For those wanting more Player Combat Tips, and even Game Master Combat Tips, check out my Combat 201 video. ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-gxfenhHVLFM.html
Seth: "Imagine if every player at the table took ten seconds to make their action." Me: "OMG right?! That would be *amazing*! I can only dream of my group acting that quickly and..." Seth: "Yeah that's way too long." Me: "............"
I know, right? I'm use to ten minutes as they all take turns digging through their character sheets, reading spells, again, or trying to figure where the optimal place for them to stand is. I swear, I could smoke an entire cigar while waiting for one them to take a turn.
From the angry gm If they're taking too long "um" ing and "err" ing then role play that, state they are overtaken by the encounter and take the parry action. It'll only happen a time or two before they get it.
Best combat video I have seen to date. Having played with many military players, even those intricately planning "L-shaped ambushes", etc., it is remarkable how often the tips here have been ignored. Sometimes it's just not realizing how the game mechanics work (vice "real-world experience"), but this video should be beneficial to ANY party finding themselves in combat together.
Thank you Seth! I have players who have not figured out these moves. Any of these moves. I say things like, "Remember the creature with one hit point can still kill you." Then I sigh and watch them injure each opponent, but not take anyone out. Aaaaah! I will suggest this video to all of them. Hopefully someone will watch this before this Thursday Game night. I have only been gaming 42 years, yet I still Found this great!
Good rundown of basics for combat. I'd really like to see you give advice on how to run good - and faster! - combats as a GM. I find it a bit of a struggle to get strike a balance between fun, challenge and reasonable time and would love to see what advice you've picked up over the years
get rid of the mat and figures and run a wuxia style / theater of the mind battle. Every few rounds use dice, bottle caps, etc to provide a visual of what's happened so far. Also, having PCs and opponents taking their turns at the same time can be fun.
The 5:50 scenario is exactly what happened last saturday. My players were fighting a hydra (an encounter they had no chance of beating head-on at their level, they needed something resembling a tactic), except they didn't decide they were gonna run. One guy decided to run. Then the other guy, who later told me he had the idea of using readied actions to all run at the same time, figured "without him to divvy up the damage, I'm dead", and abandoned the third player. Then the Hydra, that had an 80% chance to hit him, succeeded 4 attacks and he died.
We had a one-shot last night where our characters are all members of the River District Watch. It reached a point where Sahuagin appeared and they were clearly wanting something or someone. In the cells were three "privateers", so my Halfling Rogue went to question them rather than standing by at the barred and bolted entrance to the Watch-house. The other two players had completely forgotten about the prisoners but at least had the sense to maintain a choke-point at the now battered entrance. Polberry (my character) spent the entire combat encounter racing around trying to find a particular object, succeeded, and threw it to the Sahuagin. Then the Sahuagin priestess demanded the privateer captain as well. My character is a rather unscrupulous sort and gladly handed over this captain. During the combat, the DM pulled a couple of tricks which PCs often do. The first was that the priestess cast "Spiritual Weapon" next to the other two PCs. The second was "Hold Person" on the prisoner as he was resisting being handed over. The choke-point worked very well, giving the two PC Fighters Flanking. The DM was on the ball with his monsters using a few of the spells often used by PCs.
About the "Sometimes your job is to take a hit" point, I remember playing 3.5. I was a Fighter, and one of my party members was a Sorcerer. His only useful attack was his Dragon Breath. At one point a giant monster grabs me with its jaws and grapples me, and the sorcerer is standing there doing nothing, because he's afraid of hitting me, so I (as my character) shout "SET IT ON FIRE, DAMMIT!!!". Thankfully, I got out of the grapple immediately after that.
I have idea that might counter this issue but I don't think it is practical nor would it be fun for the person who has to implement it. In the Inheritance Trilogy, magic is prevalent in the setting and powerful magicians can wipe out a whole army of non-magic users if they have the right spell. Hence armies have magicians who have the sole job to protect their squadron from magical attacks, with a lesser priority on dealing with non-magical attacks. They use a combination of protective spells and debilitating spells to do this. So my idea is that a party wizard could be given this role where they would just reserve most of their spell slots for Counter Spell and buff their team mates who will be the damage user. The problems I can forsee beforehand are... 1) Is there a Wizard in the party and do they have the required spells to do this? 2) Would the party wizard be cool with it? This job sounds boring on paper as a Wizard would simply be reserving actions or using attack cantrips if they are not Counter Spelling. 3) Counterspelling is not fool proof. If there more magical attacks than Wizards to cast reactions the party will get hit. Not to mention if the wizard can only use a spell slot of a lower level for the Counter Spell to ward of a higher level spell there is a chance it can fail. 4) I'm only level 3 so my experience is limited but based on seeing how DMs run adventure I believe they would find ways to counter this tactic relatively quickly once they got use to it. Meaning it might be a one trick wonder.
In that situation there are two things to consider. Is the splash damage small enough to only effect the players. Will this allow player characters to better assist each other? Ultimately while splash damage may go off with the party scattered, you are still risking having one or more party members going down without any chance of support and ending up in a bad position in the example above. In my experience the only way to effectively deal with splash damage is to either negate the source, or to get into a position where the source cannot use it effectively (either because of terrain or because of allies/themselves)
I can definitely understand the mentality of not wanting to take a minus. In Open Legend, for instance, we've simplified the system a bit to make it so that your hit chance and damage both come from the same roll, so stacking Advantage and upping your primary attack attribute to high hell becomes eminently more appealing the more points you have to spend on such a thing. Since so much is running on that one roll, for every action you take, you definitely can't afford a minus or disadvantage unless you have plenty of advantage already stacked up and the situation looks right to allow for that. For instance, I have two characters in mind. My bog-standard mercenary and my cataphract character, from two different campaigns. Bearing in mind that the GM has to base the difficulty of an encounter around the group at large, it's understandable that they wouldn't spend every waking moment considering every possible action my characters can take, and might just look at my favoured actions and what I'm likely to do with my characters' strengths. So, my mercenary. He's a balanced dude with offence and defence in mind, meant to serve as the heal dump and primary melee fighter of the group. One thing he can do is counterattack using his defend interrupt action, or as I like to call it, the single-tempo riposte. That uses his main attribute, Might, but if he wants to defend a party member who isn't right next to him, he has to use his lower Agility instead, because he has to run or move quickly to intercept. Because the GM likely only took his Might into consideration when determining the enemy's strengths, using his Agility will likely result in a poor scenario where he fails the check (that is, beating the enemy's attack roll), so he'll have ended up wasting his major action for the next turn while either taking damage for his party member or failing to stop any damage coming their way, which could result in their death. To the cataphract, I've attributed lots of Might and several layers of advantage on fighting with a lance from horseback. She only receives that advantage when fighting from horseback, but it's a lot. So, when the time comes to decide if I want to use the Charge focus action, which doubles your Speed (movement range) at the cost of one disadvantage on your ensuing attack (you can't make any other actions but an attack after moving beyond normal Speed), I still have net advantage and can afford to go charging in at full gallop. Were she to try to fight from a position not on the back of her horse, or if she tried to use an attribute other than Might, I'd consider it too risky, due to the encounter being balanced around highs rather than lows. tl;dr: Accepting minuses becomes more worrying of a decision the more streamlined the system is, as much more can be affected by any one roll. Add in the chaos factor of the dice, and it's understandable that divorcing yourself, even for a moment, from what you consider to be your A-game can be a difficult choice. Really, the dice probably play a major role in that mentality. We live in constant fear of the dreaded nat 1, and naturally want to put as much distance between it and us as possible. Stacking pluses seems like a logical way to do that, or so we non-mathematicians think.
Awesome as always with some great advice. My favorite part was the bit where one of your players took over your game and you got to play. That made me happy. I never get to play, it seems. I'm always running. Both characters looked so stoked!
Great tips fot players. The difference between a tpk and a harrowing but survivable event is often great teamwork or a remarkably creative approach. Once your team knows how to be team its an unlimited resource. Remarkably creative plans are rare in comparison. Both are rewarding for the DM and the players.
Unconventional attacks are great but some systems take better advantage of them than others. If you like CoC, check out Mythras. Special Effects are awarded on winning a combat contest [using differential roll results]. The Special Effects in the Mythras/Legend system are game-changers and chosen by the player (allowing you to select the SE to best suited the current combat situation).
As a variation on combining attacks, my players seem to quite like prioritizing the enemy leader, if it exists and they can tell who it is, as a way of demoralizing the rest.
I never understood RPG battle tactics until I played in a D&D party of 12. If you work together, utilize terrain, break into A and B teams with specific objectives, and have characters with designated roles, you can do an insane amount of damage. To give you an idea, at L3 our party of 12 killed an adult green dragon while entrenched in village ruins. I watched one of the rangers (we had 4) fires the killing blow from a stone building that made taking cover from breath attacks very easy, as I was dragging a casualty fighter from the kobald clearing detail. By L7 we had a stone keep with walls and a citadel. The campaign had essentially forced us into withstanding a siege for a number of weeks. We could hold out almost indefinitely against the waves of orcs by using terrain, cover, concealment, and AOE. The DM gave up on that campaign after we started rotating A and B teams to holding the walls and taking short rests.
In the first example, my initial thought was to back up into the hall to the south getting 10' into the hall and forcing the bad guys to bottleneck into the hallway, reducing the possible attacks from the bad guys to two a round.
Synopsis: use every dirty trick strategy, cheese tactic, and advantage you can and don't worry about ethics/moral implications(unless there's a super uptight paladin involved). Use your head. Reminds me of the time when Me and the boys used a player's unconscious dragonborn character as a makeshift blunt instrument/barricade.The aftermath was hilarious. I mean killing the enemy via meat puppet attack and flatulence flamethrower is comedic gold, plus roleplaying the whole thing as an amnesiac episode kept the laughs going.
My players need to watch this. I've thought in the past about getting their characters into a situation where they get some military training because they really lack confidence/smarts in combat. "I hide behind the chair for cover" - dude, the occultists are carrying .45s. A chair? Really?
Haha loving your vids ... watched a massive bunch for them while in was in hospital... so thanks for the entertainment! What are the chances of you doing a play through of cyberpunk red when it comes out and airing it? Would love to watch one of your games.
Glad you've been enjoying them. As far as recording games, my players and I all agree that we don't want to do that. Gaming is our time to hang out with friends, cut loose, and not care about the world outside. A camera would feel intrusive and prevent us from ever fully relaxing.
@@SSkorkowsky just from watching your videos I could tell that was going to be your answer as you can't tell you hold you're players experience very highly and also upon yourself. I totally respect that and your groups privacy.
I recently had a GM who hated me trying to use alternate methods of attack like disarming or grappling or using mental commands. He'd always sigh and only begrudgingly go along with it. Often he'd find ways to nerf whatever I did. He just wanted everyone to do damage.
That’s why the non healers carry potions, to heal the healer, or self if healers too busy. Also possible to learn minor magical healing, even if that not your main gig.
As far as the team up, focus on one opponent idea sort of thing goes I think the ideal way to do it is the way I do some RPG games that I play in which some RPG games that I play in with the characters that have less striking power I have focus on weaker enemies together, however whoever my heavy melee Striker is I have focus on a different Enemy by himself unless the game has Auto switching to the next Target as a feature because if the weaker characters kill an enemy then the stronger fighter get the swing on that enemy turn it up getting wasted
Very nice video. On the first example I immediately thought "No, retreat south, use the doorframe as a choke point, kill them 2 at a time while they come after you." and then you mentioned choke points. Of course I've had that backfire before as well. You wouldn't believe how often that tactic is used, and the one time the dumb gobos don't come after us it was like a bomb went off in the depths of Moria and everybody looked at eachother like "Oh shit. What's gonna happen?" Mimic Doors. Mimic doors happened. Gobos knew to steer clear.
Some great thoughts and tactics. I think I'll share these ideas with my younger players. Many of these are common sense, but some people just don't consider these tactics as they aren't tactic minded. ;)
In your Sword and Club exemple... when I played here is what I once did : The opponent seems to resist every cut hey... mmm... I hold my Long Sword with a Mordhau grip. The Master ruled that it was considered a "club" for the purpose of damage etc, BUT my magic +1 was STILL applied because he judged that the WHOLE THING is enchanted. He ruled that Mordhau being a REAL technique... well was teach to fighters... so I didn't have malus when doing it (still hit less hard than the blade BUT kinda useful and cool). I was kinda proud of my move AND of my GM. Or a players that would tell me : " Well... fook it I punch it with the guard or the pommel". I would immediatly reward a player for that. Also... Monsters WON'T spread their attacks unless they have LOW INTELLIGENCE, staying by your team-mate prolly still the best thing but... MONSTERS also use tactics... .
Two perfect examples of Rule #9 in D&D 5e are the Great Weapon Master and Sharpshooter Feats; -5 To Hit for the chance to do +10 damage. Better still, the To Hit penalty doesn't negate a Natural 20, so you do double damage then stack the additional 10 points. My GWM Barbarian recently drove a skeleton into the ground like a tent peg by critting with a maul and doing upwards of 30 points of damage.
My main struggle as GM in combat is that only few of my players have read the rules and are not really aware of the possibities during combat or get confused during dice rolls. Sometimes I make handouts with a combat rules summary, but these rarely helps. Do you have any ideas how to hand players with little knowlege about the rules?
Or, if the DM/GM will allow it (and they should), you pommel strike/half-sword, hitting the creature with the other end, retaining your bonuses, and ending it rightly. (I’d just have the damage die one size smaller)
I have a question about your section about the use of weapons that are more effective, but without the bonuses to hit. Where's the sweet spot for that? When does being able to hit every time, despite the lower damage, equal the less accurate weapon with more damage, generally, anyway?
Completely depends on the variables. The difference between the chances to hit and the differences between the damage potential/average. That also changes between systems. It's up to you to decide. For example, in Cyberpunk 2020, I usually opted for the 2D6+3 10mm handgun that allowed for 2 shots a round (avg 10 damage points per shot. Range 5-15 damage.) over the 3D6 11mm handgun that allowed 1 shot a round (avg 10.5 points per shot. Range 3-18 damage.). But no matter how good my character's Handgun skill was, once the badguys started sporting hard armor of 10 or more (meaning it absorbs the first 10 points of damage), I'd switch to a rifle that does 5D6 (avg 17.5 damage points a shot. Range 5-30 damage). Even though my chance to hit with a handgun might be 30% greater than my Rifle skill, and I preferred getting a second shot from a 10mm handgun, the damage potential through the armor was so low that I'd rather have a lower chance to hit with a rifle if that meant a successful hit had a better chance of doing anything. Many times have I watched a character say "I want to use my handgun because I have a better chance to hit" and then spend 5 rounds slowly chewing the badguy down, hitting with every shot, while the PC who picked up the rifle they're not as good at took 2 rounds to hit their target but dropped them on the first hit.
Sometimes you need to take hits to win. Also occasionally you’ll need to range attack in melee with disadvantage (if you don’t build yourself with the ability to quickly relocate or fight in melee with a ranged weapon, or have an ally help you out with abilities or screening). I could name dozens of ways to counteract such situations.
Frankly, what you are talking about is nice and correct. I would not, however, call most that "combat" I would call it "battle". as I understand it, combat is the direct actions between one or more opponents, while a battle is, to me the strategic/tactical approach you described. So all the thoughts about how to have the party win would be battle, while combat is what one on one action takes place. If I understand you correctly D&D puts more emphasis on things like Warriors in front, mages behind that and Bowmen in the back. That is not combat. That is battle. Combat would be that action like jumping on a table in order to gain height advantage or the disarming action you described. Still, as D&D "combat" works that way then this is a very good video.
Hello Seth. I was wondering about your opinion on the Mutants and Masterminds game system. I'm getting ready for my first time Game Mastering a Campaign and I have learned a lot by watching your videos. However I never heard you mention the system of Mutants and Masterminds in general, I'm just curious about if you have any opinions on the system and if you have any advice towards Game Mastering for a single player and how many allies would be acceptable for the GM to play if any at all.
@@SSkorkowsky That's ok. From my experience reading it your advice from other videos like this one does translate well into the system. Thank you for all the great content and giving me my love for tabletop role playing games.
Sometimes you just need to take the hit. But also, sometimes nobody should be taking the hit. Depending on the system and the style of the game, combat may be about stepping up and taking the hit, or about defense and avoiding getting hit, or even about avoiding combat altogether. In some games, the most effective combat is the one you're not in. In OSR games, for example, combat can be extremely deadly. Strategic planning to avoid combat or to only fight at an extreme advantage, can save lives. In Shadowrun, any fight while in corp territory will trigger a High Threat Response team that knows they need overkill to stop shadowrunners. So avoid triggering that alarm, and be as subtle and stealthy as you can be. Sometimes just getting into combat at all is a sign that you're losing. On the other hand sometimes doing the stupid thing is also the most fun. I've played plenty of characters that loved running up to the enemy and getting stuck in a win-or-die situation. Of course it's important to make sure that character is either extremely tough, or capable of getting out of sticky situations on their own (maybe dodging past enemies using acrobatics and high move, maybe turning invisible, maybe teleporting out). Sometimes being too careful isn't much fun, and the game needs that extra spice of going in guns blazing.
Actually, divide and conquer can be a much better tactic in SOME situations. Remember, the more openings enemies have (while you are outnumbered especially) the more attacks and thus damage you will receive. The best tactic is to reduce how much damage you take as players. Target the foe causing the most damage and try to reduce the "surface area"/opportunities to be attacked. Plus clumping together can always make you more vulnerable to area attacks so keep a nice healthy distance within about 1 move away from each other =) happy gaming!
"I hold my action" is something GMs should always teach newbies they can do. Most of time players just play by the default turns and expect the retreat scenario to take into account the dissonance between coordinated actions and turn based gameplay. Same for "alternative methods of action" like disarm/deflect, alot of players fear actions to not be allowed because they're not listed in the chara'sheet, and players who started like that may become too rigid when come their turn to GM.
Combat 101: Ten Tips for Better Combats - Playing RPGs (Summary) 1. Stick together. 2. Combine Attacks on one Enemy. 3. Retreating is OK. 4. Use your terrain. 5. Plan your move before your turn. 6. Make a Battle Plan and be willing to change it. 7. Strategize your attack order. 8. Sometimes the best option is to remove an opponents ability to attack. (knock down, disarm) 9. Don't be Afraid to Take the Penalty. Love of bonus can lead players to take bad choices. 10. Know your Group's assets. Ie know what your allies can do (spells, powers, special ability) 11. (bonus) Sometimes your job is to take the Hit. Distributing enemy hits allows everyone to surive.
While combining attacks is going to make you more effective, I don't really think it makes for "better" combats. I mean from a narrative standpoint it's kind of stupid if a big group suddenly ignores everyone to single out and focus target one creature unless there's a really good reason to do so, and it's likely to get your DM to start doing it back to you, which really isn't much fun at all, especially if you're the poor guy getting focused fired all the time. Really I kind of thing it's best to have a gentleman's agreement not to just focus things down and play it more like an action movie where the heroes generally pair off into their own fights.
@@taragnor - Analogous to the argument against critical hits doing some massive damage or special effect up to and including decapitation. If it works both ways, eventually one of the PCs is going to have their head lopped off.
What's weird is how quickly veteran players forget. Part of that is due to strategies changing as a group and game becomes more powerful and a world of new options becomes available. It's dramatic to see when they switch from a powerful High-Level game to a weaker Low-Level one, and all of a sudden all that strategy they used to use when they were low level before is forgotten. It can take them a while to remember how they used to deal with swarms of bad guys before they had their fireball miniguns. Then you have the change of systems. Very often I've seen players either A: Forget all strategy altogether and they flail around like they've never played a TTRPG before until they begin to re-learn it, or B: They rigidly stick to a tactic that worked in the previous system and fail to take into account the mechanic differences until after they've gotten their teeth kicked in a few times.
Seth Skorkowsky Thanks for all the great advice. It’s nice to have these refresher courses. I’ve seen many veteran players (myself the included) fall into these pitfalls because they didn’t adapt to the situation. One example: I was late joining a group of newbies. (2e DnD). The group was struggling with the basics (like tying knots in a rope to make the climb up a mountain) and I couldn’t keep my mouth shut. So, the DM made me create a character. So, quick, down and dirty, I rolled up a one trick pony double scimitar specialist. My characters first encounter was with a aerial gargoyle that had been his captor for several years. He picked up his scimitars (ignoring the +1 magical longsword. I never thought to check the longsword) and went to town dealing multiple attacks and massive damage on a creature that regenerated anything but magical damage. When the party finally arrived, the fighter picked up the longsword and killed it in two hits. I ran with it. From that point on my character refused to use anything but scimitars...until he was forced to use a hammer by a god. It forced him become its cleric. Ty Windswords hated that god. But, that’s another story for another time. I miss Ty Windswords and his magic scimitars Gyre and Gimble.
Loving this so far, but had to comment on a coincidence that happened because my ISP is trash. Just after you said, "each player spends an average of 10 seconds at the beginning of their turn deciding what to do." my network had lost connection and the video had only buffered to that point. So I thought, "Wow that's a great way to emphasize how long that is" with the YT buffering 2/3 circle and everything. So I hover over the video and that time has stopped. This might be one of those you had to be there things, but it seemed pretty funny to me. Thanks for the effort you put into all of your videos, always informative and entertaining!
Says the wizard while he turns invisible and is about to cast flight to go back to town becaus ehe burned all of his spells in the first 5 rounds of combat and he doens't want to use a crossbow. True story, sadly, wasn't that fun to play with.
@@TERMINATOR3900 Yes, but since they lacked punch he did not waste time casting them,...so our adventurers were basically we fight once, got to rest 8 hours, fight again, rest for 8 hours etc etc...needless to say it was boring as hell...not to mnetion he was metagaming @Oh, it's a dire wolf, they only got XYZ hit points, you can fight them alone...oh no a Gooey Blob! Got to use fire for that one since he's immune to anything else!@ etc etc...
In the system my group uses, Rolemaster, most of the weapons have the ability to be used in non-optimal ways for a minor penalty, such as hitting with the flat of a blade or throwing a short sword (NOT a minor penalty!) or using a spear like a staff to help with that skeleton.
This is why all my characters have a mix of weapons to be able to deal all the different physical damage types. In Pathfinder that is Slashing, Bludgeoning, and Piercing. If nothing else, a dagger gets you piercing or slashing. and in a pinch a gauntlet get you the bludgeoning. But I usually include a kunai which does P or B, can be thrown, and can be used as a piton or crowbar without being damaged.
@@MonkeyJedi99 i dunno why but hitting with the flat side of a sword is my favorite thing. it's like slapping someone except you're doing it with something that very well could be lethal. obviously, the only proper term for hitting someone with the flat of a sword is to "clap" them.
Another helpful tip for combat: Kill the "Force Multiplier." It's a variation on the Shadowrun classic "Geek the Mage." Find the enemy that can drop the most damage or can keep others fighting and end them quickly. In a lot of fantasy inspired games, this is the caster classes. In more tech heavy games, this is the person either lobbing or directing explosives, or firing the automatic weapon. If the enemy has low intelligence and a single director, kill them. Assess the situation and find the thing causing the most trouble on the field, then put the boot to them.
Awesome! Tactics I like to teach people, based on what I have learned in the military and applying them to D&D type games... (1) "Battle of Thermopylea" -- Do not rush into a confined area, especially when you can be outnumbered there. Use terrain to set up a choke point with the tanks up front to block a door to limit the number of attacks against you, and let the ranged characters blast. Plus it leaves you a retreat route behind you -- always leave an exit route! (Just as the outnumbered Spartans did in Thermopylea to prevent being surrounded.) (2) "Fling fuel on the fire. Stand back to back!" -- If surrounded, stay together in a small pack with the strongest characters on the outside of the huddle. The party becomes like a little multi-headed monster. (Go back to Gandalf's orders on top of Weathertop when surrounded by wolves.) (3) "Protect the quarterback." -- In 5e D&D, tanks should use "dodge" to extend their ability to block for other players who do damage. Tanks don't have to damage, but they do have to protect the others by pinning down the monster or restricting their ability to move or attack defensively weaker party members. (In my opinion, the most tactically smart player should be the tank until the others learn how to do it by watching. Most players I see do not have the foggiest idea what a tank is; they see a fighter as a damage dealer instead of an enabler for others.) (4) "Air forces disperse troops." -- When being attacked by something that drops big area of effect bombs (e.g., fireball, dragon breath), then you need to disperse (rather than stick together) so that they cant get the whole party in one blast. (5) "Hit and run." -- If fighting things that move slower than you, then used ranged weapons and wait for them to come to you. As they get closer, move away. (6) "Decoy and destroy." -- Another split up tactic (if you have at least equal speed to the monster) is to have one character (or small group) "kite" by running one way, and the another going another way. Force the monster to chase one group that keeps running away while the other pelts it with ranged weapons. Lastly, always remember your objective. If your job is to retrieve a magic ring, then don't worry about killing monsters unless they put you in a position where you must kill them to attain your objective. Just go around them or leave. Don't waste resources and risk death when you don't need to. If you can get the ring without killing any monsters, that's efficient. (No one who has been in the military really wants to fight if they can avoid it.)
@@greggyp8265 Thanks! When I DM i use a set of tactics too. My fav is to intentionally put monster encounters that are to be avoided or run from. I love the sense that you (i.e., your character) could die, that sense of intense fear. Infinite monster spawns are a great trick to do that -- a few monsters becomes overwhelming after a few rounds. Soon the payers realize that trying to kill the monsters is not going to be possible, and they get on with what they were there to do in the first place (if it is not too late). If you do that, you have to give them an escape route (and they have to be smart enough to preserve it).
This is great advice! I noticed you didn't say which edition of D&D nor do I know how you build encounters, but for protecting the football in 5e a tank dodging is typically suboptimal because of the importance of action economy. It's hard for tanks to draw the attention of enemies and not attacking enemies lowers the tank's percieved threat level. Dodging also has the action economy result of a negative if the tank isn't targeted or is the victim of a saving throw that's not dexterity.
@@anthonynorman7545 I think dodging is great in 5e if you have others that can do damage while the blocker blocks. These are tactics I tend to like as player. As a DM, many of my encounters so that they are obstacles to attain milestones more so than objectives themselves. I like it when players do NOT attack things, but find other ways around them. The only exception is a quest where the players are tasked by a quest giver to rid the world of something. The rest of the time, I see encounters more as a problem to solve and they are often too hard to win by fighting. They are there to kick the intensity up a notch. In general I do not like 5e though -- too many player options that break the game, too much emphasis on power gaming super-hero individualism (i.e., level up and gain more power as the object of the game, rather than team problem solving/going to war with the army you have rather than the army you want, not enough mystery in the magic or rich enough description to make people feel awe or fear), and preference for farcically flawed (rather than heroically brave) characters. I am more partial to my own home brew systems that borrow form different games. My goal is to to create a sense of wonder, awe, and fear -- which means that a lot of stuff players can't know, such as a spell list with all the rules in the Player's Handbook. I think that is the biggest mistake Gygax made, and all other D&D editions have that same problem. In my opinion, the players should not know what magic is until the DM reveals it to them. Magic is the source of mystery in fantasy, and player's rule books turn it into a tool or new weapon for the power gamer instead of something that is "unknown" (in the HP Lovecraft sense). As a side note, if you read the details of the fantasy stories and to whine about how long winded Tolkein is (for example, as people like Matthew Colville have), you can learn a lot of things you can adopt or adapt for your game -- whether it be flavor, hardcore content, or even game mechanics.
I can definitely attest to the power of using the terrain and removing the ability to hit you. In a semi-recent D&D game, my Barbarian had some beef with a corrupted angel after she showed up out of nowhere (really the Greater Invisible Monk used an item to summon her, but no one thought to explain that to her and the party actively kept the item a secret from me in-character) while we were fighting some devil cultists. She was claiming not just the cult's entire stash of treasure, but also the party's indentured servitude for her deigning to help out when she arrived. Initiative was declared by the DM at my outburst, and the other party members chose to not roll, as this was my action and they don't want any of the consequences of picking a fight with a celestial, especially a mean one. Winning initiative, my Barbarian (who had seen her fighting with a wicked battle scythe not ten minutes prior, talking 2d4+6d8+4 on two attacks) disarms the angel of her weapon, grapples her, and then drags her away from her weapon. The DM, not really expecting that to happen, has the angel try to escape the grapple, (as by 5e rules when you're grappled you get no movement, even flight) but fails in the attempt due to massive Barbarian strength. I then drag her to a nearby lava fixture (as this cult is wont to have, devils generally being immune to fire damage so it's a good place to hide) and lower her in, doing obscene amounts of damage and killing her in the follow-up hit. This was a creature that was intended to be a match for a party a full 8 levels higher, and while she was moderately wounded from the prior fight, so was my Barbarian after being SET ON FIRE and basically being the Wall of Damage Sponging between the cultists and the party's casters. So even with whatever factors may or may not have made it easier, it was still a one-on-one fight with a far stronger opponent that was effectively beaten by thinking outside the usual strategy of just hitting things. "This thing is great at fighting with this weapon, maybe don't let her have it." "It can fly, but I can't, so try to keep it on the ground." "Lava does lots of damage to bad guys, maybe it does the same to used-to-be-good-guys." All thoughts that even an 8 INT tribal Barbarian can think of if you remember half their lives are spent fighting in harsh conditions where every edge is necessary.
Dear Seth: has been a while since I commented on your videos but thanks for this, I truly appreciate your efforts, andyou are alife saber, I Will make all my players watch this, our main game is cyberpunk, but we Branch out to D and D and now we start Pulp and Call of Cthulhu, but really we need more videos like thanks alot Seth, you are the best and say hi from me to Jack and the BoneSaw and the agent from Scott Bronw kisses and hugs
#2 is a point that even experienced players can miss. I think it's because people instinctively operate on the assumption that wounding an enemy reduces their effectiveness. That _can_ work in systems that track damage effects. In games like D&D though, a Goblin with 1HP hits as accurately and as hard as an uninjured Goblin. The way I explained it to my current group was to think of a group of adversaries as a single creature with multiple attacks per round. Each adversary they take out of the fight means one less attack to a party member.
I'm a relatively new player playing in two different systems with two different groups. One is vanilla D&D, which, like in this video, requires us to gang up on enemies and not try to solo them especially if outnumbered, but otherwise, isn't very complex mechanics wise. The other one is a much less forgiving system where everyone has a pretty constant, but much lower overall pool of hitpoints. Not only do you gradually become less effective depending on your health percentage, but it also has a wound system that will cripple your future attacks, parries and movement speed with just one wound. The more you get hit, the worse you fight, and the more likely you are of going down. This is hell for an unequipped and unprepared party, but we can also use it to our advantage on our enemies. In such systems, it is much more important to play tactically and try to get the drop on our enemies, especially if they hit harder than you and we know that one hit from an orcish waraxe or one bolt from a heavy crossbow WILL cause a wound, that are a bitch to fight with and also a bitch to heal afterwards.
Nick Williams Nick Williams speaking of that, I have someone in Shadowrun who I allowed to have a few abilities that make called shots amazing to try to encourage others to learn that not only do they exist, but that they’re awesome.
@@magiv4205 Yes, Shadowrun is another popular system that uses this sort of game design. You have a "Damage track" which starts at 0 and goes up to a value based on your stats before you fall down and are in danger of dying, and for every 3 damage you take, you get -1 die to all tests. This also adds more mechanical depth to the game because you can use things like drugs to increase pain tolerance and remove those wound penalties, while still being actually wounded, much like a "berserker" effect.
@@crazyeyes8962 First of all, I really have to play Shadowrun sometime, and second of all, I love the berserker effect! Not only because it is very useful, but also because it is an awesome rp element. In my system, DSA, after you recieve a wound, you have to make a saving throw after every wound recieved to not be immediately incapacitated by the pain for 5 rounds. You are still conscious, but pretty much only able to crawl. First of all, 5 rounds is a LOT, often an entire combat, and second of all, It's hard to correct, as there are very few effective healing spells in this system. And all but the most expensive ones heal gradually, and not instantly. There are several insta heal potions, but you still need someone to administer them in the middle of the fray. So if you go down, it's likely you stay down for the rest of the combat. If you manage to stay up and make a second successful grit save, you can ignore the penalty caused by the wound alltogether, and fight on normally. So it is very important to level up your grit and pain tolerance if you plan on doing any kind of melee combat, and always use buff spells before combat. Or do it like us, and have one character invest in alchemy/brewing to make potions of what we scavenge in the wilderness and on quests, to keep us supplied on drugs, buffs and heals.
Thats why I homebrewed the fleeing/faking death/begging for mercy for majority of npcs when npc has low health while also giving them disadvantages on majority of actions and removing their modifiers from actions during it. Some creatures that go berserk or hellbent on killing, of course, ignore it, but for others its much more natural and immersive to see common animals to try to run away and bandits dropping their weapons begging for forgiveness, and even undeads like ghosts try to shift the planes and disappear or possess the item or tiny creature and hide in it. So far my players love it, and the choice deciding the npcs fate is a great roleplay fuel that also cuts and forms the alignments better.
I've plowed through all your videos ever since I stumbled upon your channel. I've mostly played D&D and not once have I encountered anyone who has heard of Call of Cuthulu other than the movie oh so long ago. You, Jack & co. have a great place. Thanks for the tips, reviews & fun for us who have a hard time getting groups together or just the time for said gaming sessions.
Mark Medina There are people who have not heard of CoC RPG?!? All my gamer friends know of it, but none of them are mad enough to run it. (Well, there was the one guy in college). When I run it, my player don’t like me much. They keep coming back, though. Except that one person. If you read this, I really am sorry about that. I didn’t know you had that trigger. :/
I like what you said about taking penalties. New D&D players will almost never incur opportunity attacks on themselves, even when doing so will give them a huge advantage.
That last advice is pure gold. I love playing ranged characters, but in D&D, I was recently playing a Ranger for a three sessions game and I figured that damned they can be an excellent "switch-hitter". Ranged at first, then when needed drop the bow, draw the sword and plunge into melee. Mixed with their small spellcasting abilities which allows them to heal themselves and boy can they take a hit. Much more than I would have expected. My go to from now on whenever I play a ranged character in D&D(specifically)
Believe it or not, in AD&D many rangers were pure melee fighters that excelled at killing dangerous monsters quickly, usually with the biggest greatsword they could find. They were much more directly tied to the "Aragorn" style of ranger than the "Legolas" style of ranger. They do have a wide and useful array of skills that come in handy, and are also excellent at going solo for periods of time if need be.
Great job on this one, Seth. My players just accidentally started a war during thier last session. Something tells me that these tips will useful for them. 😁 I'm going to show then this video before our next session.
The battle plan section reminded me of one of my Earthdawn parties. They were so in sync that they fell into roles during combat, adapting to situations and opponents, all without any discussion. They just trusted each other to cover their roles no matter what they are up against. It was beautiful.
Problem with the tactical retreat is, it doesn't work in some systems. If you can Delay your whole turn, perfect. D&D 5e however only allows to Hold Action, so you could Hold a Disengage and then... that's it....can't move. The only way to do a proper tactical retreat in 5e is to use something like Thunderwave to push the enemies back, to be rogues and use Disengage as a bonus action, or to risk the opportunity attack.
It is why Seth suggested letting the slowest character run first, then having everyone else retreat on their own turn. Might also not work if the initiatives are very spread, but it is what it is.
While it's not RAW, since the PC is sacrificing their action to Ready a move action once someone else has retreated, I treat the Ready action as a sort of delayed disengage, justifying it by assuming that in the act of readying they have gauged how best to avoid opportunity attack during their impending move.
Yeah, the entire point is to figure out a way to get the players to move as close in time as each other and not let some poor sod just stand there alone to get the brunt of the enemy attacks. It's up to players of whatever game it is to figure out how that works in their own game's mechanics. Originally I'd planned to use Conan as the game in the skit, but I had to rule that out at the last minute because PCs always have initiative in that particular game. Tactical retreats are very easy in Conan. D&D combat is actually pretty goofy once you start comparing it to other systems.
@@evilscientistrecords 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣💖 No, in fact I'm planning on a video (in spanish) about this very same topic, and Seth's analysis are usually invaluable 😊 But I will keep your idea! -OK guys, let's just do a quick break and.. In the meanwhile, maybe you want to go check this video 😁😁😁
@10:00 There's an old joke: two men are walking down a highway with shovels. They stop every mile or so, one digs a hole, and the other fills the hole back in. Someone approaches the two and asks what they're doing. They explain that they're supposed to putting up mile markers, but their coworker - the one who places the signs - is out sick. Don't let that be your party.
Hahahahaha oh man my players made ALL of these mistakes in an epic battle we're currently. It was MIND BOGGLING. They all went full Leroy Jenkins. Instead of taking out small groups of enemies, and using the terrain to block the rest, they all split up and attacked different GROUPS of enemies! Out in the open! It is a complete disaster. Tho watching their "why are you doing this to us!" faces as they know full when they brought it on themselves is kinda hilarious.
Seth... you are a national treasure and I am a necroposter... maybe start responding to necroposters sometimes, cause we all weren't lucky enough to find you when the vids were fresh? Anyway, I have played around 80 ttrpg in my time and your insight and presentation are phenomenal---keep it up
On thing to consider. In the focus attacks example, if the final round had gone with the monsters attacking the more wounded character instead of the less wounded character (which is the same concept as having the players focus their attacks), it would still have been a TPK.
Sadly, ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-Pk69XGD-RBA.html, in 5e D&D you can not use a held action to disengage and move away from an enemy. Held actions do not allow you to use movement, movement can only be used on your turn.
Lol 15:45. I'm thinking of players who lose their favored weapon and then complain "I can't do anything." or who drop their weapon and will do ANYTHING to get it back, even if it opens them up to an extra attack--instead of just punching the monster in the face.
What exceptional videos. I know Seth doesn’t play 5e as often as other systems, but I treasure his takes on D&D. But videos like this transcend systems and are truly invaluable. Please keep making these universal rpg videos! Thank you again!
Pinball: hit the flashing thing, get 3000 points! RPG computer games: hit the orc with your starter mace, do 300 points of damage! Space games: shoot the enemy frigate with a seeker missile from your tier one turret, 15,000 points of damage! - - - which is why I really like the rules philosophy behind a LARP I played where a starting character had 5 hit points, and a one-handed weapon did one damage on a hit. They also slowed down combat and you had ways to gain higher-damage or special effect attacks as you leveled, and could do amazing things like disarming! OR three points of damage!
wonderful video, thanks! Some of these I already knew, and others I kinda knew through instinct and common sense, but it helps to reinforce them when they're verbalized like this.
