In response to your questions about the requirement for 3-phase electricity supply, Dr. Chris gave his thoughts: "The grid operators look at the worst possible case for export in their calculations. They look at 5.5kW of solar being produced, with 10kW of power from the batteries, and no loads, and see if the grid can handle this 15.5kW of export (in this case they found it couldn't on 1-phase). In real life, you wouldn’t see the solar producing its maximum and the batteries fully discharging at the same time, so the grid operators are being very cautious here. Indeed the batteries are designed to discharge such that no electricity goes back to the grid! The grid connection regulations were initially set up for back-up generators; if Robert had a 15kW diesel generator in his home these rules would make sense. But they do seem a bit dated to work for modern solar/battery systems."
Single phase can easily handle 40kwh. They make it hard as possible to hook up to the grid. We aren't allowed solar or batteries in East Tennessee at all. If you want solar, you have to unhook from public utilities and run totally off the grid or separate systems that aren't connected at all.
Personally, as a long time FC viewer, I find these sort of videos much more interesting than the cars. EV's are almost getting old news now. All the major manufacturers are committed to them, infastrue rollout is happening at pace and their mass adoption is a matter of when not if. Home energy and the implementation of the sort of technology in this video is the new frontier now. There's so many possibilities and the impacts will be profound in terms of how we generate, use and pay for electricity not to mention the networks that distribute it. Great work, more videos like this please.
About 30% of CO2 is produced by transport systems, and 30% CO2 is produced by buildings (heating system). Batteries and Energy Storage is the major breakthrough in reducing CO2 in the atmosphere, and to help stop global warming. That is why both EVs and (regenerative) Electricity Storage is so important. Elon knew why he went into this business, and why taking over SolarCity to build batteries for cars, buildings, and electricy grids was so important. That is what the Giga Factories are for. Thank you Elon for waking up the world, and competing with the rest of the Automobile Industry. He is even building GigaFactory 4 here in Germany! Fantastic.
@@debadityasaha1684 Says the genius that has no clue of what he speaks. Why is that people like you can't deal with simple truths. EVs are not valid alternatives yet. End of story. Neither is solar and wind. Why do you think Germany and other countries in the EU are going back to coal? The entire AGW/CC is a proven hoax. You just don't want to believe it as you are pathological.
@@niconesta8566 The irony still exists regardless of the physics. I do actually work with three phase on a regular basis. 400amp via powerlock, though it used to be a busbar when I started... so yeah, you could say I have more of an understanding than most.
My thoughts exactly! Why is it we stray farther away from making solar available to the masses?the ROI on something like this has to be ludicrous and quite amusing to your utility.So whatever efforts were made by your neighbors to level the playing field you manage to tilt it again with labor,permiting,material fees and their respective markups from you utility provider.So much for free energy!
It is only a problem for those who want to be self sufficient in electricity generation while still would like the idea of being connected to the grid. Take the bloody house completely off grid and nobody cares!
My PW2 was installed in December 2018, 9 years after our solar panels were installed. Our panels are great, but we ended up only 40% self-powered. Our aim and hope was that the powerwall would enable us to increase to 80% self-powered, and it has been very successful, and we are now almost 90% self-powered.
Dr. Chris Jardine is an exceptionally erudite explainer of things esoteric and complicated. Well done, Doctor Jardine. Robert Llewellyn, your website is always interesting, thank you.
Maybe someday a true power GRID would do exactly that. It would reduce the load on the overall system if it was only transporting power through neighborhoods.
David Bunney technology is advancing and the energy companies have ignored technology for too long. Now it’s running away from them and they must change or be left behind in history.
@@77gravity after going though the bush fires in Australia many homes did not have power for 2 months. I would have loved to have been able to pass some on the power I produced from my 6.3 kva PV system to my neighbours . Learnt a real lesson on how dependant we are on those grid connections. Do it properly and F%#k em
Sparks: does a nice tidy job-trunking, well clipped cables, SWA etc. Electrical network operator: Sticks lumps of chipboard & plywood on wall, surface wires meter and main fuses...
Thanks for this and all your work on electric stuff. I am working on changing my company to electric in a big way. We do Landscaping and over the year we have stopped using 2-stroke oil and petrol for our lawnmores and strimmers to battery. It's not easy and it's not cheap but it's good and I see improvements that were not expected. Were adding a 6kw pv system and batteries of over 10kw. We plan to add more but need 3phase and more money so it's in time. We will be getting pv of about 30kw and a electric van leaving us with just the ride on lawnmore on diesel. But that looks to be 2 years away. Just wanted to show you that your helping me change as will as others me thinks. Thanks again Garrett Fox in Ireland
It's hard to believe that I've been waiting almost 50 years for this. I saw my first electric car show in...believe it or not...1963. Then during the 70's, watched a lot of residential photovoltaic installations go up. But the cars were lead-acid batteries, and the pv installations were woefully inept. So it only took a few wars and half a century.
As someone who lives in a 3-phase house, I can tell you this raises lots of questions. For domestic wiring, each phase is normally a completely separate circuit, so presumably you have one powerwall on phase A, one on phase B, and nothing on phase C, so in a powercut anything connected to phase C will stop working. Each powerwall will only drive loads on the relevant phase, so when one is empty, everything on that powerwall dies, right?. Which means a lot of planning to make sure your freezer stays on in a powercut, etc.... Also, if the Zappi is now wired as a 3-phase device and connected to all 3 phases, then it too will stop working in a powercut because only 2 of the phases are powered, which otherwise sounds pretty scary from a phase balancing point of view. Is that how the house is wired, or have Tesla got something really clever that somehow magically combines the phases????
Finally something about the house. I mean, can you please do more videos about House Solar PV systems ( the new technologies, and the optimization of using PV systems ). I have done by myself PV System of my house ( project, purchase and the installation), but here in France we're quite behind in technologies innovation ( I do miss my life in London ). The world of PV System is changing quite rapidly, so it'll be great if you will keep covering PV House/Industrial Systems the innovations and the latest news. Best regards from France
I agree George I'd like to see more information about alternative electric heating systems as this is the next big challenge to eliminate fossil fuels?
Great episode. I own from 2 years PW2 in Australia with the gateway and what surprises me in my if the grid goes off then the batter start to support home in milliseconds, so you will be not able to see it. There is no delay at all, so all home equipment run as normal. You do not need to set up 10 clocks on different stuff :-))).
Thanks for the video. One thing, prices are NOT coming down, they are only going 1 way. If you have solar you should aim to eventually have a battery with it.
Also did not properly explain everything. Dr. Chris Jardine was incorrect on his single phase description. Single phase has 2 hots and a neutral. If you are going to install this stuff you need to know about electricity I would think!
@@hellviper944 Nearly right: It's actually live, neutral and earth - and done depend upon the colour of the wires. Traditionally live used to be red, neutral was black and earth was green or bare wire. These days, conventionally, it can be live - brown, neutral - blue, and earth - yellow and green. And all these colours can be different in different countries and according to what your electrician had available at installation time (thinking of Italy for that last one).
@@andygilbert1877 Sorry, but I think you will find you are all wrong. Now there is a strong claim. Single phase in Australia and England uses a single wire to a neutral that is 240 v potential. That neutral is earthed at the pole and at the home. There is no other source of voltage. In North America, and I asked a line technician about this one, the supply to the house is called single phase because the transformer uses just one of the three phases out in the street. It then goes to a transformer that has a centre tapped winding creating the neutral. That is earthed at the pole and in the home. So between the neutral point and the two ends of this winding there is a PD of 120vac, and a difference between the two windings of 240vac because they are 180 degrees out of phase. So there are two phases in your home supplied by a single phase out in the street. Helpful much?
Not to sound arrogant but the installation as long as normal German standard is concerned is OK at best. Why. The bending of the cables you're able to see is not even close to being acceptable here.
@@abdul9 I worked with Germans when I built my house (it's a German prefab), and you guys take the view that there are 2 ways to do anything 1) The German way 2) The wrong way. And guess what, you're not always correct ;-)
You guys are living in LA LA land the average citizen could not afford to have this put in their house, this is ridiculous quit smelling your own farts and come down and explained to the American people how we could do this at a reasonable cost
We have a Fronius Solar Battery (for 3 years now) and it not only can charge with direct DC (ie. efficient) from the panels - including all that power that would normally be clipped by the utility company limiting inverter production - but it can power the house over three phases quite happily... even if the grid goes down. The 'backup gateway' in the Fronius system is simply the Fronius inverter... it's much less hardware (and neater) than that Tesla setup! I have a battery, inverter and just my standard switchboard. No other boxes. I can't believe how much hardware is on that garage wall!
I’m in Southern California and I went with a battery from a company in San Diego called NeoVolta. In California you have to install an AC shutoff on the outside of your house (basically a lever that kills the grid to the house) and I can pull it and the NeoVolta will turn on within 1 second and the house will run completely off the battery. In an extended outage, the battery controls the panels so will turn the panels on/off to charge itself, all without grid connection. I am super happy and would recommend NeoVolta to others. Tesla is a great company however I’ve discussed with several installers that the complexity of the Powerwall installation + the extras to make your home truly run off grid is not worth it. Additionally the state rebate for the NeoVolta was better and the installation costs were lower.
Great episode! The guests spoke very clearly and concise. Every question that popped into my head while watching this (such as, can you still charge from solar when the mains power is out) was answered which is also great. More of these house intergration videos please!
I like this Dr Chris Jardine. Knowledgeable, communicates well, and seems completely free of bullshit or marketing hype. That is also a really great system, especially when most energy utility feed-tarifs seriously blow hard for any kind of ROI.
Great Update, thanks Robert! :-) Since I'm tenant of a souterrain appartment in an originally one family's home in southern Germany (remember: three phase connected :-) ), being lucky to get permission for an own off-grid PV, I'm burning for your PV series (and anything I can get hands on where- and whenever possible). Building it single-handed I'm deep in all details, both the electrics and the crafts. Therefore: Chapeau to your solasters! My to be installed "hybrid inverter" (with the solar charger integrated) will guaranty my appliances running uninterrupted in case of missing solar input and empty batteries by switching back to the grid in 10 ms. Advantage: The inverter does exactly what Tesla's backup gateway does - physically preventing any energy flowing *into* the grid. Unfortunatly, the German law doesn't accept this as proof for "off-grid", instructing these facilities to be registered both at the authorities and the local network operator (who would install a no-return electric meter for your mentioned protective reasons). Since there is no way of detecting such facilities, it's used anyway in those occasions, without registration. ;-) Disadvantages: As semi-off-grid plant I'll loose any power that couldn't be used locally (home electricity, EV, hot water etc.). And I don't have the money for an electric car yet. Will follow next asap. Secondly, with the official legal status in mind, no solaster or electrician would take the risk of being punished for breaking a law (although no single one has been punished until now). This is the reason for my diy project. Another thought to the batteries: In combination with my (2nd hand) 1.5 kWp solar array, my 3 Pylontech US2000+ battery modules (in summary 7.2 kWh, providing 6.6 kWh useful per cycle) cover about 50% of my yearly electricity consumption (with feeding-in they could theoretically cover 100%!). Economically a Powerwall won't pay off for the rest of my life, there are faint chances for that goal with my cheaper Chinese high quality LiFePO4 batteries. Thanks again for sharing your update, hopefully my own wasn't too boring. :-) Carry on, as subscriber I'll stay tuned!
100 years from now this will be the norm , everyone will have houses far better than this, a person to do this now starts the change that is inevitable! Well Done and fairplay
Professor Simon Holland I have a powerwall with backup gateway and my power is completely seemless in backup operation. Computers, clocks, router all continue uninterrupted. I don’t know why his went off, only thing I can think is that it is something to do with it being 3 phase, but I can’t see why that should make any difference.
Professor Simon Holland I have a powerwall with backup gateway and my power is completely seemless in backup operation. Computers, clocks, router all continue uninterrupted. I don’t know why his went off, only thing I can think is that it is something to do with it being 3 phase, but I can’t see why that should make any difference.
same here in rural Suffolk, but i do enjoy the power cuts. i love watching my kids struggle with no internet ! ha ha, i just pick up a book and put plenty of candles on and sit by the wood burner. lovely ! take care all !
We live on the east coast too. Power dropouts are quite common. I have several small UPS backups to protect sensitive computer/servers etc from these small power interruptions.
Have been running fully off grid on wind, solar and battery for 28 years. Multiple buildings, two residences all usual appliances including air conditioning etc etc. Running on second generation power station since 2013. Three AC coupled inverters Selectronic networked with two Kacos. Max available power 19.5kw. storage 90kwh.
cost of the battery is a 12 year payback time for a 10 year life spam, the carbon emissions from building and manufacturing the battery take 8-9 years to offset, if your not a heavy electricity user that could blow out to 10-11 years, so we have established there's no economic reason to have the battery, no environmental reason, if you live off grid then yes this is useful, your paying for the "feel good", if you want to save the world invest in hydrogen power generation.
SuperJohn12354 it’s not an economic or environmental issue. It’s far more important than that. It’s about virtue signaling and showing your neighbors that u are actively saving the planet while they are busy destroying it. The geeks that install these are the usual suspects, sandal wearing ,ponytailed, treehugging, holier than thou, types that are more than willing to lose money in order to appear “green” and clean.
If the UK version of the Tesla Backup Gateway (BUG) is the same as the USA version it will only have that long delay the first time. The gateway is learning. The second and subsequent times it switches over will occur in milliseconds. Here is Colorado I've had nine grid power outages in the last year. Most of them are are for only 5 minutes, but two were for two and three hours. During all of them I didn't see my lights flicker and my TV, stereo receiver, and computers are not disturbed. Filming the first test doesn't do it justice.
I was going to make the same comment, I have a powerwall with backup gateway and I've only known about any power cuts as the app has told me, no noticeable disruption to anything in the house.
The backup switch I have, I have to personally go and change. 🤣 at least he has an automatic switch... but I live in an area with abundant sunshine, so it is enough from the batteries to run the night. So totally off grid, except on rainy season.
@@RichardOzanne I have had the exact same system installed at my house, and when the engineer switched off the grid power, my house lights didn't even flicker! Not sure why it took so long to switch over in this clip!
I have 3 Powerwalls, single phase grid power, 12 kW peak solar. It all works great. I have my batteries set to 25% retention for power outage backup. My batteries fill up by mid day (25% to 100%, 3 batteries), the rest of the solar goes into the grid until the sun goes down (I receive a credit on my bill), then I run off my batteries throughout the evening and night. When grid power goes off, I have NO FLICKER or pause. My gateway switch is milliseconds, so even my digital clocks do not need resetting. The only way I know my grid power has turned off is when the gateway sends me a text on my phone. This setup in the video seems quite clunky and house power fails for several seconds before going to battery power. What a difference.
Thanks for sharing this! It's good to hear others' experiences. We are rural and have quite a few power cuts, which is why we chose the Tesla battery with our PV system. There have been 7 cuts since installation in September and the battery has had to provide an hour, in total, of backup power. We are computer dependent so continuity is important to us! Only once did we notice a cut happening, because an internal circuit tripped out. Usually the most warning is a flicker of the lights. The other feature that I really like on the battery is 'Stormwatch', which automatically fills the battery ahead of an event like Storm Ciara or Dennis and does not discharge until the danger is over. Although elements of the system can be installed outside, it is still rather large and will take up a lot of wall space. It is also not silent, so bear in mind when choosing a location. These are early days for storage, but batteries are sophisticated and worth considering if you have the space and the cash. (On the other hand, I've come across someone who uses old milk-float batteries for an off-grid life.)
I have seen many videos, and this one is the best I have seen simply because it responds to many questions most people interested in those technologies would ask themselves. Good job!
Had my powerwall and gateway 2 a few months ago and was surprised to see how long your battery’s took over the grid, mine is instant ( maybe this is due to your 3 phase supply ) noticed a few people asking about cost my standard single phase house cost £8500 fully installed pw2 and gateway 2. I’m doing a 2020 cost analysis to work out how long it will cost to pay back in real life situations on my channel.
I've had my Powerwall2 & solar since Oct 2018. Southern England. We used virtually no grid electricity from 24th March to 24th Sept. House use for year was 9.9 kWh per day with grid use at 4.2 kWh per day so saved 64%. The battery provided 1160 kWh to the house. So at 14.5p/kWh saved me £168. Going to take a while to pay for itself! (Cost was £5600 I think).
Dave Pinnell here is a link to the first of a few short videos about my circumstances before 2020 year, please ask any questions or if you want anymore information ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-G2aJYjnlL3A.html
9:16 Now I get why the solar inverters typically shut off in a power outage, and the importance of a physical relay interruptor. Never understood that before.
Even my small plugin solar system does that, no power on the pins when not plugged in or when the power is out. That safety is good. I can off course unplug the mc4 connector myself during poweroutage to connect a small battery to the solar panels to have some juice for my devices.
Your solar inverters also shut down if they detect the line voltage coming into your house being too high (say 252V instead of 240V). What was explained to me is that sometimes the linesmen need to work on a live distribution network but with limited Amps ... so yes they could get a small shock but not get fried. So they cut down the power being pushed into the grid and feed a "low power" 252V test 'signal' - I guess you can test for short circuits and leaks or whatever, but safely. Obviously they don't need a bunch of enthusiastic solar PV generation installations dumping huge amounts of power into what should be a 'test mode' grid when they work on it.
I did this stuff years ago, with no feedback to grid, just upgraded batteries/inverters/charge-controller/PVs as my grid-bill dropped. Now I'm off-grid. I have a back-up generator just in case (not used it since initial test/installation, except for maintenance/tests). Re-sell inverters/chargers as/if/when you outgrow them, or save one as a back-up. All my Heating/HW is bio/solar/heat-exchanger-storage. One thing I would recommend is separate PV-charger arrays so that if one is faulty/shaded etc you don't degrade all collection. Stupid idea that you 'have to upgrade to 3-phase', you were conned.
Awesome video Robert, thanks for a terrific explanation, best I’ve seen. G’day from sunny, hot Brisbane - 33C here today with 5kW coming from my 6.5kW of solar, and of course one (small) A/C running, (mainly for reducing the humidity.) We will still feed a lot to the grid even after charging our Model 3 back up to about 65%, which is where I keep it if we’re not doing a big trip. Love your juicy lumpy organic goodness!
Point of clarification, I have almost exactly the same configuration installed (same PV output and 2 power walls), but without the Gateway on a single phase supply. I am able to use the advance mode of charging the power wall's overnight on a cheap rate. It is my understanding that the level of charge/time of year intelligence is in the power wall firmware NOT the gateway. Therefore, you don't need a gateway to run this functionality.
Yes, this is correct - it is the firmware that manages the advance charging, so this functionality works on the older non-back-up gateway as well. I do talk about this at 13:12.
@@chrisjardine7406 Hi Chris, can you clarify which phases everything was connected to in Robert's system? Did you move the solar array or the original powerwall off the original phase to which the house was connected? If not, only the new ("free") powerwall would be on a second phase, with the zappi connected to all three. I have a property with all three phases so am interested!
Here in Melbourne Australia, we are running 2X power wall 2's fed by 10 kw of solar (26)panels. Since the second power wall 2 has been installed we have not used any grid supply for 2 months during Spring. The entire system is running on a single phase.
Some missing, important details here. The PowerWalls are AC and single phase each - so I'm guessing they're only connected to two of the three phases (or both on one phase)? If that's the case, the 'whole house' isn't being run by them in backup mode, just those circuits connected to the PowerWalls. There are also power output limits which would limit what you can run on each phase, including peak load.
MacGyver Is that a fact or are you guessing? If that’s the case, how does the Gateway phase shift the different phases if they’re coming from a single AC source, because the AC can’t all be in the same phase (waveform) to power three phase equipment properly... the AC sine waves must be offset for true three phase supply. I’d be keen to know the details as to how this is achieved.
@@nitramluap It isn't made clear in the video but I would guess that the Backup Gateway is on the same phase as the house always was, and the solar array, with the original Powerwall. The other Powerwall would be on a different phase. This would mean only the contents of the first Powerwall would be available to power the house in the event of a power outage, but that should suffice in reliable old UK! Charging the second Powerwall from solar is, I guess, a process whereby the solar is actually being fed back TO the grid on the first phase, with the Gateway arranging to get exactly the same power FROM the grid on the second phase into the Powerwall. The meter would nett the input and output to record zero. Anyone able to confirm or deny my hypothesis?
I live in Central Europe. My old apartment had a single-phase supply and using too many appliances at the same time would trip the fuse box. My current apartment has three phase to deal with extra load (induction hob, AC unit etc). When we had our cottage connected to the grid we were given the choice between single and three phase, and were recommended single with the option to upgrade to three phase temporarily if needed. Three phase is a bit more risky and expensive.
Looking to build a house in El Paso, Texas, so this was very informative. Obviously the sun will produce quite a lot of power, but conversely, we will be cranking air conditioning constantly. In the UK, your AC needs are miniscule by comparison. That's a win in your favor.
Lyndon Rive (CEO SolarCity, and Elons Cousin) signed my system ... sky-solaranlagen.de/solarcity-tesla-aus-usa-zu-besuch-2/ 3-Phase, Tesla Powerwall 1 System which I designed and had built 3 years ago - the first in Europe. Here is proof ... Solar Energy Film | m.ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-VXW8MJ1lVH4.html .. filmed by Tesla Energy Europe in 2016.
Just signed up for a full solar array and Powerwall 2 purely because of this (and the other Powerwall Video you did). Big investment but hopefully well worth it. Cheers Mr Llewellyn. 👍👍😃
Working on the construction of a new school, with Solar PV, scheduled for completion Oct 2020. Exploring the cost/benefit of adding a Powerwall to secure energy access AND to reduce operating costs for the school. Also installing EV charge points for staff and public use.
The Back Up Gateway has been around since the Tesla Powerwall 2 came out, as I have had one since 2017, but im in Australia, so I presume the Backup Gateway 2 addresses whatever it was that was required for it to work in the UK. Anyway when the grid goes down our Powerwall kicks in instantly, I usually don't even notice.
you can get some that use relays or some that use motor driven hard switches, they said it had to be physically disconnected as that's the rule in the UK so they would have used the motor driven transfer switch, this takes time, but in your case you must be using the new kind that uses relays these put your inverter into island mode
In India, when we used to have a lot of power cuts some 6-8 years ago, ups+inverters and batteries became a very common thing in every household. They way these inverters work is, they pass mains through when mains is available, but switch to battery power when there's a power cut. Of course these systems don't export power to the grid. But it's very normal here to run your home entirely off of battery power for 5-6 hours.
PSA for customers in the United States: Three phase is not required for multiple Powerwalls in the U.S. Electrical code and power company regulations are much different in Europe. You are also able to use the Powerwalls as backup energy supply in the event of a power outage. I work for The Green Panel out of Michigan. We are a Tesla certified installer and authorized dealer.
HUH!? 😯 The amount of time for the batteries to kick in was pretty disappointing. I expected it to be instantaneous like a UPS, with a little flicker of the lights at most. So you still need a UPS for any sensitive electronics in the house. Why can’t it work like one?
Needs to securely disconnect from the grid before it can power up the for again. There is a lot more juice in a power wall than a ups. Grid companies likely wouldn't allow it if it didn't do it slowly and checked 5 times.
Probably also related to the fact it's 3-phase - so it has to disconnect (in effect) 3 separate supplies, and verify all there are safe, before telling everything else they can power up again...
Kind of shocking that tech isn't in the Powerwall, then they've put out the Gateway as a whole intermediary system - still no UPS. You'd think it would be one of the easier problems to solve, regulatory hoops notwithstanding.
@@moarsaur exactly what I don't get!!! Like why the heck did the lights go off?!? That's a computers worth of work lost, everything in the house without a battery resetting, grandma dead from a lack of oxygen because we thought a big battery was a "backup"!!! We need to start viewing batteries as our MAINs power and the grid as our "backup"!! Then we'll actually get somewhere with all of this!!
One of the points you touched on about the difference between import and export prices. The more people who cover their own electricity use and feed into the grid, although they may be levelling those peaks, they are not paying that 10-15p toward maintaining the national infrastructure. Which means everyone else paying more to cover your share, and so with higher percentages of uptake that won't be sustainable. There has been talk about shifting to fixed standing charges with use becoming less significant in the bill. When solar panels/batteries take decades to pay off, this kind of talk of shifts in pricing make it more and more risky to invest in installing.
We had our Tesla solar roof (solar tiles not panels) installed with two powerwalls in June/July 2019 and I am still trying to get a handle on the gateway software. There are three settings or charging schemes available (1-powerwall charging is prioritized 2-balancing between solar use and grid use constantly 3-where you can set up when to best use solar depending on the variable cost the electric company uses throughout the day). The electronics are extensive but not as much as what was shown in the video which could be the difference between the US and UK. The main difference is that our backup gateway seems to be integrated into the inverter set up because there is absolutely no loss of power when the grid goes down and our system switches to stored electricity...maybe a slight flicker but small enough that we are unaware of the grid being down. And the roof installation was flawless from the old rood competely removed to the beams, new thicker ply installed, a new double thick barrier made by Firestone that is waterproof and fireproof installed and the Tesla glass tiles installed. All the work was done by Tesla (Solar City) with the utmost professionalism and safety and it looks brilliant. We were the second install in Los Angeles county and it did come at a bit higher price point but with the warranties on the installation and products it was worth it.
In Phoenix AZ US (33.42 N Latitude) and according to my basic Solar Edge 7.3kW GT inverter, the 9.2kW of panels attached to it generated 62kWh & 41kWh respectively this past year on Summer/Winter Solstice day. Both days were cloudless. Cost to to self-install the system 3 years ago was $18K USD before government rebates/incentives and the system’s upfront cost will be completely recouped next year. Eat YOUR heart out 😉.
@@NoGasWelcomeAboard That is great. However, my 5kWh Solar Edge Inverter and 22 (6kWh) Solar Edge panels cost me only Au$6000 installed after government subsidies. Plus, I receive Au$0.07 for every kWh exported to the grid (which is about 36kWh per summer day and import about 9kWh from the grid at 28 cents per kWh), meaning that the system should ideally pay for itself in 5-6 years. For Au$18000 after government subsidies, I could potentially be generating 135kWh per day in summer and 45kWh on short, cloudy winter days, although I would then receive no feed-in-tariff due to it being an oversized system. Systems are however being developed locally, where I should be able to sell my surplus power to neighbors for potentially more than the current 7 cents per kWh paid by the grid operator.
Me also... my Victron Energy system balances input from grid, solar and batteries and switches fully to batteries/solar in milliseconds - computers, TV, light etc all stay on and the anti-islanding prevents any power going back out to the grid.
Wow that’s amazing, but wait a minute, 25 years ago I installed a 10kW Victron inverter providing completely bumpless switchover from mains to battery and back again. Back then the batteries were lead acid but at a fraction of the cost of L’ion.
Great work..!!! 3 phase x 30A, 40A or 60A is standard practice in most developed Europe for the last 30 years. Even Cyprus adopted 3 phase as standard practice since the late 90s. Its the best way forward.!!
I am one of your Australian viewers who you must envious of for sun in winter! I was curious to see you had to upgrade your power and deal with the grid when getting your powerwall. We had a totally different experience with our two powerwalls- enough sun all year round to completely disconnect the grid entirely and are now stand alone. Even in winter we generate 30+ kWh per day for our two powerwalls. Plenty of power to run a house! (No central heating required!!) Thank you for your great videos sharing this amazing technology.
Congratulations on getting the powerwall installed. I hope it really works out for you,. It will be interesting to see where this technology is in 10 years time and how much it has advanced by. This is probably not the forum for it.......... but screw it I am really looking forward to the red dwarf movie.
As a person who has designed data centers for over 2 decades I find such episodes amusing. Tesla no doubt has accomplished many great things but looking at the amazement on the host’s face when it took multiple seconds for the switchover to happen left me flabbergasted. In a data center this has to happen in milliseconds so that no computers “crash”. The DG switches on in about 2 mins while the UPS keeps all systems running without missing a beat.
Great video, I've been looking forward to this one! Please do a video on Lithium Iron Phosphate (LiFeP04) batteries used for stationary storage applications like this. It is the far safer and more environmentally-friendly option, as compared to Lithium Ion Cobalt (such as the Tesla Powerwalls) or sealed lead acid. It is currently more expensive, but as I understand it that is only because it isn't being manufactured at the same scale.
Stephen Shumaker the cobalt use in Tesla Batteries is the lowest in the industry, they lead the world in that aspect... given time I’m sure it will be lower yet.
@@slim1100 I'm aware, and I hope they continue on that path. Still, LiFeP04 makes more sense for stationary storage, and Li-Ion Cobalt makes more sense for passenger vehicles. Tesla wants to have just one battery manufacturing line, so they use the same type for everything.
I have had a 10kw solar array with 3 Sonny Boy inverters for a few years now. They are “secure power” inverters that need no grid power to operate. The system will not allow flow back to grid during an outage. Each inverter has it’s own 1500w outlet that kicks on 45 seconds after power out.
Tesla is one of my favorite companies to watch out for, especially with the supercaps aquisition of Maxwell and the rumors around the Solid state battery. However, for a house battery going on Lithium Ions isn't what "clean energy" is about. Because we dont need to safe weight or room specificall for that application it would be nice if you covered an episode on a sodium Ion battery built for a house, such as greenrock. My parents actually just installed one in their new house. I haven't seen it personally but I would love to see what those are capable of. Most importantly, can you cross over systems with the Tesla grid lock with systems like that...
The real switch will come when home-based batteries become 'stupid not to' level tech. We don't need it to be small or light, we need it to work and last. Na-ion might be the answer to that.
Elon is installing a system in Australia where ultimately 50,000 houses will have such systems installed - with all linked sideways to each other to produce a town-wide grid that can be independent of the country main grid. Already the pilot scheme of 100 houses has prevented a blackout. The next phase of 1000 houses due soon and if successful funding for the full 50,000 will be released. In the future linking whole towns sideways would be possible. Making a few dirty power stations redundant.
@@harrypalmer7578 - The report doesn't specify the town - just South Australia. More info available from google. www.independent.co.uk/news/world/australasia/elon-musk-tesla-batteries-australia-homes-virtual-power-plants-free-solar-panels-a8196656.html
Three phase is standard in the States... we call that 240 volts which is two 120v lines with a shared ground. We run dryers, ranges and water heaters on the 240.
I live in the US. I got a letter from our local electricity supplier about back up generators, they insist anyone who has one has to have a cut off like yours so it doesn't endanger people working on power lines
Hmm, I was told backup systems are instantaneous (new ones). There are various types, but you definitely need a continuous and fast switching PS to keep your electronics safe. Seeing how a brand new tech like Tesla failed to switch power on for several seconds is weird. Or maybe they just use Tesla batteries and not a complete package. He did say he got it for free.
One thing not mentioned on the video is the house circuit split across the phases. How have you set this up? PW is a single phase device. Are these both on one phase? If so, have you split your house circuits so “essential” loads are on this phase and therefore backed up with other phase loads going off in the event of a power cut?
Hi, we did film this but it looks like it didn't make the edit! The Tesla Powerwall gateway only backs up one of the 3 phases. We have Roberts house run off the backed-up phase. The car chargers, and hot water top up are not backed up and are on phase 2 - if there was a power cut you wouldn't want to dump the stored power into a car. Phase 3 is being reserved for Robert to do V2G in future.
Around 14:00 it sounds like the philosophy of using Powerwalls for taking advantage of off-peak tariffs is the same as what's behind old-school "storage heaters," which are essentially boxes full of bricks you can heat up overnight while electricity is cheap, and then open the vents and use the heat during the day when the tariff goes up.
Exactly it's about a 100 grand for what you're looking at if not more it turns your house into a miniature power plant ridiculous warning don't let your kids get near it it could kill them
@@michaelmcmenzie6928 the incoming supply looked quite low down the wall but the rest of the installation was immaculate. What aspect are you worried about?
excellent; just back watching again now after having my two Powerwalls installed and sying bye-bye to my electricity bill (including daily connection fee); next getting rid of gas HWS thengas Central heating
The handover confuses me, because installations done in North America, the handover is uninterrupted. Is this a restriction from some regulation in his country or is it a faulty installation?
www.tesla.com/en_GB/powerwall 2 powerwalls with the equipment needed would cost £14,100, then you have to pay for the installation and 3 phase upgrade... ouch!
@@con1989 lol well like they said most people don't have to upgrade to 3 phase, and definitely not £14,100 for 2 power walls in australia :D I think you pay more outside-of-usa-tax than we do. (it seems to be about 2/3rds of that price before subsidies)
If someone payed for a car with, for example, 40 kWh battery, it makes some sense to buy something like Powerwall only until such cars will feature Vehicle To Grid (V2G). Unfortunately cars with CCS plug cannot have this wonderful feature yet (and they probably won't until 2025).
I also have the goal of importing nothing during the early evening peak. I've been achieving it since mid 2017, with a 1-phase SolarEdge system. It has a feature called a charge/discharge profile, which I've got set up to fill the battery from the grid between 3pm and 5pm. Simple but effective.