Apple Just Opened Up To Retro Game Emulators? Well... 

Apple’s App Store is allowing companies like Nintendo, Sony, etc to use their own proprietary emulators, so like in Nintendo’s case they can now put all their NSO apps(NES,SNES,GB,GBA,N64,Genesis) onto all smart devices and Sony can put all their classic PS1-PS3 and PSP/VITA games using their ps+ service

iOS apps can hook into the Files app on the phone to load roms.

As an Apple user, I knew it was too good to be true.

People need to specify that 'Emulation is legal' in the USA. This is not necessarily true for other regions of the world.

They not gon let us win this easy

Emulators are showing up on iOS. A gba emulator called Igbo was uploaded a few hours ago

I can see this working well for a game like shantae advance. When it's realeased way forward could partner with a emulator to get the game on iOS. Especially since there going to be giving people the rom too to slap into emulators from what I heard

I can see Nintendo putting their NSO emulator apps for an additional subscription fee that Apple takes a cut of.

I assumed that we would be importing roms and bios files through the file browser. You can download stuff through safari and other browsers and bring them into the file browser, and you can open those files in stuff like word or acrobat for iOS. Nothing in the verbiage says you can’t bring stuff outside of the app, just how files are restricted when downloading from within the app.

2:39 The PPSSPP Dev is misquoting the announcement. It doesn't say 'must' it says 'may'... To be fair he is much more invested than I am and it would be really easy to assume malintent from Apple here.

emulation is legal, but almost none use it in a legal way.

8:20 M series aren’t designed to operate on an iPhone and execute tasks such as “capture a raw image by using the main camera sensor” and “make a sim call by using as little power from the small battery as possible”. Only A series can handle phone stuff. (Spoiler, they’re pretty much the same thing minus the special operations mentioned above) So no, we don’t want to see an M series chip on an iPhone because it would render it a pointless battery drainer brick.

To me this sounds more like something like a Sega Genesis Collection can exist in the app store as opposed to something like Gens

I will continue to emulate and pirate and show my grand kids how to do it to. 👍

Apple could help themselves greatly in two ways: - Allow the equivalent of .apk files to be loaded outside of the app store (with a caution) - Have the option of an on-screen navigation bar like android. (i know both are possible with jailbreaking but you shouldn't have to do that to get that functionality)

i mean.. doesnt my iphone already allow apps user accessible space? I swear when I plug my iphone into itunes theres parts that allow users to transfer files between apps. We use to do it for free ringtones. Unless thats been chopped awhile ago

Apple uploaded the first emulator on the platform called igba a gba emulator which can play with gba files (I was playing sonic advanced)

Jon when are we gonna get a video of your retro set up and studio set up?

Yeah the timing of this has to do with the lawsuit. It will look great on paper. But expect much friction on its implementation (if the right-to-repair has demonstrated). The FTC case is about a wall garden. It is not a wall-garden if it is gated.

I don't see why you could place your "legal" backups in a Google drive and download them to your Apple device. I can do that now, there just isn't anything that can play them.

Konami did that, Castlevania SOTN is emulated they did 2 or 3 changes for the menu but the game is the same even aspect ratio. So I think isn’t new but now is public info

Delta emulator is fully supported now and on the app store

I was wondering if this would open the floodgates to VMs in your iphone.

Imagine Apple allowing Emu-apps and Nintendon't are suing them. This should go epic!

You mentioned Apple finally going to USB-C on iPhone due to regulators, the thing is it didn't change a thing at all. Apple in their infinite stupidity decided to do exactly what they did with the Lightning connector on iPhone and locked it down to USB 2 speeds. Yes you read that right, a phone that can cost up to nearly 2 grand depended on the model and storage size only has USB 2 speeds in 2024...

Apple being dishonest? I'm shocked, shocked I tell you!

Or i mean i can have the app look at my files (which is allowed) and couldnt the app just see the rom that I put into files? I have gamecube iso's saved in my files on my iphone.

Yeah I wouldn't count on it being as much as a win as you'd think as all they're really doing in this case is disclaiming any legal responsibility for what developers put on their store, but all that means is the developers themselves will be held legally accountable for what's posted on their store. So if say a company Nintendo wanted to file a DMCA against an emulator or push legal action against it's creator, they absolutely could.

Maybe Apple is trying to do for Emulation what it did for music downloads with iTunes back in the day. Before iTunes, music downloads were strictly pirated through means like Napster and Limewire. I guess they’re trying to get a piece of the pie in the retro market using their financial muscle. It will be interesting to see where this goes.

Interesting the people complaining about Apple are people who don’t even use Apple phones

How does line about "downloadable software" throw any of this into question? If they don't link to BIOS or game archives (ROMs or disc images) then the emulator fall foul of that "rule". PPSSPP devs are correct that it's unclear, but you can't just jump to conclusions that Apple is "pulling a fast one". This is something that needs to be brought to people's attend, but you frame this news as competently negative. Really thought better of you based on how you've handled things like this in the past.

Yeah the only way this would work is if the games are from private developers creating their own indi games.

Sideloading enabled worldwide like in the EU is the only real way emulation will be on iPhones imo.

It doesn't say must provide links it says may ... Here is the quote from section 4.7 which is the only section discussing this. "Additionally, retro game console emulator apps can offer to download games. You are responsible for all such software offered in your app, including ensuring that such software complies with these Guidelines and all applicable laws." In other words don't link to illegal stuff or else.

Does Apple do anything in good faith?

Sadly, even if emulators are allowed, JIT still is disabled for iPhone applications outside of debug mode. The performance will take a major hit. The existing iOS Dolphin emulator is a good example. Such a waste of good hardware.

Apple is not puling a fast one. If soene wants to put up an emulator, they can do it as longa s they have rights to the roms they also include. There could be a rom marketplace fromoffial licensed roms.

Emulators are available now

"What are we doing here John?" without direct access to files folders and storage the point is moot and jailbreak is still necessary

Welcome to 2016 Apple.

Given all of the recent legal turmoil for some emulators, I just don't think it's worth them pushing to be listed on commercial app stores. They would be better off just waiting and hoping that iOS allows side loading so people in the know can just go and find them.

There is more than plenty of crap available, as is, on the App Store. The last thing I want is even much more crap, serving as vectors for potential security breaches, if Apple is forced to open up their platform. There’s plenty of other options (phone brands and other portable devices) for people who want emulators, alternative app stores, etc. If that’s not competition, I don’t know what is. IMO the DOJ is wasting taxpayer’s money on that lawsuit. And, no. I’m not defending Apple. I’m old enough to know full well companies are not my friends. I’m defending the walled garden business model as one more business model option, for those of us who want to have that option for some of our devices. And also, yes. I’m an Android and Linux user, as well. And one of the things I like the most about each platform is that they are not like each other. I definitely don’t understand this nonsense of late, where people think that everything has to be for everyone, and everything has to be available everywhere. It reeks of entitlement to me. 🤷‍♂️

Sounds like they are just opening the door to for companies like Atari to publish an official app to play their old games, since they would own the rights for their games. I already thought there were legal emulators with download of roms. Thinking explicitly of iarcade where you could buy or subscribe to downloading roms.

John, you need to clarify that in the US people generally have the right to make backups of purchased media for personal use only. Some can and do backup their own cartridges or games. I do it. I can legally play that rom because it's a backup of my personal copy. So no, not everything these emulators run is illegal if it's not homebrew. By covering the issue the way you did you create an inaccurate impression of what people are able to do.

Oh my god, Apple has never previously allowed emulators? I never knew this being an Android user. I thought you could always do that on Apple 😂

Phones need sd cards. This trend with smaller internal storage and push for the cloud is getting annoying especially when trying to transfer things.

This interpretation makes no sense. They don't limit other apps opening up files you load onto your device manually, so it doesn't make sense they'd do this with emulators. The quote they have mentioned is "links to all downloadable software". This clearly means software the app itself downloads. Why would this ever mean manually loaded files on a device. No one in the past 20 years has referred to transferring files to a device as "downloading". Nor have they referred to loading config files from storage as downloading either. Apple also aren't idiots (no matter what people think of them as a company). They know emulators are predominantly not for home brew games, but everything they've included seems more to cover their arses from litigation from the other big companies. What they clearly don't want is for copyrighted BIOS that shouldn't be shared to be downloadable via an app, but I doubt they care about stopping those being loaded on an iPhone and into an app. I'm not really sure why everyone thinks this is a fast one. This in theory, based on the language they've used, is a requirement on links the app itself directly downloads, which is no different to their usual scrutiny over links to external payment systems or any other links at that. If you have a link in your app to an external website Apple check these as part of their regular approval process. Furthermore, why would this be about opening up the system to other store fronts when this isn't a change regarding store fronts at all. They wouldn't start with emulation as a justification for not being scolded for preventing third party storefronts in their system, if this doesn't change the fact they don't allow storefronts on their system yet anyway. Furthermore, there is no mention in the terms of these downloadable software in these emulators being paid for. If it was something they were suggesting was possible, they'd include a statement about this in their terms payment section. People are notoriously bad at interpreting Apple's guidelines, but this doesn't seem like a fast one, it just seems like their usual language you find in their app submission terms. You can often see the loop holes in their wording. Ultimately though this needs to be tested, rather that fear mongering these guys seem to have jumped on.

its welcomed change of policy since emulation is already legal

That means Microsoft can allow emulators on retail mode for the Series S and X.

I guess i’ll just stick to sideloading emulators with altstore then…

I don't think emulation on phones is that good. I guess it's okay if you're playing a simple RPG. 4:14 I'm thinking of playing that soon. I think I have a rom for that game. Not sure why Juste Belmont has a blue outline. I like the fact that the animated series confirms that that Juste is Richter's grandfather.

Honestly it sounds like it's more hassle for all these emulators being on the app store is more trouble than it's worth

Wow, so I guess no one else actually read the source document...?

Maybe they are opening the door for Sony

There are emulators on google play stores... Apple will be ok

Don’t know what this guy is talking about emulators and roms are working just fine on the Delta app on iOS. I’m literally playing 2000 super NES games right now.

Sega already released Sonic Genesis on IOS so it's possible.

When it will be released?

Don’t give up hope Brethren’s! We shall find a way to make this work. Focus all your positive energy and pass it onto the Devs, like Goku and the spirit bomb. BELIEVE in the Devs! Stand firm and don’t lose your cool. This has to work, I need this to work, this s*** better work cause I’ve been waiting years for it!!!!! Don’t lose your cool!!!!!!!! STAND FIRM DAMN IT!!!!! 💪😅🤪

Well its the Big Show!!

I'm never a fan of blatant clickbaiting, it's the one thing i really hate about RU-vid (that and Creator Adverts)

Well, isn’t roms not software though? I mean you don’t have to provide download links to photos or documents you want to open. Of course you have to provide that yourself, but that is honestly fine by me.

If Nintendo decided to expand their Nintendo online service I would absolutely pay more to play their emulators on my phone. I rarely play the emulators they support on my switch. I think that’s the market Apple is trying to open up to.

I think this means Microsoft, Sony or Nintendo can release an emulator on iOS with a library of their old games.

did people forget what happened with dolphin

Why is this such a big deal? Emulation is fine! You just can't do current consoles that is where you can get into trouble. If a company wants to remain profitable and continue to make games that you enjoy then you have pay for it. Period! No current games! Retro is perfectly fine!

hi Spawn Wave

If I'm at home, I've got like 200 devices that I can play games on. If I'm away from home, I'm supposed to carry around one of those goofy telescopic controller adapters when it would be easier to just carry a miyoo mini or something more easily pocketable? Hope you folks wanting to play emulators on your phone get everything you've ever wanted no matter what phone you own, but I'll never understand the desire. We already have more convenient ways to do this.

Wasnt Apple not allowing emulators because they didnt allow self modifying code, rather than anything specifically to do with emulation? That's how it used to be when I was doing iOS development. edit: ah, yep, seems I was right. There's a mention of JIT emulation still being in dispute.

6:35 world of final fantasy is a game 😂

Technically this could give Nintendo license to actually let some of their older Gameboy and NES and SNES games on iOS. That'll be a good time. I honestly hope Sega just emulates Sega Saturn Virtua Fighter 2 on iOS. I already bought it in my head. Also would repurchase Soul Calibur from Namco Bandai provided they don't pump it full of microtransactions.

Another reason to stay android, Apple never remove that walled Garden

I mean I can already side load these emulators on my phone without jail break but tbh it’s not super convenient. It would just be nice if Apple would just let users have at emulators already. It’s honestly not a big deal for retro emulators to be playable on their devices people will find a way to do it but why should they have to jump through so many hoops at all?

I been doing emulation on my Xbox Series X 😎

As an ocasional developer. I feel the Apple pain. You can't actually even use yout own developed software in a phone you own without APples blessing.

honestly why don't publishers work with emulators? Let the emulators be a store front for publishers to sell their old games for like $5? maybe less! money is money and you would probably have an increase in people interested in emulation. If you can't beat the emulators. Join them lol.

Is John’s face allowed on the App Store?

Ive got a better one, Apple doesn't know how emulators work.

Shit like this is why I prefer Android over iPhone. I couldn't imagine being told what I can and can't do with my own device.

I think playing anything other than a simple game such as Angry Birds is silly on your phone. Anytime I see someone gaming in public, its on a Switch and the rare Steam Deck here or there.

Iphones can still get viruses via apps like Gmail with just a simple email that doesn't require user interaction 😒

Their stock has been taking quite the hit. They must be desperate to do something that has been possible on Android for many years.

Cant wait to see nintendo lawsuit against apple. Emulators arent illegal but roms are.

yeahhhh I love emulation!!!!

Apple: "We're allowing emulators on our app store!" Gamers: "But how do we load our roms onto them?" Apple: "That's the neat part! You don't!"

When people are emulating, people shouldn’t have to browse through pirating sites to own them, but meet new people to trade games and dump them in homebrews and emulators. But just like society, there are bad apples making living so much harder than it needs to be that it makes trying to branch out into new ideas all seem illegal, when average people are not looking into breaking the law, but making a new social norm.

The i in iPhone stands for idiot 🍎=🗑

People are gonna find a way to make it free by force and till than I'm sticking to android for emulation

It's Apple. Of course, it will be half-assed to seem like it's doing something for "everyone".

Not all of us wants open systems that are more susceptible to Malware, I’d rather know my phone works then pretend I’m a hacker!

I agree this is just Apple doing what Apple does which is not give a s*** about anybody

How is this a huge win for emulators? People sensationalize things so much.

I personally don’t think that it’s a good idea to run retro emulators on iOS or anywhere else because Nintendo could take them down

Android users are missing out, I FUCKIN' hate Android devices, just to update Crunchyroll on my Nokia Stream Box I had to delete Twitch, Disney+, OSN+ and the Sega Saturn emulator, and now my storage is full once again, Android devices always do that, they eat up your storage and my Nokia Stream Box capacity is 8 GB of storage, cannot be expanded, wth? This is why Apple is objectively superior, I never run out of storage on Apple devices, they always somehow shrink my files to save storage, I'm so pissed rn 😡😡

I mean back in the day apple also made a ps1 emulator so 🤷‍♂️

Looking back that you where Wrong on Emulators on AppStore

So they're not actually gonna allow piracy?!?

Emulator are required to keep past games alive which nintendo just unplug them if they made little to no money Not port them over so is gameover

How many times i have to pay nintendo for super mario world, so i can legally emulate it? The amount of money I've spent over the years on videogames and these companies crying over a product they dont sell anymore. Instead of wasting money on lawyers, they should put on sale emulated copies of their games for every platform.

So no iPhone is as vulnerable as any other device I had a iPhone 15 pro that got infected with pegasus had to re sell it there was no way to remove that thing from the device