CGI Tarkin vs Real Tarkin | Comparison 

Congratulations!! About your daughter!

The are alot of pointless RU-vid videos out there. But this one wasn't one of them. The idea was great. The execution even better. Great job. Deserved the recognition.

thankyou! a good comparison, done well.. 🙂

Meh not really.

Exactly. The CGI is not quite there yet, he comes across a bit uncanny, but voice work was spot on.

In IMAX Tarkin looked fresh af. On the blu-ray not so much

@Life Sucks: You out of your mind?

carrottoponcrak True my jaw dropped seeing it im IMAX. Wasn't as impressed when i rewatched in other formats.

It's on purpose. Lightning is always used to "improve" the look of CGI (by clouding the most complex textures). It's the reason The Hobbit movies look so "shiny" all the time.

I think the lips movement was a bit fake in Rogue One

Nah if was absolutely fantastic CGI work. You arm chair computer tec experts need to stop talking...

@@Maceta444 No, it's not, lighting has been the doom of CGI for practically forever and CG artists know that quite well. finding the correct roughness levels etc. is what makes making CGI look good so hard

DerJac How obviously it took a lot of effort to pull this off, it’s just easier to nitpick the one thing that looks off instead of the thousands of things that look right, especially compared side by side

Invert Scrub wow 20 years, seems like yesterday

It was even more. 25 years

It might not necessarily look that much better 20 years from now. A lot of people believe the CGI in movies from the early 90's like Terminator 2 or the first Jurassic Park look more real than what we have now.

Invert Scrub people wont have to show up to act anymore just voice clips

Actors & actresses might be replaced by CGI. But they might get money from licensing their faces & expression though.

Of course he is!!! :)

apparently you know about his painful feet.. tarkins boots were too small for him, so whenever the shot didnt require his legs being in it, hed don a pair of slippers instead.

J0ttem They made the CGI Grand Moff Tarkin taller than the real one. The CGI one he looks like he's over 6ft tall. The real one looks like he's about 5 foot 7.

funny to imagine him with those slippers in front of Vader like "Hell yeah I'm talking to you in slippers, fuck the dress code.

Cool didn’t know this

Gerry Blue Not all CGI. Good CGI with locations and objects is barley noticeable.

Lucas cut so many scenes from New Hope that didn't look convincing. Spielberg cut scenes from Temple of Doom that looked "too" real. Whatever happened to editing?

The thing is they had the real Michael Douglas to work and model off with not as many years between the time Douglas supposeably looked in 1989 to the time Ant Man was shot and little physical change. If the same factors applied to Peter Cushing the results would be the same.

Actually, I heard the opposite. With Starship Troopers, the CGI bugs were rendered with shiny surfaces, which made them look more realistic. Though CGI realism probably depends on the surroundings and context. In this case, a shiny surface for a face would look more unrealistic.

In every movie you see post Titanic most likely has cgi objects and locations that you don't even perceive as cgi. Look up "CGI sucks but it doesn't" I'm sure you'll be quite amazed. You may view when ready.

I had noticed exactly the same thing, it's a pitfall CGI does all the time, humans are just fairly good at not wiggling

You do realize that the face is the only thing CGI

It seems like an excuse not a pay another actor tbh. If they'd tried to CGI a young Alec Guinness into Phantom Menace, we'd never have had Ewan McGregor!

zw0lfb4um An excuse to not pay an actor but instead to waste more money and funds on CGI technology instead AND getting an actual actor to provide the movement for the character AS WELL AS ANOTHER ACTOR for the voice work itself?

Guy Henry provided both movement and voice, I believe. But otherwise correct. It didn't have anything to do with cost. The comparison with Phantom Menace misses the mark as that took place many years earlier, with a young Obi-Wan. Rogue One happens just days before ANH, so they felt Tarkin had to look the same.

He just brings that classic movie vibe to everything, you can really tell he's probably the most experienced actor in any shot he's in.

WHAT??

Whhaat?

NANI?

WHA- oh everyone made the joke

So very much this.

Maybe in the re-re-re-re-re-release of Rogue One in 2077 they'll get it 100% perfect. I wonder if they'll make Tarkin shoot first....

Yeah. I think the only time its truly noticeable is when he speaks. But even then its hard to pin down exactly what's doing what that is tipping your brain off. (something to do with subtle ways other parts of your face should move when you speak)

"Do not be to proud of this technological terror you've constructed."

The voice is the biggest distraction.

It's good enough.

It's good enough to fool you the first time you see it, when you're not ready for it.

Yeah, same here!

I wonder if they could remaster rogue one at some point to make it seem like the real thing.

It's always the mouth. People don't move their upper lips on their own (it's physically impossible to do). The other muscles in your face pull your lip upward, and CGI characters usually have overactive upper lips. Honestly though, this is the very best GGI character I've seen. I was blown away watching in theaters. They did a really great job.

Well, things were more real in 1977 than they are today.

Tarkin is now not a person but a thing

It's the mouth that really sticks out the most.

lincolnlobster I prefer clone wars and rebels voice

Bradley Keats Stephen Stanton

The voice was absolutely on point. It made any mistakes in the CGI (which were few) completely irrelevant. I heard the voice and I knew it was Tarkin. The voice acting was the thing that mattered the most here. If the voice acting wasn't perfect, no one would care what the CGI looked like. But since the voice acting was perfect and the CGI was fantastic but still KIND OF evident, you didn't care as a viewer. You knew it was Grand Moff Tarkin and it was so convincing that nothing else mattered. This is the best Disney Star Wars movie by far, there's nothing even close.

Not just voice, Henry actually performed the whole act via mo-cap before his face was replaced with Cushing. He even studied Cushing's acting mannerisms to make his whole performance so close as possible.

They should have had Guy Henry as the voice (as they did), but then have Wayne Pygram as the body - the actor who played Tarkin in Revenge of the Sith. Then deepfake Peter Cushing on and you have the perfect mix.

Arpicembalo i know, but the way the video was edited it makes it seem like Tarkin was wanting to blow Vader’s ass away

I didn’t see the word “up” when I first read this and thought wow that’s kind of a strange way to look at it

Vader doing a flawless Leia impression : “WHAT!?”

@Johann Sebastian why is Bach here

In Dutch, we called the German Nazis: Moffen. Maybe thats where grand Moff came from.

Also Dutch: Vader = Father

i find your lack of lines that you like disturbing

"I am the Senate"

Vader's grammar is poor. He actually said "... if you would join us". Should be "... If you joined us".

Kaleesh Synth I thought the mouth was really good its the eyes that are the issue i believe since we look at them so much in people. Still glad they did it though

mouth and eyes...which is why they should have left those parts alone, and blend with the original actor

Eyes and mouth are the issue, in my opinion. Vader's voice is a bigger problem, in my problem. "Prepare a boarding problem"

That's because they copied his mouth movements accurately. A lot of old people have stiff mouth movements. It looks 'off' because it's so accurate. Sometimes you just have to take artistic licence and move away from making something 100% accurate

It's not issue with animation. It's just the way mocap actor speaks. You can watch "Making of" the effects and see that clearly.

And find an actor whose voice and cadence is creepily similar to Peter Cushing's

Another thing that bothered me is that they praised Princess Leia quite a bit while bringing down Tarkin's animation. If one considers the amount of screen time Tarkin had in comparison it gives the viewers vastly more things to gripe about.

Still, this should only be used in extreme circumstances. Frankly I'd rather they used it for Leia in IX than Tarkin in Rogue One. Not that anyone could've predicted Carrie's passing. I think it's fine since Peter Cushing liked Star Wars and his family gave their blessing. Using this for Alec Guiness would be incredibly rude since he very openly disliked the series. My biggest problem is how much Tarkin was in the movie, like Legolas in The Hobbit. He deserved a cameo to mesh with canon, but he almost became a main character and with this new technology, upstaged Krennic whenever they were on screen together.

It was good. My eyes couldn't tell the difference but there is a disconnect there.

I feel like thats pretty fitting for Krennic given his narrative arc. He was upstaged, replaced and forgotten because of his hubris and his incompetence

on of the Top 10 CGI works in mov... wait wait for real? You people keep saying Rogue one is a good movie when it has no good characters and it is full of cliches from the very beginning, and now you need to defend bad CGI glorifying it ? It looks bad, fake, robotic, like pure animation surrounded by real people. It is creepy, and fells wrong. It is too obvious, especially the mouth, and the director seems so confident and proud that does show it right in our faces, in front of the camera in almost closeups to get more chances of noticing it and distract from the purpose of the scene

Frank - did you really read my comment? I'm not "these people"... and I've said it a Million times in other posts: Tarkins role was too big, they should have not used any close ups, destroyed the illusion etc. AND I NEVER SAID IT'S A GOOD MOVIE! WHY?! BECAUSE IT ISN'T! MEDIOCRE AT BEST! READ MY COMMENT AGAIN AND GET YOUR GLASSES!!! But bad CGI? Are you insane? If this is bad CGI - what is good CGI? And the robot? What about that one? And Leia? And all the fucking rest... I was talking about the look of it! Nothing more, not the plot, not the characters... just that! It's like "I think the effects were good!" - and you go: "You people say it's a good movie! But the soundtrack was horrible and the script is a joke!" - You are so smart, man! I like potatoes more than mondays, too! I notice computer generated images almost anytime! Even bluescreens and the stuff most people believe to be no effects at all! So what is your point? Tell me 10 movies that did a better job in this... Even Lord of the Rings sometimes looks dated today and it's still a masterpiece with stunning visuals. So come on! Gladiator, Mockingjay, The Crow - they all replaced actors digitally that died during filming. But no one ever pulled something off like that. An actor that died decades ago, brought back to the screen in such a way. And like I said - it's not flawless, it's not convincing - but still impressive. And you - whoever you think you are - get your head out of your ass and the shit out of your ears and eyes. And don't twist somebody's words, that's the most bitchy thing to do! God, I hate youtube.

you must be into the emoji movie right?

bew They made the CGI Grand Moff Tarkin taller than the real one. The CGI one he looks like he's over 6ft tall. The real one looks like he's about 5 foot 7.

bew well what is flawless Mr expert?

nougatbitz Have anything else to cry about?

Yes, it was little moments like that, that threw it off. It's tough because while they needed to be a bit more 'animated' like the real actor and not as constrained, animating it too much and getting too much movement made it more exaggerated like a video game. Too bad... a pretty good job but as others have said, keeping the figure in shadows and less lingering shots would've helped too.

@@kthemaster1999 he's just pointing out the obvious fakeness of the cgi

@@kthemaster1999 Moron.

Yeah because he’s more important to Palpatine than Vader is. Also Vader has some respect for him since they were usually on the same page during the clone wars even when the Jedi disagreed

Honestly, it took a lot from my enjoyment of the show everytime he showed up. He just looked so fake........ I'm no even a star wars fan I am not obsessed about Tarkin I just felt like it was weird CG character that looked creepy and fake. Honest to god I didn't even know he was CG

S. I disagree, every time he appeared onscreen I was amazed and so were the people around me. Sure it ain't perfect, but Tarkin played such a big part at this time so he had to appear one way or another :)

This is completely misleading in what you are trying to get across... "Honestly, it took a lot from my enjoyment of the show everytime he showed up. He just looked so fake" then ends with "Honest to god I didn't even know he was CG" So which is it. Do puppets look real to people, then why does CG piss them off so much? People need to just sit back and enjoy sometimes, rather then tear every "flaw".

Honestly when he appeared my mouth dropped open. He looked so horribly fake that I could hardly believe it wasn't some kind of joke. Really hurts the movie in my opinion. And the sad thing is he wasn't even necessary. They kept cutting back to him as if they didn't realize how bad it looked. Just a hologram and a shot from behind would have sufficed.

The franchise is known for NAILING the effects, not getting it "kinda ok."

HISHE.

(::) +1

And his new height. By A New Hope, he was 4 and a half inches shorter. He probably gets shorter each time he says "you may fire when ready".

G-forces from super laser recoil shortened his spine (:P)

LOL

Personally, I think it isn't just the CGI itself, but what they do with him and the scene, etc. The CGI leia for example is much less noticable, for the lighting works with it, the background works wit it, and the motion is kept in a minimal level. I think they could have made Tarkin here less noticeable if they did a did a couple of many possible options: 1) use a body double who looks sort of like Cushing, and then apply CGI liberally to where it needs to be on the face, the body motion is a big problem, and if one can reduce the oversmoothness factor CGI has, the better. This would also help with lighting. Prosthetics may also be used in conjunction with the body-double so as to get as real a thing as possible. 2) Make the scene work with it. Keep in heavier shadows, look to Jurassic park for inspiration, where they used the darkness to full benefit of the CGI. Keep his movement minimal when you can so that people won't notice the CGI glide. Also reducing the shine on his skin would go a long way. The shine works against the CGI in making him pop more noticeably from the scene, one wants the skin to look dry and subdued, like real skin, and only a little sweaty when it works, too sweaty and one will know the illusion.

"1) use a body double who looks sort of like Cushing, and then apply CGI liberally to where it needs to be on the face, the body motion is a big problem, and if one can reduce the oversmoothness factor CGI has, the better. This would also help with lighting. Prosthetics may also be used in conjunction with the body-double so as to get as real a thing as possible." this is exactly what they did in rogue one. watch behind the scenes videos on cgi tarkin

Peter Cushing's remains would just be a skeleton by now

@@qk1050 I think his remains would just be dust by now 😅

I really mean u need glasses. Where u see anything robotic..... lol

that is just a way of saying... It is indeed robotic compared to the sudden moves of IRL tarkin and way of speaking but HOLY SHIT isn`t CGI tarkin so dam good :3

Yeah his movements, and shininess are inhuman.

he's not robotic. I think, he move too much to imitate real human movement, which makes it unrealistic. in comparison, Peter Cushing don't move much, he's steady and bold in his movement, cautious and purposeful.

Jacob Komnath They made the CGI Grand Moff Tarkin taller than the real one. The CGI one he looks like he's over 6ft tall. The real one looks like he's about 5 foot 7.

He is *S H I N Y*

You not seen the end scene in Episode III ?

And you thought Peter Cushing hadn't changed a bit in 35 years?

I did not remember the actor as well, but my first impression was basically: "Why the f** are they implementing such an uncanny valley CGI, when everyone else there is an actor"

Ashanark Peter Cushing died back in 1994.😢

cometandcupids So true I love Hammer Horror films, Peter Cushing and Christopher Lee made several films with them!

Jacob Sailer did you reply to your friend, "you're far too trusting"? ;)

It's quite obvious that they are different films, regardless of Tarkin. Color grading is colder in Rogue, not to mention Rogue has a much more crisp image, due to modern HD camera tech. Different audio quality too. Your friend really didn't think they were different movies? Is said friend not very film savvy? Like at all?

For me it is obvious that he's fake, he looks like videogame character

I didn't know he was dead until I saw the movie. "Why did they put a video game character in this film?"

I'm not a star wars fan and never heard of him, when I was watching rouge one in theaters and he was on screen I kept asking myself if he was real or not because he looked off

Yes knowing how they got the plans was very good and a missing piece in the jigsaw puzzle.

Fuck nah; that broad in the movie ruined it; Kyle Katarn is better

The Baby Yoda Show is the best.

Nick M still better than anything else Disney put out for the movies.

I disagree, I think it’s the worst Disney Star Wars

That's the point. Most people didn't know it, unless they were existing star wars fans from the original.

Same, The CGI is noticable but kinda hard if you're not very observant.

Its not about being a star wars fan or remembering the previous actor. Its about being able to distinguish phycialy real objects and fake objects created with VFX/CGI/Photoshop.. Like Ven0maniac07 said "The CGI is noticable but kinda hard if you're not very observant."....

Same! Leia looked fake though

My wife leaned over to me and asked is that guy CGI. My brother who hates the original trilogy and remembers jack shit from it laughed his ass off when he saw him. Definitely looked CGI

Eratic behaviour seriously impacts rendering duration and thus costs.

RomeoAlpha exactly I didn’t have a lot of idea of tarkin and when i saw in the theatre I didn’t doubt if it was cgi only would know about it after coming back from theatre and checking for Easter eggs

same, but i did think there was something "odd" about him in RO i just couldnt put my finger on it.

RomeoAlpha Lol seriously? You couldn’t tell?

Watched it with my girlfriend, she had no idea he was CGI either. They did a great job for sure but when u start looking for mistakes/quirks then it kills the effect. Hats of to ILM!

@@RV-go4zi You noticed because you knew it. It is noticable but so are most fings that only stand out as we are told about them.

Half of the time it's the lighting, the first scene looks really weird because we never saw Tarkin in that kind of lighting. He looks better when he's by the window with the different lighting as he looks closer to what we saw in A New Hope. Another major part is whether or not you know Peter Cushing is dead because if you do know, you instantly dismiss him being real no matter what. Even if they just reused footage you'd know something is off in a different way. Instead of not looking real enough, he'd feel like he was added in during post production similar to a green screen effect as well as having limited dialog/bad lip syncing as if he was from some english dubbed anime as lip syncing is only done once for those shows.

It’s pretty close to real tbh

"pretty close". Still very distinguishable at the moment. Would be amazing CGI if the whole movie was CGI.

nisher15 yeah it's way more apparent the more times you watch the movie and his scenes. But when I first saw the movie I was blown away on how good it looked

CinemaRockPizza may be we feel not well because we know he is death and what we saw is cgi. with avatar however no one seem to feel bad about cgi character.

Boriase Yep Star Wars fanboys are cancerous,sure the tech is not perfect but sometimes Star Wars fanboys demand so much out of every movie.

It was the same with my best friend, he didn't remember Tarkin and didn't notice that he was made with CGI.

Not all of us old fanboys are as anal as some of the turkeys complaining about CGI Tarkin. I obviously knew this wasn't real but was really impressed by what they had achieved.

Old people also have shit eyes. I didnt really grow up on Star Wars, but the CGI version sticks out like crazy to me

I did not know, and believe me I saw it the very first time he was on screen.

demonocus drumocus yes he did..people on here acting like he was claymation on Clash of the Titans or something...smh

Good? Yes. Acceptable? Mostly Yes. Perfect? No. They should have spent more time perfecting it. If they couldn't do it, which they didn't, they should have let another visual effects studio perfect it.

Fludge "spent more time perfecting it" explain how then Mr. Special effects...foh

It was a little bit lighting, a little bit expression in movement, and a little bit of texture/color in the face. Trying to make a perfectly realistic likeness of a human face is incredibly difficult for 3d sculptors. They pulled off a 99% realistic face. I was shocked when I saw this.

Perfect it as in a car? A background? A 1990 T-Rex? I'm just curious in regards to human beings which effect holds as much up, disregarding the ones that are in shot for less than a minute.

FightFan5 Makes sense given that they used a mould of his face from the 80's

Don't worry it's mostly bacause of the light.

What Darth BB-8 said. Also, RO and ANH are lit differently. Lighting makes a huge impact on how you look.

It's NOT that he looks “older" - Cushing was already frail in ANH - you are making excuses. He looks fake, just admit it.

ubertuber66 Oh oh, here we come again with the hate..

No, Leia was much better

what?, seems as if one is as clumsy as he is stupid

Both Tarkin and Leia looked creepy and fake in this. It's a toss up which one out-creeped the other.

I believe Guy Henry provided the body live on set with the lines. Peter Cushing's head was just added afterward. So I take that to mean you think Guy Henry walks a little odd! If I'm honest, I thought the weirdest thing was that owing to Henry's body being used, this Tarkin is a full head taller than the New Hope Tarkin. Guy's 6'4" as opposed to Peter's 6' flat.

Or, you know... stop doing them altogether?

Or perhaps let him R.I.P.

66 likes. EXECUTE ORDER 66

Same here, didn’t think much of it at the moment but then I flipped when they explained the scene to me

"The more I watch CGI Tarkin, the worse he looks." That is always true of special effects. The first time you see them, you notice fewer flaws because you are caught up in the action and story. The first time I saw Star Wars in 1977, the special effects were amazing. Repeat viewings, more and more flaws became apparent because I was taking the action and story for granted and looking at them more closely.

Paul Coddington - Very true.

+++

It's like how when I first played Doom 2 as a kid after years of playing Sonic and Mario I thought that shit was virtual reality

If the vfx are done well they can get better and more amazing over time. Try The Empire Strikes Back. It's looks almost as good to me as when I saw it as a child.

Simon Bauer are you kidding? Peter Cushing is sharper than a pencil when you’ve been at it trying to make it the shortest at school

I'm glad someone else other than myself noticed this. I'm surprised nobody on the production staff thought of this. Unless Tarkin loses height every time he says "you may fire when ready".

And so presumably the voice just gets squeakier and squeakier.

LOL

His uniform is more tightly fitted in Rogue One than in A New Hope, which supports my belief that he loses height every time he says his famous line.

It's interesting how they didn't just find another actor like with Mon Mothma. I guess they just wanted to show off the technology

Leia was even worse

Looks like if Rogue One took inspiration from LA Noire :P

Part of the reason is that they didn't even insert Peter Cushing's face into the movie, they inserted the face of CG Peter Cushing. They should have just used free deepfake software and saved some money. At least it wasn't as far down the uncanny valley, as say; The Polar Express, though.

It makes him more scary i guess

Oh, I love to read the comments of people who are not involved in any way in CGI and think they know how to fix it.

@@Mummy542 yep I can't even model a twig using blender

@RadRich cause I working in CG and it’s obvious to me that his comments are not professional but pretend to be

@@Mummy542 sure you must be an ILM employee or some CGI guru, so share some light of your endless knowledge to the rest of this world please

Because some people find it easier to shit on something than make an effort to prove that they are worth more.

Hammer Dracula films

@@nickm5419 Dr. Helsing is going to destroy your planet.

Eric Kinney Wondered if somebody else felt the same.. :'(

I don't think he would've approved of it. I wonder what Cushing's family said.

Eric Kinney He is dead

Christopher Lee was offered the part of Tarkin but turned it down and told George Lucas to give it to his friend Peter

good becouse we got amazing Count Dooku

Oh for sure. More so when you compare the quality of work that was done with Rouge One Tarkin to Rise Of The Skywarker Leia. Darn near perfect with the job is done for Tarkin, where with Leia is more of, meh.

I’m sure most people I watched the film with didn’t even realize he was CGI

The thing that most stood out as wrong to me was how tall Tarkin ended up given the height of Guy Henry, who provided the body and voice. He's about a head taller than Peter Cushing was, and it looks strange.

What eye disease do you suffer from?

...and I bet you didn't even notice it was CGI when you first watched the movie lol?

John Smitherson the cgi looked good if he wasn’t moving but I got to agree with you when he moves he looks a bit uncanny

His Snake is Solid By the time we watched RO at the cinema, my sister didn't know the actor is dead and this is cgi and I told her neither. but still, she said, something about his face is creepy.

Also seems to depend on the viewer's eyesight, with strong-sighted people having an easier time noticing it's off. For example my eyesight is poor and even though I know it's cgi I really have to be looking for flaws to find any, and even then it's difficult to the point where I'm almost not sure if I'm seeing actual flaws or my brain is forcing itself to spot them because it knows they should be there. On the other hand I found CGI Leia to be far more noticeable than Tarkin, with her face looking too flawless and bright. From an objective standpoint I'm inclined to think that they might have been pushing their luck a bit showing close-ups of him talking this early into the advancement of the technology used to make it happen.

Chris Addy I believe it's the dark style of RO

ApoDavis it maybe the style, but the redness applys to his forehead and cheeks for the CGI, and his eyes and mouth in real life.

Chris Addy Its CGI. It can't always be 1:1

And in Rogue One, Tarkin is 4 and a half inches taller than in A New Hope.

The newer releases of Star Wars have been oversaturated and the faces have become unnaturally redder. Also, older style make-up is more apparent in older movies (you can now tell Kirk and Spock wear lipstick in 1960's Trek on HD screens to the point that you have to assume it is fashion in the 23rd Century even though it was really just the technical aspects of making TV at the time). I also wonder if the CGI took into account the fact that the skin had to have less detail because the original and everyone else has make-up on?

Some people are just more observant when it comes to CGI. Best CGI ive seen in a movie is the young Tony Stark in Civil War. Id give that one a 50% believable. Tarkin looked 100% great within a game cut scene but 0% believable.