ATI 9600 SE: Mistakes Were Made, So You Can Avoid Them!

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In 2003 ATI launched the Radeon 9600 SE, a budget orientated graphics card that works with Windows 98 and Windows XP. We are revisiting this graphics card, testing classic games and I will tell you what I think!
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0:00 Introduction
0:34 The ATI Radeon 9600 SE
1:24 First XP System (failure)
4:21 Second XP System (success)
5:15 Software and settings
6:13 Benchmarks
7:30 Screamer 4x4
8:06 Fog working!
8:29 X: Beyond The Frontier
10:23 First 98 System (failure)
12:22 Second 98 System (success)
13:19 BIOS update
13:30 Software and settings
14:47 Benchmarks
16:44 nGlide
17:57 Gun Metal
19:42 Fog not working!
20:38 Motherboard resources
20:56 Summary and thoughts

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29 июн 2024

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Комментарии : 515

@dualpapayas Год назад

I like how you are talking about the games more. I love retro hardware, but sometime I get so caught up with benchmarks that I forget the whole point of a retro machine is because I love retro games.

@philscomputerlab Год назад

Yes, thank you! 🥰

@MarcoGPUtuber Год назад

No mistakes were made watching Phil's Computer Lab

@philscomputerlab Год назад

First 🥇

@DNS_G_Espanol Год назад

@@philscomputerlab ? ok i guess i need keep eye notifications

@JohnSmith-xq1pz Год назад

Unlike the XP installer saying how Safe,fast and flexible surfing the internet is/was...

@captain1334 Год назад

@@JohnSmith-xq1pz that was a long time ago

@JohnSmith-xq1pz Год назад

@@captain1334 Not so long ago to excuse XP not having a basic firewall from the start

@aleksgosk9346 Год назад

I used a Radeon 9600 SE in my retro box for a while, alongside a P4 with Intel chipset, SB audigy 2 ZS and Windows 98. Stability was excellent and the card performed admirably given the price.

@VorpalSyndicate Год назад

Intro is amazing... but the sad part is... its true.

@wiibur Год назад

This was the first GPU I bought new, to play Half-life 2 on Windows XP. I had no idea how to buy computer parts but the box was covered in HL2 marketing material. After a few years, it was retired to the closet until I revived my P4 machine into a win98 gaming build based on your 10 Reasons for a P4 Win98 Dos Gaming PC video. P.S. I don't mind the modern videos, I think they're cool too and seem to give you some decent sponsorships or parts that support the channel.

@philscomputerlab Год назад

Ah yes, the half-life 2 promotion. Many cards had a coupon I believe.

@RevDrCCoonansr Год назад

My morning routine includes Phil's Computer Lab while eating breakfast.

@PixelPipes Год назад

I remember the 9600SE not reviewing well at all. It was a pretty big step down in price from a regular 9600 (something like $60 vs $120), but for good reason. The communities I was in at the time treated it like a plague rat. I like the direction your channel has been going. Your videos have honestly been even more enjoyable when you started filming yourself, and the way you're delving deeper into games is a good idea. I guess they just feel more personal now, and sharing more of your own opinions on things helps with that. And doing more retro stuff is always a plus!

@philscomputerlab Год назад

Thank you 🙂When are you making videos again? I guess life gets in the way of this hobby 😐

@GGigabiteM Год назад

The only difference between the SE and the regular 9600 was the memory bus being halved. It crippled performance in games that pushed lots of textures around, but it was mostly fine in older games.

@sebastianebert4295 Год назад

@@GGigabiteM yeah I think 9800 SE vs. 9800 was more of a difference, even when using the Omega drivers to soft-mod it, I had only 4 pixel pipelines available on the 9800 SE.

@Roadkill7878 Год назад

Excellent content as usual Phil. I’ve learned a lot from your channel. Love your website and all it’s resources 👍🏻

@spladam3845 Год назад

LOL, That intro had me cracking up. I'll say it again, you suffer so that we don't have to and for that we thank you Phil.

@captainwasel8377 Год назад

I always enjoy watching your videos and there is a lot to learn from the diagnosis when you run into some problems. Keep up the great work.

@captainxl Год назад

Would love to see a series where you go year by year and cover hardware and software for that year in the dos through XP time frame.

@scherge Год назад

Privateer 2 is a great space shooter. I had a lot of fun with it back in the days. Clive Owen and Jürgen Prochnow can be seen in the cutscenes, and the game offers a lot of options when it comes to earning money for better ships and equipment. Trading, escort missions, bounty hunting, and so on, only to name a few. If I remember correctly, it was even developed by Erin Roberts. He's the brother of the Wing Commander godfather, Chris Roberts.

@legendareNz Год назад

I used a 9600pro with svideo with a tunercard to capture my gameplay. Good memories.

@philscomputerlab Год назад

The days of connecting to the TV and watching DivX movies 🙂

@pavelfara9333 Год назад

Good you share what's working and what's not! Many people are not willing to share "fuckups". But it is important. I don't have the SE version but when it comes to normal 9600 with a passive heatsink - be careful guys and put some airflow. I have seen maybe 50% of these cards dead as muton - looking as new but dead. Most likely due to the heat. On the other side all! 9600pro and XT with a fan works for me - not a single dead one got in to my hands.

@sebastianebert4295 Год назад

Yeah I'd add a simple 8 cm fan to it or even better, with some cm distance if you can. Also add a 12 cm fan behind your HDD cage to cool the whole SSD/HDD and mainboard silently. Never had a dead HDD after doing this, keeps it way below 40 °C, on some setups even below 30 °C.

@flightsimdeskuk Год назад

Freespace 1 and 2 are must haves for anyone that likes Space Shooters. Also Freelancer, Starlancer, The Darklight Conflict, Tachyon The Fringe are good to have in your collection

@philscomputerlab Год назад

I've been playing Tachyon: The Fringe and it's much more what I'm after. I will add the other games to my list!

@Chris-yc3mm Год назад

Awesome recommendations.

@jomeyqmalone Год назад

Starlancer is a really fun one that's easy to jump into

@erikmerchant567 Год назад

I had very good luck with the 9550 AGP card and never had any driver issues with it. That AsRock motherboard is really the gold standard for XP builds using AGP. I've had good luck with Win98 dual booting with it too. Great choice to go with it. Thanks for the solid video!

@jpvalverde85 Год назад

I have the Rev 2.0 and found it troublesome with SATA SSDs and the anonymous CMedia sound codec, but chipset is mega, good performance and compatibility, even crazy stuff like Kentsfield Quad Cores (tested with my Q6600, a lotta grunt for an AGP machine).

@Lady_Zenith 11 месяцев назад

Te 9550 was much better card than 9600SE. 9550 was by default 128-bit card. It was just underclocked regular 9600 made to compete with the FX5700LE (which was pretty bad), as a result it was really cheap and had huge OC headroom. It was easy to get 9600PRO performance from it. It was in its time best GPU for the money, if you include the OC.

@AaronHendu 9 месяцев назад

4core dual vsta and another one...they had AGP and PCIe slots. And support quad core 775. Probably rare these days. I had one and it helped me transition from 754 AGP to 775 PCIe without a full upgrade, but it was great for setting AGP GPU benchmark records too. Core 2 Quad plus AGP makes for huge benchmark scores on AGP cards.

@filipetmarcal Год назад

Very good test

@stephensalex 10 месяцев назад

You're not alone. I had nothing but problems (mainly instability) with VIA chipsets.

@psychopowner101 Год назад

I love this video this is the kind of stuff that always happens to me and I enjoy watching people work through their setbacks with retro computers.

@Cpt_Wolf Год назад

9600SE was always card to avoid, same as 9200SE due to both having 64-bit memory bus, and sometimes even cut down memory capacity. Budget choice back then was Radeon 9550, which had 128-bit bus. If you were really lucky and could find 4ns memory chips on your card, after little of overclocking with Ati Tools would let you to have full fat 9600 at minimum, 9600Pro, and sometimes with really good examples even 9600XT performance.

@sebastianebert4295 Год назад

Ofc. those are slower, but good enough for retro gaming for older games in nowadays' perspectives. You also can use the Omega Drivers, which are faster, also soft-modding may increase the speed (in my case it did, with 9800 SE to Pro mod) but not adding more pipelines). I still have a GT 1030 GDDR5 in my newest PC I bought in 2017, not running the newest games or only at 720 60 FPS or 1080 30 FPS, but for any old games it's super fast and stays very cool. Fast memory chips and maybe reballing RAM from partly defective cards may increase performance ofc. I mean if you have some defective cards now and many parts, you could make a DIY mix, double the RAM and things like that. Maybe need to flash the BIOS. Surely not as worthwile as with 3dfx and other rare older cards, but why not, out of fun? Repairing things makes one happy and proud also.

@jomeyqmalone Год назад

Basically any ati "se" card is best avoided

@MarcWeavers Год назад

(windows XP part of the video) up the AGP Aperture size. maybe also look into the PCE-PCI bridge, under device manager, view by connection, the one that the AGP card is connected through should be AGP-PCI bridge, the drivers usually come with the chipset (i saw this get installed by the VIA chipset driver package in the windows 98 part of the video, this might explain the better performance on windows 98 for that graphics card)

@sebastianebert4295 Год назад

I always upped the AGP Aperture size, despite anyone including the manufacturer's manual wrote to keep it at 64 MB std was the best setting (I guess just to not waste normal mainboard RAM, if the app/game couldn't make use of external memory). But with 1+ GB RAM I think it's always best to increase the value.

@BenState Год назад

Best IT video beginning ever. Im old and grumpy and I LOLd. :0 Sound cards need to be farthest from CPU on the PCI slots in my experience.

@philscomputerlab Год назад

😘

@r4z4m4t4z Год назад

great intro edit, vid well done again!

@ahabwolf7580 Год назад

Another great video, thanks Phil!

@peterilling1627 Год назад

Awesome Phil as usuall mate .

@datriaxsondor590 Год назад

LMAO That intro. 😂 That was a nice touch, man. Nicely done.

@RJARRRPCGP Год назад

That freeze at 4:04, reminds me of when I got a bad PATA cable, LOL. It was one of those round PATA cables, where they were wrapped on the outside.

@philscomputerlab Год назад

All sorts of things can go wrong with these old computers. I tend to swap parts until things work LOL

@KaitenKenbu Год назад

Modern stuff tossed in the mix is fine really. The gear straddling the line between retro and modern is especially cool like your 8-12 year old xeon builds with decent graphics. It's a nice distraction when I'm lost in the weeds on my pentium iii windows 98 or other xp projects. Recently picked up a mac pro 4,1(flashed to 5,1) that I've gotten to run monterrey. will be adding a vega 64 and another xeon to it. It should run windows 10 and some modern games at okay frame rates, the old x58 xeons are no slouch even today.

@UpLateGeek Год назад

I do remember I had issues with the old SB Live back in the day. It was similar to the issues you saw where it would crash on startup, and I had to boot up in safe mode to remove the driver. I vaguely remember it had something to do with the fact that my card was an OEM model, and the drivers I was using were for the retail model, or something like that. Once I found the right drivers, it worked just fine.

@shadowopsairman1583 Год назад

Never had a problem with them or Aan ATi All In Wonder Radeon 9700 Pro.

@JasperTedVidalTale Год назад

Very nice troubleshooting

@bok.. Год назад

I love your videos Phil! Greetings from burning Canada!!!

@carlosenriquesappa2049 Год назад

Best retro channel in youtube

@philscomputerlab Год назад

😊😀

@RevDrCCoonansr Год назад

Hey! Another winner of a card I had back in the day. Had the 9500, thought it was anemic so I got a 9600. And it TOO was anemic. But I guess you just figured that out lol! Great content, Phil!

@lookingglassed Год назад

I noticed a pretty significant increase in performance using the catalyst 6.2 and 6.3 drivers vs. newer ones. For example newer catalyst versions would run Half-Life 2 at almost unplayable framerates (l18-25 FPS) but with 6.2 it would run at approx. 60 FPS with dips to 30-40, the drivers made a huge difference across the board.

@Aaron.Newman Год назад

That intro! Wow so good

@br33ch Год назад

Starlancer is the space game you are after. It has trading, but I barely used it on my blast through and enjoyed it. I'm considering doing a trading run also soon. Loved the intro!

@philscomputerlab Год назад

Ok will check it out! I sine played another one, Tachyon The Fringe. I really like that one ...

@br33ch Год назад

@@philscomputerlab Oops I was actually thinking for Freelancer, the sequel. I haven't played the original yet

@tenminutetokyo2643 Год назад

That is nuts dood!

@BUDA20 Год назад

I had that card !

@MrCristianTudor Год назад

Watching your videos got me into retro builds and two accomplishments were achieved: Core2Duo E8200/4GB DDR3@1333/Mobo Intel G41M/nvidia GT430 1GB DDR3/Voodoo2 12MB/Audigy2/WD Velociraptor 500GB/WinXPSP3 in an Alienware Aurora case, which runs everything including Crysis 😊 and the latest build, a PentiumD925@3GHz/2GB DDR2/ATI Radeon Xpress 200/500GB mecha hdd/WinXpSP3

@philscomputerlab Год назад

Amazing 😍

@summerxia9027 Год назад

Well done😊

@philscomputerlab Год назад

Thanks 😊

@jhhoward Год назад

I remember buying a 9600 card to play Half Life 2, Far Cry and DOOM 3! 2004 was such a fantastic year for FPS games on the PC

@1300l Год назад

My first 3D card was an ATI 9200 SE. Got it to play Doom 3. Also remember injection Sata drivers on the XP install disk

@khoifoto Год назад

I haven't laughed this much to a video intro in a long time! haha.

@carbonara2144 Год назад

I had the 9600 pro version and it was great value for the money.

@RJARRRPCGP Год назад

That Asus A8V is loaded with good caps! (unless a rare defect or it sitting too long) Topcat will love those caps! Athlon 64 is 2004, week 46.

@christopherjackson2157 Год назад

Pcem is something I want to get more into

@evergreengamer5767 Год назад

Have run into that same issue with sound blaster PCI cards in many VIA chipsets when using Voodoo 5500 AGP if swap out for Nvidia card everything works fine it also works fine with Voodoo 3 PCI but very interesting to see same behavior with the 9600 SE. No idea what the cause is or if is work around but have resorted to using C-Media sound card in those systems. Also great video Phil.

@lukee4252 Год назад

Best in the business!

@xDJxGNOMx Год назад

I love your dedication and your over all style of videos Phil that much hasn't changed in those 9 something years i'm subscribed to you but if you feel like reviewing or testing out newer hardware or other stuff you should definetly do. You shouldn't stray away to far of course as it's just more pleasant and convenient to instantly know the channels content but i for one do enjoy both of these worlds as long as the focus is on something affordable and realisticly applicable.

@philscomputerlab Год назад

Thank you! I will focus on the older stuff going forward, for a range of reasons 🙂

@horemorkoriku Год назад

Having worked at a PC retailer from 2006 until 2011, mainly diagnosing PC’s and PC parts, I experienced a lot of problems with VIA. Intel was always more stable. However, Nvidia chipsets were decent. It’s not entirely unexpected to see that people are experiencing similar issues. Awesome video, thanks 😎

@ubergeeknz Год назад

In those times I recall VIA chipsets, and AMD, were problematic in terms of hardware compatibility. So it's probably not a fault with your hardware specifically, just typical compatibility issues of the era.

@Synthematix Год назад

Sata3 hdd's werent around when these motherboards were being sold

@GconduitYTubeAccount Год назад

True. But early radeons were very unstable themselves. It's only now that I trust them again.

@ia3630 Год назад

@@GconduitYTubeAccount "ATI 9600 SE: Mistakes Were Made" ... "Intel Arc: Hold my beer"

@AlbertoMontesSoto Год назад

also I've had cases those auto installers like snappy driver installing garbage and making me reinstall the system because of random crashes... so... yea...

@pauls4522 Год назад

Even a bit later as late as the amd am2 socket era I found the Nvidia chippers to be Amazing. Had 4 to 5 different am2/am2+ budget boards across a couple pcs. The Foxconn board I had with Nvidia chipset was the best!

@davkdavk Год назад

I remember the 9xxx series. 9800 Pro was awesome. A mate had the 9600 wishing he got the 9800 Pro

@BigBadBench Год назад

Gotta love the 865 chipset. Super stable and fast!

@oscarmetal Год назад

Ahh the memories!! My 9600xt bravo edition was a beast back then.

@ItIsNot1984 Год назад

The X series is amazing. You really want to play x3 though. Terran Conflict is the best imo, but there is a very steep learning curve to these games. The space combat is there, and you can on occasion acquire new ships by forcing pilots to bail or die. The game used a lot of impressively clever scripting to allow players to manage their trade stations, ships and other things. Its not a space shooter but more of a space sim.

@treighpedroche1516 11 месяцев назад

Phil I think one way you can incorporate the newer hardware coverage into your channel is by sharing projects, ideas, and tutorials on how to use the newer hardware for retro tasks, i.e. mini computers that do well playing/emulating retro PC games, OS, and software. You could go into some depth on how to maximize modern hardware for upscaled and/or virtualized DOS/Win95/98/XP era games and interesting software. How one could use retro peripherals, floppies, CDs, software, etc with new hardware, as some examples. I think your audience would be on board with that, I would!

@philscomputerlab 11 месяцев назад

The issue what that is it will narrow the target audience even more.

@uk4890 Год назад

Hi Phils I love the AsrocK 775i65G, ATI Radeons and your retrovideos!!!

@philscomputerlab Год назад

Thank you!

@mesterak Год назад

Happy Friday Phil! Glad to hear you are going to focus on retro hardware and gaming under 98 & XP. It’s what makes me look forward to your Friday videos! Also, I can confirm 100% that Pentium III and Pentium 4 (478 and 775) systems have less issues with hardware compatibility and performance under 98 and XP. I’ve probably purchased and played with at least 40-50 motherboards over the last 6-8 years to arrive at this conclusion. My best retro builds are systems with Intel chipsets with a few exceptions of boards that just work flawlessly but have VIA chipsets. I do have a couple socket 754 and 939 boards that work fine under Win9x, but without a doubt my Intel based boards have better compatibility with a wider range of graphics cards by both NVidia and ATI/AMD. Sound card wise I too love the Sound Blaster Live, Audigy, and X-Fi series cards, but lately I’ve been messing around with the AudioPCI based cards with Ensoniq (or Creative updated) chips (1370, 1371, 1373, 5880.) Many of these are OEM cards, but they work pretty good other than FM emulation that is lackluster depending on which games you play. Many of them are low profile but with high profile brackets, so I’m working on solutions to make my own low profile brackets so I can use these cards in some of my retro SFF systems that otherwise have sucky onboard audio.

@thudtheace Год назад

I can confirm that. My retro build is using an ATI 9800 pro (the big Sapphire Atlantis chonker with a passive heatsink), 2x voodoo2, SBlive on an intel P4 2.8Ghz HT proc on an Abit is7 board(intel chipset). When I built the system I originally was using an ATI9600 SE card. Everything installed and worked without issue. I only swapped the 9600 card for the 9800 because I wanted a bit more performance in games when not using the 2x voodoo2 cards. I use a drive caddy that I swap win98, winXP, Win7, Win Vista OS's. No issues. Cheers!

@philscomputerlab Год назад

Do you 3D print the brackets or cut them from blanks?

@ScottOmatic Год назад

Ah, Thief 2.. One of my favorite games ever made. The EAX accelerated sounded effects were amazing in these games back in the day.

@philscomputerlab Год назад

Yes EAX adds a bit of atmosphere.

@willaimkazer9754 Год назад

Dosbox on modern hardware, Windows 10 and 11 with RX 5.1,7.1 sound card. Some games run too fast, most run fine. Also using a 13th gen I5-13500 with RTX3070Ti. I had a 9600SE in my Compaq SR1303WM from Walmart back in the day. Also had a Audigy 2 Value with SPDIF out on it, 1 GB memory, and Windows XP. CPU was stock Sempron 3000+ running at 2.0 GHz. Was a good XP rig. Had to be careful with ATI Driver, FSB on CPU was only 333MHz and BIOS was locked. Was my first PC. Hardware shown in the video Reminds me of it. Now I have a more modern XP system. Core 2 Duo Quad 9650 @ 2.98 GHz, 4GB DDR3 1600MHz memory, GTX 750Ti 2GB version, and I think that I have the Audigy 2 Value card in it. It's still using a hard drive. 1TB 2.5" Seagate that I stole out of a external hard drive when they were available at Walmart for 100 USD. Also has a floppy drive and a card reader. Service pack 3 with all of the updates before Microsoft update stopped working. Have a Windows 98SE install disk (bootleg). Wonder what will work with that. Using Windows 11 for everything because it just works as in the modern system I talked about.

@h.b_h.b Год назад

Correctly working Table Fog was introduced in Catalyst 7.11 and above. In w98 Ati Tray Tools can enable Table Fog, but fog is a bit glitchy.

@philscomputerlab Год назад

ATI Tray Tools, okie I will try that under 98 the next time.

@georgez8859 Год назад

Hi Phil I have the GA-k8VM800M setup running windows 98SE and 512 mb ram and a Semprom CPU running with no issues. The Video card is also a Gigabyte Gv-R9600Pro-C3 a Patriot 120GB SSD and IDE to ssd adapter.I did run the windows update main update program and direct x 9. no issues so far. Thank you for the Video and all the testing you do. your videos have helped me a great deal with my setups

@kesierzg Год назад

This was my first GPU and I loved it

@InAndersonWeTrust Год назад

I was totally ??? when you were talking about issues and showed the 775i65G. Good that it ended up being the solution! Mine gives me no issues with the same hardware combo: Audigy 2 ZS and Radeon 9600 Pro (ok, sometimes it's a FX 5500 😐). About the Radeon, it's the most stable card I've used on 98. The driver offers as compatibility options alternate pixel center and disabling DXTC. The former helps with text on NFS High Stakes being clearer and the latter simply stops it from crashing to the desktop when launching the game. But like with any Radeon under 98, there's no table fog support, which makes High Stakes and Le Mans 24 Hours look a bit bland and lifeless. Fog gives them a lot of depth. Support for it appeared later on Windows XP, some time after ATI ceased driver development for Windows 98. Quirks are 640x480 @ 60 Hz inexplicably being displayed as 656x496), some resolutions like 1280x960 and 1600x1200 not being compatible with my display (meanwhile 1080p works perfectly, which it never did with Nvidia) and it sending a 640x480 @ 120 Hz to the TV once the drivers are installed. Thanks to a Vogons user I was able to solve this by setting the refresh rate for every resolution on every color depth after installing the drivers: www.vogons.org/viewtopic.php?p=1127024#p1127024 And here's the Vogons thread with the registry tweak to enable fog on Windows 98. It didn't work for me on said games, but it's worth a try: www.vogons.org/viewtopic.php?p=1057161#p1057161

@philscomputerlab Год назад

Wow great comment, a lot of tips in that one. Do you use modern patch for NFS games?

@InAndersonWeTrust Год назад

@@philscomputerlab No, I tend to avoid third party stuff, but the one for Porsche Unleashed fixes texture corruption and broken animations on CPUs with frequency higher than 2,1 GHz. No need to underclock the cpu like I do.

@maitotechlab9035 Год назад

9600se was my first video card, used it for a long time on winxp. It was a generic card branded as "yuan 9600se"

@stamasd8500 Год назад

My favorite XP gaming system uses the same Asrock motherboard (quickly bought one right after your original video on it, and very glad I did) with a Pentium dual-core 5800 and a Radeon 9800, as well as a X-Fi XtremeMusic card. Works perfectly fine. And you should give X-BTF another try. Yes it starts slow but later it evolves in a very complex game with quite a bit of pew-pew. :) One of my favorite games.

@AladimBR Год назад

As for space shooters, I cannot recommend enough Freespace 1 and 2. They are on GOG (I played the original back in the day) and they are amazing. Good missions, massive capital ships. It impressed me at that time, a real 3d with good graphics considering the hardware available. If you haven’t tried it, I highly recommend them to you.

@mistermudpie Год назад

Absolutely!

@philscomputerlab Год назад

They are on my list of games I want to play in the future, thank you!

@theuglycamel8122 Год назад

Great video as always and keep up with the game reviews, it really adds some depth! I'm running an ATI 9250 pci on a Via BioStar board (266a chipset) running a Socket A Athalon XP. I recently had a very similar experence trying to replace this 9250 with a fx5500 pci. After two days of getting nowhere, I finally had to deem the card defective. The FX seemed to work fine, but artifacted 3d terribly and wouldn't accept updated drivers. On the flip, this 9750 almost installs itself and performs (however slowly) perfectly on default settings. Personally I love Via for the DOS sound compatiblity, but there always seems to be some weird qurik lurking in all these old mobos.

@philscomputerlab Год назад

Thank you! Especially about the game coverage as I really wanted to take more time playing them 😊

@theuglycamel8122 Год назад

@@philscomputerlab You're doing a great job! The "obscure" titles are always a hit especially with a little history seasoned in. Keep on keepin on!

@sebastianebert4295 Год назад

A GPU performing slowly on default settings must be FSAA. I always turned that off. As seen in the video, on higher res and even some low res it badly effects FPS. Yeah those rare gems we see here and there are amazing. Gun Metal looks very very good. Reminds me a bit of Comanche 4, Mech Warrior games and a new adult game where a babe can fly with wings.

@Androx74 Год назад

Nice video. I remember that i have ended the game X beyond the frontier, but it was a long time ago, maybe whan i had the pentium 3 800mhz or when i had the Athlon Xp 1400+ :/, really hard to remember i still have the second episode on my shelf when i take out my win 98 system i will give that a try again :D

@vshade Год назад

I had some overclocked version of this card that I bought in early 2004, it was a bit on the slow side, but I was also way more tolerant of low frame rates back then. Played half life 2 fine at 800x600 and even some need for speed underground 1 and 2.

@JaredWoodruff Год назад

I remember buying this GPU at Aldi back in the day, was so excited to be able to finally play Battlefield 1942 with a decent framerate. Ah the memories!

@raging_beaver Год назад

I remember my 9600 back in the day. Driver issues and crashes were common occurrence so I'm very familiar with this experience.

@shadowopsairman1583 Год назад

9700 pro, no issue

@Petar321_GT Год назад

9600 XT no issue :)

@sebastianebert4295 Год назад

PowerColor ATI 9800 SE 128 MB soft-modded to Pro, no issues, but running Omega Drivers instead of Catalyst, because it's a bit faster. Crashes usually came from Via or ALi chipset drivers I often heard. Well, my cheap Via USB 3.0 PCIe card also crash my newer Win 10 every some months at least or it's not working and needs a restart.

@cee128d Год назад

I had a 9600SE back in the day. I still have a 9600XT that I use in an old Retro PC with an SIS chipset. I gave up on VIA chipset boards during the Socket 462 days as there were just too many hardware conflicts with PCI cards. ISA cards were ok, but PCI cards didn't

@AndrewK2685 Год назад

Hey Phill, excellent video as always!! I believe you need a drivers disk to point the Promise SATA drivers to windows XP installation (F6 button). I haven't tried on XP, but on Windows 7 I need to use the drivers disk for windows to recognise the controller and then the drive

@philscomputerlab Год назад

Yea I tried those. They loaded but still nothing showed up. After 10 or so tries, well I have to move on LOL

@supabass4003 Год назад

I remember this card, ATI released refreshes of the 9600, 9800 and 9000/9200 and they sucked because they had half memory bandwidth.

@DyceFreak Год назад

The 9000 was literally just a re-badged 8500. It doesn't even support DX9.

@sebastianebert4295 Год назад

Similar to the Nvidia GT 1030 DDR4, GT 1010 GDDR5, GT 1010 DDR4 and the minimum 4 reincarnations of the GTX 1050, the 1650, the Super cards (while faster 1060 6 GB exists for many years) and more. They all do the same cheap tricks. It seems there's nearly no development since 2017-2022, but many cards noone really needs to keep the prices for the best cards higher than 1000 bucks and well, those have thermal problems, desolder themselves and stuff, lol.

@supabass4003 Год назад

@@DyceFreak Oh yes I remember this being a major point of contention in the day, the FX5200 was released to combat the lower end Radeons but it had DX9 support yet it could hardly play DX9 games! I dont think the 9000 would fare much better but the 8500 was a good card in its year, the 8500LE I remember was the consumer favourite.

@reidster87 Год назад

In the early 00s, I had a Compaq prebuilt minitower with a MSI/Compaq OEM VIA based motherboard and a Athlon XP 2600+ Thoroughbred B 2.16GHz. Less than a couple years into ownership, I upgraded from the stock GeForce 4 440MX to a Radeon X700 Pro. I had an intermittent issue with the VBIOS not loading on boot, and occasional stutters and lockups. There were also occasional graphical artifacts. I replaced the OEM power supply, but the issues persisted. I tried flashing the motherboard BIOS with that of the equivalent retail MSI model, but I suspect that the stripped down Compaq Phoenix BIOS utilized a lower capacity flash ROM IC. The flash failed and bricked the board, so I was forced to hunt for a new Socket A board after they'd very much gone out of fashion. I ended up with a cheap Foxconn branded board with the SiS 741 chipset and it worked like a dream with the X700 Pro. Video would initialize at every power on, no more stutters or lockups, and the BIOS actually let me configure AGP and chipset properties. I don't know if my issues were down to chipset compatibility, a crippled BIOS, or perhaps it could have been the capacitor plague on the OEM motherboard.

@philscomputerlab Год назад

That's what I do when I run into an issue, swap parts until things work 😄 It's just very time consuming and not everyone has all the parts just lying around...

@lordofhyphens Год назад

A gold standard for space fighter sim is TIE Fighter (which has 2 campaign expansions). X-Wing is older but still quite good (and inspired a series of books by Michael A Stockpile)

@mousegeek Год назад

I've still got that card and a Nvidia 32mb as well as an All-In-Wonder graphics card/TV card.

@mindphaserxy Год назад

I had a 9550 in a Celeron D machine. That was the computer I played World of Warcraft on in 2004 to 2007. Seriously it was WoW 24/7 for a lot of us 😂😂

@jeremygregorio7472 Год назад

VIA motherboards are your problem. VIA chipsets. The chipset drivers would help but there were limits to what they could do

@Alex-ii5pm Год назад

The best space shooter i can recommend is freespace 2, guarantee you will love it. There is an opensource project which makes it better on modern systems

@techniksaal254 Год назад

If my memories don't play any tricks on me I remember when using maiboards with VIA-chipsets in combination with the 9600 I had to set the AGP-Aperture-Soze to 32MB, disalbe AGP Fast Writes. Can't remember if I set AGP-Speeds to 2x though. If you're into spacesims have a look at the Star Wars-series, eg. X-Wing, TIE-Fighter and/or X-Wing Alliance. They're all up on GOG. Also you could be interested in the Freespace-series up on GOG. Finally you might like to have a look for Freelancer which isn't on GOG.

@mashk Год назад

I used to have one of these cards. never had any issues with it, apart from the fact it was weak. still it played far cry well. bought a 9800pro for Doom 3 though

@AtariBorn Год назад

What's up Phil!

@TheVanillatech Год назад

A friend of mine got into PC gaming shortly before the Radeon 9000 series launched. He was a playstation only guy, but a very smart guy that machined air rifle parts and fixed them himself, could take an engine apart and fix it, etc. He saw me playing Screamer Rally one day on my PC and instantly got hooked, so we built him a PC together. The first card he upgraded to, after the initial Geforce 2 GTS I gave him, was a Radeon 9600 Pro. I advised him against it, back then Geforce was king *unless* you wanted to go for the awesome Radeon 9700 Pro, but that was out of his budget. He got the 9600 Pro, was quite happy with it (and I was also impressed with it overall), and he was happily playing through the back catalogue of awesome PC games such as Return To Castle Wolfenstein, Soldier Of Fortune, System Shock 2, Commandos Behind Enemy Lines etc - when suddenly Doom 3 and HalfLife 2 came out, and his Radeon 9600 Pro was instantly upgaded to a 9800 Pro. I took his old 9600 Pro for a 2nd machine I was building out of parts for a different friend, and it lived on for YEARS in that PC, given the only thing he ever really played was Quake III Arena and Total Annihilation. Now I have about six 9600's, from Pro's to some strange variants out of vendor PC's. Handy to keep as backups, and very capable early 2000's retro gaming cards.

@UpLateGeek Год назад

BTW I got around to recapping that S370 board with the ISA slot. At least starting it anyway. My desoldering gun was really struggling with melting the solder. There were a couple of traces running close to the pin on the second cap, and after a few tries to desolder the pin, it tore up the traces. It's easy to see where they go to/from, so it shouldn't be too hard to fix, but I decided to put the board aside until I've got enough time to be more careful.

@kunka592 Год назад

Add some leaded solder to the joint first, let it melt nice and good, but not with too high of a temperature setting. Also, set your de-soldering gun to a lower temperature because even a bit too much heat will cause traces to burn right off. Good luck.

@sebastianebert4295 Год назад

Yeah always add flux and solder before desoldering (it's like 10 x easier and faster then). I like to use an 80 W Weller soldering iron, 50 W isn't enough for big ground contacts. 2x 80 W soldering irons for hard parts. Solder quick and not too hot.

@CaptainShiny5000 Год назад

I actually had that card back in the days. I do remember that I had one PC during that time frame which was quite sensitive in terms of chipset drivers (was an AMD Duron I believe and VIA chipset). 1.17 comes to mind as a version number and it was the only one which would make that PC stable. Not sure if I had the 9600 SE in that PC, though - just something I remembered off the top of my head for some reason.

@jayhollowayii2 5 месяцев назад

Hello followed like your channel I am a computer nerd and I love channels like yours LGR and miketech who look at retro technology 🤓

@dergrunepunkt Год назад

A small correction, the black port gives you not only S-Video but Component and RGB 15Khz output

@philscomputerlab Год назад

RGB also? Like with a Scart adapter?

@JamesSmith-sw3nk Год назад

Good video. Doom 3 is playable on the 9800 pro but not much less in the 9000 series.

@readycheddar Год назад

I had a rage128 (ATi rage fury) in 1999 and I could *never* get fog working in Thief. Even years later when I had a 9700 pro. I don’t know how that worked but lucky you. Also X:BtF is amazing. I still have my joystick on my desk just for that game. These videos make me want to pull some old hardware out of my storage and test if it still works. Thanks, Phil!

@kurthectic2902 Год назад

DAT intro.

@corneliusantonius3108 Год назад

I know them., I bought a whole box of AGP cards and that Radeon card and some equivalents were in it from a thrift store. Made alot of money on it after testing them all in a Pentium 2 system. Onley 12 failed from all the Matrox, Nvidea, ATI Radeon cards. The one Hercules card worked though. There was one other french sounding brand of wich the name I forgot.

@BrianMartin2007 Год назад

nForce chipsets seemed to be better back in the day, as well as Intel chipsets. That being said, VIA was a nice stable budget option but always kind of buggy here or there. ALi was another chipset I had good luck with. the nForce 2/nForce2 Ultra chipsets were completely solid for me personally even when I eventually pushed 2GB out of the max of 3GB on Windows XP, coupled with the Athlon XP 3200+ Barton core (200Mhz FSB) that thing was stupid quick (I started on the Athlon XP 1800+) - had this system right before I jumped to my first Quad Core system. Great Video, thank you! P.S. Also, trying to mix and match drivers. Also, I always install CHIPSET drivers first before anything else, ESPECIALLY on any 9x. That being said, third party drivers may be better (like the custom ones for your sound cards) but I've found them buggy in the past. So I stuck with using official drivers. Also, SDI-Origins, while it has a butt load of drivers, again, I've had stability or slight performance issues. Not with everything or every system mind you. It's particularly weird for Laptops as the track pad could have two possible drivers and loading the incorrect one - while it is functional - you lose some touch gestures, like scrolling, or two finger input for example... or the mouse cursor will ROCKET off the screen... LOL

@66mhzbrain Год назад

Haha, projects that dont go to plan🤔, sounds like the story of my retro life 😁. Interesting to see the 9600se as I'm currently messing around with a 9800se which unless I'm wrong was manufacturers like sapphire and herculese' answer to ati's 9600le? That bit of 'X beyond the frontier' looks suspiciously like the training level in X Wing!

@sebastianebert4295 Год назад

Haha yes, very likely it's mimicking the old X-Wing training level. I tried X3 Albion Prelude. It was a bit flaky, once ran very slow on my mate's 2x4 core Xeon E5 workstation with GTX 960, which put any fastest i7 to shame, but ran very very fluid on my slow Core2Duo E8400 with a slow GT 1030 GDDR5. Well, X3 looks stunning, but it's definitely not for instant action like X-Wing, Tie-Fighter, Comanche, Gun Metal, AOP, AOE, Red Baron, IL-2 1946, LO-MAC, DCS v1 Black Shark, DCS v1 A-10 and such action games.

@IcebergTech Год назад

This card was the first time I ever fell for deceptive marketing. I bought it thinking it was similar to, or better than, a regular 9600. Of course, it was a long way off, and I ended up selling it for a (far superior) 9500 Pro!

@robretro Год назад

I built a PC in late 2001. All bells and whistles; Athlon Thunderbird 1.4 AYHJA stepping, Abit KG-7 RAID mobo, 1GB DDR, but a GeForce 2 Ti, not an ATI. Nothing but driver issues and instabilities under XP (when it eventually came out). Root cause always seemed to be the Creative drivers not playing well between the Via chipset and the Live 5.1 I was using. Windows 2000 behaved much better but wasn't as good for gaming as 98se or XP. I just remember endless bluescreens. I did manage to get it working stable, after pulling it out of storage and giving it another go around 2015, but it was never the gaming monster I wanted it to be.

@gophop Год назад

I have built multiple high-end retro rigs but haven't touched them in years. This makes me want to clear out the workbench. I remember there is a Piii-1.4/GF4-4200, A64-3200+/x800Pro, and I think a P2-450/GF2-MX200.

@philscomputerlab Год назад

Those are excellent parts!

@airmicrobe Год назад

Recently I saw ati 9500 but I didn't buy it because of my two 9550 one of them is xt version. LATER I found the vram position of 9500 is as --- shape not L shape. So I am just happy with my 9550 as same as 9600.