You may want to retract your advice about using the stock injectors to plug the holes in the heads. I have do this on a LNF Ecotec because I converted it to port injection. After driving the car less than 1000 miles it burnt the centers out of the injectors. The injectors are cooled by the fuel flowing thru them, so my advice do not use the stock injectors as plugs.
True. In Europe there are many GDI engines converted to LPG fuel. LPG fuel uses separate injectors (MPI), but You have to run some normal gas (10-15%) thru direct injectors just to cool them down.
@@LT3Fluffy sounds like it will burn the tip of the injector, because there's no liquid flowing to keep it cool. Once it burns through a little it doesn't take long to start cutting into things like a torch.
Very cool and definitely different. I have a supercharged LT1 myself, so I love this. However, I am left with a few strong opinions which I'm sure you and many feel the same way about, but it has to be mentioned. Direct injection, variable cam timing, squirters and high compression are essentially what makes the LT1 what it is, now gone. Also, the same combo retaining those items would make a bit more power, probably closer to 675. In fact, with that cam, compression could have been even higher than 11.5:1. Lastly, that is a very expensive way to build a carbureted 417 cube engine. A stroker LS 6.0 or 6.2 with LS3 heads would make the same power but could cost quite a bit less. Anyways, I digress, it's still very cool to see it done and I'm glad you covered it. Keep up the good work as always!
I got to agree. Just because you can doesn't mean you should. Sure, it's neat, but so is the video of the guy that did reverse flow heads on a SBC with the exhaust coming out of the intake ports. Most of the the power of this motor is from the cam. I'm sure Gibbons asked themselves "why?" when they were asked to do this, but realized the old bastard wanting this stupidity had plenty of money. Plus, why not make a video too. Still props to the guys pulling it off. It is at the very least interesting.
I was thinking you could do a lot better with an olds school SBC with a lot less custom stuff. I don't have dyno numbers to back me up but I'll bet my 383 makes more that this put out (13.5:1 though). Longevity of this build is likely better, but I know I've got a lot better oil pressure. I'd sure take the block stiffness that the new engines have though.
If strokeing means blocking off the piston oil squirt , i would save the oil squirter and choose another way to make power. Oil squirter is a must have in ANY build IMO
When they say stroking a motor it means you're adding more throw to the crank longer throw the reason they had to get rid of the oil squirters is because now that the crank has a longer distance to go it comes higher up and would actually hit the oil squirters at the bottom of the block that's why the squirters were removed
Take for instance an old school Chevy 350 block they would stroke it by taking a 400 crank and rods and putting it into the 350 motor essentially giving you a 383
Is it ok? It is perfect! I love seeing odd ball builds and if these are as rare as started, I look forward to seeing these more moving forward. What an animal 💪
I think weather your old school or new school that engine scratches both itches. Hot rodding is a living breathing animal love it when people reinvent a motor into there own image! Hats off to you guys!
I'll have to admit I was cringing at removing the direct injection and lowering compression but after hearing how snappy that motor sounded I suddenly found relief. Another badass 1 off build, love it.
@@TheHorsepowerMonster no thank you for the content... No other channel is as in depth. I wish ppl knew how much work it is to actually appreciate what they could learn from the builders and you explaining in such detail...
I also appreciate all the details you give throughout the video. Very well done. One thing I would comment is about the compression… I would not be concerned with the factory 11.5:1 compression ratio with the carburetor. With 93 octane fuel and the camshaft that was chosen, that would have worked great IMO. I built an LS3 based 349 cube de-stroked, carbureted engine that makes 600HP and has 12:1. It’s in a Nova with a 6 speed. No problem on pump gas. Keep up the great work!
I think the carburetor is an awesome idea and it's a wicked idea for bracket racing also a lot easier to put a restrictor plate in then change the tune. depends sometimes!!!
@@chevydyall7619 It is possible to enjoy watching the content and still think it’s a waste of money and time to do the build, bub. Not everybody had to hide from information that upsets them like you apparently do... 🤷♂️
When more people do it it will get cheaper by a ton. Holley and others is going to make cast replacement parts so you do not have to buy CNC milled stuff from LME. Love their stuff ofc.
Well cool! A 38% increase from standard is awesome! An with a purpose built intake, and I’d say, ported exhaust ports. This pinocle of V8 power! Will gain a even bigger percentage of power! As always you’ve created a great video, With a awesome engine!! I got my new Hemi T shirt last month! Although the XL! It seems I need a XXL!!! Lol! Thanks again bud for another great watch!!!!
I have been running LT1 heads on my Ly6 for about a year first with carb, now hi-ram efi, and I sold some parts to a dude in cali that had his gen v running with a carb months ago
Everyone thinks EFI is cool until it comes to wiring lol. I love carbed engines I recently changed my 302 Ford Windsor to carburetor and I'm amazed at how much better and easier it is to operate. Love this project!
@@danielwilson6665 nah you're good man lol. I'm the same way at car shows it's just another 383 stroked sbc in a hot rod. I get sick of looking at them too
Yes this is a definite blend of old school with a modern twist on a more or less new generation 5 small block GM V8. It sounds absolutely beautiful. I like the huge hp and torque numbers. That's why IMO old school will never die;you just proved it can work with modern engines. Guys did you know the 417 CID you got out of this engine build is similar to the old 6.9 liter (417 CID) Mercedes Benz V8? They were used in NA up to '79 and were a torquey V8. In fact I've seen a few stoplight getaways won with this 6.9 V8 in MB cars of the day. Gr8 job guys. ☺🙏👍💪💯
I dig they used a tighter LSA cam. Carbs are great if one knows how to tune them. I’m a KISS type of guy, so carbs appeal to me although this build was way above my pay grade! Lol Awesome stuff though, she sounded a bit like RO7 😎
If you're not really computer savvy and you like carburetors Holly has a self learning throttle body to really interesting to look into tricks a lot of guys cuz it looks like a carburetor
Would I trade out modern programmable efi for a Carb(s.) Never. In all classes where efi is allowed. Efi cars are faster, more consistent, easier to drive (in all forms of motorsport) and critically easier to tune with so much data/granular control over every aspect. So much so I opted for quad 50mm throttles on my new tarmac rally motor vs 48mm dellorto's. But regards the build detailed here. The customer gets what the customer wants. If they're happy with the results. That's all that matters. Jordan
EFI is safer, but with sensors constantly breaking, I'd argue carbs are way more reliable. The carb will get you down the track the same way(within reason). EFI will pull timing if it senses anything wrong, and as far as I know, efi systems dont detect broken sensors. Which will probably change in the future. Right now its a crapshoot. The one major advantage efi has over car in my opinion is for HPDE environments and drifting, where a normal carb will starve of fuel unrelated: carbs sound better than EFI
@@e36blur carbs do sound better I agree. However I wouldn’t drop $5k+ on different boxes/computers to get the same data a terminator x will. And I hook the laptop up to one thing. I don’t have to go box to box to read data
@@JohnnyAnderson1 Carbs are much more responsive and tend to produce a bit more motor noise from what I’ve noticed. Mostly notice the sound difference cracking the throttle , you can tell for sure
I find this very interesting I’d not slept last night and this keep me so interested I watched wide awake.. It’s pretty cool seeing what it takes to Reverse engineer new innovations in old tech v8’s.. I’m going to miss v8’s when GM follows to go batteries on wheels
Always enjoy the videos, even oddball stuff like this. All this to be able to occasionally do a jet change? I’m not crazy about direct injection, but going to a carb just seems backwards. Gotta admit though, this is real hot rodding.
Those adapters are hurting power but I understand you use what ya got. Would love to see a comparison of factory direct fuel injection vs traditional injection vs carb (when a direct fit manifold is available) thanks for sharing the build.
what is the advantage of doing it this way than just carberateing an ls3? it kinda seems like all the new stuff for this platform was either deleted or blocked off.
You are basically right. The customer somehow had the rotating assembly, not sure how or why he got it. And he asked for it to be built with a carb. I'm thinking he just wanted something different. Thanks for watching!
The novelty of being unique is what some other people value. Don't care if you make a steam-powered GenV LT1, if a customer is willing to pay then someone will build it.
The thought of slapping a carb on an LT1 should be an anathema to anyone with half a mind for how modern engines were designed to operate. What the LT1 or LT4 really needs is port injection to clean the intake valves in addition to keeping the computer controlled direct injection. Hey, GM did that with the 2019 ZR1 LT5 motor. That would at least be a real engineering exercise. “Hell, let’s slap a carb on it!” SMH Great, another informative and educational episode of POWERNATION.
The builder should have been aware of the paint on the PaceSetter Headers. For example, here's what SummitRacing states about the paint: "(Special warning regarding PaceSetter painted headers only: The paint on these headers is not designed as a final finish; it is designed to protect the headers after the manufacturing process and during shipping. This paint will not withstand the high heat associated with engine break-in, nor will it withstand the heat cycles associated with any type of driving. It is recommended that this protective coating be stripped, and a high-heat paint or coating designed for use on headers be applied.)" Edit: From the Pace Setter web site: "BLACK COATING FOR PRE-USE PROTECTION ONLY".
Commenting for the algorithm: It's okay to do whatever you want to whatever engine you want. :) if dude prefers a carb, put a carb on it. Idk why people trip sometimes.
PRESSURE is defined as lb/sq inch or force/per area. Springs do not exert pressure. They exert force or load in compression. I had trouble wrapping my head around this as a new mechanical engineering student.
It is still in the works. Keith is on his third iteration of the engine. The first two both had problems with the block not being able to handle the power. After a couple of heat cycles they would start leaking water into the chambers. Hopefully soon, and I'll make sure to talk about the setbacks in the video too. Thanks for watching!
My 1967 L88 427CI which had 12.5-1 ran just fine on pump gas but Vehicle documentation stated, “This unit operates on Sunoco 260 or equivalent gas of very high octane. Under no circumstances should regular gasoline be used.”
Nice! Thanks for the content… however what kind of modifications was done to the cam position sensor for the LS ignition module to function on an Gen 5 LT1 engine?
I'm not a mechanic, but I think the silver color of the parts and machines makes them easier in terms of assembly and disassembly, you can see what you're installing unlike the black color, it causes a little distraction
The paint on the headers is shipping/shelf paint to prevent rust. They must be torched and or scuffed and painted with something like VHT header paint or ceramic coated.
if u use injectors to plug the ports u will just burn them up and cause a compression leak because there is no fuel flowing through them to cool them down.
why not just add one of those aftermarket injector units with the wired control pad? That seems like the best of both worlds. Less build expense and easy at track adjustability. BUT, it is a FREE country. Carb it if you like by all means.
if the customer can't tune direct injection a carb is all you can do. I would encourage an LS carb in that case. I just don't see the advantage but whatever floats the boat.
Of course it's okay to carb a new gen engine I would like to see a gen3 hemi with a carb and distributor and there is a kit for that it uses a modified timing chain cover and gear to drive the distributor and only uses one spark plug per hole but absolutely no computer is needed so you can get the old look and easy swap to any car
When I saw the oil pressure on the screen dropping out to high 20's at over 6000 i was cringing.. I have the same oil pan but am concerned there isn't enough volume and its pulling in air... Wonder if the bottom end is still alive today?
This is a cool build but it brings up something I've wondered about. Is it possible (since you now have a carb) to use the DI system as a fully adjustable power adder utilizing Nitromethane? Don't think Top Fuel, I'm not talking about that much Nitro.
May want to reevaluate your statement.. no way 11.5:1 on a carb. Can go MUCH higher on pump fuel when designed correctly. These modern engines are designed correctly 👌. My "old" sbc with "modern" 15° heads drove and competed at 13+ to 1 zero issues. Current setup is WELL in excesse of 15:1 and drive absolutely perfect on the street pulling a trailer with pump fuel. Not E85.. (no competition level loads applied with pump at this level though) It has absolutely no problem on the street with 9k shifts on pump (low load, tires are spinning)
@Dennis Robinson in the past yes.. no problem at all. We are well above 15:1 now and still no problem street driving and spirited fun on the street. At this high of compression we put race fuel in for actual drag strip time.. but that's the only time. Current time slip 8.52@159 3000lb NA small block. Completely street able proven in multiple drag and drive style events 👍
I always love these vids id also like to know how much these builds cost mostly to see if a blue collar like me could have something like what you show built
Thanks for the compliment. I don't bother with cost because no matter what an engine builder tells me an engine costs, his competition will start peppering their customers with "I can do that cheaper." There's no benefit to the builder. Second, the way things are going now with inflation, the cost would barely be accurate 30 days after the video is published. Many of my engine build videos are still going strong two years later. So there's no benefit to the viewer. Anyhow, that's my reasoning. Thanks for watching!
Should have kept the 11.5 compression and ran it on E85 E85 is 100+ octane should keep the engine out of detonation pretty sure it should be worth 20 or more horsepower upping compression from 10.5 to 11.5 throughout the entire RPM range with a little more pop
As far as putting a carburetor on a modern L/S or anything modern for that matter. This girl says Kinda like Burger King. It's your engine might as well have it your way. If he's comfortable working with carburetors. It's really not any different than taking a small block from the 60s or 70s and putting fuel injection on. Personally, I do love the carburetor cuz you don't have the electronic engine control module to go out. They will go out at the most inopportune time and place. You have to really work hard to break a carburetor. While I do love the modern makeover the old reliable small block and they made great improvements. And yes, fuel injection and computer-controlled ignition can be made to do wondrous things. I still love the old school simple dead reliable 4 barrel. It's actually funny watching young guys scratching their head trying to figure out a carburetor and Mallory dual point distributor! You hand them a screwdriver and a feeler gauge. They look at you like you're from another planet. Well, I've already gotten way more long-winded than I intended to take care good luck with the Corvette. You keep posting videos and this girl keep watching
I love reading the comments when people think because it's old technology means it's not going to be as good or make as much horsepower people really need to keep an open mind there are a lot of old school tricks that you can do to New School motors to make lots of horsepower there are things companies are doing to motors that are old school like windage trays oil squirters roller valve trains it's not new technology it's just being used in newer motors more efficiently
27:16 I'd like to see a low rise dual plane optimized for street driving. Something meant to give excellent idle, cold starting, all weather performance in the 800-2800rpm range where a daily driver spends its time. That medium rise single plane is gonna run like a scalded dog in the upper half of the tach...which the dyno graph bears out...but it's gonna run like shit down low.
I am not sure I understand the concept of trying to make a gen 5 into a lowbread gen 1 and gen 4 engine with a carburetor. It makes no sense to me at all. But it looked cool and was a entertaining segment. I personally would not ok full pulls on 34 to 36 psi oil pressure. Thats bad judgement in my opinion and doesnt reflect so well. But despite my un filterd judgement. It ran nice looked and sounded good. So overall, nice engine.
Personally, I think it's always more than ok to put a carb on modern engines. In fact, I wish more people would. There are a lot of really good carbs being produced by boutique carb builders that perform very well. So yeah, new school self learning injection that masquerades as dominators are just as cool as actual old school dominators feeding new school engines. And that is Just my dos pesos 😎
Notice they didn’t show you two dyno graphs comparing that same engine combo direct injected vs carbureted. Perfect sales trick. Katech has an LT1 that makes over 700 hp naturally aspirated.
With this combo with a few of my ls hp tweaks this engine could make over 700 hp.the carb is to small. That particular carb is realistically only a 820 cfm.i put a pro systems 1000 cfm on there with a supervictor intake and jump timing up to 32°.I be curious what those heads flow stock.Also like to see the cost of this build
@2:43 what do you mean you wasn’t excited? That engine currently holds the the stock block GM 6psd manual record running a 6.97 @211 mph in a ‘97 Camaro! Put some respect on that platform’s name dammit! Look up GrubWorm Camaro!!!!! A stock block LS can only DREAM of running those numbers!
