During this discussion with a JW elder he asks me if I was previously a JW. He also says that the dead 144000 are "interacting" with the governing body on earth. Interesting chat!
Amazing work Dawn.. This is the closest I've ever heard a JW come to admitting that the org channels the spirits of the dead.. Sadly, most of them just don't have the ears to hear. Their pride in the org has blinded them.. Many will wake up tho, and you may never know what part you played in that, so don't give up!
You are my amazing 👏 your videos really helped me wake up from the JWs. I was born in the religion and I am still in it unfortunately. I really stood no chance if it wasnt for such videos which point out the logical fallacies and erroneous interpretations. If I could meet you, I would give you a big hug. You are doing lifesaving work by helping people remove these mental shackles.
All of my family and old friends are jws. I left early last year. I had no body. Shunned. I go to a church and have a new spiritual family. It must be so hard to be awake and still in. Praying for you.
You were amazingly patient and restrained with Bill Dawn, something I often fail at when talking to Jehovah’s Witnesses. You articulated your points clearly and respectfully, using appropriate Scriptures, something he often failed to do. I'm praying for him.
@@WitnessForJesus You have made serious efforts to lead this elder to the truth with appropriate Bible texts. In this context, it has become clear that Jehovah's Witnesses are aligned or conditioned to the two-class doctrine. (144,000 compared to the "Great Crowd"). Your reference to the concrete message according to 1 John 5:1 was expedient in this context. At this moment at the latest, the eldest should have fallen into a process of thoughtfulness. For John wrote his letters after he had completed the book of Revelation, that is, at a time when he had already received the visions of the great crowd and recorded them in the form of a letter. If John had seen the great crowd as a second class of Christians who do not belong to the "anointed class," he would not have immortalized his message in this clear and unambiguous formulation in his 1st letter. (1 John 5:1). The application of common sense alone does not permit any other interpretation. In this context, your reference to Proverbs 4:18 was also extremely valuable. The statement of the "light that is getting brighter and brighter" from the time of the Old Covenant is not compatible with the principles of the New Covenant. When I was confronted with this interpretation a few years ago, I was more than astonished. If you are interested, I can provide you with a concise treatise that proves that this teaching of the Watchtower Society is untenable in light of the maxims of the New Covenant.
@@WitnessForJesus A few days ago, I had the opportunity to speak with a Jehovah's Witness about the organization's teaching on the generation of 1914 according to Matthew chapter 24. I would like to inform you of the result, as I am also interested in your opinion. To this end, we have devoted ourselves together to the study of the entire biblical text. After this thorough self-study, I asked my interlocutor the following specific question. What events was Jesus aiming at when He used the term "all things"? We quickly agreed that when Jesus used the term "all things," he essentially had two events in mind. 1) The destruction of the temple in Jerusalem as a symbol of the Old Covenant. 2.) The future parousia or return of Christ. These two events are therefore to be regarded as inalienable cornerstones of this prophecy. The starting point of this prediction is therefore the date of the destruction of the temple, whereby this event demonstrably took place in the year 70 AD. If Jesus had meant by the term "the generation" the usual lifetime of a person of 70 to 80 years, it would have been imperative that the second of these events prophesied by him, namely his promised return, would also have taken place in the 1st century. However, since the second element of his prediction has not yet been fulfilled, the question inevitably arises as to what Jesus had in mind when he used the term "the generation" in this context. However, one thing is obvious. Jesus cannot have had in mind the usual lifetime of a man, otherwise he would have been only an itinerant preacher, but not the Son of God. It is revealing in this context that the Watchtower Society was forced to bury the original teaching with the Watchtower article of November 1, 1995. Rather, the organization had to seek refuge among secular scholars in order to find a Bible-compliant explanation for the term "the generation." The Jehovah's Witness in question was forced to make the following concession in the face of these clear statements in the New Testament. The starting point for this prediction is the date of the destruction of Jerusalem in A.D. 70, not 1914. From this point of view alone, the core doctrine of the organization is untenable. This interpretation assumes a beginning date that is incompatible with the concrete statements of Jesus Christ in this context. (Matthew 24:1-3; 24:34). I would appreciate it if you could occasionally give me your opinion on this subject. Thank you very much..
Wow. All I can say is that I hope he has a good memory and can recall some of the points you made . He sounds elderly and like a very nice gentleman, though misguided. He ended with "hope to see you soon". Yeah, I hope so too, but not where he thinks, at a kingdom hall.
Amen Dawn. You did an amazing job. It's so sad he can't see the logic, facts, and proof from the scriptures you presented. I'm sure you've got him thinking tho.
Dawn, Well done! Your focus on the covenant was a great approach which I will note for any future discussions I have. The last 10 minutes were so powerful He surely will think about what you said regarding mediator and his prayers. I thought your remarks at closing were so appropriate. I know you know all of this that follows, and I realize it was off topic, but I could not help but note that at about 6 minutes in, he casually mentions their teaching about John 5:28,29 that unrighteous will be resurrected not to judgment and condemnation but into Paradise and will enter a massive teaching program. The JWs of today will be their teachers including teachers of the Patriarchs like Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, and there will be this large group of the “unrighteous” of the centuries who supposedly never had the opportunity to know Jehovah’s ways. They will be taught I suppose in Kingdom Halls of the future in some way similar to how JWs are taught today. I mean Jehovah, Jesus and the 144,000 are invisible in heaven but will “communicate” with the teaching ones on earth so it sounds a lot like what they have today but just a modified “channel”. And I know you recognize the important thing about this distorted doctrine, that the unrighteous can gain everlasting life at the end of the 1000 years because of their own demonstrated obedience and righteousness. That is clearly salvation without forgiveness of Jesus Christ but based on their own works. It’s heresy! They use Romans 6:7 as you know, to say that the “unrighteous” paid for their own sin at their death, taking Romans 6 our of context. In contrast to this massive resurrection of unrighteous and perhaps even some wicked ones of the past, Armageddon is another story. All those not JWs at Armageddon will be utterly destroyed and annihilated. Men women and children. No teaching program for them. I think all of this is an “achilles heel” of their teaching because it completely ignores the simple Gospel message of salvation by Grace through Faith in Jesus Christ for forgiveness of sin. Once again, great job at your focused discussion and keeping him on point with powerful use of the scriptures.
You have pointed to an essential heresy of the Watchtower Society. Yesterday I discussed this Bible text according to Romans 6:7 with a Jehovah's Witness who belongs to my circle of relatives. In a first step, I was able to convince the person concerned that all letters of the New Testament are addressed to "anointed" Christians, including the letter to the Romans. (Example: Romans 8:9-14). I then encouraged the person to look at and analyze the text coherently according to chapter 6, based on their own version of the Bible. In this context, he should keep in mind the question of whether Paul addressed this message to living Christians or whether this message is intended for deceased people in general. The Jehovah's Witness in question was most astonished when we examined the Bible text together several times. For the analysis of the biblical text allows only one conclusion. The message is aimed at living people who, from God's point of view, are considered redeemed from their sins through their baptism into the death of Jesus Christ and the associated rebirth during their lifetime. An identical message is also found in the letter of the Apostle Paul to the Ephesians (Ephesians 2:1-10). I recommend that you explore the true message of the biblical text in the same way with a representative of the Watchtower Society. The idiosyncratic interpretation of the Watchtower Society proves that the true meaning of this message was deliberately distorted for ideological reasons. --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Romans 6,1-9 (NWT Study Edition) "1 What are we to say then? Should we continue in sin so that undeserved kindness may increase? 2 Certainly not! Seeing that we died with reference to sin,a how can we keep living any longer in it? 3 Or do you not know t h a t a l l o f u s (note Paul and all the followers of Christ) who were baptized into C h r i s t Jesus w e r e b a p t i z e d i n t o h i s d e a t h? 4 So w e w e r e b u r i e d with him t h r o u g h o u r b a p t i s m into h i s d e a t h, in order that just as Christ was raised up from the dead through the glory of the Father, so we also should walk in a newness of life. 5 If we have become united with him in the likeness of his death, we will certainly also be united with him in the likeness of his resurrection. 6 For we know that our old personality was nailed to the stake along with him in order for our sinful body to be made powerless, so that we should no longer go on being slaves to sin. 7 For the o n e who h a s d i e d has been acquitted from his sin. 8 Moreover, if w e h a v e d i e d w i t h C h r i s t, we believe that we will also live with him. 9 For we know that Christ, now that he has been raised up from the dead, dies no more; death is no longer master over him. 10 For the death that he died, he died with reference to sin once for all time, but the life that he lives, he lives with reference to God. 11 L i k e w i s e y o u , c o n s i d e r y o u r s e l v e s t o b e d e a d with reference to sin but living with reference to God by Christ Jesus.
@@MR-gx3gc Thank you for your comments. I wish my JW contact would be as astonished when I pointed out the context of Romans 6. Their doctrine of persons paying for their own sin is directly opposed to the teaching of scripture and the reason for the coming of Christ. They do not see that. 2Cor. 4:3,4.
@@misterg7179 Thank you for your feedback. Allow me to make the following comment. It is not a question of faith, but of common sense and average intellect, whether one is able to answer the following question in accordance with the concrete biblical text. Therefore, I recommend that you encourage the person concerned to read the entire Chapter 6 coherently, keeping the following question in mind. Did the apostle Paul address this message to living Christians, or is his message intended for deceased people in general? You will find that this method definitely triggers a process of thoughtfulness in the person concerned. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Romans 6,1-9 (NWT Study Edition) "1 What are we to say then? Should we continue in sin so that undeserved kindness may increase? 2 Certainly not! Seeing that we died with reference to sin,a how can we keep living any longer in it? 3 Or do you not know t h a t a l l o f u s (note Paul and all the followers of Christ) who were baptized into C h r i s t Jesus w e r e b a p t i z e d i n t o h i s d e a t h? 4 So w e w e r e b u r i e d with him t h r o u g h o u r b a p t i s m into h i s d e a t h, in order that just as Christ was raised up from the dead through the glory of the Father, so we also should walk in a newness of life. 5 If we have become united with him in the likeness of his death, we will certainly also be united with him in the likeness of his resurrection. 6 For we know that our old personality was nailed to the stake along with him in order for our sinful body to be made powerless, so that we should no longer go on being slaves to sin. 7 For the o n e who h a s d i e d has been acquitted from his sin. 8 Moreover, if w e h a v e d i e d w i t h C h r i s t, we believe that we will also live with him. 9 For we know that Christ, now that he has been raised up from the dead, dies no more; death is no longer master over him. 10 For the death that he died, he died with reference to sin once for all time, but the life that he lives, he lives with reference to God. 11 L i k e w i s e y o u , c o n s i d e r y o u r s e l v e s t o b e d e a d with reference to sin but living with reference to God by Christ Jesus.
@@MR-gx3gc That you again. Your question is a very goodie to extract the context. I will try that approach. One comment I will add and it relates to the scripture I included previously, 2 Cor 4:3,4. Finding the real truth involves some critical thinking but it is not only critical thinking. The JWs I am speaking with are intelligen. They do a lot of research for questions I ask them but they primarily rely on the JW website for their doctrinal positions. So I'm convinced it is not just ability to understand and think clearly about the text . It is spiritual warfare (Eph 6) where minds have been blinded. So I believe prayer is important, asking God to remove scales over their eyes to understand even though they have the capacity to understand. That said, I appreciate your suggestions and will use that approach.
I tend to talk long with JW's too, especially the ones who think they really know their stuff . The elders' scripts may be a bit more detailed and nuanced but after a while they realise how threadbare their theology is, and start faltering, as this guy did here about 1/3 of the way in - and they they start looking for ways out ... "have you ever been a JW".. "why are you so interested in us".. "what organisation are you with" etc etc.. Labeling you as an apostate or an opponent of the organisation is how they reframe the discussion. Their main problem is that they have a really timid and captive audience for their outpourings (ie other JW's) so they have no real world practice at 'contending for the faith'. One day I'll suggest that I'm actually helping them by being robust in my engagement... maybe we should charge them?
I’ve been speaking to a JW on one of Robert’s posts about the new heavens and new earth, and he was saying the same things. After much discussion, I said pretty much what u were saying, that it’s secondary to us as Christians. They’re so focused on the destination and not at all on Jesus
Sadly, that is the point. They don't FOLLOW Jesus, then "emulate" what he already did, passing Him by as though they don't really need Him anymore. When they talk about the "gospel", Jesus is almost never mentioned. The term I hear constantly is, "We try to follow Bible principals". As if the Bible is a set of "suggestions" for moral people to do. Jesus isn't a "Bible principal", as suggested by their terms, he IS the WORD of God, which means the BILBE is ALL about Him.
@@vusimngomezulu2500 I will reply to this once, then I won't respond to you again. JWs do NOT preach the gospel, at all. They/you, preach a kingdom ruled by 144,00 people, and the rest are earth bound without any contact to Jesus or the Father. You have to follow men, who SET THEMSELVES UP as your head. Jesus Christ is NOT preached by JWs. Period. I will not respond to your broken-record rhetoric.
I am going to make it real simple for Bill. He has been a witness for decades. Open to Romans 8:14 For indeed all who are led by the Holy Spirit are indeed God's children. It is just that simple. No need to muddy the waters. Poor old misled elder, it saddens me so deeply.
You shall know them by their fruit/food. Jesus came to free you from men/religion. You have no need of men to speak to The Creator. Where two or three gather in my name I am with you. Relationship with the Truth is the alternative. Living in Spirit. 🙏
Well done. They claim that the Bible is their only authority but cannot show you from the Bible why they believe the things they teach. The bad part of all of this is they are leading people away fro Jesus. Even many that leave this group are so disillusioned they turn their back on Christ.
Awesome jobs as usual. I wish you would had asked him what was Abraham, Isaac, Jacob's hope and if he said earth. I would ask jim about this scripture I tell you, many will come from east and west and recline at table with Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob in the kingdom of heaven, while the sons of the kingdom will be thrown into the outer darkness. In that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.” Matthew 8:11-12
*1Cor. 15:52-Listen, and I will tell you a secret. We shall not all die, but suddenly, in the twinkling of an eye, every one of us will be changed as the trumpet sounds! The trumpet will sound and the dead shall be raised beyond the reach of corruption, and we who are still alive shall suddenly be utterly changed. For this perishable nature of ours must be wrapped in imperishability, these bodies which are mortal must be wrapped in immortality.*
Sounds like spirit mediums are directing the org. The Word of God is sufficient. Amazingly Mislead ! Sad truth to walk blind. Heavy Burden when Jesus said his load is light. 🙏
They do speak to spirt mediums they use children todo it. There is a testimony of a women now that said when she was a child they would go into a room with 4 elders and call upon the spirts. Crazy that is why it’s called a channel😳😬
34:45 the subject is "deep" because he doesn't understand your question and he can't answer it. He can't even understand his own doctrine. You can't get simple answers from any JW regarding salvation. They seriously lack perspective. And his little comment about the postage stamp is facetious. He dug his own hole there.
P AR T II "The light becomes brighter and brighter" in the light of the New Testament" (Proverbs 4:18). Against this background, it can also be explained that all letters of the New Testament without exception originate from the time of the 1st century according to the declared will of God and come mainly from the pen of the apostles or disciples personally chosen by Jesus. It is also worth noting that the gospel, originally preached orally by the apostles, was not written down until it had been fully revealed to them. Therefore, the letter of the Apostle Paul to the Thessalonians is considered the earliest document from the collection of the New Testament. (probably written in the early 50s of the 1st century AD) In view of this theological fact, the Apostle Paul could justifiably call the Gospel he preached "THE WORD OF TRUTH" after his letter to the Colossians. Colossians 1,3-6 (NWT Study Edition) „We always thank God, the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, when we pray for you, 4 since we heard of your faith in Christ Jesus and the love you have for all the holy ones 5 because of t h e h o p e that is being reserved for you in t h e h e a v e n s. You previously heard about this hope through the message of t r u t h of the g o o d n e w s 6 that has come to you. Just as the good news is bearing fruit and increasing in all the world, so it is also doing among you from the day you heard and accurately knew the undeserved kindness of God in truth.“ Since then, no one, not even some anti-Christian popes and cardinals of the Middle Ages, has succeeded in eliminating these original writings, falsifying them or replacing them with their own, power-politically motivated writings. Charles T. Russell claimed in his publications that reading only his scripture studies would enable believers to walk in the light. According to him, however, one would remain in the dark if one only read the Bible. Significantly, the Bible has survived to this day. The 6 scripture studies of Russell have even disappeared from the official libraries of the regional assemblies, although they were distributed worldwide in millions of copies until the 20s of the last century. The Apostle John, who was still alive at the end of the 1st century, left in one of his letters, aware of the finality and immutability of the Gospel, the following urgent exhortation to all true followers of Christ: 1 John 2,24-27 (NWT Study Edition) „As for you, what you have heard from the beginning m u s t r e m a i n i n y o u . If what you have heard from the beginning remains in you, you will also remain in union with the Son and in union with the Father. 25 Furthermore, this is what he himself promised us-the life everlasting. 26 I write you these things about t h o s e who are t r y i n g to m i s l e a d y o u . 27 And as for you, the anointing that you received from himp remains in you, and y o u d o n o t n e e d a n y o n e to be teaching you; but the anointing from him is teaching you about all thingsq and is true and is no lie. Just as it has taught you, remain in union with him.“ In contrast, the history of the Watchtower Society presents itself as a constant aberration regarding the interpretation of end-time prophecies and the establishment of other dogmas, such as the identification of the king of North and South or the definition of the "generation of 1914", the "faithful slave", the "invisible presence of Christ" (originally 1874 was considered the decisive date). In his letter to the Galatians, the apostle Paul, mindful of Jesus' words warning against "false prophets," felt compelled even then to declare "cursed" those who should presume to distort Paul's good news about Jesus. (Galatians 1:6-9). Theoretical considerations aside, it is undeniable that a just God would never allow the representatives appointed by Him on earth to proclaim manifestly false statements in His name. Especially when one considers that missionary work in the name of God should serve to lead disoriented people out of darkness, i.e. uncertainty, into light, i.e. into certainty. But where do you lead people in search of divine truth when the predictions of the end times, presented as certainty, ultimately prove to be a simple error again and again, and the leaders responsible for exegesis and publication evade their responsibilities with a shrugging attitude of indifference? The characteristics of a god with unpredictable and arbitrary emotions and character traits are probably more likely to be found in the Greek mythologies of Homer and Plato. In view of the multitude of failed attempts to interpret elementary prophecy, the question arises as to the reliability of other biblical interpretations, which the organization presents to this day as absolute divine truths, but whose truthfulness cannot be objectively verified. (for example, the establishment of Jesus' kingdom rule in 1914, the appointment of an exclusive "faithful and discreet slave" in 1919, and the rapture of deceased spirit-anointed Christians since 1918). If since 1874 all really verifiable predictions originally presented as biblically unambiguous have remained unfulfilled (1874, 1914, 1925, 1926, 1975 generation of 1914), it is left to the "rational" observer to judge for himself how likely it may be that all other predictions that are not verifiable correspond to biblical or divine truth. Conclusion: The doctrine of the New Light is to be rejected against the background of the statements and associated exhortations in the New Testament.
Well the Apostle Paul would disagree with you. 1 Corinthinans 15 describes the resurrection body as immortal. Christians will receive a BODILY resurrection see Romans 8:11.
P A R T I "The light becomes brighter and brighter" in the light of the New Testament" (Proverbs 4:18). The biblical statement in Proverbs 4:18 that the "light" is getting brighter and brighter is used by the Governing Body to legitimize false teachings and predictions. However, this statement is not theologically applicable, considering how this statement is to be classified chronologically in the development of salvation history. And above all, to whom this statement is to be attributed. Namely, King Solomon, from whose lineage the Messiah would not emerge until a millennium later. When this Messiah, foretold to the Jews, finally appeared, as promised, in the person of Jesus Christ among his countrymen, the Apostle John could rightly testify in his Gospel that through this Jesus Christ "THE TRUTH" and "THE LIGHT" came into the world, while in pre-Christian times the Israelites and the prophets serving among them were to be led to Jesus Christ by the "Law of Moses" as an instrument of an educator. (Galatians 3:23; John 1:17). This fundamental break between the time of the prophets of the Old Covenant and the time after the "great prophet" of Jesus Christ announced by Moses (Deuteronomy 18:15) is also emphasized by Paul in his following letters: 2 Corinthians 3,14-16 (NWT Study Edition) „14 But their minds were dulled. For to this present day, the same veil remains unlifted when the old covenant is read, because it is taken away o n l y by means of C h r i s t. 15 In fact, to this day whenever Moses is read,a a veil lies upon their hearts. 16 But when one t u r n s t o Jehovah (note: greek: „Kyrios“ for Jesus Christ“), the veil is taken away.“ Ephesians 3,4-6 (NWT Study Edition) „4 So when you read this, you can realize my comprehension of the sacred secret of the C h r i s t . 5 In other generations this secret was not made known to the sons of men as it has n o w been revealed to his holy apostles and prophets by spirit, 6 namely, that people of the nations should, in union with Christ Jesus and through the good news, be joint heirs and fellow members of the bodyf and partakers with us of the promise.g Romans 16,25-27 (NWT Study Edition) „Now to Him who can make you firm according to the good news I declare and* the preaching of J e s u s C h r i s t , according to the revelation of the sacred secret that has been kept in silence for long-lasting times 26 but has n o w been made manifest* and has been made known through the prophetic Scriptures among all the nations according to the command of the everlasting God to promote obedience by faith; 27 to God, who alone is wise, be the glory through J e s u s C h r i s t forever. Amen. Colossians 1,25-28 (NWT Study Edition) „I became a minister of this congregation in accord with the stewardship from God that was given to me in your behalf to preach the word of God fully, 26 the s a c r e d s e c r e t that was hidden from the past systems of things and from the past generations. But n o w it has been revealed to his holy ones, 27 to whom God has been pleased to make known among the nations the glorious riches of this sacred secret, which is C h r i s t in union with you, the hope of his glory. 28 He is the one we are proclaiming, admonishing everyone and teaching everyone in all wisdom, so that we may present every person complete in union with C h r i s t.“ Romans 10,1-4 (NWT Study Edition) „1 Brothers, the goodwill of my heart and my supplication to God for them (note: „the natural or native Jews“).are indeed for their salvation. 2 For I bear them witness that they have a zeal for God,b but not according to accurate knowledge. 3 For because of not knowing the righteousness of Godc but seeking to establish their own, they did not subject themselves to the righteousness of God. 4 For C h r i s t is the end of the Law, so that everyone exercising faith may have righteousness. 9 For if you publicly declare with your mouth that J e s u s is L o r d , and exercise faith in your heart that God raised him up from the dead, you will be saved.“ The fact that one dares to quote universally binding statements of a prophet of the Old Covenant in order to disguise one's own exegetical incompetence (doctrines and predictions that are constantly in need of revision) testifies to an absolute lack of discernment and humility, that is, those virtues that the Governing Body postulates as the salient mark of a true disciple of Christ. If the Governing Body refers to the history of the development of Christian doctrine in the 1st century to legitimize its own misinterpretations, it must be borne in mind that Jesus had promised His disciples that they would not be led into the "whole truth" by the Holy Spirit until after His ascension. (John 16:13.) According to this promise, Christian truths were gradually revealed to the apostles after the Christian congregation was organized on the Jewish day of Pentecost. The narratives in the Acts of the Apostles impressively show that any truth recognized by divine inspiration and proclaimed as such (calling to the heavenly class, abolition of circumcision and the Mosaic laws, admission of the Samaritans and later with Cornelius the Gentiles into the New Covenant) did not have to be revised retroactively. In this way, according to the original promise, the Christian brotherhood was led by the apostles of the 1st century in the name of Jesus Christ "directly, i.e. without detours into the whole truth".
It's interesting to see that, as an exJW, you have a stronger faith than ever in God/Jesus and the Bible. So many exJWs become staunch atheists. Often they cite the 'cruel' God of the OT as a reason for their atheism. How would you personally reason with such ones on a God of love in the scriptures often cited as follows: the flood (millions of dead innocent children and animals) ; the Passover (thousands of dead innocent children); the curses at Deut 28:20-68; slaughter of Amalekite women and children (1 Sam 15:2,3); death of David's newborn (2 Sam 12:15,18); the census plague (2 Sam 24:15-17)? I would appreciate your scriptural thoughts on this matter. Regards...
I really don’t want the comments section of this channel to be used for debates on atheism. Here is a link to an article which answers your question. Each example you give would need its own consideration, but this article is pretty thorough. www.gotquestions.org/God-killing.html This article is also relevant. www.gotquestions.org/God-of-the-Old-Testament.html
@@WitnessForJesus Thanks for your quick response and for those articles, which were very interesting to read. I can understand you not wanting to debate atheism in these comments, as such debates tend to go round in circles. But I would be genuinely interested in how you personally would reason scripturally with someone having sincere questions about a God of love, if only in relation to the accounts in Samuel (The Amalekites, David's child, and the census). Regards...
Each instance has it's own reasoning.... For example, David's unborn baby. God is Sovereign and God could see the outcome of that baby's life. For all we know, that child would have grown to be incredibly wicked. I watched a TV show recently wherein the main character had the ability to see into the future. This character ended up being a serial killer because he "saw" who would kill others or otherwise cause terrible harm... so he killed them first. Of course the watching audience would morally side with the serial killer. He knew what would happen so he acted to stop it and only killed wicked people. I don't agree obviously with this man doing this action but..... In terms of God, he knows all things. I do not. Some actions taken were in regard to protecting the line of Jesus, so that the Messiah would come into the world, to save the entire world.
@@WitnessForJesus Thanks for your reply. I guess the question then would be, if God did that re David's newborn son, why did He not do the same with Cain, Manasseh, Ahab, Jezebel, Athaliah etc? Also, I'm just wondering if you had any scriptural thoughts regarding the Amalekites and the census?...
@WitnessForJesus Careful analysis and examination of our scriptural beliefs on the covenants, the Faithful slave and etc. Are fully supported by the scriptures. It seems the friends you call are caught off guard and seem to be in the middle of matters when you contact them. Elders are very very busy and have their minds on much. I know Elders that are very versed in the scriptures and can explain without hesitation our scriptural beliefs.
@WitnessForJesus as an example Romans 8:11 I'd not speaking of a resurrection but of Christian's mortal body being activated to a spiritual level by means of God's spirit. The surrounding verses allude to that. Being dead to a fleshly lifestyle and being made alive spiritually.
Dawn I know you were biting your lip trying not to respond when he said those will come back that never heard the truth. They always go back to their policies , he focused on directing Dawn to her local congregation rather than dealing with scriptures.
@@vusimngomezulu2500 I’m not really sure I understand your question. My comment had to do with the elder referring Dawn to the local Kingdom Hall in her area instead of providing scripture to support his belief of there being a group of Christians that’s not included in the new covenant . There isn’t a church of exjws, that’s an odd thing to say. Reading the Bible and believing what it says is required of all of us. This is all that Dawn , the exJW is showing Bill , the JW. So to address your statement/question, the man told her all religions would be resurrected so apparently he’s the one that believes all “churches “ are Jesus followers, including Hindu, nonbelievers in God etc. However the Bible teaches that there is only one church. Those of us that follow Christ are members of one body. The body of Christ. Christians who believe in the final work of Christ dying for our sins and His resurrection, and have accepted Him as the ONLY Mediator between God and man. This is in the Bible so we should believe it if we are followers of Jesus. (1 Corinthians 12:12-27: 1 Timothy 2:5)
@@adechalus i totally agree they completely ignore Hebrews that says And just as it is appointed for man to die once, and after that comes judgment, Hebrews 9:27 You don't get a second chance at this but they believe you do which is a complete lie
@@Germond82 exactly! and they always come in with their moot points then run away and delete their comment when they cannot respond like @vusi mngomezulu just did …smh
![[AUDIO] Talking with a JW elder PART 3 Things get hairy!](/img/logo.svg){kind=logo}
