Epic video! Really opening up how I want my set up to be, lots of good points to consider too! Thank so much for your wisdom! I really enjoy your quality content!!
Another fantastic video. Well thought out, deliberate in presentation, and detailed at a level that is digestible but still leaves me thinking afterwards. Looking forward to part 2!
Great video. Can’t wait for part deux. I have struggled with similar challenges for setups and really enjoy seeing how you worked through it. Great content and can’t wait to see how you like your Day 6 setup!
It’s pretty hilarious I turned this video on in my truck, after leaving the bow shop with Easton axis arrows in my seat and I’m pulling into the chic fil a ! 😂
What a topic, I love it. You hit the nail on the head mentioning preference due to animal and style of hunting aswell as personal bow setup. People take note of this and spend the time just like Brandon and other successful people do and try what works best !!! Well done Brandon love your work.
Great talk. I like the specifics and physics also. TAC just proved to me that my cheap Black Eagle Outlaw 350's are better than I am. They go exactly where I aim them. Their best feature is the ease of retrieval from dirt.
Great information ! Finally, some intelligent insight on what weight/FOC arrow I should shoot for the game I'm hunting and the bow I'm shooting! I did exactly what you said using the Online Calculators you suggested. Also, I tuned/set my bow up to the weight/FOC arrows I wanted to shoot. Taking trajectory into consideration was a factor as well. I tuned my bow to the arrows I wanted to shoot, instead of tuning my arrows to my bow. Although, I did bare shaft, nock tune my arrows and fletched them as well. One of the best videos Ive seen concerning this subject !
As usual Brandon great video. I think the arrow set up is the most important part of the bow setup as a whole. Oh one other thing. Don't worry about how long the video is!
Always enjoy your videos, man. I’ve been down some rabbit holes lately about “heavy vs lite” and it seems like people on both sides are always coming for the others throat. Thank you for not being one of those. Can’t wait for part 2.
4D Outdoors don’t go too lite. Bows are designed to shoot no less than a minimum weight or boom. Like dry firing the bow. Likely we all know that though.
I am one of those short-armed/short draw persons. I put a lot of time and expense into picking what I consider to be the "best" arrows for hunting. Randy Ulmer has some good articles on arrow selection - they are old but still relevant. Additionally, Dr Ulmer (and John Dudley) has suggested that he keeps in arrows in the 270 fps range and adds weight in order to maintain this speed, as bow performance increases year by year. Thanks for taking the time to make this content.
Yep, I stopped by shooting FMJ 12 years ago after my first set, once you start clicking arrows they start taking that set you talked about. Your channel is great just subscribed and catching up on all the Videos
Great video as always. I would recommend trying to hang out with Troy Fowler from Ranch Fairy. He and Dr. Ed Ashby will make your head spin with even more arrow knowledge.
I’m using the Ironwill system with Easton Axis (match grade) arrows and so far so good. Great groups out to 55-60 yards. This set up is expensive, but the consistency is excellent and therefor worth while. I spine index each arrow, build them, spin them and have no concerns. Id rather forgo a piece of gear if it means that my arrow flight is as good as I can make it. Plus building arrows is like hand loading ammunition for long range precision shooting, what you get out of it is what you put into it(hopefully punched tags and great memories). Great video Brandon 👊🏹
So I have ran Deep Six FMJs for a few years now. The only things I find an issue with these particular shafts is as follows: inserts work their way loose or come out entirely. And the COST of them. If you lose one (don’t judge me) it isn’t easy on your wallet when that happens. BUT THE absolute best arrow I have ever used without question. The penetration of these shafts compared to others is unmatched! Well, after all, this is my opinion based on a few years of heavy shooting and hunting! Great content once again Brandon!!
Brandon excellent data, I stopped shooting FMJs for the same exact reason (bending), my new arrows are Victory VAP SS and GT Kinetic Pierce Plat. both are micro diameter and shoot great.
Definitely a happy medium. Imo best good comments are #1 followed by good arrow flight. Then I'm looking to achieve a minimum FOC of 18% which in turn, translates to a heavier arrow. My arrow setup right now is a goldtip 300 spine, 100 grain insert, 125 grain Magnus 2 buzzcut. Total weight is 520 grain FOC at 18%. Shooting a Triax at 65 pounds, draw at 28" . I don't worry too much about trajectory since 95% of the time I'm whitetail hunting with shots under 30 yards.
Wow what a smack down on those shafts. All I can say Is thanks for saving a lot of people miss or wounded animals ,not to mention target shooting. I use Victory vap Elite amazing shafts.....buy them on Ebay for 144 dollars some times less. Since the shafts are so small they drive further thru the block targets ,I have to shoot at least 25 yards to keep arrows from going thru.
I started shooting the Victory VAP SS. Great More-Ment-um as you say. Best arrows I've ever shot. 20% FOC at 570 grains. Makes me happy at least. The stainless steel won't bend like an Aluminum one.
I didnt know you released this video so soon, lol. I bought my first bow yesterday and bought some arrows (dont know the exact kind other then they are all carbon and made by Beman) and im very happy with it already. This video and part 2 will help me greatly and I appreciate it. You're videos are very informative and useful for pros and beginners alike im sure, so keep you up. You have a new subscriber.
Good video,, preach it brother ,, weight matters ! I shoot bloodsport evidence micro ,, 160 up front 527 grains total,, shooting 70lb 32” draw,, 282fps ,, my whitetail setup ,, can’t wait till the next video
Here in Australia, I've found the CX piledriver to be awesome. They're older carbon arrows but with a good insert (60-100gr) they will kill dinosaurs. Relatively cheap too.
As a member of the initiated (Fairy Duster; currently shooting 750+g/20% FOC), and a fan of all your content, I'm on the edge of my seat, and can't wait to see your results. You're a smart dude with a responsible outlook, so this should be good stuff.
I changed from FMJ as well this year to Valkyrie Reign 300 spine with 100 gr centerline sleeve and a 230 gr head. brents test order system is great, you get a chance to try different weight.
All I have ever used is match grade 5mm axis (+/-.001). 100g tip with 75g brass insert. Cut to 26". 13.1 FOC. Right 2 degree helical. They are EXTREMELY accurate.
On the FMJ bending...I have a similar issue with my high use VAPs. I was shooting horrible groups a week before the season, but groups got better at distance. Pulled my kill sticks out to get fully prepped for the season and I was shooting bullet holes and breaking things. Lol Then I tested the deflection and found my practice arrows were super noodles. Carbon breaks down just as easy as FMJs can bend permanently.
I've had some do that as well, but probably only two out of the 4ish dozens I've had. I think the fmjs have a significantly shorter life if you shoot everyday at home with them. Slap once and they're not .003 anymore
Brandon Mcdonald most of my practice arrows have hit a lot of dirt (I practice outdoors at 70-90yds almost exclusively and I pay for it in early season) and have been used for 2+ years of weekly shooting from May to October so that might be a reason...lol
great review. I have come to similar conclusion. I want a flat shooting arrow. I dont always get to range the animal, and 5 yards of variation a flat trajectory helps me connect. I always have a FMJ in the quiver, for maybe a frontal shot, but have never used it. and NOTE... my FMJ i need to use a 40 yard pin for a 30 yard shot, pins are set using Gamegetter.
“Your setup sucks.. and I’m sorry about that” hahaha!! Dying.. yet again.. great video. I still shoot fmjs but will phase them out next year.. mostly cause of the cost but also cause I’ve noticed the spreading groups.. maybe I just suck but.. good excuse to find a little cheaper setup to make the wifey happy.
As always, good stuff. I've been shooting a long time so my personal solution is to set a bow up for 3d, for medium weight adult arrows -500-550 grain and one more for heavy arrows 660 and above. Yes it costs money but as you get older accumulate things. Also just wondering if you shot many aluminum arrows? straightened them ? wonder if it works on FMJs?
Killed my Elk Cow with a 615g Arrow (pretty light but that allowed me to get great FOC) with 105g in/outcert and 200g fixed broadhead. Shot out of a 55lb (nearer to 52lb at my draw length) recurve at 15 yards. Weight kills 😁 looking forward to part 2.
IBO speed is also a factor to consider when selecting arrows spine. A bow that IBOs at 345 is going to apply more energy to an arrow than a bow that IBOs at 315. A faster more aggressive cam system will likely need a stiffer spine. (edit for spelling)
Pretty informative video and the cinematography is nice. I am having a somewhat similar issue, but must less weight difference. I have been shooting the Cabela's Stalker Xtreme 340 spine with 100 grain up front for years they are 9.3 grain per inch. I recently bought a 6 pack of Carbon Express Mayhem SDS that are 11.25 grain per inch with a camo wrap on them and come with 47 grain inserts. My bow is an old PSE Fire Flite 33 from 06' with a 29 inch draw length and pulling 60 lbs. I bought some 100 grain Magnus Stinger Buzzcuts and Sik F4s at Cabela's since I couldn't find any 125-150 grain broadheads there or most places online are out of stock/backorder. Anyway there is a drop of 3+ inches from one arrow to the next and I have to gap shoot my pins that I have set up for the basic 100 grain points with aluminum inserts just to get close. I did chrono my set up with the Stalker Xtremes at 264 fps on a Caldwell chronograph. I even have tried a wrist release and a thumb button one.
@@brandonmcdonald6121 Thank you Sir. I am hoping so, even though I have never shot at or into an animal with my previous arrows. Once I get these dialed into 40 yards (whitetail in WV), make sure my broadheads are sharp and find an opportunity, execute shot placement, I am hopeful for success. I did quick math and without the weight of the 3 blazers and Nocturnal lighted nock my arrow weighs 473.25 including arrow, insert and broadhead.
Great point about FMJ’s I started with the 4 mm FMJs and very soon figured out they were bending Shooting Carbon Injexions now I want to try the new Axis 4 mm long range lighter hopefully faster and will shoot flatter at distance I only have 27” draw at 62 lbs on my TRIAX
Brandon Usually everyone is pimping there opinion on there favoirite and why you should buy it. Love your approach on this content. We can spend way too much time (like I did) on fine tuning, worrying, arguing stats. Most people don't have time or resources to compile data and they listen to the wrong [archery product hustler] on YT. Accuracy and shot placement will always trump arrows weight I believe. One cosmetic issue can be brought to light it that certain manufacturers(easton,BE,) have emblems on side that will wear off or wipe clean easily, where I've been shooting some victory vf that I've refltched 6 times and acetone doesn't seen to hurt the emblem too much (not saying it wont)And the emblem doesn't seen to wear. But there I go pimping arrows lol. Thanks
Hahaz I don't have any issue with someone saying they like because they actually like it. My issue is, if you're getting a check it's harder to be objective..
Thanks for this video. Great info. Always enjoy your videos... Have you tried traditional? I shoot both, enjoy both. Trad is a lot more fun. Compound is more surgical... Keep up the great content.
BRANDON I would love to have a video that you review different release! And the different types, if you could do the silver back that would be awesome.
I looked into the three insert systems you mentioned at the end of the video, but think I’m going with FOCUS system by Black Eagle, just mentioning if you haven’t looked into that particular one yet. Keep up the videos.
Yeah I currently have BE Rampage in 300 spine but will be switching to x-impact 250 spine with the extra weight up front, 30.5 draw length ~73 lb weight.
Devils advocate: what if the FMJs aren’t bending because of arrow slap from hitting targets...what if they bend from poor form when pulling out of targets? What if it’s gripping them too hard or not pulling perfectly straight out of the target when removing them?
@@dlydly1686 obviously people wouldn't want to deal with bent arrows; but maybe it's worth trying to be a little more thoughtful when yanking arrows buried deep in a target, if there's a chance that's all it takes to keep the arrows straight for longer. It's just a hypothesis, I could be wrong here.
I shoot fmjs but have been thinking about going to carbon.. I definitely like the penetration they offer. However I bought another rx4 and now one will be set up for target and the other will be my hunting game
I would be really curious to see your exact set up for arrows. I have a VXR 31.5 with the same draw length shooting 70lbs and want to try something different than my FMJs.
Have you tried tempering the arrow? The carbon fiber cylinder inside is under stress from the bent aluminum and is trying to pull back the aluminum to become straight. Giving it a helping hand with some heat might straighten it out if the epoxy inside can handle some heat (generally a maximum of 150°C (300°F) for shorter periods of time for regular epoxy and double that if it's high heat resistant epoxy), though it might mess with the properties since it's a 7075 alloy and is a tempered alloy, but it melts at 477 °C (891 °F) so the carbon fiber pipe would probably go bonkers first. The only reason I can think of for putting an aluminum sleeve on it is for impact protection, like dropping it on a rock or maybe when it hits bone (side impacts when it wobbles through and animal). Aluminum is not really great for withstanding fatigue, even if it's 7075 alloy.
You should check out the HMR from Vector. They are the most efficient piercing I've found, and I was blown away by their customer service. If they were a bow shop, they wouldn't charge you to test shoot a new bow...
Brandon, I suggest you look up the The study created by Dr Ed Ashby, you can find it on his website titled Ashby Reports. He did a massive study over a stretch of a few decades on arrow lethality.
Ive actually read it. I'll dive more into it when we talk about extreme FOC. There's no doubt that he's got the experience and I agree with lots of his principles.
I'm watching this, I just got a snapchat of my buddy watching the part 2 of the 2020 bow shootout, and my other buddy responded with a picture of the "why I won't shoot a PSE" video. So 3 hunting buddies randomly watching 3 of your videos before bed, in 3 different states, at the same time. Weird.
Momentum tells us how much energy, based on the weight and velocity of the arrow, it has available to use during impact and penetration before it stops penetrating and comes to rest. Momentum is a much better indicator of what we can expect for penetration from our arrows. GrizzlyStik › The-Power-of-Momen...
Some day I wanna see you make a video where instead of putting in the shot (video shot) that you're going for, you do the setup for it. So like that truck driving in would be you backing up after starting the camera 🤣
180gr Valkyrie, 300 spine VAP elite cut to 26.5", 4 fletch AAE Pro Max, 460gr, 20.4% foc at 286 fps. I'm think next year I'll try out the 200gr heads or go with a 250 spine and jump to the 230 gr heads
I shoot a 45lb recurve with no sights or stabilizers and can keep a group of 12 in a paper plate at 25 yards with a 7.0 gpi arow with a 125 tip and 600 spine they shoot good but should i worried about getting good penetration on deer?
