where the floor is concrete non-floating. That minimizes tons of vibration already. In my situation, heavy trucks that drive by sometimes vibrate the walls, so the Pangea may actually work against me. Definitely depends on your situation. The magnet floating pucks you suggested may be the future after all!

I stumbled upon this phenomenon years ago when I found the sound field from a set of speakers powered by a slave amp and playing in another room was so much cleaner than the sound field produced by the setup I had in my main room containing the turntable, a more expensive master amplifier, and more expensive speakers. And this difference was most obvious when the remote speakers were playing and not the speakers in the room housing the turntable. It's clear to me that unless we are listening to a record through headphones, it is unrealistic to think a record is going to sound good or that the sound field will be impressive if the loud speakers are only a few feet from the turntable. Fancy dampening tricks aside, the bottom line is that there is no better way to isolate a turntable than to distance the loudspeakers from the turntable.

Great video. Most of us underestimate the impact vibrations have on our sound. I also discovered the benefits of isolation recently by building a wall shelf and iso-pucks. Incredible!