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Cinquedea - Fighting with the Italian Renaissance Short Sword 

Academy of Historical Fencing
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The Cinquedea was a popular sidearm in Northern Italy in the early part of the 16th century. They can vary in size immensely from being a small dagger to a full size sword, however most fit into the category of a very short sword. These training examples made by Black Fencer represent a roughly avarage example with a 50cm blade length.
There is no documented style for how they were used (arguably a little of Marozzo perhaps with his large dagger type involving some cutting actions), and so we are mixing the styles of short swords we do practice with (messer/dussack) with some dagger techniques. With its very broad blade and zero flexibility as a result, these training examples are a lot of fun but must be used with the appropriate levels of control.

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9 фев 2023

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Комментарии : 50   
@dlatrexswords
@dlatrexswords Год назад
Oh yes! We certainly need more of this going on. Bravo everyone.
@tatumergo3931
@tatumergo3931 23 дня назад
Is there a katzbalger fighting video?
@Pandenhir
@Pandenhir Год назад
Never imagined a fight with short blades to be so energetic. Really enjoyed watching it! Have always been fascinated with these weird swords.
@TheBetterBleedingBladesYouTube
@TheBetterBleedingBladesYouTube 4 месяца назад
I’ve always loved Cinquedea! Beautiful weapons, truly!
@rshaart4810
@rshaart4810 Год назад
It's a shame that BlackFencer doesn't ship directly to Australia, I'd love to get some of their synthetic weapons, their distributor hasn't gotten back to me for weeks now. Always wonderful to see shortswords and short weapons in general getting some love in HEMA.
@robertprovan9374
@robertprovan9374 Год назад
They ship direct to NZ so I'm sure they would ship to Australia.
@richardbeare11
@richardbeare11 6 дней назад
Man this looks like so much fun
@GermanSwordMaster
@GermanSwordMaster Год назад
Loving the new intro :) ! And your broad usage of different weapons within HEMA. Always did the same with my club.
@raphlvlogs271
@raphlvlogs271 Год назад
the gladius and xiphos would have been used in a similar manor when shields were not available
@zerozerosud
@zerozerosud Год назад
I love the Cinquedea! It looks to me like you're using it here like a short Messer and that's a comparison that comes pretty natural to me, not lastly because of both weapons' origin as a civilian sidearm. Did you notice any difference in behavior due to the shape and weight distribution or is it essentially the same?
@AcademyofHistoricalFencing
@AcademyofHistoricalFencing Год назад
Absolutely we are using a mix of messer/dussack technique as well as some dagger. It's not hugely different no. The extremely broad forte makes them parry very strongly, and the shorter size of them does encourage a lot of offhand use. Cinquedea can of course be as long as a typical messer, in which case I think you'd find them to be near identical in use.
@JCOwens-zq6fd
@JCOwens-zq6fd Год назад
Short swords are quite interesting. Been practicing more w/ them lately myself.
@AcademyofHistoricalFencing
@AcademyofHistoricalFencing Год назад
Absolutely, short swords of all kinds need more love.
@Jarulf4477
@Jarulf4477 Год назад
I love the Cinquedea. And I have a question to the pros: Would the cinquedea paired with a stilleto be viable? I know dual-wielding is difficult and not often done but still.
@AcademyofHistoricalFencing
@AcademyofHistoricalFencing Год назад
Considering the Italians love for paired weapon usage in the era I would say it is very viable yes. Marozzo taught dagger and cloak for example, and he and contempories taught all sorts of sword and dagger, buckler, paired swords etc. We will be doing some companion weapons stuff with them. Buckler would especially be fun I think, and cloak too, we will do dagger as well. Overall though we have to consider how the cinquedea was carried and why. It seems to have been carried in place of a large dagger either alone or with a larger sword sometimes. So these pairings would be unusual.
@Jarulf4477
@Jarulf4477 Год назад
@@AcademyofHistoricalFencing Thanks for the info! I have a similar question, i personally use staves and spears, tried a lot of things with those. Do you know of any instances of double bladed spears (meaning one on each side of the shaft) Would be pretty bad for formation fighting and i have'nt found any historical data about it. Because when i tried it fighting against three friends it turned out great. Takes a LOT of space though.
@dallenhumpherys7911
@dallenhumpherys7911 Год назад
@@Jarulf4477 I don't know about having an edge on the butt of a spear, but there are lots of spears and other polearms with spikes on the butt.
@AcademyofHistoricalFencing
@AcademyofHistoricalFencing Год назад
An edge, not really, a spike yes.
@Jarulf4477
@Jarulf4477 Год назад
@@AcademyofHistoricalFencing Ok, yeah knew about the butt spike. But thank you guys for confirming my (sadly fruitless) research. 🥲 Going to look into indian martial arts next as they have pretty crazy stuff. Cheers!
@Mike-hq2yb
@Mike-hq2yb Год назад
Very Messer-esque
@dallenhumpherys7911
@dallenhumpherys7911 Год назад
It would be cool to try cinquedea and arming sword or sidesword.
@desdicadodog8452
@desdicadodog8452 Год назад
That's some great Fencing
@skohtihamilton9443
@skohtihamilton9443 Год назад
YES! Finally...
@user-pz8fj8rx3c
@user-pz8fj8rx3c 10 месяцев назад
Bellissima ti amo italia sempre. Non dimenticare mai la razza Italianna. Capisci.
@corrugatedcavalier5266
@corrugatedcavalier5266 Год назад
Very cool, I love cinquedea! How do you like the Blackfencer ones? Very smooth @ 3:16 !
@AcademyofHistoricalFencing
@AcademyofHistoricalFencing Год назад
Really liking them so far, will do a video review soon. They are a massive amount of fun.
@corrugatedcavalier5266
@corrugatedcavalier5266 Год назад
@Academy of Historical Fencing i can't get them here in the us yet but maybe south coast swords will carry them at some point. I have the PHA "basic trainer" cinquedea and it's fun but has a bit of point
@cmoralesmsae
@cmoralesmsae 3 месяца назад
1:16 was brutal 😂
@tatumergo3931
@tatumergo3931 23 дня назад
And probably the most actually used technique in that period. Given that, that's one of the openings in armour.
@lialiiz
@lialiiz 11 месяцев назад
this fight is really something! next time you should film it with a go pro!
@Ostenjager
@Ostenjager Год назад
This style looks like it would benefit from the use of a buckler, and lends itself to grappling.
@Xtafa
@Xtafa 6 месяцев назад
Is there a particular manual for the cinquedea? Hard to find much info on actual use
@tatumergo3931
@tatumergo3931 23 дня назад
I think the Marozzo manual on the use of dagger was meant for the cinquedea. Aside from that, I don't think there's much else.
@Xtafa
@Xtafa 23 дня назад
@@tatumergo3931 appreciated
@krystofmraz
@krystofmraz Год назад
Always tought its shorter, more like gagger. Looks cool but stil i would rather carry something longer 😅
@AcademyofHistoricalFencing
@AcademyofHistoricalFencing Год назад
They come in a very wide range of sizes, these ones are somewhere in the typical range, they can be a lot longer. These have a 50cm blade. I was in the Royal Armouries store rooms handling five antiques recently and only one was shorter than these at about 45cm blade, the others were 55-60cm. Most of them fall into a short sword catagory rather than dagger.
@rickvassell8349
@rickvassell8349 Год назад
What were these swords used for?
@AcademyofHistoricalFencing
@AcademyofHistoricalFencing Год назад
Worn in civilian life for self defence, brawling, fashion. And sometimes as sidearms by soldiers.
@hollandbright2903
@hollandbright2903 11 месяцев назад
just like Ezio Auditore!
@robertfogelberg7538
@robertfogelberg7538 Год назад
May be a wrong opinion seam to have dusak and fiore one hand in the same
@AcademyofHistoricalFencing
@AcademyofHistoricalFencing Год назад
See the description, we are mixing messer/dussack methods with some dagger principles because that best seems to fit the weapon which we don't have sources to work with.
@tommyss4l
@tommyss4l Год назад
Cinquedea and rotella or imbracciatura
@56Seeker
@56Seeker Год назад
I don't know the rules of this, but there seems a lot of opportunity to attack the legs being missed.
@MichaelGThomas
@MichaelGThomas Год назад
Indeed. This was our first proper tryout with them.
@AcademyofHistoricalFencing
@AcademyofHistoricalFencing Год назад
It's perfectly allowed, but it's extremely risky to target the legs, knowing what can come at you with such a brutish blade in short distance. Certainly under certain circumstances it would be doable, but you'd still have to take a big risk to do it
@56Seeker
@56Seeker Год назад
@@AcademyofHistoricalFencing The fighting with those short blades looks roman/gladiatorial, and I d have thought one would be very vulnerable to a knee hook.
@AcademyofHistoricalFencing
@AcademyofHistoricalFencing Год назад
If you had a shield it absolutely would be, but without any ability to cover the high line it's really hard to make low attacks and not get smashed from above.
@Roderik95
@Roderik95 Год назад
Were these daggers/swords made as a response to weapon laws or something else? Any evidence?
@AcademyofHistoricalFencing
@AcademyofHistoricalFencing Год назад
I've never seen any mention of weapon laws being a factor with them, especially as full length swords were so commonly carried at the time. Their existence and popularity seems to be a mix of factors. 1 - the obsession with the ancient world at the time and recreating clothing, armour and swords inspired by the ancient world. 2 - ease of wear. Large daggers and short swords were popular as they were easy and comfortable to wear. 3 - this is probably the most significant, by being so short the blade could be incredibly broad and that allowed for extremely decadent decoration, with a great many fullers, engravings, gilt etc. They were a huge symbol of wealth and status.
@Roderik95
@Roderik95 Год назад
@@AcademyofHistoricalFencing That would make a lot more sense. I've always found the blade shape so intriguing. Very aesthetic. Thanks for the thoughtful response!
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