CFMOTO 450NK - is it GOOD? A Chinese Motorcycle??

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The CFMOTO 450nk, my first impressions and thoughts about owning a Chinese motorcycle. Is it built well? How do you buy one? Is there a warranty? Will it do a Wheelie??? Lets see what we can figure out. Testing the CFMOTO 450nk!
My Gear
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0:00 Intro
0:14 Who is CFMOTO
0:55 A Chinese Motorcycle
1:32 Buying a CFMOTO
2:01 Supporting China?
2:39 450nk Close look
4:32 What should I do
5:56 Test Ride
9:33 Does it Feel Chinese
11:29 0-60 times
12:22 TCS issues
13:07 Wheelies
13:25 Highway Riding
14:15 General Testing
15:43 Final Thoughts
Business inquiries,
thegardensnakeyt@gmail.com

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Опубликовано:

25 июл 2024

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Комментарии : 166

@wlt3585 7 месяцев назад

Just an FYI for anyone curious, since 2017~ CFMoto has been creating parts (including engines) for KTM, and KTMs reliability has noticeably increased since. Enough time hasnt passed for CFMotos own products to prove reliable,but thats a good start

@AjackLee4 7 месяцев назад

They also make parts for Kawasaki

@jimperry4420 7 месяцев назад

Verysys 650

@wlt3585 7 месяцев назад

@@AjackLee4I was not aware of that, thats great to note

@Jesus-eu4gn 7 месяцев назад

Oh wow. So China is actually pumping out good parts

@sph1nx420 7 месяцев назад

I believe that the current ktm 790 adventure is also being fully built in China by cfmoto

@flangmasterj 7 месяцев назад

Man, I'd love to see this engine in a supermoto chassis. CF Moto are doing great things right now.

@youaveragegamer3746 7 месяцев назад

Man this is the reason why I'm holding on to my money, they just released a cruiser with the same engine called cf moto 450 cl-c so a supermoto with 450 crossplane is possible.

@cmpmendes 7 месяцев назад

They are talking full advantage of their arrangement with KTM.

@inoahmann7542 7 месяцев назад

@youaveragegamer3746 if they make a twin cylinder 450 supermoto, I'll buy it as fast as I can sell my ktm 500 supermoto, assuming it makes more power of course.

@maulp0k3r 7 месяцев назад

@@inoahmann7542it would probably be slower

@mattsloop2736 7 месяцев назад

Bought a 450ss for our son. He's put 400 miles on it in just a couple months before winter hit. It had 700 when we got it. He loves it. I ride it when he's not on it and it's a great bike and I've had about every brand there is.

@logancrouse6030 7 месяцев назад

Love to see a longer trip video!

@MrMnMade 7 месяцев назад

Great to see ya on one! You'll love the 800!!

@TheCoax77 7 месяцев назад

I did a CFMoto demo ride last summer. That 450ss was amazing for what it was. A fun little bike in the twisties.

@dcmphoto7437 7 месяцев назад

I'm on my 3rd CFMoto bike, a 650 Adventura. I started buying them because the styling is cool. So far they've been very good and fun to ride. I also have a CRF300L which is how I discovered this channel. The 450 engine is a nice unit.

@roccoracer 7 месяцев назад

I bought a CF Moto 650 Adventura 2 months ago. I really like it so far. The build quality is actually really good, and the bike rides beautifully. Unfortunately, it is put away until spring, but I look forward to getting it out again.

@miscvids5778 7 месяцев назад

Great video. I’d love to see you do a review of the CF Moto IBEX 800T.

@jermss_ 7 месяцев назад

I have the 450ss and I honestly love it. Love the features and it has enough power for me(for now)

@DrewSprings 7 месяцев назад

I’d love to have a smaller displacement bike like that for a 2nd bike. Glad you got your hands on a CFMoto. I’d like to see what you do next with it.

@OlafThorbjorn 6 месяцев назад

Just go for it. I did and I don’t ride the “real bike” any more 😂😂😂😂

@mooiboyace 7 месяцев назад

I love how that Papio looks!!

@MrToolean 7 месяцев назад

That sound is amazing.

@jbcavitt 7 месяцев назад

Love the video man!! Certainly got great information on it base on your inputs. I am really curious on your thoughts on it considering you are a long time owner of an MT 07. How does it stack up to it relatively thru an enjoyment factor.

@josephvecchio8528 7 месяцев назад

finally get to see a sassy jakey vid early :)

@BigTw1nBiker 7 месяцев назад

I work at a big dealership in The Netherlands, and i have to say the reliability so far is pretty okay. however the only thing that sucks for us right now is that sometimes you have small warranty parts that need to be replaced (think of maybe a temp sensor), but the availability of the spare parts is actually terrible. if they fix that they have a very good chance of becoming a big brand thats reliable and easy to work with. the prices of the bikes are very good. also their nk650 and 700 models are 90% an ER6 engine from kawasaki, so pretty good stuff.

@junhaozhang533 Месяц назад

the predecessor 400nk has notoriously low quality reputation in China, 450 engine was their first ever original world class power plant. And they are developing 500cc 4-cylinder and 675cc 3-cylinder engine sports bike right now. thanks to CFMOTO and other upcoming Chinese brand, price of import bike has dropped significantly in Chinese market.

@Jataylor8991 7 месяцев назад

Pumped your reviewing a cf moto , this brand has been building traction the past few years and I recently took a 450ss for a ride and thought it was gutless ( my daily is a Indian scout ) can’t wait to try out the 800nk at americade next spring

@TheGardenSnake 7 месяцев назад

Well yeah compared to an Indian scout haha. Those things rip! I’ll get my hands on the 800 soon.

@christopherjohnson3377 7 месяцев назад

I have a '23 CFMOTO Papio (Like a grom). Super fun just to play around on and have some fun. I would have got a 450NK but I got a really good deal on a Honda 300. I'd love to see the 450 Adventure bike when it comes out, I feel like that will create good competition against the new RE Himalayan.

@TimothyGreen-ko2vm 7 месяцев назад

This has got me excited for the MT adventure model. Definitely possible unicorn.

@johnwillard6198 4 месяца назад

I'd love to see you take this for a long ride on the interstate as that is why I want one

@bdsurfer13 7 месяцев назад

Wow, just seeing this, yes 450 adventure, I have the clx700 sports waiting for it to get out of the shop. Waiting on CFmoto for replacement parts for 3 months. Love the bike, only wish I had one to ride while waiting for repairs.

@TheGardenSnake 7 месяцев назад

3 months? Wow that’s bad.

@donderstorm1845 7 месяцев назад

black color looks best on this bike imo. good stuff.

@Chase_N 7 месяцев назад

I stopped in at a CFMOTO dealer a few times this year and I was very surprised and impressed. Definitely not what I expected. If I could just get CFMOTO to lend me an Ibex 800 test mule or one of the 450 ADVs...The presets that you'd like are on the H-D Pan America, at least as far as ride modes. There's a literal button to just cycle through 7 ride modes- Rain, Road, Sport, Off-Road along with 2 custom street modes and 1 custom off-road mode that you can set to whatever your heart desires. There's also a button to quickly turn off/on the ABS. But, it sure won't be as inexpensive as a CFMOTO.

@davmanlop333 7 месяцев назад

I would be interested in the adventure 👍

@laurisimo1 7 месяцев назад

Make a drag race with your xr301 please❤

@IrnMaiden304 7 месяцев назад

Track day, that's what I'd like to see, probably some other people as well

@floridagamer941 7 месяцев назад

Yes, I bet it is… I got the 650NK she’s a fun bike! I’ve been watching you since Accidental broadcast was doing shit! I’m actually trying to start motovlogging and I have you as one of my main inspirations. Also listening to you in the background and I actually have a Hawk 250 and love it as well but you’re right, I had to learn a lot about the mechanics of motorcycles and really understand it to get that bike to where it’s at. I feel like it’s worth it though cuz now I know how to do a lot of my maintenance.

@flangmasterj 7 месяцев назад

Holy Accidental Broadcast, that's a throwback.

@floridagamer941 7 месяцев назад

@@flangmasterj haha ikr

@romebyoutubn 7 месяцев назад

Definitely do some motovlogging! I just got mine and would love to see more content around the 650NK. Especially app features.

@floridagamer941 7 месяцев назад

@@romebyoutubn thank you and I really needed that I can walk u thru the app If u need it

@MotorDanko 7 месяцев назад

the 270° crank on the small bike is so refreshing on a 180° world... horrible sounding bikes, and horrible feeling riding a 180° crank.

@trevorke98 7 месяцев назад

Love to see a comparison between this and an mt03 seems like something it would be in competition with. Also very interested in the adventure and sumo versions

@MrGreen-ew9ix 7 месяцев назад

Z400 is the competitor not r3

@trevorke98 7 месяцев назад

Truthfully wasn't aware the z400 existed, still think the mt03 is in the same class

@leopardpro2878 7 месяцев назад

Just to put it in perspective for some people, it's 0-60mph time is the same as a BMW M3/M5 / most Audi's / Aston Martin V8 / Acura NSX

@TheGardenSnake 7 месяцев назад

When you put it like that 😳

@AceCarleton 7 месяцев назад

It be really cool if they gave you the new 450 Adventure to try out

@iitzorion3517 5 месяцев назад

I’m currently looking at purchasing my first bike and I came across the ss version and I’m kinda stuck between that a r3 and I’m looking at a 636 possibly

@lukeparker1508 7 месяцев назад

I think a motard (or even better, a dual sport) with this engine needs to happen, there would be nothing else on the market like it. Kind of reminds me of the old SXV, but I can imagine this would be far more reliable and require an eighth of the maintenance. I just worry about the weight and handling characteristics of putting a parallel twin into a dirt bike frame, especially when haven't built a dirt bike before. I wouldn't want to take a bike on a tight trail if it weighs more than an xr650l (350lbs). The 450mt will be a step in the right direction, but I would shoot ropes for a dual sport.

@TheGardenSnake 7 месяцев назад

The thing is bikes like the 500exc or crf450rl and other plated MX style bikes, they’ll make more power then this twin 450. But you gain having a super low maintenance engine with great highway legs. Kinda like a modern air cooled 650. They’re heavier and slower then the enduro bikes. But you could ride them around the world. I’d love to see it or at least a prototype the test the concept.

@AcrylicDuck 7 месяцев назад

i want this engine on the duke 390

@mrastleysghost 7 месяцев назад

They need to put that engine in a 450 dirt bike frame and add a rally tower

@lgwappo 6 месяцев назад

In a year or two I'll be downsizing to a bike this size because I'm old & it's getting harder to pick up my bike if I drop it. I didn't know about this bike until I saw them at my dealer. Just went in to buy oil. Waiting to see how they hold up over time. Also looking at the Triumph Speed 400, Genuine G400C & Royal Enfield Hunter 400. Harley & Honda make bikes in India that I'd seriously consider but they won't bring them to the USA.

@TheGardenSnake 6 месяцев назад

It’s cool to see so many options now in this class that wasn’t even around a few years ago.

@SolarEclips86 5 месяцев назад

I have the cf moto 800 nk what a amazing motorcycle

@thatelfdoesit 7 месяцев назад

Ok jake please get the adv version i would love to see a repeat of the build on the mt07

@TheGardenSnake 7 месяцев назад

Bro believe me I wanna do that

@waynerobertson511 7 месяцев назад

@@TheGardenSnake Supposed to be available 1st quarter next year. Of course, that usually means the end of the quarter.

@Shadow.Shot.Airsoft 9 дней назад

Trying see if I want this or the z500 or Mt 03 for first bike

@NickAbbott1337 7 месяцев назад

Road trip to Houston and come do an oil change on my Husky SM an ill let you ride it :P

@remid161 7 месяцев назад

I have a CFMoto 800 SXS and I personally love the thing. I've been some crazy places with it and put it through the same abuse I did as the Polaris RZR 800 I had, and I can confidently say I prefer it. Granted I am comparing a 2102 RZR to a 2019 CF Moto, I realize that, but so many people are ready to jump on the Chinese crap bandwagon and I truly believe that this brand deserves a better shake than that. My two cents, give or take for inflation and interest rates! :P And this bike sounds sick for a stock bike BTW. Love to hear it when I'm not staring at that display :)

@TheNielsAlmelo 6 месяцев назад

Atleast the menu is quick to navigate to

@markhouston3404 7 месяцев назад

Its the support network thats missing, my old grs was only 3 years old and was impossible to find parts for. Sometimes its best to spend the extra and get a known brand.

@TheGardenSnake 7 месяцев назад

I was just up at the dealership by me that sells them and the parts guys had the parts fisher for all the cfmoto stuff pulled up. Maybe it was bad at one time but they said they can get anything pretty fast. Actually the owner was telling me about needing a part for an engine under warranty and they just sent a whole engine haha. He was like we only need this one part but I guess the costumer gets a new engine. Hey I wouldn’t complain.

@markhouston3404 7 месяцев назад

@TheGardenSnake so to me, them sending a whole engine suggests the part wasnt available. Very suspicious but i do hope im wrong.

@johnfink1322 2 месяца назад

Would you recommend this to a brand new rider

@adventureswithjay7751 3 месяца назад

If there was a supermoto version of this, I'd buy it today.

@scottporter0069 7 месяцев назад

I'm shocked. Afraid you we're gonna be a hater but you had fun.. Your spot on when your fun. 800 ibex next?

@FigginsWellington 7 месяцев назад

My local honda dealer sells these. They seem nice and good quality. Apparently cf moto makes the engines for ktm? At least that's what the dealer tells me

@TheGardenSnake 7 месяцев назад

Yeah they build a lot of KTMs stuff at this point. They have a partnership.

@syahidmazlan5255 6 месяцев назад

Do a Cfmoto 450nk vs Ktm 390

@colinclarke9379 7 месяцев назад

motard at drz price would be epic

@Dropback679 7 месяцев назад

Wonder if this would be a good stunt bike

@itsbillymaze4951 3 месяца назад

Cfmoto is part owned by yhamam and i have a nk650 for a steal and honestly its a great bike. Not on tbe same level as a mt07 but not far off.

@pfcdevin337 2 месяца назад

The supermoto and dual sport market is wide open for cf Moto to take.If they put this engine in a factory supermoto, they will destroy all competition for the right price

@thinkdunson 7 месяцев назад

10:39 engine braking is directly proportional to the engine's compression ratio. not sure how it would have anything to do with the crankpin offset. some bikes, even with high compression ratio, might have less engine braking because they're specifically designed to open the valves when the throttle is closed; thereby preventing the vacuum that causes engine braking. 13:58 my first bike was a ninja 300... it only had maybe 35 horses?... but even then, the top speed was well over 100mph, and it got there pretty quickly. so yeah, if a 300 will easily do highway speeds with decent overtaking, then there's no question about a 400 or 450.

@TheGardenSnake 7 месяцев назад

Corse plane engines have lighter flywheels typically. This will aid in acceleration and deceleration.

@CraigSmith568 7 месяцев назад

Not a bad looking bike, but personally don't care for the looks of the front. Also not a fan of the TFT screen. I prefer analog gauges so it isn't just this bike. Overall I think it's worth the money.

@zeromobile8670 7 месяцев назад

Comment section I need your help !!! can anyone tell me if a 17” x 5.50” rear rim is gonna fit on a 2009 crf250x

@maguslascivious4980 2 месяца назад

I was sure they were putting this engine in the Svartpilen... Shame they didn't Putting that in an ADV style bike, if it's not heavy, would be awesome. I wanna see a girl on the back of that thing. And you're right, a 300lb dual sport or enduro with that engine would be amazing.

@mehmetyildirim625 20 дней назад

Has it slipper clutch?

@brysonwalker5465 7 месяцев назад

What mount are you using for the 360 camera

@TheGardenSnake 7 месяцев назад

The easiest way to explain it is to check out this video I made on it. It’s not complicated but hard to explain. ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-hm9IWBYxrXg.htmlsi=VH_H97DH_HFEEB2q

@c4or2ey02 5 месяцев назад

Lol I have a hawk 250 and it's fun for a cheap bike.

@bfarm44 7 месяцев назад

For $5400 bucks you can’t go wrong

@pewpewdru 7 месяцев назад

Dude said “Neck’ed”

@phokeene9123 6 месяцев назад

Im jelly. I cant even pop a wheelie on the 450ss

@CITYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY 3 месяца назад

Shit for the price you get much more techs than other entry level bikes

@milodudeful 7 месяцев назад

honestly I've been waiting for CF to make a 600-1000cc sport bike especially if they can make it cheap. From what I've heard the engines are fairly good, but I have seen issues with the frames

@TheGardenSnake 7 месяцев назад

They did announce a 675 inline three I think and a 500 inline four. Those should be interesting. But so far this 450 seems solid. What happened with the frames? I haven’t heard about that.

@milodudeful 7 месяцев назад

@@TheGardenSnake Chaseon2wheeels i believe had an issue with the frame being improperly welded causing the rear axel to be twisted

@TheGardenSnake 7 месяцев назад

I texted chase about that and he said that wasn’t him. I tried googling it and found nothing. You sure you got that story right? Maybe it was a different brand.

@milodudeful 7 месяцев назад

@@TheGardenSnake Edit: not really a crack just a bad weld that interferes with the chain alignment, but with the amount of load in that area it kinda sketchy

@TheGardenSnake 7 месяцев назад

@@milodudeful do you have a post something you saw this? I’m trying to understand.

@Fahrenheit38 7 месяцев назад

Hey man, what mice you use?

@TheGardenSnake 7 месяцев назад

This is my set up ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-V01_M8dNHXM.htmlsi=eKvmZ_WFA9dzEK6C

@markurds001 5 месяцев назад

just bought this NK450 , 5 days old, i have this issue that everytime I downshift and blip the throttle maybe 3 to 4x times. there are times my engine dies. Is this normal? or something is wrong with the motorcylce? :(

@TheGardenSnake 5 месяцев назад

Is that in second gear? I had that happen to me like 3 times. Down shifting into second before I released the clutch and it stalls. Probably something with the fuel tuning. But those all happened when the bike had less then 100 miles. It’s got around 500 miles now and I haven’t seen this problem since.

@markurds001 5 месяцев назад

@@TheGardenSnake yes sir ! mostly downshifting into 1st gear, will check after the 500miles mark. thank you!

@skylarkesselring6075 Месяц назад

@@markurds001any update on this issue for you? Looking into this bike and looking out for issues.

@kokoterider7463 6 месяцев назад

seems smaller bike than the ver 1. ofcourse it can wheelie just look at the size of the rear sprockets looks like a stunt oversize one.

@TheGardenSnake 6 месяцев назад

Uh the rear sprockets not that big.

@bfarm44 7 месяцев назад

It’s only 250 bucks more than the cb300 Honda with a lot more power and options a much better purchase.

@brycetheshredder 7 месяцев назад

Yeah I wish this was out when I got my cb300f in 2016 but that was still a great first bike and I got rid of it after like 14 months anyways

@T3-RIDER 6 месяцев назад

Why only 2 year warranty? In the uk CFmoto give 4 years

@TheGardenSnake 6 месяцев назад

🤷‍♂️ all the other moto brands just have a 1 year. You can always add an extended one.

@user-ps5pd6jw7q 5 месяцев назад

Now you can review the Cuban and North Korean motorcycle. Have some loyalty American Patriots.

@inqufox1750 7 месяцев назад

Pretty sure CFmoto and KTM are one and the same they are partners and their 800NK is basically the KTM 790 duke and they just use a lot of the electronics and things they share with KTM like the TFT and such so when you get certain CFmoto things you're basically getting a KTM or mostly KTM and from what i hear Yamaha is about to do similar things with like the MT07 and such and start out sourcing things to make things cheaper. Like again the KTM 790 that you get in stores now is made by CFmoto so a lot of their bikes are going to feel a bit more premium but at the same time not exactly like KTM and Chinese bikes have the best track records for reliability so only time will tell if CFmoto helped or kept KTMs rep EDIT: Also pretty sure most of their bikes have WP suspension been looking into them because how affordable they seem to be for what you get so im excited to see your over all opinion on them as well and yeah this engine in a duel sport sounds awesome

@metalsadman 7 месяцев назад

they use kyb

@inqufox1750 7 месяцев назад

@@metalsadman oh really? Neat!

@reflective636 7 месяцев назад

Do you think it would be worth selling my 03' 636 for this bike?

@TheGardenSnake 7 месяцев назад

Well I mean what is your goal for the bike? What kinda riding you doing. Cuz it’s not a sport bike.

@reflective636 7 месяцев назад

@@TheGardenSnake there's just so much servicing needed to be done for the bike. Idk if it's worth keeping anymore

@TheGardenSnake 7 месяцев назад

The 450 is fun but it’s not superbike fast. I imagine it’s pretty reliable but time will tell.

@joek81981 4 месяца назад

I first rode a CF Moto in 2002'ish in BC. They're not as new as they seem. Look up the CF Moto V5. Its absolutely hilarious. THAT was the definition of an awkward, adolescent motorcycle company.

@joek81981 4 месяца назад

Actually a V3, it was called. I had a google, its worse than I remembered.

@Minionmoto529 7 месяцев назад

another bike build in the garage??? on that CFMOTO bike does it feel like it's made with quality materials/parts. it looks like a decent bike but im not sure.

@TheGardenSnake 7 месяцев назад

Next video I go over the bike up close looking it over really good. That should answer your questions on that. The videos about a Patreon already.

@chn9181 7 месяцев назад

I think you can rev it to 12k RPM

@TheGardenSnake 7 месяцев назад

I didn’t really even look what red line was. I was just going till the shift light was going off.

@adolfgerhardhermann5952 3 месяца назад

And I heard you saying it has a trash control!? TF????

@savagememes873 6 месяцев назад

CFmoto is a trusted brand. they are cheap because they exploit cheaper labour and stuff like that. their bikes are famous for being straight ass copies of other bike manufacturers bikes. CFmoto is basicaly trusted aftermarket parts seller of the bike world. buying CFmoto is like buying a aftermarket stock part vs authentic honda part.

@chrispekel5709 5 месяцев назад

The Japanese brands build in countries like Thailand and Indonesia which has even cheaper labour than China

@dcryder9736 7 месяцев назад

Will it off road 😅?

@TheGardenSnake 7 месяцев назад

Don’t tempt me!

@afallencheetah6610 7 месяцев назад

All bikes are duel sport bikes if you're brave enough.

@Nikitan275 7 месяцев назад

CFMoto bikes look great, but are they great mechanically...

@TheGardenSnake 7 месяцев назад

My next video (already out on patreon along with a dyno video) I look into the bike much closer. Really looking at the build quality up close.

@BeanoNoir 7 месяцев назад

I'm going to request that you do something, so dastardly, so insane, so intense, it's difficult to type out. I request............................... that you ride this motorcycle. You should ride it, locally, to a nearby destination, then (and here's where it gets even more unbelievable) you should ride it home. I can't believe I'm saying this out loud. I mean, I'm not saying it out loud, but it feels like I am. Man, this is hardcore.

@TheGardenSnake 7 месяцев назад

Dude I’ll die if I try that, are you crazy

@BeanoNoir 7 месяцев назад

@@TheGardenSnake Crazy like a fox. A hypothetical fox, of course. I don't want to make light of an actual crazy fox, that would be wrong. #foxmentalhealthawareness

@gingerbolam 7 месяцев назад

hey suzuki take some notes and reinvent the DRZ with this engine or CFMOTO give Suzuki a run for their money and come out with a proper supermoto

@megoingfast 7 месяцев назад

I've got the CFMoto cforce 400 atv. A few problems but it was cheap. The older motorcycles have been here 10 years back were really bad. Major improvements in the past 6 years. It's all china these days. Harley Davidson, Briggs and Stratton, etc... big engine names.

@TheGardenSnake 7 месяцев назад

Yeah like even if you buy a bike by these guys or those guys a ton of the parts, manufacturing, and possibly assembly came outa China.

@kankit230 7 месяцев назад

Had nk in my country for a few years, crap bike, low quality compared to almost any manufacturer, only thing they have good is the TFT speedometer

@jaredbowles4202 7 месяцев назад

If they sell this in a supermoto it's going to sell so damn well.

@nofovos 3 месяца назад

what you mean in US Trash control systems ?? :P you mean traction control?? :P i ask for friend in Europe :P

@kennethalcorn7104 7 месяцев назад

Cf moto quads are pure junk hopefully the bikes are better

@adamlee581 7 месяцев назад

Juuuuake

@TheGardenSnake 7 месяцев назад

Aduuuuumshlee

@miscvids5778 7 месяцев назад

First boy

@jkl1129 7 месяцев назад

You were second but good try

@TheGardenSnake 7 месяцев назад

Yeah but the first one looks like a spam account haha. But also this video came out three weeks ago on Patreon so really first comments where a while ago.