Breaking Down the Cycling Industry's Troubles: Who's at Fault? 

I’ve been in the bike industry going on 38 years, I’ve watched the cost of living rise faster than my salary the whole time. Back in the late 80’s and 90’s I had custom frames with Dura-Ace components. A few years back I started thinking that those ultra expensive exotic bikes with top of the line components aren’t for me. Now most of the bikes we sell are out of my price range. I’ve reached the conclusion that the bikes I have are gonna have to last the rest of my cycling life.

I agree with you. I don't think $15,000 halo bikes are the issue. $2,500 Tiagra bikes and $6,000 105 bikes are the real issue. Sure, the 105 bike now has carbon wheels, but that's a hell of a lot of money for the "groupset of the people."

Can’t remember the guys name who rides the old aluminum cannondale and you asked him if his bike is holding him back, but he hangs with the a riders and helps pace other riders in the group, he said no. My aluminum 2016 trek is not holding me back. I almost bought a used carbon Emonda a while back, but couldn’t settle on the price. My last bike was a 2005 trek 1000 I paid $300 bucks for. Put over 10k miles on it before I moved to the Emonda. I passed so many people riding 10 or 12k bikes on that $300 bike, and I’m not a fast rider. Been riding for 30 years but I just can’t bring myself to pay thousands for something I can buy for hundreds in a couple of years later from someone who barely used it.

I ride a 1987 steel steed on club winter runs, we compete for who rides the heaviest bike and still smash the ride! Inverse bike snobbery 🙂

I've owned a lot of high end bikes. $10k plus in 2005. Some of the my favorites came out of trash cans and were found on the side of the road (and got to build up my way).

There are lots of problems with the bike industry, but I would say problem #1 is the fact that cycling is an elitist sport. Nobody wants to be the guy riding the $1,500 aluminum bike when all his friends are on carbon bikes with carbon wheels. It's a status symbol, which is not what it should be. Most cyclists are people of means, and you're not driving your Range Rover to the local bike shop ride with a cheap bike on the back. The #2 problem is that the bike industry and a lot of RU-vid channels that rely on their support have convinced us that we all need the lightest or most aero bike, cost be damned. That's great if you're a pro racer, but 99.9999% of us are not. We get ZERO benefit from the marginal gains that the top pros get out of Dura Ace over 105, or Zipp wheels over aluminum wheels. Anything over $2,000 for a bike and you're wasting your money because of the law of diminishing returns. Think of it this way: If you and the fastest guy on your local group ride were to switch bikes, are you beating him? No, you're not. Because it's not the bike. It was never the bike. It will never be the bike. All you can do is train properly, eat properly, sleep properly, work on your position on the bike, and that's it. Then you're either fast or you're not. And you know what? That's fine too, because riding your bike is supposed to be fun first.

Interesting video with a very positive ending. I am enjoying 60+ years of cycling. I have enjoyed racing, commuting, touring, utility, etc. I have come to the conclusion that cycling is about your body and health and relationships with others. I look for a bicycle that is reliable, good quality and can last a long time. I got a custom Waterford touring bike and am still using it after 23years! I also have a commuting bike and a unicycle. As a bike tech, I would often get concerned when I see a beginning cyclist buying a high performance bike when his body wasn't ready for it. Performance comes from bodily training and not from acquiring an expensive bike.

In my experience, the fastest guys are usually the youngsters on older bikes with mix-and-match builds and worn kit. It's not about the bike. This seems to have become more about keeping up with the Jones' as opposed to making smart financial decisions. We see it with everything, not just bikes.

Hey Luis you hit the button on this video! Purchased a NOS Italian steel frame outfitted it with an older Campagnolo. gruppo,best riding experience I’ve ever had. Do I get shamed when out on the road? No way. Total cost slightly under 2200$ . I’d like to thank the bicycle industry for causing this void thereby giving me a chance to get a beautiful Italian handmade frame at a great price. Looking forward to your next video. All the best!

I'm keeping my 1986 Colnago Super, works for me and parts and wheels are still available.

My first bike was about $900, a used Cannondale synapse carbon with rim breaks and 105, lovely bike. I cycle to get fit, not race, and the fact it's not aero or light I believe benefits me because I have to work harder, (if that makes sense). On the flip side it's satisfying when I go past someone on a hill whose riding a bike worth more than my car:)

Back in the early 1970s, pretty much every mid-sized city had at least one Schwinn dealer. If cycling was popular in the area, the dealer might well have a certificate on the wall proclaiming they were in "The Thousand Club," meaning they sold at least a thousand Schwinn bikes that year. They would very likely have a special, lighted box on the showroom wall with Schwinn's top model, the Paramount, proudly displayed. A successful shop might turn over that Paramount at least once a year, but to sell a half dozen annually was unusual--the same bike might be on display for years. Schwinn took that model pretty seriously, but didn't make much money on it, nor did the dealer. It was called a "halo bike" because it lent prestige to the shop, along with the shiny Italian hubs and brakesets with the outrageous price tags, the entire shop stock of one each on display in a glass case where you couldn't help but notice them. These prestige items communicated that this was a top shop, and they helped to make the $140 for that orange Super Sport seem a bargain. I expect that the manufacturers are not far from that with these ultra-expensive bikes. They do not exist because the company expects or even wants to sell many of them, but to help boost sales and profit margins on the models they are selling in quantity. They also lead the customer to believe that the company is at the forefront of design and support the assumption that this experience will trickle down to the models customers are actually likely to purchase. Count me with those who say that the vast majority of these "innovations" are little more than marketing gimmicks, if they make any positive difference at all. BTW, the inflation argument only goes back so far. If you extend that top bike in most shops in 1972 to today, it would be around $3,000, and at that most people thought it was amazingly expensive for a bicycle. That got you a handmade frameset built with the top technologies of its era and fitted with the most expensive components in the world, in the middle of the "Bike Boom" era that restarted the long-dormant adult bike industry in the US.

-$10k+ bikes -new " standards " -11 speed then 12 then 13 -new " standards " -internal cable routing for " marginal gains " -new " standards " -wireless shifting -divorcing the rider from maintenance; send it to the shop -new " standards " In the Uk Chain Reaction and Wiggle have gone bust, GCN Plus is closing, Mapdec Cycling and Hambini show us horrific build quality on top end bikes on a weekly basis. Once passionate bike companies are regularly bought out by corporations looking to trade on their names. The global bike industry hasn't died...it committed suicide.

In 1995, I purchased a new Trek 5200 OCLV equipped with Ultegra for $1800. My bike was just one tier down from their 5500 flagship model with Dura-Ace. According to the CPI inflation calculator today, my Trek 5200 should only cost me around $3600. That price point would barely get me in a low-end Domane with mechanical Shimano 105.

I commented about social media influencers driving people to focus on top tier on GC's video and you've done an excellent job of elucidating and expanding on that here.

Regardless of age it is very important how flexible you are, how trained is your upper body. If you test a bike for let's say 15 minutes, with a lot of spacers below your handlebar, even a racing/aero bike can feel right. In my Experience dealers often want you to sell the bikes they have in their store.

I will be able to find what I need to keep riding, but it will probably all be used stuff at ever-increasing prices as it becomes more rare. The current issues in the industry are mostly the fault of consumerism and the concomitant notion that the only way to avoid embarrassing yourself on a ride is to have the latest and most expensive kit. It's a lie. None of my road bikes have motorized shifting or disk brakes, and I have no problem keeping up with the group.

I spent a few years (since 2017) riding on a $1200 bike with my club, learning and gaining experience and fitness. I didn't get any bike shaming. I upgraded the components of that bike over the years, and it allowed me to ride fast enough to keep up with the B+ group. Last year, I purchased a $7,200+ carbon fiber aero bike, with the latest electronic components. Sure, that bike goes faster with less effort, but there's nothing wrong with a lesser expensive bike to start.

I have a Bianchi Mega Pro which was my first new bike. I bought the best frame I could at the time with a lowish level groupset but pretty much everything apart from the frame has been upgraded by now. It used to look 'old' but now it gets admiring glances. If only I could climb remotely like Pantani did on a similar looking bike.

I am on my third bike. It is a 1998 steel frame Bianchi that I bought new. A lot of the components have been replaced, but the handle bars, stem, head set (Chris King) and frame remain.

I road mtb for years before getting hooked on road due to the pandemic and lockdown travel restrictions. I'd say, ride what you can afford and learn not to care what others think.

Luis, as a sport cyclist for more than 50 years, I am pretty sensitive to other riders on my preferred training route here in the Bay Area. I noticed in 2020 when Covid had shut down public gatherings, a huge influx of new riders -- not just individuals, but couples and even families. The Bay Area is blessed with hundreds of miles of two-lane roads with paved shoulders. Mostly they have little car traffic because the commuters use the freeways. The result is a near-ideal cycling environment, with a Mediterranean climate that enables year-round riding. Right from when I moved here in 1996, the region had a large population of "serious cyclists." With Covid, from among the region's population of 8 million, I would guess that several thousand adults found themselves riding bikes on public roads for the first time since they were little kids. Most were low-end bikes. That was the year 2000. By 2022, with some Covid restrictions still in place, that huge number of new riders had VANISHED. What we veteran riders had predicted for years, that cycling would eventually catch on as a mass sport, had in ideal circumstances imploded. And I think I know why. Having observed these new adult riders pretty closely over a couple of years, I was made aware of how hazardous our sport is when a rider is unaware of the numerous techniques required to ride with safety, inches away from often-hostile drivers of cars. So many of these newbs were putting themselves at serious risk. They lacked the street smarts to stay safe, and I was aware of a high level of anxiety among many of them. Also, so many of them were physically struggling, even on easy roads. We cyclists are outliers among the most sedentary and overweight population in human history. My guess is, a lot a 40-year-old couch potatoes, accustomed to watching experienced riders gliding along, got the notion that cycling requires very little exertion and therefore would qualify as something they could to do when Covid shut down their usual pastimes. Very few of these newbs were riding high-end bikes. This left room for a lot of them getting hooked on this sport and upgrading to more expensive models. But instead the exact opposite happened. Anxiety about riding on public roads among cars, and exhaustion from being completely out of shape yet trying to keep up with others, combined to cause the great majority, in my estimation more than 90 percent of these new riders, to park their bikes in their garage and mentally dismiss cycling as their choice of how to spend a sunny weekend afternoon. I agree with you, it wasn't having to pay $16 thousand for a bike that scared off the newbs. And the few who did buy expensive bikes rejected the sport in the same numbers as owners of inexpensive bikes. Their commonality was a deeply negative reaction to the cycling experience. They were fearful of encounters with cars, and not having an aerobic base, were under the impression cycling would always be exhausting for them. Had these novice riders hooked up with the numerous clubs in this region, they'd have been guided toward staying safe and getting fit by the encouragement and example of experienced riders. What veteran rider would be reluctant to assist someone new to the sport? We love doing that! But these new riders were making decisions in a vacuum of shared ignorance. Not knowing any serious cyclists, they exchanged among their networks of sedentary friends a lot of uninformed attitudes about whether adults have any business riding bicycles on public roads. Their sedentary friends validated their fear of traffic, and crucially, voiced their prejudice against cycling by adults as "un-American," that it was for kids in suburban neighborhoods. Adults riding bicycles and impeding cars on taxpayer-funded roads were a bunch of oddball vegans wearing peculiar outfits. The boom-and-bust popularity of cycling triggered by Covid has, to my mind, confirmed cycling's status in the USA as a fringe sport. A few years back, Lance Armstrong cause a mini-boom in cycling here and we all know how that turned out. To the American public, bicycle racing was synonymous with doping. And what middle-class parent would choose a doper's sport for their 12-year-old child to get involved in? It's all very sad, because Americans are in desperate need of a fun outdoor activity that gets them and their children away from screens. But nevertheless there it is: we are not in a downturn of cycling, we are in the new normal. Which is much like how things were before Covid. Manufacturers who ramped up production in the hope of doubling or tripling the riding population are going to have to dig themselves out of the hole they're in. Some won't make it, but the best will. The same with bike shops. This whole Covid cycling boom was merely a blip in the numbers of those engaged in a sport most Americans associate with eccentrics and entitled elites. In this country we will always be a tiny, and often disliked, minority. We know better, but the fact is, we have zero credibility in communicating the joys of cycling to a population whose favorite pastime is knocking back brewskies while watching football on their big-screen TV.

My first bike, was a used bike. From 2015 a ritchey road logic. That cost me $1500

I do custom painting on some framesets that end up costing US20k n the owners don't hv a clue how to ride it. Well, you said it all. Good job 👏

I'm enjoying the steep bike shop discounts. Recently purchased two Trek bikes. A Madone SLR 7 and Trek Emonda ALR 5 with tire and carbon wheel upgrades. 15% off on the Madone and 10% on the Emonda. The Bontrager carbon wheel set was 20% off. It's a no brainer if you are in the market for some new stuff. Enjoy it while it lasts.

Great video! My first bike was a used older Masi that I found on craigslist and paid $500 (which at the time I thought that was expensive...little did I know haha). After riding solo for 2+ years on the Masi, I was finally brave enough to jump into my first local no drop 30 mile group ride and the amount of crap I got for riding that bike was enough to discourage me from riding with them a second time.

Great video! As always I enjoy your perspective on cycling. Nowadays people think that the best of everything always make you faster and that why we are at this point. I still get grieve when I show up with my Campy equipped bike and tubulars tyres for races.

the law of diminishing returns absolutely applies to the biking industry today. Reaching the zenith of performance gets extremely expensive for really marginal or even questionable gains.

In North TX cycling hot bed, don't have any of those issues. We get a variety older & newer bikes depending on the group ride or race.

I started with a 1k Boardman then onto a Colnago zeroCX then Colnago C60 over the last 10 years. Im taking delivery of a dream bike next week Battaglin Portofino fully loaded Dura Ace and Campagnolo Hyperon Ultra wheels. At my age comfort is key even if it comes with a large price tag, but well worth it.

This was a great video. You hit the nail right on the head with your commentary. I am that $15k guy, but I entered cycling actually as a teenager and broke. I had some bikes, but most were Frankenstein builds. A mix of hand me downs and what parts I could afford. I said, “when I get my paper right. I am going high-end because I am sold in this game!”

it is pure greed here in europe period. a high end frame costs 600euro in china, then gets shipped to taiwan for a stamp and then sold by short sighted greedy firms who spend more on advertising than on everthing else.this will be their downfall in the long run.

Great video. I think you've hit a point that I haven't seen many people acknowledge and that's where novice cyclists jumped into the sport head first with their first bike purchase being a high end cycling machine. That boomed over the pandemic and likely led to the false projections by bike companies on who their target demo is for certain price points. As for me, cycling is main mode of transportation, but when I started to take it more seriously as a hobby, I've used the method as you indicated at 3:46 to build my bikes, and that's saved me usually at least 50% off buying a brand new prebuilt bike from a bike retailer or LBS including my "super bike", a Madone. When I started doing group rides, the club I joined was very welcoming. The only peer pressure we got was to ride more and ride hard, no matter your bike.

I just bought a TIME ADHX on black Friday deal with a fabulous price

Excellent video. My first bike was a Trek (over 20 years ago). I am just able to upgrade my bike. I kept my frame and upgraded my wheels and components. For me. A great savings.

I ride with a club now (rapha) where I feel like I could turn up on any bike and nobody would judge it. But I used to ride with a guy who constantly would passively criticise my bike for not being cabron. Saying things like "you're loosing so much power through your fame on climbs, thats why you're struggling"

I find your take refreshing. Yes, the bicycle industry is way to blame. The dailed to predict the massive drop in demand. I also blame the consumer as well. They bought during the pandemic and they bought high. So now the cycling industry has too many upper end bicycles and nobody to sell them to. So we have a glut that will take years to clear and companies who are trying to push to retailers who can't get bicycles out the door fast enough. What may fix this though is something we are seeing across the U.S. Bicycle specific infrastructure. Again, this is going to take years.

Excellent information. Reasoned, fact based and yeah, the state of the cycling market is a two way street. Customer habits AND brands are in a relationship and both compliment each other.

We printed A LOT of U.S. dollars (digitally) in last 10years, as you know. Diluted dollar= inflated pricing. No such thing as a free lunch. Ride a used bike that fits.

GCN did a similar video about “the bike you need vs what you want.” Proprietary building systems on “super bikes” is an issue as well… and a bike fitted with 105 costing 4 grand with the Taiwanese built frame set is a bit steep. Not that their bad just a bit over priced. Right now I can order a Litespeed titanium frame set outfitted with mechanical 105 for about 3 grand. Which is reasonable and those frames are built in the US.

Most new cyclists with deep pockets are easily persuaded by marketing. Faster frame, more aero, lighter, stiffer, more compliant, more comfortable, and blah blah blah. What they didn't realize is that performance on the bike takes time, no pain no gain. So they end up selling their high end bike for something faster and more comfortable hence the unrealistic demand for 'more expensive bikes'. The problem for the industry is that they are catering too much for these new cyclists who most likely will end up leaving the sport because they don't have the time nor the patience to achieve performance on the bike. Some manufacturers have realized this hence the prolifiration of e-bikes.

Great content! Thanks 🙏🏾

Completely agree about beginning cycling by building and understanding the mechanics first. As for price points in the very opposite of the spectrum I built my fisrt 11 years ago for about 450$. In october I bought my second, a preowned 90's colnago for the same price... So to me, indeed, being able to work your bike up by yourself makes the price drop like crazy.

Nobody is mad at $10,000+ bikes. What sucks is buying an entry-level groupset kind of bike but still having to pay $4-6k. That's why I went used and it took me almost a year to find my bike. Very hard to find something with a $2K budget that is engineered or QC'd properly brand new. See Hambini and PeakTorque. People coming to cycling just want to do buy once cry once, but your first bike shouldn't cost more than your first car.

Great insights, thanks. Same situation here in France...

8-speed beater - that hurt. Dawes Linear 8-speed Shimano RX100 (105 1st gen)

I’ve had 6 bikes in 40 years of riding. I like my 2015 Tarmac I think I paid exactly what it is worth brand new. Do I want a newer bike, of course but I don’t want to pay today’s price. I keep telling myself to start saving and buy a new bike in 2 years, maybe.

All well said. Thanks for your video.

The big problem is that wage growth has stagnated and hasn't been keeping up with inflation, therefore making bikes, effectively, much more expensive than they were before. So, I blame government economic policies that have killed wage growth.

Great topic Luis, I consider my self a novice rider and my first bike was an entry lever road bike, no where near the prices you mention. (lol) But I can say that peer pressure sometimes do play a part in upping your game when it comes to bike brands and what you put on your bike. Now I could see buying that 5 grand and up bike if I'm in my best physical health competing in races, but for the average rider who is probably putting no more than maybe 400 miles or less on a 15 grand bike yearly, noooooooo!

Thank you, lots of insightful comments.

I started cycling in Oct with a used Felt FR30 2018 model. I get so many complements on it. I've upgraded the tubes, wrap, and tires. I might even throw some carbon wheels on it. I just love my $500 bike. No shot I'm putting her in the garage for an off-the-rack package.

Thanks for thought, was really interesting!

It’s not the older bikes that are problematic for new riders. It’s terrible group socialization with little to no basic instruction as a means to grow the sport and keep riders safe.

Got out of the marketing craze...having multiple bikes in2k range. Sold all my bikes during pandemic. Almost broke even. Now have a $650 and $900 bike. Both on sale lol. Super happy

I think part is of the problem is not specific to cycling, but just part of the overall culture: there is a lot of money around and we are constantly being pushed into consumerism. So comparing and shaming may have been internalised by a lot of people. And the industry is tapping into that. I do hope durability, ease of maintenance and compatibility will regain some terrain.

I have a few road bikes and the one that always puts the biggest smile on my face is my ‘71 Super Sport (700c, 3x8, and other modifications). I love the feel of the chromoly frame and friction shifters. Not as fast as a 12K carbon but close enough for group rides.

When I first got into racing, I bought a Cannonade CAAD 7 with Shimano 105 and Tektro brakes. It was $1,250. The issue with the current industry is that they abandoned the intro level crit bike and all OEM’s have used “technology” claims of newer tech such as disc brakes or carbon wheels and used it as an excuse to raise both prices and eliminate the entry level option

I think it is a market correction. The pandemic closed the gyms and people were looking for was to stay in shape and some people looked into cycling. Another issue with people forced to stay home or practice social distancing, impacted the manufacturing industry which produced less bikes. So local bike shops had low inventory which long lead time so people were willing to buy whatever was in the store. Now everything is back to normal, but the local bike shops have too much inventory. People now have choices and can wait for a sale and buy the bike they actually want. Another challenge is customers can buy directly from the manufacturer if the local bike shops don’t have the bike they want. Cycling is a very expensive sport and interest rates are high. Since not everyone can buy their bikes with cash and high interest rates is another reason bike stores have so much inventory.

Great topic. I've been in the cycling industry for around 30 years as a racer , mechanic , inside sales , etc. I've seen how certain bike trends can take over like a cancer and convince people that they had to have a certain product. Good example. Steel vs carbon. Steel will always be a great choice for some , but for others , they will find a reason for complaint against one or the other only because of what they have heard thru the media. Some may have never even ridden either type to give a logic comparison . Rim brake vs disc brake is another example. I've heard people say that they would never ride a rim brake bike because they believe that disc brakes are so much better . I happen to love rim brake bikes and i have a disc brake bike also. When companies like Sram and Shimano set the standard for what the next big thing is going to be, you tend to have a lot of people that follow that narrative without question. I now live in Atlanta Georgia and the 2 big names out here for the most part is Trek and Specialized. If i showed up on my De Rosa , someone would tell me they have never heard of that brand before. I for one was never a guy that had to have the latest , but I'm also the guy that found it to be more fun to build my own bike rather than buy one complete. I guess that's the nerd in me. As far as the industry goes, they have gotten greedy over the years and covid was a big part of that. Bike shops did not send people home to work from their bedrooms like other businesses did. When I worked for Trek, we were so busy that we had to shut the shop down so that the mechanics could play catch up. So many people wanted to ride bikes that the production chain got overwhelmed and couldn't keep up with demand. If you remember , there where thousands of bikes and components from oversees stuck on freight ships that couldn't dock. So bike shops were running low on parts. Bike companies like Trek were making the owners place preorders with the hope that they would have enough inventory to make it thru the year. Trek also introduced a price increase 3 times during the covid crisis. They were following the trend which started with groceries and toilet paper. By the time time covid had run its course, that inventory started coming in at a fast rate and bike shops were running out of room to store bikes. Funny thing is , the prices never went back down. Bike companies hit their best sales numbers within that 2 year span and a ton more bike companies were created also. The industry was in the drivers seat . From that point after , we saw a steady increase in pricing. Note , the only thing that separated a BMC from a Cannondale was the frame. At every specific price point meaning from entry level $1200.00 to top end race bike $15,000,00 , the components were the same. Either Sram or Shimano and maybe Campy. The machine that produced the mold for the BMC and the Cannondale didn't change, but the price or carbon went up along with parts that came on the bike. So all these companies got greedy at the same time and when they realized that people were still gonna pay, they felt like they won. Some of us have been around long enough to know what works well and what is more or less a bunch of hype. The new generation of cyclist wants the latest and the greatest because they see Justin Williams on RU-vid winning races on his Specialized slr8 and it looks cool. I get it. Because of this expensive new bike trend , now you have some amazing used road bikes for sale on the Facebook marketplace etc. Guys like me that aren't stuck on disc brake bikes can find some treasures out there that most of the newbies would not think about buying, but NO ONE IS BUYING THEM. HAVE A BLESSED DAY BRO.

Anyone saying the price of bikes hasnt gone up, isn't paying attention. In 1999 you could buy a made in america full suspension frame with full XTR, chris king hubs and headset, made in american stem and seatpost, etc for around $4,000. Today you could buy a full suspension bike with XTR for maybe $7000 or so - but it's all made in China! To make the same bike in the US would cost atleast 30% more. We've moved all production offshore to save on cost - and we haven't saved anything. Cost remains the same, while the US has lost manufacturing jobs. Real wages and buying power has fallen. So has the price of bikes remained the same? Sure - but it's not the same bike.

Interesting question, and glad you explored it. Around here in the Boston area I don’t see it too much in group rides. People are riding some high-end bikes, alright, but all different vintages, so this is nothing new. And the vast majority are not these top-tier models, but more your 2nd-3rd bike type and with lots of miles. No bike-shaming, but rather, the reverse, where there’s more cred in lungs-n-legs over tech. That all said, yes, you do see the phenomenon of super bikes you describe, for sure, even if it’s not the regular crowd. I think a lot of this is a combination of COVID (no dining out expenses, desire to get outside, YOLO spirit) and social media (endless promotion of the most expensive consumer goods available on demand, not just by reading a magazine once a month, say) means you have a lot of people buying more expensive models. Plus, let’s not forget that during COVID it was very hard to buy parts and bikes, so you bought what was in stock. In a constrained situation like this, of course the industry will respond with more expensive configurations. Meanwhile, you have the big manufacturers vertically integrating to capture more value chain profits, as you rightly point out. Lots of factors. It will take a while to settle down, but things will find a new equilibrium, and it is great news that supplies of value-tier enthusiast-oriented models are back. I am not a big fan of upgrading every few years; I think it’s great that someone can be happy with what they have and not feel inadequate so if they buy a bike that’s “too good” and then ride it for 10-20 years, that’s great!

Great video, hopefully this will tell people don't put the expense of the bike above your capability to ride it.

Great thoughtful post that I think will resonate with newer cyclists without offending them.

Great topic. Luckily the people I ride with have slowly been easing into the sport. Buying with budget in mind first and then updating once they know what is important for them. Is it comfort, is it aero, is it weight or is it anything else. They they are willing to out in the 💰 but at least they know they are putting the money towards something they know they will value over time.

"The value of an item it's always what's somebody is willing to pay". That's a massive fact.

Direct to consumer is where it is all headed. A Giant road bike with 12 speed electronic shifting and carbon wheels for $3,500 now. Do any group ride and you will see it’s mostly older riders. Young people not really taking up cycling.

The sad thing is the big price gouging companies like Specialized, Trek and Cannondale will survive and continue their wicked ways. Where the good more affordable small to mid-size companies will fall.

Amen. I recently bought a second-to-top grade roadbike which took a big chunk of change... but, this is my tenth or eleventh bike and probably the last bike I'll ever buy. Thanks for your insights.

Brilliant video.i agree with pretty much everything you say, the problem was and will always be greed and false hope that the supper bike will take your performance to next level. I find deals everywhere, frames, components, wheels, etc ... can't see myself buying a $14k new bike to lose it all in 5 years when obsolete . keep up the good work, love your videos, fresh , honest and different .

Agreed on what you said. I recently bought a 2024 LOOK 795 blade rs with mcc dx 47 wheelset. Some consumers like myself rather spend on a pricy good bike “end bike” then to own a few bikes( which will cost a lot more). Still rocking with 2016 fuji SL 1.1

Interesting discussion to reflect on as a new cyclist. I got my first road bike (base Allez) in February this year and really fell in love with cycling. Upgraded some bits on it and had my fun but quickly realized I’d like to ride something new at some point. Ended up “skipping a few bikes” myself and got a Tarmac SL7 with Ultegra Di2 in July after they went on a nice discount at my local shop. MSRP was CAD $8k but paid 6, which still felt like too much to be spending on a bike at the time but I’m so happy with the bike and don’t regret it one bit. During the shopping around process I couldn’t help but think there was nothing compelling in that $3K-$5K range. All bikes felt a bit too similar, nothing exciting, and in general didn’t feel like the upgrade from the Allez would be worth it. Only thing that caught my eye was the cheapest spec Aeroad from Canyon but I wasn’t sold on buying online. Great video :)

Years ago i paid part by part. Condor in London were my local shop sold everything. They had complete bikes, but i could not afford them. You pay month by month for the steel or the Alu frame, then once you had that, you would build it up. Groupset was the next item. Remember that groupsets would come with a set of hubs as well, campy record 9 speed groupset had record hubs. , The wheels were built up with Mavic rims and spokes. Finishing kit was then bought when you had the cash. I would use old stuff just to get the bike out. The full build took about me 18 months. These were top end bikes, same set up as the pro's rode. They cost a fait bit back then. They still cost well over 1.5 k back in the late 1980's! I got my last complete Condor in 2022 in a sale for 3k. Yep, only 11 speed DI2, cheap wheels, but i love it :-)

Incredibly well said!

So glad I got new tcr with ultegra, carbon frame/wheels, and a power meter for $3500 in early 2020

I run in a more commuter-oriented cycling community, and the discussions there are a lot more around modding your current bike than getting a new one. I mean hell, my bike is a hybrid frame completely rebuilt as a gravel bike. And to echo what Francis Cade and Jimmy have said, lower tier stuff, like even Claris and Sora is really good now. Budget bikes, like under $1000 new are AMAZING. Microshift Sword is incredible, and Sensah and Ltwoo are putting out solid budget offerings as well. TLDR: I'm riding a budget aluminum frame built up with a Claris 3x8 groupset and Hunt wheels, and there is nothing that bike can't do that a top spec bike can. Will the top spec bike do it better? Yeah, probably, but my bike can still do the job

I'm writing as someone who was a member of a cycling club and did occasional road racing as a teenager in the 1970s. I've recently returned to cycling and I'm shocked and dismayed at the needless use of expensive technology in modern bikes. If you are cycling primarily for the exercise then it does not matter what type of bike you ride - it only matters how hard you push yourself. If you are susceptible to peer-pressure and marketing B.S. then your bike is more of a status symbol. Look up the definition of 'Weblen Goods' - it is when a product becomes more desirable the more expensive it.

MTB XC 29 price vs 26 is even more shocking. You can get 26 old school super pricy parts for nothing.

I totally agree. I would buy a good cromoly frameset and build the bike myself. Setup to my taste and biometrics. We are all unique imo...

For $2,299 you can get a Canyon Endurance 105 DI2. More bike than 90% of the people out there need. That bike at that price I’m sure is keeping their competitors up at night.

Spot on Luis! Not only do you do provide exceptional cycling techniques, etiquette and performance vids, but you’re a rational and astute "professor" of cycling eco-politics as well! Dude, you’re spoiling us! Two excellent vids in less than a week! Thank you!

Part of the tension in the market is direct sales vs big brand companies. Part of the money saved by an internet purchase is the support you buy from your LBS. However, the big brands do not usually offer too many options to spec your build. With some direct companies you can choose groupset, wheels, etc. The other thing is that you don't know where something comes from. Some brands sell lower quality for a higher mark up BUT there sometimes a reason a brand carbon frame can't match the price of a generic build. I think there is emerging another option in boutique brands. A shop or group, like REI, can have frames and bikes made to build. There is a shop in Montreal that markets its own bikes, Bassi. The models are based on what the customers are using for real world use. These are sold as a frame, a package or you can contact them to put together something more tailored to your taste. Some of the medium frame builders such as Rodriguez will do the same with stock frames and custom on request. For the new rider it takes some time to discover what works for you. Trial and error involved then you know what you are looking for. There is a lot of options for people and that is a good thing. Over time it can be like ice cream at the supermarket. Some different names on the package but the choices are the same.

Of course there's bike shaming but I don't judge them any differently. I'm happy to ride

the industry is working against a saturated market and marginal diminishing returns. Plus the vibe on group rides like En Gamba is more of a fashion show than a bike event. Good discuss

There’s very little difference between bikes. You can make a relatively cheap bike far faster than an my expensive one, purely by setting up aggressive geometry to be comfortable. Production costs fell massively. Prices have risen. You can get fantastic bikes and wheels cheaply, just without a show-off name on them. That’s all they trade on now.

As someone with 1.5 years of competitive cycling experience and an FTP ~270, I think it's insane to spend more than 4k on a bike for my currently level of ability. My wife and I make good money and even $4k seems extravagant to me. $10k for a bike with mid level skills and fitness is downright irresponsible for 99% of people.

I love the fact that people are buying expensive bikes as their first bike. that means you can get it on the secondhand market much cheaper when they give up in a year. maybe that's part of the problem just to many great bikes floating around to buy a new one.

Starting Cycling as poor kids 40 years ago we always had to build up our own bikes. Later with more money the best way to find the optimum was still to put everything together with my own hands. Usually a purchase of a person who is new participant on a market, starts with a need that was awoken by somebody. These days often by influencers and advertisements. If a person is not very reflected he or she falls into that trap without knowing if he or she really needs that. For example while Covid, many people started their activities only to realize activity is hard Work 😂...And are never to be seen... maybe never again beeing active. A „Superbike“ makes no Superhuman. Besides there is nothing that is wors fitting than a Superbike with all that Areostuff. Liebe Grüße 🙋🏼‍♀️

The problem I found was finding a non-ebike. The wife needs a better (lighter easier to shift) bike for our rare rides on the local bike paths, the shop I went to mostly had ebikes available and when the salesman went to his computer to check what he could get in our price point, he found things were unavailable

We tend to give kudos to the most for least. When someone shows up on a top end bike it just looks like they think that splashing cash will make them faster. And also feels highly unlikely they can tune or fix anything on it!

I built a S-WORKS SL-8 clone. Let me explain, painted a Pro frame, put on S-WORKS stickers. Got the Roval handlebar/stem, sram red 12 speed, CeramicSpeed derailleur and BB for far less than optioned from dealer. Total spent $8,700 on what looks like a $12k bike, only 80 grams difference.

I spent $8k this year on a custom bike. That seems like an exorbitant amount for me, and I'm still reeling over the fact that I spent $8k on a bike. So I really cannot possibly imagine spending twice as much. My car only cost $18k. My three other bikes cost $1400, $3000, and $4000.

@luisscott I do see some more entry to slightly above entry bikes in my area(Carmel, Carmel Valley,Pebble, Monterey). Now when I ride up in the Bay Area it flips to who can show up with the newest and most $$$$$ toy on a ride. Many of them are the walk in to a shop, ask what is the most high end and pull out the credit card. Also whenever a new better frame or group or wheels comes out they rush to buy it. Not that they can feel the difference other than being able to say, I have X new thing. Now I am the type that builds/picks my own parts for the last 30+ years. For me I pick every part and have done research in to why it is better for me and my riding goals. Plus I love matching colors from, nipple color, cable housing, tire, saddle, bar tape, caliper color, frame.....My bikes all fall into the high end of the market with some being new and others a little older. I feel this crap trend to have all black bike is a true show of no creativity or imagination!

I'm currently not looking for that $15000 bike but I'm looking for the one piece handlebar that comes on that bike and it's not in stock. Why is it not in stock? I don't understand why it's so hard for the manufacturer to make that piece of equipment and yet they'll overstock the bike shops with bikes that no one is looking to buy.

So true

I just bought a used lightweight rim brake road bike that weighs 7.2 kgs, which is more than good enough for my cycling needs. I ride regularly over 100 kms for training and paid less than $1,000 and its an incredible bike to ride. There is a huge correction taking place right now in the bike industry, which will take years to sort out. The fact is, less people are cycling now and the trend is for that continue. Electric scooters and ebikes are now the big thing for a lot of people.

i start with $700 entry level giant defy, now that same bike is $1.200, and a bike with shimano 105 was $1.500 now is more than $3.000 here in japan, i bought a full group shimano 105,cost me $250, and put on my giant defy with used mavic akasiun for $80, now is other bike, fast than before, for me is enough, i want a better bike, yes, but i have family, things is hard now,the salary does not increase equal to the infraction, used bike is very expansive now too,It seems like you can find good used things in the United States, and your purchasing power hasn't changed much

My first road bike (after commuter bikes) was a used $400 Trek in 1994. Then I got a clearance sale $1000 M4 Specialized with Ultergra in 1998 and did my first racing. I got on a team and bought a Scwinn Fastback for $1600. I had strong results and my next team was sponsored by K2 bikes for my next three seasons. The team kicked ass and we got a Specialized sponsorship and I had a new S-Works for two seasons. Afterwards I never paid retail again. I stopped racing but bought used bikes from people who get new race bikes every or every other season. My current ride in an S-Works 2018 SL7 Ultralight I got for $2600. It was worth every penny adjusted for inflation.

I'm still on my 2013 Scott foil 20. It's plenty of bike for me. I've replaced most of the parts on it over the years and other than that I just change the chain and recable it every so often and it feels like new again. There is no need to spend 15k on a bike. That's just a status symbol.

Buying expensive bikes is overrated. I have a 1k bike purchased in 2016. I still have it. My fitness level has improved so much I keep up with athletes that race. I see people buy 10k bikes but don’t work on their fitness. 🤦🏽‍♂️