British shooter here. Been shooting for 22 years. Just wanted to say that i love your channel and the way you explain things. I'm humbled to say that ive already learnt ALOT from your channel. We as shooters and hunters must always be learning.
EXCELLENT! Like you, I've also hunted for 50 years. I live and hunt interior Alaska. I've used all copper bullets for the past decade or so....I like the penetration and exit holes. Exit hole especially for bears which have long hair that wicks up blood. I hand load my .270 Win with 4350 or RL22 and 110-130 gr monoliths like Barnes TTSX and 180gr Barnes TTSX or Nozler E-Tip and 4831 with my .300 H & H Magnum. I use monoliths for tiny Sika Blacktails up to huge bull moose. Each of my rifle shoots a different monolith best, so for best accuracy I try a couple different monoliths in my hand loads.
I learned a LOT more about monolithic bullets in this one video than everything I've heard since they came out in the 80's. I have to say that while my Go To projectile for my -06 has been a Sierra 180 grain BT GameKing, I just might have to look into trying those newfangled bullets now for both excellent accuracy as well as on-target terminal performance. Thank you, Sir, for the video. Even if I didn't see it for about a year after you posted it. God Bless.
Ron, this was a great video with useful information on picking the correct bullet. The section explaining the all copper bullets was very timely as some jurisdictions are now requiring hunters to use lead free ammo. Thanks for sharing your thoughts and experience. Take care and be well.
I just realized why I enjoy your videos and find the content interesting. You seem to leave opinion by the wayside for the most part and focus more on numbers and data. I like that. Too many you-tubers try to make videos like this but don't really approach it scientifically. They shoot some stuff and sometimes validate their argument with some crazy story, but there is no real content or data behind it. I like the way your brain works. Keep up the good work!
The collection of recovered projectiles and notes about them is the best data I’ve ever seen related to bullet performance in flesh. Almost every other thing I’ve seen on this topic amount to “cool story bro”; just random opinions and no data. Personally, I’ve used cup/core bullets (berger) for years and never had a bad experience, but I’m also very choosy about the shots I take, so that may be more of an anecdote than a data point. Not to mention my sample size is much smaller. I’ve shot everything from deer to moose with them and it’s always worked out, but I really appreciated how you compared the various outcomes with different projectiles. Top notch stuff.
Regarding the ballistic coefficient of lead vs non lead, sometimes the longer non lead bullet can have a higher B.C. for the same weight. As you reach the maximum bullet length that a barrel can properly stabilize, the greater density of lead will give a higher B.C. Excellent video, Ron. Thanks for the thorough, concise, and easy to understand information.
I designed a tubular bullet that allowed a high ballistic co-efficient . It had a good sectional density too which would "buck the wind". It also had vertical slits to allow it to mushroom upon impact. The fact that the weight of such a bullet is distributed at the periphery means that it is gyroscopically stable too. Strangely most cartridge manufacturers do not seem to realise that tubular bullets could give optimum external and good terminal ballistics making them flat shooting, wind bucking and good humane performers. Great video Ron!
@@fruitfarmfords8243 There are three ways to make a tubular bullet seal. If the bullet is contained within a parallel case ,like a 45/70 then a simple rear base wad would suffice to drive the bullet out of the barrel. The bottleneck cased ammunition is more complicated. A rear sabot onto a reduced diameter base allows the bullet to be driven conventionally. The split sabot will blow clear after the spinning bullet exits the muzzle. My own solution includes an internal ball bearing that drives the tubular bullet along and is blown clear on exiting the barrel. In the 1970's the army tried a 50 calibre Browning tubular bullet which did 5000 fps and carried supersonically for greater ranges . I think it was too light on impact for military purposes. A tubular design allows great sectional density so slow loss of velocity, momentum and energy. It can also be driven faster because it is lighter in weight,
Ron, Enjoyed the video regarding the all copper bullets. I started using the Barnes Vor-TX line of ammo about 4 years ago and have not looked back. I now use them in all of my hunting rifles and purchased some recently for a 41 Remington Magnum Ruger Super Black pistol I intend to hunt with this year. They have worked flawlessly on Alabama whitetails even in my smaller caliber rifles like 300 AAC Blackout and 6.5 Grendel. By the way the 6.5 Grendel is a CZ Model 527 and it shot a cloverleaf 3 shot group right out of the box on the first three shots @ 100yds. It has become my favorite whitetail rifle. All bullets recovered were perfect mushrooms with near 100% weight retention as you mentioned.
All the informative discussion about monolithic bullets, ballistic coefficients and why the 6.5 Creedmore does what it does is a great opportunity to teach people who otherwise ignored or didn't know about these factors that make for a great rifle. Even though ancient cartridges like the 7X57 and 30-06 are great, what we shoot is getting a century-long update.
Ron, excellent presentation! I too have 50 years of hunting experience, but only more recently have been blessed with the opportunity to hunt (and take 😁) “big game” with a couple of successful elk hunts in New Mexico. I really appreciate the practical information and your efficient delivery of it. This episode is the BEST one I’ve watched yet. I can’t tell you how many times I’ve been in deep dissertations about all the fancy gadgets from mud grip tires to camo hats and face paint and I could only think, “if y’all would spend as much effort understanding your bullets and how to put them where it matters” you’ve miss and wound a lot less animals. I have for years, enjoyed great performance from bonded core bullets. The problem with these is twofold for me; Hornady has for some reason decided to indefinitely suspend their Interbond, and the Accubond has gotten ridiculously expensive and now are way more expensive than some good monos. You’ve talked me into trying monolithics! I have hesitated because of my concern that they would not expand enough at lower velocities. I too, believe that with a monolithic, I can drop down a weight (due to the weight retention of these) which will give me more velocity to use in the first place.
I absolutely love the Remington Core Lokt line!! I use it at 150g for my 30-30, 30-06, 308, 7mm mag, 300 Savage and 140g for my 6.5CM!! in the last 20 years I’ve hunted whitetail deer every year and take 6-10 a year and I’ve NEVER had one that didn’t drop within 40-50 yards at the very furthest!!! Normally with a double lung heart shot they drop on the spot (in my experience!!!) but I’ve had them run!! As always thank you so much for your time and sharing your knowledge and experience!!! Just wanted to share my thoughts with you!!! Ive been watching a heck of a lot of your videos lately just stumbled on you on RU-vid and gotta say I really enjoy the content!!!
This is what I call full coverage a topic for any experienced level. I really love when you assist the hunter and give him or her the tools to make the best hunting experience. I've been hunting for a really long time and I learned a few things myself. I've always been a fan of the Nosler Partition. Ron, you've really loved a life of hunting and journalism that most of us could easily envy. My 20-year-old daughter has decided to be an outdoor journalist. What basic advice can you give her? God bless and thank you!
thank you Jeff. Tell your daughter to be hard working, authentic and honest, and persistent. Don't try to fool anyone and don't sell out for a quick buck. Best of luck.
Thanks for the reply. She's a great young lady and she is all of those things, with a lot of integrity. Her mother and I got blessed. She's actually right here reading your advice and she says, "Thank you very much". May God bless the Spomers...
Ron, thanks for the video. I'm a big fan of Barnes bullets, I have been using them for about 20 years and my children use them and now my grandchildren use them.
Glad the Barnes are working well for you, Shane. My wife and I have been using them in various forms since the early 1990s. I had one box of early .284s that did not work as advertised, i.e. didn't expand. That issue was quickly addressed and resolved by Barnes. No issues since. TSX and TTSX have been excellent. And now I'm getting into the LRX.
Great knowledgeable video Ron, here in Eastern Canada i'm a big fan of the Nosler Partition out of my 30-06 for hunting Whitetails, Black Bear and Moose works wonders evrey time! 💥
@Colin Miller i definitely eat bear there's nothing like a bear roast cooked in my slow cooker delicious 😋 if ever you want my recipe i'd gladly pass it along!
Mike Gaudet yeah man let me know, I’m a new hunter so I’m not even sure what’s good for meat although where I’m at I can hunt bobcat, nutria, squirrel raccoon possum. People really eat all of that??
@Celestial bear burgers are as good, if not better than axis burgers 😋 you need to explore your options when it comes to what is not just good, but it's so darn good that it will make you cry, just like the menudo at speedy Gonzales place in El paso does me.
Really enjoyed this video. I don't shoot many all copper bullets but now know that if I do hunt with them, shoot within ranges with highest velocity to maintain proper expansion. Thanks for the heads up on this.
Another good bonus of bonded and copper projectiles is if you have to make a follow up Shot. Now I don’t condone shooting animals up the rear but if you put a poorly placed shot the first time, sometimes the only follow up shot you’ll get if from behind. With a bonded projectile you know for sure the projectile will punch far enough to hit vitals. With a cup and core you can’t be sure, it could penetrate 12 inches and not make any vitals
I've tried lots of different bullets barnes ttsx is my favorite. Deep penetration leaves a good blood trail if needed and the most accurate hunting bullet in most of my hunting rifles. Some guys I hunt with spend thousands a year on hunting gear but buy cheap ammo. Somehow I end up trying to help them track there game with no blood trail up and down hills through swamps with nothing to go on cause there cheap bullet broke up and didn't exit. I just don't understand how people can spend thousands and cheap out on the only thing that kills what there hunting.
Very good point. I have observed the same thing in archery as well, everybody wants this years flagship bow or new spendy gear then stick a cheapo broadhead on a Walmart set of arrows and call it good.
Love the video. I too pondered the whole "should the bullet pass through or should it stay in the animal" theory and originally I felt that it would be good to have the bullet stop in the animal. But the more I hunted I realized that having an animal have two holes to bleed from usually meant an easier track and quicker bleed out. Plus if it's not getting good penetration, a hit through bone might not get deep enough for vitals. There's a sweet spot with just about everything. Too much is too much and too little, not enough. I think thats why having game appropriate calibers are important. Absolutely love it Ron, keep it up.
Ive had issues with picking lead fragments out of game meat in the kitchen so these copper bullets seem like a win. I like to see all the detail about performance. Made the switch over seem like a no brainer. Thanks for the insight Ron.
That was a great, detailed video explaining the various differences and trade-offs between conventional lead core bullets and the all copper, monolithic options. A couple of things not mentioned are the higher cost of the all copper bullets, and the potential for greater accuracy with lead-core bullets, where more of the weight is toward the rear of the projectile. Something I have long wished for is a bullet that is much like the Nosler Partition, where a solid copper bullet has had the shank filled with lead. This would make the projectile heavier in the rear, increase the sectional density for any given length of bullet, and otherwise provide all of the key advantages of both bullet types.
The discontinued Winchester XP3 bullet had lead filled shank, hollow copper nose just as you describe. Barnes had an MRX like that, but with tungsten in shank. Talk about heavy! Seems to me there were or are others, but I'm drawing a blank from the memory bank at the moment. Anyone? Didsn't Federal have a hollow nose copper bullet with a lead shank once?
@@jasonbroom7147 The XP3s were indeed a great bullet. But sales were low due to high prices. Most hunters go with the cheapest ammo they can find so they have sufficient funds left over for beer. (Only half kidding.)
Possibly the most informative of all your videos! Great job! In 2017 I saw something that I would have sworn would never happen with a 165gr Barnes TSX from my 300 WSM. A friend shot a large 6x7 bull elk slightly quartering to, but almost broadside two times at 320 yards. The bull laid down briefly, but then got up and traveled approximately 150 yards before dropping for good. There was no blood where he initially laid down, nor along his trail that I was able to follow through disrupted pine needles on the forest floor. Both bullets impacted within three inches of each other, penetrating the back half of the on-side front shoulder and ranging through to just behind the off side shoulder. Both bullets failed to exit and were just under the skin on the off side, each beautifully mushroomed with all petals intact. Upon examination, we found a lot of hair packed inside the curl of each bullets petals. This particular bull elk had the longest winter coat of any elk that I've ever seen and my assumption was that the extremely long hair had initiated bullet expansion before entering the elk's body, which also could explain why there was no exit and absolutely zero blood, even around the entrance wounds. While that same bullet has performed wonderfully for me all other times, I think this case just shows that we should never assume anything and to be ready for follow-up shots, even when we are confident of bullet placement and the bullets 'normal' performance.
Yes. Trusting every bullet to perform perfectly every time is not wise. Always be ready to administer finishing shots, or, as many elk guides say, keep shooting until its dead! I've found that, in general, all animals remain conscious for several seconds after solid heart/lung shots. It isn't until blood pressure drops that they get dizzy and fall. And then, of course, it takes roughly 10 min. for brain cells to die from oxygen deprivation.
My Ruger American .270 shoots the Federal Power-Shok all copper really well. I was very impressed with them compared to the lead core that I’ve always used.
Great video! Thank you very much. What I could never understand, yes Barnes bullets are expensive, is; the CHEAPEST yet most IMPORTANT part of a hunt is the bullet you send down range. I mean we all spend lot’s of $$$ on places to hunt, clothing, boots, calls, and so many other things, why would you bargain hunt for ammunition? It doesn’t make any sense.
Well done Ron. The only time I ever use lead bullets is in a rimfire. Copper outperforms jacketed lead in centrefire hands down. Been using them professionally for more than 20 years. If copper bullets had been developed first, jacketed lead would never have got a start. The most important thing to remember is to get the twist right, and everything else will fall into place.
Great video. I had the absolute test in Namibia. I got the chance to cull 20 Oryx. 338 RUM with 210 Barnes TSXs and 210 Swift Sciroccos. All chest shots. Every Oryx hit with a 210 TSX took a few steps. Or ran 50 yards plus. The Scirocco knocked them off their arse. Only 1 ran. Rest my case.
Ron, I believe you are speaking from your experience, but it isn't mine. 2018 my 15 yr old grandson shot a 6 point elk at 200 yards with a 130 gr Barnes TTSX from his .270. The bullet entered far forward in the rib cage, breaking a rib, broke the far side shoulder and lodged under the hide. The elk kept running, although not as fast due to the broken shoulder and finally fell in thick scrub oak about 400 yards from where he was hit. He was still alive when my grandson found him a half an hour later and finished him. When we found the bullet there was virtually -0- expansion and the bullet still weighed 110 grains. We were not impressed with the performance. My grandson now uses Nosler Partitions. I hunted for elk for 40 years using Hornady Interlock and Remington Core-Lokt bullets. I always got good expansion and penetration with shots ranging from 5 yards to 450 yards. Oh, and cleaning his rifle with the Barnes bullets was a real chore requiring lots of swabbing with Sweet's 7.62, not Hoppe's No. 9. So until Colorado mandates all copper bullets, we are sticking to the old fashioned jacketed lead bullets.
Got my first deer this year and i was able to recover the bullet. I used the cheap herters hunting ammo and the lead core separated from the jacket. Didnt seem to matter as it was a heart shot amd he dropped where he stood. (Probably helps that he was only 15 yards away)
Bought a new 243 couple months ago... finally got to try loads few weeks ago... found the gmx and h335 was best with a clover leaf... done a lot of research and was keen on switching to all copper.. I have hunted over 25 years with lead/copper.. I figured try the gmx and see how they do on deer this fall
Really well put together video. Thanks! In CA, we use copper by law. Love it! Had to go to lighter bullet since heavy copper bullet was too long to stabilize and grouped poor, but with copper, ight is OK since penetration is way better than lead. Copper allowed me to down size my rifle.
The 165 -169 grain bullet's of various construction loaded in the 308 cartridge can be load developed reasonably enough to allow swapping between them for jump shooting in tbe forest through too open spaces with longer distances and the ensuing lower velocity impact. Nosler Partition, Hornady ELD, or BT's, and even bear driving Swift can all perform within their limits using the 308 cartridge.
Hello Ron, I always enjoy watching your videos. I know you are fond of copper bullets. Which I think is awesome. I know it's not your channel, but I would encourage you to watch Meat Eater Copper vs. Lead bullets. It is really worth watching. They compare the copper, bonded lead bullet, and a cup in core bullet in the same cartridge for a fair comparison. I think you would enjoy seeing that. It is informative also. Anyway I saw this and wanted you to check that out. It kinda takes the arguments out of things. Thanks Ron, always a pleasure to watch you.
I fought against monolithic bullets like the Barnes TSX and TTSX for years. When I finally fell for them, I fell hard. I use the Barnes and animals that I have shot have all had massive terminal damage and complete pass throughs. For example: the Barnes 110g TTSX out of a Tikka 270 at 3410 FPS gives complete pass through but it looks like a bomb went off inside the Whitetail. I still use lead core bullets for predator hunting but prefer the all copper for big game.
I have been educating my self on this subject recently, and have decided to just stay from bullets like ballistic tip type bullets as well as burger type bullets and I'm gonna stick with bonded soft points, copper and partition type bullets
If I've ever disagreed with you and been a smart a22 I apologize. Brother you're a excellent teacher I think you missed your calling......thank the Lord😉
I did not know density factored into BC I always assumed it was the length and shape of the bullet, I had thought copper bullets being larger for the same weight had higher BC but I guess I learned something there. Thanks!
crumble some paper into an orange sized ball and wrap it in plastic wrap so its exterior is smooth. grab an orange of equal size. Throw them both as hard as you can and measure which one goes farther.
Man I've got to say you're like a prophet of the shooting world.Thank you so much for sharing your wisdom, knowledge,and lifetime accumulation of experience with us.I always take so much away from your videos. When I was a teenager I used to love reading columns from Colonel Jeff Cooper and I must say after listening to your wisdom bombs time and time again I feel very much like I did back then reading his columns so thank you again and please keep up the excellent work!
I like a through shot. Like a close shot from my bow. Lot of great info. I like the softer lead in muzzle loader bullets or in wad cutters. I have tried brass balls in the muzzle loader. I will be trying some copper bullets in the 308 150 grain. Great video.