£246 - Ursa Ryan can say otherwise, but the reason he decided to use Tokugawa for this guide so he could build the University of Sankore and claim it was only because of the synergy.
One of the biggest things I love about all your video formats, of recent videos cuz that's when I discovered this channel is how you take the time to explain how things work with one another. I watch a lot of other Civ players that are well known but there's something about the way you take that extra few steps and explaining your thought process and your reasoning that makes me really excited to watch your videos! Please keep up the great work and don't stop explaining for us who are trying to become a little better! P.S. you show some features I never see other players utilize (mainly cause they're too good I suspect)!
Great game so far. Really deviated from what I was expecting. One strategy I don't see talked about often is planning out your first 6 farms. First, its give the Feudalism boost which is probably one of the most important civics in the game for the two additional build charge's policy card. Secondly, a good farm triangle or diamond in your capital is a huge boon for a Pingala city in terms of ensuring steady population growth. You won't get a chance to place farms on hills until the Industrial Era with Civil Engineering so you will be missing out on two eras worth of growth in a very crucial time. In addition, using a hill for a farm is a waste of potential production. A mine is typically better on a hill unless you city is starving or stagnating. Big cities mean more districts and more districts mean more yields!
I know you wanted to focus on Pingala/Magnus and normally these two are the ones to go for but there are times when a Liang start is better. When your tiles are poor, growth will be weak and chops are few but your start is coastal, and you have an excellent opportunity to maximise your production by buffing your population as much as you can. This spawn is a good example. If you moved more inland you know you will deny yourself additional city locations. So you should start near the coast. In my opinion crossing to the grassland adjacent to the tobacco was the best play. From there you have a +5 harbour (+5 because I believe you also get an extra 1 from Japan's ability), faster pantheon (God of the Sea!) and a Sailing eureka, potentially more chance of oil in range and this amount of coast tiles is crying out for a Mausoleum, so from there we're also seeing a theatre square go down. Liang helps here in 2 ways: an extra builder charge, which is useful because you desperately need to buff your tiles because they are weak, and fisheries which will massively boost your population and also help production while Liang is in the city. Once you've spammed your fisheries, farms and squeezed out as much production as you can, Liang can then move from a highly populous capital with a Mausoleum, and then Pingala moves in and dramatically increases your science and culture output, and the process can be repeated with Liang in other cities. Now you're praying for the Auckland city state to show up for that sweet water production from suzerainty. The main weakness here is the lack of a good IZ location. You can still get a good one if you put your gov plaza adjacent and aqueduct to it, but it's quite easy for another city to make an IZ and your capital can leech off the radial production from a later factory and power plant. After all, you only really need one for all cities in range to get that benefit and I believe IZs are weak investments until Industrialisation (a few mines or quarries achieve similar outputs as the district and workshop). You're not going to get a great campus either, but population and Pingala and Japan's ability can compensate to still net you a +3 or +4 if you set things right. Finally I know that avoiding Magnus will cost you pop for every cap-built settler, but the fisheries are so bountiful in food that pop growth easy enough for it to not nearly be a problem.
I always find Liang a disappointing first pick, but I agree that if your start is so bad you can't even settle a good capital in reasonable turns she may be the only option. Her coastal benefits require a lot of production into builders to set up.
@@jimbo5603 This is to some extent true. However in my opinion builders should be built more often than most people choose to. For example if you watch the deity player Civtrader6, you see the power of having multiple builders at once combined with Magnus. He no longer posts videos unfortunately but a key feature of his play was to place multiple builders ready to chop, queue up his desired product and then chop chop chop all on the same turn so he would come out with things like a pyramids built in 1 turn, multiple military units, ancestral hall etc, built without even ending his turn. Granted the aspect that includes Magnus is obviously incompatible in Liang starts and in his time the chop yield with Magnus was much larger (Rise and Fall, before Gathering Storm), but if you can instead combine with a policy card and/or a pantheon, you will see the almost same result. In any case, I'd actually suggest the main brake on the Liang vehicle is border expansion and gold. You will not be able to easily afford to buy all the coast tiles (and easily weigh such decisions against the opportunity cost of not buying other things) and the border expansion will depend on your culture, which is of course not easy to increase dramatically early on. Therefore the demand for builders is bottlenecked by these two key factors. Praise be to Sinbad.
Liang is not the pick here. No amount of builder charges can fix flat land and coast in terms of production. Tokugawa is a internal trade civ so he will be getting food from his magnus trade routes. Districts don't make themselves. If you have all food tiles and food trade routes and no production tiles, it will take too long to build anything. Setting to the left would be the better play because it has far better yields. God of the sea fishes give 3/1/1 yield after getting pantheon and making a builder and sheep give 3/1 yield after settling turn 2. He can still get his sailing eureka after setting 2nd city and still go harbors. The only district adj that matters is harbors for shipyard production and +4 campus for rationalism boost. The campus doesn't even need to be a 4+ at the start. As long he gets 4+ adj before he gets enlightenment, it's fine. IZ adj does not matter before industrialization. Most of the yields that come from district come from the district buildings and city state envoys.
i got my second deity win with tokugawa, japan was a;ready one of my favorite civs and i already had my first vidtory with hojo. Tokugawa is a great civ and i love him dearly
I love your videos and the first 25 minutes gave solid advice to getting a good start on deity games but if the strategy for the rest of the game revolves around capturing an undefended settler, using it to found a city next to a natural wonder that gives great food then settler spamming to control the center then it's stops working as a guide to get people to know how to win standard deity games where they can't rely on that kind of luck lol.
Just a note of the settler - I thought I mentioned at the time and I'll mention it again here - being flexible and spotting weaknesses with the AI, be it a free settler or a bunch of weak coastal cities with no walls, that is absolutely the sort of thing that any strategy should incorporate and I'd reccomend keeping an eye out for it. It's in the same bracket as the AI selling cheap luxuries or great works, or RNG from city states or tribal huts. I understand that you can't replicate it in every game but the point is that if you look for these things and look to exploit them, EVERY game will have at least something for you to jump on and take advantage of. Deity AI demands that sort of optimisation. In this particular example, had I not got the settler, I would have just ferried my own up 15 turns later and used open borders to bypass Australia. It would have been less of a head start but with chops you can easily get a foothold somewhere like that
@@UrsaRyan Responding for the algorithm lol. My nitpick is that for a guide to master deity, nabbing a free settler for your third city, settling a food wonder, then spamming new cities doesn't provide any educational value since there's no reliable way to get there without insane luck. However having the delayed settler, using the open borders to bypass Australia, and showing how to find a suitable location where you can manage loyalty and make it great with chops would be a wealth of information to learn from. In a normal game, stealing settlers is always hype but in a guide the free settler made it a lot easier to snowball since you're 15 turns ahead of schedule. But if I were in your shoes I doubt I'd have the discipline to delete the settler after taking it, and city spam is my jam so I'm not throwing stones, just boosting interaction lol
19.43 You may want to mention that settlers cannot embark on coastal tiles just with sailing alone. You didn't technically say it but without any mention to the need of Shipbuilding in the Second Era new players might come to think that you're just going to get Sailing, make a Galley & start moving Settlers along inside it. Love your content as always!
Thanks for this. I've watched plenty of civ videos from people like you, potato, civ lifr, boes etc and I always appreciate videos that don't involve alternate game modes. For me, a guide isn't very good if it's like get X secret society and spam X because it's so narrow scope. Same with having a wonder start or some huge map advantage like Russia on a cold map. This map is great because it's borderline underwhelming but balanced, perfect for a guide
For me, the Pingala vs. Magnus decision comes down to growth. If your city has poor growth, you'll struggle to regrow your population after producing a settler, in which case Magnus's Provision and Surplus Logistics promotions will be very helpful, removing the population loss from settlers and alleviating your growth problem. On the other hand, Pingala's Connoissour and Research promotions work off of population and thus require the city to have the growth needed to produce that population in order best benefit from them. In short, poor growth -> Magnus; good growth -> Pingala.
Good way to think about it - for me Pingala and culture helps to get more govornors quickly, which often helps long term - but I can see it your way as well!
@@UrsaRyan In my first game with it I had a ton of camps so I took goddess of the hunt and built Temple of Artemis. I was getting like 15 amenities from it in my first couple cities and had a ton of great tiles to work.
Have to say. Most civ RU-vidrs rush their tutorial videos which makes no sense. I guess they assume the viewer watched all their other videos. But this was explained very well
Nice content! Also, this version of Japan has a really similar (and arguably better) counterpart in the civilization expanded mod -- Germany! Really recommend playing expanded Germany with the City Lights mod, cuz you can easily make multiple 180＋production cities by around turn 150 with the help of Hanzas, boroughs, and crazy trade routes
15:28 you should always send delegation if you're trying to be friends with them, since they might not accept the delegation afterwards for a very long time, and if you are at say -2 afterwards you can send them a money gift which i think varies from +2 to +5 happiness depending how much you send them so it can literally be the difference between being friends with them on turn 30 vs turn 130
This might be a bad idea, but my strategy for the Capital would be to settle the Plains Hill to the West. It is a turn 3 settle, but the quality of the land is much better and the Capital is more centralized, which is something you want to do as Tokugawa. EDIT: ok the mountain range does change my idea, but that would still be my original plan
I agree with you to settle west, but to turn 2 settle near the 3 hills. Settling turn 2 would give more tempo to the early game and take up less turns. Also putting any districts on hills is a bad idea on this map because it is ideal to work high production mine tiles while doing magnus internals.
but for real: it's Amani or bust, then Pingala or bust and sec.soc or bust, i.e. 6 promotions. occasionally you need Victor and if so 2 promotions at which point you are are starving for these sweet sweet 8 promotions. I rarely see Magnus start these days, least of which for black marketer. it's nice to see you going Magnus =]
In my experience (mostly single player diety) Pingala is almost always first because Connaisseur allows you to get titles faster while giving insane value. The rest depends, but I like Magnus into Provision when I can get greedy
Are you trolling? She's only really good for getting suzerain status at one single city-state, and if you're relying on one single city-state for your early game strat, you're probably gonna have a bad time. Better to eco with Magnus, or take Pingala's science/culture to move your research along.
tippy - the idea is you place Amani, get the era score for suzerain as well as map reveal, then move her to the next city state and repeat. Golden ages are very easy this way!
How come the AI has that little of the science per turn at turn 44 for example? I think in my games it is always 3 times higher. So that way, there is no catching up with them (at least not that I can figure out at the moment). I.e. by turn 100 I had around 100 science per turn and they had at least 3 times that. Poundmaker has something like 5 times that. Actually, just checked both Poundmaker and Korea had 500+ at turn 103, Australia had 300+ vs 120 science per turn from my civ (Japan)
Thank you for the great videos. But I am struggling with this one. You got a totally random settler at turn 47-ish, which if that happened to me I would take it too. But I've done about 15 starts on Snowflake and have yet to have the luck you did. The video was going to showcase how to win without random acts of luck, but I get that we should not pass on one. But is this possible with out an early settler snatch? Seemed like that set you up pretty sweet. Diff game without that, at least with my very low skill level.
it absolutely is - the main difference is taking the time to walk a settler to the middle island. You'd be a few turns behind but it's worth missing a city or two near your cap in order to conquer and hold the middle of the map = )
So here is the thing - if war is declared, delegations get sent home (as do embassies) - so it's actually better to save the gold as it all gets reset!
A little critique from me. I feel you should have gone with another map type since a huge part of civ is exploring and using the exploration to inform your further choices. You already know the 6 leaf clover map pretty well 🙈
This guide is showcasing how to a win where the variable of the map isn't the important aspect - but I totally agree that learning how to go about it map first is equally important XD For another series!
It honestly would have been a very good alternate move. For me the swinger was land - moving towards the coast would have removed half a dozen tiles of land my capital could have used for food, districts and wonders - I wanted to give myself more space. Had Auckland appeared, I would have agreed that the coast settle would have probably been better!
@Ursa Ryan I probably would have just gambling that there wasn't a super heavy faith civ. If all the AIs also failed to turn 2 settle, in theory the settler pantheon just might have been possible. Especially given the faith city state first meet. Congrats on the success man. You've been grinding out a ton of great content lately.
Not sure which one you mean? Pop over to discord - I keep a full list and there is an entire thread dedicated to mod chat - people there can direct you (and they know of awesome mods even I don't use yet)
Yes it would be a good strategy - I like commercial hubs for the adjacency with the other inland Japanese districts and for the great merchant points, which I prefer to use early game.
@@UrsaRyan While great merchant points are very nice as 3 of the merchants give trade routes as opposed to 1 admiral, the harbors really give coastal cities the needed housing. The inland capital can always have a commercial in it and run projects to get those nice trade route merchants.
It does You only get one of them though, so making sure it's in a good productive city for your empire tends to be a better shout in the long term. You see the AI putting down loyalty driven government plazas a lot and you often see them being a bit rubbish because of it!
@@UrsaRyan yes, plus 4 tiles for example… plus 4 what. What is this plus even about? Potatomcwhiskey explained it. If your doing your own beginner series, assume that 1. I am stupid 2. And have never played the game before On the flip side, it would be annoying. I watch your vids and i dont play civ at all
Can anyone tell me what DLC I need to get the updated Pingala? My game (which has gathering storm) still has his upgrades being faster creation of science or culture buildings without those bonuses of +1 per citizen.
Absolutely do - they cover large areas of the map and translate to a lot of era score - just don't auto explore with them. You need to micro manage their paths to keep them alive
F in chat for console = ( Don't worry, A to Z restarts very soon! Also check out my previous Nubia guide on this same map, most stuff there is still relevent
