BATMAN V SUPERMAN WAS A DISAPPOINTMENT 

For all its faults, this line by Jeremy Irons is golden: "That's how it starts, sir. The fever, the rage, the feeling of powerlessness, that turns good men... cruel."

What baffles me the most is the choice to adapt the dark knight returns as the batmans in-universe debut. TDK is a response to 20 years of silly batman stories, not a start to his character Its like snyder was flipping thru the book, saw batman holding a rifle, killing joker, and punching superman and said "fuck yeah bro this is gonna be my movie"

Feels bad for both of the actors

"This is not a bad performance this is a bad interpretation." That's a great statement.

We needed a solo Batman before they had BVS. A solo Batman movie would’ve explained a lot of the rage Batman had in the BVS movie

Starring Henry Cavill as Mopeyman, Ben Affleck as Captain Murder and Jesse Eisenberg as Heath Ledger.

The biggest problem with Batman in this movie is that much of the development that made Batman go that dark is done off screen. Therefore it is being told to us and not shown. That breaks film rule 101. Show don’t tell!!

I always liked to think that Clark simply never accepted himself as superman and wondered why everyone else did which could partially explain why it doesn't feel like he's the classic superman. It doesn't really work sure, but on paper sounded really intriguing.

i tried watching this movie twice and i fell asleep twice worst part is that both times i woke up, i tried to finish it, and still fell asleep again

Oh man. That's not Luthor. That was The Riddler, hitting his head and having a mental breakdown thinking he's someone else and everyone else played along just for laughs. PS. LOL, I made the comment just before the video points it out.

Yeah the plot fundamentally does not work with how wrong it gets Lex Luthor, wanting to cram in so many different story lines including the death of Superman which obviously should've been used in a later film, and Batman trying to kill Superman does not jibe well when the whole conflict could've been resolved with a single conversation

Imagine if in Civil War, Thanos just rolled up and he was immediately taken care of then and there with the help of Captain Marvel. That is what Batman v Superman did with Doomsday. I've said it before, you said it here, what a waste of all the characters.

I think it would've worked if Batman finds out Martha is Clark's mom's name after he saves her, like if it happened as Vee pitched where Superman could've said "You have to save my mother" and then after the save Batman asks her name to comfort her or something like that and she then reveals "Martha," giving him the same realization the movie was going for

Those who defend Batman using a gun or intentionally killing someone as " him losing his way" are the same who excuse Superman for causing so much destruction and violence because he's " new to being a hero, or just starting out". I mean how much heroing does it take to realize that humans are mortal and you should probably take the fight away to less populated areas. Look Snyder has his fans. But they don't get the ideas behind these heros, what they stand for , Its like any history longer than 10 yrs is ago is too dated. B oth characters have been around for 85 yrs. Many of us fans love that history. But to Snyder in a world where Gods walk amoung us, aliens everywhere, super powered individuals exist, that for Snyder the hardest part for him to accept is that heros can be morally pure, and not psychologically damaged and morally ambiguous.

The problem that DC has had. Is trying to catch up to Marvel's cinematic success out the gate. Every Dc movie has been rushed and poorly executed. And don't get me started on the horrible casting choices for certain characters. But i would have to strongly agree with you. The fact that someone thought it would be cool to have batman kill. Especially using guns don't know the essence of Batman. Furthermore they don't understand Superman either. They made metropolis as dark as gotham. Then they shoe horned in Wonder women and Doomsday. This was a train wreck..smh

*16-year-old me will never forget how massively disappointed I was when I saw this movie. This was supposed to be the epic showdown of the century between two of the most iconic superheroes of all time but what do we get instead? A 2 1/2 hour contrived sloppy confusing mess of a movie that was just a pile of nonsense, full of character butchering, creating tons of plot holes, having so many infamously stupid scenes, very pitiful villains and it’s very clear that they combine so many classic comic book storylines into one movie which doesn’t work at all. The only saving graces of this movie was the badass warehouse fight sequence and the introduction of Gal Gadot’s Wonder Woman, which gave me goosebumps.*

Ben Affleck deserved a solo Batman movie. Too bas his Batflick fell through.

<a href="#" class="seekto" data-time="957">15:57</a> killing Tchalla was the worse decision marvel could’ve done

It should be called, "Batman & Superman"

I remember mostly liking the movie and really hating the dude that did Lex, but, it could have been as good as it’s animated counterpart, shameful we missed out on such a spectacle.

Also I hate that Luthor created Doomsday. Take so much from Doomsday, on top of that, dude he is more like Bizarro....

So according to you thus movie was a disappointment but the 90s show wasn't?😂😂😂😂

Sure Batman did used guns during the 40s 50s or even in Todd McFarlane Year 2 Batman comic story but I do feel like Thomas Wayne Batman from the Flashpoint storyline is the only Batman who uses guns and being way more aggressive than his own son IMO.

Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice was my second theatrical movie that truly disappointed me. My first one was Terminator: Genisys.

Honestly, I’m still not sure if Jesse Eisenberg is playing Edward Nigma or if he was saying hey Zack you should’ve cast me as the Joker! But as horrible as this was it’s still Zach Snyder and the writing that did this. And if you read what his plan was it was going to get worse. And the biggest culprit is the WB itself they wanted the MCU but they wanted it yesterday and were unwilling to do the work. Batman vs Superman should have been two heroes that fight on the same side but from different angles and it should have ended with the forging of the World’s Finest and the friendship that brings out the best in both. It also becomes, in my opinion, the driving force behind the formation of the Justice League.

Having a Batman 20 years in was a dumb decision in my opinion.

Batman V Superman wasn't nearly as disappointing as the realization that it wasn't even the most faithful adaptation of The Dark Knight Returns released that year (2016). "You cost me hours of work last night." "Then I'll get right to it. You have to go back into retirement. You're upsetting too many people." "Mhm." "Why do you always have to be like this? You played right into their hands the last time. When the parents groups and the subcommittees came after us, YOU were the one they pointed to! You act like a Criminal!" "We are criminals, Clark. We always have been. You're still one, too. Only difference is that you have a boss--" "And you answer to no one."

BVS was the first Batman movie ever where I felt like walking out of the theater halfway through the movie and Jesse Eisenberg made it unbearable.

The death of Superman was rushed and didn't left a impact, lex luthor is a cartoon, Batman was a murderer, wonder woman has no reason to be in this movie, doomsday was unnecessary, the fight was forgettable, Clark wasn't developed, Lois was boring, the justice league set up is forced, how did lex discovered Superman can't see through led and discovered other meta humans? And how did he know Superman and Batman secret identities? You got a three hour movie and you couldn't even do that right... This movie is a mess with and without the extended cut

Ben Affleck is the only live action Bruce Wayne/Batman I have ever liked - and he was given THE WORST material to work with. I wish Ben had gotten a fair chance FAR from Zack Snyder.

the ultimate cut of this movie is way better then the theocratical cut in my opinion.

I remember being hyped too Vee…….until I read that it would be a sequel to Man of Steel, and made by the same man……..thanks Zack 😒

The argument that the Martha scene is about Batman seeing Superman as a human being for the first time would have held a lot more weight in a movie where Batman had sworn to never kill human beings. The notion that he was willing to kill an alien to protect humans is a theme that could be cleverly worked with (and in the comics Superman and Batman both often kill tons of aliens and it's often not remarked on, though this is probably just bad writing). But as you said, this movie is entirely squandered.

I don’t know but i loved this version of batman..the way he fights especially the warehouse scene where he takes on 5-6 goons at once seems so believeable because ben aflecks size..and the batsuit was more accurate to the comic than any other batman movie so far..

The first time I watched this movie was in the cinema, and I loved it (not so much now since I find the theatrical cut to be unwatchable, after watching the ultimate edition) because it was the first live action movie with the DC trinity in it. Batman killing never bothered me because I'd already seen him kill plenty of people in the comics and the movies, both intentionally and unintentionally, so it was nothing new to me. I also liked this Batman's character arc in finding faith in humanity again through Superman. Henry Cavil is literally perfect casting as Superman, it's criminal that he was fired (especially in the way he was fired). His brooding never bothered me either because it made sense on why he was (if the world was questioning my every move, I'd be brooding too 😂). I still think this movie has Gal Gadot's best performance as Wonder Woman even though she has the fewest scenes in this one. I like Jesse Eisenberg. I don't care what role he plays (he could play Martian Manhunter and I'd still like it 🤣).

This movie could have turned Scoot McCnairy into Metallo but it doesn’t do that. Instead he is also thrown away as quickly as he was introduced.

Atleast the title isn't as bad as it's original ones, which were "Son of Sun" and "Knight of Night"

You made a great point about Superman seeming to shrug off death. Like thats the worst it can get and he came back from it. What conflict can he come across that is worse than death?

That's why I could never be a Snyder fan, even though I love Henry as Superman this movie was rushed, I was angry that they skipped Man of Steel 2 and went right into this, it was probably not Snyder's idea but the execs at WB. This movie is the reason they had to restart fresh without Henry, he had the worst Lex and Doomsday.

To me the most uncharacteristic thing that Bats did in that film was branding the inmates knowing they were getting beaten to death because of it. So like what, he doesn't kill but endorses it?

Maybe giving Batman a higher killcount than Michael Myers was a bad idea 😂

Interesting theory about the lex Luther portrayal: one of the things that obviously don't anchors this film is that it's still trying to carry plot points from the earlier drafts of a Batman versus Superman movie. And in all of those movies, except for this one it was always Alexa Luther teaming up with the joker against Batman and Superman. My theory is that they stupidly basically combined the lex luthor and joker characters together, which explains a lot of this versions Lex luthor's behavior.

I think the entire movie would’ve increased in quality by 50% if they would’ve just shown how and why Bruce lost his way, like Vee said his first reaction about “even if there’s a 1% chance” would never be Batman’s first thought/reaction so in the case for this movie we never got to see it, Snyder hints towards it with the beat up Robin suit and seeing why Batman has this strong held conviction about not even giving supes a chance because he sees the power he holds and he knows supes could take everyone/everything left in Bruce’s life and we never fully understand why he has 0 room to even hear supes out. It’s just “I’m gunna kill him” from start up until very end.

Ty vee! I’ve been trying to tell people that the Martha part is not really dumb! It’s a good scene that brings batmans humanity back and makes him realize that he and Superman are not so much different! Batman realizes Superman is like a human!

My main issue with this movie is that it has no idea what it wants to be. It can’t decide if it wants to be a sequel to Man of Steel, a reintroduction to Batman, a Batman and Superman team-up, or a set-up to a Justice League movie (any one of these ideas are fine, but pick one or the other).

Only positive things are Alfred and Wonder Woman. The rest was terribly mishandled.

To be fair, the premise of The Dark Knight Returns is that Batman did go off the deep end. He shoots a thug with a gun in a sudden black-and-white color shift and jokes to the reader that he's using "rubber bullets, honest" in his tank. That was Frank Miller teasing about Batman's no-kill rule and mocking DC's censorship.

Definitely agree. It didn't help that Affleck gave a good performance in such a messy movie

Your Lex Luther rant made my day! Literal tears at Zoey Deschanel! Thank Zod the Snuder-verse is almost over. Please come through James Gunn! But since he called The Flash one of the best comic book movies ever, I'm a little worried.

Currently working on a Snyderverse films in chronological order video. Starting by watching Wonder woman , then WW84, man of steel, bvs ultimate edition, Suicide Squad, Sndyercut JL, Auquaman, Shazam, Birds of Prey, Shazam 2, The Suicide Squad, Peacemaker, Black Adam, finishing with the Flash in this particular order for Canon. I have to say personally if you ever watch these films again if you see them in this order, IN THIS PARTICULAR Order and you take if for a DC Universe series and not individual films but more of miniseries it actually really all works. I would also go on a limb and say I can accept Lex Luthors character being the way he is up to the moment he essentially learns the secrets of the universe in BVS and flips a switch and shaves his head and gets very serious at the end of the film because we see a development in his seriousness and cunning when he reveals Batmans Identity to Deathstroke in the Snydercut (which in a sequel film mayber JL2 would also show how Lex found out who both Batman & Superman were because like you said is a huge deal). I would also say like Zac Snyder did in his film having chapter cards if you watch the films as chapters it is enjoyable and does not feel rushed it really shows that there was a vision a huge overarching story and one that could have paid off in time but money, corporate inference, and personal tragedy robbed of alot of cool moments. Also really quick I'm a huge Batman fan but still personally didn't feel he needed a film because there have been so many and I can understand the correct and enjoying the different versions of him in media and could get on board with his particular 20 year in it Batman needed to be dirty and had been through so much that so much more tragedy in his life ala losing Robin could have just changed perspective for Batfleck making him colder and darker because by the time we get to Knightmare World in the JL Snydercut he tells Joker his will kill him and swears to Harley by it, because this batman is at the end of it all he cant keep up he is broken mentally and physically. Thank you for my Ted talk! Haha

Every video is a BANGER! Popcorn alert, I've waited SO long for this.

It’s like I said in another Batman video this was the first time I realize their mothers were both named Martha lol

batman used guns and killed ppl (how do u mess up the simple no kill rule) and another flaw was he wasn’t a detective all he did was hack a computer the movie made him a lazy detective

Awesome video as always Vee! For the Martha moment, I think many people still misunderstand it! No flex I SWEAR, but I understood it back in the day when first saw it at 19 on opening weekend DESPITE seeing the problems as they occurred and registering the movie to be bad! Sups doesn't call his mom Martha in some ploy to trick Bats, the writers weren't being lazy/ thinking they r beyond smart or something like that. We had a scene prior where Sups basically talked to his Ma and even his ghost pa about not belonging and such. Doing the best you can and blah. Sups didn't feel human/ a good person or whateva. So when he says save Martha it's because he doesn't feel right saying she is his mom anymore. That's how low he felt. It inadvertently SAVED his life. Not him godhood but he humanity! B and S both have mommy's. Both named Martha. It's beautiful and hella gay ❤️❤️❤️ Execute pretty meh but still, sexy! Me like :) Edit I sleepy got wake up morning go work earn money

Would've worked if it was based off the 3 part World's finest episodes from Superman TAS, and had elements of the Public Enemies story. And also if anyone but Zack Snyder had directed.

I'll be honest, I really like this movie. The visuals, the music, the cinematography with each frame looking like a painting, it's a real treat just from that viewpoint. Everything else is lackluster at best. I understand what Snyder's vision was, and on paper it's actually pretty good. But the execution is so poor. And most of the defences I've seen in favour of the Snyderverse feel like poor attempts at jumping the gun or overexplaining something like an English teacher, making sonething out of nothing.

"And right now, I'm going to share why with all of yo-" AD TIME God I just "love" youtube's ad placements. It's always so abrupt and intrusive.

It's WB's fault tbh The original plan was Man of Steel 2 with Braniac and possibly introducing supergirl as an explanation for the open pod for MOS But not good enough, WB wants to use the big names for more money

I tried watching this so many times. I either fell asleep or was just completely lost; my Husband hates answering questions during a Movie but I had to ask! It’s so much going on. I thought there would be a Part 2; or it would Transition into something similar to the “Marvel Universe” I get it’s not Marvel but it seems so RUSHED none of the Movies together make any sense by the time Justice League comes!

Zack wanted to call it Dawn of Justice but studio forced him to add Batman v Superman in front

I almost walked out of the theater on opening day by the third act and I only recently tried to give it another chance, but couldn't get through the first act.

A movie that has both Batman and Superman in the title should have made over a billion dollars, and the fact that it didn’t shows how bad Zack Snyder was at the dceu, even if some movies were good

I really like the ultimate edition and I still enjoy this movie

<a href="#" class="seekto" data-time="569">9:29</a> The moment I unexpectedly laughed my ass off

<a href="#" class="seekto" data-time="383">6:23</a> Alfred: That’s not how math works. 😂😂😂

the way batman was written in this movie was more like the way cadmus should be written

James Gunn is going to FIX it.

With the Batman not picking up a gun argument Keaton and bale had guns on their respective vehicles. A gun is a weapon and a tool. Almost like a sword. I believe if a character can overcome a tool that haunts and has impacted every aspect of his or hers life….. that’s character growth both forwards or backwards. The reason your superhero’s don’t use guns is because for a majority of the time…. These characters and media are for children and imagery of guns and using guns is akin to smoking. Or that’s how corporations see it. It’s a fantasy…. Zack Snyder never had Superman hold or use a gun because there’s no story or purpose…. But with Batman….. there’s something you could explore like comic artist did back then. Cough cough How a former robin became a mercenary known for using guns

What about Frank Miller's dark Knight. He uses a gun in several of frank miller's issues

Definitely an understatement

That lex luther performance could have been in the remake of charlie and the chocolate factory and it would work seamlessly

Every time I see those bad guys in the dream sequence run up to Batman and pose with their guns, not fire, and just wait to get hit, I just fucking laugh. It’s so dumb.

This was a very thorough review and I really enjoyed it

Jessie eisenberg is a terrible lex

I feel like I’ve seen this video before

I could never see a Legion Of Doom behind a short Lex Luthor like Jesse's lol.

Yes, it was. But I will defend the "Martha" scene to death. I maintain that was a great scene. Same as the Zod neck snap from MoS. People hate it, I think its like the only good scene from the movie. Zack Snyder is such a strange director.

I still think the argument that Keaton's Batman is excused for killing because of when the films were made is disingenuous. If you want to adamantly follow the Batman rule of no killing then it should apply to all Batman iterations made after the rule was established.

I liked the Ultimate Edition.

I don't see how it was a disappointment, there was no reason to have any kinds of expectations high enough

It was the beginning of the end they should've just done a Man of steel 2 or Ben Affleck solo Batman film and build him up but WB tried to rush and catch up to Marvel and now its dead.

Imagine a Batman movie where he accidentally kills someone cause he used a bit to much force or you know accidents happen then has to deal with the self inflicted trauma that he just broke his own rule. That could be a cool take maybe but just throwing a gun into Bruce's hand and saying "he lost his way" is just anticlimactic. Plenty of different ways to kill without using a gun. If you want to tell a story of Batman "losing his way" which I already think would fail tbh. At the very least do it subtly and more realistically lol who knows maybe it could be done well. But this way is just shit we don't see the transition the believe.

What stings the most for me is that i see what Snyder saw with this batman. A character who was so pissed off and done with the world's BS he was about to break his own rule. But snyder didn't need to put batman killing to achieve this effect, just the marking of criminals, the way he fights and talk about crime was enough to make us realize that, and him rationalizing that superman wasn't a human just a monster was the perfect setup for the whole "but what if he is put in a situation where his rule is about to be broken?", that would make his reaction to superman calling his own mother martha more impactful because at that moment bruce on his haste to kill the threat and break his rule would make him turn into the very thing that he swore once to fight against, and the reaction upon realizing that being quite understandable, "wait, what the fuck you have a mother? and her name is martha?! what was i doing?!". That would made this version of batman my fav. Fuck i hate the many lost potentials with snyder's films

I think what really made the MCU work was that before we threw the heroes together as the Avengers was that we got two Iron Man movies, a Hulk movie, a Thor movie, and a Captain America movie. Yeah we could say that those heroes were not as well known at the time as many of the DC heroes, but those movies not only introduced the characters, they showed how those characters fit into the world and how the world was shaped by the presence of heroes. Another problem I think was that the MCU has an extremely cohesive narrative, but with the DCEU once Zack Snyder left (thorough no fault of his own), the cohesive narrative fell apart, yeah we have a shared cast, but the movies didn’t feel like they all fit into the same universe like the MCU movies did.

Watchmen and BVS made me get invested in comics and whole bunch of DC stuff. Began to buy a bunch, and I not done that since like 20 years ago

Again I have to say that originally Batman did kill and did carry a gun. He stopped early on but still you could have mentioned it. Other than that- awesome video!

Yea, Aflleck's Bruce Wayne just run into falling building debris. And shows up as Bruce Wayne, not Batman trying to kill them all in his Bat?

Yea i really forgot they fumbled the bag on this one.

The extended cut was better Movie Needed a faster pace . More action scenes Two more fight scenes between Batman and Superman. One wear Batman isn’t prepared similar to justice leagie war Bizzaro should have been the villain. Lex should have been more of a force.

<a href="#" class="seekto" data-time="279">4:39</a> you cant excuse one irritation of Batman and not the other...

'member when the movie I am Legend leaked that the studio was planning this movie nearly a decade before its release?

I enjoyed it. The fight is great. All the killing is realistic because... come on. Only in comics superpowered beings managed to pull zero casualties on their war on crime activity I don't mind that Luthor too. Need a crazy evil genius to scheme all of that. Genius with something wrong in his mind. What i don't like is why Luthor want Superman and Batman to fight. Need some clearer reasons. Yes everything is rushed. This movie should focus on why Superman need to fight Batman, vice versa, and how Luthor orchestrate that. Then maybe introduce Wonder Woman to end their fight, expose Luthor evil scheme. Not just some "Marthaaaa" Wtf. With that DC is set to Superman is Dead story for the third Superman movie. Movie on how a more "mature", bald Luthor research everything about Kryptonian so he know ways to kill them, hence he "create" or summons Doomsday on earth. This way DC can introduce more superheroes to help Superman fight Doomsday. That triggering events for Justice League movie. Movie about how the rest of superheroes try to resurrect Superman to save the earth once more, because only he can.

Guess im in the minority here that even tho theres alot going on in BvS, its still one of my favorite DC films. I just knew all the references and it wasnt hard to put together what they were doing. I still love it.

I personally wasn't disappointed in this movie, after that POS movie Man of Steel and the trailer looked horrible so I had extremely low expectations and it was just as horrible as I thought it would be.

Solidarity Vee- completely in alignment with all you said, especially your Lex rant-- what a- for want of a better term- interesting choices made!

At first watching I was not too impressed...but, after a period I watched it again and I really liked it...The one thing I could not stand however was the over acting of Lex Luther by J Ess, It was as though he had watched Heath Ledger getting critical acclaim for Joker and said "Hold my beer"...

The only good thing I can say about this movie is at least it's not Suicide Squad (2016)

I only saw the director's cut and still disliked it

Superman :TAS 3 parter episode " World's Finest" & multi-episodes of The Batman series, id watch those over Batman V. Superman by far.

@ Vee Infuso: Thank you! Im glad someone other than me has common sense. Aflleck's was suffering from paranoia, reacting what he thinks was a dream,etc Batman doesnt react so naive & neclect nor rush to conclusions. Omg, more like Mad Hatter than Lex dude. He was having more interacting with Bruce Wayne/Batman than Superman