‘‘Whosoever wishes to be in a state of salvation”(this, not ‘‘ Whosoever will be saved”, is the true meaning of ** Quicunque vult salvus esse”’), “it is above all things necessary that he hold the Catholic Faith, which faith except he do keep whole and undefiled without doubt, he shall perish everlastingly.”(St. Athanasius) Within the Catholic Church, we hold that which has been believed everywhere, always, and of all men: for that is truly and properly Catholic, which comprehends all things in general after a universal manner. And that shall we do if we follow Universality, Antiquity, and Consent.(Vincent of Lerins, Against Heresy, Ch. II) "While you stick to the old Church of England ways you are respectable-it is going by a sort of tradition ; when you profess to return to lost Church of England ways you are rational;-but when you invent a new ceremonial which never was, when you copy the Roman or other foreign rituals, you are neither respectable nor rational. It is sectarian."-J. H. Newman to Henry Wilberforce. Life of J. H. Cardinal Newman, by W. Ward. 1912. I. 235. "I am dying," Ken had written, "in the Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Faith professed by the whole Church before the disunion of East and West; and, more particularly, in the Communion of the Church of England as it stands distinguished from both Papal and Protestant innovation and adheres to the Doctrine of the Cross."(Thomas Ken, 1637-1711, Bishop of Bath and Wells). There is no finer statement of the Anglican position to be found anywhere. "The Catholic Church is the home of the Holy Ghost. It is His only Earthly home. He does not make His home in any Dissenting sect. Sometimes people quarrel with the Church and break away from her and make little sham churches of their own. We call these people Dissenters and their sham churches sects. The Holy Ghost does not abide does not dwell with them. He goes and visits them perhaps, but only as a stranger."-A Book For The Children Of God, p. 77. London: W. Knott, 1891. "It is schismatical to attend Dissenting Meeting Houses or to subscribe to or assist the sectarian objects of Dissenters in any way. If the traveller should assist at Protestant worship, he is aiding and abetting that the doctrine, heresy, and schism from which he prays in the Litany to be delivered. They are not a branch of the true Church(unlike the Roman Catholic and Eastern Orthodox). The same cannot be said of Roman Catholic Churches and their objects because the Roman Catholics are a branch of the true Church." "The Bible is the Book which God has given to His Church, and it belongs to the Church alone, and not to any Dissenting sect. No one but a Catholic can safely read the Bible and no Catholic can read it safely who does not read it in the Church's way. In the hands of all, the Bible thus used is dangerous to morality and truth. Therefore, an endless variety of sects."-The Congregation In Church, p. 202. New Edition. London: Mowbray.-A Book For The Children Of God, p. 77. London: W. Knott, 1891.-Golden Gate, by the Rev. S. Baring-Gould, Rector of Lew Trenchard, Part I., p. 177. Edition, 1875.-Union Review for 1865, p. 148.-Church News, July 7, 1889. “It is the distinct duty of all who pray for the peace of Jerusalem to repudiate foreign Lutheranism, Calvinism, &c., and to do their utmost to show that the English Church of which they are members, is really one with the Church of Rome in faith, orders, and sacraments; whilst the Protestant bodies are branches cut off from the True Vine of which the Roman and Anglican and Eastern Communions are living boughs of the Catholic Church.”-Church News, July 7, 1869.
With some of the best minds in the western world thinking about the bible for almost 2000 years, this genius thinks he has it all figured out and that you should believe him because... reasons.
@@badatpseudoscience I was replying to a Protestant Christians, not atheists. I am attacking Protestants, not atheists or other religions. This statement refers to Protestants who have a false heretical Christianity, this was never meant for your ears that statement only refers to Christians who are heretics, not nonChristians as they never professed it. In fact, Protestants are worse than atheists and nonChristians.
‘‘Whosoever wishes to be in a state of salvation”(this, not ‘‘ Whosoever will be saved”, is the true meaning of ** Quicunque vult salvus esse”’), “it is above all things necessary that he hold the Catholic Faith, which faith except he do keep whole and undefiled without doubt, he shall perish everlastingly.”(St. Athanasius) Within the Catholic Church, we hold that which has been believed everywhere, always, and of all men: for that is truly and properly Catholic, which comprehends all things in general after a universal manner. And that shall we do if we follow Universality, Antiquity, and Consent.(Vincent of Lerins, Against Heresy, Ch. II) "While you stick to the old Church of England ways you are respectable-it is going by a sort of tradition ; when you profess to return to lost Church of England ways you are rational;-but when you invent a new ceremonial which never was, when you copy the Roman or other foreign rituals, you are neither respectable nor rational. It is sectarian."-J. H. Newman to Henry Wilberforce. Life of J. H. Cardinal Newman, by W. Ward. 1912. I. 235. "I am dying," Ken had written, "in the Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Faith professed by the whole Church before the disunion of East and West; and, more particularly, in the Communion of the Church of England as it stands distinguished from both Papal and Protestant innovation and adheres to the Doctrine of the Cross."(Thomas Ken, 1637-1711, Bishop of Bath and Wells). There is no finer statement of the Anglican position to be found anywhere. "The Catholic Church is the home of the Holy Ghost. It is His only Earthly home. He does not make His home in any Dissenting sect. Sometimes people quarrel with the Church and break away from her and make little sham churches of their own. We call these people Dissenters and their sham churches sects. The Holy Ghost does not abide does not dwell with them. He goes and visits them perhaps, but only as a stranger."-A Book For The Children Of God, p. 77. London: W. Knott, 1891. "It is schismatical to attend Dissenting Meeting Houses or to subscribe to or assist the sectarian objects of Dissenters in any way. If the traveller should assist at Protestant worship, he is aiding and abetting that the doctrine, heresy, and schism from which he prays in the Litany to be delivered. They are not a branch of the true Church(unlike the Roman Catholic and Eastern Orthodox). The same cannot be said of Roman Catholic Churches and their objects because the Roman Catholics are a branch of the true Church." "The Bible is the Book which God has given to His Church, and it belongs to the Church alone, and not to any Dissenting sect. No one but a Catholic can safely read the Bible and no Catholic can read it safely who does not read it in the Church's way. In the hands of all, the Bible thus used is dangerous to morality and truth. Therefore, an endless variety of sects."-The Congregation In Church, p. 202. New Edition. London: Mowbray.-A Book For The Children Of God, p. 77. London: W. Knott, 1891.-Golden Gate, by the Rev. S. Baring-Gould, Rector of Lew Trenchard, Part I., p. 177. Edition, 1875.-Union Review for 1865, p. 148.-Church News, July 7, 1889. “It is the distinct duty of all who pray for the peace of Jerusalem to repudiate foreign Lutheranism, Calvinism, &c., and to do their utmost to show that the English Church of which they are members, is really one with the Church of Rome in faith, orders, and sacraments; whilst the Protestant bodies are branches cut off from the True Vine of which the Roman and Anglican and Eastern Communions are living boughs of the Catholic Church.”-Church News, July 7, 1869.
@@johnpolitis9060 I was talking about UNLEARN but this also applies to you. I am X-Catholic and still enjoy deep conversations with Catholic friends and clergy. What you have said in these posts is blatantly anti-Catholic. The Catholic cannon does not call for hatred toward protectants. In fact, it is just the opposite. I don't mean this as an insult. However, I think you should talk with someone about your issues. Again, I don't mean that as an insult.
I use Anglican prayer beads. They’re not vain repetitions.. the beads are just like a track you follow to help you through the prayers you have memorized. You’re thinking about the words you’re saying to the father not just mindlessly trying to say things a certain number of times. You can also use prayer beads to memorize scripture, or let each cruciform bead be associated with a specific scripture or prayer you want to pray through. Just a tactile tool to help you pray. Also, a physical reminder that God is just as close as those beads you hold in your hand, similar to the tassel on a prayer shawl in the Jewish tradition.
@@J0PHIEL I am a catholic and a christian because I have only one Lord and Savior who is Jesus Christ. We do not pray to Mary, instead look at it as praying through her and meditating on the love of a mother to a son and all the pain she must of gone through. The rosary is meditation on scripture because the prayers recited (Lord’s prayer and Hail Mary) are in the bible. If you’re just looking at it as just repetition and not meditating/concentrating on the words, then yes it may seem vain but I assure it’s not. There’s a certain calming effect about it when you do it wholeheartedly and it’s helped me a lot with my anxiety issues. There’s a lot of misconceptions about our faith but no one is above Jesus and the Father and while a lot of this might seem unnecessary (just talk to Jesus directly) I don’t think Jesus minds us talking to our mother who he left us as he himself said on the cross. God Bless you always.
@@kap849 why not? we all pray for each other and are considered part of the body of Christ even after death. So why not talk to the Mother of our Lord. The Lord even tells us to pray and intercede for each other in scripture but for some reason people have an issue when it involves Mary. Why ask someone to pray for us if we can go directly to Jesus like you just said?
Prayer beads are just the updated version of prayer ropes, which were used by Christians during the 300’s, over a thousand years earlier than this guy claims. I agree that it can become empty repetitions, but the idea is to meditate on Christ, particularly when you look at Orthodox prayer bead traditions, where they pray “Lord Jesus, Son of God, have mercy on me, a sinner.” They do that 100 times, but it’s not because they think the more it’s said the more God will hear; it’s simply a way to clear your mind without losing focus on Christ.
I have a few counter arguments. I try to keep it concise. 1. “The Rosary is VAIN repition.” Its meditative repitition, designed to keep our focus on the specific highlights of Jesus’ life, which we call the Sacred Mysteries. Events like the annunciation and the nativity. It is not “vain” per se, to use repitition to center your focus on these literal life-changing events. 2. “Mary (and the saints) cannot intercede for us” In the wedding in Cana, the crowd didnt come directly to Jesus when the wine ran out. Instead, they asked Mary to ask for them. And Jesus, despite the wedding not being part of His plan (He literally said “it is not yet time” to publically show miracles), He changed water into wine anyway. Because that’s how much Jesus loves Mary. Or lets go back further. Of when He was 12 years old, staying at the temple to preach. Jesus wanted to stay there and preach more. But Mary said “come home” and He obeyed. Because that’s how much Jesus respects Mary as His mother. We can see here that Jesus would willingly get out of His way just to satisfy His mother. So yes, Mary’s prayer CAN help us if we ask her to. 3. Mary and the Saint cant pray for us because they’re dead. Jesus himself told that the dead are NOT unconscious. They do not lie dormantly, waiting for the end times. They are alive spiritually. In the parable of the rich man, we see the rich man died and went directly to his afterlife, CONSCIOUS. When Jesus went up the mountain to be transfigured, the dead Moses and the dead Elijah appeared to Him, CONSCIOUS. You see, the dead ARE conscious. What they are waiting for is the resurrection of their physical bodies, albeit in their perfect form as intended by God. 4. “Intercessory prayers dont work. Offer prayers directly to God” If that’s the case, if you’re in trouble, don’t ask your friends, family and church to pray for you. And if they do, reject them. Because why would you need their prayers, right? Wrong. Yes, God does grant your prayers directly. But at the same time, He wants us to be in prayerful communion with one another. And this communion doesnt end with death. There is a whole people in the afterlife who are in prayerful communion with us. They pray for us the same way your mother and father prays for your health. The only difference is that the saints are already one step closer to God than us. Its really not that difficult to understand.
Icarus, I believe you’re at the right channel! I understand what you said about how Jesus consulted, loved and obeyed his mother. Of course! She was incredibly blessed to be his mother. If we could talk to her now, I think she would be horrified to know people prayed to her. 🙆♀️. She knew what Jesus went through, who He was and is. Icarus, please tell me where in the Bible where anyone, especially Jesus, prays to Mary? The Bible is supposed to be our guide, we’re supposed to be “Little Christs”. 🤷♀️ We’re to imitate Him but we cannot live up to His example, I know. That’s why we needed a Savior. 😊 Also, to pray to Mary, to me, is like you’re actually circumventing and denying God’s power. You can pray prayer directly to the Mercy Seat of God. 🙆♀️ The Bible says our prayers to a God are deposited in golden bowls before the throne of God (Rev. 5:8). What a beautiful verse! 😊 God is truly the only one who can answer your prayers. He is the only who is omnipotent, omniscient and omnipresent. Why the need to pray to anyone else? Hebrews 4:14-16 (ESV): 14 Since then we have a great high priest who has passed through the heavens, Jesus, the Son of God, let us hold fast our confession. 15 For we do not have a high priest who is unable to sympathize with our weaknesses, but one who in every respect has been tempted as we are, yet without sin. 16 Let us then with confidence draw near to the throne of grace, that we may receive mercy and find grace to help in time of need. Isn’t that beautiful? Icarus, I have had to unlearn much of what I learned about God-the doctrines of men, not the teaching of God. I read and re-read your post and it made me sad. The Bible is our sole source for truth, if you can show me where your statements can be backed by scripture, I will happily reconsider. Thank you for sharing. 😊
@@Julie-sx4wk I’ll try to respond as much of your arguments here, and forgive me if I paraphrase you wrongly. 1. “Show me where in the bible did People pray to mary” In my example, I already showed you the wedding of Cana. How people asked her for help to talk to Jesus. But that was when she was physically present. But what’s stopping her from being spiritually present today? Is she not in heaven? Are the living christians not in communion with the dead christians? 2. You can pray directly to God I agree. And it is, as you say, beautiful to see this mercy. But then again, is it wrong to ask for someone to pray for you? Have you never been in a state of brokenness so low, that you asked your loved ones to pray for you? You’ve never called your mum and said “I’m going through a lot right now and I don’t know how to fix this. Please pray for me, okay?” In those situations, why do you ask your mum to pray for you? You know that God listens to your prayers if you pray to him directly. But why do you still reach out for more people to pray for you? The premise of the Marian dogma is like this. 1. God is pleased when Christians have prayerful communion (i.e praying for each other) 2. The living and the dead are still in prayerful communion, as death cannot separate christians from each other. 3. Mary is among the dead, and the holiest among the dead. Because God would not choose any simple woman to be the tabernacle for his word. 4. Hence, God listens to Mary’s prayers, and Mary never stopped praying for us.
@@icarus6492 When people compromise their relationship with Gd then Adonai blinds them so they can no longer see the truth. Go on your knees, walk away from "church" you attend, and fast. Time is short, very short. Shalom
Icarus, the dead are indeed asleep in the grave. You rightly identified the parable of Lazarus and the rich man as being just that. A parable. The subject of the parable was NOT to teach the state of the dead. The transfiguration on the mount was a VISION. Jesus himself called it that. The purpose of it was to show that Moses representing the law, and Elijah the prophets, both recognised and accepted that Jesus was the son of God and promised messiah. I can't see what else you think it was intended for.
Jesus said: do not pray like the heathen do, vain repetition....Mary, Allah...Buddha? I have decided to follow Jesus, good teaching Brother, thank you GODSPEED
I saw a comment that asked why the repetitive presentation of the subject was. Well, I enjoy being reminded of important matters. The LORD would agree because he tells his people. Which is you and I to remember him and his commandments. Last I checked, he doesn't change his ways as a man would. So thank you to Lex, your wife, and your kids. Blessings
Was just having a discussion this morning on Gab about vain repetitions vs heartfelt communication and relationship through prayer. Divine timing! Thanks, Lex.
So the angels saying Holy Holy Holy three times to God as found in the Biblical book of Ezekiel and Isaiah and the 4 Gospels of Christ's birth is vain repetition too. So if you say vain repetition applies to the angels saying Holy 3x to God found in the Bible, then you are going against God Himself and His Word and you are rejecting God and His Word and yet claim to follow it, then you are a hypocrite and a heretic and not a Christian at all. Are you putting the angels on the same level as the Pharisees. What you are saying is blasphemy and sinning against God, His Son, and the Holy Spirit. So you are a blasphemer, a heretic, and a hypocrite.
John, there is clearly a difference between the angels repeating an honorific title to the Lord, and sinners repeating babble so many times that they need a contraption to keep count. If the rosary is not to be included as an example of vein repetitions, then what is?
When the Pope himself said that the rosary isa Christocentric prayer.. I would hardly say that meditating on the mysteries of the gospel is in vain.. ❤
What about using them as a tool of focus and not as a tool of repetition? Such as the tassels on clothing mentioned in the old testament or a cross necklace?
Amen brother, thanks for making this. So many people are being deceived by false teachers, religions, traditions. They need to turn to the Bible directly and read it for themselves to see the truth.A lot rely on man's direction over God's.
Turning to the Bible directly and reading it yourself is itself false teaching. It's just that it's such a common false teaching wherever you find Protestants that nobody even thinks to question it. It really isn't even coherent to say that everyone should read scripture for themselves to see the truth. It's unquestionable that different people come away with different interpretations of the Bible. This immediately invalidates sola scriptura because there is only one Truth. Everyone who opens the Bible doesn't get to define their own truth. And the standard answer that the Holy Spirit guides you to proper interpretation is completely false for the same reason - it's nonsensical to think the Holy Spirit leads different people to opposing truths.
Riddle me this: who are the “saints” who’s prayers come before the throne as incense in heaven in Revelation 8:3-5 Please unlearn that we serve the GOD of the LIVING, NOT of the dead. Whom are the saints that rose in Matthew 27:52?
John was taken in the spirit and shown in VISION. The prayers are those prayers said by the saints whilst on earth. According to the Bible, all believers are saints. John's vision was showing that God hears the prayers of his people on earth. Following the death and resurrection, certain graves opened and God raised to life those dead. Like how Jesus raised Lazarus. This was to confirm the resurrection, Jesus being the furstfruits. They would later die again. They were not raised incorruptible st that time.
Good teaching. Only thing I like to add, is that Mary and saints spirits are in heaven. The bible mentions that the saints in heaven collect our prayers from earth, and take them to God.
The portion of Revelation in which John, in VISION, sees the prayers of the saints in a bowl is symbolic of the fact that God hears the prayers of believers...the true saints...uttered whilst alive on earth. What you and papalism suggest is nonsensical.
The attachment to Mary is almost a demonic spirit the way it has a hold on people, I used to pray the rosary daily. It was a dedication to her to say these prayers for her intercession to show her honor etc. Once I was born again and started studying my bible all these weird teachings fell apart. Even though (at the time) it helped me through a dark part of my life, I know now that it was wrong and Yahuah was guiding me to truth the whole time
While I agree with the sentiment, Don't go back, keep moving forward! If your dedication to Mary takes away from your relationship with God, then you were not properly dedicated to Mary. Study the Bible in its fullest and see how God works consistently through salvation history and someday, you'll have a devotion to Christ's mother that honors God and doesn't detract from His glory!
@@mitchm4573 In Isaiah 42:8 God states, “I am the LORD, that is My name; I will not give My glory to another, Nor My praise to graven images” (NASB). Mary was an awesome lady and we’re grateful to her, just as we are toso many like those in the Hebrews Hall of Faith and throughout the Bible. 😊
Psalm 84:12, Jeremiah 33:9, Isaiah 46:13 along with many others all talk about God bestowing, giving and others, besides himself, having glory, and all arguably within a larger context than that of Isaiah 42. You've got one of those pesky biblical contradictions you need to overcome, and you can't do it by dismissing everything except Isaiah 42 in regards to the question at hand. And that's before even getting into the nuances between honor (honor your father and mother) and glory (which we do not give God because glory originates from him, instead we reflect his glory back to him and in doing so, share in it). Obviously a lot more to discuss on the topic than a RU-vid comments section effectively allows for.
And no, the Rosary does not contradict Christ's words. He told us not to repeat EMPTY prayers. Praying the Rosary while meditating on the life of Christ and His Blessed Mother is NOT empty.
Then you don't know your Bible. The statue in Daniel 2, the fourth kingdom is Roman and divided Europe is the Papacy as they are church and state that don't mix like clay and iron.
@@paulydwaboutit4326 if you believe that the Name of Jesus Christ has no power in and of itself, then of course it's empty according to your view. I as an orthodox Christian believe that the Name of Jesus has power in itself and that's why I call upon His name and His Mercy without ceasing in the Jesus Prayer.
This is some of the worst anti Catholic bigotry I have ever heard. It is also lazy theology. Spend five minutes learning about or google meaning of the rosary and you will find it is a way to respect and worship God. To say it is a form of "necromancy" is just a way to split the followers of Jesus into camps. Splitting the followers of Jesus is the Devils plan is it not? Every Sunday in Catholic Mass we always pray for our Prodestant and Jewish brothers and sisters. I offer my prayers to this channel and all those who read this. May we come together and resist the temptation to demonize each other. God bless you all.
Prayer beads.🍒 vain repetitions. As a kid, I remember watching the ladies do this at church & funerals. They called it the novena prayers. The only thing I tried counting when unable to sleep were sheep 🐑 It never worked! Whenever I have trouble falling asleep, I take herbal 🍵and go directly to Yeshua, He restores my sleep😴💤
Thanks for sharing this. I pray the rosary as a form of meditation and focus on the life of Jesus it’s not repetition for me but a reflection on His life on earth
shalom brother Lex, powerful and scripture is truth❗️ thank you ..... some of my family are in that as well ..... sad 😢. Praise and Glory to Yah HalleluYah
Thanks, Lex! This video came up between the videos I was actually looking for, on how to make a rosary. I thought it might be helpful for concentrating on daily prayers I pray. However, I believe you're right. Thank you for helping a brother to see what's right.
‘‘Whosoever wishes to be in a state of salvation”(this, not ‘‘ Whosoever will be saved”, is the true meaning of ** Quicunque vult salvus esse”’), “it is above all things necessary that he hold the Catholic Faith, which faith except he do keep whole and undefiled without doubt, he shall perish everlastingly.”(St. Athanasius) Within the Catholic Church, we hold that which has been believed everywhere, always, and of all men: for that is truly and properly Catholic, which comprehends all things in general after a universal manner. And that shall we do if we follow Universality, Antiquity, and Consent.(Vincent of Lerins, Against Heresy, Ch. II) "While you stick to the old Church of England ways you are respectable-it is going by a sort of tradition ; when you profess to return to lost Church of England ways you are rational;-but when you invent a new ceremonial which never was, when you copy the Roman or other foreign rituals, you are neither respectable nor rational. It is sectarian."-J. H. Newman to Henry Wilberforce. Life of J. H. Cardinal Newman, by W. Ward. 1912. I. 235. "I am dying," Ken had written, "in the Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Faith professed by the whole Church before the disunion of East and West; and, more particularly, in the Communion of the Church of England as it stands distinguished from both Papal and Protestant innovation and adheres to the Doctrine of the Cross."(Thomas Ken, 1637-1711, Bishop of Bath and Wells). There is no finer statement of the Anglican position to be found anywhere. "The Catholic Church is the home of the Holy Ghost. It is His only Earthly home. He does not make His home in any Dissenting sect. Sometimes people quarrel with the Church and break away from her and make little sham churches of their own. We call these people Dissenters and their sham churches sects. The Holy Ghost does not abide does not dwell with them. He goes and visits them perhaps, but only as a stranger."-A Book For The Children Of God, p. 77. London: W. Knott, 1891. "It is schismatical to attend Dissenting Meeting Houses or to subscribe to or assist the sectarian objects of Dissenters in any way. If the traveller should assist at Protestant worship, he is aiding and abetting that the doctrine, heresy, and schism from which he prays in the Litany to be delivered. They are not a branch of the true Church(unlike the Roman Catholic and Eastern Orthodox). The same cannot be said of Roman Catholic Churches and their objects because the Roman Catholics are a branch of the true Church." "The Bible is the Book which God has given to His Church, and it belongs to the Church alone, and not to any Dissenting sect. No one but a Catholic can safely read the Bible and no Catholic can read it safely who does not read it in the Church's way. In the hands of all, the Bible thus used is dangerous to morality and truth. Therefore, an endless variety of sects."-The Congregation In Church, p. 202. New Edition. London: Mowbray.-A Book For The Children Of God, p. 77. London: W. Knott, 1891.-Golden Gate, by the Rev. S. Baring-Gould, Rector of Lew Trenchard, Part I., p. 177. Edition, 1875.-Union Review for 1865, p. 148.-Church News, July 7, 1889. “It is the distinct duty of all who pray for the peace of Jerusalem to repudiate foreign Lutheranism, Calvinism, &c., and to do their utmost to show that the English Church of which they are members, is really one with the Church of Rome in faith, orders, and sacraments; whilst the Protestant bodies are branches cut off from the True Vine of which the Roman and Anglican and Eastern Communions are living boughs of the Catholic Church.”-Church News, July 7, 1869.
@@johnpolitis9060 catholic church is overseen by the Adversary, Satan, who has deceived many :( . None of what you have written is true. None! Do you also believe that the Messiah is Catholic? Well, He was born as Israelite and taught each Saturday (Sabbath) in synagogue...is that who you follow?
@@Julie-sx4wk Scripture in what version? Who translated Scripture to English? Who thinks oral history is literally preserved for thousands of years without human distortion? This what I don’t understand about any fundamentalist take on religion. You can’t claim one take is false when you can’t even trust your own take. It’s ridiculous. You’re all in the same Judeo-Christian league, yet you fight each other constantly with the vigor of hooliganism in football. Meanwhile Satan’s laughing and demons are cheering as you carry on thinking y’all are holier than thou from each other. Please. Get over yourselves. Unite.
i heard Catholic saying if the holy spirit intercedes for us, then why do we sometimes ask our fellow brothers to pray for us? how would you respond to this?
You're right. To me, that would be an argument in favor of the catholic view. The other passage often used is 1 Timothy 2:5 saying that Jesus is the only mediator between God and men. But if you intercede for a friend, are you not a mediator then ? To me, the answer is that Christ is The only mediator between The Father and us, because He is The Way. The only way in the plan of Salvation, in Which we can be saved. God chose Jesus as the only way to him in the new covenant. That being said, when once intercede for a friend for example, he acts in Christ and prays God, for his friend, through Jesus. In fact, the Bible nowhere forbids anyone to be a mediator to Christ for someone, or to ask someone to pray for us. A follow up to that would be : Can Saints in heaven pray for us ? I think there is strong evidence in the Bible and in Church history for that..
@@skylinestudiosrc you 'use' passages? For what? If not to lift up your brother on Christ. We're is the Love in your actions. I sense fear and confusion. That is of satan
But... What if the beads are not used to pray to Mary or to the dead or for vain repetition but for interceding for individuals and for memorizing Scripture? I see nothing wrong with this. If we avoid publicly displaying beads in the form of necklaces and bracelets then it also seems perfectly fine.
Saying the Jesus Prayer on a prayer rope is to make the prayer ingrained in your mind and heart. That is not vain repetition. And by the way. Every time you sing a chorus line, that is a repetition. It is also a 🙏 🤲.
I don't think the use of scripted prayers is wrong per se. It is the use of the rosary that is being questioned. Its use has been documented as being the object in pagan worship in many religions. But the use of beads isn't found *anywhere* in Scripture. I have learned that the Lord's Prayer in (Mat 6:9) is an outline rather than a prayer. Would it be wrong to recite? As long as it isn't repeated over and over and over and over all at once, no! Some of us recite the Aaronic prayer corporally. Others memorize Biblical verses that may form private prayers. I don't think those are vain repetitions. No one is beating their chests so others can observe how pious they are. The difference in my mind is determining when it becomes so repetitious that it loses its purpose which is to praise our Father; To make petition; To entreat His presence and find His favor. As an aside, I agree with those who note that many of today's worship songs are so insidiously repetitions they tend to produce a trance like experience. Might it fall under the category of vain repetitions? Perhaps! Scripture attests of YeHoVaH's messengers eternally in the presence of God pronouncing "Set apart set apart set apart!" (Rev 4:8). 🙏
@@linak7155Well said, Lina. ♥️ The Bible is filled with repetition to get through our thick skulls and to counter false teaching. His Word does not return void… Isaiah 55…10For just as rain and snow fall from heaven and do not return without watering the earth, making it bud and sprout, and providing seed to sow and food to eat, 11so My word that proceeds from My mouth will not return to Me empty, but it will accomplish what I please, and it will prosper where I send it. 12You will indeed go out with joy and be led forth in peace; the mountains and hills will burst into song before you, and all the trees of the field will clap their hands.… Looking forward to that, praise God! ✝️
0:36 Jews have had a practise of learning the 150 psalms by heart. They also probably have a practise of reciting them every day or every week or whatever the interval is. With Copts, it's every day, with Greeks, it's every week, in order, with Latins it's every week with thematic rearrangements of the order. Now, not everyone who wanted to live a religious life knew Latin or was able to say the psalms, the rules of St. Francis (died 1226) prescribe a repetition of specific numbers of Our Father's and Glory Be's in substitution for psalms, and to use knots on strings as, basically, prayer beads. In the wiki article "prayer rope" I find this: _"The history of the prayer rope goes back to the origins of Christian monasticism itself. The invention of the prayer rope is attributed to Pachomius the Great in the fourth century as an aid for illiterate monks to accomplish a consistent number of prayers and prostrations in their cells. Previously, monks would count their prayers by casting pebbles into a bowl, but this was cumbersome, and could not be easily carried about when outside the cell. The use of the rope made it possible to pray the Jesus Prayer unceasingly, whether inside the cell or out, in accordance with Paul the Apostle's injunction to "Pray without ceasing" (I Thessalonians 5:17)."_ It seems you are off by 1000 years. Unless for some reason you wish to make a point that a knot and a bead are different from each other in priciple, but I don't think so.
Prayer beads were used in Christianity, the Eastern Orthodox Prayer rope was invented in the fourth century, and the bible tells us anyone who is dead in Christ is therfore alive, we see proof when Christ talked to moses, so is Jesus conducting necromanc? No of course not, necromancy is like what king saul did, and through a witch of some sort however we ask the saints to pray for us, they CAN hear us because scripture states we are surrounded by a great cloud of whitnesses, and later in revelations it talks about the prayers of the saints, everyone I encourage you to do your own research.
Actually - we know that there is evidence that Catholics used prayer beads way before the rosary came into existence. St. Jerome in the 4th century is known to have used them. Also, just because we count how many prayers we pray or repeat prayers doesn’t mean they are done in vain. Many Saints say that if you pray the rosary quickly without meditating upon the life of Christ as we should, that particular rosary that was prayed was not as effective or as powerful. Just because other faith’s used prayer beads doesn’t condemn them in any way! Also, idk about you, but my Jesus preaches eternal life making Mary and the Saints alive in heaven! Their souls are in heaven waiting for the resurrection of their bodies! And yes, the Holy Spirit is the advocate, so what you are saying is no one can pray for anyone ever? The Bible definitely teaches us to pray for one another just like Mary and the Saints do! Necromancy and asking the Saints to pray for us is completely different - necromancy is a term used for interacting with the dead to gain information. Saintly intercession from heaven is simply just that, asking them to pray for us!
Man does not have a soul. He is a soul. There is no separate conscious entity which flies to heaven upon death . Death is death. I laugh at your attempts to change what necromancy is.
@@geordiewishart1683 what? I’m confused lol we are body and soul composites, meaning we are not just a body with a soul or souls that inhabit bodies. A result of sin is death which is the separation of the body and soul. That’s why after a period of time after a person dies, they still have remnants of their bodies, aka bones lol Asking those in heaven to pray for us is taught very clearly in Sacred Scripture! Necromancy is specifically communicating with the dead to gain secret or unknown information apart from God.
I think Lex himself may have already done a video on this but the idea that man has a frail / mortal body and yet an immortal soul are pagan in origin. The first time soul is mentioned is when God formed Adam from the earth and breathed into his nostrils so he became a living soul. Soul is simply a living being. I cannot now see your response but you saw proof of man decaying in the grave as what! You also claimed much biblical proof of it being encouraged to ask for help for saints in heaven. What is this proof? Necromancy is defined in many dictionaries as contacting the dead, especially for help in divining the future or for influencing a future event. Praying to the dead is necromancy.
@@geordiewishart1683 lol I don’t know what your argument is…I never said the mortal body is frail. God breathed life into us! Like I said, we are body body and soul composites, not just a frail body with a soul or a soul that inhabits a frail body. A human person is both body and soul. We are on the same page there. Revelations 4:4 talks about the 24 elders clothed in white garments and Revelations 8 speaks of incense being offered by the Saints to the throne of God! Yeah, when we ask the Saints to pray for us, we aren’t asking for secret or unknown knowledge of the future. We are simply asking them to pray for us just like you or I would ask our friends or family to pray for us! Also, we don’t pray to the dead. The Saints are alive in heaven! I believe in a God of life, not death! :)
I would love for you to do a video on Biblical forgiveness. When the Lord tells us to forgive others as He forgives us, what does that mean? God doesn't forgive unconditionally. His forgiveness is conditional. He expects contrition, repentance, etc. So if the Lord has conditions on his forgiveness, and He says to forgive others as He forgives us, is his method a model to follow? Can we have conditions like He does? The requirement for those whom have done us wrong to require them to ask for forgiveness and be contrite? Or do we have to forgive outside of what the Lord does and forgive unconditionally every time with every one? I know from a secular standpoint it is good for our health to forgive and move on, but I'm more concerned with Biblical forgiveness.
When I pray the rosary I meditate on the specific mystery in the life of Jesus - Repetitive prayers such as the Hail Mary or the Jesus Prayer are really contemplative, not mindless, for those of us to pray the Rosary -- Differentiating between what is / not in the Bible is fine, but there would be no Bible if there had not been any tradition to draw upon
For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus; 1 Timothy 2:5 KJV No Mary, no saints that have already past away and so on....
‘‘Whosoever wishes to be in a state of salvation”(this, not ‘‘ Whosoever will be saved”, is the true meaning of ** Quicunque vult salvus esse”’), “it is above all things necessary that he hold the Catholic Faith, which faith except he do keep whole and undefiled without doubt, he shall perish everlastingly.”(St. Athanasius) Within the Catholic Church, we hold that which has been believed everywhere, always, and of all men: for that is truly and properly Catholic, which comprehends all things in general after a universal manner. And that shall we do if we follow Universality, Antiquity, and Consent.(Vincent of Lerins, Against Heresy, Ch. II) "While you stick to the old Church of England ways you are respectable-it is going by a sort of tradition ; when you profess to return to lost Church of England ways you are rational;-but when you invent a new ceremonial which never was, when you copy the Roman or other foreign rituals, you are neither respectable nor rational. It is sectarian."-J. H. Newman to Henry Wilberforce. Life of J. H. Cardinal Newman, by W. Ward. 1912. I. 235. "I am dying," Ken had written, "in the Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Faith professed by the whole Church before the disunion of East and West; and, more particularly, in the Communion of the Church of England as it stands distinguished from both Papal and Protestant innovation and adheres to the Doctrine of the Cross."(Thomas Ken, 1637-1711, Bishop of Bath and Wells). There is no finer statement of the Anglican position to be found anywhere. "The Catholic Church is the home of the Holy Ghost. It is His only Earthly home. He does not make His home in any Dissenting sect. Sometimes people quarrel with the Church and break away from her and make little sham churches of their own. We call these people Dissenters and their sham churches sects. The Holy Ghost does not abide does not dwell with them. He goes and visits them perhaps, but only as a stranger."-A Book For The Children Of God, p. 77. London: W. Knott, 1891. "It is schismatical to attend Dissenting Meeting Houses or to subscribe to or assist the sectarian objects of Dissenters in any way. If the traveller should assist at Protestant worship, he is aiding and abetting that the doctrine, heresy, and schism from which he prays in the Litany to be delivered. They are not a branch of the true Church(unlike the Roman Catholic and Eastern Orthodox). The same cannot be said of Roman Catholic Churches and their objects because the Roman Catholics are a branch of the true Church." "The Bible is the Book which God has given to His Church, and it belongs to the Church alone, and not to any Dissenting sect. No one but a Catholic can safely read the Bible and no Catholic can read it safely who does not read it in the Church's way. In the hands of all, the Bible thus used is dangerous to morality and truth. Therefore, an endless variety of sects."-The Congregation In Church, p. 202. New Edition. London: Mowbray.-A Book For The Children Of God, p. 77. London: W. Knott, 1891.-Golden Gate, by the Rev. S. Baring-Gould, Rector of Lew Trenchard, Part I., p. 177. Edition, 1875.-Union Review for 1865, p. 148.-Church News, July 7, 1889. “It is the distinct duty of all who pray for the peace of Jerusalem to repudiate foreign Lutheranism, Calvinism, &c., and to do their utmost to show that the English Church of which they are members, is really one with the Church of Rome in faith, orders, and sacraments; whilst the Protestant bodies are branches cut off from the True Vine of which the Roman and Anglican and Eastern Communions are living boughs of the Catholic Church.”-Church News, July 7, 1869.
Praying the Rosary is praying the Gospel. Joyful Mysteries: The Annunciation Lk 1:26-27, The Visitation Lk 1:39-42, The Birth of Our Lord Lk 2:1-7, The Presentation in the Temple Lk 2:21-24, The finding of Jesus in the temple Lk 2:41-47. Sorrowful Mystery:The agony in the Garden Mt 26:36-39,The scourging at the pillar, Mt 27,26, The crowning with thorns, Mt 27:27-29, The carrying of the cross, Mk 15:21-22, The crucifixion, Lk 23:33-46. Glorious Mystery: The Resurrection Lk 24:1-5, The Ascension Mk 16:19, The descent of the Holy Spirit Acts 2:1-4, The Assumption Lk 1:48-49, The crowning of Our Lady Queen of Heaven Rev 12:1. Pax Christi
1:12 _"pagans were known to use prayer beads to count the repetitions of their prayers"_ For India - certainly. For Romans and Greeks available to Galilee - not that I know of. Do _you_ have any better material?
@@linak7155 The bells and the smells because l love tha Middle East .I have been doing a lot of research on the forefathers and l realise as a Protestant we are not the first church .I have read so many quotes of the fathers and suffering of the martyrs .I have subscribed to many orthodox channels and love their teachings on humility and caring for others .Suffering is not a disgrase but it is helping us on our way to live holy .Their worship is so wonderful !The Russian orthodox music ,the Coptics ,the Greek and Syriac .I love their churches with the icons .I just cant talk to them .They are so encouraging to me when l ask questions .I can go on and on .Just listen to their music .It brings so much peace !
@@linak7155 Thank you for your reply .I live in Pretoria ,South Africa and wish l knew a church like that .I can not go back to the charasmatic church with valid reasons and do nor want to discuss it here .Thank you once more for your time .
You are 100% correct! Mary cannot steal Jesus's Glory! We don't have to ask Mary for anything, Jesus is the Christ! The Father, the Son and the Holy Ghost are the ones who have the power! I can't just pick any name out of the Bible and start asking that dead Saint to do stuff for me! I don't see how they can read the Bible especially the New testament and continue to ask anybody else instead of Jesus!
He who offends a mother, always offends her child. Why do believe this doesn't count for our Lord? Repent before your soul is judged. Our Lord forgive you, Amen.
I just threw away three things into the trash that were given to me. One is a reflective thing for the window, with symbolic insignia, one is a heavy bell with some kind of symbol? And the other is a dream catcher. Gone!!! Thank you for teaching me to better understand the Bible.
I have a mental condition that makes it almost impossible to stay focused for more than a couple of minutes. I use certain tools to help me with that. Prayer is very difficult and frustrating so I thought beads would help me with that. Not to count or repeat. Just focus. Any thoughts on that?
THANK YOU / I WAS LOOKING FOR CHAPTER AND VERSE / WELL DONE , TO THE POINT WITH CHAPTER AND VERSE AND WITHOUT SELF-RIGOROUSNESS FALTER-ALL B/S WE GET WHEN ASKING A FELLOW CHRISTIAN A SIMPLE QUESTION . THANKS AGAIN / KEEP THE FAITH , JESUS SAVES
I don't pray to saints, but I heard something that made me go "hm"...if everyone who believes in Christ has eternal life in heaven with him, then would they still be dead? Doesn't that mean that they are alive with him in heaven?
prayer beads were used before the rosary. it was originally used by monks to recite the 150 psalms and it was called a psalter not a rosary. At that time had nothing to do with the haily mary or the mysteries of Christ
1:46 _"they can't hear those prayers"_ More than you know? Like, could God in Heaven be telling them whatever is part of their glory, like the people they intercede for? Does ruling with Christ for a thousand years mean anything?
Has hearing become worse since the blessed can enter heaven when they die? Or is hearing someone on earth struggling to make it to heaven harder than hearing someone actually damned forever?
Trust me I understand why it’s believed that the saints do not hear us or that it’s wrong to ask for their intercession since it’s been drilled into heads by modern churches but it’s very much biblical to ask for intercession. Especially when following the original churches rather than a lot of new age teachings. Revelation 8:4 “And the smoke of the incense, which came with the prayers of the saints, ascended up before God out of the angel's hand” - referring to the prayers of the saints Hebrews 12:1 “Wherefore seeing we also are compassed about with so great a cloud of witnesses, let us lay aside every weight, and the sin which doth so easily beset us, and let us run with patience the race that is set before us” - showing that even in death they watch over us as a cloud of witnesses Job 5:1 “Call now, if there be any that will answer thee; and to which of the saints wilt thou turn?” -God showing Job that a man can turn to a Saint but, will he get an answer if that man is foolish? Luke 16:19-31 Which also shows that the saints can speak and interact even after death. With Abraham speaking to the rich man who had died. The necromancy in the Bible is talking about people trying to conjure spirits to perform magic arts, fortunes, omens, sorcery, giving offerings of humans which is all demonic. Leviticus 19:26, Deuteronomy 18:10, Galatians 5:19-20, Acts 19:19 Again I understand the common misconception but the true lies here are what are now being taught about the saints. The saints in todays culture are not taught in modern churches and when they are; it’s always about idolatry and how they’re dead in which their prayers mean nothing. IMO that’s pretty disrespectful to those who have far surpassed many of us in terms of dedication to Christ especially for those saints who died for their faith.
Anyone who has googled proper rosary has encountered the concept of NOT doing it mindlessly but to meditate on every part of it and pause as needed to give proper reverence to what is being prayed. Your over generalization seems to fit your agenda rather than state any factual information. Are there people who rush through the rosary and don't give it proper attention and heartfelt thought? Yes, obviously. The people rushing through the rosary are only wasting an opportunity to connect with the holy spirit in a mindful way, but their tendencies do not represent the intention of the rosary practice. As I am a student of religious discussions, I look for people who may present opposing views with well informed facts and logical presentations of theological concepts juxtaposed with real historical content. Your simple statement of "vain repitiion" does not hold up against the overwhelming evidence of what has been promulgated as the proper, heartfelt practice. That said, your credibility of someone who can enter into a rousing logistical discussion of theological differences is lacking. As an example, look into the many discussions about the Filioque "controversy". There are seemingly valid points from both sides of this argument, and most times the people "arguing" their differences offer historic documents and theologically established mores which require some real study to come to some conclusion. So in that example, anyone engaged in this discussion brings credibility because of the preponderance of theological tradition and documentation. You, on the other had, have not offered anything close to a theological discussion but rather a transparent rebuke based on false information. Who hurt you?
Praying the rosary was never prayers to Mary or the saints in the first place. It's a prayer to God. Hence, it is not a vain repetition. Non-Catholics have a lot to learn about what Catholics do. Condemning Catholic practices without asking deep questions on why, is not good enough. There are numerous revelations inspired by the Holy Spirit that have led to many of the Catholic practices we see, but the true origin of these are not out there. This makes it, then, difficult for people to understand. I'm Catholic, I'm Christian and we Christians will keep enlightening each other.
@UNLEARN the lies, if you can find me one Christian in the first thousand years of Christianity (who you don’t think was a heretic) who denied the True Presence of Christ in the Eucharist or the Perpetual Virginity of Mary or the importance of the intercession of the Saints… I will leave Catholicism.
You said Mary and other saints are dead in the ground, awaiting Resurrection, but is this accurate? When the Bible talks about saved people who have died, it only says their bodies rest in the ground, not their spirit. I don't believe a person's spirit stays in a coma-like state awaiting the Resurrection, but rather they are met with the Lord after the body has died.
@@bobbysworldrox The original writings in greek did not have punctuation. A scribe came along and placed punctuation where he thought it belonged. Today I tell you, you will be with me in paradise. You can not make doctrine off one sentance. You must read the whole bible and take into account everything Jesus said. The spirit of life the breath breathed into a soul to make it living is what goes back to God not the person. The bible us clear that the dead know nothing. And the dead are not raised until the last trump.
Revelation 8:3-4 And another angel came and stood at the altar with a golden censer, and he was given much incense to offer with the prayers of all the saints on the golden altar before the throne, and the smoke of the incense, with the prayers of the saints, rose before God from the hand of the angel.
The saints are true believers on earth. The prayers are their prayers, uttered whilst on earth. There are no dead people in heaven saying prayers for us.
1:49 _"they don't deserve such prayer"_ Like: * adresses used by God Himself to Mary? * adresses to Mary underlining divinity of Our Lord? * "pray for us" Have you asked someone to pray for you and are you sorry because he didn't deserve that, only God does? * or the adress "blessed" which is what Jesus uses of certain categories in Matthew 5? When we say "Holy Lucy, pray for us!" we are: * affirming Lucy is holy or blessed in the sense Jesus meant in Matthew 5 * ruling with Christ for the thousand years * asking her to pray for us. What part of this doesn't she deserve?
1:39 Could Mary do sth to get a miracle accomplished at Cana? The main prayer invoking Her in the Rosary - check Luke 1:28 and 1:42, the Church then adds the name Jesus, which Mary and Elisabeth did not yet know in Luke 1. Usually also adding an originally separate prayer, which acknowledges Jesus is God by beginning "Holy Mary, Mother of God" ... Can saints under the altar in heaven accomplish things for Christians persecuted on earth? Check apocalypse 6:9 and the two following verses.
people have adopted a lot of different things that are widely accepted like trinity and Yeshua being Yahweh in the flesh and they are also unsound beliefs and teachings but have a long history of acceptance as truth. Traditions can be dangerous and because they are old traditions doesn't make them correct but people seem to be more caught up in traditions on religious rhetoric
0:29 The statue from 3rd C. BC, was it visible to Galilaeans of the 1st C AD? Not just St. Thomas Didymus, when he came to India, but _all_ of the audience in Matthew 6?
2:01 If the Holy Spirit intercedes for you, is it _ever_ by inspiring someone to pray for you? Are you saying Lucy or others awaiting a glorious resurrection are cut off from the Holy Spirit?
2:22 When it says Jesus is interceding, do the mentions of His resurrection mean He does so as a man? If the head does so, can the members do so? Are only the Christians on earth members of Christ?
Our Father who art in heaven hallowed be thy name thy kingdom come thy will be done in earth as it is in heaven give us this day our daily bread forgive us our debts as we forgive those who are indebted to us lead us not into temptation but deliver us from evil for thine is the power and glory FOREVER! and i doubt Jesus was holding beads when praying that...
Amen,, brother. This is exactly one of the reasons why I left the Catholic faith years ago. Catholic faith is based on tradition, not on anything biblical.
@@thepaganone3326 protestantism is based on learning and reading out of the Bible. Catholics don’t do that. Catholics read from the little book that’s given to them in their church. Catholics add to the Bible which the Bible says is a sin. Catholics worship carved images, The Bible says that is a sin, Catholics pray to saints and the Bible says to only pray to the Lord. Catholics pray to Mary. Catholics worship Mary. Which Mary is just a sinner like the rest of us and is no one to be worshiped or prayed to.
@@thepaganone3326 They’re are many false teachers who teach a prosperity gospel which is a shame and is apostasy. There are those, like Lex, who are great teachers. I hope you watch more of his videos. 😊
@@Julie-sx4wk I have learned a lot but as for prayer bead is where I disagree. Now I am against the Marian rosary, but utilizing a rosary as a tool for remembering scriptures like psalms or even just keeping one’s hands busy is beneficial. Now I know there will be many that will chime in with that it is wrong but to each their own.
I don’t know how to respond to those that pray to Mary and claimed that she answered their prayers. What do you say to them? Or are they lying? Also to those they claimed they die and saw heaven but God tells them is not your turn go back to earth. I wonder! Or those that say they saw ghosts of their parents after their death. I never experience anything like these events. I just wonder!!!
The only thing you're wrong about is the doctrine of soul sleep. There's so much evidence that the doctrine of soul sleeping isn't biblical. if I am wrong, please tell me how I'm wrong & please show scripture to show. God bless.
@@geordiewishart1683 Base off on who's interpretation? Yours? No one can interpret the bible correctly & this is why there are over 30,000+ dominations of "Christianity" because none of you guys can agree on anything. Why are you right & I'm wrong? What authority do you have do state such a statement?
Life ever lasting. They are not really dead I don't believe. They help us. Some spirits try to help.. hence the spirit guides.. but the holy spirit is to be our guide and God had even persevered some of the saints bodies so I believe they're part of our help. The Bible mentions saints.
1:03 Lex Meyer, why do you go to KJV which was drafted in polemics against Catholics on certain topics, rather than the Greek text and old translations? None of these have "use [vain] repetitions" as what you are supposed not to. Greek - battologein "speak like someone stuttering" Latin - multum loqui "speak much" Syriac and Coptic (I checked on Quora) - both have words meaning "stutter" ... Now if you stutter, you repeat, but involuntarily. If you repeat, you use many words, only if you add up single occurrences. "Stutter" and "use many words" can have other connotations, have you checked about the ethnics available in Galilee?
Isn't the "Our Father" repetitive? asking for a friend. When we pray for a friend or family member aren't we interceding for that person? If they are sick; is asking for their health many times is wrong now? Jeremiah 15:1-Long after their deaths, Moses and Samuel are depicted pleading for the Israelite people on earth...are their prayers more important than ours? Revelation 8:3 - The prayers of the saints rise up before God, and then God acts on earth: are these prayers non-repetitive? Since you are stating that the Catholics are "pagans" , why are you using a Bible given to you by "pagans"? Are you a pagan brother Lex?
Remember when Jesus and Shadrach Meshach and abendago used vain reputation also we shouldn't ask people for prayer because after all there's only one mediator between God and màn😂 Going by the logic all prayer is vain reputation because the God is all knowing. Nowhere in the Bible does it mention that Mary And saints are dead and in the ground
