Should have pitched your vocals down two steps. Get that supabass in your vox tone to match the bullish synth. But a clever little rap, like you had some good tea and some toast for breakfast and you played around with writing a little rap, and were surprised at all the little clever things you could say, so you said fux it, and rolled with it. You keep doing you. Honestly the whole music channel thing, and specifically the synth channel thing is really stale by this point. If I'm interested in a synth, I'll just cue up all the videos from all the same channels, and just play them all at once. Might as well. Create some interest at least trying to follow each narrative amongst the cacophony. Anybody remember what RU-vid used to be like, less hierarchical, more amateurish, unique, more diverse, inspired, those were the days, golden days, when someone made a video because they had something to say, or show or were invested in an idea or topic... not because the algo demanded 2 videos per week or you get flushed into the long tail never to be discovered by a recommended video or even a very specific search. F YT. They've enabled such an enourmous information transfer, more impactful than the global university system... but then they had to go all one world order, and turn channels into unpaid tv shows, with a weekly time slot, and boring predictable programming. I was so happy to see the TV era come to an end, and people discovered they could find endless information on uniquely personal topics of their interest... and then YT tightened the noose, cut pay, cut all the diverse channels, made them undiscoverable, and left us with 10 channels per topic, channels that had to heavily invest in sustaining their weekly viewership, so all their videos had to become 15 minute infomercials for the various brands serving each little niche. Gone are the days of "This synthesizer SUX! Why would they put all these tiny little knobs on this tiny little synth that you can't even turn to achieve a desired sound, and without messing up surrounding knobs... who is this synth for, faeries, elves?" And now we get subtle aphorisms that if you're not GASed up too bad, you can deduce the reviewer thinks an element of or the whole product itself sux, but really, almost everybody glosses it, and decides not to pick up on the subtext and so every product from every manufacturer is just great, totally worth the one grand, two grand, three grand they're asking.... Whoa, I'm really turning into a grumpy old man, totally slipped into a rant there. Losing control, man. Anyway, Starsky, anything to invest your channel with YOUR character, your HONEST opinion, I'm down for. I really do appreciate your channel, I remember the Moog v. Model D days when you were just someone with something to say, to show, and you've come a long way, and good for you, but every video a commercial... stuff it man.
@@alphanumeric1529 it’s a VERY good point. Negativity brings all sorts of sh!t down on you. When I said I wasn’t 100% with the OBX8 I got so much grief (even though I’d bought the thing, and was overall positive - I just didn’t like the Page 2 menus!!!)… If you watch others there are some negatives but not going into detail and now I completely understand why. It’s a drain on your psyche. But if you watch my Osmose review, for example, I spend a while while going into the reasons the software isn’t up to scratch - others gloss over it, maybe a sentence or a flippant comment. I demo’d why the Pro-800 and Monopoly weren’t up to scratch, and the PolyD having a -18dB level, for example. But overkill I’ve learned to only demo stuff I think is of interest. If I don’t like it or think it’s not very good I won’t record anything, even if I’ve spent a few days trying to understand it and use it in tracks eg . My sanity is worth more than the hail of abuse you get for not liking something (even if doing it in a constructive way). People spend a lot of money on this stuff and don’t want to hear they made a bad decision. The Toro is interesting because of the question ’why?’ - why this and not a model D or Pro-1? I hope I’ve answered that here - if you want complexity don’t buy it - if you want simplicity it’s perfect. People are too keen to try to destroy opinions or bully you into submission. It’s a whole lot dirtier than when I started 8 years ago. I have to take much more care, and so does everyone else. It’s a shame but I don’t blame anyone for the gloss. Unfortunately we have to read between the lines.
No doubt for some there is real value in just wanting a fairly straightforward "bass" sound with maybe a wee bit o' twiddling with no extra muss and fuss. Being able to do more is not always necessarily a good thing; sometimes simplicity is just the ticket.
@@Sharon-music I was trying to be a "nice" person, but hitting one of 3 buttons (plus glide and decay on/off) does NOT make up for how limited it is, how wonky using the amp EG on the filter is, and especially not for having ANY phasing in a bass patch. They will sell a TON of them and many/most will be happy with the relatively few good sounds they get which it does have and never care what an inherently poor voice architecture this is if looking specifically for bass patches. Hades is almost as easy to use and a VASTLY better bass synth. (Given the amount of time spent with any synth a lousy $100 more is worth every penny IMHO) Cat is actually $50 less and is also a VASTLY better as a bass synth, but NOT particularly easy to use.
OOOOOMPF! Mine is waiting for me at home after my business trip!!! So happy to see this review, before I go home on Thursday! Can't wait to noodle with mine now!👊👊👊
I agree from a synth player or midi programming point of view. But as mentioned in the review, the original (combined with pedals) was aimed at people playing instruments and requiring some additional bass. In this regard, quick access to three or four presets and being light on the slider and nob front makes for a safer on stage playing experience.
ten years ago when i first started i bought a volca bass and a microbrute, for the price of either now i could get a moog clone, that is just so insane
it does one thing, but nothing else can do that one thing. i'm talking, of course, about the original T1's, a set of which i am a very lucky owner, but i also have the minitaur, AND i plan on picking this up. maybe i'll hook them all up at once and do a remake of Big Bottom. great video! you pushed the sound design options further than we normally get to see, and your rap wasn't crap
Great review Starsky! I’ve just recently upgraded some equipment in my setup, including a set of Crumar Mojo Pedals, so since Sweetwater was out of stock for the Moog Minotaur, I took a chance on my first Behringer synth and picked up a Toro, and actually received a discount on the Toro as well. Being a HUGE Rush and Genesis fan, and NOT having a huge wallet, I now have a ‘fake’ Moog Taurus, and for live playing, one cannot tell the difference! I absolutely love it!
As someone who's favourite Rush album was A Farewell To Kings, this is heaven. I can see loads of Prog fans going for this - I have bought loads of Taurus style plug-ins over the years.
The original point of the Taurus was attached to foot pedals, and big buttons that you could change with your feet. Seems to lose some of the functionality in this small format, more a limited minimoog lite module.
FYI, this thing happens to fit perfectly on Studio Logic mp-113 foot pedals. I throw on a bass guitar and can can easily pretend I'm a low, low rent copy of Geddy Lee playing his Taurus pedals. Good fun.
Different user interface, different filter envelope behaviour and probably more importantly, nostalgia value for people who've heard a lot of music featuring a Taurus. I have a Model D (Boog), and I'm not that enthusiastic about it. I like the Pro-1 more, probably because of the music I remember hearing played on one. I'm enjoying the Toro more than the Model D, so far. It's odd, because I normally go for synths with as many features as possible, but i also like instruments that really only do one sound and have very few options - flute, clarinet, sax, bass guitar, and so on. The Toro has kind of that feel to it. It does one thing well, with some deviations and opportunities for getting it wrong, and that's pretty much all.
It seems filter envelope behaviour follows the Moog Taurus 1 and 3. I own the latter so I can't compare the Toro to the Taurus 1. The Taurus 1 and 3 filter envelope is a pulse signal, which is great for simulating the timbre of a plucked string. Adjusting the filter envelope attck time slows the rise time of the pulse, but it also limits how far the pulse rises. This means that for a given filter envelope amount setting, as the attack time increases, the perceives envelope amount decreases. I guess the average target customer is a progrock fan looking for a Taurus 1, so it's not its limitations that matter but its sound, especially the low end, and its behaviour.
Great demo as always Cheers 👏🔥 Personally I really enjoy its simplicity. The tones are just there 👌 Stacks up perfectly with my Moog Minitaur. Compliment eachother perfectly. Like you say the form factor is really nice too. Was never into Behringer earlier but this one is a keeper for me and make look Behringer way. Even if I agree they did loopop and you crazy wrong here? Enough said about that already. Onwards and upwards. Was waiting for your demo to learn if it really is as simple as I found myself. You confirmed this so I know it is not my unit. Then again simplicity and killer tone just available is a beauty isn’t it? ⚡🔥 Appreciate the demo and hope you do not have to waste time on silly maketers or politics going forward. You and loopop make superior demos and merely want to say thank you to the both of you 🔥🔥
its guaranteed to drop its price within 6 months. I think itll be selling for 60% of its current price in no time. It misses the vital bit. The pedals.
Wowsa! I like the wasp for deep gritty bass, but it is bad for losing the bass where this isn’t. Maybe not a popular opinion, but I would use this more than my Boog D. Thank you.
I feel you may be confusing cancel culture with people having opinions. It would be a shame if people all got branded into one easy to manage group for having an opinion. Cancel culture for instance is usually aligned with cultural movements and or political leanings. This subject is neither.
Thank's, I've got my eye on 2 for sale now. As a guitarist inspired by The Police, Rush and Genesis I look forward to connecting my Roland Pk5 pedals into one of these very soon.
I will never look at resonance the same since playing an Oberheim… once you’ve had usable full range of resonance , all those filters that whistle just don’t satisfy. It’s like FM, leave it on 1 or turn it off.
Not really sure where the Toro fits into a contemporary music niche... the original Moog Taurus was marketed to people who were used to playing the organ, hence the footpedals. I already own a Model D, and even though I do hear a subtle tonal difference, I'm not compelled to buy one of these at all. Yes it does sound great, but is that enough in 2023?
I think this one’s definitely for a specific task. Reading the comments from people who are into the original bands I can see where it fits in. For me not so much, but I get why it works for others.
I got one and sent it back. It sounds great but there were too many things that didn't really do anything worthwhile, it's too simple for it's size when real estate in most studios is at a premium. The volume swings when using resonance means its going to be a pig recording or playing live and the overall build quality didn't seem that great. This is for retro heads only.
Thought on the original you step on a footswitch and get that note of bass, like first footswitch is the one of the scale, the second the second, the third the third, the fourth the fourth, or maybe a pentatonic scale? Did I completely imagine that? Or is this a Mambutu effect type of thing and I have memories from a different timeline?
I wasn't aware of it before I started watching Toro reviews and comparisons with the Taurus, but it seems they mostly used a one octave range chromatic pedal set. The Taurus had foot pedal switches, like a stomp box on/off switch, for the presets... and maybe the octave button. It also had big faders for the volume and filter cut off, where the Toro has knobs, and those two faders could also be worked with the feet. I've been meaning to wire up an expression pedal adapter, to use it as the filter cut off control, powered by a USB power bank. I made a mod wheel box like that a while ago.
As far as I know, the main benefit of the original is that once you set the beat amount, it remained the same throughout the pitch range. Volt/octave synths like a Minimoog are a pain for bass since they will double or halve the beating when you go up or down an octave. Very important feature for a bass synth to remain constant. Does this do the same?
@@StarskyCarr I suppose I'll stick to the D then.. Thanks for saving me some bones on this awesome (but for me redundant) synth! I have too many synths as it is.. lol. Many of which I've only begun to explore. Recently I've picked up daily music production again and the temptation is to just keep on buying stuff, and especially legendary synths like the Taurus are tempting.
@@Jobotubular Right that's a good point. Can you overwrite all the presets with your own creations though? And I think this is such a simple synth that's it's almost as fast to just dial in the sound you want. :)
@@StarskyCarr I like judging! I judge everything and everyone - sometimes I express my judgements (when it makes people happy, or it's constructive). In this case, I liked the rap and since I am a hip hop producer I know that more effort (thought and feeling) went into this than just finding words that rhyme! Can't fool me, young man!
@18:56 it wasn't until you got to the arpeggiator that i could really appreciate this synth...it's almost like i'm listening to my Juno-6...it's that good...
I remember a mate of mine bought a set of Moog Taurus foot pedals from a junk shop in Manchester in '92 for £150 We were all 303s and acid at the time. We laughed at this set of 'organ pedals'... Then we plugged it in... the bass O.. M... G... THE BASS!
Eh.... I don't see a point in this much less cloning it. The only value the original had was the foot pedals, without those this is entirely pointless.
As a massive Genesis fan (up to a point), I crave that Taurus Bass Pedal sound and may think about picking one up at some point and hooking up my Helix to control the blighter, just so I can pretend to be Mike Rutherford on Seconds Out! Cheers for a top vid as always man.
Actually, I was going to vote "no" because after receiving your review videos, new gear often abruptly appears in my synthcave and I'm really out of space and inputs! Well, let's see what happens.
Same complaints heard over the years about the Minitaur. It's a fucking bass synth. What exactly do you want it to do? Oh it only does 4 octaves, I wonder why that is?oh it's a fucking bass synth based on pedals that provided bass. Not a complaint about your review which as usual was excellent.
Great overview that answered all of my questions. A Taurus pedal clone... without the... pedals. So you need to use a keyboard. Which makes it a very simple limited synth. I wonder why they didn't include pedals? I think they would have sold a bunch of them. Weird.
Blessings and a curse…you did a great job! But in the explanation was something that I did not like about my Moog Sirin and now that I know this has it too, I’m less enthusiastic. This one issue is very authentic to the original instrument however. So it’s probably something most people are looking for.
I think you maybe missed something with the Beat function. You need to tune the oscillators with Beat at zero and THEN add the Beat. You should then get the result you expect.
The oscillators by them selves track linearly- so if you let them track with no beat - if they are returned the beating gets faster and faster as you go up octave. Start with them in “perfect” tune and they should sound “perfect” as you go up. When you add some beat amount the beat offset that is added is hertz/volts so it produces the same number of beats per second regardless of what octave you are in. I hope that makes sense.
I own and have owned lots of behringer gear over the years. Love their synths especially and I’m not ashamed to admit they have a place next to my Prophet 5 and nicer gear. But I’m really starting to dislike them A LOT as a company. Their whole social media presence is completely cringe and they just seem to be up their own arse about themselves. The only reason I wished you didn’t do this review is to just stick it to them for their extra-ness. But thanks for doing it, this thing sounds massive!
You have nicer gear than your Prophet 5? Nice! --I agree with the above, albeit we are not in the same position as Starsky, he needed to make a choice this month and I'm glad he did. I liked his Pro 800 review although it did appear he was favoured to do so. With this current review it's clear he does still just review their gear not sell it. Yes it would have been over if he had used the Swing.
Yeah, it’s a bit odd. I did write a piece describing my perspective etc. but decided not to put it out as I don’t want to become embroiled. Take home is I wish they would chill.
@nepnep2470 just an FYI I wasn't 'favoured' to make anything ... I bought the P800 as I have the original and thought folks would find it useful. I do it all by myself and buy loads of stuff purely to demo it. It's a hobby, but pays for itself. On my 3rd P800 video I managed to get sponsorship from Thomann, but that's highly unusual. I thought I'd ask them as the videos were quite popular. I should do it more often!
The thing with the vintage replicas is there’s no ‘stealing’ involved all the IP has expired. There are plenty of other manufacturers using the original Moog filter and oscillator designs for example. There are lots of other 909 and 808 clones whether single eurorack instruments or complete drum machines. So these classic designs are up for grabs - international IP law allows this. All IP expires over time, or when a company dissolved and no-one buys or maintains it (there’s a cost to holding onto IP so only worth paying if the market is there). Whatever anyone thinks of the company I just thought I’d point out that it’s not theft. … basic admin of the comments. I’m hoping all this experience will eventually lead to interesting new designs built in these foundations.
@@StarskyCarr I appreciate you and your videos very much, I have learned a lot, and you’ve helped me make choices about purchases. You are so knowledgeable and helpful! I know that “B” is all legal, they’ve an army of lawyers to assure that. They are just highly uncreative, and have no desire to move the world of synthesis forward. It just irks me that they repeatedly cash in on other companies’ innovations. And…. They have blatantly copied products still for sale- Mother 32, DFAM, Keystep. And no acknowledgment by them where the ideas come from. Sorry, I can go on a bit, I do feel strongly about it! I appreciate your honesty, and love your channel! Keep it up!
Ever watched his videos? Zero ego, some of the best walk-throughs on YT. He didn't start the flame war, Beh did (for reasons wildly unclear), and then threw Starsky in for funskies. I back both, no need to pile on either, they're both great. I couldnt have got my head around the MV1 without both of them, for different reasons-Loopop had the process/function walk-through, and Starsky had the specific work flows and use cases. I've used both for several of my hardware bits n wotsits.
@@PiriakaTrackwrecker I agree with you completely. And the reaction was humorous in light of the strange business conflict that was revealed to the followers. In my personal opinion, both sides were overreacted. A manufacturer who acts like an elephant in a china shop and puts up posts that seem to have been pulled from the hip by 12 years old girl. And from the other side a RU-vidr who claims that in the name of his set of noble values and his high morality he does not intend to review products of a leading manufacturer in the field. It seems to me that he missed the audience here, these are electronic music enthusiasts and creators who opened RU-vid app to learn what's new and not to go through an educational workshop. In any case, the power is in the hands of the viewers themselves, and both sides must remember this - who is their audience and what interests them. Leave ideologies at home 😉
I've noticed that this guy loopup gathered some Greta fanbase around him. Just read the comments about him, they all seems to start with HOW DARE YOU lol.
